How to Build a Million-Dollar Portfolio Starting From Nothing | Graham Stephan

Summary

Podcast Summary: The School of Greatness

Episode: How to Build a Million-Dollar Portfolio Starting From Nothing | Graham Stephan
Host: Lewis Howes
Guest: Graham Stephan
Date: May 8, 2026

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Overview

In this enlightening episode, Lewis Howes sits down with Graham Stephan, renowned YouTuber, real estate investor, and financial educator, to explore the journey from humble beginnings to building a million-dollar investment portfolio. Graham shares candid stories about his relentless focus, frugality, and the mental shifts that powered his rise—from calculating the cost of gas before seeing friends to becoming a millionaire with diverse income streams. The conversation is a masterclass in personal finance, investing, mindset shifts, and the power of self-belief, all told with Graham’s signature honesty and practical wisdom.

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Key Themes & Discussion Points

1. Foundational Habits on the Path to Wealth

[01:56 – 05:11]

• Consistency – Graham credits his financial success to relentless repetition of effective habits.
  • “I was relentless in just keeping the same habits over and over and over again.” (Graham, 02:15)
• Singular Focus – He pursued one goal obsessively, aiming to do one thing extremely well.
• Extreme Frugality and Saving – Graham saved every penny, living so frugally it sometimes affected his social life and health.
  • He recalls even skipping driving to see friends if the cost in gas wasn’t justifiable.

2. Early Money Mindset & Influences

[05:17 – 07:13]

• Graham was not taught about money by parents but was influenced by his grandfather’s coin collection and books like The Millionaire Next Door.
• Developed a natural inclination for collecting, saving birthday/holiday money, and tracking expenses from childhood.

3. Breaking Into Millionaire Status & Multiple Income Streams

[07:13 – 10:12]

• Made his first million in 2019—income came from both real estate and YouTube.
• Describes how YouTube income began as “sushi money” but scaled quickly, highlighting the power of digital leverage versus purely time-based income like real estate sales.
  • “If every video I make just makes an average of a dollar a day...I could be anywhere in the world.” (Graham, 08:00)

4. Smart Physical & Portfolio Investments

[11:41 – 12:46]

• Best investments: fast computer, high-quality camera (for YouTube), and real estate rental properties.
• Graham maintains a roughly equal split between real estate, index funds, and cash.

5. Mental Barriers & Mindset Shifts

[12:46 – 16:36]

• Immediate exposure to wealthy clients in LA allowed Graham to believe success was possible for him too.
• A formative mistake—spending his first big commission on a sports car—turned into a networking advantage.
  • “I spent all that money buying a Lotus Elise...but that car...helped me network. I loved it.” (Graham, 14:16)

6. Invisible Assets: The Value of Mentors & Networks

[15:35 – 16:36]

• Graham emphasizes investing in relationships and learning from mentors like Jason Oppenheim.

7. Investment Approach During Economic Uncertainty

[18:53 – 20:42]

• Daily dollar-cost averaging into index funds is part of Graham’s core routine (buys $5,000 worth every day the market is open).
• Keeps cash in treasuries at ~4.4% yield while seeking good commercial real estate opportunities.

8. Advice for New Investors

[20:42 – 22:10]

• Advocates “house hacking”—buying a duplex, living in one unit and renting out the other—as the best way to start with $20k–$100k.
• Stresses the importance of reducing housing costs and being willing to “put in the work” as a landlord.

9. Should You Own or Rent Your Home?

[22:10 – 23:28]

• Buying vs. renting should depend on your area and length of stay. In areas like LA, renting is often cheaper and less risky.
• If you plan to stay 7-10 years, owning may make more sense.

10. Why Graham Moved from Los Angeles to Vegas

[24:21 – 27:38]

• Sought better quality of life, lower costs, improved community, and greater flexibility (less traffic, cheaper and bigger homes).
• Graham prefers Vegas for his lifestyle but notes LA’s unique energy, diversity, and entrepreneurial scene.

11. Psychology and Emotional Relationship with Money

[27:45 – 32:30]

• Always mentally subtracts 40% for taxes, then multiplies what’s left by 4% to estimate potential passive income.
  • “For every $100, I get, I have $60 left...and then I take that and multiply by 4%...that’s my passive income.” (Graham, 28:17)
• Struggles with “scarcity mindset,” always preferring to err on the conservative side.
• Avoids emotional purchases—“almost never,” except for a large personal aquarium.

12. Major Life and Business Lessons from Real Estate

[34:04 – 37:22]

• Persistence is critical—a lot of rejection and wasted time with "fake buyers" is inevitable.
• Learning to read people and not giving up.
• “I got so excited every day to wake up...it never felt like work.” (Graham, 36:40)

13. Money, Relationships, and Frugality

[38:05 – 41:49]

• Extreme frugality never hurt his relationships; focuses on quality of time, not expensive outings.
• Admits he’s loosened up thanks to his partner—now sometimes enjoys dinners out and values experiences more.
• Legendary anecdotes about bringing his own Subway sandwich to restaurants and always boxing up leftovers.

14. Busting Money Myths

[42:02 – 43:24]

• Rejects “you could die tomorrow, so spend today” mindset; advocates planning for tomorrow as statistically wiser.
• Saving aggressively in his 20s lets him enjoy more freedom and relaxation now.

15. Fast-Tracking to a Million: Regrets and What He’d Do Differently

[43:24 – 49:57]

• If starting over, Graham would have begun YouTube much sooner—urges aspiring creators to start before they feel “credible.”
• Tells the story of how encouragement from an early YouTuber inspired him but fear of lacking a flashy lifestyle held him back.
  • “Would I look back in the future and regret not doing this? And I thought, yes.” (Graham, 48:11)

16. Risk, Loss, and Major Setbacks

[52:37 – 55:35]

• Worst investment loss: Robinhood stock (lost ~$150k of $200k invested), an emotional “double down” during a big market drop.
• Wins balanced by occasional big losses; urges listeners to make individual stocks a small slice of their total portfolio.

17. Thoughts on Crypto, NFTs, and AI

[55:35 – 61:53]

• Never “got” NFTs, dabbled in crypto (mostly Bitcoin), warns of hype cycles.
• Predicts digital currency and blockchain will have far-reaching impacts (e.g., digital dollar, luxury goods authentication).
• AI could soon create customized, on-demand tutorial content; thinks it’s too early to say where it will “land” for wealth-building.

18. Long-Term Money Goals

[62:01 – 64:00]

• Wants to reach $1M/year in passive income, aiming for ~$25M invested in low-risk assets.
• If/when achieved, plans to buy more time for himself—travel, pursue interests like “van life,” and continue creating content.

19. Three Truths and the Definition of Greatness

[66:47 – 69:11]

• Three Truths:
  1. Self-belief is crucial—believing you can do something makes all the difference.
  2. Confidence attracts people; be your best self and worry less about others’ opinions.
  3. Authenticity and not caring about external judgments inspire others.
• Greatness:
  • “To help others. If you make an impact on someone else’s life and it’s a positive impact...there’s nothing better than that.” (Graham, 69:01)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Relentless Consistency:
  “I was relentless in just keeping the same habits over and over and over again.” (02:15, Graham)

• On Early Frugality:
  “I was calculating the cost of gas to go and visit a friend...the cost of gas was not worth the time I would be able to spend.” (02:48, Graham)

• On Realizing YouTube’s Power:
  “If every video I make just makes an average of a dollar a day…I could be anywhere in the world.” (08:00, Graham)

• On Big Investment Mistakes:
  “Very stupid. When I bought Robinhood stock, that was probably the worst loss…200 grand, lost 60-70%.” (52:59, Graham)

• On Overcoming ‘Not Ready’ Fears:
  “Would I look back in the future and regret not doing this? And I thought, yes.” (48:11, Graham)

• On Scarcity vs. Abundance:
  “Everyone tells me I’ve got, like, a scarcity mindset because I’m so much like, when I get something, I don’t want to lose it.” (29:46, Graham)

• On Greatness:
  “To help others. If you make an impact on someone else’s life and it’s a positive impact...there’s nothing better than that.” (69:01, Graham)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Foundational Habits: 01:56–05:11
• First Million & YouTube’s Impact: 07:13–10:12
• Physical Investments & Portfolio: 11:41–12:46
• Investment During Economic Uncertainty: 18:53–20:42
• Advice for New Investors (House Hacking): 20:42–22:10
• Why Leave Los Angeles: 24:21–27:38
• Money Mindset & Emotional Relationship with Money: 27:45–32:30
• Biggest Investment Loss: 52:37–55:35
• Crypto, NFTs, AI: 55:35–61:53
• Vision for the Future: 62:01–64:00
• Three Truths & Greatness: 66:47–69:11

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Conclusion & Takeaways

This episode is a candid and information-rich blueprint for anyone serious about building wealth from humble beginnings. Graham Stephan’s story demystifies what it really takes—discipline, frugality, singular focus, and constant learning. His unique mix of caution and measured risk, as well as his ongoing journey of embracing abundance, offers hope and clarity to listeners at any stage of their financial path. Above all, Graham's message is that greatness lies in helping others along the way and daring to believe in yourself before anyone else will.

