This Senate race may shape the Democrats' future

Summary

NPR Politics Podcast – "This Senate race may shape the Democrats' future"

Date: July 28, 2026
Hosts & Reporters: Myles Parks (Voting), Ashley Lopez (Politics), Sam Greenglass (Congress; reporting from Michigan)

---

Episode Overview

The episode explores Michigan's upcoming Senate Democratic primary, positioning it as a pivotal clash over the future direction of the Democratic Party. As the retirement of Senator Gary Peters opens the seat, the race features a classic confrontation between establishment-backed and progressive candidates, with broader implications ahead of the 2026 general election and potentially the 2028 presidential race. Key themes include party infighting, the influence of progressive vs. establishment ideologies, pressing voter issues (e.g., cost of living), and the high salience of U.S.–Israel policy in Michigan's diverse communities.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Candidates and Their Coalitions

[01:18 – 02:28]

• Haley Stevens:

  • Congresswoman, ex-Obama admin staffer, flipped a suburban House seat in 2018.
  • Endorsed by party mainstream (Sen. Gary Peters, Gov. Gretchen Whitmer).
  • Positioning: "I'm just beating MAGA four times in my congressional races and I'm passing laws ... We don't need wish lists or, you know, in fights. We need action now. And that's what I've always been about. That's the Michigan way." (Haley Stevens, 02:01)

• Abdul El-Sayed:

  • Former health department head (Detroit, Wayne County).
  • Endorsed by progressives (Sen. Bernie Sanders, Rep. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez).
  • Distances self from Democratic Socialists officially but champions key left priorities like Medicare for All, abolish ICE.

• The Framing: The race is widely seen as establishment vs. insurgent, a microcosm of Democratic soul-searching post-2024 loss.

  • "It's the insurgents versus the establishment. And I think this is not atypical of a Democratic primary." (Ashley Lopez, 03:07)

---

2. Party Ideological Dynamics and Voter Appetites

[03:07 – 05:23]

• Traditional Democratic infighting between centrists and the left playing out in a battleground, not just safe blue districts.
• Michigan’s open primary allows (but rarely sees) independents to participate meaningfully.
• Ashley Lopez: "There is a uniform force among Democrats right now, which is that they're really upset at Republicans and their own party. ... Michigan's an interesting state to watch because ... this is a test case in a swing state and it's a statewide race."
• Unknowns: Will a left-leaning candidate’s win in a primary translate into electability in November?

---

3. Voter Perspectives and Priorities

[05:42 – 09:55]

• Voter Motivation: Deep discontent about affordability, healthcare, cost of living, and desire for new approaches, not just ideology.

  • "People are fed up. This is not working for the majority of people. Gas is expensive, groceries are expensive, Health care is insane." (Ashley Lopez quoting a local Dem, 06:24)

• Electability vs. Values:

  • Some prioritize perceived electability: "Who has the best chance of beating the Republican, that's gonna be my biggest priority." (Voter, 06:53)
  • Others focused on alignment: "I just want to vote for who I think will be the best representative for me and my beliefs." (Voter, 07:03)

• Ashley Lopez: "In the Democratic Party, there are two wolves. People voting with their head and people voting with their heart."

• Abolish ICE?

  • Seen as less salient this cycle, especially among centrists/swing voters; more relevant to activist left.
  • "Polling has shown that ... independent and more centrist voters would prefer reform to complete abolishment of ice." (Ashley Lopez, 08:08)
  • Cost of living and combating Trump are decisively top voter concerns.

---

4. Demographics and Electoral Geography

[09:15 – 09:55]

• Black voters remain key for Stevens; young voters and college towns are El-Sayed’s focus.
• Suburb swing voters (esp. West Michigan) could decide the race — both candidates are less known outside Detroit area.

---

5. The Israel Issue and National Party Fractures

[11:19 – 14:05]

• The race reflects national Democratic splits over Israel/Gaza.

  • Michigan’s significant Jewish and Arab communities render the issue especially salient.
  • AIPAC spending heavily for Stevens, opposing El-Sayed; El-Sayed campaigns against special interest money and calls to end aid to Israel.
  • "This is an issue ... where the broader electorate seems to be moving more towards the positions that people like Abdul Al Sayed have ... more skepticism, negative feelings about Israel ..." (Ashley Lopez, 12:03)

• Fallout from 2024’s "uncommitted" movement: Foreign policy now an activation issue for some Michigan voters.

