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Kaylie Ray: The Truth Behind That Viral Arizona Senate Clash | The Riley Gaines Show
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- [00:01]
A
Get in the game with the college branded Venmo debit card. Wreck your team with every tap and earn up to 5% cash back with Venmo Stash, a new rewards program from Venmo. No monthly fee, no minimum balance, just school pride and spending power. Get in the game and sign up for the Venmo debit card@venmo.com collegecard the Venmo MasterCard is issued by the Bancorp Bank NA Select Schools available Venmo Stash terms and exclusions apply at Venmo me stash terms max $100 cash back per month. They just can't help themselves. Time and time and time again, Democrats prove themselves to be anti woman. Oh my gosh. We have an incredible guest today. Her name is Kaylee Ray. She is a former volleyball player, female volleyball player at Utah State University. She has recently been a critical advocate of the inclusion of men and women's sports. She's been testifying all across the country, most recently in the state of Arizona where a viral interaction happened between her and a female, a woman, a female Democratic state senator. Excited to show you that. Get Kailey's response and more. Stay tuned for this episode of the Riley Gaines Show. Well, Kaylee, thank you for joining the Riley Gaines Show. I have so enjoyed getting to like know you over the past few years and even prior to clicking record, learning more things about you, I just admire you and your courage. Can you speak to just, I mean, just for a brief moment of. I think it's important for viewers or listeners to understand just how much of your life, whether that be social sacrifices, physical sacrifices, the emotional toll, the mental toll that playing sports, especially at the high level, takes on on a female athlete like yourself. Can you kind of explain your background?
- [01:53]
B
Yeah. Well, thanks for having me on. Of course, when I say it takes up all your time, I mean this is the only thing I focused on doing all growing up. It's the only way I made friends, was through participating in sport and volleyball, dedicated all my time. If I wasn't working on stuff for school or if I wasn't spending time with my family, I was training in the gym, working out, doing everything I could to prepare my body. Much less than getting there to the Division 1 level. People are so quick to assume that student athletes have it easy and I cannot emphasize enough how that is just not the case. Balancing the work of college on top of training, recovering, lifting strength and conditioning, practicing for hours on end. Like it, it is your whole world and it definitely becomes fused with your identity of who you are as a person.
- [02:53]
A
Yeah, 100%. All of those things on top of trying to maintain some sort of social life, which as a Division 1 athlete is. Is truthfully nearly impossible unless you know the. The relationships you. As you just alluded to, and certainly as I experience, the relationships that I think are closest to you are your teammates. So people who are kind of in the trenches with you. Yes. So you go to Utah State University. Can you talk about what you experienced, even maybe prior to finding out that you would at some point, soon be competing against a team that had a man on it?
- [03:30]
B
Yeah, I mean, it's. It's really difficult, the adjustment. I thought, I'm a super independent person. College will be easy. And I will say, like the living on my own, doing my own laundry, cooking my own meals, that wasn't any trouble for me. But learning to balance the demands of my coaches with what I actually wanted and with school and receiving an education, it became quite a difficult juggle. On top of that, I got hit with some health challenges pretty early on in my career. That also just added another layer of stress and devoting time and energy to things that weren't involving my sport or my social life. So sport is usually where you get your fulfillment in those spaces. And when sport isn't going so well, it can be really difficult. The mental toll, the emotional strain that that puts on a student athlete. And I'm sure every college athlete out there listening to this right now is like, I know exactly what she's talking about. Um, totally.
- [04:41]
A
Well, as you said, you place so much of your identity in your success as an athlete, and so when that's not going well, the rest of your life tends to go down with it.
- [04:51]
B
Yeah. And it's really hard navigating relationships, particularly between player and coach and then professors and strength and conditioning coaches and trainers and your teammates, leaders, and, you know, just when we have foreigners on the team, like, there's a lot that you are tasked with navigating early on. And so I would just say being a college athlete isn't easy, much less when you have men invading your sport.
- [05:23]
A
Talk about that. Talk about the first time you learned that San Jose State University, a school in your conference, had a man on their team and that. That you guys would be playing this team.
- [05:35]
B
So I had first in. In 2022, we had competed against San Jose, and that was the first time that we saw the biological male named Blair, originally Braden, I believe, competing, and my teammates. And I immediately knew, like, this is not a female athlete. Of course, we had our.
- [05:59]
A
Why do you say that? Was it. Was it the physical of it, like, sheerly playing against him, you could notice a difference.
