The Imperfect Bedtime Routine w/ Greta Johnsen

Summary

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The Nightly – "The Imperfect Bedtime Routine" w/ Greta Johnsen

Release Date: July 2, 2026
Host: Greta Johnsen (Guest Host)
Guest Caller: Virginia from Brooklyn, NY
Produced by: Hatch Podcasts

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Episode Overview

This episode dives into the nuanced, sometimes chaotic world of bedtime routines through an authentic, playful conversation. Greta Johnsen, known for her work on "Gretagram" and "Happy to Be Here," chats with Virginia, a Brooklyn mom, about their often messy, always-evolving nighttime rituals, navigating family life, interruptions from sports obsessions, and the low-pressure approach to routines (including horoscopes and unique lip balm). The episode champions self-compassion, adaptability, and the small comforts that help us wind down.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Setting the Scene: Nighttime Routines (01:28–02:20)

• Virginia, originally from Jersey, calls in from Brooklyn to confess her lack of a polished bedtime routine – “a little less aspirational than some of the routines that I hear out there.”
• The NBA playoffs “just blew everything up” for any routine in their household.

Virginia (01:53): “I don't think I really have one… it's just a little less aspirational than some of the routines that I hear out there.”

2. Family Dynamics and Night Energy (02:24–03:58)

• Virginia shares about her newly 14-year-old son, the late-night “Nick's fever,” and how energy spikes at the end of the day make winding down tough.
• Greta empathizes with late-night sports obsessions, noting she’d never stay up for a 1:30am game – “There is almost nothing on this beautiful earth that I would stay up till 1:30 to 2.”

3. Cultural Influence on Evening Life (03:58–04:44)

• Virginia’s Argentine roots shape their evenings: "We eat late…then of course there’s dishes, dog walk, and homework check-ins."
• Late dinners and the challenge of balancing family rhythms with self-care.

4. Bedtime Management and Wrangling Kids (04:44–05:52)

• Struggles with her son’s nighttime creativity, like pulling out paint late at night.
• Greta suggests introducing "a quiet hour"—screen-free, low-stimulation time to ease into bedtime.

Greta (05:07): “Have you tried doing like…almost like a quiet hour… screen free time? I have found to be super helpful before bed. I don’t always follow that…”

5. Building a (Loose) Routine: Audio, Pets, and Bedroom Rituals (05:53–06:54)

• Virginia’s son loves The Nightly and has audio stories (like “nightly squirrel” and “campfire”) that reliably put him to sleep.
• The post-son part of Virginia’s routine: wandering the house, “doing a sweep,” putting food away, and relishing that moment of calm before her own wind down.

6. Personal Rituals: Horoscopes and Reflection (06:55–07:48)

• Virginia reads horoscopes before bed—sometimes for reflection, sometimes just entertainment.
• Greta reflects on whether self-reflection is best done pre-sleep, but sees the value in closing out the day.

Greta (07:34): “I do think that, like, the self reflection thing, I mean, it's lovely. I do wonder if right before bed is, like, the ideal time. But I could see it being a nice, like, kind of capstone to your day.”

7. Books and Audiobooks as Nighttime Companions (07:52–08:52)

• Both Greta and Virginia love to read; time is short, so audiobooks and recorded newsletters have filled some of that space.
• Greta recommends short story collections as cozy, achievable bedtime reads.

8. On Forgiving Imperfection (08:53–11:15)

• Discussion about granting yourself grace when routines fail; “forgiving yourself when it doesn’t go exactly how you want it to go.”
• Greta brings up the “Willpower Instinct” book and the value of letting go of all-or-nothing thinking.

Greta (09:08): “A huge part of any intention… especially around a routine is like forgiving yourself when it doesn’t go exactly how you want it to go.”

9. The 87% Club: Doing Good Enough (10:43–11:27)

• Greta shares her “87% club”—the idea that you don’t have to give everything 100%. Sometimes 87% is perfect.

Greta (11:16): “What is the 87% version of what you’re trying to do? Does that feel attainable?”

