Demna's Appointment Ushers In a New Era for Gucci

Summary

The Run-Through with Vogue: "Demna's Appointment Ushers In a New Era for Gucci"

Release Date: March 14, 2025 | Host: Nicole Phelps | Guests: Virginia Smith, Mark Guiducci

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Introduction

In this episode of The Run-Through with Vogue, host Nicole Phelps delves into significant shifts within the luxury fashion landscape. The focal points include Demna Gvasalia’s appointment as Gucci’s new Artistic Director and Dario Vitale’s promotion to Chief Creative Officer at Versace. Joined by Vogue’s Global Head of Fashion Network, Virginia Smith, and Creative Editorial Director, Mark Guiducci, the trio navigates the implications of these high-profile leadership changes and what they signal for the future of these iconic fashion houses.

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Demna Gvasalia’s Appointment at Gucci

Background and Selection

Nicole Phelps opens the discussion by announcing Demna’s transition from Balenciaga to Gucci, highlighting his nearly decade-long tenure at Balenciaga and his role in founding Vetmall.

Nicole Phelps (00:50): "Demna was appointed the new artistic director of Gucci... What will happen to Balenciaga after Demna's departure."

Virginia Smith (02:17): "The last time we had something like this was when Demna debuted at Balenciaga... he changed the way we think about fashion."

Mark Guiducci (03:30): "Demna's always had a way of looking at culture in a very interesting way, and he's very much at the zeitgeist of what's going on."

Impact on Gucci

The hosts discuss the potential transformation Demna could bring to Gucci, contrasting his avant-garde approach with former Artistic Director Sabato di Sarno’s focus on quiet luxury.

Nicole Phelps (05:05): "Francesca Bellatini's quote makes me think they identified him not just because he is a real designer's designer... but also because he does have such a fabulous sense of a dramatic moment."

Virginia Smith (05:44): "Sabato was perhaps an experiment in quiet luxury, and Demna, who knows what he will bring, but almost certainly it won't be that."

Creative Vision and Future Shows

The conversation shifts to Demna’s recent Balenciaga show and his potential direction for Gucci’s future collections.

Nicole Phelps (06:06): "He had this show a few days ago in Paris, and it was quite different... what do you think he's gonna give us?"

Mark Guiducci (06:50): "I think he’s starting something new. It was an ending collection from him, and he'll start something new at Gucci."

Virginia Smith (07:29): "Gucci is at least four, maybe five times the size of Balenciaga as a business... It’s really interesting to see how Demna's brilliant mind will navigate this broader market."

Nicole Phelps (19:15): "Demna was addressing the rumors and he says... what is important is to focus on the clothes."

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The Future of Balenciaga Post-Demna

Potential Successors

With Demna departing, the question arises about Balenciaga’s next Artistic Director. Nicole Phelps suggests Nicolas de Felice, designer at Courreges, as a strong candidate.

Nicole Phelps (08:41): "I personally like Nicolas de Felice for this job... He's a real designer's designer."

Virginia Smith (09:12): "And his shows too."

Mark Guiducci (09:20): "I think that's a great idea... if they want to keep it in the family."

Industry Implications

The panel reflects on the importance of internal promotions versus external hirings in maintaining brand continuity.

Mark Guiducci (16:24): "These are really important roles that are going to people who have worked in the background for 20 years."

Virginia Smith (16:44): "It's different than the wunderkind hiring... These are people who have put in the time and experience."

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Leadership Changes at Versace

Appointment of Dario Vitale

The discussion transitions to Versace, celebrating Dario Vitale’s elevation to Chief Creative Officer and Donatella Versace’s new role as Chief Brand Ambassador after three decades.

Nicole Phelps (10:39): "Donatella took over at Versace after her brother's horrific murder in 1997... What do you see as Donatella's biggest accomplishments?"

Mark Guiducci (11:18): "The return of the supermodels was probably sparked by Donatella... it's so great how she chose Dario Vitale."

Reflecting on Donatella’s Legacy

Virginia Smith and Mark Guiducci laud Donatella’s three-decade stewardship of Versace, emphasizing her influence and the seamless transition to Vitale.

Virginia Smith (14:00): "She is synonymous with Versace... there is no one who could be more Versace than Donatella."

Mark Guiducci (12:36): "Dario has been behind the scenes in a very influential way... it feels like a really nice, graceful transition."

Virginia Smith (14:15): "Donatella is iconic... it's beautiful how she carries her brother Johnny's legacy with humility."

