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The Portrait System Podcast
How To Stand Out & Charge Higher Prices in a Saturated Market with Tristin Tracy
00:54:24
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- [00:00]
A
Hey there, it's Nikki Klosser and I want to let you know about an awesome free giveaway for people on our email list. If you haven't already, click the link in our podcast description or go to theportraitsystem.com signup to get on the list. If you sign up, you'll get a free posing 101 PDF to jumpstart things. It's an epic PDF, so you'll definitely want to get this. Also, just by being in our email community, you'll get deals, sales, and information about any of our upcoming events and activities. So head over to theportraitsystem.com signup and and sign up. Today you're listening to the Portrait System podcast.
- [00:35]
B
I saw other photographers like you mentioned, Elena S. Blair, you know, making a lot of money doing this and I stopped to think, okay, like, even if there are a lot of photographers, you know, there's a way to stand out and there's a way to make some real money doing this.
- [00:54]
A
Welcome to the Portrait System Podcast. I'm your host, Nikki Klosser, and this show is here to help you succeed in the world of photography and business. To help you learn to become financially free, doing what you love and so much more. With over 1 million downloads, countless photographers have taken what they've learned from both our episodes and from theportraitsystem.com and they have grown their businesses, quit their day jobs and are designing a life of their dreams. We keep it real and share stories about the ups and downs that come with running a photography business. You'll hear real life stories of how other photographers run their business and you'll learn actionable steps that you can take to reach your own goals. And thank you so much for being here. And let's get started. Hey everyone, it's Nikki Klosser here. My guest this week on the Portrait System podcast is Tristan Tracy. Tristan is a family maternity, surprise proposal and newborn photographer in Santa Barbara, California. Santa Barbara is one of those cities that is very saturated with tons of photographers charging next to nothing and she shares with us how she stands out and books clients at a higher price point. Her marketing game is really strong and you're going to want to hear this. Tristan also shares some ways that she does some unique upsells that are also very interesting. And she has been successful in her business only for four years. She started her business four years ago and what she has accomplished has been incredible. And that's not only because of her really stunning images, but mostly because of the Work she has put into it. Okay, let's get started with Tristan Tracy. Hi, Tristan. Welcome to the Portrait System podcast. How you doing?
- [02:27]
B
I'm great, Nikki. Thanks for having me.
- [02:29]
A
Yeah, I'm excited. One of the reasons I really love WPPI is because of the opportunity to meet so many other photographers in our industry, and you're one of them that I got to meet. We were having cocktails together with Elena Blair.
- [02:43]
B
I know. I was so excited. You're sitting next to me like, oh, my gosh, she's amazing.
- [02:48]
A
It was fun. It was such a fun week. And, yeah, like I said, I can't tell you how many guests I end up just chatting it up with. And I end up thinking, like, wow, you would be a really guest for the really great guest for the podcast. That's kind of what happened. So.
- [03:04]
B
Yeah. Yeah. Thank you.
- [03:06]
A
Yeah. I'm excited to hear all about your business and your story, and this will be a good one. And you shoot mostly families with some newborn sprinkled in, is that right?
- [03:17]
B
Exactly. Yes. Family Maternity is one of my very favorites. Newborn. And then I just sort of, by chance started doing surprise proposals, and that part of my business really took off.
- [03:28]
A
That's exciting. Very cool. All right, well, let's back up a little bit. Have you always been a photographer? Is this something new? New for you, or is this something you've been doing, you know, all along?
- [03:38]
B
It is something that I have been doing all along. I took photography classes as an elective all throughout junior high and high school, so for six years, and I just loved it. I loved the dark room. I loved how you could manipulate these images. And then digital came around, and we kind of played around with that and Photoshop, and at the time, Brooks Institute was in Santa Barbara. I don't know if you've ever heard of that. It's a photography college, and there were so many photographers in town. Every year, you know, a new. A new group would come in. So, unfortunately, photography wasn't really valued and wasn't seen as a career that you could make money in, because there were so many in town here. So I thought, okay, you know, that's a bummer, but, you know, okay. So I had a whole career in fine jewelry, which I really loved, and I kind of realized this afterwards is that I was taking photos all throughout that time, too. I was doing a lot of product photography, both for clients who were looking to make purchases, you know, from a different state or show, you know, their spouse something that they saw. But also I was doing a Lot of photographs for our ads and, and things like that. And so when I looked back on it and I knew that I loved families, especially after having my son. I just loved being around kids and working at his preschool and being really involved with it. I realized I've been doing photography like non stop sort of my whole life, but in a different way for a few years.
- [05:06]
A
Okay, so, and just so people know, Santa Barbara is in California. So you know people who aren't in the states or who might not know exactly where Santa Barbara is.
- [05:14]
B
Yes.
- [05:14]
A
And it's interesting because there are a lot of towns, I think most, most towns have a ton of photographers in them. Now. Back then you said you didn't think it was valued, there were so many photographers, but you're still in Santa Barbara. I imagine there are still a million photographers. What changed that? All of a sudden you're like, okay, I think I can, you know, create a business out of this, whereas before you didn't think you could.
- [05:39]
B
Yeah, that's a good question. I think that I saw other photographers like you mentioned, Elena S. Blair, you know, making a lot of money doing this. And I stopped to think, okay, like, even if there are a lot of photographers, you know, there's a way to stand out and there's a way to make some real money doing this. And I started digging, digging into it and there were a lot of, and there are a lot of family photographers, but there aren't a lot of them that are charging a premium. And I know working in fine jewelry, there's jewelry stores everywhere of all different price points. Some people want to spend a lot of money on jewelry and others don't. And that relates with photography as well. Some people want the best, most expensive photographer, or at least a premium photographer to photograph their family or to photograph their surprise proposal. And so just because there's a lot or quite a few of lower priced photographers doesn't mean that there aren't enough clients that want to spend more money.
