Riley Gaines (4:45)

Well, it sounds amazing. I can't wait to go downtown and see, like, the Clay and Laura Travis building. But honestly, one of the things that I've appreciated about you most, something I've come to learn throughout the past few years, is you really are someone who puts your money where your mouth is, whether that's the philanthropy side of things, but even more so online offering what WNBA teams like a million dollars to play, what was it like a high school state championship boys basketball team. Of course, you've had no one take you up on this, which leads me to someone that again, the online discourse is there. You and I have talked about this person a lot. Megan Rapinoe. What in the world is wrong? This is a woman who has historically lost to, I think, a 15 and under boys team out of Dallas. We've got a clip here. I know you've seen it. Let's watch it. Really, really quick.

Jennifer Virtue (5:39)

Horrible rule that came out from the International Olympic Committee. They've announced a new policy that they're calling. I can't even believe they're calling it this because it has nothing to do with protecting women. I feel like two people who played at the very highest level for every competition that you possibly could agree with this and never felt like this was an issue at all. We already know that biology, as much as we want it to be just nice and clean and tight and perfectly in one category or another, it's not. We know that. So now what we're doing is subjecting everybody, all women and all people who are identifying as women to this really invasive testing. And this will ultimately just prevent people from competing within the women's category that they feel like have an unfair advantage.

Riley Gaines (6:37)

It's kind of like the whole point, like, the women's category is intended to be exclusive. What's your thoughts here?

Clay Travis (6:46)

Well, I think you actually put a good tweet up because I wasn't an athlete or even in school when you said you were having to be tested for Covid all the time. I did do those Covid swabs. They were super invasive and they didn't feel good and you had to do them all the time. My understanding is this is one cheek swab. And for the vast majority of women, they will say, okay, you are a woman. You're eligible to compete. And if someone doesn't test as a woman, they're not ineligible. They just compete as men. And that's. That seems very fair to me. And again, I think President Trump deserves a lot of credit for this because we're going to host the 2028 Olympics in Los Angeles. And he has made it quite clear that men shouldn't be able to compete against women. And unfortunately, we have given gold medals, I believe, to a bunch of different people who are actually male identifying as women. And you've got a daughter, I hope one day that I have a bunch of grandsons and granddaughters, but the idea that I would ever have a girl who has to compete against a boy in a sport is crazy. And let me say this. I don't know that I've talked about this. I coached Little League, the best player on my 10U team was a girl, she was dominant. She could throw the ball harder than the boys, she could hit it farther. If, if someone is so good that they're capable of competing in a sport that's different than their gender, more power to it, girl to boy competition. But the idea that a guy should be able to compete in women's competition with men being bigger, stronger, faster than women, it's. It's just crazy. And you know, you've gotten savaged over this, which is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever seen for simply caring. Unlike Megan Rapinoe and Sue Bird about younger athletes. Like I think you've talked about your sister. One day it'll be your, your daughter being able to compete against other women. I just can't believe that this is still an issue and this is where we are as a country.

Riley Gaines (8:49)

You know, you said it, me, caring. Do you think that's what it is with people like Megan Rapinoe and Sue Bird? Do you think they know that men and women are different? I mean, you have to imagine that's the case and they just simply don't care. Or do you think they fully believe that a man who takes puberty blockers, do you think they believe that he can somehow turn himself into a woman if he so wills it?

Clay Travis (9:15)

I don't know. And this is, I can't even get into their head because you have to know. You mentioned Megan Rapinoe's team competed against 15 year old boys from Dallas, Texas and they lost. This is not the best 15 year old boys in the country. This is the best 15 year old boys in Dallas, Texas and they lost. So the biology of testosterone, once it starts rolling. I've got a 15 year old in my house. He's a totally different human than when he was 12. He's the same size as me now he's starting to try to bench more weight than me. Testosterone, when it takes off, is a huge differentiator, as everyone who's ever raised kids or gone to school can testify to. So she has to be able to see it. I think she's just so committed to the delusion of her politics that she's not willing to say publicly what she knows to be true privately. That's my kind of assessment of what I think she's got going on.

