Roundup: Kash Patel Confirmed As FBI Chief; China Sees Opportunity As USAID Gets Cut

Summary

Summary of NPR Politics Podcast Episode: "Roundup: Kash Patel Confirmed As FBI Chief; China Sees Opportunity As USAID Gets Cut"

Release Date: February 21, 2025

In this episode of The NPR Politics Podcast, hosts Ashley Lopez, Ryan Lucas, and Domenico Montanaro delve into two pivotal developments shaping the current political landscape: the confirmation of Kash Patel as the new FBI Director and the implications of the Trump administration’s cuts to USAID, particularly focusing on China’s strategic responses. The discussion is enriched with expert insights, notable quotes, and a comprehensive analysis of the potential ramifications of these events.

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1. Confirmation of Kash Patel as FBI Director

Narrow Confirmation Vote and Controversies

The episode opens with significant attention to the recent confirmation of Kash Patel as the new Director of the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI). Despite an anticipated smooth passage, the confirmation vote proved to be surprisingly tight.

Ryan Lucas (00:34): "Cash Patel was confirmed as the new FBI director yesterday despite questions about his qualifications. This vote came out to 51 to 49, with two Republican senators, Maine's Susan Collins and Alaska's Lisa Murkowski, voting against him."

This marks a stark contrast to his predecessors, who typically secured overwhelming support, with at least 92 votes affirming their appointments. The narrow margin underscores the contentious nature of Patel’s nomination.

Concerns Over Independence and Qualifications

Lucas elaborates on the underlying concerns that fueled the skepticism surrounding Patel’s appointment:

Ryan Lucas (01:45): "There are concerns about whether he can be independent from the White House or whether he's somebody who's going to do exactly what President Trump wants him to do."

Patel's close alliance with President Trump raises alarms about the potential erosion of the FBI’s traditionally independent stance. His past provocative statements have further intensified doubts regarding his suitability for leading such a crucial federal institution.

Ryan Lucas (01:51): "He has made a lot of inflammatory comments over the years. He's talked about wanting to root out the deep state; he calls public servants, law enforcement officials who investigated Trump gangsters political prisoners."

Implications for the FBI’s Role

Domenico Montanaro adds context by highlighting Patel’s previous endeavors and the significance of the FBI’s role in national security:

Domenico Montanaro (03:08): "This is somebody who was known for being provocative... it's another thing when you want to run the FBI, which is one of the most important structures in this country for fighting crime."

The panelists express apprehension about Patel’s ability to maintain the FBI’s non-partisan mandate, especially given his past criticisms of the agency.

Future of the FBI Under Patel’s Leadership

As the conversation shifts to future expectations, Lucas emphasizes the challenging environment Patel inherits:

Ryan Lucas (04:43): "Patel takes over at the FBI at a tumultuous time. The new leadership at the Justice Department has pushed out at least eight senior leaders... there are concerns about potential mass firings, essentially a purge."

The uncertainty surrounding the organizational stability of the FBI under Patel’s tenure is palpable. The potential for significant personnel changes raises questions about the agency's operational efficacy and its ability to tackle pressing issues like counterterrorism, cybersecurity, and public corruption.

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2. US Cuts to USAID and China’s Strategic Moves

Historical Context of US Foreign Assistance

Transitioning to international affairs, the podcast explores the Trump administration’s decision to slash funding to the United States Agency for International Development (USAID), among other foreign assistance programs. Emily Fang provides a comprehensive overview of the origins and evolution of US foreign aid:

Emily Fang (07:34): "It began in the early 1980s under President Ronald Reagan, competing with the Soviet Union both politically and ideologically. Reagan’s speech in 1982 led to billions in foreign assistance through agencies like USAID and the creation of foundations like the National Endowment for Democracy."

Post-Cold War, these funds transitioned to support humanitarian and civil society initiatives in regions grappling with authoritarianism and conflict, such as Iran, China, and Ukraine.

Rationale Behind the Cuts

Ashley Lopez probes into the motivations driving the Trump administration’s reduction in foreign aid:

Ashley Lopez (08:29): "It's been done under the umbrella of trying to shrink the federal government and its budget. Elon Musk and President Trump accuse agencies like USAID of spreading leftist propaganda and being linked to Russian influence."

This reduction is part of a broader "America First" strategy, prioritizing domestic over international concerns and viewing foreign assistance through a lens of fiscal conservatism and skepticism towards global entanglements.