- [06:05]
B
Yes. Especially in volleyball. I can't speak to other sports having, like, not really played other sports, but this person in the physicality and the way that they played. In volleyball, when you're attacking the ball, some people call it spiking, but if you play volleyball, you just call it attacking as someone is going to hit the ball. On the men's side of the game, there is so much more torque. You kind of see it's almost like the body as they're swinging, like folds in half. In girls, that's significantly less. Like it's there. But you can just see if you just watch clips of this player playing, the torque, the physicality, and not to mention the height of the vertical, it was very apparent to us, like, that's a dude.
- [06:56]
A
And even a men's volleyball net is like, what, seven and a half inches higher than a women's net, right?
- [07:04]
B
Yes.
- [07:05]
A
So that right there acknowledges that biological differences exist.
- [07:10]
B
Yes. And even at the youngest of ages, the boys high school teams play on that higher net than the women's. And growing up, having an older brother who eventually in high school, went on to play volleyball, he had like a 44 inch vertical even on the men's net, was jumping over the height of the men's net very easily. So it was very apparent to me when we first saw this player like that something here is not like the others. So my teammates and I had speculations, we made comments amongst ourselves, but it was very new. We were just confused, couldn't possibly understand, and it wasn't confirmed to us. So then you're kind of left thinking, am I judging someone unfairly? You know, there's a lot as women, we are kind of taught to be pleasant and pleasing and have people like you and don't say stuff that might rock the boat. So a lot of that was just locker room talk. Like, we kept it to ourselves. In 2023, we continued to make those same comments. It was very obvious to us that player was out for most of the season with a thumb, allegedly a thumb injury. Brooke can speak more to what was actually going on then. But again, we had made comments, and my coach, my head coach at that time, then confirmed to one of the players on the team because he was friends with the San Jose State coach at the time, like, no, that is. That is a transgender player, had told us. Now we're like, okay, puzzle pieces are clicking into place here like we weren't wrong, we're not dumb. And then right before they were to come play us at our gym, administrators came into our team film room and talked to us before the match and said, as you know, as you probably know by now, but at this point it wasn't public knowledge. It was just amongst our team and they had said any if we hear any comments, any derogatory comments from players or fans like you will be ejected immediately. There's no tolerance for that. And I guess San Jose State had reached out, their administration had reached out prior to ensure that our gym would be a safe space for this athlete. And that was when feelings started to really take root.
- [09:58]
A
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- [09:59]
B
Celsius energy drink, then straight to the gym, pre K pickup back home to meal prep.
- [10:05]
A
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- [10:10]
B
I'm ready.
- [10:11]
A
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- [10:13]
B
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- [10:20]
A
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- [11:58]
B
Yeah, everyone was just so unsure. It was such a bizarre thing that nobody knew how to handle it. We hadn't seen this before. We had obviously talked to our parents and it was kind of understood amongst the team, like, this isn't right, but also like, these people are in charge, like, what else can we do about it? Can't do anything about it. So we ended up playing. I think Blair maybe played for a second, but not much because they were still coming back. He was still coming back from the injury, I guess, but that was the last time I played against San Jose State. And then some stirrings had happened the following spring and then it was confirmed publicly and it became public knowledge prior to the 2024 season. And that was when kind of we realized that, oh, we were right in feeling like this was a big deal and maybe now we're actually in a place where we can do something about
- [13:08]
A
it, talk about that. I'm sure the people watching or listening to this can recall. We have. It seems our society has very short memories. But I mean, just not even two years ago, your team really kick started a slew of other teams and making a bold statement and essentially boycotting, I mean, effectively forfeiting a game against San Jose State University. Can you talk about the decision behind this and the conversations that went into this? And one of the things that I want to know is if you had support from administration, maybe your coaching staff or even higher ups in the decision to not play against San Jose State.