10. Household Chores and Sharing Duties (11:48–13:00)

• Virginia and her son now trade off dishes and dog walks; music helps get through the chores neither wants to do.
• Debate over if dishes must be done at night—Virginia confesses she treasures waking up to a clean kitchen.

Virginia (12:52): “Waking up to a clean kitchen… Oh my god. That’s a pleasure.”

11. TV as Family Connection, Not Distraction (13:00–14:41)

• Discussion on merging TV time with dinner and cleaning routines—using it as a reward and a way to relax.
• Virginia’s son prefers comedy (Bob’s Burgers, I Love Lucy) over fantasy or sci-fi, leading to playful banter about “tricking” kids into new genres.
• Greta plugs the “Night of the Seven Kingdoms” Game of Thrones spinoff as an accessible, comedic family show.

12. Small Luxuries: Lip Balm, Bedding, and Just Laying Down (16:03–19:18)

• Virginia doesn’t have elaborate pre-bed rituals; her joy is sinking into the perfect bed setup she’s “cracked the code” for.
• Chat about favorite lip balms—Burt’s Bees for Greta, Savannah Bee and “chicken poop” (a lavender balm from Colorado) for Virginia.

Virginia (16:23): “When I lay down, I’m literally just so happy to be laying down. And I just kind of luxuriate in that moment.”

13. Permission to Rest Imperfectly (19:18–20:28)

• The episode ends with Greta encouraging everyone to “sleep as long as you need” and offering gentle, non-judgmental warmth.

Greta (19:35): “Sometimes I say I want to sleep forever, which I know is, you know, not actually a thing we can do, but I hope you sleep as long as you need. I’ll just say that.”

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On routines and self-forgiveness:
  “Whatever you are today doesn’t mean that you have to be the same thing tomorrow.” — Virginia (10:29)
• On the ‘good enough’ philosophy:
  “What if you just gave a little less? You know, what if it was 87%?” — Greta (11:16)
• On small comforts:
  “When I lay down, I’m literally just so happy to be laying down. And I just kind of luxuriate in that moment.” — Virginia (16:23)
• On quirky products:
  “It’s called chicken poop. It’s a lavender scented… and I had seen it in Colorado and I’m like, how is it that the Ace Hardware in Myrtle Avenue has chicken poop lip balm?” — Virginia (18:26)

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Timestamp Guide to Important Segments

| Time | Segment | |-----------|------------------------------------------------------------------| | 01:28 | Virginia introduces her "imperfect" routine | | 03:58 | Late dinners and cultural roots | | 05:53 | Using audio (and The Nightly) as a bedtime aid | | 06:55 | Reading horoscopes before bed | | 08:34 | Bookstores and the hunt for short fiction | | 09:08 | Embracing imperfection in routines | | 10:43 | The "87% club" explained | | 12:52 | The joy of a clean kitchen in the morning | | 13:34 | Family TV strategies; favorite shows | | 16:23 | The perfect bed and simple pleasures | | 18:26 | Lip balm stories: Savannah Bee and “chicken poop” | | 19:35 | Closing wishes for restful sleep |

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Tone and Language

Warm, humorous, and forgiving. The conversation is infused with gentle wit, candid admissions, and a sense of camaraderie for listeners with “imperfect” routines or busy lives.

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Summary

This episode is a permission slip to embrace imperfection, to approach bedtime as flexibly as life demands, and to relish whatever small comforts and rituals bring personal joy. Greta and Virginia’s discussion offers relatable examples, gentle advice, and a celebration of both the chaos and coziness inherent in real-life routines. Whether your night ends with dishes, dog walks, sitcom reruns, or lavender lip balm, this conversation is an invitation to be kind to yourself—and maybe join the 87% club tonight.