- [06:39]
A
Absolutely. There was this, this post in my local Chelsea Facebook group recently and I want to read it to you. Okay, so it says, I've searched previous posts and haven't found what I'm looking for. I'm in search of a more high end family photographer. Usually people ask for a budget photographer. However, I'm looking for someone who creates two true works of art, quality over quantity of photos. Someone who will discuss outfit choices with me ahead of time. You know, and she just goes on and on. And so she said, you know, as the mom who is Always the one taking the snapshots and never in them. Family portraits are my chance to be in photos. I wanna feel beautiful and I want someone who values this. And I'm like, duh. Like I was so happy to see that. And there's tons of comments in there. So you're right. There are people out there who are willing to spend who want the extra service like in there.
- [07:32]
B
It's like they want an experience. Yeah, a luxury experience.
- [07:35]
A
Exactly. She said, I want someone who poses every limb and not just because, you know, I didn't read the whole thing, but part. And not just a generic stand over there. Someone with a classic true to color editing style. Not just a trendy fad one, you know. So she goes on and on about what she wants. But just to your point. Yeah, there are some people who are truly looking for a budget, but there are other people who are not. And there are a lot of clients out there like that.
- [08:03]
B
Yeah. Especially being in a tourist destination. I'm lucky that way. There are a lot of people who are coming up, staying at really nice hotels, looking to make their weekend or week long trip memorable. And this is an amazing experience that I can offer them of them coming together and remembering their trip, remembering their time and celebrating it.
- [08:24]
A
Now, looking through your. I'm just checking out your family portfolio now and it is so, so beautiful. I would hire you in a heartbeat.
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B
Thank you.
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A
It looks like it's all natural light.
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B
Yes.
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A
Yeah. Okay. That's what I thought. There's a lot of golden hour. There's a lot of glowy light. There's so much emotion and interesting composition. I mean just the color tones, everything is very true to life. Classic. I really love it. But that said, you can have a really, really gorgeous portfolio and no one might find you. Your phone might be not ringing or your emails not blowing up. So, you know, how do you. In such a saturated market where you do have all of these budget photographers around you, how do you make people find you?
- [09:13]
B
Yeah, well, that's multifaceted for sure. The biggest way is I've really learned about SEO. I've optimized my website. I've spent a lot of time writing blogs and curating information, answering questions and trying to kind of build up my website as much as possible to rank really well on Google. And I do. I rank number one for family photographer. Oh, I can pull it up. I have it right here. I rank number one for newborn Santa Barbara newborn photographer. I ranked second for Santa Barbara vacation photographer, second for Santa Barbara proposal photographer. Second for maternity photographer, and even for photographers in Santa Barbara, I rank third. So it's pretty, pretty good. I've spent a lot of time working on that.
- [10:04]
A
The thing is real quick though, I mean, I know we're not going to get a whole lot into SEO, but do you do it yourself?
- [10:12]
B
I do. Okay, well, I have help. So I've learned a lot from Elena S. Blair and I heard this great speaker, Mary Beth Bryant, and I've worked with her about twice a year. I schedule hour long calls with her and she looks through my website and tells me where I need to improve. So I've done all of the work myself, but I've definitely hired experts to tell me what I need to know. Right. What am I missing? Where can I improve? What's confusing? How is Google seeing this and searching it now?
- [10:45]
A
I'm wondering if something that comes along with being at the top of Google searches, do you get a lot of tire kickers who are just looking for that budget friendly photo shoot and if so, are you able to convert them into paying clients?
- [11:00]
B
I actually get very few clients who are wasting my time or who are. Occasionally someone will ask for my pricing in the submission request. They'll ask me, you know, what's my availability and what's my pricing? And that's like a red flag of okay. They didn't spend a lot of time on my website. They didn't obviously look at the pricing page because I'm really transparent.
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A
Right.
- [11:23]
B
I want everyone to know what I, what I am priced at for that exact reason. But my conversion rate's pretty high. I book at least half the clients who inquire from me. Maybe a little more.
- [11:34]
A
Oh, that's great.
- [11:35]
B
So, yeah, it's, it's not bad at all.
- [11:38]
A
All right, so, and I do see you have an extensive pricing page on here. So if people are really, you know, interested, they're gonna, they're gonna go through and look, it makes it pretty obvious. Yeah, for sure. So tell people just so everyone has an idea of, you know, where, where do you start at with your packages and what's your average sale if you know that?
- [12:00]
B
Oh yeah. So I'm an all inclusive photographer, so really I just have one price. It's 1250 for a family session, same for maternity, newborn proposal session. All is $12.50. I do have a, that is a maternity and newborn package put together with a discount. But really I just, I want it to be obvious. This is the price, this is what you pay. You're gonna get 75 plus. Digital images both in color and black and white. And I include a luxury photo album in that as well. I like for my clients to have something tangible, something real that they're excited to look at, that they'll leave on their coffee table, show to friends and family when they come to visit. I will have clients often buy multiple albums afterwards to give as gifts to family members. So that's a really special part of my, my session.
- [12:49]
A
Okay. I noticed also that you do have an upsell for a cinematic film to go along with, so I would guess that that would increase your average.
- [12:59]
B
It does, yeah. I would say maybe one in seven to ten sessions. Add that. Add on for a family film or any sort of proposal film. It does make my session on just a little bit longer and. But yeah, it's. I love doing it. Passionate about it. It's so much fun to be able to bring the photos to life with movement. And I'm very movement based anyway, so it's neat to be able to, to capture that as well. And actually expedited gallery delivery is an upsell that I do get fairly often. I'd say maybe one in every four sessions. They purchase that as well.
- [13:36]
A
So you say instead of like, how much time does that cut down on?
- [13:41]
B
So Instead of the three week delivery time frame, they get sneak peeks within 48 hours and the full gallery delivered within one week.