Transcript

[Podcast Host]

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[Interviewer]

What would you say are the three habits that you started to develop early on when you didn't have a lot of money into becoming a millionaire? Could you think back on three specific habits that supported you from going from 50 to $100,000 a year to breaking into the first million?

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, I would say definitely consistency. I was relentless in just keeping the same habits over and over and over again. I would then say it was the focus of just. I had one goal in mind of just like, I'm gonna do this one thing and do really, really, really well. That's all I wanted to do. And I would also say saving money. I mean, I lived really, really, really frugally.

[Interviewer]

You obsessed about that.

[Graham Stephan]

Probably too frugal. I was too frugal.

[Interviewer]

You were like every penny. Yeah, I can't go out and have an extra sushi. I can all you know oh, not even.

[Graham Stephan]

Like, I wouldn't even do the sushi. It was probably unhealthy. I mean, looking back, like, I can't have regrets about it, but, I mean, it got to a point where I remember I was talking about this yesterday. I was calculating the cost of gas to go and visit a friend, and I determined how bad it is, though. Like, the cost of gas was not worth the time I would be able to spend with his friend. And, like, I did the analysis on that and thinking, well, if I'm only going to see for two hours and it's going to cost me X amount of money, that's stupid. Like, I should not be looking at it like that. But that's how I was in the beginning.

[Interviewer]

Where did that come from? Is that like a childhood learned behavior? Did you model that from somewhere? Were you just, like, why did you feel like you needed to be so obsessive about every penny? And decisions of, like, driving to see a friend, Is it worth the money?

[Graham Stephan]

Like, wait, yeah, a lot of it. I thought of, like, how much I would be making or the cost of my time. And then extrapolating from there, what my time is worth, doing certain activities. There was also another point. I must have been, like, 15 years old, maybe 16. I just got my driver's license, and I remembered how far $20 could get you. And I was like, okay, If I have $20 and that's my budget and that's what I'm spending, I could put $10 in the gas tank. I could spend $5 in a Subway Footlong sandwich, and that's like two meals to $2.50cent. And then I have another $5 left over for, like, miscellaneous. Like, I remember breaking it down to that degree. And then just from there, you know, taking that to, well, here's what a dollar could buy, and just, like, appreciating that. But then also going through. There was a time briefly, I think. I think the job was, like, six weeks. I worked at this gold precious metals bullion investment firm. I did data entry because I thought I wanted to, like, be an investment banker. I'm like, this is a great way to get experience. Wasn't. But I think I was. I think I must have been paid, like, $7.75 an hour. Like, it was maybe eight bucks, like, max. And this was back in early 2008. And I remember thinking, okay, like, if I'm making like, $8 an hour, is a Subway sandwich worth 40 minutes of that? No. And then how could I stretch that further so I Just thought everything in terms of, like, going back to making, like, eight bucks an hour.

[Interviewer]

Wow. Did your parents teach you lessons about money early on? Did you have money mentors?

[Graham Stephan]

No.

[Interviewer]

What were the things. What were the beliefs you had early on around money? Like, what did you think when you thought of money? When money came in, did you think, I need to save it? Do you think money was good? Money was bad? You know, what were your beliefs about it?

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, I never thought money was bad. I had always been obsessed with, I guess, like, saving and collecting. Like, even as a kid, I think it was. My grandpa showed me, like, his coin collection, and I thought it was so cool. And he's. And he showed me a picture of, like, 1909 S VDB penny. It's like, these pennies are out there still. They're like X amount that are probably still in circulation. And, like, every. Like. And I was, like, maybe 6 years old, and I'd just be checking pennies. Like, every penny. Be like, this is a 1909 SVDB. Like, I never found one. But I've just been obsessed with, I think, just saving, collecting. Like, I. Even if I got, like, birthday money or Christmas money, like, I would save it, I wouldn't spend it. And I liked just to see that accumulate in, like, an envelope in my room or something. Yeah, yeah. Be like 100 bucks or something like that. Like, the whole year's worth of, like, saving and collecting. I just naturally, I think, gravitated towards that.

[Interviewer]

What was the. I mean, did anyone teach you about money, though? Did you ever, like.

[Graham Stephan]

No, not really. My mom had a book, and I think it was, like, the Millionaire Mindset.

[Interviewer]

Secrets of the Millionaire Mind.

[Graham Stephan]

Maybe I don't. Something about the millionaire mindset. Or maybe it was the millionaire next door. And I must have been, like, 10, 11, 12 years old, and I just saw the book that's a millionaire on the side of it. I'm like, I'm gonna read this book. And I was not a reader at all. Like, I was not reading books, but for some reason, I just read that book and I enjoyed it. And it's just like, all these things made sense. Like, oh, the average millionaire drives a Ford F150, and it's more common to drive a Toyota Corolla than it is a Ferrari. And most millionaires don't make a million dollars a year. They're making an average income, and they save for 30 years. And so all of those things, like, I just had an interest in that.

[Interviewer]

What was the year you made your first million Dollars or in sales like that came in. What was the year that happened? Do you remember the year?

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, that would have been 2019. And that was a combination of real estate sales and then YouTube adding on top of that. Right.

[Interviewer]

And the year before, where was it at? Like, was it half as much? Was it close to that?

[Graham Stephan]

Was it the year before? I think I made $250,000 from YouTube and then I think 500 grand from real estate.

[Interviewer]

About 750 grand the year before.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, probably about that.

[Interviewer]

What do you think was the difference between what you did or how you thought from 2018 to 2019?

[Graham Stephan]

I would say I had never. For me, it was really YouTube. But that really started 2017 for me because I never thought that I'd make money on YouTube at all. Like, I started making videos just because it's like, it seemed like the fun thing to do. And even I remember making a dollar a Day on YouTube through ad revenue and just thinking, wow, this is like a free sushi dinner that I could. Because I was going to do YouTube anyway. So it's like the fact that it's making $30 a month, it's like, that's sushi once a week, Once a month for free. And I remember it being like $100 a month and being like, wow, that's my cell phone bill. And then $300 a month. That's my car insurance and gas. Like, this is so cool. And it just, I guess seeing that I could make money without having to be, like, actively involved, even though, like, I became very involved. But with real estate, I was in sales. And so the bulk of my income at that time was really like, I gotta be there, I gotta show houses. If I don't sell a house, I don't get paid. I could work and earn nothing. And a lot of my commission is dependent on my ability to get listings, meet clients, be there for those clients. And I would drop anything for them at any time. If there's a client who wanted to see a house Friday at 10pm, I would cancel any. I'd be there because that's what I had to do. But seeing on YouTube that I could work around my own schedule, post videos, and like, every video I was like, wow. If every video I make just makes an average of a dollar a day, I get a thousand videos and that's a thousand dollars a day and I could be anywhere in the world. And so something like that was very freeing to me, that I knew that I could scale it away, that I couldn't do as A real estate agent. Even the best agents I've seen, like we're talking about like the top few in the country are making two to six million dollars a year and they have like huge teams and they've been in the business for 20 years. And I started seeing people on YouTube be like, they're doing this in, you know, a few months and scaling to that point. The reach that I was able to get on YouTube and the benefits that I saw of just like being able to network and meet other people. I could meet a thousand people by making one video in the time it would take me like years in real estate to like one on 1,000 people, one on one. And that really changed my mind in terms of just seeing what was possible.

[Interviewer]

So 2018, if I remember what you said, about a half a million came in from real estate, is that right?

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, yeah. And then of course on top of that though, you have like broker splits

[Interviewer]

much miscellaneous in terms of like sales coming in. You got expenses and everything obviously. But that's like how many homes is that for? A half a million dollars in commissions wasn't much? Well, in LA, I guess.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, yeah, five, 10 homes.

