The NPR Politics Podcast

Episode: Why Trump Says He Wants To Send The National Guard To Chicago And Portland
Date: October 8, 2025
Host(s): Tamara Keith, Domenico Montanaro, Tom Bowman, Ryan Lucas

Main Theme

This episode explores President Trump's latest efforts to deploy the National Guard to Democratic-led cities like Portland and Chicago amid rhetoric about crime and immigration, sparking both legal challenges and criticisms of federal overreach. The team unpacks the legal, political, and practical context behind these moves, contrasting them with more locally-invited National Guard deployments, and discussing the sharp partisan and public divides around using military forces for domestic law enforcement.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Status of National Guard Deployments

• [01:21–01:38] President Trump has attempted to deploy the National Guard in cities such as Portland and Chicago. Tom Bowman clarifies the current status:
  • The Guard has not yet deployed to those cities.
  • In Portland, a federal judge blocked the decision pending appeals.
  • In Chicago, a couple of hundred Illinois Guards are prepping for crowd control, while 200 Texas Guardsmen may soon protect ICE facilities.
• Notably, these moves face both legal hurdles and logistical complexity.

2. Trump’s Public Justifications

• [02:36–03:24] Tamara Keith and Domenico Montanaro discuss Trump's reasoning:
  • He cites illegal immigration and crime as primary justifications, emphasizing a failure of "radical left Democratic mayors" to control the situation.
  • Trump uses stark, often incendiary language, e.g., calling Portland a "war zone" and saying, "Chicago mayor should be in jail for failing to protect ICE officers. Exclamation point. Governor Pritzker also exclamation point." — Tamara Keith quoting Trump [03:05]

3. Legal and Political Implications

• [03:54–06:00] The team breaks down the legality:
  • Trump uses terms like "insurrection" to justify federalizing the Guard, which under Title 10, Section 12406, allows the president to intervene during invasions, rebellions, or if locals can't handle the situation.
  • The Insurrection Act (1807) historically enables this, though it has not been formally invoked yet; Trump publicly threatens to invoke it if courts or politicians hinder his actions.
• Tom Bowman recounts:
  "If you look at what's going on in the streets of Portland, I mean, it's quite mild there... there's clearly no war zone there, no insurrection." [03:54]

4. Military Concerns and the Blurring of Civil-Military Lines

• [06:39–07:56] Trump’s remarks about using cities as "training grounds" for military personnel trouble many military officials:
  • Bowman notes pushback: "They didn't sign up for the military to go after their own citizens. And clearly, cities are not training ground for the military." [06:53]
  • The episode highlights concerns over politicization, breaches of the apolitical tradition, and the danger posed by Trump’s language to constitutional norms.

5. Political Motivation and States’ Rights

• [08:02–09:15] The discussion underscores the political optics:
  • Trump is seen as targeting Democrat-led cities for political advantage, potentially distracting from faltering public perception of his economic performance.
  • Domenico: "It's states rights if conservatives are running those states, and it's not if Democrats are, because they feel like Democrats aren't doing the right thing." [09:15]

6. Comparison: Invited vs. Imposed National Guard Deployments

• [11:01–14:48] Ryan Lucas provides a contrasting example:
  • In Albuquerque, NM, the Democratic governor and mayor jointly invited the National Guard to assist with crime, focusing on "civilianization": Guards in polo shirts perform administrative tasks to free up police time; they do not perform law enforcement or appear militarized.
  • Mayor Tim Keller claims a resultant drop in crime; notably, community input is mixed, with some, like Dan Williams of the NM ACLU, warning, "It normalizes the idea of the military doing civilian law enforcement, which is a tradition almost as old as this country that we reject." [15:34]
  • This model is sharply contrasted with Trump's forced deployments.

7. Public Opinion and Media Influence

• [16:27–18:52] Domenico shares polling data:
  • Americans are split: 52% favor, 47% oppose using the National Guard in domestic crime-fighting; support is highly partisan.
  • Quote from Republican respondent Keith Herpe:
    “Entities such as, you know, the National Guard or whatever go in and to cities like Chicago and Seattle and Portland and where we’re having problems and, and fix the problem, which some people might view that as violence. I don’t. You’re putting down an insurrection, you’re doing your job. That’s what I believe.” [17:37]
  • Media diet significantly shapes public perceptions—Fox News’s coverage, for example, often depicts selected cities as chaotic "war zones," in contrast with on-the-ground realities and crime data.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• Trump’s Rhetoric and Threats

  • "Chicago mayor should be in jail for failing to protect ICE officers. Exclamation point. Governor Pritzker also exclamation point."
    – Tamara Keith quoting Trump [03:05]

• Blurring Civil-Military Boundaries

  • "They didn't sign up for the military to go after their own citizens. And clearly, cities are not training ground for the military."
    – Tom Bowman [06:53]

• Albuquerque as a Positive Case Study

  • "We brought in the National Guard in cooperation together in polo shirts and with no law enforcement ability at all and no fatigues and no military vehicles, and all they do is all the civilian work that was tying up the officer's time."
    – Domenico Montanaro quoting Mayor Tim Keller [12:16]

• ACLU Concerns

  • "It normalizes the idea of the military doing civilian law enforcement, which is a tradition almost as old as this country that we reject."
    – Dan Williams, ACLU New Mexico (quoted by Ryan Lucas) [15:34]

• Public Opinion Polarization

  • “Entities such as, you know, the National Guard ... go in and ... fix the problem, which some people might view that as violence. I don't. You're putting down an insurrection, you're doing your job.”
    – Keith Herpe, Georgia Republican voter [17:37]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 01:21 – Introduction to discussion of Guard deployments in Chicago/Portland
• 02:36 – Trump’s justifications and rhetoric
• 03:54 – Analysis of legality, use of “insurrection” language
• 06:39 – Military’s response to Trump’s desire to use U.S. troops in cities
• 08:02 – Political motivations behind Trump’s actions
• 11:01 – Albuquerque’s locally-invited and demilitarized National Guard deployment
• 14:17 – Community and ACLU reactions in Albuquerque
• 16:27 – Polling data and partisan divides
• 17:37 – Republican voter’s perspective
• 18:27 – How media shapes perception & why “invited” Guard deployments get less attention
• 19:39 – Historical context and concluding thoughts

Takeaways

• Trump's deployment of the National Guard to opposition-led cities is legally and politically contentious, and often at odds with crime data and local leadership perspectives.
• The contrasting case of Albuquerque demonstrates that locally-invited, non-militarized Guard support can help address immediate needs without invoking controversy or undermining local autonomy.
• Public opinion is sharply divided along partisan lines, with media narratives heavily influencing perceptions of urban security and the appropriateness of military involvement in civilian law enforcement.

This episode provides valuable context for understanding the intersection of politics, law, and public sentiment surrounding the deployment of military forces inside the United States.