← The Product Boss with Jacqueline Snyder
The Product Boss with Jacqueline Snyder
658. "I'm ready to stop throwing spaghetti at the wall- how do I find my path to profit?" | Coaching Session Re-Air
00:53:43
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- [00:00]
A
This is why I feel like I'm at this point. I'm like, which direction do I pick? Because I know everything's important, but, you know, there's a lot of options.
- [00:12]
B
Hi, I'm Jacqueline Snyder, and this is the Product Boss podcast. I've helped launch and grow thousands of product based businesses, even one of my own. And over the last 20 years, I've seen behind the scenes of businesses just like yours. Whether they are makers, manufacturers, artists, or food and beverage businesses, I have spent so many hours studying it all. I've discovered what makes them successful, what mistakes they could have avoided, how did they turn their ideas into a successful business? And what are the strategies that they have used to make more sales and be discovered by more customers? And this is what this show is all about. Whether you're just starting out or you're looking to become a million dollar product boss, I'm here to give you the permission to chase your dreams no matter how big or small. All you need is the right mindset, a little courage, strategy, and support, and you too can be the next million dollar product boss. Let's do this. Hey, hey, product bosses, we're back with another incredible coaching session for you today. I'm chatting with Inez of Barkin, who sells stylish and practical dog feeders and treat pouches for you and your pup. Now, Inez started her business just over a year ago, and while she has been seeing steady growth through the wholesale, she feels like she's been spreading herself very thin and trying to do all of the things to grow her business, but nothing sticking. I mean, I think we can all say that we felt way at some point, if not right now. Now. That's why today we're going to figure out what is Inez's best next step to take to make the biggest impact in her business without her feeling overwhelmed and having to do all the things. All right, let's dive in. Hey, hey, product bosses. I know a lot of us want to get organized. That's my word of the year. One of them is discipline. And it's that discipline and kind of getting organized and staying organized and really kind of minimizing my overwhelm this year. So if you're anything like me, you're probably juggling spreadshee. You might be guessing, like, what stock do I actually have on hand or do I have enough to make these raw goods? Right. Especially if we've just come out of the holiday season and maybe you're just crossing your fingers that you have the right stock levels. Or that when you restock, you order the right amount. But I know that a lot of times when we're sitting in inventory, it's actually just chaos. It's like, is this organized? Is it organized in my head, Is it organized on a spreadsheet? I have a piece of paper jotted down somewhere. I don't know. Right. But here's the deal. We're going to move into this year without the chaos. It does not need to feel this overwhelming. Because what if managing your inventory could actually be simple? Right? Simple and not stressful and actually really informative. That's where Katana comes in. Now, I love Katana. It is the inventory management software that I have recommended for years and it's built specifically for product based businesses like yours. And with Katana, you are going to save time. You are going to know the exact details about your inventory, especially when it comes to time to reorder and how to streamline your operations, all so that you can focus on what you do best, which is being the visionary, which is being creative and making amazing products and taking care of your customers and focusing on sales. So if you are ready to ditch the overwhelm and get your inventory under control, I'd love for you to schedule your free demo for katana@theproductboss.com katana and you can see how Katana can be a game changer for your biz and make 2025 a breeze. All right. Inez, I am so excited to have you. I am such a fan of your products and what you sell. We were just chatting pre call about our dogs and how they might bark in this. But that's okay because your brand is called Barkin. So thank you for letting me coach you. I'm really excited to get into your business and dig in and see how we can create a strategy for it. But before we get started, would you just kind of give me a little bit more background on what Birkin is, what you sell and all the things? Yes.
- [03:47]
A
Well, thank you so much. I am, I'm so excited. I've been talking about this for ages with my, with my husband. So I'm really excited. So Barkin is a business that. But I started when my daughter turned one and I was deep, deep in the throes of postpartum depression and I was thinking, like, I have to do something for me. And then my dog was going to growl class because he's a little cranky when we're walking, especially with huskies. And then about two minutes before we were Leaving our house, he got into our treat pouch. So we had nothing for our class because we lived quite far away. So there was no time to get new things. And so of course, naturally, instead of just buying a new treat pouch somewhere, I decided I had to go and make one. And then I was, you know, cracking jokes with my cousin who was like, what do I call this business? And I realized I can't afford a Birkin bag, but I can make a barkin bag. So that's how it came to be. And then it was a year long process of going back and forth, designing, testing materials. I mean, the design is so different from what I first drew to what it is now. But yeah. So when my daughter turned one, it took me a year to create a brand new treat pouch. And then last year, last April, I can mark it actually really well. Every time it's her birthday, I know that's my barkin anniversary. So when she turned 2, that's when I officially launched my treat pouches. And now, one year in, here I am and I feel like a baby boss. I know there's a lot to do and it's just me and I'm kind of at that point where, which road do I take before I double back and take the next path, but trying to figure out what is the best next step that's going to have the most impact before I get bogged down with everything.
- [05:20]
B
You're like, you know what? I just had a baby postpartum. She's one. Let's get a nap. Let's start a nice.
- [05:26]
A
Who needs sleep anyways?
- [05:28]
B
I mean, you're not sleeping, so you.
- [05:30]
A
Might as well, you know, it seems like the most logical next step. Apparently then I remember when I was.
- [05:36]
B
Nursing my daughter, the second one, and it was kind of like it was that time when, like you could follow people on Instagram and have them follow you back. And it was like you grew your followers. And I swear it was just nursing her. Following, following, back, follow. You know, it's like, well, this is my. With my son. It wasn't that thing. And I was like, oh, now you know, it's like second kid. And I'm really in business all night. So you also sell. So while you started this with the treat patches, you also sell walk kits, slow feeders, collars, leashes, all the things. So do you make all of those?
- [06:02]
A
I designed all them. The slow feeders, I have not designed 100% from scratch because if anyone's worked with silicone based products, it's a very involved Process with the mold and all this. But there is a bit of a story with the collars and leashes and they actually came before the treat pouch because I was too impatient to wait for the treat pouch to arrive. But now looking back, I realize, oh, that might have been my first mistake. I really should have just focused only on the treat pouches. But back then I thought, like, well, I need something to start building up the brand and selling. So of course I picked the most competitive pet product out there for collars and leashes.
