Why You're Still Playing Small (And How to Stop) | Emmanuel Acho

Summary

The School of Greatness — Why You're Still Playing Small (And How to Stop)

Host: Lewis Howes
Guest: Emmanuel Acho
Date: May 29, 2026

---

Episode Overview

In this energetic and candid conversation, Lewis Howes welcomes Emmanuel Acho—author, broadcaster, and former NFL linebacker—to discuss why so many people "play small," how to break out of limiting patterns, and how to embrace a life of significance and ongoing growth. They unravel deep topics such as the dangers of goal-setting, overcoming the need for approval, the real meaning of confidence, handling criticism when in the public eye, and the pitfalls of measuring oneself by others’ standards. Emmanuel shares personal stories, hard-won insights, and uplifting philosophies, all centered on helping listeners stop playing small and start living more expansively and authentically.

---

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Lessons Before and After Success

[02:15]

• Post-success lesson: Not everyone will like you, and that's okay:

  “Everybody will not like you. And that is okay. Cause you don't like everybody. … If I don’t like everybody, how can I expect everyone to like me?” — Emmanuel Acho [02:15]

• Pre-success lesson: The importance of private work:

  "It's what you do in private and in silence that ends up getting praised in public. … It was the work in private that ended up getting praised in public." — Emmanuel Acho [03:17]

---

2. The Synthesis of Experiences

[04:04]

• Emmanuel likens personal growth to creating "Velcro"—combining disparate experiences and perspectives to create something unique:

  "So everybody just has to figure out what two things can they combine together to become that greatest version of themselves." — Emmanuel Acho [05:05]

---

3. Rethinking Goals: Replace Goals with Limitless Objectives

[05:57 - 11:24]

• Emmanuel describes the trap of traditional goal-setting—how it limits potential and can damage self-esteem if missed:

  "At best, if you set a goal, you will achieve it. But what if you could have achieved more? At worst … you ruin your self esteem." [07:53]

• Instead, he advocates for “an objective with no limitations”—a direction, not a finish line:

  “A goal, by definition, is an end towards which energy is aimed. An objective is simply directing energy towards something.” [09:44] “Now it’s all about having an objective with no limitations.” [08:49]

• Makes the case for living “illogically”—without fear of failure because failure requires a predefined endpoint:

  "Imagine a life without failure. Why? Because when you don’t set a goal, you can’t fail." [09:00]

Memorable Example:

• Lil Wayne lyric as a metaphor:

  "When you mention Pac, Biggie, and Jay Z, just remember … Weezy, baby. … His objective was subjective." [10:35]

---

4. The Tyranny of Other People’s Expectations

[12:25 - 13:00]

• Don’t let insignificant people have significance over your life.

  "Don’t let insignificant people have such significance over your life. And that's often what we do, bro." — Emmanuel Acho [12:25]

• How comparison and desire for approval drives self-doubt; Emmanuel’s favorite quote:

  "And those who were dancing were thought to be crazy by those who didn’t hear the music." — Emmanuel Acho [12:54]

---

5. Handling Criticism & Social Media

[14:31 - 17:18]

• Social media amplifies negativity, and mob mentality leads to dehumanization:

  "In the jungle, not all animals want to be petted. Some just want to roar. Twitter is the jungle. … Cowards turn courageous when they can remain anonymous." — Emmanuel Acho [14:56 & 15:30]

• Emmanuel shares a story of directly calling out someone who critiqued him online to remind listeners: criticism often doesn’t stand face-to-face.
• Importance of stepping away when the chaos is too much:

  “Sometimes you just gotta step away... log off. ...We are seeing things we were never meant to see." — Emmanuel Acho [16:59-17:02]

---

6. Finding Your Place, Checking Boxes vs. Living Objectives

[19:00 - 20:33]

• Emmanuel breaks down the struggle of climbing to the "mountaintop"—not as a traditional goal, but as an ongoing journey of achievement and service.

  "We're all trying to figure out what value am I providing...where is my place in life?" [19:53]

• The challenge: sustaining "the heat and the hate" that comes with public attention.

---

7. Criticism as the Cost of Praise

[22:47 - 24:56]

• You will face criticism at the top or at the bottom—so you might as well do what you love:

  "Criticism is the cost of praise. … If you don't want criticism, don't play the game." — Emmanuel Acho [22:47] "You're gonna be criticized at the top or criticized for doing nothing. So you might as well do something you enjoy." — Lewis Howes [23:41]

---

8. The Power of Emotional Regulation

[25:08 - 27:15]

• The essential life skill isn’t avoiding emotion, but learning to regulate it:

  "The number one skill to have is the ability to emotionally regulate your feelings..." — Lewis Howes [25:09] "Emotions are dangerous, but controlled anger or controlled aggression is the most dangerous of all." — Emmanuel Acho [26:03]

• “Emotionally fouling out” isn’t just for sports—it’s a risk in life whenever we let our emotions take control.

---

9. Expanding Beyond Invisible Boundaries & The Roger Bannister Effect

[27:41 - 30:16]

• Emmanuel’s deepest fear isn’t failure—it’s living inside of a box he didn’t realize was there:

  "My biggest fear is not realizing I am living inside of a box that is around me." [27:41] "The reason we don't achieve our highest highs, bro, isn't because we're not skilled...it's because we don't realize how high we could achieve." [28:55]

• Roger Bannister’s story: After the “impossible” four-minute mile was broken, others quickly followed.

  “He broke the dam open for everybody.” [29:14]

---

10. Reframing Progress: Focus on Movement, Not Endpoints

[30:28 - 34:24]

• True progress is about continuous movement, not reaching milestones:

  "I’m reaching for movement. That’s all it is." — Emmanuel Acho [30:30] "Let’s keep moving forward." [30:37]

• The pitfalls of letting others decide your metric of success (NBA vs. Olympics analogy):

  “We let other people's metric systems dictate the happiness in our life." [33:32]

---

11. Failure Reframed: You Didn’t Fail, You Fell

[37:36 - 39:39]

• The only real failure is stopping, not falling:

  “I didn’t fail. I fell. And as long as I get up, I win.” — Emmanuel Acho [37:36] “To fail is to put a period where a comma belongs. I ain’t doing that no more.” [38:10]

• Story of artist Devin Rodriguez: masterful skill built over ten years, not failure.

---

12. The Power and Pitfalls of Standards and Beauty

[41:17 - 43:02]

• The Mona Lisa as metaphor for shifting standards:

  “If the Mona Lisa were painted today, might go to a garage sale for $20. … But why do we subscribe to a definition of beauty that somebody else set? Because you can never catch it.” [42:15]

---

13. Building Self-Confidence

[45:03 - 48:58]

• Self-confidence starts with recognizing “the thing” you have, as told to Emmanuel by Oprah (“You have the thing, my friend”):

  "You have an ability to communicate with people difficult truths and they still want to hear you." — Emmanuel Acho [46:05]

• Story of being released by the Eagles and his coach wishing he could “buy stock” in Emmanuel’s future—sometimes others see your value before you do.

---

14. Self-Love and the Challenge of Success

[49:08 - 51:01]

• The paradox: with more external success comes more internal pressure and less self-love.

  "Expectations minus reality equals disappointment." [49:45] "It's so hard, unbelievably hard, to try to maintain excellence. And that is why I'd say six and a half, because I'm just hard on myself now." [50:52]

• The biggest fear becomes not losing, but having and losing:

  “The biggest fear, dude, isn’t in not attaining. The biggest fear is in having it and losing it.” [51:31]

---

15. Work/Life Balance & the Real Meaning of 'Having It All'

[54:52 - 58:29]

• You can have everything, but not all at once (Oprah quote). There are tradeoffs to every pursuit.

• “My all right now is significance. … I don’t care about success. I care about significance.” — Emmanuel Acho [58:29]

• On significance:

  "My desire is to inspire those to go higher past the required, so those I admire can also admire whom they've inspired before they expire." — Emmanuel Acho [59:25]

---

16. Advice for Building Self-Love Amidst Criticism and Expectations

[61:44 - 63:08]

• There is no final answer; self-love is an ongoing journey of letting go of expectations and learning to embrace the process, including the falls, the “not okay” times, and the moments in the spotlight.

  "It's a constant journey, man, of trying to say, like, hey, it's okay to fall. … It's okay not to be okay." — Emmanuel Acho [62:06]

---

17. Letting Go of Others' Expectations and Fears

[67:40 - 69:36]

• “We can't be afraid of other people's fears. … Let go of other people's Expectations. Because truth be told, it's other people's expectations that kind of dictate the weight of our own imagination.” — Emmanuel Acho [68:37]

---

18. If He Could Advise Himself Pre-Viral Fame

[70:24 - 73:51]

• “Breathe. It’s gonna be okay. ... Buckle up. Your life is about to change forever.” — Emmanuel Acho [70:24]
• “Prepare yourself because it’s about to be a roller coaster of good and bad.” [71:14]
• Looking ahead, Emmanuel’s future advice to himself:

  "Enjoy the process. ... We forget to enjoy the journey." [73:00]

---

19. Three Truths (Emmanuel’s Timeless Life Lessons)

[75:25 - 76:38]

• Love God, love others.
• You are worth getting to know.
• You have the ability to change the world (changing the world looks different for everyone; you can change your world).