[Interviewer]

What is that?

[Graham Stephan]

Probably about that. I would say in a year I would have maybe 20. And I like years. This is like five years, like six years ago. I don't know how many years ago this was. I would say on average I probably had about 25 transactions a year. A lot of those would be high end leases and of those sales rentals. Yeah, and then sales would be, I don't know, 5 to 10. But some, usually it would be like I'd have a whole bunch of one and a half to $3 million homes and then I'd have like one a year that was like 5 million or like 8 million and that would boost the bar a lot. Or sometimes I'd get really good lease commissions. There would be some properties for lease that would make more commission than the sales. Just because, let's say it's $30,000 a month and I'm representing both sides and we get like an 8% commission on top of that for a two year lease. That's pretty big.

[Interviewer]

Monthly, you get a commission monthly?

[Graham Stephan]

No, I get one. Check. Sometimes they'll say, well you know, we'll pay you for the first year and then we'll pay, which is fine. But now a lot of them would just pay up front.

[Interviewer]

That's amazing. What would you say the top three physical investments that you've made that have paid the best dividends over the last five to 10 years.

[Graham Stephan]

Probably a good computer, a faster. I was like, on this little mini MacBook for a while that would pause for minutes, and I didn't want to spend money. I finally got a new MacBook at the time, and it helped my video processing a ton. That has probably been one of the best investments. Probably a good camera for YouTube videos. Besides that, though, I would say real estate has been. Has been a fantastic one. That's always been like, the core of everything I do is like, that's the foundation, is like good real estate rental properties. And that's like the foundation, I guess, to fall back on, if that makes sense.

[Interviewer]

How much real estate do you have now?

[Graham Stephan]

It is tracking. I think it's six properties total. One is my primary in Vegas, but

[Interviewer]

then six, Five rental properties.

[Graham Stephan]

Yep.

[Interviewer]

And then the rest is mostly index funds at the moment, or.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, index funds and cash. I pretty much almost got a 30, 30, 30 split between real estate, cash, index funds.

[Interviewer]

Really. When did you feel like you were able to break through mentally and emotionally? Of. You see these bigger homes, you see individuals who have made it essentially in a certain way financially. When did you start to realize, hey, maybe I could break through this financial level as well and get to certain level? Was that when you were 18, getting started, or was it more in your mid-20s?

[Graham Stephan]

I'd say immediate, like just. Yeah, immediately. Just, like, seeing and being around these people. I just felt like I could do that too.

[Interviewer]

At 18? 19.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

Wow.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Graham Stephan]

Even though I didn't achieve that immediately, it's just. I guess it was a feeling like I felt like I dressed the part too. Like, I'd see how they dress, and I go to H and M and like, try to replicate their style for, like, 50 bucks. And so just doing that. A big change for me, too, came when I sold my first house. And I do what I tell everyone not to do. I spent pretty much all of it on a car. And I think my commission, like, after everything, like, 50 grand, something like that. Like after I.

[Interviewer]

50 grand?

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, like, after all, asset commission. Yeah. First house.

[Interviewer]

That's huge.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah. $3.6 million.

[Interviewer]

How old were you?

[Graham Stephan]

I had just turned 19 or I was just turning 19.

[Interviewer]

That was a massive commission.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, it was. And that buyer I met doing an open house. I had done an open house every single Sunday for nine months. And then just a buyer happened to walk in. We had a great conversation. He was a doctor and straight up just gave me a chance. Like, that was one of those things where he was Like, I remember when I was 18 and someone gave me a chance and I wanted to do the same for you.

[Interviewer]

That's cool.

[Graham Stephan]

I want you to help us find a house. And I did so much to him, but I spent all that money buying a Lotus Elise. And the car, I think was like 30 grand plus taxes and stuff like that. And you also have to pay tax on the commission. So I was left over, like, nothing afterwards. But that car. I started taking it every weekend to these car meets, like early in the morning, like early Sunday, wake up at like 6am, go to a car meet and meet, like car friends there. Like people driving, like Ferraris on Lambos. And here I got in for the cost of a new Honda Accord. And so, like, being around those people, like, getting into those groups, and I loved it. It was just like, fun. Like, I take the car and go to car meets and then right afterwards I'd go into an open house, I park the car out in front, and people commenting it helped.

[Interviewer]

So what sounds like you said what you tell people not to do is

[Graham Stephan]

actually a great investment in hindsight. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Right. It was a bad investment, but it was a great investment.

[Graham Stephan]

Could have gone the other way too, I think, had I been reckless with it or maybe not used it. Like, if I was, oh, I'm going to go pick up chicks in the car now. Not worked, but I just used it as like a passion and a networking tool at the same time.

[Interviewer]

What's the best invisible asset that you've invested in for yourself?

[Graham Stephan]

Oh, man.

[Interviewer]

That continues to pay dividends today.

[Graham Stephan]

What do you mean, invisible asset?

[Interviewer]

Like, not a. Not a physical thing, but more of a skill set, a learning something you've developed a relationship that you've invested in. Something invisible that is not a tangible,

[Graham Stephan]

I would say just like. I would say just great people and mentors around me. Jason Oppenheim, I say this all the time. Has been like, one of the best parts of, like, just learning, I guess, not how to be more assertive, but, like being able to convey what you want and being able to basically give it, give a direction in a way that people will understand. And seeing him operate on such a high level, just watching him, like I just go into the office and just listen to him speak and see how he negotiates and like, those sort of connections and just being able to learn from those people has been invaluable.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, that's beautiful, man.

[Podcast Host]

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[Interviewer]

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[Podcast Host]

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[Interviewer]

What's your plan with this year? With the recession potentially going to happen? You're talking a lot about this on your channel. What's your plan to do with the cash? What do you plan to do with it over the next six to 12 months? If everything crashes, if real estate crashes, if the stock market crashes, what will you do?

[Graham Stephan]

Well, I'm buying in dollar cost Averaging into the index funds every day. So every day the market's open, I just. It's a habit of mine to wake up every morning and buy the same dollar amount every single day.

[Interviewer]

How much is that? Every month? Every day?

[Graham Stephan]

Five grand.

[Interviewer]

Five grand a day, Right in there.

[Graham Stephan]

Always. Index funds. It's just like my morning routine is just like index funds. Anything above that, obviously taxes can take that into consideration, goes into the cash pile. And in a perfect world, I want a really good commercial property that's triple net, ideally in Las Vegas, but I believe we have a ways to go on that, because right now I have that money parked in Treasuries and It's earning about 4.4%, maybe 4.5, 4.3.

[Interviewer]

Not bad. Yeah.

[Graham Stephan]

And I just keep rolling it over. That's not bad. So if I'm making 4.4%, but I'm looking at commercial properties making 4.5% to 5%, I don't see the risk premium there yet. So I think if I could find something at seven, seven and a half percent to me, that gives enough of a buffer where, like, if the market continues going down, I've locked that in, but I've yet to see those deals come up yet. So I'm looking, I look every day, and I think it'll get to a point where I could start making offers. But some of the properties that come up, they're great, but I don't want to be like, their first week on the market. Here's an offer for 30% less. It's like, I'm not going to shoot myself in the foot. It's offensive to them. But if it's been listed for six months, four months, whatever, then I'd consider making an offer.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, I know you get asked this question a lot, but if someone had between 20,000 in cash or 100,000 in cash, and I know you're not a financial advisor, what would you be suggesting as options for them to do? To invest it as opposed to holding onto it in the bank and they wanted to invest it somewhere, what would you suggest? Between 20 and $100,000 of extra cash laying around that they want to invest in somewhere to make an interest.

[Graham Stephan]

The biggest thing that's made a difference for me is house hacking. One of the best things that I've done is like buy the duplex. I moved in one side, I rented out the other. I think a lot of people, not every area has a duplex that you could go and buy. But I found that if you could reduce Your housing, because housing makes up 25 to 35% of your income, just a third of it is gone just for a place to live. But if you could find a way to reduce that by using that down payment, leveraging that for, you know, a duplex or a triplex or anything where you could rent out the other units, ideally it'll cover your overhead. But even if it covers half, like, to be able to save an extra 20% of your income by building up equity in a property that you could rent out, I think that's tremendous. But you also have to be okay with being a landlord, putting in the time to, like, managing a property. You also have to be careful about what you buy, that it's a good deal. It's like, just because it's a duplex doesn't mean it's worth buying. So if you're willing to put in the work, I think that could probably yield the highest results.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. What's your thoughts about owning a home in general? I know there's different real estate experts that talk about, you know, only rent where you live and own the thing that you rent out. So it brings you in passive income. What's your thoughts? You own your home, you live there. Do you think people should buy a home or should they rent and use their down payment as an investment to bring in cash somewhere else?