- [06:38]
B
Well, whether, either way, like you're still using the collar for the belt and the treat pouch. Right. So as a pet parent, I can coordinate with my animal.
- [06:47]
A
Yes, that was the plan. Although I, I'm really been thinking because it's so much harder to move those products than the tree pouches and even the feeders. The feeders are. That's, that's like the, the thing that's really becoming trendy. I'm starting to pop up everywhere. The feeders and the treat pouches, like, suddenly they're just all over the place. Because now it's becoming a thing on Instagram to style your feeders and make them look pretty and snap them for the gram. But yeah, it's made me think like, once the collars and leashes are done and the harnesses that I have currently in my garage that I have not even launched yet, but I have them sitting there not enough time in the day. Once those are gone, I'm seriously thinking of not bringing them back and just really following your advice on my bestseller, which is the treat pouches.
- [07:32]
B
Okay. And this, what would be your secondary best selling product?
- [07:36]
A
I think in terms of like the amount that's sold in the short amount of time, like relative to time, it's probably the feeders.
- [07:41]
B
Okay. That's where I was going with it too. Yeah.
- [07:43]
A
When I, when I got the feeders, I, I got them leading up to Christmas because I thought I needed variety. Someone said, oh, you need to keep coming out with new things all the time. And I sort of got, well, I guess I should try that. And I realized that might not have been the best advice.
- [07:56]
B
Yeah, everyone, it's all the shits.
- [07:58]
A
Oh, yeah. I definitely for some reason forgot all of your advice and panicked in that moment and went and ordered more things. But at, in that moment, I picked the feeders, which ended up being a happy accident because I got a small order of about 64 pieces just to try it out and then they sold out within two weeks. And that's When I realized, okay, the feeders are not bad.
- [08:19]
B
Well what I like about it is the silicone nature so that we're using similar materials, you know, so it kind of keeps it into like, you know, I've done this and I've coached people that have baby products that are silicone and you know, the benefits, you know, you kind of can like be known for like oh, that's the, that's the lady who does the stuff with the silicone type product versus like there's other treat pouches, pouches that are fabric or you know the, like the ugly ones that are just like the bucket fabric black on your hip, you know, and then there's, and then even for the feeders they're hard and like there's all sorts of things. So I do like that they're silicone consistently. All right, so good to know. And it's funny when you say that you're not alone. I remember somebody, I coached another person and she's like, you know, people on Etsy are like, you need to come out with two products a day. She's like, but then you're telling me to lean into my best sellers. And she's like, I don't know what to do. And I was like, well how's that working for you? You know? And she's like, well it's not. And I was okay, so let's just give it a chance to try it a different way and if that doesn't work for you, you'll find your way. But at least you're trying it, you know, so everyone has their own way, like their own path to profit. There's people that know how to do it and they can, they can do it. But there's a lot of people that start out with a lot more money when they're starting product based businesses and so they have the ability to make more product, to have bigger collections, to market, to spend money on marketing. Cuz like you have to spend money on lead acquisition and conversions and stuff like that. And that's truthfully when I teach it. And because I've started so many startups that are people like you, like me, we're starting out of our homes, we have a good idea, we have families to. Maybe you were working a full time job, it's not as possible. So it's like how do we snowball this and start in one place?
- [09:47]
A
Yes, yes. And I, I've definitely like, I can, I can already pinpoint the moments where I, I did make a decision and thought I really wish I didn't do that. For example, Pinterest ads. I thought it was a good idea, but I realized I'm like, I was not at the level where I should have been spending on Pinterest ads. And I wish I didn't spend that money because that could have gone in to a new color, which people are requesting. But now I don't have the wiggle room to get a new color because of course I. I'd and larger quantities to make it worthwhile. So there are definitely moments where I thought, oh, if I could rewind, I would not do Pinterest ads and probably not get too many other types of products when I already know the treat pouches are working.
- [10:26]
B
Yeah. And you know what? Like, you don't learn this until you walk through it. So part of this is that we do need a fail. I just coached someone. I don't know when you're all going to hear this episode, but like, I coached someone right before your call. It's like, you know, like, how many times did you fail in your formulation before you, you know, you did it because we were talking about marketing and she's like, well, I actually nailed it on the first one. I was like, well, okay, so that isn't a good example. Like, how many times did Thomas Edison fail on his way to building the, you know, the light bulb? But we're, we're good at certain things and we're not good, not, not good. We don't have enough experience or knowledge about other things. So some things we're going to nail based on our background, based on something about us. Like, she's a scientist, so it works for her, but then marketing is harder. So for you, you did something where you figured out how to design and source and get a product made somewhere else. Good at color. Your photos look amazing. Your website's really clean. There's, like, a lot that you've done that is really good. There's the mistakes, but you wouldn't know it if you didn't fall down. So we're just going to move forward.
- [11:21]
A
And I know that marketing is my biggest struggle. It's. There's. There's just some things that I think I know, but I don't know. There's. There's something that I'm missing, and I'm feeling like it must be really obvious because so many people figure this part out, but I have a design background, so that's where I was able to put that to use. But now the marketing side, and I, thanks to msm, I have I think I'd like to say I've mastered the wholesale aspect of it.
- [11:47]
B
Amazing.
- [11:47]
A
I'm in 35 stores worldwide.
- [11:49]
B
Yes. Congratulations.
- [11:52]
A
Thank you. And definitely that module is like my guiding star for the first year. And it worked. But now I want to expand beyond wholesale and not rely on just fair. Not that I do. I always do. My wholesale strategy was outreach and then offering the fair link if they like to take advantage of all those, you know, benefits that they get as retailers. So that strategy has worked really well. And now I'm all over the world. The French really love my product too. I'm in multiple shops in France, which is exciting.
- [12:26]
B
Did you catch that? When it comes to growing your business and figuring out where to start or what sales platform to sell on, you have to understand the things you're good at and the things you are not yet good at. Right. And once you figure that out, then you can determine your easiest path to profit. For Inez, she identified one of her biggest struggles as marketing. So she overcame that by directly jumping into wholesale because she had the module inside of multi stream machine. Specifically, she wanted to focus on getting onto fair and getting her products and what she did into 35 stores worldwide. Right. Where she could sell to other people's customers and audiences. Now, when you start to know your own strengths and weaknesses, what you want to do and actually what you don't want to do, which is amazing, right. That is the key to figuring out where to start. And if you need the permission, I'm giving you permission right, right now to do what feels best for you and your business. Okay, so it sounds like you said that you want to figure out like a roadmap to give you the right direction. So the things you wanted to touch on from your intake form were how to get direct to consumer sales, like some more traffic to your website, and how to grow your email subscriber list, does that still sound where you want to go?