---

20. Definition of Greatness

[77:40 - 78:26]

"Stepping outside of the box that others have built around you and constantly becoming the best version of yourself. ... We have to constantly evolve and learn to fall in love with the evolutions of ourselves." — Emmanuel Acho [77:40]

---

Notable Quotes & Moments

• On criticism:

  "Criticism is the cost of praise." — Emmanuel Acho [22:47]

• On falling vs. failing:

  “As long as you get up, you win.” — Emmanuel Acho [37:59]

• On being a bridge:

  "You really became a bridge for a lot of people that didn't see the other side of the river." — Lewis Howes [05:13]

• On comparison and metrics:

  "The problem is we let other people's metric systems dictate the happiness in our life." — Emmanuel Acho [33:32]

• On self-love and expectation:

  "Expectations minus reality equals disappointment." — Emmanuel Acho [49:45]

• On legacy:

  "My desire is to inspire those to go higher past the required, so those I admire can also admire whom they've inspired before they expire." — Emmanuel Acho [59:25]

---

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [02:15] - Lessons learned from success and pre-success
• [05:57] - Why Emmanuel stopped setting goals
• [14:31] - Handling criticism and social media's mob mentality
• [22:47] - Criticism as the price of praise, and why you should play anyway
• [25:08] - Emotional regulation as the critical skill for greatness
• [27:41] - Breaking out of invisible boundaries and the Roger Bannister effect
• [37:36] - Redefining failure as falling, not failing
• [41:17] - The Mona Lisa metaphor for beauty and standards
• [45:03] - Building confidence, Oprah’s “You have the thing” affirmation
• [49:45] - The equation: Expectations minus reality equals disappointment
• [54:52] - On having it all and the tradeoffs of significance vs. surface success
• [61:44] - The ongoing journey of self-love
• [70:24] - What Emmanuel would tell himself at the start of his rise
• [73:00] - Advice from the future: Enjoy the journey, not just the outcome
• [75:25] - Emmanuel's three truths
• [77:40] - Evolving your definition of greatness

---

Final Takeaways

• Stop playing small: Move beyond self-imposed and societal limitations by setting objectives, not goals.
• Fall in love with the journey: Progress, not perfection, is the true sign of greatness.
• Don’t be governed by others’ expectations: Craft your own measure of success and embrace your unique “thing.”
• Self-love and significance require ongoing work: Even at the height of achievement, learn to regulate emotions, appreciate the process, and keep growing.
• Greatness is constant evolution: Step outside the boxes built by others and pursue continual self-betterment.

---

Connect with Emmanuel Acho

• Follow Emmanuel on social for more inspiration and wisdom
• Check out his latest book: Illogical: Saying Yes to a Life Without Limits

---

This episode is a powerful reminder that the only true limitations are the ones we accept, and greatness is available to those willing to dance to music only they can hear.

Transcript

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

This message is brought to you by Apple Card. For a limited time, when you get a new Apple card and purchase AirPods Pro 3 at Apple, you can earn back the cost up to 250 daily cash. New AirPods Pro and up to $250 bonus daily cash back. Now that's music to my ears. Subject to credit approval, limitations and spend requirements apply. Apple Card is issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA Salt Lake City branch terms and more at apple.co/airpods. Guys, we got to talk about your secret late night Internet searches. You know the ones. Bumpy leg rash, hair loss. Trying to figure out your body by endlessly searching for answers. We've all done it and it never works. Thankfully, there's Amazon Health AI. It can connect your symptoms with your medical history to offer personalized care to 24 7. So call off the search. Amazon Health AI is here. Healthcare just got less painful. Hiring isn't just filling seats with Indeed sponsored jobs. They'll help you match with candidates who can actually move your business forward. Target candidates by skills, certifications or location. Join the 3.3 million employers worldwide that use Indeed to connect with quality talent that fits their needs. Spend less time searching and more time actually interviewing candidates who check all your boxes. Less stress, less time, more results. Now with Indeed Sponsored Jobs.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

And listeners of this show will get

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

a $75 sponsored job credit to help you get your job the premium status it deserves@ Indeed.com podcast. Terms and conditions apply. Hiring do it the Right Way with Indeed.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

What's been the biggest lesson in the last couple years of taking your shot of putting it out there, being on a limb, and then learning about how to handle the opportunities, the success, the fame, the recognition? And also, how have you learned how to say yes and no to certain things that might be big but not right for you at the right moment?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Two lessons. Yes, I'll give you one pre success, one post success. I'll start with the post success lesson. Because that one I'm learning right now as I'm talking to you. Everybody will not like you. And that is okay. Cause you don't like everybody. And you know, I've had to realize, like, yo, people don't like me, man. Like this person's mad at me. A black person's mad at me because I'm too nice to white people. A white person's mad at me because I'm a race baiter. Why don't people like me? And then I kicked back and I said, wait a second, I don't like everybody. So how Can I expect everybody to like me? It was something, dude, I've had a hard time to reconcile with because.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Because you're a nice guy, right. You want to be liked by people. That's it.

[Emmanuel Acho]

At least I try to be a nice guy. And in the midst of trying to be a nice guy, I'm still like, why are so many people upset daily? And I have to reconcile with that pre success. I think it's, you know the old phrase, noah didn't wait till it started raining to build a boat?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Uh huh.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Right. Like we don't wait until things get crazy to start doing building. And I think what you've learned, what I've learned, what I hope people learn through this conversation, it's what you do in private and in silence that ends up getting praised in public. It's the wood that you're chopping when nobody's looking. It's the paintings that you're drawing when nobody's buying. It's the words that you're saying when nobody's listening. It's the character you're developing when nobody's watching. Like, what you're doing in private is ultimately what ends up getting esteemed in public. And what I've learned now, retroactively, it was the work in private that ended up getting praised in public.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

And you worked for years on developing these skills and everything.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Everything. Well, what I've learned, dude, in talking to you and watching you, my own life, studying from brilliant minds that have come before us as we try to achieve our own. The greatest creations, individually and collectively, are the synthesis of different creations. I think about Velcro. Velcro was created, and I'll paraphrase, but Velcro was created when somebody was walking through the wilderness, if I'm not mistaken, and those little annoying pricklies, those little pricklies got stuck to a sock and they were like, well, if a prickly can adhere to a sock as an adhesive, why can't I create something? So you take the concept of a prickly and the concept of a sock and you create Velcro. And my life was the synthesis of NFL locker room, predominantly a white private school, a predominantly urban NFL locker room. Synthesize those together and create content.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Perspective. Here's a perspective.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Bingo.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

So everybody just has to figure out what two things can they combine together to become that greatest version of themselves.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah, you really became a bridge for a lot of people that didn't see the other side of the river.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Correct.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Right. There's a river. There's a separation of Ideas, thought, understanding, whatever you want to call it, connection. And you were able to see different sides and bridge the gap with your own Velcro. Now, for someone who has a gap in their imagination, they see a future that they want to create. They see an idea, a vision, a goal, whatever you want to call it. But they don't know how to become the Velcro and bridge it to get to the other side. What has been your thoughts or your philosophy and your advice on how to accomplish, set and achieve goals?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Man, I love that question. I love that question. Dude, I don't believe in goals. I no longer believe in goals. Crazy. Because I know we're told for so long to set a goal, write it down, live by it. True story, y'. All. Maybe one of the most depressing moments of my life. After my junior year playing football at the University of Texas, Texas, a top flight college football program at the time I submitted my name to go to the NFL draft. I wanted to go professionally after three years. But I got back from the NFL a report. Emmanuel, you will not be drafted in rounds one through three. You will be drafted in rounds four through seven. There are seven total rounds in the NFL draft. For those watching and eventually listening, I'm not going in the fourth through seventh round. I'll come back for my senior year.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Oh, this is junior year.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Junior year.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Gotcha.

[Emmanuel Acho]

So what I said was this. I took that sheet of paper that said a manual, you won't be drafted in rounds one through three. And I highlighted that line, you won't be drafted in rounds one through three. And I hung it above my bed and I put one of those little sticks through the wall and the paper in my bed. I looked at it every morning I woke up and every night before I went to sleep. You know what they say about goals. Look at them. Commit them to memory. Well, While at the NFL combine, I'm running my 40. At the conclusion of my senior year, the NFL combine. Again, for those watching, listening. It is the ultimate job interview if you want to go to the NFL. I'm running a 40 yard dash which will dictate essentially where I will be drafted.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

What round you're in?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yeah, exactly. As I'm running, I'm running. I hear this boom, boom, boom, boom. I thought my heels were clicking. They weren't. My quad was tearing off the bone. I clutch at my. I fall to the ground in sheer agony. During the 40.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

During the 40, when every scout and coach is watching, everyone watching. I still have the NFL TV is filming. It's on espn.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Phone's blowing up with text or um, I, K, X, Y and Z. It's terrible. I clutched to the ground. I'll save you all the rest of that details of the story. I end up getting drafted in the sixth round. I learned a valuable lesson that day. Stop setting goals. Here's why. At best, if you set a goal, you will achieve it. But what if you could have achieved more? At worst, if you set a goal and you don't achieve it, you ruin your self esteem and your self efficacy. My self esteem, my self efficacy, or your self worth? How you look at yourself. We're ruined that day. We're undermined that day. So instead of setting goals now, Louis, I have an objective with no limitations. Small difference. But that small difference will make a huge impact on your life. A goal, by definition, is an end towards which energy is aimed. An objective is simply directing energy towards something. So why, if I'm going to have a goal, would I focus on the end when I'm at the beginning? Instead, I direct all of my energy towards something. I start my book illogical, which you and I are going to get into. Imagine a life without failure. Why? Because when you don't set a goal, you can't fail. And so many of us combat failure in our lives. So many of us are trying to figure out, how can I become the best version of myself? But we can't become the best version of ourself because we're still mourning our former self. We're still mourning our failures from our past. We're still mourning our defeats from our past. We're still mourning our scars from our yesterdayears. I'm done mourning my scars. Now it's all about having an objective with no limitations. Similar to that quote, if you shoot for the moon, even if you miss, you land amongst the stars.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