Transcript

[A]

Audio for sleep by hatch. Hi, I'm Greta. Welcome to the nightly from Hatch, where your late night thoughts go to rest. I am so happy to be here with you and have just like a super snoozy time. If you don't know my work, I have a newsletter on Substack called Gretagram and a podcast called Happy to Be Here. And I also co host the official Game of Thrones podcast. We are back for season three of House of the Dragon, which is a wild time today. We are going to be talking about all kinds of good stuff, but before we get to it, I just want to say that if you want to come on show and talk about anything that is on your mind, you are more than welcome. You can just email us or send a voice memo file to the nightlyatch co. Our caller today is Virginia. Hello, good evening. Where are you from and what's on your mind tonight?

[B]

Virginia, hi, I am from Brooklyn, New York. I was actually born in the city and grew up in Jersey, but I've been in Brooklyn longer than I've been anywhere else and I'm happy to be here and chat about nighttime routines.

[A]

All right, so yeah, what about nighttime routines? What are you thinking? This is one of my favorite subjects, by the way, so I'm just thrilled to have you.

[B]

Well, I'm curious to hear yours because I have a confession. I don't think I really have one. Sure. And it's a little bit on the blink right now. Yeah. Or maybe I. And it's just a little less aspirational than some of the routines that I hear out there. Yeah, yeah. I feel like we were like kind of nearing a nighttime routine until the NBA playoffs happened.

[A]

Oh, well, geez.

[B]

Yeah. Oh yeah.

[A]

Brooklyn, of course. Yeah. Okay, so when you say we, who are you talking about?

[B]

Me and my 14. My newly minted 14 year old son.

[A]

Oh my goodness. I don't. Does a 14 year old son just sleep all the time? How does that work?

[B]

You know, that's a good question. I feel like the sleeping in is just beginning to happen. On weekends, waking up is definitely a struggle, but in the evenings, there's definitely like an uptick of energy at the end of the day, which is interesting. And especially with like Nick's fever, it's really, you know, become something else completely. And we're all a little sleep deprived right now and trying to like steer back to something resembling a bedtime.

[A]

Oh my gosh, it's so funny to hear you say that because I was in London during the playoffs and Two of my colleagues who are also there are New York people and huge Knicks fans and they were staying up to watch the games that didn't start till 1:30, which was just like. I can't think of. There is almost nothing on this beautiful earth that I would stay up till 1:30 to 2,

[B]

except for the Knicks.

[A]

I mean, it was, you know, I understood it, but it was not for me. Yeah, well, I mean, okay, so Nick's Knicks aside, because I feel like, you know, we're, we're, we're, we're getting a, like now that we have completed the NBA season, the parade is over. I mean, what you like, what is an ideal nighttime for you, do you think?

[B]

Well, you know, every night is a little bit different. We eat late because my family's from Argentina. Oh, cool, right. According to them, everyone in America has dinner at like 4:30 in the afternoon. But I'm trying to strike a balance. But we typically eat late. And then of course there's dishes. We have a dog. So there's like an evening dog walk, which I love.

[A]

That's nice. That sounds really nice.

[B]

Yeah, it is. It's lovely. A homework check in that's, you know, serious.

[A]

Yep.

[B]

Yeah. And just kind of like making sure my son is actually headed toward bed and like not starting like a new activity at 10pm like that kind of thing. Wrangling. Yeah, wrangling.

[A]

Yeah, the wrangling. That's so tricky because it's like. Yeah. I mean, you can't just be like, okay, good luck with that new activity. I am going to bed. Can you.

[B]

I know there's often like, he'll pull out paint at, you know, 9:30 and I'm like, no, no, no, we're not going to start doing that right now. As much as I, you know, encourage that, it's, it's not the right time. Yeah, yeah, yeah, for sure.

[A]

I wonder if there is like, have you tried doing like, I don't know, almost like a quiet hour where it's just like, you know, I mean, it seems like screen free time. I have found to be super helpful before bed. I don't always follow that, but I really try.