- [13:35]
A
It's still. It's still there because, you know, I understand that email is one of the. One of the highest converting platforms is that.
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B
But nobody uses it.
- [13:44]
A
I really, really want to. It is my biggest because I know it's such a good one. Having subscribed to so many things and I mean, that's how I found out about msm and in the fall and one of the five day challenges, and actually the big thing was I won the Dymo.
- [14:00]
B
Oh, you got the printer. Yeah, we gave away the Dymo printers.
- [14:03]
A
I took that as my sign from above that this was the time to join MSM and go full into Barkin. That was my sign from above. I remember you even said, oh, this course is going to work for you. Because I remember saying, I feel like I've tried courses. And they just, I don't know, nothing, nothing's happening. I don't know what I'm doing.
- [14:19]
B
So now you're, now you're in 35 stores worldwide and you only use one module.
- [14:24]
A
Yes, that's been my main module to watch over and over again to figure it out. Mostly because I knew I needed a cash injection. I had to, I had to start right away after putting money into the product.
- [14:34]
B
Yeah. And I think in one of the easiest paths that I see for people is sometimes wholesale because I feel like, because it's funny, a lot of people that I coach now, they think fair is the only way because fair is in such a good job at marketing. And people, it's an easy platform. The same way that Etsy became an easy platform. You come up with an idea, they it's a platform you can get yourself stuff loaded up onto and they're more or less driving the marketing to the site. So fair would be Etsy comparison for wholesale. Now, while I super appreciate what they've done and they, they've made that it has become. There's a lot of brands on there and it's way more flooded that it's been harder to discover brands. So people sit on there and they don't get sales. And I am not a person that sits around and waits for things to happen. Like I'm like, how am I gonna go make it happen? And I think I try and instill that into like the community and people who listen to me on the podcast. And so truth, I still stand by everything I teach. I mean, not still, it is the way if I were to start again, what I teach in the MSM module, let's say for wholesale, is how you said outreach, how to go find the people. And then if you want to use Fair as a transaction portal, 100% you pay 0 fees for giving them this easy way to transact with you. But it's, we have like this really clear way of being able to find them. And then it's like you said you needed a cash injection. And if you just got on Fair and waited for people to find you, that is not a cash injection. And then there's a lot more lift. And I say lift, like effort, which we're going to dig into to get people to your email list to convert. Right. Even Amazon, I love Amazon, but there you got to play in the Amazon playground. We teach like how to run Amazon ads because you do need pay per click. I think in person is another easy way to get sales right away. But you got to find an in person marketing, get into it. Right. So wholesale to me is a way that I can pick up a phone and start to take action and get people to answer and then just start to weed through people. So I love that you did that because is that's how you get discovered, even by being in new stores and people discover Barkin and then they come visit your website.
- [16:22]
A
Yes. And I found that when I did that because I was getting more orders. I guess whatever algorithm fairs got going, they've started feeding more shops to my profile there. So I would say like a good 50% of the stores that I'm in found me through fair, but only after I, you know, really pushed and emailed a ton of people using a template and just attaching and pictures and hoping to hear back. And the interesting thing is, I mean I do this, I try and do this regularly still because I've had shops that I reached out to them and they finally emailed back about five months later. You know, they just didn't have time. Whenever I sent it five months later, suddenly they're interested. So it's been, it's been a good way to do it. And I would say, you know, I was looking at my numbers and I would say Now a solid 80, 85% is wholesale. But I would love, I would love to get more direct consumers because obviously my margins would be much better if I could sell directly. And, and I know like I have the proof that my product sells. I just, and people want it because I've had shops doing repeat orders. These haven't just been one offs and then never heard from them again. So I know it's out there and people want it. I just, I'm having a hard time finding those people myself. And my Instagram's growing, but I'm really discovering that the numbers on Instagram of followers mean absolutely nothing. It has not translated to anything really other than getting photos of people who've already bought it from shops.
- [17:42]
B
Well, well, like you said, it's photos of people who've already bought them from shops. So knowing that, and this is how Kim Kardashian discovered my product, was that I was on the shelves in a shop, more like in a bowl on a shelf in a shop that she was shopping at. And she would have never like been Googling me or finding my website. But she discovered me in a store which means I know we were talking about Kim but like there's so many other humans that discovered my product in a store. So as a strategy you will start to see and this is exactly what happened for me. I did direct to consumer. It was hard to get people to like I launched a cricut right Only my friend bought for me and then her friend a few weeks later and it was like no one. And so I was like I need to find what works. And so I knew, I knew I could do in person cause it was very easy for me like just go set up a booth. So I tried in person. I got feedback, I got to know what are they like what do they not like what are they reaching for. I got like immediate feedback. Then I launched wholesale which is like the stage that you're at. And that's when people started discovering me. The brand started being known. Carrie Underwood wore it, there were celebrities, you know, I had. It was like this combination. It's the multi multiple streams of revenue and eyes on your business effect. And so that all compounded and started to drive more traffic to my website. So without me having to do a lot I started to make sales or have brand like my brand recognition and then they could buy and I was able to get better at what I offered on my website because I knew between wholesale buyers and between what I, the feedback I got from in person, what they wanted and then I could keep tweaking my site. So I think you're on the right path, like you've got the right path to profit. And then now we're talking kind of like a next level of how to get them, like how to drive traffic to your site and then how to convert them. So what do you do right now to create brand awareness? Like how are you marketing?