• Although for most, economic and anti-Trump anxieties outweigh stances on Israel.

  • "Most of the voters I have talked to over the last week or so ... there are other topics that are the driving force behind their decision, namely, how the candidate can push back against President Trump and how they plan to address the cost of living." (Sam Greenglass, 13:20)

---

6. Broader Implications for the Party

[15:06 – 18:31]

• Alyssa Slotkin as a Model:

  • Won as a moderate in 2024 despite Harris losing Michigan to Trump; seen by some as offering lessons to Dems.
  • "It's not moderate versus progressive. ... It's people who are going to buck the system and fight or people who are going to stay and do the same old, same old." (Sam Greenglass quoting local Dem, 16:06)

• Michigan as Test Case:

  • Debate over whether Michigan's primary foreshadows the national party’s direction, especially as Michigan readies for a leading role in 2028’s presidential cycle.
  • Voter Joel Rutherford: "If the Democrats hopefully take the Senate and take the House, they better do something ... if they don't and it's just the same old, same old ... it's almost not going to matter then who the candidates are." (17:10)

• Potential Progressive Upset:

  • While El-Sayed isn’t the presumed front-runner, his rise signals real growth among party left dissatisfied by top-down leadership.
  • "It is at least a signal that there is a very loud, growing part of the party that doesn't like what Democratic leaders are sort of picking for them." (Ashley Lopez, 17:32)

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "We don't need wish lists or, you know, in fights. We need action now. And that's what I've always been about. That's the Michigan way." – Haley Stevens (02:01)
• "People are pissed. People are fed up. This is not working for the majority of people. Gas is expensive, groceries are expensive, Health care is insane." – Ashley Lopez, quoting Alyssa Diebolt, Macomb Dems (06:24)
• "Who has the best chance of beating the Republican, that's gonna be my biggest priority." – Voter Madison Miles (06:53)
• "I just want to vote for who I think will be the best representative for me and my beliefs. And then my decision became pretty easy from there." – Voter Elizabeth Schaefer (07:03)
• "In the Democratic Party, there are two wolves. People voting with their head and people voting with their heart." – Ashley Lopez (07:05)
• "Polling has shown that ... independent and more centrist voters would prefer reform to complete abolishment of ice." – Ashley Lopez (08:08)
• "Most of the voters I have talked to ... how the candidate can push back against President Trump and how they plan to address the cost of living." – Sam Greenglass (13:20)
• "It's not moderate versus progressive. ... It's people who are going to buck the system and fight or people who are going to stay and do the same old, same old." – Sam Greenglass quoting Debbie Rosenman (16:06)
• "If the Democrats ... take the Senate and take the House, they better do something okay? ... If they don't ... it's almost not going to matter then who the candidates are." – Joel Rutherford, Macomb Dems (17:10)

---

Important Timestamps

• Candidates Introduced & Ideological Framing: 01:18 – 04:36
• Voter Sentiment & Motivations: 05:42 – 09:55
• Demographic & Regional Considerations: 09:15 – 09:55
• Israel Debate & National Party Tensions: 11:19 – 14:05
• Michigan as Party Bellwether: 15:06 – 18:31

---

Final Thoughts

The Michigan Senate Democratic primary is more than a local contest: It’s a stress test of the party’s identity, strategy, and coalition-building ahead of a pivotal election year. Issues of electability, policy boldness, shifting attitudes on foreign policy, and the appetite for institutional change are in sharp relief. Whatever the outcome next Tuesday, the race will offer clues not only for Michigan but potentially for the future of the national Democratic Party.

Polls close Tuesday; expect further analysis once results are in.

Transcript

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

Support for this NPR podcast and the following message come from Carvana. Selling your car. Carvana has offers so good they're almost inexplicable. Sell your car 100% online in minutes. Visit Carvana.com today.

[Myles Parks]

Today we head to Michigan, where the Senate primary there is playing out like a mini war for the future of the Democratic Party. Arguments about electability, arguments about Israel and and arguments about what a successful campaign looks like in the Midwest after President Trump took the battlegrounds there two years ago. Let's get into it. It's the NPR Politics podcast. I'm Myles Parks. I cover voting.

[Ashley Lopez]

I'm Ashley Lopez. I cover politics.

[Sam Greenglass]

I'm Sam Greenglass. I cover Congress.

