The Rest Is Politics – Episode 448: Mandelson’s Epstein Disgrace, Kirk’s Assassination, and Trump’s Illegal Boat Strike

Hosts: Alastair Campbell & Rory Stewart
Release date: September 11, 2025

Episode Overview

In this high-octane edition of Question Time, Alastair Campbell and Rory Stewart confront an avalanche of crises—both domestic and international—that have dominated UK and global headlines. They dive deep into the shock resignation of Peter Mandelson over newly revealed Epstein links, the assassination of MAGA influencer Charlie Kirk and its explosive political aftershocks, Trump’s unprecedented and illegal Venezuelan boat strike, and a tour of underreported crises from Haiti to AI’s influence on public service.

The hosts bring their trademark blend of sharp analysis, political gossip, and respectful—if lively—disagreement, offering listeners context, clarity, and some wry observation during a tumultuous political week.

1. Peter Mandelson’s Resignation: The Epstein Scandal

(Starts ~02:25)

Key Discussion Points

• Mandelson's forced resignation:
  After being appointed ambassador to the US, Peter Mandelson is pulled into the Jeffrey Epstein scandal due to newly released emails and a telling "birthday book" entry.
• Explosive revelations:
  Mandelson’s emails reveal a more sustained, financial and personal relationship with Epstein, including support after Epstein’s conviction for child trafficking.
• The downfall trigger:
  The final blow comes from an email where Mandelson vows to help Epstein overturn his conviction. PM Keir Starmer, after once defending Mandelson, is forced to sack him.
• Mandelson’s pattern:
  Discussion of Mandelson’s history of resignations—three in total—each linked in some way to proximity with power and wealth.

Notable Quotes

• "Peter's just got, you know, he's got, in a sense, got too close to the same sort of person." —Alastair Campbell [07:39]
• "It’s pretty disturbing...for a very senior cabinet minister to think that it’s appropriate to stay in the apartment of a multimillionaire in New York who’s in prison for child sex offenses." —Rory Stewart [09:38]
• "He needs to be in politics, he needs to be in public life and doing big things...so this will be absolutely devastating for him." —Alastair Campbell [11:14]
• "He did say...there is going to be worse to come." —Campbell, on Mandelson’s forecast [12:21]

Deeper Insights

• Political culture:
  Both highlight the reflexive urge among political elites to send support when a colleague is in crisis, often misjudging the seriousness of transgressions in the moment.
• Lessons for leadership:
  Campbell discusses how Mandelson’s fall reflects the perils of seeking proximity to power for its own sake, and how basic judgments—especially around convicted sex offenders—must override loyalty.

2. The Assassination of Charlie Kirk: America’s Political Violence & Fallout

(Starts ~19:42)

Key Discussion Points

• Who was Charlie Kirk?
  The 31-year-old was a dominant right-wing influencer, hugely popular among young Trump supporters, and a relentless provocateur—frequently anti-Islam, pro-guns, anti-birth control, and staunchly pro-Israel.
• Weaponizing a tragedy:
  Republican and MAGA voices immediately blame “left-wing rhetoric,” weaponizing his murder against Democrats—despite not knowing the killer’s identity or motive.
• Diminishing political discourse:
  Campbell and Stewart both decry the rush to martyrdom and how American—and even British—conservatives like Boris Johnson have amplified the polarization.
• Dangers for democracy:
  Kirk’s death, the hosts warn, will boost conspiracy thinking on the right, further destabilizing US politics ahead of midterms.

Notable Quotes

• "Charlie Kirk will rapidly become a very powerful martyr for that movement … It will make American politics that much more dangerous, that much more polarized as we head towards the midterms." —Rory Stewart [26:15]
• "If ever there is a moment where we need leadership that will try to unite rather than divide, it’s now. And I’m afraid we did not get that from Donald Trump and many of the MAGA people today." —Alastair Campbell [25:48]

Memorable Moments

• Campbell notes a chilling video: "To shoot somebody that accurately from 200 yards, that is somebody who knows how to use… whatever gun they were using." [28:08]
• Obama’s response is cited as measured and presidential, contrasted with Trump’s weaponized reaction. [23:50-24:10]

3. Trump’s Illegal Venezuelan Boat Strike and the Erosion of Global Norms

(Starts ~29:06)

Key Discussion Points

• The facts:
  Trump orders the destruction of a Venezuelan “drug boat” in international waters without Congressional approval, legal justification, or clear evidence—evoking condemnation.
• Dangerous precedent:
  Stewart compares it to drone strikes and extrajudicial assassinations, noting this escalation comes with even less legal or moral grounding.
• The vice-president’s response:
  JD Vance’s notorious response: “I don’t give an F,” when challenged about legality.
• Impunity culture:
  Campbell evokes the Rainbow Warrior affair and the killing of IRA suspects in Gibraltar—unthinkable then, now shrugged off.

Notable Quotes

• "It’s entirely illegal and completely shocking … the US in international waters, with no congressional authorization, … just kills them … with no questions asked." —Rory Stewart [29:34]
• "We’re in this new world of impunity that we’ve talked about so much." —Alastair Campbell [31:21]

Timestamps

• Trump’s action and JD Vance’s reaction: [29:34-31:21]
• Comparisons to past international incidents: [31:21-32:49]

4. Haiti: Collapsing State and the World’s Deadly Apathy

(Starts ~34:42)

Key Discussion Points

• Worsening crisis:
  Over 90% of Port-au-Prince now controlled by gangs, over a million internally displaced, with police and civil service crippled.
• Child soldiers:
  UNICEF reports that up to half of gang members are children, forcibly recruited into violence.
• International (in)action:
  Dorothy Shea (US ambassador) lobbies the UN for a multinational “gang suppression” force. Meanwhile, Trump pressures Canada to take the lead in Haiti, without US boots or money.
• UN failures:
  Stewart cautions Canada against taking the bait, recalling a history of failed interventions in Haiti.