- [19:20]
A
Oh gosh. This is, this is where my baby bossness starts to show. I this the social media platforms that I'm trying very hard to do are Instagram, TikTok and Pinterest. Definitely Instagram is where I'm most active just because I've found that the community there of people talking and getting feedback has been pretty good. And that's also where I've been reaching out to shops first. If I couldn't find their email I would try and connect with shops there. TikTok is, it's slowly doing its own thing. It's sort of a, it's a platform that I don't think I fully understand but there's action in terms of views for reels, but again, I don't think it's translated to anything. I've included a discount that's TikTok specific so I could see if it's translating and it's not. And then Pinterest is another one where I've tried the ads and while the ads were running, the amount of people viewing was great. But then when I stop them, of course it kind of comes back down. But I have made some conversions there, even though there's not a lot of activity. I've signed up for an in person market that I'm going to this week. I wish I could say I'm doing more than that, but aside from that, I've been trying to, on all these platforms, direct people to the email list so that I can at least have a solid group of people that I'm talking to. And to get them to sign up to my email list, I've got the discount. I've got a free ebook on slow feeder recipes. I do a monthly giveaway just for the newsletter list of getting a free pet portrait. And then I try to send an email at least once a week and not flood them just with sales. So I know there's. I'm. This is not enough. I know there's stuff that I need to fix or change.
- [21:01]
B
I was gonna say you're actually doing a lot, so you're actually doing a lot, so it might actually be, what can we do less? And then what can we really hone in on and get really good at it? Right? Because right now you're spreading yourself so thin across all these different sales channels and platforms and giveaways and da da. You're not allowing yourself to like really figure it out, nail it.
- [21:19]
A
Oh, I like that. That's. So that's a relief because between that and my daughter's only three and she doesn't go to daycare, so I do this when she's not awake.
- [21:28]
B
When she's not awake. Okay, so you've got some time. Success leaves clues. I know you've heard me say this, so what successes are you having? It sounds like Pinterest works to a point, but does it convert? Like, what have you seen that actually is leading to like that we could turn it up better.
- [21:42]
A
So with Pinterest, I've noticed that I've had like a handful of conversions. I can count. There's not a lot because I'm not on there every day, but pins that have converted are the ones that populate when I update my Shopify. So I've tried to make sure everything is linked on all the platforms to try and automate whatever I can. I also found one retailer through Pinterest who happened to be looking for pet products. So that one converted in a big way. So there's, there's that. And then I think TikTok is really more of an afterthought. I would say most of my energy at the moment is Instagram, even though I, I have a lot hate relationship with Instagram. But I've started an ambassador program to try and get other people to be promoting my products. So I'm actually just about to pick a new batch of people and every time I do that, I give them some free products so that they can have something to work with for their photos. And I also have set up a commission link so that they are, you know, interested in continually talking about Barkin products. So I would say Instagram is my first focus, Pinterest is my second. And I'm using Pinterest to try and drive people to the email list more. Whereas Instagram, I think, is more of a community chatting with people who have the product or shops.
- [22:56]
B
Now, when it comes to figuring out your next steps for growing, it's important to collect and analyze your data, right? The numbers don't lie. So while I always joke about how hard math is, you do need to know your numbers to better understand what's broken or not working as well. Because it could be something happening in your business, especially if you're planning on driving more traffic to a specific platform. Why? Because if you focus your marketing efforts on say, bringing more traffic to your website, but your audience, right, the customers you're bringing to your website are not converting once they land on your website, then that would be a huge issue and something that you want to know is happening so that you know to fix it. Now, while Inez already has a good conversion rate, we want to dig deeper into how we can get the people who are already visiting her website to convert and to convert more instead of immediately jumping to thinking that she needs to bring in more customers, more traffic. So let's see what changes we can make on her website to up her conversion rate. Hey, friend. Okay, I want to talk about something that I know that you really need, but so many people have all the reasons why they don't do this. We really need is we need to build an email list. I'm going to tell you that there are two things that you need as a product based business. You need an email list because that is your asset, you actually own that. And that's the direct communication with your customers. And you need your own website because you can't build on borrowed land. But right now I want to talk about email marketing. Because email marketing is actually the way that you are going to drive sales in your business. It's the way that you're going to stay connected. Forget thinking that social media is the way because guess what, the algorithm chooses who they want to send your images and reels and all the things to. But emails really gets you connected with your customers. So if you feel like you're trying to connect, you're trying to sell and you feel like you're wasting hours trying to get things job done or you feel like you would just like an easier way. My friends, this year it's time for a change. And that change is Klaviyo. It is the number one email and SMS marketing platform that I recommend specifically for product based business owners. Did you hear that? It's for product based business owners, people who sell products online. And the reason why it's so amazing is that it's got these incredible capabilities and it seems list with so many of the tools and the platforms that we recommend. So with Klaviyo, you can send personalized messages, you can automate campaigns, and here's the best part. You can boost your sales and your revenue without having to do much more than type in a few things into your keyboard. Okay, so Klaviyo makes your emails feel like they are talking directly to your customers. Right? Your customers are going to feel like it's a one on one conversation with you. And it's super easy to set up. Even if tech is not your thing. Trust me, tech's not my thing either. And this is amazing. So if you're ready to see this in action, I'd love you to get started for free. Now all you have to do is head to the productboss.com Klaviyo, that's the productboss.com K L A V I Y O and turn your email list into your best performing sales channel that you own. Hey friends, are you unsure of what to say on social media or what to even send in your weekly emails? Well, what if creating content could be easy? Would you be looking for a shortcut to create? Creating consistent content. Yes, consistent content. Because you know consistency is key. Well, let me tell you, you are not alone when you feel like you're struggling on what to post or what to write in emails. And we know that you have that Product part of your business down. But as you're listening to this podcast, you probably already know that to get more people to your products, to buy your products, you need to create great content. Oh, I know, I see. I keep saying content and that's the dreaded C word. And we can't tell you how many product bosses tell us that they want to create great content for their audience and their customers, but they don't know what to say, or they are so busy they can't find the time, or they really, really, really don't want to be the face of their brand. Well, no worries, because that's exactly why we created a year of content. It is your shortcut to creating consistent content that resonates with your audience and brings more loyal customers who can. I can't wait to buy your products. If you want to see how easy this is and how easy it is to create content for your audience and your customers, head to www.ayearofcontent.com. are you making sales direct to consumer right now? Are people buying on your website?
- [27:16]
A
Yes, but only a handful a month. It's. It's not, it's not much like one a week count and not even. It sort of comes in waves. It's one of those things where there was one week where suddenly I had like five over the weekend and then it'll be silent for a while and yeah, it comes in waves, I promise.
- [27:34]
B
And then did you. Do you track how many site visitors you have a month and then like the balance rate. Do you know all that data?