[Myles Parks]

And, Sam, you're coming to us from your home state of Michigan. I'm curious, when you get off the plane there, is there like a red carpet? Does Gretchen Whitmer, like, greet you at the airport? What's the deal?

[Sam Greenglass]

I wish. But, you know, Michigan in the summertime is like no place else. You've got the lakes, you've got beautiful weather. And there is really no place I'd rather be on the campaign trail in this particular season.

[Ashley Lopez]

From what I understand of Midwest summers, you were probably greeted by mosquitoes, right?

[Sam Greenglass]

Not as bad as Washington, D.C. okay, fair enough. We did have some smoke here and that outbreak with the lettuce, but now we're we're doing okay.

[Myles Parks]

Okay. So we're coming to you to talk about the Senate race that is super interesting in Michigan for this open Senate seat because Senator Gary Peters is retiring. That is critical. If Democrats win, want to retake the Senate. Republicans are eyeing it as well because President Trump won there just two years ago. Tell us, Sam, about the two Democrats who are running for the Senate seat.

[Sam Greenglass]

Okay, so I've spent some time now with both of these two candidates. You've got Congresswoman Haley Stevens. She's a former Obama administration staffer, and she flipped a suburban House seat back in 2018. And she's got, you know, the endorsements of more mainstream Democrats in the state of Michigan. Senator Gary Peters, who's retiring, as you mentioned, Governor Gretchen Whitmer. And this is a little bit about how she describes campaign.

[Ashley Lopez]

You know, I'm just beating MAGA four times in my congressional races and I'm passing laws and I'm doing damn good work. We don't need wish lists or, you know, in fights. We need action now. And that's what I've always been about. That's the Michigan way.

[Sam Greenglass]

Then you've got Abdul El sayed He ran the health departments in Detroit and Wayne county, and he's backed by progressive superstars like Senator Bernie Sanders and Representative Alexandria Ocasio Cortez.

[Myles Parks]

Problem, too often with the Democratic Party is that we have an instinct to say the right thing, but we're bought off by the people who are on the side of doing the wrong thing. And so we're constantly hedging and pulling punches. So we say not much of anything at all. I mean, it feels tempting to see this race as something we've talked about a lot this year, this feeling, this sort of outsider candidate. We talk about a lot with the Democratic Socialist candidates, though. I know El Sayed has made it clear he is not a Democratic Socialist. But I do feel like the dynamics feel similar when you've got this establishment Democrat like Haley Stevens who's got the backing of the Chuck Schumers of the world, and then you've got somebody saying the things that El Sayed is saying. I mean, do you see it similarly, Ashley?

[Ashley Lopez]

Yeah, it's the insurgents versus the establishment. And I think this is not atypical of a Democratic primary. When a party loses a big election like Democrats did in 2024, a big question is like, okay, where do we go from here? And primaries are kind of letting voters sort of guide where the party is headed. Of course, there's sort of like intra party drama, which always very fun as a political reporter to cover. But, you know, even though Abdullah Said is not a member of the DSA of the Democratic Socialists of America, a lot of his platform reflects that. And so that's why this is coming up a lot like Medicare for All, abolish ice, which are pretty popular among the left flank of the Democratic Party. Depending what issue I'm gonna pick, abolish ice, because that seems to be the least likely to be popular with more centrist members of the Democratic flank. Although these things are all sort of arbitrary, right? Like, there's a uniform force among Democrats right now, which is that they're really upset at Republicans and their own party. And that's what's playing out here. I will say, like, Michigan's an interesting state to watch because so much of this DSA versus establishment fight you've seen in blue states like New York and in congressional seats mostly, which are sort of tailor made to be a little more insulated from independent and centrist politics. You know, that's like, why those fights were happening.

[Myles Parks]

Right as we get this more like ideologically, this, like Jerusalem. America's very gerrymandered. We've got the extremes on both ends, and so that can bring out extreme candidates in those races.

[Ashley Lopez]

Right. And it's, you know, it's a place where Democrats can like, try new things and like, sort of like different kinds of candidates and keep a seat, which is the important thing here for the party. So, you know, this is gonna be an interesting one because it's a test case in a swing state and it's a statewide race. So it's just like a lot of things that there's a lot of unknowns, but it is like the dynamics of the infighting between the party is similar to what we've been seeing, but this is a very different field.