So as opposed to creating a goal, then what are you creating? Are you not creating something? You're creating an objective.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Correct. I'm creating an objective.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

So what would it look like then?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Beautiful. People would always ask me when I got into tv, hey, Emmanuel, you want to be like Michael Strahan, right? For those that aren't familiar, Michael Strahan hosts Good Morning America co Host, NFL hall of Famer he's that guy.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

I said, no, I don't want to be like Michael Strahan. Because if I say I want to be like Michael Strahan, I might just be like Michael Strahan. And while that's great for Michael Strahan, he's already taken so why would I want to be like this man who's already taken? As great and as great and as great as he is, Michael Strahan's already taken. I gotta be Emmanuel Acho. So when people ask me, what do you want to be? I just say, I want to be as. I want to be considered one of the most creative people the industry has ever seen. My objective is subjective. My objective is subject to people's opinions.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

It's like art.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Bingo. It's exactly like art, bro. Unless thinking of art.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Lil Wayne, one of my favorite verses. He says, when you mention Pac, Biggie, and Jay Z, just remember. Just remember Wheezy, baby. Or when you mention Pac, Biggie and Jay Z, make sure you mention Weezy, baby. Essentially saying, when you mention the greats of all time, just make sure you mention me, too. You're not saying, I want to be the greatest. You know what I'm saying? He didn't say the best rapper alive, all that. But his objective was subjective. When you mentioned Tupac, when you mentioned Biggie, when you mentioned Jay Z, just make sure you mention me, too. And where I am now at with my desires in life, I don't have goals anymore, bro. Because if you have a goal, you can fail. And I'm done failing. While people say, yo, Acho, that's crazy. Remember, our greatest accomplishments in life are typically crazy.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

They're not rational.

[Emmanuel Acho]

They're completely irrational. Yeah, they're completely irrational. And a quote that I'm hung up on now. I'm hung up on it. Will Smith said in his latest book. He said, remember, when somebody gives you their advice, it's just that it's their advice based on their limited life experiences. You and now are a unique combination of which has never occurred before.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

That's true.

[Emmanuel Acho]

By which you are the best metric of success. You and now. Unique combination never occurred before. You're the best metric of success. So me, in this present moment, in this conversation with you, it's never occurred before.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Right.

[Emmanuel Acho]

So how this conversation is going to go is dependent upon you. Dependent upon me. Me and writing a book. This new book has never occurred before. So why would I be limited by someone else's standards? It's kind of like what you and I discussed off camera. We can bring it on camera. I know you wouldn't mind.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Don't let insignificant people have such significance over your life.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And that's often what we do, bro.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Why do you think so many people focus on the insignificance of other people's thoughts? And opinions.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Because we all want to be liked, man. And, and, and.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

And how have you learned to let go of that.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yes.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Feeling of being liked or loved or thought in a positive light when people say things that you don't like?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Well, my favorite quote, maybe for the last decade. Top three favorite quotes. Because I'm a huge quote guy. One of my favorite quotes. And those who were dancing were thought to be crazy by those who didn't hear the music. Imagine, and we've all been in this situation before, imagine walking on the beach, biking through the city, and you see somebody just dancing. You'd be like, yo, what? Exactly. But maybe they're not crazy. Maybe they just had headphones in and you couldn't see. Those who were dancing were thought to be crazy by those who didn't hear the music. What I've realized there's come a point in my time in my life where I'm dancing and people think I'm crazy. They just don't hear the music yet. You're dancing, you start, you're 1200 episodes in now. People think you're crazy. They just didn't hear the music yet. So many people watching this are dancing and people think they're crazy. No, the people that think they're crazy just haven't heard the music yet. So we have to understand we're not crazy. They just haven't heard the music. And that is what keeps me going, realizing, yo, I'm not crazy. I'm on my path to greatness. And eventually they will catch up.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah. So when you see someone saying something negative, for whatever reason or anything, how do you handle it internally and then how do you handle it externally? Do you reply to certain things? If someone's saying something, maybe it's true or it's inaccurate, do you take the energy to defend yourself or respond or do you just say, you know what? Okay, this is their opinion. I'm gonna focus on my vision.

[Emmanuel Acho]

That's really good. Sometimes I do fall into that cesspool, if you will, of social media. It's the worst.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Tough, man.

[Emmanuel Acho]

At times it could be. Social media does great things. It clearly has for you. Clearly has for me. But it can be the worst. I think about this. In the jungle, not all animals want to be petted. Some just want to roar.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

It's true.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And Twitter is the jungle. Social media is the jungle. In the jungle, not all animals want to be pet man. Some just want to roar. And you have to understand, when you log on social media and when you are in those people spaces, Some people just want to roar. And then I also remember, and this is from a movie, another quote. A person is smart, but people are dumb, angry animals. Individually, collectively, you and I are smart. But when you get amongst the crowd, then all of a sudden you have that.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

You, You.

[Emmanuel Acho]

You have that crowd chaos, if you will. And I. And I said this because I've been thinking so much recently, recently, that cowards turn courageous when they can remain anonymous. Cowards turn courageous when they can remain anonymous.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Oh, wow.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And so often on social media and in life, people can remain anonymous. In group settings at stadiums, people can remain anonymous.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Say it to my face. Come say this to my face and let's have a conversation.

[Emmanuel Acho]

That's it.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

We don't need to fight.

[Emmanuel Acho]

We can have.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I talk.

[Emmanuel Acho]

We can talk, bro. I reached out to somebody the other day because he reached out to me and he was like. He didn't reach out to me. He tweeted at me. This was a clown take. And not surprising, considering the source. I'm like, you got a million followers on social media. We used to work at the same company. You can get my number. I called him up. Oh, man, my bad. I regretted it as soon as I said it, man. I shouldn't have said it. It's on me. And I'm like, do we got issues? Just let me know. But I think people get in the midst of that mob mentality and it's sheer chaos. So I will say, to your point, it's been hard like that journey. It's tough up the mountaintop, and I'm just. I'm still trying the journey, but it can be depressing.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

How do you manage it emotionally and manage your emotions? When you see something that maybe is seeming unfair or just mean and maybe you're not doing it the best way yet, but you're on the journey.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Sometimes you just gotta step away.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah, don't respond.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Don't respond and honestly log off. I think we have such a mental health crisis right now in society, in large part because of social media. We are seeing things we were never meant to see. We're hearing things we were never meant to hear, and we're reading things we were never meant to read.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

And we're seeing, hearing and reading them in a very elaborate manner with a lot of, I don't know, emotion. You know, it's like we used to read or see things or hear stories without watching the news in such a way that was dramatized to its worst point to get the attention. This is one of the reasons I don't really watch the news ever. I want to be informed and educated, but I don't want to be entertained or captivated by my emotions. Overwhelmed by watching information as entertainment. And so I try to step back and say, tell me the facts, tell me the data so that I can have a rational thought around it. Otherwise I'll get tied into just watching the news and be like, the world is ending.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think we all have to do a better job of protecting our own minds, our own spaces, what we can take and what we can't take. Because you only get one mind, dude. And I know you pride yourself on your mind. I pride myself on my mind, dude. We only get one.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And I think we all have to do a better job of protecting our own mental health.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah. I grew up in a religion called Christian Science, and the founder is a female. Her name is Mary Baker Eddy. And she had a quote that said, stan Porter at the door of thought. Don't allow these thoughts to enter the mind continuously because then it'll damage everything in your life. So stand porter at the door of thought. Be a guard at the thought, at the mind, and don't just allow anything to be consumed by it. What has been the biggest struggle then, for you, mentally and emotionally in the last couple years?

[Emmanuel Acho]

The biggest struggle is trying to ascend to the mountain. And the reason I say that, bro,

[Louis (Interviewer)]

is to get to the mountaintop.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yes. Trying to.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

What is the mountaintop?

[Emmanuel Acho]

I think the mountaintop is different for everyone.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Is that a goal?

[Emmanuel Acho]

For me, the mountaintop is checking boxes.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Okay, Right.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Like it's checking boxes.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Give me an example.

[Emmanuel Acho]

An example. Okay, great. Now I host my own show on sports. Speak for yourself. Check. Oh, ok, great. Now I partnered with Oprah on a book. Oh, another book. Oh, a third book.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Check. Okay. But the book has to best sell. Check. It's just like. It's just trying to ascend, trying to do. And not being dejected when you don't. And then, bro, I also think trying to figure out our place on this earth.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

I think we're all trying to do that when we remove the masks and the makeup. Figuratively speaking of our life, we're all trying to figure out what value am I providing to the people I'm interacting with? What value am I providing to society? Where is my place in life? And I've been constantly. My biggest struggle the last couple years is trying to really figure that out. And now that it appears, I figured that out. Trying to sustain heat. Excuse me. And the hate that comes with that.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

The heat and the hate, huh?