- [13:51]
B
Yeah, well, obviously we had heard that in the preseason Southern Utah had refused to play San Jose. And because it's a preseason match, it doesn't really affect, you know, the conference standings or anything like that. So there was no penalty for Southern Utah to back out of that match. But then we started to hear and like talking to girls on other teams, you know, like, there's a potential here to make a really big statement and like let the country know, like put everyone on notice that like, this is not something we're going to stand for anymore. I believe I had been talking to my parents and my dad had actually reached out to you and got us in touch. And it was such a huge support to me at that time because you were immediately like, I've been talking to university presidents, I've been reaching out to athletic directors, like, I'M well aware of the situation at hand. And to just finally. It was like the first time that I was like, oh, like someone's on my side here. And it's not just like, my team and I against the world. So it was the first time I kind of felt like I could breathe a little bit. I was empowered to do so. And I began having conversations with my athletic director at the time, her and I had actually kind of a tumultuous relationship. Early in the summer. She had let go of two administrators who I had grown to love dearly in my time at Utah State. And I was kind of outspoken against her publicly, but I honestly think it made her respect me a little bit more. And so in conversations with her that followed, obviously she was incredibly supportive of my stance on the issue, and she. I felt the most support from her and, you know, from my coaching staff. The support was not really there. They didn't want to draw attention. It was a hot button topic. They didn't want to be controversial, anything to just, you know, shut down, be quiet about it. But, yeah, my athletic director at the time, she was really someone that I grew to rely on in that and have very open and plain conversations about what can the university do? What can we do? Ultimately, in my communications with her, they sent out an anonymous survey to the girls on our team while we were away on a travel trip. I like, want to emphasize that. That this is taking away time and focus. So much energy. It was a distraction all season, like, nobody could focus on playing volleyball. We're away on a travel trip, about to compete against a team, and here we are, like, dealing with the weight of this massive issue that they sent out an anonymous survey to let us vote on it of sorts. And then based on our responses, the university president and athletic director helped us make that decision.
- [17:07]
A
That's so good that you at least had someone administratively in your corner, as opposed to a university president, number one, lying to you, as they did at San Jose State University, to. To Brooks team, to the women's volleyball team, but forcing you to play. Do you know if the result from the poll was unanimous?
- [17:31]
B
I think just in conversations amongst the girls on my team, it was unanimous. We weren't, like, we didn't talk about it other than in the locker room, everyone together. I know for some girls, it was a very hard issue. Those people that want to be very compassionate and understanding. But like you've said a hundred times, where is the compassion for the girls? Where is the compassion for the women actually playing? So I Knew some girls were divided, but ultimately agreed, like it's wrong, it's wrong for a man to be in a woman's sport, a biological male. I know that led to really difficult conversations with family members and kind of families being torn apart from this conferences girls, Wyoming's team in particular, I knew that their whole team like split on the issue. It was really difficult.
- [18:28]
A
And that's something I want people to realize because again, unless you've played a competitive sport, it's really hard to grasp. Again, not just the sacrifices, but I mean think of the seniors this could have been. I mean it was, it was their last season playing. Especially when we're talking about the, the conference championship like this prematurely ended their career. Like the fact that this was a burden that young college girls, 18, 19, 20 year old girls had to, had to carry. There are so many fingers to be pointed here, so many people to blame. I remember being heartbroken at the time because of course you guys doing what you did, other universities, Wyoming, University of Nevada at Reno, these other schools, of course it takes such boldness and courage to do that, to effectively say no, enough is enough. But it is so tragic that you even had to, you're sacrificing your season and in some cases again, especially for the seniors, you're sacrificing your entire career. And so you mentioned that Southern Utah, they didn't necessarily have a penalty by you guys forfeiting against San Jose State University. What was kind of at stake there,
- [19:40]
B
we took a loss on our record. For us, we were only scheduled to play San Jose once that year. So it was only one loss on our record that we had to take. Which utterly bizarre how that even came to pass. Mountain West Conference, very shady in the way they went about passing that rule under the table where by refusing to play a team you'd have to take a loss on your record. And that was exactly what kept Wyoming from the Mountain West Conference tournament was because these teams were forfeiting to San Jose and San Jose was getting unfair wins on their record. They just got to walk into the tournament as a 2 seed, get the first round. By, I mean the whole thing that it's, it was a farce. Like the Mountain West Conference tournament did not reflect the best teams that season and like you said, ended careers early. And for the people that strove their whole life, worked endlessly to get to this level. And all you are competing for is winning a conference championship, it's winning a national championship, whatever it may be, that's always been the end Goal. And to have to give it up and walk away because the Mountain west commissioner decided this was going to be the case, and the San Jose coaches and administration decided that this person's identity was more important. The fact that those girls had to give up dreams for a sport that they had worked their whole lives for, like, it just makes you so nauseous and so sick.