[Sam Greenglass]

And I should say we might not know the outcome of this test until the general election this fall because Senator Bernie Sanders, he won the Michigan Democratic primary in 2016. So it wouldn't be unexpected if El Sayed wins this primary. What I will be watching for is if that happens, can he win the state this fall?

[Ashley Lopez]

Yeah, it wouldn't be exactly the biggest upset for the more, as you were saying, the more ideological, left leaning candidate to win a primary, because in primaries it's the more ideological candidate that usually wins. Although Michigan does have open primaries, so independent voters can weigh in if they like to. It's just they don't in big numbers, like primaries, tend to be party faithfuls.

[Myles Parks]

Well, Sam, you've been talking to a lot of voters since you've been there. What are you hearing specifically about these two candidates?

[Sam Greenglass]

Yeah, so I've been talking to voters literally from the Detroit river all the way across to the west end of the state and Lake Michigan. And I asked this question that you raised to Alyssa Diebolt. She's chair of the Macomb County Democrats, of course, this critical county in metro Detroit. And she said something that Ashley has nodded at there, that this mood is not necessarily about where a Democrat sits on the ideological spectrum, but it's much more about maybe hunger for something new or that the existing approach to fighting Trump or addressing affordability just isn't working. People are pissed.

[Ashley Lopez]

People are fed up. This is not working for the majority of people. Gas is expensive, groceries are expensive, Health care is insane.

[Sam Greenglass]

But, you know, for a lot of voters, this decision has actually not been very easy. I talked to two voters at a beach at a state park on the coast of Lake Michigan, Madison Miles, and then Elizabeth Schaefer, and they kind of ended up falling on different sides of this dynamic when it comes to their vote.

[Ashley Lopez]

Who has the best chance of beating

[Myles Parks]

the Republican, that's gonna be my biggest priority.

[Sam Greenglass]

I just kind of decided that I don't want to think that way anymore,

[Ashley Lopez]

and I just want to vote for

[Sam Greenglass]

who I think will be the best

[Ashley Lopez]

representative for me and my beliefs. And then my decision became pretty easy from there. Ooh, then in the Democratic Party, there are two wolves. People voting with their head and people voting with their heart. I mean, it's a tension that's been in the party as well, which is like, do we pick a candidate that we think would stand up better to a Republican in a general election? The electability argument. Although I think the left makes the point that having fighters, no matter their policy, people who look like they're fighting the system as opposed to protecting it, like the left would argue that that's what voters are talking about here.

[Myles Parks]

I feel like we hear via your reporting, Ashley, from swing voters on this podcast all the time. And specifically, when I think about a candidate who has that abolish ICE message, I guess I'm just really curious. That hasn't really been battle tested yet in a general election, because we really haven't seen it. We haven't seen a general election since President Trump's really increased immigration enforcement efforts. Is that a message that those voters who you will need to get some of them to win a general election in a place like Michigan, Is that a message that those people are gonna be receptive to?

[Ashley Lopez]

No, but you have to remember one. This is a primary. So that probably plays less of an importance right now. But, yeah, you know, independent and more centrist voters would prefer reform to complete abolishment of ice. Polling has shown that, you know what? You and I have heard that from swing voters and battleground states across the country. And then the other thing is, like, how salient is Abolish ICE right now heading into this Michigan primary? Who knows if this will crop up again? Earlier in the year, this was a bigger issue. But there, I mean, I'm curious to hear from Sam, what actually are people most motivated to vote for right now? Because I would be surprised if it was abolish ice.

[Sam Greenglass]

Yeah, you know, I've heard this come up from a couple of voters, but Michigan has not had the same kind of pronounced response from ICE like we've seen in places like Minneapolis. And so it might be a bit less salient than some of these other issues. Cost of living came up all the time. The cost of health care, the cost of groceries and gas. I'd say that was the issue that I heard time and time again from people. And then just this concept of being able to push back against President Trump more broadly.

[Myles Parks]

I feel like I always like to hear, Sam, about the demographic groups that we're watching in a primary like this and then looking ahead to the general election. Do you have any thoughts on that in a place like Michigan?

[Sam Greenglass]

Yeah. I mean, you've got Congresswoman Haley Stevens really trying to boost turnout among black voters who have been a key part of her constituency. And then you also have Abdul El Sayed working to turn out young voters in college towns like Lansing and Ann Arbor. And then some of the swing voters in this race in the suburbs, especially in West Michigan, where these two candidates are less known. They're both from metro Detroit. Those are folks who could really make the difference in turning this election.