- [27:40]
A
I. Well, as much as I've gotten from Shopify, I don't have. What's it, Google. Google Analytics. It's on my mile long to do list to figure that out. So in the last 30 days it's not enough. It's under a thousand store sessions. So I know I need to try and get more traffic because obviously that's just not enough to. I know the conversion rates are like 1 or 2% if you're, if you're on a good place. So yeah, that's, that's why I know I'm like, I. The biggest things I want to do is grow the email list, try and drive traffic. I feel like I'm floundering with driving traffic. I know Instagram is not the place to do that. They're not, they're not going to my website from Instagram. So Pinterest I think is the main one that I've got linking back all the time and then the email list.
- [28:25]
B
But on Instagram, there's Instagram Shop. So you do have Shoppable. So it is technically still to shop off the platform. Because what I, when I trying to figure out from you and understand is if we get the traffic to your site because, because we could look at all the places that it could be broken. Right. So we could drive traffic. So let's say we get the traffic to your site. Does your site, do people bounce? Do they, does it convert? Where do people go when they get to your site? Do people put stuff in the cart and then the abandoned cart? Right. So if I can kind of understand it could be, okay, we've got no traffic, but let's say we made it. We, we pushed a lot of traffic to it. Is there a place that the site's not converting and they fall off or not? And I just want to see if you know any of that, that info I, I get.
- [29:02]
A
So in the last, let's see, let me just look at the last 90 days. Maybe that's a better like sample. I've had about 110 add to cart sessions, but only 47 of those have reached checkout.
- [29:16]
B
And they converted though.
- [29:17]
A
And even less than that have converted. So I, I, I know there's something I'm missing there. I've played around with my shipping trying to just, I, I've got the free shipping thresholds, I've tried just calculate based on their location. Now I've switched over to flat rate shipping because I thought maybe it's the surprise shock of shipping costs when people are so used to free shipping everywhere in Canada. I find that shipping can get quite expensive, almost more so within Canada.
- [29:44]
B
You're not alone. It's more expensive for Canadians to ship to Canadians than to send it to.
- [29:48]
A
The US it is the most frustrating thing ever. But you know, this, this is what I'm working with. So that's why I thought, okay, I'm going to do the flat rate shipping so that at least any Canadian buyers are not shocked what to see coming their way. So I've actually had more orders on my website going to the U.S. than within Canada.
- [30:05]
B
So by you telling me that 110 people have added, I think you said 48 make it to checkout and then sounds like a huge percentage of those people drop off.
- [30:14]
A
Yeah, it says here that my analytics are saying only 15 sessions converted. So I know there's something happening there aside from trying to get more traffic.
- [30:23]
B
So I took the 15 and I divided that by 110 of the people who added to car chart and it says that it's 15% conversion, which is not terrible. Like we have to estimate. I put it really low, 1 to 3% will convert. So you're still like a 4.2percent conversion, which is on the higher side. So what this is telling me is you actually just need to up the traffic. You need to feed it more people to. Even if your conversion stayed the same 4.2% of the 2600 and you fed more people into it, you would end up with more revenue. It's about the, the amount of people in. So you have two places you play here. You either add more people and you keep the percentage of the conversion the same, or you up your conversion. So if we could get, you know, okay, so we're at 4.2% of the total amount of people going there. If we got 10%, that'd be 260 people. So you can see how there's two levers at play here. There's digging into the people you already have and winning them back, trying to get them to convert. Because 2600 people visiting your site over the last nine days is a significant amount of people. However you're. They're discovering you, they're ending up there. What's happening is that and even your 4.2 percentage is actually a good conversion point. But it's like, how can we make small tweaks to different parts to make it easier or. Yeah, make you making more revenue easier.
- [31:36]
A
And I would say even my website, like recently, in the last month or so, I sort of redid the homepage so that it's really all about the treat pouch. And there's no confusion about what, what's being sold there. So trying to walk them through all the different aspects of the treat pouch. And that's why it's. There' nothing about collars and leashes on there. And I'm trying to use those as a way to bundle things and increase things so that they can qualify for free shipping.
- [32:01]
B
So your free shipping threshold is high. Now they're gonna have to find something. If they don't wanna pay shipping, they're gonna have to find something that's gonna add to it. You could use things like. And this is like digging into Shopify. Cause when you're using Shopify there could be like upsells and cross sells. So there's also ways, ways that like next to it it says like free, you add. Add eight more dollars for free shipping. Right. So like, it like will show them. Like you just need to add to your cart. It could say like customers who bought this also bought this. Or like add to your bundle and add the collar and leash or add a feed a slow feeding bowl to it. Like you can look at people who are already buying from you. What are they buying? What else are they putting in the cart? You have that data of like your customers are exploring your site. If they buy more than just one pouch, do you know what else they're putting in?
- [32:46]
A
So the feeders are generally pretty new to the, to the website. So I've noticed that started to get added to cart more. But I think every time I've seen orders that are higher than 45 or 50, people are buying two treat pouches. I think they either are getting themselves a different color or I've seen people order the same color two, three times because they might be giving it as gifts. And funny enough, they're not actually adding collars and leashes which would be an easier add on. Not, not as much occasionally. Yes. But I think the only time those really started to take off more is when I had a sample sale.
- [33:17]
B
Okay. So it could be a buy more, save more and so you could even have like save 10% when you buy two or more for example. And like it's an automatic code that If I put two or more I get 10% off, for example. Or maybe it's even just a buy two or more and get free shipping.
- [33:31]
A
It's incredible. But I mean I'm the same when I'm shopping. So yes, that makes total sense.
- [33:36]
B
Which is why they're going to abandon cart and inside of multi shipping machine, which I know you're in there. I don't know if you've seen it, but we added in a free shipping shipping threshold calculator.
- [33:43]
A
I haven't seen it yet. I need to, I feel like I'm at the point where I need to dive back in again and do a big refresh of all the things.
- [33:50]
B
Yeah. So I, I think use the free shipping threshold calculator because there's. You can figure out like how much should it actually be?
- [33:57]
A
Well, I was, it was lower. And then when someone ordered internationally, I realized that the. I think I had it at 150 and it just didn't make sense. I ended up spending so much on shipping because it went to Asia. And that's when I realized I made a mistake in the numbers for that lease. The international.
