Episode 950: The Growth Mindset

Summary

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The Official BNI Podcast – Episode 950: The Growth Mindset

Host: Dr. Ivan Misner
Guest: John Rivers, AOIT Consulting
Date: March 4, 2026

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Episode Overview

This episode explores the concept of a "growth mindset" within BNI chapters, focusing on cultivating a culture of inviting visitors and fostering sustainable chapter expansion. Dr. Ivan Misner interviews John Rivers, a 20-year BNI veteran and Chapter Support Director, who shares actionable strategies and personal experiences that led his chapter from stagnation to remarkable growth—both in membership and business generated.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Stagnation vs. Growth in BNI Chapters

[02:26–03:05]

• Many chapters plateau at a certain size and level of referrals, despite members’ best efforts.
• Rivers observes that ~80% of members don’t actively invite visitors.
• Ivan: “I call those people…they’re happy in their hole, and they don’t want a ladder.” [02:49]

2. The Power of Consistency: The 15-Minute Rule

[03:06–04:05]

• Rivers introduces the “15-minutes-per-day” method:
  • Dedicate a non-negotiable 15 minutes daily to inviting and following up with potential visitors.
  • This discipline led his chapter from 25 to over 70 members and closed business from $500,000 to $6 million annually.
• Rivers: “You spend 15 minutes per day and you put it on your calendar and you hold it sacred, and you invite and follow up for 15 minutes per day.” [03:11]

3. Shifting Culture: From Passive to Proactive Inviting

[04:05–05:04]

• Recognizing and celebrating members who invite regularly helps shift culture.
• Rivers: “Whatever gets recognized gets repeated.” [04:53]
• When more people embrace inviting, growth accelerates well beyond the “double-triple” effect (doubling members, tripling referrals).

4. The Aquarium Metaphor: Preparing for Growth

[05:07–06:24]

• Rivers tells a story of an 18-inch shark at an aquarium, stunted by the small environment, paralleling chapters limited by their spaces.
  • Key takeaway: Growth is constrained by both mentality and physical readiness (venue size, seating, etc.).
• Changing to a larger meeting space immediately drove growth.
• Rivers: “If you want to grow, prepare for growth—have enough room, name badges, and make visitors feel welcome.”

5. Intentional Visitor Experience

[06:24–08:13]

• In both online (Zoom breakout rooms) and in-person (“the dance”), it’s vital to:
  • Plan visitor introductions to key chapter members (especially referral partners).
  • Make visitors feel there’s space for them socially and physically.
• Rivers: “Have enough room that the visitors feel like there’s room for them to join and still have room to grow.” [06:18]
• Hybrid chapters enable broader participation (e.g., members driving hours, one joining from another state).

6. The “Dance”: Welcoming Visitors In-Person

[07:21–08:13]

• Process:
  1. Pre-printed name badges at registration
  2. Visitor host guides them to meet chapter leaders and members in their contact sphere
  3. 15 minutes of open networking leads to meaningful introductions

7. The Follow-Up: Where the Magic Happens

[08:14–09:57]

• Pre-meeting email sets expectations and offers a warm welcome.
• Rivers’ “magic sauce”:
  • Post-meeting phone call, asking:
    1. How was the meeting?
    2. Did you get the application? Any questions?
    3. Is there anyone you’d like to follow up with?
• Rivers: “Even if a visitor can’t join...doesn’t mean they can’t do business with the people in the chapter.” [09:47]

8. Maximizing Visitor Invites via Multiple Channels

[10:01–10:41]

• Uses LinkedIn, Facebook, Alignable, Craigslist, Eventbrite to find and invite guests.
• Practical conversation starters: “Who is the best pet sitter in the area?”—fosters warm referrals.
• Rivers: “I post the event...direct invite specific people, then ask—Who is the best pet sitter in the area?...What are you doing next Wednesday morning?”

9. ROI Justifies the Effort

[10:41–11:18]

• Rivers’ method led to a 10x increase in “thank you for closed business.”
• Misner: “Yes, you do have the time…if you’re going to have a 10x increase on ROI, that is a justification for the time to make connections and relationships.” [10:50]

10. Building Accountability and Sustaining a Culture of Inviting

[11:21–12:08]

• Start with 1–2 accountability partners who commit to regular inviting and follow-up.
• As the culture takes hold, more members get involved, multiplying results.
• Rivers credits BNI’s “Law of Reciprocity” (see Podcast #419): Giving (by bringing visitors) leads to reciprocal giving and business.