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Industry-Wide Shakeups and Future Prospects

Wave of Designer Appointments

The panel discusses the broader trend of significant leadership changes within major fashion houses, contemplating the reasons and potential outcomes of such shifts.

Nicole Phelps (17:08): "What are we in this moment of such great and profound change with designer hires?"

Virginia Smith (17:08): "Maybe some of these smaller companies could end up being some of the big players... it's all up in the air."

Mark Guiducci (18:11): "Demna going to Gucci and others gives them a fresh slate. There's so much possibility."

Optimism for the Future

There is an underlying optimism about the infusion of new creative visions and the potential for innovation within established brands.

Virginia Smith (18:52): "It's nothing if not really exciting. Who knows?"

Mark Guiducci (18:55): "It's gonna be a really incredible thing to witness."

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Conclusion

Nicole Phelps wraps up the episode by reiterating the transformative changes within Gucci and Versace, expressing excitement for the upcoming seasons and the fresh perspectives these new leaders will bring. The panel underscores the dynamic nature of the fashion industry and the continual evolution driven by visionary creatives.

Nicole Phelps (19:18): "Hopefully next season, we'll be talking about the clothes."

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Key Takeaways

• Demna Gvasalia’s move to Gucci signifies a potential bold new direction for the brand, moving away from its recent focus on quiet luxury towards more avant-garde and culturally resonant designs.

• Dario Vitale’s promotion at Versace ensures continuity and fresh creativity, building on Donatella Versace’s nearly three-decade legacy.

• Balenciaga’s future may see internal promotion with Nicolas de Felice poised as a potential successor, maintaining the brand’s strong creative leadership.

• Industry trends reflect a preference for promoting experienced, behind-the-scenes talent to top creative roles, fostering stability and innovation within established fashion houses.

• Overall optimism prevails among Vogue’s fashion experts regarding the future of these iconic brands, anticipating exciting developments and influential collections.

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Notable Quotes

• Nicole Phelps (05:05): "Demna's profound understanding of contemporary culture... he does have such a fabulous sense of a dramatic moment."

• Virginia Smith (14:00): "There is no one who could be more Versace than Donatella Versace."

• Mark Guiducci (18:11): "There's so much possibility, and I think that is amazing as a designer."

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About the Hosts and Guests

• Nicole Phelps: Director of Vogue Runway, leading conversations on major fashion industry shifts.

• Virginia Smith: Global Head of Fashion Network at Vogue, offering insights into global fashion dynamics.

• Mark Guiducci: Creative Editorial Director at Vogue, providing critical analysis and historical context to current trends.

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Produced by Chelsea Daniel, Alex DePalma, and Joanna Solotarova. Engineered by Jake Loomis and James Yost. Mixed by Mike Kutchman. Executive Producer: Stephanie Karaoke. Head of Global Audio: Chris Bannon.

Transcript

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[Nicole Phelps]

This is the Run Through. I'm Nicole Phelps and the creative director. Shake ups. Musical chairs continue. Although I think we should call it artistic director in this case because Demna was announced as the new artistic director of Gucci. And that's not the only thing that happened today. Versace is getting a new chief creative officer. His name is Dario Vitale and that means that Donatella Versace is moving into the role of chief brand ambassador after nearly three decades designing Versace. We are here to talk about what this means for Versace. What will happen to Balenciaga after Demna's departure. He is doing the couture show in July and why all of these shakeup are happening now. There is so much to discuss. I'm joined today by Vogue's global head of fashion network, Virginia Smith and creative editorial director Mark Guiducci. Welcome.

[Virginia Smith]

Thanks.

[Mark Guiducci]

Thank you, Nicole.

[Nicole Phelps]

Woo.

[Mark Guiducci]

Nicole. I was ready for like, you know, a quiet weekend after being on the road for quite some time and that is not the case. This is our first emergency podcast meeting.

[Virginia Smith]

Can't fashion sleep for a weekend?

[Mark Guiducci]

Apparently not.

[Nicole Phelps]

Yes. We've been working for a month solid, so coming waking leading up to this news was overwhelming. But thanks to our colleagues at Vogue business in London, we have a, we have a five hour advantage. And you know, just bless them. I bless, I bless them right now.

[Virginia Smith]

Yeah, thank God for them.