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

One of the biggest money mistakes I see people make is waiting for the perfect time to get serious about their finances. And I've been there myself. It can be easy to say you'll just deal with it later. But later has a way of showing up fast. And that brings us to today's sponsor, Northwestern Mutual. They'll match you with a financial professional who'll work with you to build a plan based on what's important to you, looking out for your blind spots and finding new opportunities to help grow your wealth and protect what you've worked so hard for. They listen to you find out what's going on in your life today and what you have in mind for the near and long term. Personally, Northwestern Mutual has been behind my financial and emotional security as an entrepreneur most of my life. Having someone in my corner helps me make clearer decisions and stay focused on building a future I am proud of. Find a better way to [e-mail] the Northwestern Mutual Life Insurance Company Milwaukee, Wisconsin and Northwestern Mutual Wealth Management Management Company paid testimonial by a Northwestern Mutual policy owner Guys, we gotta talk about your secret late night Internet searches. You know the ones. Bumpy leg rash, hair loss. Trying to figure out your body by endlessly searching for answers. We've all done it and it never works. Thankfully, there's Amazon Health AI. It can connect your symptoms with your medical history to offer personalized care 24 7. So call off the search. Amazon Health AI is here. Healthcare just got less painful. You know how people sometimes invest in something that seems incredible at first, but then it doesn't live up to the hype? Like when everyone was convinced NFTs were the future and people were buying them for thousands of dollars and now they

[Louis (Interviewer)]

barely have any value.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

Marketers know that feeling. They optimize for numbers that look great, like impressions, but then they don't see revenue. LinkedIn has a word for that. Bull spend. Instead, you can get the highest roas of major ad networks with LinkedIn ads. Cut the bull spend. Advertise on LinkedIn. Spend $250 and get a 250 DOL. LinkedIn.com Louis Terms apply.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I don't think people understand that. Once you have audience and attention, there will be heat and hate. No matter how pure your intentions are, no matter how kind you try to be, there'll be hate.

[Emmanuel Acho]

You know what I've realized, man? And my co host Marcellus Wiley says this criticism is the cost of praise.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

It is.

[Emmanuel Acho]

We don't Realize that enough, like recently for those watching sports news. Naomi Osaka, number one tennis player in the world. Just a couple years ago, she tried to stop a tennis match because somebody said, you suck. Somebody yelled, you suck. And she went to the. To the judge and was like. And went to the ump and was like, yo, can we stop the match? Like, can we get them kicked out?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Is this recently?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Recently, two days ago, she tried to

[Louis (Interviewer)]

stop the match and say, kick that person out.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Correct. And at the end of the post game presser, tears came into her eyes for different reasons. And I was just like, criticism is the cost of praise.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

And if you don't want criticism, don't play the game.

[Emmanuel Acho]

It's like, you don't have a choice. Don't play.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Don't show up.

[Emmanuel Acho]

You can't play if you don't want criticism. It's not even like you were advising Doane. It's like, yo, criticism comes with it.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Here's the funny thing not to cut you off is that you're gonna be criticized at the top or criticized for doing nothing. So you might as well do something you enjoy. Cause if you're sitting on the couch and you have all this potential, but you don't do something, the people closest to you are to say, what are you doing? Yeah, this person has so much potential. I give me their potential. Yeah, I could do something great with this. But they're just sitting on the couch depressed.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yeah.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Worried about people's thoughts or opinions. There's a price either way.

[Emmanuel Acho]

You got to pay it either way.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

You got to pay it either way. Maybe it's greater price as you're climbing and dealing with the. The more attention. But there's a price either way.

[Emmanuel Acho]

You know what else, man? And I've realized this too, and it's hit me place in first the face. You can't call for attention and hang up.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah. So look at me. Oh, but only say nice things about me.

[Emmanuel Acho]

You can't. You can't. And whether we intentionally call for attention or we don't, you can't call for attention and hang up like the boy who cried. Woof. Like us in our friend groups. Like a child in a house cries and cries. Mother asks, what's wrong? Father asks, what's wrong? Nothing. And what are you crying for? Right. You can't call for attention and hang up. And so I think there's just a lot of learning and discovering that I'm doing on this journey.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah, the emotional regulation is funny. I was just interviewing a neuroscientist Slash brain surgeon. He's an expert in both areas. So he studies the brain and the mind. Right.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

The thoughts.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

And after this two hour conversation, the whole thing came down to the number one skill to have is the ability to emotionally regulate your feelings and how thoughts, the brain and the mind are connected to feelings and the ability to emotionally regulate them. Not saying that you're not going to have wide range of emotions, but the ability to regulate under pressure, under stress, so that you can get into flow, that you can get back to your mission, your vision, and not be in chaos mode. You know, you can defend yourself rationally essentially in times of chaos. And he said, that's kind of what it comes down to. If I could teach a skill, it'd be the skill of emotional regulation. And I think the farther we try to strive to unlock our potential, the more we need to learn that because the more people are going to be coming at us. It sounds like.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yeah, yeah. 1. I think that's a phenomenal thought. I think it was Michael Jordan's trainer who said emotions are dangerous, but controlled anger or controlled aggression is like the

[Louis (Interviewer)]

most dangerous of all. Yeah, yeah. Is that Tim Grover? Yeah, yeah, he's great.

[Emmanuel Acho]

It's like the most dangerous of all

[Louis (Interviewer)]

because being emotional and reacting, you're gonna fell out.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Dang it.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

You're gonna do something stupid.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Correct.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Which I did many times in multiple sports. And then you learn the lesson, oh, my emotional reaction gets me on the bench or hurts my team.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And you know what's interesting, we're talking sports, but this is a life, man.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah, that's life.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Because while you can say foul out, literally, figuratively speaking, if you're at the grocery store and then you get upset and then you get emotional and then you get into it with the cashier. Emotionally fouling out. If you're talking to a friend and then you get into it with your friend and then you say something you shouldn't have. Emotionally fouling out. Relationship oriented. If you're talking to somebody in your dating and then you get into it. So we're talking a sports conversation, but it is the controlling of your mind. But to me, bro, everything starts with the mind. Both our greatest limitations and our greatest accomplishments. To me, it's all up here.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Absolutely. What has been the biggest. You talked about living a life without failure or fear of failure?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Living a life without failure.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

What is the biggest fear for you in the last couple years? And now that you've, let's call it, broken through. Right. You were already really successful. I mean, you're NFL player and had a career in sports TV and all these things but broken through to a different level. What is now the greatest fear?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Ooh. That's why I like talking to you. I like talking to you. My biggest fear is becoming compelled place it. My biggest fear is not realizing I am living inside of a box that is around me. My biggest fear is not realizing, hey, there is a door you haven't yet opened and what you think is a world is actually just a locker that you are inside of. One of my greatest. One of my favorite scenes of any movie is the end of Men in Black. I believe it's Men in Black one and at the end of the movie they open up a locker and they open up the locker and they realize there's an entire another world out there. They find thought they were living in their world but there's such a bigger world out there. And my greatest fear is not pushing beyond a boundary because I don't even realize the boundary is set because I didn't set it because somebody else said it and I've been living inside of somebody else's box or somebody else's boundary. The reason we don't achieve our highest highs, bro, isn't because we're not skilled. It isn't because we're not talented. It isn't even necessarily because we're, we don't want it. It's because we don't realize how high we could achieve.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Right.

[Emmanuel Acho]

I think that's the biggest limiting reactant realizing our highs. One of my favorite stories, if not my favorite story story of Roger Bannister four minute mile. Four minute mile. For those that aren't familiar, Roger Bannister scientists believed it was physically impossible impossible to run a mile in under four minutes. Quick history lesson for everybody. It's my favorite story. Scientists believe it's physically impossible to to run a mile in under four minutes. May 5th, 1952. It had never been done in 2000 years. But by May 6th, Roger Bannister Oxford, England runs a mile 3 minutes 59 seconds. Within two years, 10 people ran a mile in under four minutes. Now the world record for the mile 3 minutes 43 seconds. And roughly 1800 people have done so. Why? Because one man, Roger Bannister remove the barriers that other people set around him. One man said, you know what? I'm not going to subscribe to that barrier. One man said, I'm not going to subscribe to goals. One man said, I'm not going to subscribe to that. And he broke the dam Open for everybody. And after that dam was broken for everybody, the whole rest of the running world proceeded to run through it. So my biggest fear, bro, is living inside of a box that somebody else set before me.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

So if you don't have goals to break or reach, what are you reaching for? Like, what's beyond a barrier that you're not trying to accomplish?

[Emmanuel Acho]

For me, I'm reaching for movement.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Okay?

[Emmanuel Acho]

That's all it is. I'm reaching for progress. Moving forward. I'm moving forward.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

So it's not reaching an end goal.

[Emmanuel Acho]

No, it's moving.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yes.