- [21:22]
A
It does. It. It really is so sick. And it is so incredibly unfair. And again, they do it under the guise of being kind and being inclusive and being compassionate and all these fantastic buzzwords that sound good on paper, but all the while, it's you all, as women who were absolutely and entirely sidelined. Like you were actually being used to validate a man's feelings who cares about your own. He is the one that matters. Right? You even talked about how your gym had to create a safe space, which. That's the stupidest thing ever. Everyone is allowed to play volleyball, right? No one prevented him from playing sports. He just has to compete in the adequate and accurate category being the men's category.
- [22:08]
B
Right. And I also just think it's so funny to walk into an opponent's gym and expect it to be a safe place. Are we joking? Like, what is sports about? I'm sorry.
- [22:17]
A
Exactly. Exactly. And so what has the last few years, I guess maybe the past year and a half looked like for you in terms of maybe personal growth or advocacy? I know there's been a lawsuit launch, of course. I saw you on the Supreme Court steps recently. So you have clearly taking the initiative to continue to use your voice and to lend your name and your face to such a critical issue. What has the past year and a half looked like?
- [22:47]
B
It's been a lot of just plain conversations with people and relentlessly working to make sure. I mean, my strongest motivation for me right now, actually, I have a little baby niece. She's about to turn a year old, and I want her to have all the same opportunities and more than I did. And the thought of her ever having to experience the emotions, the trauma that we had to go through, much less the girls like Brooke who were in it and had to see that every single day. Those feelings, which someone couldn't possibly be able to comprehend looking on the outside. I never, ever want another girl to feel like that. Like girls like Macy Petty, Peyton McNabb, Lauren Miller, like Stephanie Turner. The list goes on and on and on. And that is exactly the problem. So I have no trouble these days standing up and speaking out. It gets easier when you keep doing it. And I've learned that courage kind of begets courage. And the more that I am courageous and upfront about this, the more that I find other people are too. Just amongst my teammates, I know, like, we have really been inspired on this cause.
- [24:10]
A
Well, courage begets courage. And I think. And that is certainly an outcome of speaking out, but maybe an unintended outcome of speaking out is the other side throws a pie in their own face oftentimes as they simply can't rebuttal this issue. They really can't in terms of fairness, in terms of safety, as it pertains to locker rooms or, you know, especially in this case, sharing overnight accommodations in terms of privacy. You recently were testifying before the Arizona State Senate. We have a video. We're going to play it really quick.
- [24:44]
B
Roll it.
- [24:45]
C
I mean, I have my sports hat on now. It's all about a sports mentality. Growing up in sports, being a tomboy. I mean, you look pretty healthy. I've played against girls that look like you. You look very much in shape and strong. But it's a sports mentality when you're growing up and how much competition that you'll take on. So it's not just a silver bullet for one community of sports players. It's the individual person on how competitive you want to be. So you grew up one way. I grew up a different way. I would have taken on a man in a heartbeat. I played in. I was the only girl sometimes in men's sports. But to have a man on my team, I would have welcomed it. But this is just my opinion. So it just depends on the sports mentality of that individual. And that's why this bill is bad. Because you're just putting. Putting a whole community of women's sports in one category. When women like me, we have a different opinion. So how competitive do you think you really are?
- [25:57]
A
Yeah, Kayleigh, playing at the Division 1 level, how competitive really are you? You don't want a man playing on the court with you. Well, you're just simply an unserious athlete. I mean, the level of narcissism that was exuding from this woman all while she has like this very prideful smile on her face. There's so much I could say here. I don't know how you didn't explode in the moment listening to this. Your response actually was beautiful. You, of course, were so composed and respectful. What was your initial thoughts in hearing this?
- [26:35]
B
I mean, she starts off by commenting on my body and then proceeds to move into how. Well, we obviously grew up different Ways. Well, surely we must have because I don't know, the mental gymnastics you have to do to make the argument the way she did it was astounding. I was honestly just a little bit in shock. A lot of disbelief for her to say the words, I would have welcomed a man on my team. I was like shaking, my hands were shaking. I just thought. And she did have that smug. She looked down on me like, here, little girl, let me educate you. You know, and that, like, patronizing like that is just one thing I can never ever like, stand behind. I was. For someone in my position to walk in front of a committee in the Senate, it can be a little daunting. I really appreciated the senators who said, thank you for sharing your testimony. You know, like, that's not an easy thing to do. But for her to just say everything she said and then be like, but that's my opinion. And then when I finish my response back to her as I'm walking away, she goes, thanks for your opinion. And it's like, it's so utterly dismissive. But it can't be surprised because that's what they do. They dismiss, they abandon. They have to ignore basic fact to justify anything that comes out of her mouth.