11. Personal & Chapter Growth

[11:57–12:08]

• Rivers’ commitment translated into tangible business growth:
  • From solopreneur to a team of 9 full-time employees over 7 years.

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Notable Quotes

• Ivan Misner [02:49]:
  “I call those people…they’re happy in their hole, and they don’t want a ladder.”

• John Rivers [03:11]:
  “You spend 15 minutes per day and you put it on your calendar and you hold it sacred, and you invite and follow up for 15 minutes per day.”

• John Rivers [04:53]:
  “Whatever gets recognized gets repeated.”

• John Rivers [06:18]:
  “Have enough room that the visitors feel like there’s room for them to join and still have room to grow.”

• John Rivers [09:47]:
  “Even if a visitor can’t join the chapter or doesn’t join the chapter, it doesn’t mean that they can’t do business with the people in the chapter.”

• Ivan Misner [10:50]:
  “Yes, you do have the time…if you’re going to have a 10x increase on ROI, that is a justification for the time to make connections and relationships.”

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:26] Stagnation and visitor invitation problem
• [03:06] The 15-minute daily inviting method
• [05:07] The aquarium and environment analogy
• [06:24] Visitor introductions and the value of being intentional
• [07:21] The “dance” in-person visitor process
• [08:14] The follow-up process and checklist
• [10:01] Leveraging multiple platforms to invite
• [11:21] Building accountability and sustaining the culture

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Final Takeaway

Adopting a growth mindset in a BNI chapter hinges on daily intention, consistent action, and a culture of proactive invitation and follow-up. By preparing your environment, honoring visitor experience, and holding each other accountable, your chapter can foster remarkable growth and amplify closed business for all members.

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Transcript

[A]

Episode number 950, the Growth Mindset.

[B]

You're listening to the official BNI Podcast with BNI Founder and Chief Visionary Officer, Dr. Ivan Meisner. Stay tuned for networking and referral marketing tips from the man who's been called the father of modern networking, along with suggestions and insights into getting the most from your membership in the world's largest networking organization, bni.

[A]

Hello, everybody, and welcome back to the official BNI Podcast. I'm Priscilla Rice, and I'm coming to you from Live Oak Recording Studio in Berkeley, California. And I'm joined on the phone today by the founder and the Chief visionary officer of BNI, Dr. Ivan Meisner. Hello, Ivan, how are you and where are you?

[C]

I am doing fantastic, Priscilla. And sometimes I feel like I'm in a young Frankenstein movie where at some point in the movie, the main character says, it's a miracle. It's because I'm home for like two months in a row, and it feels like a miracle. And I'm happy to. To be at my home office in Austin, Texas for a couple of months.

[A]

Oh, I'm glad for you. Well, what do you have to share with us today?

[C]

Well, I have a guest, and his name is John Rivers. John is celebrating his 20th year as a member of BNI with his company, AOIT Consulting. As a dedicated chapter support director, he's deeply passionate about helping chapters grow and thrive. And when John joined the Portland Business Advantage, the chapter had just 25 members. And since then, he's personally sponsored. Okay, sit down, everybody. 51 members.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

Helped the chapter expand to more than 70 members at this time. Outside of his IT work, John and his wife Anna love traveling, particularly to bni, national and global conferences and conventions, and visiting chapters around the world. John, welcome to BNI Podcast.

[D]

Thank you for having me.

[C]

It's good to have you. Our topic today is the growth mindset. And so I got a couple of questions, and I'm just going to let you run with it because I think. I think your content is really solid. How do you create a culture of inviting people for growth in a chapter?

[D]

Yeah, so I've been in BNI for 20 years, like you said, and I've seen chapters that get stuck at the same size, roughly the same number of members, and roughly the same amount of thank you for closed business. But no matter how hard they try, they stay at that same size. But I also found that about 80% of people don't invite visitors.

[C]

Yeah, you know, I call those people. They're happy in their hole, and they don't want a ladder.