China’s Opportunistic Response

The discussion shifts to China’s opportunistic maneuvers in response to the US retreat from funding soft power initiatives. Fang details how China is attempting to fill the void left by the US:

Emily Fang (11:08): "China is moving in to fill the US funding gap. Although not their strong suit, they're making an effort by offering alternatives to US-supported civil society groups, such as facilitating private conversations with the Chinese government."

This strategic push by China aims to bolster its influence in regions where US foreign aid previously supported local NGOs and human rights organizations. The competition for ideological and political dominance intensifies as both superpowers vie for global soft power supremacy.

Impact on US Soft Power and Domestic Implications

Domenico Montanaro reflects on the broader implications of this shift:

Domenico Montanaro (09:54): "The end of the US’s soft power challenges decades of American foreign policy. Critics argue that an America First approach is too transactional and short-sighted, potentially undermining long-term US influence."

Moreover, Fang highlights the domestic repercussions of cutting USAID funding, particularly for American farmers whose agricultural products have supported US foreign initiatives:

Emily Fang (13:13): "American farmers could be hurt as USAID cuts reduce the demand for agricultural exports like grain sorghum, impacting their livelihoods."

The intertwining of international policy shifts with domestic economic interests underscores the multifaceted consequences of reducing foreign aid.

Quotes Highlighting Key Points

• Ryan Lucas (01:51): "He has made a lot of inflammatory comments over the years. He's talked about wanting to root out the deep state."

• Domenico Montanaro (03:08): "This is somebody who was known for being provocative... it's another thing when you want to run the FBI."

• Emily Fang (07:34): "It began in the early 1980s under President Ronald Reagan..."

• Ashley Lopez (08:29): "Elon Musk and President Trump accuse agencies like USAID of spreading leftist propaganda."

• Emily Fang (11:08): "China is moving in to fill the US funding gap."

• Domenico Montanaro (09:54): "An America First approach is too transactional and short-sighted..."

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Conclusion

This episode of The NPR Politics Podcast provides an in-depth exploration of critical developments in domestic and international politics. The confirmation of Kash Patel as FBI Director reveals a potential shift in the agency's traditional independence, raising concerns about its future direction and effectiveness. Simultaneously, the Trump administration's reduction in USAID funding marks a significant pivot in US foreign policy, with China seizing the opportunity to expand its global influence. These discussions highlight the intricate interplay between domestic decisions and their far-reaching implications on international relations and national security.

Listeners are offered a nuanced understanding of how these political maneuvers could reshape the landscape of American governance and its position on the world stage, emphasizing the importance of vigilance and informed discourse in navigating these changes.

Transcript

[Ashley Lopez]

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Hey there. It's the NPR Politics Podcast. We're recording this at 12:25pm Eastern Time on Friday, February 21, 2020 25. I'm Ashley Lopez. I cover voting.

[Ryan Lucas]

I'm Ryan Lucas. I cover the Justice Department.

[Domenico Montanaro]

And I'm Domenico Montanaro, senior political editor and correspondent.

[Ashley Lopez]

Cash Patel was confirmed as the new FBI director yesterday despite questions about his qualifications. Ryan, this was a pretty tight vote, even though it seemed like his confirmation was never really in doubt, right?

[Ryan Lucas]

No, it wasn't really in doubt. Republicans did, for the most part, kind of unite in lockstep behind him. But this vote came out to 51 to 49. There are two Republican senators who voted against confirming Patel. That would be Maine's Susan Collins and Alaska's Lisa Murkowski. And if you look at the three directors immediately before Patel, they all received at least 92 votes in favor. So that gives you a sense of how controversial a nominee Patel is to lead the FBI, which, to remind people, is a really big job. The FBI is responsible for investigating counterterrorism, bank robberies, cybersecurity, all sorts of things across the spectrum. And there's a lot of crime going on, and a lot of this comes down to the FBI to fight. So this is a very big job. And there are a lot of people, whether they be Democrats and also former national security officials, who have concerns about Patel, about his qualifications, about his experience, his temperament, and whether he's really the right man for this job.

[Ashley Lopez]

Yeah. Can you talk to me more about what concerns people had going into his confirmation?