[Emmanuel Acho]

It's moving forward, man. Like you, you're gonna do another episode tomorrow, and hopefully it's better than today and then the next tomorrow, and hopefully it's better than that day. And then you're just gonna keep moving. Like, let's not get so bogged down by. But I didn't get this. Oh, but I got that. Just keep moving forward. When you go to a beach and you end up standing in the ocean, eventually after about five minutes, you'll look back and like, yo, I done drifted way far away. And you just drifted further than you ever thought. That's where I'm at now. Let's keep moving forward. Yeah, we get so caught up in. I want to be married by 26, and I want to have two kids, and I want to have bought my first home by 29. And by 35, I want to be done having kids and I want to have four kids. Two boys, two girls, preferably twins, because that would be easiest. Bump all that. Yeah, forget all that goal setting. Goals lead to failure. I want to live the most impactful and significant life I can possibly live. And if I happen to live that life with somebody else, great. And if I don't, great. And at 35, I want to see where I am, and at 30, I want to see where I am. And I want to just continue to move forward and make progress as a human being. But at the end of the day, bro, the reason we have these goals isn't even because of us. It's because of other people. This blew my mind. This blew my mind. And you're a sports guy, so this may as well. This might blow yours as well. This truly blew my mind. We often debate LeBron James, Michael Jordan, greatest basketball player of all time. Who do you say, sir?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I mean, I'm from Ohio, so I Go for LeBron.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Go for LeBron.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I just saw LeBron last night to play, so.

[Emmanuel Acho]

So, right. Let me blow this. Michael Jordan, LeBron James. Debate open for a second?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yes.

[Emmanuel Acho]

For those that claim Jordan's the greatest basketball player ever, they, they claim it primarily for this reason. He went to six NBA championships and he won six. But outside of those six NBA championships, Jordan never went back to an NBA finals. He went six times, and he won all six times. LeBron, on the other hand, has gone 10 times, and he's only won four.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

It's more like. He's more like Tom Brady, you know,

[Emmanuel Acho]

gone 10, won four. Jordan went six. Won six times. Okay, great. Now let's talk about the same exact sport. Basketball. Let's talk about the same exact result. First place and. Or second place, Jordan and LeBron. But now let's talk about a different measuring system, a different metric system. The Olympic Games. In the Olympic Games, Michael Jordan would have six golds, no silvers. LeBron would have four golds and six silvers. On an Olympic scale, four golds and six silvers is abundantly and clearly greater than six goals, than six golds. But in the NBA scale, six golds is better. So the question simply comes down to whose metric system are you using?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Right.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And the problem is we let other people's metric systems dictate the happiness in our life. Because in the NBA, you finish in second. You, you leave the court crying and weeping, devastated. The Olympic Games, you finish in second. To a degree you're elated, depending on what country.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Right.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Why? Because somebody else dictated how we should feel about a certain situation based upon their metric system, not even our own.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Absolutely.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And I'm just done subscribing to other people's metric systems.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I go to the Olympics, that's an accomplishment. I go to the Olympics and get a bronze. I'm like, I meddled. You know, we're the three best in

[Emmanuel Acho]

the world at what I do.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Exactly.

[Emmanuel Acho]

But in the NBA, you get third. In the NFL, you finish in third. In the mlb, you finish in third or fourth. You're like, you're petrified, you're distraught. And I realized, bro, we just subscribe to other people's metric system and we let it dictate our happiness.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Now tell me. Okay, I love this approach. I love the philosophy and the mindset. But for someone watching or listening who's like, okay, but I really want to accomplish some goals, to feel like I'm accomplishing something because I wanted to build my. Because it's always built my confidence when I do accomplish. But I hear you say, but if you don't accomplish, is it going to hurt your self esteem? So how do we if someone's like, I want to write a book this year, Do I set a goal to write a book or is it a journey of writing the book? Do I create micro goals on a weekly basis and have accountability? You know, there's going to be deadlines? Or how do we think about the process of like completing a project, launching something we wanted to launch, doing our artwork, creating our music, whatever it might be. How do we then set these things and make them happen?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Right. So I got my master's in sports psychology and I dedicated my final thesis paper, if you will, for my master's degree to this concept. I elaborate and expound on this concept in a logical. But I will give you a snippet, because I studied goals so long, I understand there is a use four goals when you are talking about the micro in order to accomplish something, there is a use for goals in a relay race, to stick an Olympic sport of track and field. It does not matter how fast we run if we do not get the baton around. So the micro goal needs to be to get the baton around. When I say don't set goals, have an objective with no limitations. I'm talking about a larger principle of life.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yes.

[Emmanuel Acho]

When you're talking about macro things such as, hey, I just want to write a book. Right. In the macro of writing a book, sure. Say, I want to finish a chapter on Monday and I want to finish my. I want to write a chapter every week. Every Monday. If you have a employer who's like, hey, we need this done by this date. Well, within that stance, there is a means to set a goal. You talked about talking to the neuroscientist. You mentioned this pivotal word, flow. In order to achieve flow. Flow is simply when you no longer are conscious of time in the midst of a task. In order to achieve flow, you need automatic feedback, autonomous feedback. In order to get that feedback, you need to set goals. So there are principles, objectives in life within micro constructs, where goals have value. I'm talking about the macro look of life, where goals will do more damage than they will, as you're saying.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Or at least goals will just be a limiting, reactive.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Gotcha.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Because I always think, what if Roger Bannister wasn't just trying to break the 4 minute mile? How much faster could he have gone? You never know. He went 359.8. He broke it, barely. There's literally 2/10 of a second was the difference. How much faster could he have gone? Maybe no faster, but maybe. If my goal, Louis, was to write A book. I would have wrote a book. I wouldn't have wrote the second one, and I might not have written the third one. So that's where I'm thinking, like, bigger picture. I just want to see people be the best version of themselves.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

So how do we. I mean, people are going to fail, but you're saying to reframe failure or to not even look at failure as an option, because if you don't set the goal, you can't fail in that sense.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Bingo. I thought about this the other time. I don't. I don't think people fail. What I say is this. And I thought about this. I didn't fail. I fell. And as long as I get up, I win.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Ooh. Yeah. Like a child. A child falls hundreds and thousands of times, and they never think to themselves, maybe this walking thing isn't for me, the dude. They fell. They fall, and they get up.

[Emmanuel Acho]

We didn't fail. We fell. As long as you get up, you win. The winning isn't getting up. So many people think they failed. They didn't fail.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

They stopped.

[Emmanuel Acho]

You stopped, you didn't fail.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

You just failed, fell, and you just never got up.

[Emmanuel Acho]

That's it. A relationship didn't work, you didn't fail at that relationship ended in the four. You didn't fail in that relationship. Job, you got fired, you didn't fail, you fell. Get up, you'll look back. You win as long as you get up. So when people keep talking about failure, I don't subscribe to that, but I don't subscribe to goals because ultimately, to fail is to put a period where a comma belongs. I ain't doing that no more, Big Dog. Exactly.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

To be continued.

[Emmanuel Acho]

I'm putting periods where commas belong anymore. And then we do that too often in our life. It's like this relationship ended. Period. No, this relationship ended. I found somebody who was more suitable for me, who I am more suitable for, and I now ended up significantly happier than I was.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

That's a good way to look at it. You know, looking at. I mean, I feel like it took me a long time to learn how to walk in relationships. I was just falling and wobbling all over the place. You know, I just needed some coordination sooner. But it took me a while to be able to look back and learn the lesson. And I feel like I'm in a much more stable place, you know? You know, I have coordination with my body now in relationships in terms of walking. And some people learn faster in certain areas of life, but it's not about giving up on love. Giving up on your career, your books or your message or your art. It's about learning. A friend of mine posted this video. His name is Devin Rodriguez. He got big on TikTok. I think he's got like 30 million followers in the last two years. He started drawing people on subways in New York City. And he would just see them, he would draw them and he would hand them a sketch and people would be blown away. He did a video recently where he started learning in 2010 how to draw. And he posted a photo from 2010 to 2020 every year, his work. And it was ugly the first five years. I mean it was. You'd throw it away. It was so bad, right? It was like a five year old sketch. It was like something I would do. Right now it's about how I draw. But now it looks like you take a photo of someone and he can draw it perfectly. But it took him 10 years to master the skill. He didn't fail the first five years, seven years. He fell forward by, kept improving. I think it's a beautiful lesson you're talking about. Don't think of it as failure, think of it as falling, bro.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And so many people in our life, even our loved ones, want to tell us that we failed. And we begin to believe them. And that's the problem. We've all committed to believing the lie that we have failed in life. We failed in our school, we failed in our relationships, we failed in our jobs. We haven't actually failed. But if you believe and listen to a lie long enough, you will be convinced that it's the truth.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And what I now practice is detangling so many of the lies that we've been told over time, deconstructing so many of the thoughts that we've believed over time. Because it's those thoughts and it's those lies that bog us down.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And bro, this also blew my mind. The Mona Lisa. I went to Paris last summer. I went to Paris. I went to the Louvre. And bro, you been to Louvre?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I think I went to the outside. I didn't go inside. Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

So I'm in the Louvre and there's art everywhere. There's art on the ceiling, there's freaking art on the wall walls. Art on the left side or there's art everywhere. As I'm walking through this, you know, hundreds of acres seemingly, I see a

[Louis (Interviewer)]

huge long line for the Mona Lisa.

[Emmanuel Acho]

I don't know yet though. I don't know. So I'm like, what in the heck is this line for? It's art everywhere, y'. All. Why y' all standing in the line to see a piece of art? Just look left. I turn the corner. Huge line for the Mona Lisa. I was like, I ain't waiting in the line, so I'm gonna just walk by and see. I look at it. It's nice. It's nice.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

It's a painting.