Riley Gaines (10:13)

No, I agree with that. And in watching this clip back, I was thinking to myself, you know what, I don't think, correct me if I'm wrong, I don't think Megan Rapinoe said a single word about The Iranian women's national soccer team. When all of that was going on,

Clay Travis (10:28)

she finally spoke out. Weeks later, Riley, she issued a tepid statement. After there had been weeks of silence, she finally said something, but it was paled in comparison to how outspoken she is on the Olympic rule. And I just, I find her to have been wrong about almost everything in her worldview. And, you know, I wish she would have to answer questions like the one you just asked. I mean, it's a very reasonable question that someone could ask because I think the reality is if 12 men decided to compete as, as women, there would be no starting women soccer players. Right. All 11 starting spots and probably the top sub would all be male. And she said this after she retired, conveniently after her career is over. And I just, it is insanely unfortunate that this could happen. I wish that Elizabeth Eady would get more attention and Megan Rapinoe would get less because I think one of them is brave, insane, and. And the other one I think is a coward and insane. And I'm going to take brave insane like you and other female athletes out there who've been willing to speak out on this over the Rapinos of the world.

Riley Gaines (11:43)

Yeah, you mentioned Elizabeth Eddy. This is a woman who, she played 11 years in the professional league alongside people like Megan Rapinoe, but ultimately just retired. I'm sure her tenure was part of it, playing for that long. But she said, look, I, I couldn't do it anymore. The backlash that I faced from my teammates, from captains on my team, from people who I would have called best friends, who disinvited me from their wedding for saying that I don't think men should be on the soccer field with us. Crazy, crazy stuff. So I agree that she's brave. Those are the voices we need to amplify. And worth noting, Megan Rapinoe and Sue Bird, they don't have daughters, you know, and I do think that that is another level to it. The lengths that you are willing to go to protect the integrity of that. Staying on the topic of sports, you participated in a roundtable hosted by President Trump, what, just a few weeks ago now, he signed an executive order surrounding Nil. Nil and kind of taming the wild, wild west that is the ncaa. Can you kind of explain what this executive order does and kind of the key provisions of it and how ultimately this helps save college sports, as President Trump touts himself on doing?

Clay Travis (12:56)

Yeah. So look, there is a hope that Congress is going to be able to pass a bill to try and give an antitrust exemption to college athletics so that basically they can put rules in place right now. They get sued as antitrust violators anytime they try and put rules in place. But I imagine a lot of people watching us right now are kind of rolling their eyes because Congress can't seem to do anything. So President Trump, I think, is frustrated with how long the process of Congress trying to enact a bill is taking. And he wrote this executive order which hopefully will have some of the color of law, but has not been passed by Congress. And I think there are three things that really kind of stood out. And I want to get your take on one of these in a sec here. You get five years to play four, which has been the standard for most of college athletics. Uh, you cannot transfer more than once freely, meaning you can't go from playing. You swam at Kentucky. You couldn't go from Kentucky one year to Florida the next, more than one time. And then it says once you go pro, you aren't able to come back into college in this sport, which has been something that has been occurring now. You went to uk, you're a great swimmer there. Can you imagine what kind of education you would have gotten if you had swam at four different schools in a five year process, like for transferring credits, for relationships that you build for all these different things? Everyone talks about how great Nil is, but the idea of going to four schools in five years as some of these guys, and it tends to be guys and then claiming that you're getting any education at all, it's just absolutely bonkers to me. And almost no one talks about it.