[Ryan Lucas]

Well, there are a whole bunch of them. There's the fact that he's a very close ally of President Trump. There are concerns about whether he can be independent from the White House or whether he's somebody who's going to do exactly what President Trump wants him to do. Traditionally, the FBI is independent, and it's something that has been very important historically. There's also just the fact that he's made a lot of inflammatory comments over the years. He's talked about wanting to root out the deep state he's called public servants, law enforcement officials who investigated Trump gangsters. He says that people who stormed the Capitol on January 6th who fought with police, he says that they are political prisoners. That's, of course, Echoing the sort of comments that we've heard from the president. And more broadly, he's just a very fierce critic of the FBI itself. He has said on a bunch of podcast appearances that he wants to shut down FBI headquarters on day one. He wants to turn it into a museum to the deep state lawmakers. Certainly Democrats asked him about a lot of these things during his confirmation hearing, and Patel tried to push back on them. He said that he would not politicize the FBI, that he wants to take politics out of the FBI. He wants to focus on traditional crime fighting. But those comments did little to assuage the concerns that Democrats have, and that.

[Domenico Montanaro]

Just simply wasn't who Cash Patel was before he was at that Senate hearing. You know, this is somebody who was known for being provocative, who wrote a book, not just about the government gangsters, as he noted in the book title, but he wrote a children's book called the Plot against the King that seemed to depict someone with blond hair as the king looked like maybe President Trump and, you know, somebody who looked like Nancy Pelosi as one of the people who was engaging in the plot against and someone who maybe looked like Kash Patel, who seemed to be the sorcerer behind the king. So, you know, it's one thing when you're trying to sell books and get yourself on podcasts. It's another thing when you want to run the FBI, which is one of the most important structures in this country for fighting crime. And he says that he's not going to engage in political weaponization or try to go after enemies and all of that. But we saw people who said one thing at the hearing which defied what they believed before the hearing, seemingly, and then when they got confirmed, did something else.

[Ryan Lucas]

And really, one of the biggest concerns with Patel centers around things that he has said about wanting to go after his perceived enemies and Trump's perceived political enemies. And now you have Patel in charge of an organization, the FBI, which has these vast, vast investigative powers. And there are a lot of concerns that he will make good on those statements that he made when he was not at the FBI about wanting to go after perceived enemies.

[Ashley Lopez]

Yeah. Given those concerns that were mentioned, what do we expect from him as director?

[Ryan Lucas]

I will say that Patel takes over at the FBI at a tumultuous time for the organization. The new leadership at the Justice Department has pushed out at least eight senior leaders there, really top level folks with a lot of experience. And more broadly, the new leadership at the Justice Department has demanded and now received a list of thousands around 5,000 or so FBI employees who worked on January 6th investigations. Remember, that was one of the largest investigations, if not the largest in Justice Department history, touched every state in the US They've demanded a list of everyone who worked on that. And that has led to concerns at the FBI. I've heard a lot of these concerns from folks who worked there of potential mass firings there, essentially a purge. And so the impact that something like that would have on the FBI's ability to do its job and to protect the American public is a significant concern. And how Patel's going to deal with that and how he's going to try to lead an organization as big and important as the FBI is something that we're just going to have to wait and see how that pans out.

[Ashley Lopez]

Yeah. Well, Ryan, thank you so much for being here today.

[Ryan Lucas]

Thank you.

[Ashley Lopez]

Okay, let's take a quick break. And when we come back, how China is responding to the cuts at usaid.

[Domenico Montanaro]

Hey, it's hey, Martinez.

[Ashley Lopez]

I work on a news show.

[Domenico Montanaro]

And yeah, the news can feel like a lot on any given day, but.

[Ashley Lopez]

You just can't ignore la noticias when.

[Domenico Montanaro]

Important world changing events are happening. So that is where the Upverse podcast comes in.

[Ashley Lopez]

Every single morning in under 15 minutes, we take the news and boil it.

[Domenico Montanaro]

Down to three essential stories so you.

[Ashley Lopez]

Can keep up without feeling stressed out.

[Domenico Montanaro]

Listen to the Upverse podcast from NPR.

[Emily Fang]

There's been a lot of attention on loneliness lately. 16% of Americans report feeling lonely all.

[Ashley Lopez]

Or most of the time. The former surgeon general even declared a loneliness epidemic on It's Been a Minute. We're launching a new series called all the Lonely People, diving deep into how loneliness shows up in our lives and how our culture shapes it. That's on the It's Been a Minute podcast on npr.

[Emily Fang]

Public Media counts on your support to ensure that the reporting and programs you depend on thrive. Make a recurring donation today to get.

[Ashley Lopez]

Special access to more than 20 NPR podcasts. Perks like sponsor free listening, bonus episodes, early access and more. So start supporting what you Love today.