[B]

Yeah, we definitely, we're not, we, we're not big on screens to begin with, so that's not much of a challenge anymore, which is great. And he actually, he loves the nightly. He's a big fan, so. Oh, yeah, yeah. Once we, once we can actually like get into the bedroom and kind of start that whole thing, you know, he invites the dog onto the bed. And he has a routine. He has. He has a restore, and he has the nightly squirrel for you. And then he has campfire lined up, and by the time we hear the crickets, he's out. So that's kind of like a reliable. I know. I didn't see that coming. And I love it. And I love it. Yeah. So he's out, and then by the time he's out, that's kind of when my bedtime routine kicks in. Sure. Which is, like, mostly consists of wandering around our home and putting things back into the fridge.

[A]

Important.

[B]

Yeah. Asking myself, like, why there's like a, you know, like a yogurt by the window and, you know, that kind of thing. So I have to do a sweep. I do the sweep, and once everything is where it's supposed to be, I kind of just take a big breath and the day settles. Our apartment settles. My brain settles a little bit. And then it's, you know, brush teeth, wash face jams, climb into bed. And then the one thing that I do jump on a screen for is I read my horoscope.

[A]

Oh, fun.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah.

[A]

And you do that, like, right before bed every night?

[B]

Not every night, but I try to, you know, like, I'll read like, a little something, but usually, like, I'm searching for. For my horoscope that day on various different platforms. Yeah, that's so.

[A]

And it's for. It's. That's kind of funny because aren't you. Isn't it like, the horoscope of the day you just had?

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. And I have a. I have a few different, you know, places that I pull from, and it depends on, like, the mood that I'm in.

[A]

Sure.

[B]

Like, do I want something completely, like, do I want just entertainment or. I do. I want some serious, like, self reflection.

[A]

Yeah. That's really. I love that because. Yeah. I do think that, like, the self reflection thing, I mean, it's lovely. I do wonder if right before bed is, like, the ideal time. But I could see it being a nice, like, kind of capstone to your day.

[B]

Yeah. I need something, you know, to kind of, like, close out.

[A]

Yeah, totally. Yeah. Have you ever. Do you like to read much?

[B]

I love to read. There's not a whole lot of time. So it's been a lot of, like, you know, audiobooks.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

These days and. Or just honestly, like, listening to, like, recorded substacks.

[A]

Oh, interesting. Yeah, totally.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I was gonna say, I wonder if, like, a really good short story collection would be nice for you just because those can, like, be really Good little bite sized bits of something where it's like you feel like you've accomplished a thing, but you know, you maybe have only read a couple pages, but it can help kind of like soothe your brain a little, you know?

[B]

Yeah, definitely. And I actually recently went to the bookstore looking for just that, looking for recommends. Normally if I go to a bookstore, like, I know what I want, you know, I go in mine, but this, but this time I, I went in for help. I'm like, I just need some really good, you know, a collection of short stories.

[A]

Yeah. And were they helpful?

[B]

I haven't dug in just yet. They're just kind of sitting there as props. I'll get to them. I'll get to them at some point.

[A]

So you did, you did leave the bookstore with a couple books though.

[B]

Yes, the intention has been set.

[A]

Okay, that's great. I mean, I gotta say, I do think a huge part of any intention is, especially around a routine is like forgiving yourself when it doesn't go exactly how you want it to go.

[B]

Definitely.

[A]

I think that's super important. And it's something that was presented to me really helpful, helpfully in a book called the Willpower Instinct kind of randomly. But like, there are all these studies about. And in that case it was around dieting, which, like, you know, take it early. I'm not condoning dieting in this context, but I do think it's a really interesting concept, which is that like, the people who ultimately were the most successful were also the ones who were like forgiving them of themselves when they had a cheeseburger or whatever, you know. And I just, I do love that idea of like. Because I think it can be so easy to get into that mentality of like, well, I didn't do it, so it's ruined and like, I can never do it again and I might as well just give up now as opposed to like, well, you know, like, I didn't do it exactly how I wanted to tonight, but that's fine and I can try again tomorrow, you know.

[B]

Yes, definitely. We need to be easier on ourselves all around.

[A]

Yeah. Especially when it comes to something like a bedtime. Like that should be the easiest possible thing, right?

[B]

Yeah, definitely. I mean, well, that's something that I also like that comes into like my parenting with anything, with schoolwork, whatever it is, I'm like, whatever you are today doesn't mean that you have to be the same thing tomorrow.