Riley Gaines (14:45)

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Clay Travis (18:16)

You know, if I had a magic wand and, and I could kind of put it in place, I would have several broad parameters. First of all, there's a big difference between nil and pay play. And I'll give you an easy example of that. Livy Dunn, who a lot of people know, the gymnast from lsu. Almost all of her money is actual nil places want to endorse her. From her social media platform, she's able to endorse. I think Vora would be an example. You and I love xxxy. Great product. Encourage everybody out there to go buy as much of it as you can. I'm wearing their shorts right now, even though I'm dressed up like a professional person at the up top. I've got on their athletic shorts right now. I love. But that would be nil. Right? You're being paid to endorse a product through your own social media channels. Being paid to play a sport is different. Okay? So I think you have to distinguish between those two. We kind of have turned nil into pay for play. And for pay for play, I think you need to have a set salary cap. I think that guys should be able to get paid in revenue producing sports. But I don't think that you should be suing to stay in college instead of going pro. It used to be when, when I was a young guy that everybody. Maurice Claret's a great example. Star running back for Ohio State. He sued to try to get to the NFL earlier because he would make more money as a pro than he would as a college kid. That's the way it should be. You shouldn't go to pros and make less than you made in college. And so it's broken. So we need a salary cap. We need a collective bargaining agreement. I still think, and I know I'm getting to be an old man on this, that you need to get an actual education because your point, Riley? Financial literacy. I worry about this for my own kids all the time. So many people are knuckleheads when they're young, especially boys. When they have money and they get at a young age, 17, 18 years old, they don't have any idea how to save it. They don't have any idea how to invest it. They think that gravy train is going to be there forever and then boom, you're 24. Your pro athletic career may Be over. Your college career is over and you don't even have a network to get a real job anymore because you don't have any tangible skills. And you went to four schools in five years. So you didn't even make a relationship with the university to be able to try to get a gig in real life. So I worry about all those things that would be kind of my magic wand parameters that I think would be better for. For most athletes. Most athletes don't have a value outside of their sport and scholarship. And so I think we have to, as you did, distinguish between revenue and non revenue producing athletics as well.

Riley Gaines (21:02)

Yeah, absolutely. Which is another maybe intended, I think I would initially say unintended consequence of this executive order is it does kind of help women's sports, non revenue sports and that Olympic pipeline for Team USA and yeah, the financial literacy piece. Clay, I'm honestly like embarrassed to admit this, but the other day I had to write a check and I'd never written a check before because everything is done digitally over.

Clay Travis (21:27)

Oh yeah, that's funny.

Riley Gaines (21:28)

Pay all your bills, everything online. So I had to write a check. And it says at the bottom, you know, memo. I had no idea what that meant. I had to call my dad. I'm like, dad, at the bottom of this check.

Clay Travis (21:37)

It's really funny.

Riley Gaines (21:38)

I do. And he says, riley, like, tell me you're filming like a TikTok. And you know, I'm like, dad, I have no idea what this means. He was also embarrassed, but. But it's real. Like how, you know, if you've never had to do it. So absolutely agree with you there. You mentioned this will probably be challenged legally in the courts. Who is it that is opposing this? Because I've seen statements by, I mean, I think all the Power 5 conferences, they seem to support it. So who is it that opposes this executive order?

Clay Travis (22:06)

It's going to be individual athletes who feel like the executive order restricts their compensation. So if you are an individual athlete that's already transferred once and you want to transfer again. For people out there who don't remember, transferring used to be difficult. I mean, when you started your athletic career at Kentucky, I presume the rules were if you transferred, you had to sit out for a year and you then gave up one year. So you had five to play four. But it was a big deal. Right? If you're 18 and you sit out for a year and you can't play again till you're 20, that really restricted a lot of movement. And by the way, I don't think that's a bad thing, right? Because I think kids should learn how to fight through. Now, sometimes you get recruited over your coach leaves. There are external factors that I think certainly can be considered, but one of the biggest challenges is coming in as a freshman and realizing I'm going to bust my ass for a couple of years until I really get significant playing time as a junior or senior. Because it's really hard to be good and excellent at something. And I think that making people aware of how hard they work and again, building those deep roots of a university connection are, are important, important. But it will be by and large individual athletes who feel like their compensation is being restricted. They're going to argue that there is an authority that there, there's an antitrust component to this. This is getting into the weeds and being a nerd legally, which sometimes I do the only way. Like let's use LeBron James as an example. He's been the best player in the NBA for much of the last, you know, he's 41 now, but for much of his career he was the best player in the NBA. He was making way less than he otherwise would because there's a ceiling on compensation. The floor then is elevated as a part of the collective bargaining agreement. So the mediocre and lesser players get paid more than they deserve. The LeBron's of the world make less. That's collectively bargained for because otherwise LeBron was probably worth $100 million a year some years. He never made that because of the collective bargaining agreement. If you just restricted LeBron's pay and everybody agreed in the NBA, they're not going to pay him what he's worth. And there wasn't a collective bargaining agreement that would be an antitrust violation. He would be able to sue. So it's the CBA for pro sports that gives them the antitrust exemption. The Congress needs to pass it so we can get basic rules put in place. Until they do. There are lawsuits. The President's trying to address it, but there will be suits laid out against him too.