[D]

Yes. And so in BNI Podcast 177, the double triple effect, you talk about if you double the chapter size, you triple the number of referrals.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

And when I joined Portland Business Advantage, we had about 25 members. We'd go up a couple and down a couple, and we always stayed roughly around $500,000 for a couple of years. And I knew that I couldn't ask anyone else to do something I wasn't going to do myself. So I learned an inviting method from Dr. Ben Reebs. And it's really simple. You spend 15 minutes per day and you put it on your calendar and you hold it sacred, and you invite and follow up for 15 minutes per day. And over the last seven years, we grew from 25 members, and now we're over 70 members with over $6 million a year. And thank you for closed business.

[C]

Okay, so to heck with my triple effect. You have gone way over that. And so I try to be conservative in the numbers that I give, but what I love about comments like yours is that I tend to, to, you know, like, give the low end, what you've just described as the high end of what can happen when you, when you double or triple your chapter.

[D]

Yeah. And. And now we have many people in the chapter that regularly bring visitors. And that's how I think we've seen a culture change and the growth mindset of the people that are with us now want to continue to see the chapter grow because that the numbers reflect more than just that double, triple, triple effect, like you were saying.

[C]

Right. And so before people understand that, they kind of wonder, you know, what's in it for me? You want to talk about that?

[D]

Yeah. So whenever somebody says to me, how do I get that same effect in my chapter? I asked them, what are you looking for from B and I? Is it to get more money? Is it more connections and more referral partners? And so in order to start growing your business, you just need to dedicate 15 minutes per day in inviting and following up. And for the leadership teams out there, if you see someone doing this, recognize them. It is one of our core values and we want whatever gets recognized gets repeated.

[C]

Yeah, yeah, good point. Love that.

[D]

So I went to an aquarium locally that had an 18 inch shark. And I said, that's the smallest shark I've ever seen. And the employee that was working there said, that shark is actually full grown in this aquarium, but if we were to release it into the ocean, it would grow to 6 to 8ft long. And I feel like so many chapters are stuck because they're in a small aquarium. My chapter was stuck at 50 members for a couple of years. And the room that we were in was beautiful, but it was cramped. We just didn't have enough chairs for members. Or we had enough chairs for members, but not enough for visitors. We had people standing against back wall, maybe a chair in a corner, and we switched to a larger venue. It was. It had more room, more chairs, and we almost instantly grew 10 new members.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

So I tell people to be ready for that growth, to have that growth mindset first. Let's be prepared. Let's print name badges ahead of time for our visitors.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

Introduce the visitors and say, not only are you going to meet me, but let me introduce you to one of my colleagues in the chapter that's going to be a great referral partner for you. Run a great meeting, have enough room. And not just have enough room for your members, but have enough room that the visitors feel like there's room for them to join and still have room to grow.

[C]

Yeah, it's really an issue of intention and attraction, isn't it? I mean, if you have an intention to grow, you need to have a room big enough to grow. And then you have the focus on the attracting visitors, which is your 15 minutes a day.

[D]

Exactly. So on Zoom, we actually, we plan ahead of time. We look at the visitor registration list, and we put our visitors into a breakout room with two members in their contact sphere. Now, this also requires our members to show up early so that they're there for the breakout rooms. But then at the end of the meeting, the visitors say, man, what's really started this meeting off so great is I got to meet two of my ideal referral partners right away when I got here.

[C]

Now, wait a minute now, because you're talking about Zoom, are you doing online meetings or in person or a hybrid?

[D]

So my chapter is hybrid. So we get to.

[C]

Okay, got it. So it's in person in part, and online in part. By the way, I love hybrid, the concept of hybrid chapters. I'm a supporter.

[D]

Yeah. My chapter actually has a member in Boise, Idaho. Our chapter base is in Portland, Oregon. We have people at the beach. People drive three to six hours for our meeting. And that's. We have five or six people that drive over an hour to get to the meeting. So it's amazing. So in person, we do the dance, which. This is where a visitor comes up to the visitor registration table. They get their name badge that was pre printed for them. They get to go set their stuff down, maybe get a cup of coffee. The visitor host will then walk them up and introduce them to the president for 60 seconds, then move them down to the vice president, then the secretary treasurer, and then people in their contact sphere. So 15 minutes of open networking. That visitor meets 15 people, which after the meeting they get to go meet those and those members that they want to follow up with and possibly do business with.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

And then the fortune is in the follow up. We've heard that all over. But I teach my process for how to invite and follow up. It's easy and repeatable and you just put it on your calendar for 15 minutes per day. Now, I taught one person that he wasn't getting the same results I was and I found out he wasn't following up.