[Emily Fang]

At plus.npr.org.

[Ashley Lopez]

And we're back. And we're now joined by international correspondent Emily Fang. Hi, Emily.

Hey, Ashley.

So Donald Trump is undertaking efforts to slash spending at the federal government level, which includes a lot of international pro democracy and human rights groups. Emily, can you just start with the basics here? Why did the US Start funding these programs to begin with?

It began really in the early 1980s in the middle of the Cold War under President Ronald Reagan. At the time, the US was competing with the Soviet Union, both for political influence, but also in the ideological sphere. And so Reagan gave a speech in 1982 where he spoke about funding what he called the infrastructure of democracy. And what resulted is the billions of dollars in foreign assistance funding through agencies like usaid, through the State Department, and then the creation of other foundations like the National Endowment of Democracy. And when the Cold War ended, all that funding evolved into going to support humanitarian work abroad, civil society work around the world, especially in countries that are authoritarian or were devastated by war. So think countries like Iran or China or now Ukraine.

Yeah. And why is it that the Trump administration is reversing this long held position of the US when it comes to diplomacy abroad?

It's been done under the umbrella of trying to shrink the federal government and its budget, and it's really been driven by Elon Musk and President Trump. Musk has also accused these agencies that I just mentioned of, for example, usaid, of being behind what he called a hoax of Russian influence in the Trump administration. He also said the US Aid agency spreads leftist propaganda without giving ev. And then he's also been resharing posts on X, the social media site that he owns that has implied the National Endowment for Democracy is a CIA front. Again, no evidence. But what's interesting to me is this is exactly the same kind of criticism that authoritarian countries like China have Long said about U.S. foreign assistance funding. And this reversal now on cutting, you know, cutting foreign assistance funding is notable because this was actually kind of an issue that Republicans have long championed, especially Republicans like Marco Rubio, who is now the US Secretary of State. He's now in charge of defending and implementing these foreign assistance cuts. But when he was a US Senator, he was a big proponent of foreign aid. He saw it as essential to US national security by promoting US Democratic values abroad. And he said that cutting it would not bring us to balance. But now he's been a big defender of these cuts.

And Domenico, I wonder what you think this means for sort of having the end of, quote, unquote, soft power in US Foreign policy. What this sort of means going forward?

[Domenico Montanaro]

Well, I mean, the idea that the US Would walk back from the idea of soft power really kind of flies in the face of decades of what was American foreign policy following World War II and then the ascent in the 1960s and into the 80s and early 90s of the Cold War against Russia. Really, the idea was to counter communism and what Russia was trying to do around the world. And now the US Has a different sort of calculation to make, which is China, because China is in places like Africa trying to, you know, build infrastructure projects, you know, and try to, by the way, also mine in places where they're helping those countries out to try to take some of those natural resources from those places, but also try to win over some of those populations in some of those countries to try to win allies. And it's a really America first sort of approach, but one that a lot of critics believe is really short sighted and something that's too transactional for the long term success and power of the United States.

[Ashley Lopez]

Yeah, and Emily, I think it's worth mentioning like a good portion of this funding has actually supported Chinese dissidents. I wonder how China is seeing this. Is this welcome to them?

Yeah, US funding was supporting basically the last remaining traces of Chinese civil society. And with the cuts, China has not said very much publicly because honestly, they could just sit back and do nothing to reap the benefits of this US retreat and funding soft power. Because the groups that are seeing their funding cut are the ones that really were a long term nuisance to China. I'm talking about labor rights organizations, civil society groups, human rights investigation organizations. A lot of them had been forced to flee from China given the political controls there. And that's why they needed funding from the US And I talked to seven of these groups focused on China, but now based in the US because they don't have funding anymore. They are already furloughing or laying off their employees and a lot of them have paused their programs. Now there's evidence that China's moving in already to fill this US funding gap in just the last few weeks. Big caveat, funding soft power is not China's strong suit. They're often really heavy handed about it or inefficient, but they're making an effort. And I actually managed to talk directly with a Chinese state representative here in D.C. who answers to the government in China. They requested anonymity when meeting because they're not authorized to speak publicly. But they're here in the US because they reached out to at least one China focused group who is at risk of losing their funding and proposed to this group. You know, instead of criticizing people and organizations in China publicly, perhaps they, as a Chinese government representative could facilitate private conversations with China to achieve the social change that the organization wants. And one of the groups that this representative was in contact with said they kind of felt like this was a tactic to buy their silence. But the Chinese representative argued it was a more effective way for organizations to work. So you're already seeing this competition between the US And China, given the risk of losing all, all the civil society funding.