Notable Quotes

• "One of the reasons I wanted to talk about this is I actually think this is, dare I say it from the United States, a good idea. Heaven knows how he would implement it, but … a multinational force to go in and try to get some sort of control." —Alastair Campbell [42:00]
• "It’s difficult to think of a place where the UN and the international community has failed more and more successfully over time." —Rory Stewart [43:07]

Timestamps

• Haiti’s current crisis: [35:51-37:34]
• International response and Canada’s dilemma: [41:43-44:19]

5. The Green Party’s New Leader: Populism or Progress?

(Starts ~46:31)

Key Discussion Points

• Zack Polanski’s election:
  Wins with 85% of the vote, brings an “eco-populist” approach, and utilizes social media savvy reminiscent of Farage’s tactics.
• Media quirks:
  Polanski’s history as a hypnotherapist and name change from David Paulden raise eyebrows (and jokes).
• Strategic positioning:
  Hosts debate whether his left alignment helps or hinders the Greens, and discuss possible alliances, even with Jeremy Corbyn.

Memorable Quotes

• "He taught her how, through visualization, she could make her breasts larger... This magic he’s able to bring to people’s bosoms, he’s now bringing to the Green Party." —Rory Stewart [46:57]
• "I gotta say, the point about his communication... he is a very effective communicator, no doubt about that at all. He gets the social media stuff." —Alastair Campbell [47:35]

6. Artificial Intelligence, Bureaucracy & British Public Services

(Starts ~53:33)

Key Discussion Points

• AI and productivity:
  AI could relieve overburdened doctors, lawyers, teachers, and even overhaul clogged courts—potentially transformative.
• Political anxieties:
  Stewart and Campbell agree the UK/EU risk strategic dependency if AI infrastructure is monopolized by the US and China.
• Real-world anecdotes:
  Stewart’s 90-year-old mother uses ChatGPT for parish church planning; Campbell is wowed by ChatGPT-generated invention ideas at a cricket match.

Notable Quotes

• "AI could completely transform productivity in public services... The potential is absolutely unbelievable." —Rory Stewart [53:33]
• "I was at the cricket the other day... he goes onto ChatGPT... they came up in like two seconds and two or three of them, I thought, yeah, that’s really interesting..." —Alastair Campbell [56:18]

7. The Changing Putin: Declassified Clinton Papers

(Starts ~58:54)

Key Discussion Points

• Newly released Clinton–Putin transcripts:
  Reveal a more westward-leaning early Putin, even raising NATO membership with Clinton.
• Differing interpretations:
  Was Putin genuinely open to the West, or playing for time? Stewart lists western policies (Libya, NATO expansion) which hardened Putin’s stance.
• Putin’s core:
  Campbell relays US analysts’ skepticism—Putin’s strategic DNA never changed.

Notable Quotes

• "There’s even this extraordinary discussion... about whether there might be a way of getting Russia to be a part of NATO." —Alastair Campbell [59:23]
• "This guy’s been a Russian nationalist from the very beginning obsessed with recreating a Russian empire." —Rory Stewart [62:31]

8. Civil Disobedience, the Police, and the Media

(Starts ~63:44)

Key Discussion Points

• Mass arrests in London:
  Over 850 pro-Palestine demonstrators arrested in a coordinated act of civil disobedience.
• Media and public perception:
  Was the coverage sufficient without celebrity involvement? Banksy makes an artistic intervention.
• Police’s unenviable role:
  Hosts reflect on police capacity, the “impossible position” they’re in, and an amusing complaint letter from Baroness Emma Nicholson regarding the Graham Linehan arrest.

9. Modern Sainthood: Carlo Acutis

(Starts ~67:41)

Key Discussion Points

• Teen internet saint:
  The British-born, Italian-raised teen is canonized, with debate over the merits and PR motivations behind modern sainthood.
• Personal tributes:
  Campbell would nominate his partner Fiona ("She must be such a saint to put up with you"), Stewart, his own mother.

10. Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Mandelson’s resilience:
  "He keeps coming back again... none of these resignations are ever permanent." —Rory Stewart [09:38]
• On Trump’s abnormality:
  "This goes back to day one of term one, when he claimed that there were more people at his inauguration than Obama’s... the utter abnormality of everything that surrounds him." —Alastair Campbell [32:49-34:42]
• On the need for media focus:
  "There should be more coverage of Haiti." —Alastair Campbell [44:19]

Timestamps for Key Topics

• Mandelson’s resignation/Epstein saga: 02:25–19:23
• Charlie Kirk assassination: 19:42–28:15
• Trump’s Venezuelan boat strike: 29:06–34:42
• Haiti discussion: 34:42–46:31
• Green Party/Zach Polanski: 46:31–49:50
• AI in public services: 53:33–58:36
• Putin’s evolution: 58:54–63:44
• Civil disobedience & policing: 63:44–67:15
• New saints and sainthood: 67:41–70:51

Tone and Style

The hosts display a blend of seriousness befitting major scandal and tragedy, but also their well-honed ability to disagree without rancor, peppering their analysis with humor and historical perspective. They move seamlessly from Westminster intrigue to global crises, always searching for context, lessons, and (occasionally) something to smile about.