[Nicole Phelps]

Let's start with the Gucci news. We announced that Demna was appointed the new artistic director following Sabato di Sarno. And Demna, as we all know, was the creative director of Balenciaga for almost 10 years. He also founded Vetmall. And, and I am curious to hear from you why you think Gucci CEO Stefano Cantino and Kering's deputy CEO in charge of brand development, Francesca Bellettini, chose him.

[Virginia Smith]

Well, actually on this here pod, just a couple of weeks ago, Chloe and I were talking with Hari Neff and we were talking about how fashion seems like it's ready for. I think Hari said let's give birth to something like a new moment, a new idea that really affects how we think about fashion. Not just how we dress, but also how we approach things. And we were talking about Alessandro and then we were saying that the last time that feels like that really happened may have been when Demna debuted at Balenciaga that, you know, the shoulders went out to here, and we changed. And the idea of dressing wealthy people as if they weren't this idea, like, was very subversive at the time and really shook things up. So the idea that just a couple weeks later that we're talking about Demna filling that vacancy, that, you know, there has been another designer there as well, but it has some sort of synchronicity. And, you know, I think that that moment in. I think it was 2016, fall 2016 was his first Balenciaga collection. You still remember that red puffer, right?

[Mark Guiducci]

And that red puffer is still being sold at Balenciaga. You know, it's like a perennial favorite for everyone. But you do. I mean, and interestingly enough, I was sitting right next to Alessandra McKeely at that show.

[Virginia Smith]

No way.

[Mark Guiducci]

Yeah. It was very funny how those worlds were colliding. But I agree. Mark, I think. I think he's an incredible. I mean, he. In hindsight, he seems like a very obvious choice, but it wasn't really one of the names people were talking about over and over again, at least in most circles. So. But, you know, Demna's always had a way of looking at culture in a very interesting way, and he's very much at the zeitgeist of what's going on. And I think they probably recognize that and want that for Gucci, and it really does seem like it could be a very, very exciting fit for the two of them.

[Virginia Smith]

Yeah. You know, one thing about Balenciaga show is that it's one of the most exciting shows of the season. Always the ideas that are there. I mean, I remember the one that sticks out in my mind most was the one where we were on the red carpet, where we were inside the theater and projected inside the theater was the red carpet. That was the arrivals for the show, and that was the show. Just the idea of subverting this idea of what a fashion show even is like, if he brings those kinds of ideas to his shows as well as his campaigns, and the way Gucci will show up in the world, as well as to the clothes, whether they are similar to what he's done for Balenciaga or not, I'm just really excited to see what that is.

[Nicole Phelps]

Yeah. Reading Francesca Bellatini's quote in the press release makes me think that they identified him not just because he is a real designer's designer and a guy who drapes on the form and can, you know, magic these incredible shapes, but also because he does have such an fabulous sense of, like, a dramatic moment, she said. Demna's profound understanding of contemporary culture, coupled with his extensive experience in conceiving visionary projects, has established him as one of the most influential and accomplished creatives of his generation. So I guess we have some pretty big Gucci shows to look forward to.

[Virginia Smith]

It's a big shift, obviously, from what they've been up to with Sabato di Sarno. Sabato was perhaps an experiment in quiet luxury for Gucci and an extension of what an Italian version of that phenomenon could look like. And Demna, who knows what he will bring, but almost certainly it won't be that.

[Nicole Phelps]

Yes, I do think this we should dig into a little bit, because, as we've already mentioned, that first Balenciaga show was so silhouette shifting. Suddenly we all wanted a parka that, you know, didn't quite go over our shoulders, or the. The jacket, the tailored jacket with a little bit of hip, which you still.

[Virginia Smith]

See, by the way.

[Nicole Phelps]

Oh, yes. And, I mean, I still think that is one of the best collections of the last decade. But he had this show a few days ago in Paris, and it was quite different. Backstage. He was talking about standards. Our colleague Sam Hein at GQ called it Normie Clothes. And so I just wonder, what do you think he's gonna give us? Do you have any predictions?

[Mark Guiducci]

Hmm. I don't think it's something we've seen from him before. I would think it would be a new. A new vision from him if I had to sort of guess. You know, it almost seemed like, looking back at that Balenciaga show, it almost seemed like a little bit of a bookend to. If you. You know, he obviously knew it was gonna be his last one, or almost his last ready to wear. I guess couture is really a different thing for him, probably. But in looking at it, you know, it was so sort of quote, unquote, normal, as we say. But I don't think that's what we'll see from him at Gucci. I think it's sort of an ending collection from him, and he'll start something new.