- [13:48]
A
Okay, that's a really interesting upsell. I don't think I've ever heard of that before. Very cool.
- [13:53]
B
Yeah, it's common in wedding photography and I figured why not bring some of those add ons that you commonly see with weddings to families. And it's especially for surprise proposals. They are so excited, they want to see the photos right away. They want to post about it on social media. And so I was getting people asking for sneak peeks and I was not feeling great about it. You know, I same I try to take, you know, Sundays off and usually proposal sessions are on Fridays or Saturdays. And so I was feeling a little frustrated that I wasn't able to have my full day off. And I was like, well this is obviously something people want, so how can I feel good about it? And you know what, price work works well for me and my workflows and so it's something that when they add it on, I'm excited about it. Like great, you know, happy to do it.
- [14:41]
A
Yeah. No resentment. You don't, you know, for your time. Yeah. The way I do packages where it comes with a specific number of photos per package. So a sneak Peek isn't. Doesn't make sense because it's. I would be giving them some photos in advance that they could just then not purchase. You know what I mean?
- [15:01]
B
Exactly.
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A
For something like this, that, that definitely. Or if they did prepay for a pack ahead of time, then I could, you know, I don't know, figure that out. But yeah, I like that idea. Very cool. Okay, so going back to marketing again, standing out in a super saturated market, you have SEO and what are the other things that you do that bring people in?
- [15:21]
B
So one of the biggest things that I found is just community marketing, like getting out in my community and telling people that I'm a photographer. This was especially crucial in the beginning stages because my website was not ranking anywhere. You could do a search for Tristan Tracy, and my website wouldn't even even come up. Right. In those early days, I was like, oh my gosh, you know, what am I gonna do? So I just started working every connection I had, you know, every, like the yoga studio that I went to, my child's preschool, you know, any, any community outreach that I could do, I did it. And what I realized pretty quickly is that was actually really effective. Of course, starting with someone, you know and a business, you know, is effective, but it sort of gradually turned to businesses that I didn't know. Outreaching to resorts and boutique hotels, reaching out to parent focused nonprofits like PEP or Mama Toto, you know, any of those mom groups for newborns, children's music lessons. I just started to like, find anywhere I could that had my ideal client. And at the time, those were families. And I mentioned that it sort of pivoted because one of the resorts that I worked with asked me if I'd ever photographed a proposal before. And I, or they actually, they asked me if I could photograph a proposal, not if I'd have photographed one before. I said, yes, I can photograph one, sure. And in my mind I'm thinking, oh my gosh, like quick Google, what, What do you do to photograph a proposal? So I, you know, did some research. I figured out, okay, what am I going to do? And it didn't make sense to charge my, my price point for just like a ten minute thing, right. Of just the actual proposal. So I figured, okay, I'm going to photograph the proposal, but then I'm going to take them on this little photo shoot afterwards. So I kind of combined the proposal and the engagement shoot so that I can charge more.
- [17:12]
A
I like that.
- [17:13]
B
What I realized is, is there are so many proposals happening in Santa Barbara. There's probably five a day, if not more happening. And so there's a huge demand for it. So I started making a pricing page for it. I started writing blog posts about it. I started making a portfolio specifically for it. And then what I kind of realized is why don't I make like a mini website or a mini page for these different hotels with photos just from proposals at their hotel. And they loved it. So I started making these custom pages, talking about the hotel, how I work with the concierge to deliver this beautiful session, you know, seamless experience. And they, the hotels will send these URL links to prospective clients. So they're like cheerleaders for me. I couldn't believe it.
- [18:07]
A
And that is amazing.
- [18:09]
B
Hotel guests always want to know, you know, what's the setup going to look like? What's this going to look like? What's that going to look like? So I'm giving the hotel like all these images that they can use to easily answer these questions. So it's been a huge win, win. And I had no idea that I'd get so many business from the hotels. And so there's about five main ones that I work with. And every maybe six months I try to reevaluate, okay, what hotel haven't I reached out to, you know, where, where can I get a few more on board? Because it's, it's so lucrative.
- [18:41]
A
Wow. Now are you only doing this with, with surprise proposals or are you also offering family sessions through the hotels? Like, is that something they'll also market for you?
- [18:51]
B
It is something they'll also market for me. However, the demand is not as high, so I will certainly do family sessions, baby moons, you sessions. I'll get through hotels as well, but it's not at the same rate that they're referring proposal sessions to me.
- [19:07]
A
And I feel like this could really differ depending on where you're at. I mean, if you live somewhere near like a, you know, a roller coaster park or, you know, Disney World or, I don't know, somewhere that families may travel, even campgrounds, you know, whatever. I feel like that's something that even I'm just thinking like a campground, you know, that they could market for you where you are, you know, there's so many different ways to do this.
- [19:36]
B
Yeah. I've tried to reach out to a glamping company here in town and haven't gotten as much traction with them. But I absolutely agree that there, there is you just once you start thinking about it and like brainstorming locations near you of where families travel you know, who might have a budget to pay for this sort of thing. Like, the sky's the limit now.
- [19:59]
A
What do you think? Like, what does the hotel really get out of it? I guess.
- [20:04]
B
Yeah. So I, you know, I hate the word kickbacks, but I know that they're getting them from other vendors like wine tasting and sailing tours and all that. So I, I don't make it a one for one. I don't say you referred this client to me. Here's X amount of dollars. I try to keep it more general, but I will give them a card every May, three months or so, six months maybe, with some cash in it. And then I do an extra, extra nice one at Christmas time because I'm making money and I want to share that love with them. I try to go early to any sort of session, but especially proposal session, and I chat with them. I see, you know, how are you doing? I'm friendly. I'm interested in what they're up to, what they're doing. And so I make friends with them. And.