[Graham Stephan]

I think it really depends on the area. Places like Los Angeles generally are cheaper to rent. The difference becomes, if you plan to live in the house for like, 15, 20 years and you know, it's a place that you're going to be raising a family or for the peace of mind of being able to, like, not worry about rent increases. But, like, Los Angeles is an area, it's kind of a bubble. Yeah, yeah. Where renting is so much cheaper. The majority of the city is rent control. Your rent's going up usually 3 to 5% a year at the very most. It's cheaper. You'll save more money.

[Interviewer]

I mean, it's more expensive right here than it is anywhere in the country, really. Yeah, true.

[Graham Stephan]

A lot of other places it's cheaper

[Interviewer]

to rent versus owning here.

[Graham Stephan]

Correct.

[Interviewer]

So expensive.

[Graham Stephan]

I would say generally, if you plan to live in the house for seven to 10 years, it's usually cheaper to own. But you have to factor in also, you know, your closing costs, commissions, maintenance.

[Interviewer]

Now, in la, there's a. There was a whole, like, mansion tax coming out. Did you see this in April?

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, I saw that.

[Podcast Host]

Trying April.

[Interviewer]

5% if you sell that.

[Graham Stephan]

I don't think that passed. Did it? I hope.

[Interviewer]

Pretty sure. In April, if your house is over 5 million.

[Graham Stephan]

I don't. I don't think that's.

[Interviewer]

I think it did.

[Graham Stephan]

It passed. I have not kept up.

[Interviewer]

I think you're in Vegas now. I think it did. So it's like if you had a $5 million home. Five percent again, the mansion tax on top of stupid.

[Graham Stephan]

My issue with California is that their solution to everything is tax. Let's not fix everything that's broken here. We just need more money. But they make so much money to begin with. Where does it go? Where does it go? So their thing is just, let's tax the rich people, let's drive everyone out of state, but then let's tax the people who stayed even more. It makes no sense to me. I think, you know, California is such an amazing state with so much to offer. Incredible.

[Interviewer]

Why did you move? You grew up here?

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You know, grew up in Cali and la. Why go to Vegas when the weather is perfect here? 90% of the time you've got the ocean, you got the mountains, you've got industries here. Why move away?

[Graham Stephan]

I think the quality of life deteriorated to a point where it was better somewhere else. And I never thought I would leave. But what really kept me here was doing real estate. And like up until 2020, I was going to the office every single day to the Oppenheim Group. And I would do real estate on the set. Like I was like 85% YouTube at that point. But if a client came around like I was and they were looking for a four million dollar house, like, I'm going to help them find a house. Anyone else? I had, you know, a cool little referral business within the office of, like, I'll give that to so and so, and I'll give that to this. And it worked really well. And I'd be involved in the phone like throughout the process, but they would do a lot of the stuff and it worked really well. But when Covid happened and I was just like home making videos, I realized how much I loved just like being able to make videos and like do that. I just had so much fun doing that. Then I realized you don't have to be in Los Angeles to do that. Just checked out Vegas, realized how nice it is in some of these areas of like Henderson and Summerlin. Really liked it. I'm inside anyway, like, you're talking about like going to the beach and the mountains.

[Interviewer]

You don't do that.

[Graham Stephan]

How many people in LA really go to the beach? No one Goes to the beach. Like, sure, you go to the mountains every now and then I'm inside anyway,

[Interviewer]

so like, might as well save on property tax. Might as well save on all these things.

[Graham Stephan]

Like the quality of life there was so much better. The house was way less expensive, way bigger, twice the square footage. I was able to have a larger off. My office in Vegas was like 4 times the size of my office in LA. Was able to also have a podcast studio in my house. At the time, Jack was living with me. He had a bedroom there. So like I would say half the house was an office. And that was like an entirely separate part of everything. Like, you know, walking. You have the kitchen, everything. And then this left side was office. It was like Jack's room. He was editing, he was doing the podcast. Like it was perfect setup. But then also it's like, there's no potholes in the road, there's no traffic. Everyone is really friendly. It's a really great community. I know all the neighbors and like in Los Angeles you might know the people on either side of you. And that's was so like closed off. Vegas was like a very friendly environment.

[Interviewer]

Perfect for you. Yeah.

[Graham Stephan]

So immediately I knew, like, this is the right choice. And I, I would say every now and then I do miss the weather. The weather here is obviously better.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Graham Stephan]

But I don't mind the heat.

[Interviewer]

You're inside all the time anyway.

[Graham Stephan]

I would say the biggest difference though, I like the people here. I feel like here you get a wide range of people, perspectives, ideas. It's like this, this melting pot of different cultures that you don't get as much in Vegas. And I miss this sort of like free spirit entrepreneur. There's something different here than you get in Vegas. And sometimes I feel in Vegas you get in your own little world. It's just like just doing one thing. And I come back here and like get to meet and see other people who are doing like much bigger things. And it's inspirational for me to see.

[Interviewer]

Maybe moving back out in the next year or two. No, just come out more.

[Graham Stephan]

But I could come back for work. Yeah. And I could, you know, come back here for a few days and then jet right back home.

[Interviewer]

That's cool.

[Graham Stephan]

I'm happy with that.

[Interviewer]

That's good, man. I'm curious about what is the psychology that happens for you when money comes in your bank account, when you get a check, which I don't know if you get checks anymore, but when money enters the bank account and you get paid on the 20th or 21st YouTube money. Every month, or whatever it is, sponsors come in. When it enters and you see it come through, is there an emotional connection you have to that dollar amount?

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Or is it neutral? Is it. Is it.

[Graham Stephan]

No.

[Interviewer]

Is it exciting? Is it fun? Is it scary? What is the feelings that you have?

[Graham Stephan]

So immediately, because it's really hard to separate what I have in my bank account versus what I'll have left over after tax. So whatever money is in there, I just mentally will do. And I, you know, do quarterly taxes. But like, anything that comes in, I just multiply that by 0.6, and I just assume 40% is going to be gone for taxes, accounting, miscellaneous fees, just random stuff. Just average 0.6%. And then I take what's left over of that, and then I multiply that by 4%, and that to me, is how much that money will last for the rest of my life. And so I do that with everything. So for every $100, I get, I have 60 cents left. Or, sorry, 60 cents. For every $100, I have $60 left, 0.4. I think that works out to be like $2.80 or whatever it works out to be. That's my passive income. And, like, that's. I'll never go below that. And so that's what I invest. Everything. I mean, my actual personal expenses and cost of living is very low. Like, everything I do is either for the business, discretionary, personal is like almost nothing. So it's just like everything gets invested for the most part that's left over from that.

[Interviewer]

And how do you. How does it. How does it feel, though, when you're analyzing this? You see the dollar amount come in. You multiply, you do all these things. Does it excite you? Do you feel abundant? Do you feel like, okay, everything's on the right track? Do you feel scarce ever?

[Podcast Host]

I'm sure.

[Graham Stephan]

I'm sure. I definitely. Everyone tells me I've got, like, a scarcity mindset because I'm so much like, when I get something, I don't want to lose it. But I've also been very conservative in terms of, like, building wealth, saving money, in terms of, like, investment returns, like, everything. I'm like, if I just can average 4%, like, I'm fine. Or even 3, usually 3%. But no, for me, I just think, like, I've always increased my lifestyle based on really the 3% rule of, like, I could spend 3% of what I have invested every single year, regardless of how much it makes. 3%. What can I buy with that? And Then even of that, I'm like, okay, well, I still want to save half. So it's like, really the one and a half percent rule. But it gives me something to look forward to that I know it's sustainable, like, whatever I want to do. As long as I stick with that, I can get new experiences, I can work my way up to something else in a way that I don't have to worry about it running out and feel safer that way.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Graham Stephan]

Because at least what I've seen from real estate, so many people just, like, blow all of their money. I remember this one person who was well known and was making five to $10 million a year, and they were having difficulty qualifying for a house making five, $10 million a year because they spent it all. Now, their view, I'm sure, was, I'm just gonna keep making money, like it's not an issue. And they've gone on to have a successful career, make a lot of money. But for me, I could never be at a point where, like, I'm spending that much. And, like, that's the threshold. Like, you have to. Because you never want to go down. I think it's really hard to scale back. It's very easy to scale up. So I've always made sure to, like, be very careful of once you get used to something, like, it's hard to go down, and it's very easy to go up, and you don't want to set the bar too high, just in case.