And Domenico, I wonder if you have a sense of how this would like, actually affect Americans, because this all does seem a little bit abstract, but I'm wondering if there's a way in which like Americans could actually feel the end of this funding, you know, back home.

[Domenico Montanaro]

Well, you know, morality, you know, and humanitarianism is something that a lot of Americans believe in, although it's not always a great argument for a broad swath of Americans because of course they're concerned about kitchen table issues and how it affects their pockets. You know, and one area that maybe a lot of people don't think about is farming and how American farmers could be affected by cuts in usaid because a lot of the food that USAID uses to feed others in the world, in the developing world, comes from places like Kansas, where grain sorghum farmers are supplying usaid. And as that's cut, you're going to see those American farmers hurt as well.

[Ashley Lopez]

I would argue this matters because the US And China have been competing on technology, on political influence, on industrial standards, and definitely in soft power. And the US Is cutting back its foreign presence and its foreign assistance funding at the very moment that China has stepped up and pledged tens of billions of dollars more in places like Africa. And so the potential trade offs have, have never been bigger.

All right, Emily, thank you so much for bringing your reporting to the pod.

Thanks so much for having me on.

It's time for one quick break and when we get back, can't let it go.

There is a lot happening right now in the world of economics. You may have heard about the president's desire for a sovereign wealth fund.

[Ryan Lucas]

If your country's small, well governed and.

[Ashley Lopez]

Has a surplus, it is probably a good idea.

[Ryan Lucas]

We are not any of those.

[Ashley Lopez]

We're here to cover federal buyouts, the cost of deportation, and so much more. Tune in to NPR's the Indicator from Planet Money.

[Emily Fang]

On the Throughline podcast. The myth linking autism and vaccines was.

[Ashley Lopez]

Decades in the making and was a major moment for vaccine hesitancy in America, tapping into fears involving the pharmaceutical industry and the federal government.

[Ryan Lucas]

No matter how many studies you do showing that this is not a problem, it's very hard to unring the bell.

[Ashley Lopez]

Listen to Throughline from NPR wherever you get your podcast. And we're back. And it's time for everyone's favorite Friday segment, can't Let It Go. That's the part of the show where we Talk about the things from the week that we just can't stop thinking about, politics or otherwise. And we have with us political correspondent Sue Davis. Hey, sue, thanks for joining us.

[Emily Fang]

I am so happy to be here today.

[Ashley Lopez]

All right, well, we're gonna start with you. What can't you let go of this week?

[Emily Fang]

You know, I was gonna talk about something else this week, but then before the podcast, I saw a hot take that got me literally so hot. It is now the thing that I can't let go. And it is a colum in Time magazine in which someone defends voice notes in a column entitled We Should All Send More Voice Notes. Now, if you don't know what that is, it's when someone will literally on their phone, like, record themselves talking to you and then, like, text it to you. And I cannot tell you how much I disagree with this sentiment. I'm sorry if either of you are voice note people, but please don't send voice notes. This is not something that. This is a social contagion. I need to stop here at this podcast.

[Ashley Lopez]

I think I only get. Get them from younger, maybe Gen Z folks, but also just some people who have, like. Like this. They're really bought into it. Like, they refuse to text any other way. And I do talk to those folks less because it's too much for me to. It takes too much of your time.

[Domenico Montanaro]

I think it's super annoying. I agree with you. I mean, and I've always been a little confused by it because this is kind of like going backwards in time. I don't know. I can't understand anything anymore, frankly. I get a voice note and I'm like, now I have to listen to this. I gotta make my phone quieter, you know, Just text me what you want to say also, you know, it helps you think about what you want to say first before you, you know, just spit it out.

[Emily Fang]

Also, like, if you want to leave a message, just do a voicemail, because the thing I appreciate. And also, don't leave a voicemail, just text me. But if you do leave a voicemail, at least your phone now will transcribe the voicemail so you can, like, look at what they said really quickly. Like, a voice note sent to you is diabolical. And anytime someone sends me a voice note, I'm not lying, I delete it and text them and say, what do you want to tell me?

[Domenico Montanaro]

That's a confusing thing, because I thought that voicemail was going out of style. I'm so. I'm so confused.

[Emily Fang]

What's old is New again, I will.

[Ashley Lopez]

Say I think we're the wrong audience for this because we have to deal with audio forms of people's voices all day. And other people maybe just want to hear, like, actual people's voices, but not us, clearly.