- [20:48]
A
Yeah, and I think this is really important. And the reason I ask this is I don't want people to just all of a sudden approach businesses about this sort of thing because you have to really consider what are they getting out of it. And maybe that means if your client allows you to, you're sharing some of the highlights of the photos that they can use in their own marketing on their Instagram, on their website. And, you know, and then all of a sudden I just keep going back to this campground thing. But this campground now has these gorgeous photos on their property of families that they can use in their own marketing. You know, maybe that is the pitch. If it's not going to be money, you know, there's so much.
- [21:27]
B
Yeah, I try not to talk about the money part of it at all. And I have a whole course actually that I've written about this and it talks about what will the business get out of it. And so different businesses have all different types of needs. I've partnered with my local birth center and so they can really use headshots for their staff. The midwives would really enjoy their own family sessions. So that's something that I offer them complimentary. I want them to have this experience before they recommend it to a maternity client who's sitting in their office. You know, sort of a vulnerable thing to. To recommend someone without trying it ahead of time. So every business has something different that they need. Maybe it's branding shots. I work with cultural landmarks. They definitely need photos. For their social media, they need landscape photos, close up photos, you know, anything new that they're working on. So yeah, I really try to think about what this business could use, what they need and then I talk about that and the amazing amenity that I'm offering their guests. If it's a hotel, you know, the experience that I'm going to do this perfectly, they're not going to have unhappy guests. So yeah, every business is different. Absolutely. And the money part is just a bonus. I don't even talk about it.
- [22:41]
A
Yeah. Are there other, other than hotels, are there other businesses that you've partnered with that this has been successful with?
- [22:48]
B
Yeah, yeah. Many the most lucrative have been hotels, but probably the second is birth centers, midwives. It's, it's something that clients are paying extra for. You know, it's, it's cheaper to have a hospital birth. So right when, when they're having a birth center birth, you know, they're really considering this. It's an important experience for them. And so photography goes beautifully with clients who are using a birth center, both maternity and newborn and even some birth. I've gotten birth clients out of it too if that's something. There aren't a lot of birth photographers out there, but.
- [23:27]
A
Right. Yeah, that's a very interesting niche to be in. It's like you have to be on call.
- [23:32]
B
It is, yeah. It's a little bit more tricky and I don't do many of them at all. But it was an interesting experience. I talked about parent focused nonprofits and cultural landmarks. There are like kids music lessons. You know, that's a really great place because the parents probably sitting off to the side in a waiting area. You could leave a postcard like a double. I have a double sided postcard that I leave out for them to see as they're waiting for their children child to finish up. You know, some sort of music lesson. Schools is another big one where you can photograph the school and then you put in your postcard talking about your family photography so you could get hired again. But yes, there are lots of different businesses in town to reach out to.
- [24:17]
A
Yeah, that's really great. And I want to encourage people again if it's a birth center, you know, whatever it is, make sure you are making it valuable to them and their clients as well. It's not just hey, can you give people my stuff? You know, you have to.
- [24:31]
B
Yeah. If it's one sided, you won't get anywhere. You have to talk about how you're wanting to help the business, business, how It's a partnership and you have to really be interested in hearing their needs, you know, asking questions, ask a lot more questions and just listen before speaking.
- [24:46]
A
Yeah, absolutely. And like you said, when, you know, you get there early, you're talking with people, you're building a connection and a relationship. People are going to refer you if they know, like and trust you. And that is a huge part of it. Become their client first. I mean, birth center would be a little, you know, if you're not pregnant, that's a little bit tough. But, but, you know, find ways to connect with people who work there. You know, offer a free photo shoot for one of the doulas or, you know, I mean, there's just, there's so many ways that you can kind of get in with people in order to start building that relationship and those connections.
- [25:21]
B
Oh, absolutely. Photography is such an interesting career choice because you can really service anyone. Anyone can have value in photography, different types of photography, but really your services can be used for anything.
- [25:34]
A
So, yeah, absolutely.
- [25:35]
B
Sky's the limit.
- [25:37]
A
Hey, just a quick break to tell you that since you're here listening, you have access to a really great offer for our listeners only. We have a special promo code you can use to get 50% off the cost of membership. Just go to theportraitsystem.com or click the link in the description and use the promo code PODCAST50 to get 50% off of a membership. We rarely discount membership, so this is a big deal. As I hope you already know, the membership is how I and so many guests on this podcast reached our success. And it gives you access to countless amazing videos, an awesome community, and all the tools you need to build a massively successful business. So use the code podcast50Now to join the community and to start building the business of your dreams. I'll see you there. Okay. I mean, it really sounds like, you know, your marketing is multifaceted. I mean, you truly have, you know, like you said, you've got the SEO, you've got your boots on the ground. Really business to business marketing like crazy. You're talking to people. Your website is phenomenal. I mean, it sounds like you have really put in the time and the effort and the work in the marketing side of it. And especially like you said, when you're first starting out, this is really, really, really important.
- [26:53]
B
It's. Yeah, it's so important. And in the very beginning, you need to build a portfolio. And so offering to do complimentary sessions for business owners is a really great opportunity to, you know, refine Your work, get more people in front of your lens, build those connections. And. And I've had no problem. Like, as my pricing has gone up, the hotels and other businesses that I've worked with, they haven't even batted an eye. I do something that I will recommend is that when you ask a hotel to refer clients to you, I ask them just to give me the information, and I'll take it from there. I don't want other businesses talking about my pricing. I don't really want them talking about what I offer, like, any of those details, because those might change over time, and I really want to be able to explain that myself. And so if you can gently sort of let those businesses know that they can just send over the client with the email address and you'll take it from there. And I really like to keep them in the loop. So I'll tell the hotel who booked with me, what time the session is, all the details. Then right after the session, if I don't stop by the concierge desk and tell them myself, I'll send them an email letting them know the session went great, the clients were happy. Then I'll send them a few photos. If the clients signed the model release, you know, they were a big part of this coming together, so they love to see photos of how it turned out. So I try to include them, like they're part of this session and this experience, and then they're not sort of left wondering, oh, how'd that go? Like, did that ever happen? So I want to, like, keep them. Them in, you know, in with me and. And feeling like they're a part of it.