[Podcast Host]

So.

[Graham Stephan]

I've always been really cautious about what I do and just knowing that lifestyle inflation is a thing, and how could I curb that in such a way that is sustainable but still gives me something to look forward to.

[Interviewer]

How often do you make emotional purchases?

[Graham Stephan]

Almost never. I don't think there's any purchase that I make that's emotional. Really? No. I mean, the only thing that I bought without money in mind was my aquarium. That was the only thing that I did not. Yeah, I didn't look at the price tag. I don't care about how much it costs, and I'm not getting any return on my money. That was the only thing. But I built that into, like, what I have invested. I'm like, okay, if I have X amount invested, that'll pay for the aquarium, and X amount invested, in addition to that will pay for all the maintenance, all that stuff. So I just, like, factored it in that and worked towards that being a goal.

[Podcast Host]

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[Interviewer]

What were the three biggest lessons that doing real estate sales taught you about life and business in general?

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, I would say not giving up because with, with sales it's like you, you, you have to stay on it. And learning how to differentiate between like read people I guess is a big one because I got four fold so often like as a young agent you don't realize how many fakes there are out there. Like people who will just waste your time and pretend to be buyers. I had this dude and I was so naive and looking back, I was an idiot. He walked into the open house and told me that he was in the market for like 25 to $50 million homes. The guy wasn't like, you know, representing himself in such a way where he could afford these houses and nor would a guy of that caliber realistically trust an 8, 18 year old kid who's like brand new to show. Yeah, show me 50. Like chances are they have business managers, they don't even show up to the houses first. They have assistants do it first and then they have people vet it. And then they show up and they're very discreet. This guy was very flashy about, like, oh, yeah, I did this and my company does that. Like, they're talking about, I had no idea. So I'm sitting there showing him houses, and every agent is looking at me like, is this guy pre qualified? Blah, blah, blah. And I'm like, oh, yeah, he's good. Idiot. And I remember one agent, I would consider her not a mentor, but she really took me under her wing. And she had a listing, and she's like, bring him to my listing and I'll feel him out for you. And she was there anyway. And so he came there and she started asking him questions about his proof of funds. He literally goes into his car in his trunk and pulls out papers and hands it to her. And she's like, this is proof of funds. It was like a word document the guy just printed out saying like, X amount company blank, this, this. And afterwards she said like, this guy is fake. He's not real. He's not a real buyer. And then.

[Interviewer]

But you'd already spent 20 listings showing him 20 listings. Yeah, I was an idiot.

[Graham Stephan]

But then you also ruin your name in the process of. Like, any time you bring a buyer by these agents, remember that they know, oh, this is Graham. He's the kid who brought by this like, really bad buyer. He wasted my time. I spent an hour setting up this house. And like, their time is valuable. My time. I got nothing to lose. And this guy, meanwhile, was just. I think he was just dreaming and he was using it as inspiration. And he would spend like two hours at the house just like laying back.

[Interviewer]

Oh my gosh, I was an idiot. Oh, man. Okay, so learning to read, people never giving up, being consistent. Yeah, but you can't. But you can't never give up unless you know how to read the right person, know what the really intentions are. What's another big lesson you think you learned from real estate?

[Graham Stephan]

I loved it. I don't know, there was something about it where I just felt I could do this 24 7. And it never felt like work. It's just like what I enjoyed doing. Like, I got so excited every day to wake up. Like, you know the feeling. Sometimes we had just like a really good day and you can't go to sleep or like so excited. Yeah, yeah. Or like maybe like a Christmas morning where you can't wait to wake up. Like, you know, you're going to Disneyland or something like that. That's how I felt going into work. I just enjoy it. Like, I would wake up early and, like, be excited every day to be able to go and do real estate and, like, learn and be around these houses. Because for me, it was so foreign to, like, walk into a $5 million house, get to be around people who could afford that. And, like, everyone I saw, like, what can I learn from this person? I just found it really inspiring.

[Interviewer]

That's cool.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, it really opened up my mind in terms of, like, what's possible. And so I really believe that, like, having access to Los Angeles just gave me that worldview of, like, it's insane. The possibilities that are out there.

[Interviewer]

Yes.

[Graham Stephan]

And just believing that, hey, if these guys could do it, why can't I? And you would see that they're nothing special. It's just, like. Just they've got good at a skill, and you don't need to be, like, this superhuman person.

[Interviewer]

I'm curious about your thoughts on money and relationships. How has been living an extreme, frugal financial lifestyle supported or hurt you in intimate relationship with your girlfriend?

[Graham Stephan]

I don't think it's ever hurt.

[Interviewer]

It's never hurt.

[Graham Stephan]

I don't think it's ever hurt. Even, like, just dating in general, I think there are cheaper ways to do everything. And people that know me in general, like, they kind of would know what they're getting into.

[Interviewer]

Right, right. They're not expecting you to do something.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, it shouldn't be a surprise. But, like, I would say a lot of the things that you would do, like in real estate, they're either free or they're very inexpensive. Like, I think it's more important to spend quality time with the other person versus, like, hey, we're gonna go to, like, this fancy restaurant. I think there's a time and a place for that, for sure. But I think at least for the first, like, the dating period, it doesn't have to be expensive at all. And with Macy, it's been. It's been really nice because she's. I don't want to say she's as frugal as I. She's okay with spending money on certain things. If she feels like the value's there versus I'm always like, the cost. Like, oh, but the value might not be there for this. We could get 80% of it. You know, I want to say with her, I've definitely loosened up because I could afford it. But a lot of the things still, it's like she enjoys contributing. I appreciate that. I think some of our trips, it's like, you know, she's got credit card points. She's like, I opened up these credit cards. I got the sign up. I was like, it's a free trip, you know, So a lot of things like this, they don't have to cost money. But I will say I have loosened up, really, with Macy. Just in the sense that I don't fret over, like, $60 dinner anymore. Like, five years ago, I was doing that $50 dinner and be like, well, we could do that for cheaper over here. I'm gonna eat a little bit at home, and I'm gonna go there, get one. Like, bad. It's really bad.

[Interviewer]

Do you wish you would have changed that? If you could go back, would you have done it differently, have more balance?

[Graham Stephan]

Probably not. I mean, I'm sure there are things going back where I'm like, yeah, I should have done that. It was stupid. Like, one time. I know I'm gonna get hate for this, but there was a car meet and I had budgeted it. And again, like, it's different if you're making like, 20 grand a year. I was probably making 100 grand a year, and I had budgeted that day only for gas. I didn't have enough for the food. And they're all driving through Malibu and they're going to like this. This fancy place for lunch. I got a Subway instead. And, you know, I sat down at the table and I asked to serve really nicely because it was like a row of, like, 20 people. Like, can I eat my Subway here?

[Interviewer]

Oh, my God.

[Graham Stephan]

And they were totally cool with it. And I figured the tip that I'd leave them is way less than what I would have spent on this meal that I didn't need. I wanted a Subway. I didn't want to spend $50. So I just left the tip instead and I ate my Subway. They were totally fine with it. I forget what it was a restaurant in Malibu, but there are 20 people at the table. I don't know how big the bill would be, but, you know, anyway, like, that's the stuff that I. You know, in hindsight, it was cringy to do. Oh. The other thing I would do all the time is if I were out with friends and there's extra food, they weren't taking it home. I would be the one be like,

[Interviewer]

you would take it home?

[Graham Stephan]

Everything.

[Interviewer]

Box it up, everything.

[Graham Stephan]

But I would go, man, whole meal out of that.

[Interviewer]

That's great.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, A whole meal.

[Interviewer]

I need to take more stuff home. Yes, that's what I need to do.

[Graham Stephan]

Oh, yeah.

[Interviewer]

Nothing wasteful.

[Graham Stephan]

Nothing would ever go to waste. Even would we go out with the Oppenheim group. It was usually the six of us.

[Interviewer]

Oh, they had lots of good food then.

[Graham Stephan]

And Jason was the type, order everything

[Interviewer]

and then you take.