[Virginia Smith]

I love that idea. I hope you're right. You know, Gucci is at least four, maybe five times the size of Balenciaga as a business. And so Balenciaga is quite a focused idea. His Balenciaga is quite a focused idea. And to imagine what his Gucci would be also means that it would have to be something that has a broader market, too. So that'll be very interesting. Alessandro was able to grow Gucci from a smaller company into that because that maximalist aesthetic had so many ways to put it together, so many ways to take it apart. And it'll be really interesting to see how Demna's brilliant mind. That'll. I also think it's worth noting that Karin really believes in Demna because it's not so long ago that Balenciaga went through a quite traumatic scandal around some of its advertising. And so to put this faith in Demna to take the biggest job that they have in their stable is pretty inspiring, I think.

[Nicole Phelps]

All right, another big question. What happens to Balenciaga now that Demna is leaving? I personally like Nicolas de Felice for this job. He is the designer at Courreges, which is owned by Artemis, which is in the Kering family. And he's a real designer, a real designer's designer like Demna. He drapes on the form. He does a lot with very little these geometric shapes that turn into these really sexy pieces. But I mean, who do you guys like?

[Virginia Smith]

And his shows too.

[Nicole Phelps]

And his shows are incredible. That confetti this season was so, so joyful and so happy making and fabulous. Yes.

[Virginia Smith]

So simple and it was so memorable.

[Mark Guiducci]

That's a good idea, Nicole, I have to say. Thank you. Yes.

[Virginia Smith]

Yeah, I like that one.

[Mark Guiducci]

I mean, I haven't thought about it so much in the last 10 minutes, but I do think that's a great.

[Nicole Phelps]

Idea actually, if they, you know, want to keep it in the family, which they seem to want to do at this moment.

[Virginia Smith]

Let's ship that.

[Nicole Phelps]

We're going to take a quick break. When we're back, a new chief creative officer at Versace.

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[Nicole Phelps]

All right, we are gonna switch gears and talk about Donatella. This is a really history making moment in fashion. As we know, Donatella took over at the house of Versace after her brother's horrific murder in 1997. So that means she has been at the top for nearly 30 years at that brand. It is a life. And so what do you see as Donatella's biggest accomplishments? What in your memory of these last 30 or so years really sticks out for you about what she's done there.

[Mark Guiducci]

Oh, God. I mean, there's. I feel like there's been so many Versace moments. I mean, obviously, the recent JLO one was amazing. The initial JLO one was amazing, where she basically invented Google Image search. I mean, incredible. And then the return of the supermodels was really probably sparked by Donatel. I mean, she's just had a incredible tenure at, you know, her family's business, basically. And the thing that makes me feel good about this transition is that I feel. I mean, I don't know this. I'm just assuming this, but it seems like that a lot of people wanted that job and wanted that role. I'm sure. And other people have been rumored to have been in talks with her over the years, but she clearly took her time in choosing someone that she felt was really. I mean, this must be so important to her on so many different levels, on a personal level, on a business level. And it seems like, you know, unlike other transitions that have happened to other brands, this one seems like something that everyone was involved in and wanted to have happen, and that makes me feel very good about what's next for the future of Versus Hachi. I don't know Dario very well, but obviously he's had a ton of experience. He's been, you know, this is Dario.

[Nicole Phelps]

Vitale, the guy who is the new. The new Chief Creative Officer.

[Mark Guiducci]

Yes. I mean, you know, he's been a bit behind the scenes, but I sort of love that, you know, that of all the people who wanted this role, that's who she chose. And, you know, he has been behind the scenes in a very, very influential way. So, I don't know, it feels like a really nice.

[Virginia Smith]

Graceful.

[Mark Guiducci]

Graceful. Yeah. I don't know. It makes me feel good about Versace and how it happened.

[Virginia Smith]

Yeah, I mean, she is. She's iconic. You know, there are people who are, you know, some of the young designers that were talking about maybe taking over some of these houses who don't know fashion without Donatella Versace, you know, and I was really touched by her quote. She said, it's been the greatest honor of my life to carry on my brother Johnny's legacy. He was the true genius, but I hope I have some of his spirit and tenacity. And that is the humility that's baked into that, you know, from which that comes is so beautiful and maybe too extreme. You think about, you know, this is a woman who has a Lady Gaga song named after her. This is a woman who. She almost doesn't give herself enough credit. She can't believe, I think, sometimes how important she is for people in fashion and even outside of fashion.