- [28:31]
A
I'm looking through your proposals page now, and I think, like you said, I think there's such a market for this, you know, and maybe not in, like, the smaller towns, but in. In areas where. Well, or maybe, I don't know, people get. Yeah, I guess people propose everywhere, but especially in some of the bigger cities. I would have loved to have my proposal with my husband on record. You know, I mean, it's really cool. Yeah, I just. I really love it. And it's like you've captured some of these really important moments. And when I look through all of your portfolios, I'm noticing a theme of just so much. It looks like genuine emotion and expression throughout all of your work. How do you. What do you do to. In order to get this, like, natural expression, I guess.
- [29:23]
B
Well, that's a huge compliment coming from you, so thank you. That is something that I try so hard to work on and Elena Blair mentioned that in the very beginning when I started mentoring with her, she said, don't think about what you want your work to look like. Think about what you want it to feel like. And so I've really, I've tried to focus on that. How do I want it to feel? And so I'll give prompts that have more feeling to them. And I want to show love, joy, and connection. I've narrowed it down to those three words. And so I think a lot about how can we show love, joy and connection. Well, we can do that with our hands, with our eyes, the way that we interact with each other. And so I'm just talking to clients constantly about how beautiful their child is, or what does their baby smell like, or isn't this an amazing time to come together? Or I'll tell jokes. You know, I have a nine year old, so I have these terrible nine year old jokes that I'll tell. Love it. Or I'll ask the dad, does he have any, you know, dad jokes that he can throw out every once in a while? So I try to really, like, talk about how this is a special time to come together and celebrate one another. And I just, I talk a lot about, I talk a lot to clients. And so I think that that's what helps bring that together.
- [30:41]
A
Yeah, that's really great. I mean, when you think back to when, when was it that you actually started your photography business? How many years ago was that?
- [30:49]
B
Yeah, so I used to be quite embarrassed to say this because it's. It's not that long ago, but now I feel really proud of how much I've gotten, how much success I've had in such a short amount of time. So I started my business in May of 2021.
- [31:02]
A
Oh, wow. So it's only been a little over four years. That's incredible.
- [31:05]
B
Exactly.
- [31:06]
A
I thought you were gonna say like 10, 15 years, you know.
- [31:09]
B
No, it was in the middle of COVID You know, I was sitting at home. Ideally I should have started like a year before because I had that whole year of COVID that I wasn't doing anything. But I spent the whole summer brushing up on my photography. I had mostly always photographed, like, still subjects, you know, either jewelry or landscapes or, you know, whatever I was photographing in high school. It wasn't a lot of people. So I spent a lot of time learning about how to interact with people in front of the camera, what to say, what to do, where do I want to position myself for the lighting. And then I just was Photographing all of my friends and family that I possibly could. And I started charging in the fall of that year, and I figured my camera and everything had cost me $10,000. And I figured if I can make back that $10,000 by the end of this year, then I have a real business. And if I can't, then I'm going to sell my equipment and I'm going to move on to something else. And thankfully, I made $12,000 by the end of that year. And I was like, okay, you know, now I need to step this up. And so I took education even more serious and really learned everything that I could. And I've just, yeah, taken off since then. It's been pretty incredible.
- [32:20]
A
That's so awesome. I love it. Well, it's interesting that you said only four years. I thought you were gonna say longer than that. And I was gonna tell people, like. Cause I know that you also are a mentor to photographers now.
- [32:31]
B
I am, yes.
- [32:32]
A
I was thinking, like, 10 years. That would have been a really, you know, to do a lot in 10 years, like, everything that you've done. But you're saying it was only four years. You've gone from starting a business to becoming one of the most successful photographers in the Santa Barbara barber area, and you mentor other photographers all in a really short amount of time. And I just think it's really great. And I think if you really put the time and the effort in at the beginning, which is Tristan, that's exactly what I did at the beginning. I was, like, networking my ass off. And I know sometimes people don't want to hear that, but I do way less marketing now than I ever had. You know, I had to do so much more before because once the ball gets rolling, once you make those connections, wherever you are doing your networking, whether it's in a networking group or with another business, a hotel, whatever that is at a school, you know, all of a sudden, things will start to snowball. It always does. As long as you're putting in the work.
- [33:29]
B
Absolutely. Yeah, I was.
- [33:30]
A
That's the caveat, though. Yeah, it always does. If you're doing the work, if you have a strong portfolio, if you're marketing yourself well, if you have really good client interactions, you're providing great services, like, it will snowball. You don't always have to be, like, constantly marketing for the rest of your life. I promise. Okay, Sorry, go ahead.
- [33:51]
B
Yeah, absolutely. It does take some time. It's like pushing a rock up a hill in the beginning. And I started to see a little bit of success with just, you know, that first hotel starting to refer clients to me. And I was like, okay, I've got something here, you know, how can I build on this? And you're right. In the beginning I was leaving my postcards all throughout town down anywhere that I possibly could. And then I started to refine it. Okay, what's working? You know, where am I seeing success? And then just trying to put my efforts towards that. And then now it's more of just maintenance. The couple best ones, you know, making sure that I'm servicing those businesses really well, Making sure I'm following up and asking them what they need out of this, you know, partnership relationship that I've built with them. And I don't need to do nearly as much now. Absolutely.
- [34:37]
A
Yeah. Yep. For sure. Maintenance, I think, is a really good way to put it. It's like there's the building and the growth of your marketing plan and your marketing systems and then it goes to the maintenance. So that I think I just want to, you know, I just don't want people to feel really discouraged that you have to do this for the rest of your life, you know. So. Yeah, I love, I mean, yes, for the. I mean, you don't have to market yourself like crazy for the rest of your life. That's what I meant to say.