[A]

Yes. Yeah. I think that's so important. It's so nice. I mean, it reminds me of Something that I've been talking a lot about on my show, Happy to be Here. Which, like, part of the tagline for that is that it's for recovering perfectionists. And I started a thing called the 87% club, which is the idea of, like, especially for people who are used to giving like 100% all the time to everything. It's like, what if you just gave a little less? You know, what if it was 87%?

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And like, I do wonder if that could be a helpful framing for you. Just around like, what is, what is the 87% version of what you're trying to do? And is. Does that feel attainable? You know?

[B]

Yeah, definitely. I mean, I feel like I have seen every variation of percentage. Right.

[A]

Yeah, maybe it's ever to do. Exactly. Yeah. Yes, totally. Yeah. I think the main thing is like, especially the stuff you just don't want to do. It's like, how can we just get that as low as possible and then you have more energy for the stuff you do want to do, you know?

[B]

That's a tough one. That's a tough one. Like, I definitely don't want to do dishes at the end of the day. Like, that's the toughest one for me.

[A]

I hear you. That's a tough one for us too. Do you. I feel like, could your kid do the fridge sweep before he goes to bed?

[B]

He's, he's been, he's actually been doing the dishes. Like, you know, he's at an age now where I'm like, all right, listen, we had dinner. One of us is walking the dog, the other one is doing the dishes.

[A]

Oh, I like that.

[B]

Yeah. He gets a choice. And if I have to do the dishes, I have to put on headphones and put on some music. It's the only way I'm getting through it.

[A]

That's nice.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I mean, there is also the question which is, can be very difficult for my little anxious, control minded brain, but like, do you have to do the dishes at night?

[B]

I mean, I've done the pendulum swings. I have, I have tried the other way, but this is like something new that we're sticking with and I respect that. Waking up to a clean kitchen.

[A]

I do.

[B]

Oh, my God. That's a pleasure. Yeah.

[A]

Yes. That is a gift you can give yourself for sure. Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

I have found a thing we've been doing lately or maybe that I like to do, I'll say is like, we often will, like eat dinner while we watch an episode of something. And. And like, I really love the idea of, like, once we're done eating, like, pausing, whatever it is, and like, doing the kitchen cleanup and then going back to the relaxing thing, you know?

[B]

Interesting.

[A]

So at least. At least then it's not like that frenzied, like, we gotta do this and this and this and this and this and this, you know, because that can feel so, like, activating before going to sleep.

[B]

It is. It is activating. Yeah. You know what? I might try that. Like, that might be, like a weekend thing for us.

[A]

That's kind of a funny. Yeah. Yeah. I totally get not wanting to put your kid in front of the TV

[B]

for every dinner, but then there's also, like, finding the show. That's gonna work for both of us.

[A]

Yes. But I think that could be kind of a nice opportunity too. Right. Cause you can decide, you know, and. Yeah. I mean, at least for me and my boyfriend, we kind of like having a couple on rotation. So then it's like, we've got the drama, but then also, if we want the goofy comedy, you. That's a. That's an option too. And then you can kind of be like, okay, what are you in the mood for? You know?

[B]

Yeah, we're definitely more on the comedy front. He, you know, he's not into. He's not into Star Wars. That kind of. I know. He's not into fantasy or sci fi.

[A]

Interesting.

[B]

I know. He's into satire.

[A]

You have raised a really interesting child over there, haven't you, Virginia?

[B]

Yeah, it's good. It's good. He has, you know, he has his staples. His staples are Bob's burgers and I Love Lucy.

[A]

Oh, my gosh. That's amazing. Yeah, I love that, huh?

[B]

Yeah. But he won't watch. He won't watch the Mandalorian with me.

[A]

You know what you could try is a Night of the Seven Kingdoms. I feel like I've been shilling that really hard on this podcast, but it's because I genuinely believe it's very good. It's the Game of Thrones spinoff that came out in January.

[B]

Okay.