- [34:14]
B
Why don't you not sell international right now? Just focus on US And Canada. Take off international and then internationally you could put on like your store List your stock is like where they can buy internationally. So you drive traffic to retailers and. Or let's say it was somebody I don't know in Japan. You might be like, oh, there's people inquiring from Japan. Somehow they're seeing it. Or maybe I have a store in Japan because I used to sell to Japan. And you may then contact stores in that place and be like, I'm getting a lot of inquiries. We don't ship international. You could be like some of our retailers that we could send traffic if people contact us.
- [34:46]
A
I've actually had. It's funny, this past week I've had multiple emails for people asking to distribute Barkin in South Korea. And I don't know where the. Somewhere somewhere in the US for the big box retailers. But I feel like that's a whole other beast that I have to figure out. I don't know anything about that yet, but I do, I do have some interest in Asia now.
- [35:05]
B
Yeah. And that's what happened with me. I had a job Japanese, so it's a buying group. So what they did is what I loved about the Japanese buying group was that they actually bought the samples for me versus other places will be like, send them to me for free. Right. And so they, I like got this huge order. They were buying all the samples. Then they had the samples internationally for me, like in Japan. And then they would reach out and then they would sell to stores over there. And so I made money on the, the front part and then on them being that. So. Absolutely, because wholesale is a route that you're taking. It could definitely be something that you explore, a buying group. I'm not sure about the US one. You know, you just want to like qualify people.
- [35:42]
A
Yes.
- [35:43]
B
So you just want to double check and like see like what brands they represent, you know, that kind of thing. But it's an, it's an idea. So. So your first lever is going to be really understanding your website, I think lowering your free shipping threshold and then making the offer that free shipping on two or more treat pouches. Free shipping, I think you remove international because you're not having a ton of traffic anyways to your site right now or you're not converting a lot so you can bring it back later when you've worked some of this out. Do the, the tree patches come with a strap? Yeah, they do. It's just in the secondary pictures. Okay. Then I want you to think about cross sells upsells or just saying buy to free shipping, like right in the transaction part. So I Think that there's so many ways we can go with your brand right now.
- [36:26]
A
This is why I feel like I'm at this point, I'm like, which direction do I pick? Because I know everything's important but you know, there's, there's a lot of options.
- [36:35]
B
Yeah. So I think that, I think if it's something like customers love to buy two or like you put some sort of quote like this is why I loved buying two was because I could like easily rotate them. Right. Like, or I could change the straps and you might show people changing the strap. Now is it something you do right away? Maybe, maybe not. It might be an add on, like change your straps, but you would have to order your skus in a different way. And so it's a little complicated.
- [36:55]
A
Yeah, it's, it's something I'd thought about but just, just from like a logistics side of ordering the, you know, the new straps and having to get like large volumes for this, I don't feel like I'm there yet. But if I can increase the volume of sales, that's definitely something I thought about.
- [37:11]
B
Yeah. So you can do a couple of things. You can either source straps, like handbag straps that you source and you'd become like really fashion forward with them and you don't manufacture them, but you source and resell. You can wait or you can show it that when they buy two they can interchange the strap. So then it's eating in my head as a customer that I can change things up and like I'm like, oh, I should buy two because I really like the paint pink, I really like the green. I can't choose which one I want. So if I buy both, then I can actually do the combo I want. And then again, another brand I always talk about is Dagny Dover. And they do a really good job. Same thing. They're kind of like you, they're solid colors. They sell these kits which you don't have to get into yet, but they like, they have their bestsellers and people really buy these based on color, but they're more expensive. So I'm not going to have multiple backpacks, but I will have a backpack and a fanny pack and blah blah, blah of like the, the brand. Right. So and then you can see again, save 20% with kits. So they're like telling you like I can save if I add things and then they actually give me the kit and then shop all kit. So this is another really good brand to look at when you're thinking about how do they show stuff. So I think that there's just, there's more places that you can pull from. Do you see how sometimes even small tweaks can actually make a huge difference? You hear me say all the time that success leaves clues, and that continues to be the case here. I want you to figure out what is working for you and your business. I want you to get super focused and then start figuring out where you can make small tweaks to start seeing big changes such as looking at your abandoned cart sequence or offering upsells and cross sells, or improving your SEO. I want you to focus on refining what is already working instead of trying to do all the things and be in all the places, because that's where the overwhelm happens. Let's narrow this in for you so you know what to do. Your three step process, it's as easy as steps one through 17. So looking at your website. So treat time anytime. Okay, that makes sense. Sure. If this picture converts, I want a Shop now button. I need a button. Shop, Treat bags, or what do you call them? Treat pouches. So shop now. Shop. Treat pouches. You call them treat pouches. But I. But pouch is a very specific name and I don't know if that's what people are searching for. Okay, so from an SEO perspective, in msm, we teach you how to search SEO. I want you to go look and see are people searching treat pouches, treat bags, treat holders. Like, what are training belts? Like what are they actually searching? This is like when I did my company and I realized I was like totally off and I was like helping you launch from a brand up and I was like, nobody's looking for like launching from a brand, your brand or whatever. So when I changed my SEO to how to start a clothing line, everything changed. So that's one place I just. That would be like a tweak from an SEO perspective to use language. Because if they're not searching the word pouch now, it could be a Canadian, Canadian word.
- [39:57]
A
Right.
- [39:57]
B
So if it's Canadian, then you could double up SEO for like. So you might double. Like you might. At least when you're tagging pictures and stuff like that, you're using multiple words.
- [40:06]
A
Right?
- [40:06]
B
Right. Okay. Shop now. So that's something that's missing. Then it slides to this one, which is say hello to enriched meals. Again, I don't know that this is. Why is it enriched? So it might be like slow down. What is. What's his name? Your dog?
- [40:20]
A
Mr. Oh, Boeing.
- [40:23]
B
So slow down, pup. You know, and it's like shopping Slow feeders.
- [40:27]
A
Right, right. So language.