- [35:07]
B
Yeah. In the beginning you're just, you know, throwing everything at the wall and then you see what sticks and you see what's working and then you can refine from there. But in the beginning, yeah, I was up till midnight most nights. If I couldn't sleep, I was at my computer at 4 in the morning. Like I wanted to work on this last thing before. So it's, it's. I was a hard push in the beginning and thankfully my family was really supportive of me. And it was during COVID you know, where there was, there was some downtime. I feel really lucky that I was able to concentrate on photography and not have a second job right in the beginning because I could really spend all my time just being sucked in and absorbing all the information possible.
- [35:49]
A
Oh, definitely. When I first started my business, I was a full time social worker and I was definitely doing the evenings and weekends and lunch hour anytime that I could could, that I could squeeze it in for sure. I think that the good part though about it is that at the beginning I think we're so extra excited about it and so motivated that, you know, it just, I feel like, I hate to use the word easier because it's not necessarily easy, but when you are that excited and motivated about growing your business, it's the best time to do things. So it kind of works out nicely.
- [36:29]
B
Yeah, and I had a little bit of a fire under my butt too, because Covid was starting to not become so much of an issue and I needed to get a job soon. And I was like, well, I don't want to get a regular job. I don't want to get a retail job. I want this to work. And so it was like, okay, what do I have to do to make this work? You know, I need to make money. And. And it worked out well. I've, you know, it's gone beyond anything I could have dreamed of. And I think seeing that, seeing that it's possible from others was a huge eye opener. Seeing other photographers being really successful in the family photography realm of. I always knew wedding photographers could be successful, but I didn't know that there was such a niche market for families and that you could make good money doing it. So it was eye opening.
- [37:14]
A
Oh, absolutely. When I first started out, it was. I was watching my friend Catherine grow her business on Facebook and she did mostly families. And. And so that's what I thought I was gonna be, was the family photographer. And it's so funny cause I'm so not that now. But yeah, when you see other people doing it, it truly, gosh, it's like it just gives you that fire, you know, that just like, well, if she could do it or if he could do it, maybe I could do it. And yeah, so it's very inspiring. And that's why I love this podcast so much, is so others can hear that, yes, this is possible. Yes, you can do this. And you know, I like to hear about the parts that are hard and you know, because that's a reality of it too. Like you said, sometimes staying up till midnight, but you have to kind of want what it takes. Like, I don't know any successful photographer or business owner for that matter, who just half ass it and it sort of happens for them. You have to really make sure that drive and that excitement is there. And I wonder too, when I asked you at the beginning, like, what was the difference between when you thought the market was too saturated and you would never consider having a business to all of a sudden it changing. I wonder if your mindset changed as well. I feel like mindset is such a huge part of this and making, you know, making things successful. What do you think?
- [38:34]
B
Well, absolutely. When I was, you know, leaving high school and thinking about where I wanted to go to college. I was thinking about sort of a normal career path of like working, working under someone or working with someone. I didn't even think about the possibility of working for myself or being a business owner at that point. And it was only after years of managing a very high end fine jewelry store that I realized I have this incredible responsibility and I'm doing it really well. And also my husband, he is an entrepreneur and he was a business owner at that point. And I was doing some of the bookkeeping for him on the side. And so I kind of learned the different roles of like managing and the books and all of that. And I realized, hey, I can do this myself. I can own and operate a business on my own. And I just, yeah, was not. That wasn't even in my purview when I was, you know, 18, 19. So it took some time to, to get the confidence and the knowledge that I have now.
- [39:35]
A
Yeah, yeah, same. The, the whole, the whole business part is so daunting at the beginning, but. But again, when you find a system that works, and again, the portrait system, the whole everything sue taught about packages and pricing and selling and all of that, I was like, okay, I can do this. This makes sense to me. Was it scary? Yes. Did I tweak some things and make it my own? Yes, absolutely. But I always say this. You don't have to recreate the wheel. Find a business model that works for you and run with it, and you can change things along the way. That's okay. I do it all the time, you know. Well, I used to do it way more than I do now. I've. I've just. I know what works for me now. But. But yeah, so it's the business part can, can really, I think, stop people in their tracks and keep them from moving forward, but absolutely.
- [40:24]
B
It's just as much the creative as it is the business. And I, I have a really great balance of both. And I, I think that not everyone does, but I really run my business like a business. I am really organized with my trello boards and my systems and procedures and the client workflow. I really take that very seriously. And I just, last week kind of went through all those steps myself. I put myself in as a client and I set myself every email template that a client goes through along the way and kind of realize, you know, what's too much, what wording needs to be tweaked, you know, how can this be optimized? So I really, really run it like.
- [41:02]
A
A business that's smart. Tell people what a Trello board is.
- [41:06]
B
Oh, yeah. So for those of you who haven't heard of Trello T R E L L O, I should ask to get some sort of thing from them. I always talk about them. So you make this board and I have a pre session workflow, a post session workflow, and then when the gallery is delivered, and then sort of the afterwards, so I put the client name in and I have all these little boxes. So, like, you know, when I've sent them the quote, when I've sent them the invoice, when they've paid their deposit, it just tracks everything really beautifully. So I can come back and I can see, oh, yeah, this person I left off here. You know, I'm still waiting for the remaining balance or this client is still worth with the editor, you know, but it should be back soon. Or the client, you know, the gallery's been delivered, but I still need to make the photo album. So it just keeps everything really nicely organized for me. And because I work with a VA and an editor, you know, there's a few of us, so it's something that they can all look at as well, and then I can really easily. They know what steps they need to do next because it's written on this board and they check it off once it's done. So just makes it really easy to see visually because I'm a very visual person, see where everything is.
- [42:15]
A
That's really cool.