[Myles Parks]

Okay, let's take a quick break and then we're going to talk about Israel in just a moment.

[Ashley Lopez]

Support for this podcast and the following message come from Made in Cookware President and co founder Jay Kalik shares why he was inspired by his family's fourth generation kitchen supply business.

[Myles Parks]

Growing up in a commercial kitchen at home really opened my eyes to bringing what was cool in restaurants into your home. And when you think about what we do today, we are asking these chefs for product ideas. We are designing products together with them that we then realize a home cook can use as well.

[Ashley Lopez]

Learn more about Made in Cookware at M a d e I-ncookware.com this message comes from Betterment.

[NPR Sponsor Announcer]

Their automated investing and saving tools give you the quiet confidence of someone who knows where to put their money with tax smart tools that help grow your after tax returns year round. Get started [e-mail] that's B E T T E R M E N T.com investing involves risk performance, not guaranteed. Betterment is not a tax advisor nor should any information herein be considered tax advice. Please consult a qualified tax professional Support for this NPR podcast and the following message come from Carvana Selling your car. Carvana has offers so good they're almost inexplicable. Sell your car 100% online in minutes. Visit Carvana.com today.

[Myles Parks]

And we're back. So another theme that has been really big this year in Democratic primaries is Israel. And I gather, Sam, that this is coming up again in this race. Can you explain?

[Sam Greenglass]

Yeah. And one reason this debate has really been so fierce in Michigan in particular is because there are sizable Jewish and Arab communities here, especially in metro Detroit. And also that the pro Israel lobbying group is AIPAC has been spending millions to boost Stevens and Oppose Al Said because he supports ending aid to Israel and has also made calling out special interest money a really key part of his campaign message. So it's both about Israel and Gaza, but also about this broader concept of special interest money in politics.

[Ashley Lopez]

I mean, there are a few issues that in Democratic primaries right now seem to be. Be the biggest divider between establishment versus some of these insurgent candidates than aid to Israel. And this is an issue unlike Abolish Heis, where the broader electorate seems to be moving more towards the positions that people like Abdul Al Sayed have, which is having more skepticism, negative feelings about Israel, and a sort of dislike of the United States spending so much money on giving aid to Israel, especially at a time that people are feeling economic pinches in other directions. So it is an interesting test case because the leadership of the party seems to think that this is a position they can't really move on. But their voters have a different idea about this.

[Myles Parks]

Well, it's interesting. I feel like my impulse is to think that any sort of foreign policy issue is gonna be pretty low down on the list of priorities or things that voters are thinking about when they go to the ballot box. But in Michigan specifically, I mean, we talked a lot about the uncommitted movement there and the role that that played in Kamala Harris losing in 2024 to President Trump. The uncommitted movement, you know, really wanting to focus on the atrocities in Gaza. I guess I'm wondering, could this actually play a bigger role in Michigan specifically, do you think, Sam?

[Sam Greenglass]

You know, I think this could matter on the margins, and the margins do matter in a state that could be really narrowly decided like Michigan. And I think this could especially matter in some communities. I've met a handful of voters who do say that they are making their choice because of this issue and will sit out the fall election, or at least consider sitting out if their preferred pick loses, because they just cannot get behind the other because of this particular issue. But I got to say that most of the voters I have talked to over the last week or so, especially folks who are still undecided, there are other topics that are the driving force behind their decision, namely, you know, how the candidate can push back against President Trump and how they plan to address the cost of living.

[Ashley Lopez]

This fight over whether the Democratic Party is gonna change its position on Israel is part of a larger battle over whether the Democratic Party is willing to change its positions to meet their base or to meet Americans sort of where they're at, you know, because the right has shifted rightward. We have some pendulum politics in this country. The left has also moved leftward. And, you know, the Democratic Party sort of sitting in this position where its voters are sort of moving away from a candidate that's saying, like, I'm willing to meet our voters where they're at versus a candidate who's like, I'm gonna st. A position that the Democratic Party has held for a long time is emblematic of how the Democratic Party's gonna function on a lot of fronts. And there's a lot of frustration right now that the Democratic Party is not meeting the moment that they're not adequately changing the way they fight to meet, to fight against a party that has thrown out a bunch of norms and is acting in a way that we haven't seen political parties act in a long time. So, I mean, this is one of the bigger fights, I think, to see in a swing state, because its ramifications are about a little more than Israel, honestly.