[A]

And it's. There's nights, there's knights and stuff, but there's no. There's no dragons. There's no magic. It's just like jousts.

[B]

That could work well. I think that could work really well for him.

[A]

I think it's great. It's also. It's funny. And there's only six half hour episodes, which is also just like an easy ask, you know?

[B]

And it's funny. You say it's funny.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Okay. All right, I'm gonna. I'm gonna give that a whirl.

[A]

Yeah, I think that one. Yeah. Because that's a whole other topic we could get into is, like, how to trick your child into liking sci fi and fantasy.

[B]

Seriously, I tried so many things, and he's just like, I know what you're doing.

[A]

That's so funny. Back to bedtime, though. When it comes to, like, you're crawling into bed, are there. Do you have any, like, little treats, like a lip balm you like, or, like, a sleep mask or lotion or anything like that? That's like, your before bed thing?

[B]

I. I actually don't have anything like that. I'm pretty, like, utilitarian at that point. I mean, for me, like, you. It took me a while to, like, find the right combination of, like, mattress and, you know, whatever it is. Yes. To. And I cracked the code. I cracked the code for myself. That's amazing. So when I lay down, I'm literally just so happy to be laying down. And I just kind of luxuriate in that moment. I'm like, oh, this is amazing. Yeah. But sometimes, you know, I will. You know, sometimes there might be a candle for, like, a little while, but I'm afraid that I'm going to fall asleep and something's going to happen.

[A]

Yes, yes.

[B]

So I keep it. I keep it pretty simple. Yeah.

[A]

Yeah. I respect that. I have found it. Really. I don't know if it's because I'm a Taurus or I just love being self indulgent. Speaking of horoscopes, but I have a whole thing with, like, my lip balm, my hand lotion, maybe some other lotion if my elbows feel dry. My sleep mask, my boyfriend's like, wow, you're really gearing up over there, huh? I got my little night guard. It's like a whole thing. I love funny.

[B]

And what I have to ask, because I am a lip balm person, like, you know, in the daytime, what do you use?

[A]

I actually use Burt's Bees, which I recently learned is now owned by Clorox, which I don't love, but I just haven't. I just feel like that's the consistency I'm looking for in a lip balm, you know?

[B]

Right.

[A]

And, like, I really like the mintiness of it, and I feel like it does what I want it to do. I had tried some fancier one recently, and I felt like it was just drying my lips out, which is, like, not the point at all.

[B]

Yeah, I hear that. I hear that. I've Got a couple favorites that are, you know, on constant rotation, but I do dabble, so I will check that one out. Yeah.

[A]

So, yeah. What are your favorites?

[B]

I have one from the Savannah Bee company that I really love.

[A]

Ooh, that sounds nice.

[B]

Yeah. And then I have another one that I actually found in my hardware store, of all places. Wow. It's called chicken poop. I know. Yes, it's called chicken poop. It's a lavender. It's a lavender scented, flavored, whatever the term is for it. And it's from Colorado, and I had seen it in Colorado and I'm like, how is it that the Ace Hardware in Myrtle Avenue has chicken poop? You know, lip balm. And he's like, we went out to some, I don't know, some work event out in Colorado, and I loved it so much that now I carry it in the store. Wow. Yeah, it's really good.

[A]

Like, really good chicken poop. Oh, my gosh. I love that very much. Okay, great. So you gave me some homework, too. I love that.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But we're not doing any more work tonight, Virginia, because you know what it is? It's bedtime.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

Well, Virginia, thank you so much for calling in. It was a delight to talk with you. I hope you sleep very well tonight.

[B]

Thank you. Have a good night.

[A]

You too. If you want to come on the show to talk about anything that is on your mind, from chapstick to satire to sci fi and fantasy, send us an email or a voice memo to the nightlyatch Co. Tonight, I want to say goodnight to just everybody. I hope you all sleep the way you want to sleep. Sometimes I say I want to sleep forever, which I know is, you know, not actually a thing we can do, but I hope you sleep as long as you need. I'll just say that.

[B]

Sa. Sa.

[A]

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