[Podcast Host]

You got a meal for a week.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah. But because he likes to be like, I'm gonna have a few bites of this, a few bites of that, a few bites of this. And then there'd be like half a meal there. And he would just say, oh, I'm gonna get. I'm gonna take it all home and that. Like, I'd put it in the fridge and I'd live off that for days. So that's. That's a lot. Like when I made one of my how much I spend in a week videos. I think my grocery bill is like a hundred and something dollars a month for food.

[Interviewer]

I don't know how you like that.

[Graham Stephan]

But now a lot of that was subsidized by like eating really good food, but taking it all home and then divvying it up throughout. Like, it's like a meal prep, but it's food that would have gone to waste. Yeah. Yeah.

[Interviewer]

I'm curious, what do you think of the biggest money myths that keep a lot of people broke?

[Graham Stephan]

Oh, money myths that keep people broke. I don't know. I always feel like you could die tomorrow is a common thing that I would hear a lot of people say. Like, I'd rather just live now than. My perspective is that you can always live tomorrow too. Like, your chances of living tomorrow knock on this much higher than passing away.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Graham Stephan]

So I think plan for tomorrow is a probably better approach. Statistically. I feel like you can live just as easily, like in your 30s and early 40s as you can. I'm sure the experiences in 20s are different. Looking back, I still feel like mentally, I feel like 23 to 25. I don't think I've grown up since then. Mentally, I still feel the same age, except I need more sleep now. But I feel like now, like I've done so much saving throughout my 20s that now I can finally, like, loosen up to a certain extent.

[Interviewer]

Buy an extra piece of sushi. It's one piece.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah. And I still look at prices. Like we went out to sushi the other day. I saw a $28 roll and a $15 roll. And I'm like, the $15. I get two of those versus one of those. I'd rather the two. So I get the two.

[Interviewer]

So if you had to go back and just imagine your 18 year old self. How old are you now?

[Graham Stephan]

32.

[Interviewer]

32. So imagine 14 years ago, and imagine that you, in a hypothetical world, you had to become a millionaire, and half the time. So you had to hit your first million in revenue and sales coming in in half the time, from 18 to that time.

[Graham Stephan]

Right.

[Interviewer]

As opposed to when you were. I don't know, how old you were.

[Graham Stephan]

I was 26.

[Interviewer]

26. You had to do it at 22, 23. Right. Let's just say hypothetical scenario. You had to. What would you have done differently in order to get there? Would it even be possible?

[Graham Stephan]

It would have. It would have been YouTube for me. Yeah. Because every day after real estate, I wouldn't watch TV, watch YouTube. Like, that was my version of TV. This is like 2008. And early YouTube, very early YouTube. But that was like I was. Would come home and just watch YouTube videos. Like, that was what I enjoyed doing. And I noticed back then that there was no business or entrepreneur content on there. And what really solidified it for me was Rob D. He's a car channel, posted a video about how he was able to buy a lamborghini Diablo, a 2001. And he made a video in his garage, like, way before, like the Tai Lopez stuff, like way before. But he made a really inspirational video about how what he did for a living to afford a Lamborghini Diablo and was so honest about it. And there was a guy before him, his name was Robert Hilmner or Himmler. I don't know his name. I can't remember his last name, how it's pronounced. He drove a green Lamborghini and was selling a program or a course or something about like how to get rich or something like that. There was some speculation that it was like family money or something like that. But he, I believe, owned like a car customization shop or something like that. So Rob Dahn made this video basically saying, I'm gonna just tell you what I know for free. I have nothing to sell you. And this is my story. And he posted it. I was so inspired by that. That for me is like, I want to do that. And what really hit it off for me was that I sent him a message on Instagram. He maybe only had a few thousand subscribers at the time, or sorry, not Instagram, Facebook sent him a message. And I'm like, hey, I love your content. And I could pull it up here if you want to see it. But my original message back then was like, there's a huge market on YouTube for this type of content. If you double down on this. It could be huge.

[Interviewer]

Really?

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah. I bet I could pull it up.

[Interviewer]

So this was a video he put on YouTube?

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

You messaged him on Facebook. He was just doing a couple videos. He wasn't doing it consistently correct.

[Graham Stephan]

Hey, Rob. Message from a fan and fellow car enthusiast. I've been watching your videos from before you had 10,000 subscribers and love your videos. I'm so happy how far you've come. You'll be hitting 100,000 subscribers subscribers shortly. You've definitely been a great inspiration. I have two questions for you, if you have the time. And then I asked, like, what camera mics you use. And then what did you find? Give your biggest break? Was it uploading content regularly? Was it car videos? Was it inspirational? And then I said, just a comment. I believe you could have a great career in motivational speaking. In business, there's a big market for young people who don't relate to Tony Robbins and who have never heard of Napoleon Hill before. Just food for thought. This would be a big opportunity. And then he responded back. He gave his answers and said, I want to be a motivational speaker without actually being a motivational speaker. Ha ha. And then I said, you know, I think you could take these videos very far in that direction. But that was more than 10 years ago. But I wanted to do that, but I didn't have the courage to do it.

[Interviewer]

Why didn't you have the courage?

[Graham Stephan]

I didn't have a Lambo. I know how stupid it sounds, but I felt like, who would listen to me? What did I have to, like, Rob had a business and a Lamborghini.

[Interviewer]

He was credible.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah. What did I have? You know, looking back, it's stupid because I could have, like, I felt I needed either a million dollars, a Lamborghini, like something, a show of success, because back then, that's what you had to do. On YouTube, it was like Lamborghinis just got clicks. And, you know, me starting my career in real estate with, you know, 150 grand in savings or, like, still a lot, like, looking back, could have said, like, how to make 100 grand, but like, 20 something. I didn't have the courage. I felt like I would embarrass myself. But had I started back then, I would have been so early. And it was just a feeling like I wanted to do that, but I just didn't put it off for years.

[Interviewer]

So this is something. I'm really excited you're talking about this because I think a lot of people don't have the courage to do the thing they really want to do because they don't feel credible or ready to do it. So what would you say to people who are like, well, I don't have the money. I don't have the credibility yet. I'm just getting started in this thing and I want to start talking about it or creating content or doing whatever, writing a book about it, but who's going to listen to me? What would you say to those people?

[Graham Stephan]

You just got to do it. It got to a point for me where I guess the intuition of, like, I want to be doing this. Why am I not started getting to a point where I just felt, if I don't do it now, I'm never going to do it. And then I thought to myself, would I look back in the future and regret not doing this? And I thought, yes. And so I just. I secretly made a YouTube channel and filmed a video during an open house. And I'd like just with my iPhone, one taked it and, well, I did multiple takes trying to get ready for it because people would walk in the house. I'd like, put my camera down. But I just posted one video and I was like, I'm just gonna post it up, see what happens. And I had no idea what I was doing. But I learned, like, as I was doing it, you know, I had the window right here. So I had like realized if I shoot against the window, like, I look too, like, you know, dark. And if I go here, lighting's better. Like, minor things. Then I looked on YouTube, like how to edit a YouTube video on YouTube. Learned iMovie through there, like how to edit a good thumbnail. I could just see what's working. And like, Derral eves was a big one for me. Like learning about, like, SEO and stuff like that. Like how to rank Michael back then was just to rank on the first page for different key search results. So, like, I wanted to rank first page for passive income, how to be a millionaire real estate. The first one I ranked was 2008. It's so niche. 2008 Lotus Exige S240 and there are like 20 videos on there with like 20,000 plus views. And I was like, I want to be on the first page. So I made My video Lotus Exige S240 review, you know, 2000. Like something like that. And I slowly watched just climb and I shared it online. And like, that didn't help, but like, over time, it just kept doing better.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Graham Stephan]

So I just. You just gotta start.

[Interviewer]

Do you feel like you have a scarcity mindset or an abundance mindset?

[Graham Stephan]

I don't know, probably a degree of both. I would say I don't like. I don't like loss. Some really like risk adverse when it comes to stuff like, like, like I'm okay losing a certain percentage because it's like okay if you have a hundred dollars, if you lose a penny, it's not that big of a deal. So it's like things like that in terms of a percentage don't faze me. But just in general I'm really against loss. Like whatever I get, I'm very conservative with it because I want to make it last. So in terms of that, I would say a scarcity mindset. There is some abundance though in terms of like bigger opportunities and pursuing, I would say passions. Not afraid to do that anymore. But yeah, financially I'm just very conservative.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Podcast Host]

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[Interviewer]

What do you. What's the investment you've made that had the biggest loss? Financial investment, like, like in an asset class.