[Emmanuel Acho]

It's a painting painted somewhere from 1503 to 1518, I believe. Historians suggest you realize if the Mona Lisa were painted today, might go to garage sale for $20.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah, maybe, maybe.

[Emmanuel Acho]

But why? Because the Mona Lisa back then depicted a pale woman with thin lips and a large forehead. And that was the depiction of beauty back then. Depiction of Beauty in 2022. Sun Kissed Skin, you know, thin waist, nice build. But why, bro, do we subscribe to a definition of beauty that somebody else set? Because you can never catch it. The definition of beauty in the 1500s, vastly different than the definition of beauty now. What was beautiful then? We don't value now. What we value now, we don't value then. But either way, we didn't even set it back to. Why do we let such things, significant, insignificant people, have significance in our lives? And man, I'm just like, what all are we believing?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yes.

[Emmanuel Acho]

That we just don't need to.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

You know those moments when you're ordering everything to your house from groceries, gear, random things you didn't even realize you needed until the last minute? It just makes life a little easier. And now you can add Internet to that list. Get same day delivery FOR T Mobile 5G Home Internet powered by doordash and no store visits, no waiting around for a technician. It shows up, you plug it in and you're online in about 15 minutes with one cord. T Mobile has the fastest 5G home Internet. For me, working from home on the podcast that simplicity matters a lot. I'm on video calls, uploading episodes, researching guests and sending emails. And when everything just works and I don't have to think about it, I stay focused on what actually matters. It fits right into my workflow and it keeps things moving throughout the day. Visit t mobile.com homeinternet to check availability and get your home Internet delivered today. Same day delivery for most Internet eligible customers. See if it's an option during checkout. Fastest according to OOKLA Speed test intelligence data. Second half 2025. All rights reserved. You have goals. Strayer University can help you find a clear path forward. For over 130 years, Strayer has been innovating higher education to make it more accessible, like offering Bachelor's students access to up to 10 no cost gen ed courses to help lower the cost of tuition. Visit Strayer Edu to learn more. No cost Gen EDS provided by Strayer University Affiliate Sophia Learning eligibility rules apply with Strayer University. For details Strayer University is certified to operate in Virginia by Chev and has many campuses, including at 212115 Street north in Arlington, Virginia.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

So what would you say people can do to build self confidence if they're doubting themselves? What are some things? If it's not setting and accomplishing goals, what can we do to build it?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Well, like you just said, self confidence starts with self. And I think, and this is what I will tell, I will share, I believe you and I have had this conversation either off or on the on or off the record. June 9, 2020 get that call from Oprah. And when Oprah calls me, she says these words, well, okay, true story. Let me not lie to you. I missed the call. Yeah, okay, Oprah. Oprah and I did a conversation on Apple. Uncomfortable conversations meets the Oprah conversation. I missed the call. Oprah's right hand woman rushes in. Hey, great job Emmanuel. But I think Oprah called you. I scurry to call her back. I call her. This is what she says, you have the thing, my friend, you have the thing. And coming from someone who had the thing and has the thing, you, my friend, you have the thing. So I'm like, yo, Oprah just told me I have the thing.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

She anointed me with the thing.

[Emmanuel Acho]

So what is the thing? She said you have an ability to communicate with people difficult truths and they still want to hear you. So what would my advice be to people who are trying to get that confidence without setting goals? I would tell them what Oprah told me. You have the thing. The question is, what is the thing? What is the ability that you are uniquely skilled, gifted and or excel at? We all have it. I promise you. You have it because we all do. Your thing might be an incredible painter. Your thing might be simply being a servant, a great listener. Your thing might be being great with kids. Your thing might be being great with animals. You might be great with secretarial tasks. You might be a skilled mathematician, but you have the thing. So for those that are lacking confidence, you don't need to set a goal to know that you're skilled. You just need to believe that you're skilled. And you need to figure out what is it that you are skilled at. I Shared this story today on my social media. But you, my boy, Let me share it now.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yes.

[Emmanuel Acho]

2014, I'd been released by the Eagles for the fifth time.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

By them or by.

[Emmanuel Acho]

By the Eagles?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Holy cow. How do they keep bringing you back?

[Emmanuel Acho]

They cut me. They would sign me back. They cut me. They would sign me back.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Oh, my gosh.

[Emmanuel Acho]

They cut me, bro. For the five. By the. The Eagles cut me for the fifth time. By the age of 24. When I got cut this time, my coach, Southern draw accent, he said this. He called me E. I said, e, I wish I could buy stock in your future.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I said, huh?

[Emmanuel Acho]

He said, I wish I could buy stock in your future. I said, coach, you wish you could buy stock in my future? You all just released me for the fifth time.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

That's crazy.

[Emmanuel Acho]

In the last two years, and I'm not even 25 yet. Fast forward seven years, eight years, I realized what he was saying. He saw in me what I hadn't even seen in myself. Not as a football player, but as a person. My coach text me about three months ago, and he said, stock price is too high now.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Oh, that's pretty cool.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And so what I would just tell people is like, man, I wish I could buy stock in your future. Because my coach saw in me what I didn't see in myself. And I think sometimes it's our job to see in people what they don't even see in themselves.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

You know what's interesting is we should be reinvesting in our own stock daily and, like, pouring back into ourselves, buying into ourselves so that we appreciate over time, the more we do that by acquiring skills or learning how to heal traumas of the past, or mending friendships or forgiving people, or, you know, know, being consistent with the habits that help us live a better life, we will ultimately be more valuable in the future.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Correct.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

So start investing now.

[Emmanuel Acho]

That's it. Like investing in yourself and learn to fall in love with yourself.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Absolutely. On a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the highest form of self

[Emmanuel Acho]

love,

[Louis (Interviewer)]

1 being the lowest form of self love, where are you on that scale? Not. Not if you stripped your ego away and the shell and you looked within your heart and you said, I love myself unconditionally this much. On the spectrum of one to ten, where would you be at a six and a half? Where were you two years ago?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Huh? Preemptive? Preemptive. An eight.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Okay, so you love yourself more before. You love yourself now.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Why? I believe that.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

This is interesting.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Expectations minus reality equals disappointment. Expectations minus reality equals Disappointment.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

You didn't have expectations before that?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Before, uncomfortable. There was no expectations. Not by the world. I had my own expectations, but the world had no expectation of me. Now my expectations are freaking through the roof. Now you're number one bestseller. You've won an Emmy, you got a show. Sit down with you. Expectations are through the roof. So now I've gotten harder on myself because you and I spoke about this. And our off camera combos are just as good as our on camera combos. It's so hard to maintain excellence. It will keep you up at night, it will take years off of your life. It will cause you to burst blood vessels in your vocal cords, which I have. It is so hard, unbelievably hard, to try to maintain excellence. And that is why I'd say instead of six and a half, because I'm just hard on myself now.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Wow.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And I'm hard on everybody around me now. I believe that the fun isn't winning. You know, my coach told me the fun isn't winning. I've never met too many happy people that don't win.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

You say the fun is or is not fun?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Is, isn't winning. My coach, linebacker.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

No one's having fun losing all day.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Nobody. And so instead of six and a half, because I'm just.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

But you're winning. You're winning more than two years ago.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yes, but bro. And again, Will Smith, you got three

[Louis (Interviewer)]

books in two years, an Emmy, massive press all over the world, massive social media following. You're changing lives, you're impacting people. You're spreading your voice to the world.

[Emmanuel Acho]

The biggest fear.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

And you love yourself less.

[Emmanuel Acho]

The biggest fear, dude, isn't in non attaining and not attaining. The biggest fear is in having it and losing it.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

So how do we let go of that? How do we let go of that fear?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Well, to let go of that fear, what are you gonna lose?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

What could you lose? In theory, reputation or.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Right, you could lose reputation, you could lose emotional comfort, you could lose financial stability, emotional stability. And thus you could ultimately lose spiritual stability.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

And then what? Lose it all? Then what?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Honestly, probably wouldn't be all that bad.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Where were you five years ago?

[Emmanuel Acho]

You know, where was I two and a half years ago?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Exactly, man, you were fine. You were an age.

[Emmanuel Acho]

In all honesty, here's the thing.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Now, now what you're saying, this is a powerful conversation. What you're saying is with success you love yourself less.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yes, Twist. I would say that my highs are high and my lows are. My highs are significantly higher and my lows are lower.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Okay, so.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And I think that is what land you bro two and a half years ago. Just chilling. Yeah. Not much good, not much bad. Just here. Yeah. Yeah. Now, Emmy, there's more at stake. Solitude. Number one bestseller. Isolation.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Oh, man.

[Emmanuel Acho]

You know, it's just. It fluctuates.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

So how do we become the Tom Brady's of life, you know, where it's just more even keel.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Well, here's what's interesting. Let's not be bamboozled by Brady.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Oh, yeah, he could be emotional.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Well, here's why I say let's not be bamboozled by Brady. If you are married to someone for 22 years and then you file for divorce and you go back within two months, there's an issue either internally with you or you didn't think through your decision. Tom Brady was married to the game of football for 22 years.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Right.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Divorced, the game of football.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Now he's coming back and then within

[Emmanuel Acho]

two months was like, you know what? Give me this football back. It makes me wonder like, how happy was Brady without it? Clearly not.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Maybe he just wasn't done.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Sure.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I mean, he can still play at the highest level. Still one of the best in the game.