- [40:30]
B
Yeah. Very kind of practical and very direct. You need very direct call to actions. If these were sold out, this is a great marketing moment to send an email and be like, slow feeders are back. And then you may even like. And the other thing that people don't realize that they do is they keep the same hero images up on their website forever. But your hero image needs to change to your marketing schedule. So if you're going to pitch slow feeders to this week, then Slow feeders should be the thing I see when I land on your site. It should be the thing I see on your social media. It should be the thing that I get the email about. And when I come here, I click and it takes me to slow feeders. And that's what you're marketing this week. And then next week if you're going back and you're going to be selling like bundles or two pouches, free shipping and then you're emailing about that, you're putting it on your homepage, you're putting it on Instagram, like wherever it is. Then it's like, okay, now I know what you want me to buy, so it's okay to change your marketing and like you want to change your homepage to match, match your marketing.
- [41:22]
A
Okay, that, I mean it's, it seems so obvious when you say it right?
- [41:28]
B
Then I think when you look at your site, forget this style meets functionality. It's a cute dog. I can't even see the collar. So I would drop this and I would go back to, you know, customer favorites, shop pouches, like whatever it is. And I would put immediately underneath your image, I would put product to shop from. So. And then I love how this one like tells me what's in it. You could be selling more off this homepage. And then the fact that it doesn't have to be a belt and it could be a crossbody I think is another thing that like is different. So it's also analyzing or showing how it's like it could be crossbody, it could be your belt, it could be, you know, whatever. Like that's an. I think it's an important factor that maybe you're not sharing.
- [42:05]
A
Yes, I 100% agree with everything you're saying. Is this, this is, I knew this is where I, you know, when you look at your own thing for so long, you sort of stop seeing all the missing pieces of the puzzle. And this is eye opening in the best way.
- [42:20]
B
Okay, so you're getting like a mini Audit at the same time then when I go to shop. And if you want to list out your products like treat pouches, walk kits, slow feeders, collars, leashes, those are more important than contact and bark and world. So it'd be way easier if I could just shop from this navigation and we talk about this inside of multi stream machines, how to like get them to convert better and things like that. But if I could see what I could pick from then it's like listed out here. Jewelry companies do that a lot or cosmetic companies. The other thing is depending on your see how your app does. Your app lets me roll over. I would like you to show me when I roll over it that I can see like on the different ones. Like I see one picture where she's got a crossbody and one picture where it's on the belt or like that your scroll over shows that it could be worn a couple ways. I actually think especially for women because it's probably more of a woman's product.
- [43:05]
A
I would say the majority of buyers are women. I've had some men buy it, but very few. And then they tend to be millennial.
- [43:12]
B
Gen Z. Yeah, they're wearing Louis Vuitton.
- [43:15]
A
Have human kids. Yeah, they're like their dogs are their babies.
- [43:18]
B
Yeah, they're wearing like Louis Vuitton F fanny packs. Like they're so cool. Yeah, I saw a couple of them the other day and I was like, oh my God, they're so cool. So because of that and because they're Gen Z or they're younger then I would say and you are selling to women but you. So you want to show that it can be worn in different ways by you saying that. I do think there is an element to TikTok perhaps where you could potentially go I know you're not into TikTok, but there's parts that can go viral on TikTok. So I just want you to not close up to that yet. But thinking through and Shanti who was on the podcast, she's in the Mastermind. She has a brighter year. You can go see what she does. Made a million dollars just on TikTok selling adult learning books for five.
- [43:56]
A
That's incredible.
- [43:57]
B
So I'm not saying and I don't want everyone listening to me like, oh, go get on TikTok. It just depends on the product. But because you're telling me Gen Z, if you do have this younger customer, then you might want to decide where your customer is versus Pinterest is a search. So Pinterest are searching for stuff. So Pinterest, you may decide that you're going to do. And we talk about this in msm, like how to create a backdoor for people to find you. So Pinterest might be like 10 ways to train your dog or how to deal with like a fussy fanny pack, like when you don't know where you know whatever it is. Like you might do Pinterest type stuff or training ideas or the things that you have on your blog right now.
- [44:30]
A
Yeah, and I think it's actually been working that way. Like, you know, I don't think they're specifically looking for my product. And if anything, from my experiment with Pinterest ads, I confirmed what I already like had in my gut about who my buyer was. At least the ads I could see, like the type of people that were clicking on them. So if anything, it really confirmed what I was was making assumptions about. So.
- [44:51]
B
So Pinterest is just a strategy where you do not have to be blogging, you do not have to be blogging weekly. The way that we teach it in MSM is a way to create a backdoor for people to find you. And then you could just create more images to populate in more places. And maybe you don't run ads to it, but it just lives there. And it's this backdoor. If you're going to go with Instagram, you're growing on Instagram, you can keep going with that. Let Pinterest live the way it is. Just don't do anything else there. You've got the blogs that you've already created and track the traffic that's coming from those blogs. And if it's converting, you're going to work on Instagram. Your growing of your email subscriber list would be when you do this in person market, ask people to join your list, tell them that they get. Maybe you bring those candles, maybe you make like an entire gift bag that's like, hey, when you join my list, I'm giving one of these away every day or something like that. Join the list or something. Or get 10% off your order online or 15% off whatever it is. So work on growing your list. Do you send emails?
- [45:43]
A
I try to send them once a week, every Thursday that I do. I mean, I miss a week here and there when life just happens. But generally I try and send them once a week and the content varies. My conversion, like opening rates hover around 45 to 50%. So I think it's actually pretty good. My list is quite humble, but I think those Numbers are pretty good. And then the click rate is around 1512 to 15%.
- [46:08]
B
That's great. That's huge. You have a small list, so the smaller your list the more you have happening. And are they e commerce emails?
- [46:14]
A
It's a mix. Some of them are. Sometimes I'll be talking about a specific product, sometimes I will just be talking, talking about like a slow feeder recipe. But almost every email I'll include some kind of button that relates back, like check out this product if you like this recipe. Or they might, they're not always obviously e commerce emails, if that makes sense. Which maybe is the reason why they're working. I'm, I have to experiment more and see how that goes.