[Graham Stephan]

Oh, and like, asset class, like stocks

[Interviewer]

or crypto or real estate. Did you ever lose a bunch of money that you're like, man, I put 100 grand.

[Graham Stephan]

Are we talking dollar amount or percent?

[Interviewer]

Dollar amount, yeah.

[Graham Stephan]

Very stupid. When I bought Robinhood stock, that was probably the worst loss.

[Interviewer]

Individual stock.

[Graham Stephan]

That was an individual stock I. I picked.

[Interviewer]

What'd you put in it?

[Graham Stephan]

Roughly 200 grand.

[Interviewer]

200 grand? How much you lose,

[Graham Stephan]

like, 60, 70% by the time I sold.

[Interviewer]

So 150 grand or something.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, that was. That was. That was stupid. It still was in the ratios of like, what is what was acceptable to me in terms of like a percentage. But it was stupid. I mean, it was just like, that was a gamble.

[Interviewer]

Was that an emotional.

[Graham Stephan]

It was when their stock dropped, like, they saw a substantial drop. And I'm like, people are still posting their screenshots on WallStreetBets. Robinhood has a lot of cash. They're not going anywhere. There's so many places to pay pivot, take a risk on this. And I think I put 100 grand in that. And then it dropped even more. I'm like, I'm gonna double down on

[Interviewer]

this because, oh, man.

[Graham Stephan]

Stupid. That was stupid. But again, like, in the big picture, we're talking about, you know, if the portfolio size is, let's say, 8 million bucks, like, we're talking about, like, you know, 200 grand total of that. So in a percentage, it's like, not that bad. But when you think of the dollar, I don't think of the dollar amount. Like, I throw up if you're like,

[Interviewer]

ugh, it's the worst.

[Graham Stephan]

That was just. That was a stupid one. Now I do have others that make up for it. Other side, I think Enphase at one point was up like 400 and something percent. The original Tesla I bought was up 2000%. So, like, I had winners on that.

[Interviewer]

That's big.

[Graham Stephan]

And I sold almost all my Tesla too, back in March at the highest, which was luck because I sold it to buy a Tesla Roadster. And then I just kept selling it afterwards because I was like, well, now I sold this, I may as well just reinvest it in the S and P. And I'm like, I'm still getting an equal exposure in The S and P, just putting it there and it's safer. And that was just luck. But I also had the opposite of that. I sold my original half a. My original half I think I sold in 2020 when it had increased threefold really quickly. Looking back, I mean that's still way cheaper than it is today. Oh well, you win some, you lose some. So that's why it's like individual stocks, such a tiny part of my portfolio. But looking back, it's a stupid. I would have been better off just putting all of it. But yeah, I mean you get it out of your system.

[Interviewer]

Yeah, of course. And a lot has happened the last couple of years with Crypto NFTs and now AI coming in a lot of around AI. What's your thoughts on Crypto NFTs AI in terms of building wealth for the future when it seems like there's been a lot of scams and all these different things and get rich quick schemes and people losing a lot of money. How can people use these tools or should they even consider them to build wealth in the future?

[Graham Stephan]

I never understood NFTs. That was the one thing that I really tried to like get into it. I wanted to buy a cryptopunk, but I just didn't. I thought it was kind of neat to have like kind of the original, but cryptokitties was like the original one. I never really understood. I never got into NFTs crypto. I've had an on and off relationship with because I bought Bitcoin originally, 2017.

[Interviewer]

For how much?

[Graham Stephan]

16,5. 17. And I like day traded it because for me it's like everyone was talking about bitcoin and at the time it went from basically $1,000 from when I started making YouTube videos to 17. And so that whole rise, people are coming make a video about bitcoin. I just didn't get it. I'm like, I don't understand it. And I thought when I made that video, like I'm going to buy a bitcoin and see if I understand firsthand what it's about. And maybe like me buying into it, I could just feel firsthand what everyone else is feeling. That helps. Sometimes when I'm talking about something, it's hard to talk about something objectively without having been in it. And then once you're in it, you could kind of see, you put on the goggles and you see like, wow, this is what everyone else sees and experiences. This is why they feel this way. So I bought a bitcoin, but I was like, I Had so much fun trading it because it was like 24, 7. It's like you could be there at like. And I was just having so much fun, like two o' clock in the

[Interviewer]

morning, like checking it going up.

[Graham Stephan]

But I was making like these little twenty, thirty dollar like profits, like went up and I just sell and then I place a limit and then like buy and like do this, but I just like trade it. And then from there I just spread it amongst a whole bunch of like, you know, crap coins just for fun. But I just really focus just on bitcoin, really.

[Interviewer]

So where do you feel like AI is going to be coming now for building wealth? Do you think anything's there around?

[Graham Stephan]

I think it's probably too early. I worry AI is going to become like the next hypey sort of thing. And I could see it going in that direction. I don't know how that'll come about, but I could totally see like a year or two from now, like AI becoming the next like crypto boom, NFT,

[Interviewer]

web 3.0 and all these things.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, something like that. I think like with crypto, I could see there being a huge future in that in terms of like the blockchain and like its use cases. I think I'm surprised they haven't created a digital dollar yet. Like, I think that's coming. I think it's going to get to the point where everyone like you get a Social Security number, you get a wallet.

[Interviewer]

I know.

[Graham Stephan]

And they know exactly how much goes into that wallet, how much goes out, where it goes. Like, imagine every dollar has like a, has a tracking device in it. And they could see like, wait a second, you received this dollar, you got paid from this person, but you paid it out to here. Why wasn't there a tax? Why didn't you claim it? Like, I think it's all going to get to that point in the future. There's going to be no privacy now. They can't get away with like without physical money at all for probably quite some time. It's always going to be legal tender. Like, imagine trying to scrounge up dollars from like you're not going to.

[Interviewer]

There's some restaurants that don't take physical currency in la. At least it's getting that way where it's only through the app. They just don't.

[Graham Stephan]

I think it's just going to. They're going to make it so convenient and they're going to build so many walls around using cash that people are going to go, I'm going to pay attention to it. So I think cryptocurrency is going to provide an option for them to do a digital dollar to track everything and they'll know if, like they'll try to curb anything and just track it. So I could see it going in that direction. So I think it's a ton of opportunity. I also think someone else had mentioned this. It makes sense to me, like verifying luxury goods, like if you want to buy, let's say Ferrari, you have something on the blockchain that says you are the owner. This is built by Ferrari. Here's all the details. Buy Louis Vuitton bag. And the replicas are getting so good. You want to verify it's that here's a little, you know, NFT thing that comes with it. You can scan it and like you are the, like this belongs to this, right? So I could see that.

[Interviewer]

That's interesting.

[Graham Stephan]

So that's where I think it's going. But I think we're just, you know, in that initial boom phase and it's going to develop and I think the potential is huge. And that's why I don't know if like Bitcoin Ethereum is going to be something that stands out like an Amazon of the dot com bubble or if it's going to be like a geocities where it's like nobody uses that. So I don't think we know quite yet. But I do think it's a ton of potential in that AI. I don't know, I'm not smart enough to understand. I don't know anything about it. So yeah, I think it's really cool. What I was saying in my video yesterday. I think it's going to get to a point where AI is going to be able to create any video you want. Like imagine you searching and getting a tutorial for anything you need and it's created in AI.

[Podcast Host]

It's a character.

[Graham Stephan]

Here's an example. But it's going to be so lifelike that you're not going to know this isn't a person making video. Imagine you're changing a car in a 2006 Toyota Prius. You type in YouTube how to change tire. 2006 Toyota Prius. You're going to get like videos of people who have made that. But it's not going to be, maybe not going to be a 2006, 2005, it's not going to be the same color. There's going to be like an intro, fluff, all that sort of stuff. But imagine if you type that in AI. Could create that video based on the blueprints of that car. How to change a tire. And it shows your exact car, a 2006 Toyota Prius. How to change the tire. Here's what you do. Here's where the tool is. Here's this. Here's what you do. And if you have a question. How do I get the lug nut on when it's too tight and it creates a video. How to get the lug nut off. That's too tight. But that's. Why can't it do that in the future? I think it can.

[Interviewer]

What's. I got a couple final questions for you. What's your money goals? If you could predict it's 20, 20, 37 years away.