[Emmanuel Acho]

But the question that you just asked me is, what I would ask him is like, would you still. Okay, what happens if you don't play? What happens if you lose it? Right. Like, yeah. I think Brady's greatest a compliment was walking away playing at the highest level. No top 5 or top 10 player in the history of American sports has done that. None. The late, great Kobe Bryant, one of your best interviews on this show. The late great Kobe Bryant, his last year played 60 games out of 82. Second to last year. He played 35 out of his last game, however, went crazy, was a banger. 60 points on 40 shots.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Was a banger. He went out on top, went crazy.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Phenomenal. But the Kobe in the last three

[Louis (Interviewer)]

years wasn't a championship.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yeah, he was just hurt. I mean, think about our greatest of greats, Peyton Manning, albeit his team won a Super Bowl. He was hurt. So I think you go out on top. But I think back to the crux of this conversation. There's a dichotomy of success. And I love what Oprah says, and I believe she says it best. You can have everything, but you can't have it all at once.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah. Can't have all of what, though? Because I feel like you can be healthy, you can be fulfilled, you can have love in your heart, you can have a beautiful relationship and you could be on your journey of a fulfilling life mission.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yes.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

So what does it mean? You can't have it all? I mean, I can't what?

[Emmanuel Acho]

I don't know.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

What is this?

[Emmanuel Acho]

All, I think all is in the context of which he's speaking is like, there are no. There are no. What should I say? It's like, okay, having it all is like if you want to be the best media mogul.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yes. You can't also be a full time traveling musician or something, or like an

[Emmanuel Acho]

athlete or even like Tom Brady. You can't be the greatest quarterback of all time and also be the greatest husband. Something's got to get only 24 hours in a day. So the time you are putting towards football, you're taking away from your kids. Time you're giving your kids, you're taking away from football. Like something has to give. And so when I think about it, it's like something's gotta give.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Well, I mean, if you've been trained, I mean just, I don't know, I don't know Brady's life or what is going on there. But if you've given so much to one thing for decades and you've built momentum, you don't ride on it, but you've laid the groundwork. So maybe you can have more time for family or other things downtime once you've done 20 years of effort to master your skill. So there might be, you know, at a certain point you can transition into. Okay, now I have more time with friends or family or whatever it is. Again, I don't know his personal life, but. So maybe not all at once, but I think.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Correct. But it's an interesting exploration.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Absolutely.

[Emmanuel Acho]

It's an interesting exploration. As so many people when they hang it up, retire from their profession. I just want to spend more time with my spouse and my kids.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I mean, Oprah hung it up.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Right.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I mean, she stopped her show. She transitioned into different shows and projects.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Correct. And now, you know, she'll do three, four conversations a year. She'll produce a couple things.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

She's got her Apple show. Right?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Correct.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Whenever she wants to do it, I guess.

[Emmanuel Acho]

But she, you know, when she was banging out her show 260 days a year, I mean, just go crushing, go going. But I think even she would admit, like, and her and I spoke last week, I think even she would admit, like, didn't have the same level of downtime, didn't have the same peace about life, didn't have that same tranquility.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Absolutely.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Even. You're grinding away, dude.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

We're in the grind phase.

[Emmanuel Acho]

You're in the grind phase. One conversation, you having another conversation.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

But at one point, at one point, I see a evolution, you know, and it's been evolving over the last nine years. And I see a evolution of when you bring in an amazing team and you're able to systematize and you're able to create other, you know, parts of a network and shows, it doesn't have to be you grinding in the same area.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Correct.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

You can evolve.

[Emmanuel Acho]

I can't wait for that.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

You know what I mean? It's like if you wanted to do 10 more books, you're not going to be the one that has to write them all yourself. You can have support, a ghostwriter to help with you or an editor or something. So it's not just all. You can evolve beyond it.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Correct.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

But there is a period of time where we must go all in on, lay the foundation. Absolutely. For years to do. If you want to do anything at a high level, you've got to obsess over something, you know, an instrument, your art, your craft, whatever it might be. So 100% agree that you can't have it all. I can't be the greatest public speaker in the world and a media host and this and playing the guitar on touring around the world or whatever it's like. But I feel like you can have your all.

[Emmanuel Acho]

So then it comes down to if people's all like, my all right now is significance. People say, emmanuel, how'd you get so successful? I don't care about success. I care about significance.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

What does that mean? Impact.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Service. Impact.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

But significance. I feel like when I think of significance, it's me being significant as opposed to being of service and creating significance in the world.

[Emmanuel Acho]

I say they're the same. Why would I say they're the same? Is you being of service is significant to you?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Sure.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Like, for example, it was 2014. I'm laying in my bed in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. I'm playing for the Eagles at the time, and these words came into my head and I never was able to shake them. And I literally. I end a logical with this. That's the last thing in the book. My desire is to inspire those to go higher past the required, so those I admire can also admire whom they've inspired before they expire.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

That's beautiful.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And it was like, I was like, wait a second. I was laying in there and it was literally what you just said, Impact, significance. My desire is to inspire those to go higher past the required, so those they admire can also admire whom they inspire before they expire. I was like, that's my life. I didn't even come up with it. It was just imprinted onto my heart, my true desire. I just want to inspire people to be a better version of themself so that the people who admire me, I can admire them before I get up out of here.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Wow. So you mentoring or supporting others, you can? Yeah, exactly, dude.

[Emmanuel Acho]

One of my favorite things is when people are like, I saw you uncomfortable conversations. And I use that. And we've now built a curriculum around it at our job. I'm like, y' all admired me for sitting down and having these conversations. Now, in turn, I'm admiring you for having conversations based upon a conversation I had.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

That's cool.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Like, that, bro, is my deepest desire.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Now. Now, here's my. I'm gonna get back to this because I want to put a bow around this topic of self love. What's it going to take for you or anyone as they start to break through certain levels of success or accomplishment or whatever they might be looking for? What's it going to take for people to increase their level of self love with criticism? With the weight of gold, as the Olympians call it. I don't know if you've seen that documentary, the Weight of Gold. Powerful about how Olympians. Not all. Some of them get extremely depressed after they accomplish the gold medal or the Olympics. Some even commit suicide. And it means different things because what's next? And I'm living from this past now as opposed to something greater for myself. So how can we, when we accomplish. When we succeed, when we get recognition, significance, develop deeper sense of self love as opposed to. You go from an eight to a six and a half. Not saying it's bad or something, but how do you say stay at an 8 or improve as you make more impact in the world, as you accomplish more and have more that you've received. That's my question for you on how you can do that personally and how we can support others in doing that as they accomplish.

[Emmanuel Acho]

I think it's a constant journey. I'd be lying if there was an answer. I think it's a constant journey. And again, I've referenced it so many times, but I felt so seen and reading Will's book because he was like, I was my own drill sergeant. His own drill sergeant. And I think it's a constant journey, man. Of trying to say, like, hey, it's okay to fall. Yes, it's okay if one of your books don't best Sell.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Absolutely.

[Emmanuel Acho]

It's okay if a conversation doesn't go as great as you thought, it's okay. If this date didn't go as great as you thought, it's okay if this relationship ends, it's okay. As this job isn't for you, it's okay. And I think it's that constant exploration of saying like, you know, it's okay not to be okay.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And what you just said is like, dude, what happens if you lose it all? You're back where you were two years ago.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah. And I think where you're innate self,

[Emmanuel Acho]

love, I think it's reconciling that. I think it's reconciling, like let go of that fear of failure. Because I've let it. That's why I stopped setting goals, is to let go of that. But now it's like, now that you've achieved, it's okay. Just to me, again, it's just a matter of like, hey, you've, you've, you've made it.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yeah.

[Emmanuel Acho]

But if we're being honest, there's just a dichotomy that I'm, that I'm figuring out along this a lot.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I think this would be powerful for you over the next few years or whenever you figure this out, to share with me or share with your audience how people can accomplish, achieve and have the responsibility of success and continue to have immense self love. And I think it comes for me. What I've learned is letting go of the expectation of the accomplishments. You know, my last book, my first book was a New York Times bestseller. And then there was an expectation I got to make the next one eventually. New York Times bestseller, probably same for you. I got to make this just as big, if not bigger. I remember going into it saying, my last book, I was like, you know what? I'm writing a book that's probably not going to be the biggest thing ever because it's talking about how men can be more vulnerable. And it came out right when MeToo happened. So I was writing this a couple years before and it came out during it. I was like, this could either be the biggest thing in the world or this could be the last thought people have is how men can heal their hearts. And it did well, but didn't hit New York Times bestseller list. And I remember for a day I was like, if I'm being honest, I was upset and angry and frustrated that it didn't, it hit the numbers, but it didn't hit the list. And then I said, what was the reason why I wanted to write this in the first place. It was to be able to help one man who might be going through mental challenges or struggles to heal and improve the quality of their relationship with their partner, their friends, their family, and then their community and the world. And it's been doing that and it's been continuing to do that year after year. And I'm just like, I got to keep focusing on the impact and the significance, like you call it the service to one human being or thousands or millions, whoever wants to listen or read or consume. And when I it took a few days to kind of let that go. My ego go of being hurt or frustrated or angry, angry. And when I did that, I just said, okay, I'm going to just really appreciate the people that are reading it, that are messaging me and take it in and be like, wow, that was impactful to that person. And that's been a big game changer for me. It still doesn't mean I don't want to accomplish goals and all these things and, you know, succeed in my own right. But letting go of the expectation of it, needing to look a certain way has been extremely helpful for me. Still loving myself, even with the success.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And I think it's hard to do

[Louis (Interviewer)]

though, because the big you get, people expect it, you expect it. It's the expectation, people expect it and they'll look at you differently. Oh, why didn't get New York Times this time? Or why didn't it do a million copies this time? If it did half a million last time, or that video got 5 million views, why did this one get a million?