Riley Gaines (24:39)

And there's no timeline of when we could expect to see something moving through the house, is there?

Clay Travis (24:45)

I mean, they, they say, I guess they say, we think we're going to do it this summer. But Riley, I'm not optimistic Congress can pass anything right now and I think the conferences and a lot of other people aren't either. But so the summer before the midterms is what they say they're trying to do.

Riley Gaines (25:04)

We will see. We will see. Well, thank you for that analysis that's helpful for, for even people like me, especially the, the legal side of things. I want to ask you about Gavin Newsom's wife, or maybe I should say partner. She referred herself as the first partner of California. I. Everything I know about this woman has been like entirely against my own free will. She pops up on my timeline like every on X specifically is a new clip of, I think it was Jennifer of Jennifer Virtue signaling in some way, shape or form. Let's play the latest clip that I saw today.

Jennifer Virtue (25:43)

I had to be very raw when we interviewed the young men who were juvenile offenders in San Quentin. I told them about my own loss, where I lost my older sister a few days before my seventh birthday. And I blame myself for her death and I share that because that they ultimately were accused of committing these violent crimes and sentenced for life. And I think it shocked them that this, you know, blonde lady who was, you know, the interviewing them had a similar story, was perhaps in the wrong place at the wrong time and, but wasn't punished the way they were because clearly it was an accident. But theirs was probably an accident too.

Riley Gaines (26:31)

The smugness of which she's talking about hardened criminals who are sentenced to life in prison in San Quentin. First of all, for context, for those who don't know who are listening to this, because I didn't know this until I found this video and saw some of the research behind it. Gavin Newsom's wife apparently ran over her sister in a golf cart when she was six years old. And of course this was an accident, unintentional. She goes on to say how she faced zero consequences, but in this video she's saying, you know, they're facing life sentences, but whatever they're charged with was probably an accident too. I mean this is like peak elite tone deafness. What's your thoughts on her? She seems like a total liability to Gavin Newsom, quite frankly.

Clay Travis (27:18)

Well, she is a liability. That's an awful story, but I don't think there's anyone in America who would say, hey, if a six year old drives over her eight year old brother or sister in a golf cart, that they need to be put in prison for the rest of their lives or that they need to be compared to adult criminals. That's what she did. Um, and again, it's an awful story. I'm a parent, you're a parent. Like something awful happening to kids, siblings involved, it's truly atrocious. But it's nothing at all similar to what she's talking about in San Quentin. And look, Riley, I repped murderers, drug dealers, alleged domestic abusers. As a young lawyer, we were required to represent criminals. And so I understand the concept of believing in rehabilitation, believing in finding forgiveness, finding a way to recalibrate your life after you've done something awful. Her experience is not similar to what they are accused of. And look, I don't think there's very many people out there who would say, hey, you know what? The issue we have in America is we're too kind, so we're too cruel to violent criminals. I actually think we're far too kind to them. I want violent criminals behind bars longer. We would all be safer if they were. And this is also important as someone who committed who. Who defended those who had committed crimes and been accused of crimes. Very rarely, very, very rarely does someone commit a truly heinous violent crime. And it is the first time they've ever done anything criminal in their life. These people who commit these crimes, Riley, they start at young ages and they typically are continuing to grow and accelerate the level of their criminality. And so this idea that, oh, they made one bad decision in their life and they ended up here, does it happen? Yes. Is it insanely rare? Yes. Is it in any way analogous to what a six year old did? No. And so I think she's just a tremendous liability for Gavin Newsom. And this is she's evidence. Sadly, you see this a lot of the woke mind virus having taken over educated white women more than almost anyone else in the country. And I think she speaks as someone who has completely taken over by that woke mind virus.