[Graham Stephan]

Seven years.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Where will you. Where would you like to be in seven years with your money goals, with your investments, cash assets? You know, obviously there's so much that could happen in the next seven years. So many new developments that probably will happen that you're not even aware of. But if you could have a goal in mind in seven years, where would you like to be financially?

[Graham Stephan]

I mean, I feel like I'm already there. But like, it would be cool to be able to make a million a year in passive income. I think would be really cool. Just. Just from investments, I think would be a neat goal to have. I think it's doable.

[Interviewer]

What do you need to make a million dollars a year in passive. What is. How does the calculations work for you?

[Graham Stephan]

Probably about 25 million invested in relatively safe investments.

[Interviewer]

Real estate index funds.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, I'm talking net. So like net of all mortgage payments. Just like purely profit. A million a year.

[Interviewer]

You think you need 25 million in assets, maybe less.

[Graham Stephan]

If it's. If it's real estate, you could probably do that with like 15 to 20, depending on the property you buy and if it's triple net and how much work you're doing on that. So I think it's doable. Depends on the investment. Just depends on what's the opportunity at the time. But I like having a split between index funds and real estate because I feel like they're different enough where I'm not too concentrated.

[Interviewer]

Sure, sure, that's cool.

[Graham Stephan]

But that would be just a goal if I'm to say anything. A million a year, probably.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Graham Stephan]

Passive income.

[Interviewer]

That's pretty inspiring. You have a lot of sushi with that.

[Graham Stephan]

You could.

[Interviewer]

Yeah. Would you start spending more with that million in cash? Would you look at it? It's like, now I can spend on whatever. Or what would you think about then?

[Graham Stephan]

I have no idea. I'd probably get a bigger aquarium. Realistically though, I would say traveling first class, which could do with credit card points, but, like, being able to do that more frequently. Like, I do want to travel. I think that's a goal of mine to do one day. I really want to do van life at some point. Van life, I'm like, yeah, I really

[Interviewer]

want to get a nice van and go around the country.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah, I think take the podcast on the road. Do van life, I think. I think would be so fun. I'd like, visit all 50 states. I think would be really cool. Spend six months doing that. Travel, I think would be a lot of fun. Bigger aquarium. But for the most part, I think at this point, I just want to buy back my time and just be able to enjoy the things. The other day sounds stupid, but it was a weekday and I just wanted to read a book. I never wanted to read a book. I'm not a reader necessarily for books. I'll read anything online. If it's on Reddit, I'll read the whole thing. But I just felt like reading a book. But I was like, well, but I got so much work I need to do and, like, I'd rather. I'd feel better getting caught up and, like, ahead than I would reading the book. But I really wanted to read the book. So I think I'll probably lean more in the direction of, like, taking more time. Like, even doing a trip like this, Like, a year ago, I wouldn't have done it because I'm like, I'm so focused on. I just need to make videos and anything that distracts me from that. I don't think it was my happiest doing that because I, like, I just want to see stressed, like, you know, there's just. Just random things that I was not fully, like, in the moment for because my mind was constantly thinking, like, YouTube videos. What. What would be a good title for tomorrow's video? Like, be, like, people around having conversations, and I'd be there and I'd be present. But, like, there's like that 20% of my brain that's thinking, like, YouTube in the back. It's always there. I don't think it's going to go away, but I would like to scale back from that a little bit more in the moment.

[Interviewer]

We'll have to get you out here once every couple months, then for a couple days, you know?

[Graham Stephan]

I think so.

[Interviewer]

That's good, man.

[Graham Stephan]

Yeah.

[Interviewer]

Graham Stephan show on. On YouTube. You've got some Amazing content over there. I love it. You've got the podcast as well, which is really exciting. How can we. Iced coffee hour. It's called the podcast. You guys can see it both on YouTube. How can we be of best service for you? You got over 4 point something million subscribers subscribers now. What can we do to serve you?

[Graham Stephan]

I don't want anything. I would just say if, if you want to subscribe, that would be cool. Subscribe to your channel. I, I don't know, I just say just I subscribe to your channel. Like at this point, I'm, I'm fine. I would rather just, you know, guys, subscribe here on, on this channel would be, would be really nice.

[Interviewer]

Subscribe to both of our channels. Yes. This is one of the questions I ask. Everyone at the end is called the three truths question. So imagine another hypothetical scenario. It's your last day on earth. You live as long as you want to live and you accomplish everything. Your money, goals, life goals, they all happen. But for whatever reason, you've got to take all of your content with you. So no one has access to your information, your content, YouTube, whatever else you create, it goes to some other place when you die in the future.

[Graham Stephan]

So it just gets deleted.

[Interviewer]

It gets. Well, maybe it's just we don't have access to it. It's somewhere else.

[Podcast Host]

Hypothetical.

[Graham Stephan]

It's private.

[Podcast Host]

Yeah, it's private.

[Interviewer]

It's unlisted. But for whatever, whatever reason, you have the opportunity to share three final truths with the world. Three things that you know to be true that you would share as lessons to the world. And that's all we would have of your content left. What would be again, off the top of your head, those three truths for you?

[Graham Stephan]

I don't know. I don't know if there's like any absolute truths out there or just lessons

[Interviewer]

that you would want to share.

[Graham Stephan]

Three, I would say, gosh, like probably self belief, like believing you can do something is very important. I think people are drawn to confidence. And so if you could learn how to be your best self and accept that, I think that would go a long way. And I think the less concerned you are with what other people think, usually the better they think about you because you're not afraid to be yourself. I think everyone is scared to be themselves. And so when they see someone else, just like not caring, other people look up to that in a way that so many people can't do. So I would say, like, those things universally for me have been true.

[Interviewer]

That's cool, man. Final question for you before I ask it. I want to acknowledge you, Graham, for your commitment and dedication. It's been incredible what you've created over the last five years on YouTube. Every week you show up and give something inspiring, informational, and entertaining. And I know it takes you days of research and days of work, and you're doing a lot of it on your own. And you've helped a lot of people educate them, learn and learn about a

[Podcast Host]

scary subject for a lot of people,

[Interviewer]

which is money, in a fun way. So I really acknowledge you for how you keep showing up.

[Graham Stephan]

Thanks.

[Interviewer]

And I know it's a lot of work, and I know it's. You know, you probably have to figure out how to make it happen in the future at scale, but what you've created in the last four or five years has been really inspiring. So acknowledge for your efforts, your intelligence and your creativity. It's really cool.

[Graham Stephan]

Thanks.

[Interviewer]

Final question. What's your definition of greatness? Oh, man.

[Graham Stephan]

I would just say, honestly, to help others. I think if you make an impact on someone else's life and it's a positive impact, and you could. They have a good feeling towards that, I think there's nothing better than that.

[Interviewer]

Yeah.

[Graham Stephan]

Anytime I meet somebody who's like, yeah, I bought my first house because of you, and my credit score is great and I turn my finances around, now I have, like, 10k in the bank and I was broke. Like, just the impact, because I know, like, how that would feel for me. Like, for me, like, meeting Rob Daum for me would be one of those moments where I'm like, dude, you have no idea how much you've helped me. Just, like, your video on how to buy a Lamborghini was, like, set me off. Like, and I'll remember that for the rest of my life. And so just, like, having that for other people, I think, is so insane. Like, it's. It's hard to put into words, but it's so neat. And then you feel like you've got a friend. And so everyone I meet who's like, if they watch my videos, I know they're, like, into personal finance, investing, building wealth, chances are they're. They're an entrepreneur. And so, like, we're instant friends because of that. Like, no matter what their background is, it's just. It's neat. And I've never had that before.

[Podcast Host]

I hope you enjoyed today's episode and it inspired you on your journey towards greatness. Make sure to check out the show

[Interviewer]

notes in the description.

[Podcast Host]

Description. For a full rundown of today's episode, with all the important links and if you want weekly exclusive bonus episodes with me personally as well as ad free listening, then make sure to subscribe to our greatness+channel exclusively on Apple Podcasts. Share this with a friend on social media and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts as well. Let me know what you enjoyed about this episode in that review. I really love hearing feedback from you and it helps us figure out how we can support and serve you moving forward. And I want to remind you if no one has told you lately that you are loved, you are worthy, and you matter. And now it's time to go out

[Interviewer]

there and do something great.

[Commercial Narrator]

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[Graham Stephan]

Learn [e-mail] Sapphire Reserve cards issued by JPMorgan Chase bank and a member FDIC

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