[C]

Yeah, that's, that's key and I want to get to that. But let's just review what you just said. Have enough room and chairs for the visitors, have name tags, prepare members to meet specific visitors. I love that you introduce them to the leadership team. I think that's great. All right, so engaging with visitors as a follow up. Talk about that.

[D]

Yeah. So here's how I follow up. Before the meeting, I send an email, what to expect at our meeting. I tell them the time, the location, a few details about the meeting. And I say I will meet you at the door. And I, I make sure that I'm there early, even though I'm not on the visitor host team or on the executive leadership team. And in person, I help with the dance. And on, on zoom, I help greet the, the visitors in breakout rooms.

[C]

Yeah.

[D]

So, but the magic sauce behind this whole process is after the meeting, I pick up the phone and I call visitors.

[C]

Oh, here, here.

[D]

And I actually asked them three questions, open ended questions. Number one, did, how was the meeting? Number two, did you get the application? Do you have any questions on application? And number three, is there somebody in the meeting that you didn't get the information for, but you would like to follow up with them?

[C]

That's a great question.

[D]

Remember, even if a visitor can't join the chapter or doesn't join the chapter, it doesn't mean that they can't do business with the people in the chapter. So make sure you're making those connections for your members.

[C]

Yeah. And now Your chapter is $6 million a year on average.

[D]

Yes. So amazing with all those things. I use LinkedIn, Facebook, Alignable, Craigslist, Eventbrite. I use all these different websites to go out and invite visitors. I Post the event on where our meeting is going to be. I direct invite specific people for the chapter and then I also ask the question, who is the best pet sitter in the area? And comes up and says, oh, this is my, my pet sitter. I'll pick up the phone and call that person and say, sally sue said you're the best pet sitter in the area. What are you doing next Wednesday morning? Are you able to come to my B and I meeting?

[C]

I love it, absolutely love it. And, and what I love about it is, you know, people sometimes will be thinking, I can't, I don't have time to do all that. But wait a minute. You, you know your chapter went from $500,000 and thank you for closed business to $6,000,000 in thank you for closed business. So yes, you do have the time to do that. If you're going to have a, a 10x increase on ROI, that, that is a justification for the time to make connections and relationships. Well, listen, we're talking about time. We're almost out of time. What's the easiest way for a chapter to start building a culture of living?

[D]

Yeah, so the easiest way is to say living.

[C]

I meant inviting.

[D]

Yes. The easiest way is to find one other person that's an accountability partner in your chapter. If you're lucky enough, you might even get two. With two to three dedicated members that are sending out regular invites and inviting visitors and following up. Then the new members will actually join the chapter and join the inviting team and they'll start inviting new members and following up and pretty soon you'll have a culture of inviting. Over the last seven years, I started out as a solopreneur. I now have nine full time employees. And if you listen to the B and I podcast, 419, the Law of Reciprocity, it says the more that you give to the people around you, the more they're going to want to give back to you. And I think bringing visitors is one of the biggest ways to give to the people around you.

[C]

Yeah, absolutely. And it ends up in generating more and more business for everybody in the room. And that's the key. That's what I want. I want everyone to just get a boatload of referrals and what you've just described is a fantastic way to do that. John, thank you so much for being on the BNI podcast, John Rivers. And John's website is a oitconsulting.com thanks for being here, John. I appreciate it.

[D]

Thanks so much.

[C]

Over to you, Priscilla.

[A]

Oh, great. Thank you Ivan well, that was wonderful, John. Thanks so much. I think that's it for this week. This podcast is sponsored by MeisnerAudioPrograms.com these audio programs will provide you with the tools and the inspiration to powerfully enhance your B and I experience. So check out the great material that's available to [e-mail] and then use the promo code IVAN5O for 50% off of everything. All of the proceeds go to the B and I Foundation. Thank you so much for listening. This is Priscilla Rice and we look forward to having you join us again next week for another exciting episode of the official B and I Podcast.

[C]

Sam.