- [28:13]
A
Yeah, you're right. It was so patronizing. I don't think she realized. Well, I have to imagine she didn't. How deeply regressive what she's saying is, how utterly misogynistic. And you're right, she, she says she would welcome a man on her team. Cool. But guess what? You don't get to consent on behalf of all women. I mean, it was just the most insane line of questioning or, or I guess her thought process there. But one of the things that was remarkable to me, and we saw Greg Gutfeld say this earlier this week on Fox, was at least she is acknowledging that he's a man. Right. I think that's a pretty big step and I think it was overlooked by many, including myself. I don't think I initially came to this conclusion because people like you and me, we've been calling them men for, I mean, because our eyes work and we have functioning brains and a fifth grade understanding of biology. We've been calling them men. But to see a Democrat legislator say outright, maybe indirectly, but certainly directly saying that this was a man, that's a pretty big step in the right direction.
- [29:19]
B
I think so. I mean, it came out of her mouth. Must be, must be true.
- [29:24]
A
And for her to say, you know, you look really healthy, like, I'm, I'm baffled I'm baffled because you can. You can tell what she's insinuating there. It is absurd to me that anyone who claims to be a fierce defender of women's rights supports these people in this part. Deeply regressive, utterly misogynistic.
- [29:48]
B
It was so exactly what she said. Regressive. That is such a perfect word for what it was. To say is to essentially advocate for the abolition of Title IX in a women's category altogether was so upsetting and unbelievable that the words actually came out of her mouth. And to, like you said, insinuate that maybe my physical stature or how my body looks should correlate to being able to take on a man. And to then say, I just, like, must have lacked competitive spirit. I have no words. It truly baffles the mind that this was an argument, that. That she has that smug look on her face like she thinks she's doing something with it.
- [30:41]
A
I hope that you have felt incredibly supported online, and I hope that she feels like the dunce that she is. That's putting it very kindly. There are several things that I could call her that come to mind, but. But I think dunce is appropriate. I hope she understands now. Maybe it takes public backlash to feel that. I hope she understands just what she was saying and just how harmful it is, not just to girls like you, but you're right. To girls like your niece. To girls like now, my daughter, the next generation. I. I hope and pray desperately that she doesn't have kids, she doesn't have daughters, because I can't imagine one day growing up and watching a tape of my mom say that to another young girl. Understanding how she's undermining and diminishing the opportunities for me as her potential daughter, to succeed and to achieve. That is crazy. And so I guess my question for you kind of wrapping up here is, is it worth it? Have you found it to be fulfilling and satisfactory? And do you think we're moving the needle here?
- [31:51]
B
I think we are. I really do. It's becoming more of an open conversation. People are starting to recognize that this is common sense. This is a common sense issue. This is basic biology, basic understanding, basic truth. It has been very fulfilling to me in standing up. I have found a community of people that have no shame in standing for what is right. And I think telling the truth is a compassionate thing. And I believe that surrounding myself by people who are unafraid to stand for the truth has definitely inspired me to keep moving forward. I know we are certainly far from over. Obviously, I'm hoping that that bill passes in the Senate and we can get that on the ballot for Arizona voters to make a decision about. Obviously, we don't want to leave it in the hands of people like Senator Miranda, but I do. I think we're moving it forward. And like you said, the fact that she agreed, it's a man. We must be getting somewhere. But I know that the fight is far from over and my energy is revamped. I'm ready to go.
- [33:02]
A
Well, thank God for it. And thank God for you. Truthfully, I'm just so grateful because you are. You are fighting for the future of. Of my daughter, your niece. And that's what it's about. So thank you, Kaylee.
- [33:13]
B
Thank you. I wouldn't be able to do this without you first trailblazing the path, so.
- [33:19]
A
Oh, please. Well, onwards with full steam ahead.
- [33:22]
B
Yes, together.
- [33:25]
A
Thank you guys for tuning in to the Riley Gaines show. Be sure to follow us here on YouTube.com RileyGaines you can subscribe that way you never miss an episode. You can follow us over on Instagram at Riley Gaines Show. We'd love to hear from you. You can leave comments here. You can DM us over on Instagram. We want your feedback. We want to know what you want to hear about. We want to know what, what guests you want to see on the show. Be sure to share these episodes far and wide. It helps tremendously. When you do. You can share it with your friends or your parents or your neighbors. Heck, why don't you share this with that liberal in your life? You know the one I'm talking about. Share it with the person who needs to hear this message the most. We'll see you guys later.