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Riley Gaines (30:07)

Yeah, absolutely. I agree with that. I think she's attempting to appear, you know, empathetic and apologetic. And she seems to be very emotionally driven. And these are wonderful things in their true essence. I think, especially as women, we tend to be those things on average, certainly more so than men, who are, again, more aggressive and dominant and assertive. Again, good things for men, for those who are genetically encoded to protect and to provide. Those are fantastic things. But what she's doing, it's. It's not empathetic how she's speaking. It's really not with kindness or compassion. She's allowed those things and what she believes those things to be to. To be weaponized against her. So I agree with you. I think she's a liability. I think, you know, she's like, trying to diagnose and treat young boys as if it's a. A disease to be treated. She talks about her son. I, again, I more so think she's doing it to virtue. Signal her. She seems so very proud when she's talking about this. And she got this book and she's reading it to her sons and she changes. If there's a protagonist that's a boy or a male, she changes to. She. I don't think she actually even does that. I think she's just saying that. Anyways, who do you think is the, like, the Democrat darling, right now? You think it's Gavin Newsom?

Clay Travis (31:29)

Well, I think he thinks he is, and I think his wife thinks that he is. I said this on my show the other day. I still think Kamala Harris is going to be the nominee, and people think that I'm crazy for this take. I think black voters in Democrat primaries are going to show up and vote for her. I don't think they're going to show up and vote for Mayor Pete. I don't think they're going to show up and vote for Gavin Newsom in big numbers. If I were handicapping the race right now, I would still make Kamala the favorite. I would. And I think, you know, look, we'll see what happens on the Republican side, whether JD And Marco end up working together, how the next couple of years go economically and all those things. But I think the reason Kamala titled her book 107 Days is she's going to argue she didn't get enough time to make the case of why she's the right choice for America. And I think some people are going to find that to be a compelling argument. Not me, but I think a lot of Democrat voters, particularly black voters in Southern states like where we live, Tennessee, South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, places that tend to vote early. I think Commonwealth will do very well.

Riley Gaines (32:40)

Yeah, and I agree with you. I think people have short memories. I think they will have forgotten how horrible and inauthentic of a campaign she ran leading up to the election in 2024. So I'll be interested to see what direction they go. Do they go with someone more moderate like Bashir or who appears to be moderate? I don't think any of them are moderate by any stretch of the Imagination, but who appears to be more moderate, such as Bashir or Shapiro or what that looks like. One more thing I want to ask you about. Last thing in talking about kind of the Trump hysteria, of course, it's not new. Over the weekend, he tweeted this. He says a whole civilization will die tonight, never to be brought back again. I don't want that to happen, but it probably will. However, now we have complete and total regime change where different, smarter and less radicalized minds prevail. Maybe something revolutionary, wonderful can happen. Who knows? We'll find out. Tonight, one of the most important moments in the long and complex history of the world. 47 years of extortion, corruption, and death will finally end. God bless the great people of Iran. And now we are being lectured on the 25th Amendment. Can you explain this and what we're seeing, the discourse that we're seeing online right now?