[Emily Fang]

Just text me, girl. Just text me.

[Domenico Montanaro]

Or call. We can call the conversation. I rather do that.

[Ashley Lopez]

Love a phone call.

[Emily Fang]

Text me first and say, can you chat? And then when I say, yeah, give me a call. Ashley, what about you? What can't you let go of?

[Ashley Lopez]

So what I can't let go of this week is, for those who didn't catch it, there was a concert, a concert event, basically, to celebrate Saturday Night Live's 50th anniversary. I didn't watch the whole thing. It was three hours long, which this is the same reason I haven't watched the Brutalist yet. I cannot commit to something that long. But I was really happy to catch parts of it because the thing that I can't let go of is I saw the, like, a mashup of all the Lonely island songs, like, some of the hits. Do you guys know what I'm talking about?

[Emily Fang]

No.

[Domenico Montanaro]

No.

[Ashley Lopez]

Okay. Like, some of the titles are not suitable for a podcast, but there were all these music videos that came out in the Aughts with Andy Samberg, and then Akiva and Yarma were, like, part of his comedy group, and they had, remember, like, that video about getting cupcakes and Chronicles of Narnia and, like, all of those little segments with Justin Timberlake. This was, like, such a specific time in SNL history, but it was like, every time these videos came out, they were such a big cultural moment when I was in college that seeing all that stuff played again just remind me how, like, older millennials have gotten, because Andy Samberg looks like such a dad now, and it's just so. I just cannot stop thinking about, like, how big of a deal those SNL they were called, I think, SNL shorts or something that came out. It was like they were moments, and they had, like, some pretty big stars to come out.

[Emily Fang]

I'm remembering this now because I remember, as you said, Andy Samberg. And they did the one I remember, the is Lazy Sunday. Is that right?

[Ashley Lopez]

Is this the thing we're talking about? That's the one you're talking about? Yeah. That was, like, one of the first big digital sketches to come out of snl. It was a big moment.

[Emily Fang]

They also did a really hilarious one with Natalie Portman, which she, like, is this, like, demure actress, but in the skit, she's like this hardcore gangster rapper. And it was really funny.

[Domenico Montanaro]

Yeah, well, they, you know, I ran so far away. You know, you look like a very hairy Jake Gyllenhaal to me was always a funny line. I always thought about Ahmadinejad, who could make that joke.

[Ashley Lopez]

Right.

[Domenico Montanaro]

I mean, it's just, just so crazy. I love SNL because it's always been so countercultural and, you know, has lasted as long as it has and especially when at a time when video music videos were going out of style.

[Emily Fang]

I love this, too, because it allowed us to work in an Ahmadini Jad reference into the Can't Let It Go segment. So congrats.

[Ashley Lopez]

All right, Domenico, what can't you let go of this week?

[Domenico Montanaro]

Well, what I can't let go of, and I'm sorry, if you're eating anything, is boogers.

[Emily Fang]

Oh, I'm a mom.

[Domenico Montanaro]

Say more, not my own. Okay. I have to clarify that this has to do with Elon Musk's very young son. He was in the White House this week and he picked and wiped something that you're not supposed to do. We tell our kids all the time. But he did it on the Resolute desk at the White House where Donald Trump was sitting, the president of the United States. And if that's not funny enough, word then came out this week that the Resolute desk, Donald Trump Reports on Truth Social is being lightly refinished, a very important job. This is a beautiful but temporary replacement.

[Ashley Lopez]

Oh, my gosh. Well, he is kind of a germaphobe, right?

[Emily Fang]

Yeah.

[Domenico Montanaro]

Yes. Known germaphobe. And, you know, whether or not it's not clear that it's related to that. Exactly. But that didn't stop places like the New York Post, which are generally pretty friendly toward Trump, from jumping to that conclusion, saying in their lead, which I love, the White House has assured the public it's not a permanent change.

[Ashley Lopez]

All right, that's all from US today. Our executive producer is Muthoni Muturi. Casey Morrell edits the podcast. Our producers are Bria Suggs and Kelly Wessinger. Special thanks to Krishnadev Kalamer. I'm Ashley Lopez. I cover voting.

[Emily Fang]

I'm Susan Davis. I cover politics.

[Domenico Montanaro]

And I'm Domenico Matanaro, senior political editor and correspondent.

[Ashley Lopez]

And thank you for listening to the NPR Politics podcast.