[Nicole Phelps]

And so many dresses, beyond the famous J. Lo dress, let's not forget that the famous Angelina Jolie leg sticking out on the red carpet was in an atelier Versace gown.

[Virginia Smith]

The other thing, of course, is that she is one of few women who have had, especially going back to the 90s, a brand with her name on it that she ran and whose image she really embodied. It was, of course, Johnny started that company. But when you think of Versace now, you think of Donatella, and she is synonymous with that. And that alone is really an accomplishment to think about what she's built, especially in a kind of machismo culture. You know, the other thing to say is that of course, Donatella is. Her role is changing, but she's not leaving her own company and she is the chief brand ambassador, which is something she always, of course, has been. There's no one who could be more Versace than Donatella Versace. And so, in a way, it also opens up this idea of what else is she going to do? You know, like, what could she do with maybe more time on her hands to go be Versace in other ways?

[Nicole Phelps]

We'll be watching. So what do we know about Dario Vitale? He is a young. A young guy, 40, 42, I think, and born near Naples and studied in Milan at the Instituto Marangoni before going to D Squared for a year. And then he landed at Miu Miu and really, really made his mark there. But that's all we know, right?

[Mark Guiducci]

That's all we know. But I look forward to knowing more. I think that is really interesting that we don't know him so well, you know, and I find that that's sort of great.

[Nicole Phelps]

You were saying earlier that you like the idea of somebody making it big who has really toiled behind the scenes for a long time.

[Mark Guiducci]

We're sort of seeing a revival of that behind the scenes talent getting bigger jobs with Michael Ryder at Celine, Julian Klassner at Dries, and now with Dario. And it's nice to see that people who've really put in, you know, the time, the experience are being rewarded with these roles.

[Virginia Smith]

It's really different than the wunderkind hiring, you know, when Alexander Wang went to Balenciaga or something, where a kind of hotshot kid gets the job or someone from outside the fashion world is getting the job. These are really important roles that are going to people who have worked in the background for 20 years.

[Mark Guiducci]

Yep, agreed.

[Nicole Phelps]

Today was a very big day in fashion news, and it might not be the last very big day in the coming weeks or months. Another job being talked about. It's the worst kept secret in the industry. Why are we in this moment of such great and profound change with designer hires, do you think?

[Virginia Smith]

I mean, why is hard to say, but I think that there are so many prognostications about what all of this means, where we'll be in a year. And I kind of think anyone who makes grand statements is saying too much. And that when we think about Gucci, actually, and you think about what Alessandro was able to accomplish there and how much that company grew, both from a financial but even just a creative landscape point of view, I think it's kind of exciting to think that maybe some of these companies that we think of as smaller propositions could end up being some of the big players. And it's all up in the air, which is nothing if not really exciting. Who knows? We were talking about that big idea and where it's going to come from, and I think right now we feel like it could come from anywhere.

[Mark Guiducci]

I also think there's something like some really talented designers are getting these roles, which is wonderful to see. And I think, you know, Demna going to Gucci and others, this is giving them. It's like you're starting with a clean slate and the world is your oyster. There's so much possibility, and I think that is. Must feel amazing as a designer. Like, you can start from scratch, and that is a freedom that doesn't happen that often. So to have all these new roles with, you know, very talented designers, starting a new chapter in that brand's legacy is amazing. First day of school. Yeah, exactly. And I think it's gonna be, you know, really an incredible thing to. To witness.

[Nicole Phelps]

Yeah.

[Virginia Smith]

And for journalists to follow.

[Mark Guiducci]

Yes.

[Nicole Phelps]

And to talk about the clothes, which I think we should close by talking about what Demna said backstage, and he was addressing the rumors and he says, but I think that in the fog of rumors, what is important. Sometimes I read more about rumors and about who is going where than what we really want from fashion. Now, hopefully next season, we'll be talking about the clothes.

[Virginia Smith]

I hope so too.

[Nicole Phelps]

All right, that is it for the run through. Thank you, Virginia. Thank you, Mark.

[Mark Guiducci]

Thanks, Nicole.

[Nicole Phelps]

See you next week. The run through is produced by Chelsea Daniel, Alex DePalma and Joanna Solotarova. It's engineered by Jake Loomis and James Yost. It is mixed by Mike Kutchman.

[Mark Guiducci]

Stephanie Karaoke is our executive producer and Chris Bannon is Conde Nast's head of Global Audio.

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[Virginia Smith]

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