Clay Travis (33:52)

Well, the first time the Biden presidency was Weekend at Bernie's, a movie that came out that is absolutely insane, that features a dead man that they pretend is alive. That was a crazy movie. Riley. Then they made weekend at Bernie's 2. Um, and so every Democrat was fine with Weekend at Bernie's one, which was Joe Biden's first term in office. And then other than Dean Phillips, the Minnesota congressman who ran against him, all of them lined up and said, yes, we want another four years from Joe Biden, who clearly was mentally and physically incapable of being President of the United States. Once they all lined up behind Joe Biden, there is nothing that Donald Trump can do. The guy on Monday had a hour and 15 long, hour and 15 minute long press conference where he answered every question under the sun. And he does this every day, such that if Trump isn't in front of the media for 10 hours, Democrats go crazy and start saying he's sick and in the hospital. Riley. So I think that's. That is the reality. Look, I trust Trump. I trust Pete Hegseth. I know you know, Pete. I trust Marco Rubio. I trust these guys to make good decisions in a tough climate. By the way, let me go back to one question you asked a minute ago when we started about the Million Dollar Challenge, because some people say, you know, I offered a million dollars to a WNBA team to play against the high school state champion team of my choice. And if the WNBA team won, they would get a million dollars, which is a huge amount, more than most of them made at the time, to play for a year. Some people said, why would you do that? Because I think we need we saw it with you swimming against Leah Thomas. But I think we actually need a real competition between men and women. The best women against just good men, and see what the biological difference is. I think those high school boys, Riley, would obliterate the WNBA champions. That's not meant to demean the WNBA champions. It's meant to illustrate the importance of. Of having separation of men's and women's athletics. You lived it. A lot of people out there still tried to deny it. I want this challenge to happen. I think a lot of people would watch, and I think what they would see would stagger a lot of people. Biology is real. And it doesn't mean that men are better than women, and it doesn't mean that women are better than men. I don't buy into that concept. Look, I think we just need to acknowledge that we're not the same. And for most of human history, we did that. We were very happy to do that. And this. This. I think it's actually quite sinister. I think what they're trying to do is argue that there is no difference between men and women. That's really what this is about at its root, that biology is not real. And so I simply would say, let's have a competition, and let's see. And the fact that no one will do it, I think deep down proves that there is a recognition of. Of this reality.

Riley Gaines (36:54)

Of course they won't do it, but for you, even offering, you're like a big.

Clay Travis (36:59)

I'm a huge misogynist. I'm like the worst human who's ever existed. But again, prove me wrong. I'm putting my money on the table. I'm putting my money where my mouth is with something I try to do to be as honest and end the hypocrisy as much as I can. And they won't follow through.

Riley Gaines (37:17)

No, no. And like I said, you do that really, really well. Well, Clay, I appreciate you. Thank you for joining the show. Always love seeing you. Gosh, you're on my TV screen all the time. I don't know how you have enough, how we have the same amount of hours in the day, truthfully.

Clay Travis (37:34)

Hey, look, I am so proud of you. True courage is rare. I've said it to you privately, but I think it's important to say publicly. There are so many people who know what you are saying to be true and so few who will actually say it. And your fearlessness and your bravery matters a great deal to me and so many other out there. So thank you. And by the way, hold up that old school Tennessee Titans sweatshirt. We need to give them some good. We need to give them some good mojo. I've been going to their games for over 20 years now. It was really tough this year since they moved to Nashville. We need some good mojo. Nashville is a great city. You and I are born and raised in it. A rarity. We need a decent team here again. Please be good again, Titans.

Riley Gaines (38:19)

Come on. Fingers crossed. Get like we started the show and how we'll end it. At least Vanderbilt is on the.

Clay Travis (38:25)

That's true.

Riley Gaines (38:26)

And they have a new stadium, too. It looks fantastic. It does look fantastic. So thank you very much, Clay.

Clay Travis (38:31)

Keep killing it, Riley. Thank you for having me.

Riley Gaines (38:35)

Thank you guys for watching today's episode of the Riley Gaines Show. I hope you loved it and if you did, make sure you subscribe. You can do that right here so you never miss an episode. We'll see you guys next week.