- [46:36]
B
Yeah, you can do like a newsletter a month, like subscribe to the newsletter to get tips. And then when they do that they also get e comm emails. Like one is where you work on it more and the other ones are to sell. So first for you it's you know, teach pop marketing. So it's paid, organic or partnership? You've tried partnership, it's not ideal. There's paid. You've tried that on Pinterest. It could be, I'm not saying you should do paid ads on meta, but if it's a route that you're like, this is where my customer is, it could be something you try. But if you don't do that then it's organic. So if it's just organic, then it's gonna be through in person getting people to subscribe. It's gonna be through word of mouth. You could have raving fans become affiliates or ambassadors of some sort by having it on the shelves of stores and your brand is written on it, they will come, follow you and then the viral content because you're in MSM and you have all these other ways of doing it and you're doing it. But I do think even if you didn't work on marketing right now. Okay, so if, let's say we took the whole marketing part off the table and we just worked on upping your conversion. So raising your average order value, stopping people from abandoned cart, getting a really good abandoned cart sequence up, which in MSM I have a three part series for you to send, which Shopify sometimes has a limit so it could be through your email service provider instead. Like we recommend and klaviyo. So the initial thing I think where I'd want to actually send you and I know your question was like how do I get more direct to consumer sales? We have 2600 people. If we could up your conversion. So making it easier checkout, making them not abandon cart when they add to cart. Because now, you know, they get to cart and they check out because they see shipping, right? And they put in their cart and then they like disappear. So one, it's like, hey, you added to cart, come back a three part email sequence on that. And then if a issue for them is, oh, I'm gonna have to pay for shipping and this thing is this amount and I'm paying half of it in shipping, I don't want it, then let's figure out ways to get them to get to free shipping easier and making those suggestions of, you know, upsells, cross sells, buy two, get free shipping, really promoting that. And that in itself is going to start to make you more money without you worrying about growing your list right now, without you worrying about going viral on Instagram.
- [48:33]
A
Right. You know that would be amazing, right? Yeah, it would, it would just, it would make a huge difference.
- [48:39]
B
And then you just set your goals. You set your wholesale goals. Keep doing follow success leaves clues, right? So follow it. So keep selling. I know you want margin wise, but you can make a million dollars on wholesale alone. So like keep pushing wholesale for you right now that's an easier lever. Go from 35, double your stores, which is work on that. Just keep thinking, how do I keep improving wholesale? You already know what works. So keep doing more of that. Do your own outreach. Keep driving traffic, don't wait for fare because like you said, more you drive to fair, the more fair pushes you. So now you've got this double prong attack and then you are having traffic. Whatever you're doing, which is, you know, and you're doing a lot of things, whatever you're doing is working. So now let's just get the better conversion online and then that is gonna start to shift things for you. And then we can come back, do another session and then, you know, we can work on what's next. But I think instead of overwhelming yourself with all of the things that would be the couple places I think you could fix.
- [49:26]
A
This is amazing. I, yeah, I felt the totally stretched thin trying to do everything and hoping something sticks without doing everything super well. So this is huge. It's like all the clarity.
- [49:40]
B
Good. Like you said, sometimes you're up close to it and like you, you've been a student for a really long time. So like you're nailing it. You're doing a really good job at the things that you're doing. And then this is why like Getting one on one coaching or continuing like your, your knowledge and your business and stuff like that is just like, you keep tweaking, testing, trying, testing, trying. And I know that this happened for me with my brother. He was working for me like one summer and he was like, you know, if you're trying to do everything, you're doing nothing well. And I was like, he's. He's like, you're making zero dollars. He's. He just talked to me about this weekend. He's like, I remember when you're doing this, you're making no money. And I was like, yeah. I remember specifically saying to you, like, I could go get a job at Paper Source and work for someone and make this more than I was taking home, not going into debt, not worrying about taxes and all this stuff. And it was like that to me was a huge shift where I was like, I got it, I got it. Focus. I need to go all in and I need to figure out I need to focus on one company. And then again, you're either featured like core product or a hero product or core collection. And then you're really good at wholesale and you're at adding on direct to consumer. And then let's just work on one traffic source and these small tweaks and then that overwhelm, you'll start to see things work and then you can do what's next.
- [50:43]
A
I mean, this makes so much sense. It's like, it's just sometimes you need to hear it from someone else.
- [50:48]
B
Yeah, trust me, I had my brother and then I'll be like, passed it along.
- [50:53]
A
Please, please say thank you.
- [50:54]
B
That was when I was baby boss. Oh, my God, you're right. Oh, my God. Your product's awesome. How can people buy from you, support.
- [51:04]
A
You, all the things they can come to shopbarken.com on Instagram. I'm shopbarkin. Basically everywhere we are shop Barkin. No apostrophe that's just in the logo, but in all the handles and the, the URLs.
- [51:17]
B
Shopbarkin.com and buy two pouches and then you can intermix the straps and make cute little accessories and all the things mix and match.
- [51:24]
A
Build your collection of colors.
- [51:26]
B
I like that. Mix and match is a great idea. All right, Inez, thank you so much.
- [51:30]
A
Thank you so much. This has been incredible. I am eternally grateful.
- [51:35]
B
Inez is an incredible person and she has been absolutely nailing it. I mean, talk about action. Takers are moneymakers. She jumped into multi stream machine. She got 34 or 35 stores worldwide. I mean, she really jumped in and, and decided like, this is what she's going to do with her business. And you can see she's super successful now. Sometimes all it takes is a second set of eyes to help you realize that you don't need to be doing all the things. The main theme here is that oftentimes we tend to overcomplicate things and make them harder on ourselves, when in reality, we just need to be really focused in our actions and get really good at what's already working to start seeing the success we want. And if you don't know what to do or what next step to take, then this is a time for you to really consider what do you need to know? What do you need to learn? What kind of support do you need? Right. Do you need a step by step guide, a path to profit? What do you need? And go out and get it? Because it's not always about doing something new, but rather it's about honing in, testing and trying and tweaking until we become really good at what's already working in our business and then we can continue to build on that. So you do that until you start to see it start to work and then you get the results that you're looking for. I hope that you love this coaching session as much as I did. Inez has a beautiful, amazing, amazing product. Make sure to check out her products. And if you have a dog or someone that you know, go out and support this product boss and I'd love to hear from you. So send me a message over on Instagram at the product boss. That's where all the things are happening. You get to see behind the scenes. We have some really funny videos and we're there to support you along in your journey. And if I could ask you before you go and move on to the next episode or whatever you're doing in your day, would you mind taking a moment and following the show? And if you feel called, would you mind leaving a review for the podcast? It really, really helps us reach more product based business owners out there. And I read every single one of them and they really just touch my heart when I read them. And I'm just. It keeps me going and keeps me motivated because I know I'm on the right track and supporting you twice a week on this podcast. All right, my friends, till the next one.