- [42:16]
B
Yeah, I really like it. It's free.
- [42:18]
A
Yeah. Oh, it's free.
- [42:19]
B
Yeah.
- [42:20]
A
Oh, even better. How cool is that? Awesome.
- [42:23]
B
I know.
- [42:24]
A
All right, getting back to just a little bit of the creative side with how you shoot in natural light. Do you have any sort of like, go to setting, you know, that you just always start on, or are you constantly changing things up?
- [42:38]
B
Settings for my camera or setting?
- [42:40]
A
Yeah. Settings for your camera? Yep.
- [42:42]
B
Oh, yeah, definitely. Yeah. So I love to shoot close to wide open. 2.8 is my sort of standard. I've tried with going lower, but I'm often photographing, you know, more than one person, a group of family. And it is really tricky when, you know, only one person's in focus. So 2.8, I feel like a good, you know, happy medium. I like a really fast shutter speed, so 640 is sort of my standard that I start with. As the sun starts to set, I might go down to 500, but really I want a fast shutter speed. Kids are moving quick, I'm moving quickly. And then I let my ISO be on auto, so it kind of. It'll move around. I'll play with that a little bit. I use a lot of backlighting, and so if I'll notice that the client is dark and that it's exposing for the sky, then I'll override it. But mostly that seems to work out really well for me, just letting the ISO be on auto.
- [43:38]
A
Oh, yeah. I like that. It's a really good idea.
- [43:40]
B
Yeah, it just keeps it easy. I love my zoom lens. I really only. I. I own two lenses, but I use one lens 99% of the time. If I'm doing the video, then I have a video lens that works well. But mostly I'm always using my 28 to 70 zoom lens F2.0. And I have a Canon R5, and they just work beautifully for me.
- [44:03]
A
Fantastic. When you're shooting in golden hour, do you underexpose the clients or. Because at 500, I'm just trying to think. Think at 500. I guess if you're. If your ISO goes up really high. But do you ever underexpose and then just bring it back when you're editing?
- [44:17]
B
I try not to underexpose clients because I noticed that their skin will get a little sort of muddy or a little dark. So I don't. I try to bring the sky in a little bit post. It's been really nice with Lightroom having those updates. They have the sky like auto ones, so I like to do the sunset for the sky, and it works out really well. So it's more important to me that the people and their faces are looking as great as possible than the sky. I don't do any, like, fake clouds or fake sky, but with that sunset, it brings in just, like, a little bit of that. Purpley blue is so pretty.
- [44:59]
A
If you're listening and you haven't tried this yet in Lightroom, what Tristan just mentioned is if you have your Lightroom open and you have an image and you're in develop develop mode, if you hit K, the keyboard letter K, it'll pop up and you can click this, like, select sky, and it'll select the sky, and then you just do your adjustments from there. And it's so easy and so wonderful. I love it.
- [45:22]
B
Yeah. Lightroom will have some, like, presets just specifically for sky already built in. And there's like, there's maybe seven or eight of them blue, like vivid blue, which is what I'll use during the day if it's a proposal, like, you know, noon or something. And then sunset, sunrise. They have a couple of them. But yeah, that vivid Blue, and then the sunset one's my favorite.
- [45:47]
A
Yeah. Awesome. Very cool. I'll have to play with those more because I haven't used them a whole lot because my. Usually I only shoot senior sessions outside, and I haven't done a lot of senior sessions yet. This year, it's just ramping up. July and August are in. September are my busiest. So I'm excited to play around more with that because I'll be doing a lot of wildflower. My wildflower garden is growing so beautifully. I'm so excited. I never know what it's going to be like each year.
- [46:16]
B
Spring is my favorite time, and we just had our family photos taken, too, and it's just so painful that more families don't have their photos taken at this time. It's the most beautiful, and it's not crowded.
- [46:28]
A
Yeah. Well, I should say my flowers are not blooming yet because I am in Michigan, and things don't typically bloom until July, although there are these gorgeous white and purple wildflowers all over the place right now in Michigan, I made my husband stop so I could take a picture to figure out what they are so I can plant them, because they come back every year and they just grow wild, and they're absolutely gorgeous. And that's exactly what I said. I was like, I could be booking senior shoots, like, you know, May, April, or well, really May and still give people flowers, because usually when people reach out to me, they want the flowers. But my flowers are most in bloom end of July, August, September, which is not ideally when I want to be shooting, because I have my cottage. I want to be with my family, but I never work weekends anyway. It's always, you know, during the week, during the day.
- [47:15]
B
But, yeah. Yeah, our flowers are just starting to kind of die off. We have a lot of wild mustard here that'll grow, like, 6ft tall or higher. Oh, wow. And it's just so ne to be, like, in the foothills with the mustard growing everywhere.
- [47:28]
A
Yeah, that's cool. Awesome. Yeah. I'm obsessed with growing different flowers, and I've tried different things, and sometimes they work, sometimes they don't. But I went back to Old Reliable this year, so it's growing in nicely, and I'm so excited.
- [47:43]
B
Beautiful.
- [47:43]
A
All right, awesome. Well, thank you. This has been so great. I do have a couple more questions that I always ask at the end of each episode, so I'm hoping you will answer those for me. Sure. Okay. And the first one is, what is something you can't live without when you're doing A photo shoot.
- [48:00]
B
Ooh, what can I not live without when doing a photo shoot? Well, I take it like, for me, I need to come to a session feeling energetic, feeling excited, and feeling confident that I've looked back at the questionnaire. I know the client's names, I know if they have kids, the prep work. So really, for me, it's just coming prepared and coming with a really good attitude. And then when I meet them in person, trying to match my energy to theirs, if they're also really energetic and, and perky and happy, I try to keep that energy going. And if I notice they're a little bit calmer, then I try to, like, tone it down a little bit. But I think second to my camera working, I just need to, to be in tune with, like, that I am, I'm prepared and that I'm coming in and this is going to be great and I'm going to do everything I can to make this a really positive experience. So my attitude, I think, is key.