[Myles Parks]

Well, Sam, the other thing I was thinking about as we were getting ready to tape this podcast is Alyssa Slotkin, the senator who won in 2024, a Democrat. She is one of the few Democrats who came out of 2024 unscathed. I feel like she won a state that Kamala Harris lost to President Trump. She beat Republican Mike Rogers, who is the likely Republican candidate for Senate again this year. I'm wondering how the candidates that you're talking to and the voters are thinking about Slotkin's campaign considering coming out of 2024. She was considered something of a North Star, and that people were talking about things that the Democratic Party could maybe take away from what she did.

[Sam Greenglass]

Well, then, yeah, I think Slotkin is actually a really good example that points to this dynamic maybe being a bit more complicated than where a Democrat specifically falls on the ideological spectrum. I was talking about this with Debbie Rosenman. She chairs the Birmingham Bloomfield Democrats in Oakland County. And she brought up Slotkin, who is a moderate Democrat, but. But frames things more as fight versus flight.

[Ashley Lopez]

It's not moderate versus progressive.

[Sam Greenglass]

She believes it's people who are going

[Ashley Lopez]

to buck the system and fight or people who are going to stay and do the same old, same old.

[Myles Parks]

That kind of fits in, I feel like, to exactly what we were just discussing. Ashley, that is so interesting. What else are you guys going to be watching before we close in this race? Sam, I want to start with you.

[Sam Greenglass]

You know, I think there's going to be a lot of conversation about whether the country can draw some bigger inferences about the future direction of the party from whatever happens in Michigan in this primary. I've talked to some voters who are not convinced that that will be the case, that Michigan is unique in some ways that might not necessarily extrapolate to other places, but many are going to be trying to make these connections, especially now that Michigan is set to host one of the really early presidential primaries in 2028. And I was talking about this with Macomb County Democrat Joel Rutherford, and he says, you know, in the mix of that conversation, there is one thing that he knows for sure and that he'll be watching. If the Democrats hopefully take the Senate and take the House, they better do something okay?

[Myles Parks]

People better see some real change because

[Sam Greenglass]

if they don't and it's just the

[Myles Parks]

same old, same old 28, it's almost

[Sam Greenglass]

not going to matter then who the candidates are. And you know, the other thing that Rutherford told me, he says if Democrats don't come together after this very messy and tense primary, then there is no way that they can win.

[Ashley Lopez]

I mean, it will be interesting if Abdul EL Sayed wins. For the most part, he was not, as he was not the front runner coming into this race. And the fact that he has been able to build so much support over the past several months up to a year is pretty interesting. It is at least a signal that there is a very loud, growing part of the party that doesn't like what Democratic leaders are sort of picking for them. Again, not super surprising sometimes when parties go through big losses, sort of looking in the mirror, who are we? Where do we go from here? Can be sort of a messy, messy fight. But I think in a state like Michigan, which, you know, this is why we're talking about this so much, it is an important state. It's a battleground state and it's a swing state. You know, the voters there, elections are just really close there, and the voters there represent a whole mix of demographics. You know, it is going to be something to watch. But again, as Sam also said, like the real fight will be come November.

[Myles Parks]

All right. Well, polls close on Tuesday, next week. So I'm sure we'll be talking about this race again very soon. Sam, have a great rest of your trip. And thanks so much for talking with us. I'm Miles Parks. I cover voting.

[Ashley Lopez]

I'm Ashley Lopez. I cover politics.

[Sam Greenglass]

I'm Sam Greenglass. I cover Congress.

[Myles Parks]

And thank you for listening to the NPR Politics podcast.

[Ashley Lopez]

This is Tonya Mosley, co host of FRESH air. Don't miss my interview with writer Gia Tolentino we talk about plastic surgery and how current beauty standards are changing our relationship to reality. It seems more explicitly anti human right now than ever before. There seemed to be something that's dovetailing with the age of AI. Listen to Fresh Air on the NPR app or wherever you get your podcasts.

[Sam Greenglass]

Are We Doomed? Looks at big problems. Nobody would rationally want nuclear war.

[Myles Parks]

That's not quite correct.

[Sam Greenglass]

How can we add friction?

[Ashley Lopez]

Put the launch codes inside somebody's chest cavity and you have to kill them to get them out.

[Sam Greenglass]

Are We Doomed? Solving humanity's biggest threats. Part of the NPR network. Listen wherever you get your podcasts.