- [48:58]
A
Yeah, I love that. Matching their energy. I do that with email sometimes. If someone uses a thousand exclamation points, which I love, I love using a thousand exclamation points, I will do the same. If they are very formal and calm, I will respond in that way. And I think it makes someone feel like they can relate to you more. I mean, and not that we're trying to, like, pull the wool over anyone's eyes or anything, but sometimes that can be very helpful, especially with when you're dealing with the energy of someone's family.
- [49:24]
B
Yeah. And I've just noticed it with my own family, we have our own photos taken every year. And a couple times my husband's been like, oh, I can't stand that photographer. You know, thank God it's over. And I was like, oh, really? Like, I thought it went pretty good. And he's like, oh, she just kept saying this or that or. So it made me realize, okay, like, like, especially the men, you know, they're. They're not always wasn't their ideal to have this photo shoot. And I was thrilled. So trying to really think about the way I'm saying things, and especially when talking to the men, how I'm saying things. I don't tease husbands or guys. I don't say things that are kind of off putting, which I guess would be kind of obvious, but. And I thank him at the end for doing this and, and making this a positive experience.
- [50:14]
A
Yeah, that's super solid advice, definitely. All right, number two is how do you spend your Time when you're not working.
- [50:22]
B
Oh, playing pickleball. Huge pickleball players in this family. My husband and I had a couple tournaments so far this spring, and it's just so much fun. The community is amazing. It's great to be outside under the sun, exercising, sweating, and it's such a group sport that I love it.
- [50:42]
A
So fun. That's awesome. I've been hearing a lot about pickleball lately.
- [50:46]
B
Oh, you should try it. My son is even into it.
- [50:49]
A
Awesome. All right, number three is, what is a photography specific product that you would recommend to people?
- [50:56]
B
Well, I talked about trello, but that is not photography specific. Yeah, I'm not like a. A huge gear person, so I don't.
- [51:06]
A
I'm not either. I always say my reflector and my spider holster are my two that I always.
- [51:11]
B
Yeah, I bought a reflector and I've never used it. So I really like my. The strap, my camera strap. It's a silk strap and it's sort of wide and I think it comes from, like, my baby wearing days. I really got into, like, fabrics and textiles and I love it because it's sort of grippy and it'll hold my camera back because it's. My camera's really heavy. The lens is crazy heavy. So the silk, I can kind of put it over my shoulder. And it just started the weight really nicely. It looks beautiful. It's like a really pretty textile that's like tactile and soft, but grippy and it'll. And then when I'm doing video too, I wrap the silk scarf around my wrist to hold my camera steady.
- [51:57]
A
Oh, nice.
- [51:58]
B
So I make almost like a little tripod out of myself using it. So that is probably my very favorite accessory.
- [52:04]
A
All right, nice. All right, and number four is, what would you tell people who are just starting out?
- [52:10]
B
Oh, goodness. That's a good question. I would say to try out a few different types of photography and think about what you enjoy photographing the most and really focus your efforts there. Don't think about what type of photographer you think think is the most successful or you think you should be. You know, I. In the beginning, I thought all real photographers have a studio. You know, that's. That's what it means to be a real photographer. And that's so wrong. I don't have a studio. I don't want a studio. I wouldn't take one if someone gave it to me. So I love being outside. I love being in nature. I love exploring with families and having fun and moving around. And so that's really where I want to focus all of my efforts. All of the language that I use on my website talks about that. All the images that I'm showing on my website are those types. So to really kind of narrow it down, once you try a few different types, think about what you enjoy the most and try to focus there. And I think in the beginning it's good to be slightly focused and then every once in a while I'll try some new things and see if I like it and then I can expand from there. But if you try to do everything all at once in the very beginning, it's too much. I think it is good to try it and see what you like, but once you realize what you like, focus in a little bit there.
- [53:29]
A
Yeah, that's solid advice again. All right. And then I mentioned before that you mentor other photographers and you said you have a discount or something to give away to the listeners. Do you want to share about that?
- [53:41]
B
Oh, yeah. So I've written a whole course on community collaborations and you know how I go about it, what I say, what I do of templates are in there as well. The maintenance, as you mentioned, the followup. And so I have this coupon code for 50% off for your listeners. The coupon code is NC2025 and you can pick that up on my website, tristantracyphotography.com and I have quite a few freebies on there too. I mentioned my postcard, so I give away my postcard template for free. I have a little posing guide on there. We talked about that sort of of real love connection that you see in my work. So I have some of my poses in there as well.
- [54:22]
A
All right, wonderful. Well, thank you so much. And Instagram, you're tristantracyphotography as well, right?
- [54:28]
B
Yes. Yes.
- [54:29]
A
Okay, cool. I encourage people to check you out because your work is amazing and yeah, it's just really fun to watch you.
- [54:35]
B
So thank you, Nikki. I so appreciate you having me here and it was great to connect with you at wppi. Hopefully I'll see you next year as well. And nice talking today.
- [54:45]
A
Awesome. All right, well, you take care. Enjoy the summer.
- [54:49]
B
You too. Thank you.
- [54:51]
A
Thank you so much for listening to the Portrait System podcast. Your 5 star reviews really help us to continue what we do. So if you like listening, would you mind giving us a review wherever you listen? I also encourage you to head over to sue briceducation.com where you can find all of the education you need to be a successful photographer. There are over 1000 on demand educational videos on things like posing, lighting, styling, retouching, shooting, marketing, sales, business and self value. There's also the 90 day startup challenge plus so many downloads showing hundreds of different poses. We have to do checklists for your business lighting PDFs. I mean truly everything to help make you a better photographer and to make you more money. Once Again, that's Sue briceducation.com it.