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

You know those moments when you're ordering everything to your house from groceries, gear, random things you didn't even realize you needed until the last minute? It just makes life a little easier. And now you can add Internet to that list. Get same day delivery FOR T Mobile 5G Home Internet powered by doordash. No store visits, no waiting around for technician. It shows up, you plug it in and you're online in about 15 minutes with one cord. T Mobile has the fastest 5G home Internet for me. Working from home on the podcast that simplicity matters a lot. I'm on video calls, uploading episodes, researching guests and sending emails. And when everything just works and I don't have to think about it, I stay focused on what actually matters. It fits right into my workflow and it keeps things moving throughout the day. Visit t-mobile.com home Internet to check availability and get your home Internet delivered today. Same day delivery for most Internet eligible customers, see if it's an option during checkout fastest according to OOKLA Speed test intelligence data. Second half 2025. All rights reserved. You have goals Strayer University can help you find a clear path forward for over 130 years, Strayer has been innovating higher education to make it more accessible, like offering Bachelor's students access to up to 10 no cost gen Ed courses to help lower the cost of tuition. Visit Strayer. Edu to learn more. No cost Gen EDS provided by Strayer University Affiliate Sophia Learning eligibility rules apply. Connect with Strayer University for details. Strayer University is certified to operate in Virginia by Chev and has many campuses, including at 212115 Street north in Arlington, Virginia.

[Emmanuel Acho]

To me, there's such a fear of in life in general, in my mind, of other people's expectations of you.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Gosh. So how do we let go of that?

[Emmanuel Acho]

I've journeyed with it and at times I do well with it, at times I don't. I'll say it in story form. Mortuous cuisphobia Mortuous cuisphobia the fear of ketchup. True thing. Sixth grade, bro. Sixth grade. I'm at my friend's house eating a burger, and his older brother walks in and he throws something at the table. My friend runs and hides behind the chair. I'm like, yo, what the heck just happened? I look at what his brother threw at the table and I see it was a ketchup packet. After checking on my friend, I bust the packet open. I finish eating my fries and I was like, wait a second. I rethought about that story and learned a lesson. We can't be afraid of other people's fears. And so often in life we're afraid of other people's fears. Imagine if I would have ran and hid because of a ketchup packet like my friend did. Friend was afraid of ketchup.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

More chews.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Q is phobia. I am not. But I'm not gonna hide because he was hiding. And I think what I've done at times is being afraid of other people's fears. So we all do. Like we're afraid of getting into a relationship because our friends are afraid of commitment. We're afraid of getting out of that toxic relationship because our friends are afraid of being single. Well, we've never left a small city in Texas. Our parents haven't. So we're not going to. And I think the only way to get rid of that is to let go of other people's fears. Let go of other people's Expectations. Because truth be told, it's other people's expectations that kind of dictate the weight of our own imagination.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Absolutely. Absolutely.

[Emmanuel Acho]

When you think about one hit wonders in the music industry, they're one hit wonders because we called him that. We called him a wonder and we said that song was a hit. So I think it's a matter of not being afraid of other people's fears and letting go of other people's expectations which dictate our own. Man.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

If you could go back, when was the post you did the first post? Two years ago.

[Emmanuel Acho]

It was June 1, 2020.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

June 1, 2020. If you could go back the day before June 1 and have a conversation with yourself from where you are now to that day, and you're about to go in and do this thing, or maybe it's the morning of and you're about to put this video out that you've been thinking about and you wrote the script to, or you didn't write the script. I think it was all off the cuff. But you've been organizing in your mind for a period of time. And sit down. If you were going to literally stand face to face and have a conversation with yourself almost two years prior, what would you say before you jumped in and did this video with everything you know now, what would you say?

[Emmanuel Acho]

I would say two things. The first would be breathe. It's gonna be okay. Because I couldn't eat that morning. I didn't say anything. I'd say, breathe is gonna be okay. And then I would say, buckle up. Your life is about to change forever.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Wow.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Because when I recorded that video, I lived in Austin, Texas. I now live in Los Angeles, California. When I recorded that video, I worked for another sports network. I've since switched. When I recorded that video, I had no team outside of a broadcasting agent. I now have a team of like five to 10 people. When I recorded that video, I wasn't in partnership with Oprah. I now am. I would say, buckle up, man. Your life's about to change forever. And I'd say, prepare yourself because it's about to be a roller coaster of good and bad.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

What did you need to prepare yourself? How could you have prepared yourself more emotionally?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Emotionally, I could have let go of my desire to please all people. I think it's Abel Lincoln. You are either please all people some of the time or some people all the time. I could have prepared myself. Nobody prepares you in my mind like how to be well known. Unless you're the son of somebody famous. Right? And fame is you know, and it's famous relatives. Why I said well known. Nobody prepares you for that. And nobody prepares you for the constant opinions of other people, bro. It's hard. I hit a depth of loneliness after I found first saw you maybe a month later. Really? In December of 2020, just depressed.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Really?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yeah. Because thousands of people, I love you. Thanks for the conversations. But then I'm sitting in my house in Beverly Hills, just by myself, just, you know, no friends, middle of a pandemic, just isolated. Nobody prepares you for the constant comments. Acho, you're a sellout.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Constant.

[Emmanuel Acho]

And comments. Acho, you're a race baiter. Acho, you're a race grifter. Nobody prepares you for that. So I would have told myself, buckle up. It's going to be tough, but it'll be worth it.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

And if you were sitting in front of yourself right now, your two year old self, older than today, what would you say to prepare you for these next two years? So now I'm your future self?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Yeah. What would it say to this though?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Yes. And with everything that you've created and learned and are going to learn and you have this experience now, your future self, what would your future self say to you?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Enjoy the process. Enjoy the process. I think the biggest thing I forgotten and I think the biggest thing so many people can forget, we forget to enjoy the process. We forget to enjoy the journey. Yes, the fun isn't winning, but you can still find enjoy in the journey, win or lose. And at times I don't enjoy the process because I'm so focused on moving that I don't enjoy where I am. When you have an objective without limitations, it's all about movement, man. It's all about movement. But you got to enjoy the journey, these conversations, enjoy them. Your third book, dude. I'm the only person not named Oprah to have multiple books under the Oprah imprint.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Right. It's crazy, man. Enjoy it.

[Emmanuel Acho]

Enjoy it. I didn't know. I. I didn't know Oprah. Seventeen months ago, she walked right by me.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I got three books now.

[Emmanuel Acho]

I got three books. So enjoy the journey, enjoy the process.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

I think everyone needs to hear that for sure. Illogical. Saying yes to a life without limits. Emmanuel Acho. This thing is going to be inspiring. Lots of great lessons, wisdom stories. Yeah. Don't let other people's fears become your own. That's what I just opened up. So the first thing I opened up right there. So don't let other people's fears become your own. Powerful stuff, man. I got a couple Final questions for you. I asked these same the last time. Before I ask them, I want people to follow you on social media. You got great content over there. If you love sports and life lessons, you always have these great moments when you're at the sports desk sharing youg life lessons, which I love that stuff. Get the book illogical Saying yes to a life without limits. Make sure you guys check this out, Get a few copies for your friends, share with people, and if anything, when you're reading it, you get a handsome smile on the back of the book. So make sure you spread the light and love with your friends. This is called the three truths. I asked you last time and I've got your three truths here. I'm curious if it's changed. If this was your last day and you've accomplished everything you want to accomplish and you've lived as long as you want to live, but eventually you got to turn the lights out and you can't leave anything behind. Your message, your content, your books. There's none of this behind. So all of your words and content goes with you somewhere else. But you had three things you could share with the world. Three lessons. What I like to call three truths. What would you say were yours?

[Emmanuel Acho]

Ooh, it's so funny because it's been, what, 18 months? And I don't remember what I said last year last time. I can't wait for this. I think my. My most important truth. Love God, love others. I think I'll never flinch or waver on that. Love God, love Jesus, love others. That's. That's just. That's me as a man of faith. I can't waver from that. I think my second biggest truth, man, and I love this. And I forever loved it. You're worth getting to know. You're worth getting to know, man. I think that's hit me more now than ever, bro, is like people don't realize they're valued and people don't realize, like, you are worth getting to know.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Absolutely.

[Emmanuel Acho]

My third biggest truth. Where would it be right now if I could only leave a truth? You have the ability to change the world. You truly do. And I just wish people would believe that changing the world looks different for different people. But you have the ability to change your world.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

Those would be my three.

[Emmanuel Acho]

What were my three last time?

[Louis (Interviewer)]

If people want to know, they have to go. Listen to. You had two of the three identical. So if people want to know what they are, they'll have to go check that out. We'll have it linked up. For you to listen to that. Before I ask the final question. Emmanuel, I want to acknowledge you man, for your constant growth and your commitment to service. I think people could get scared of success or they could get scared of the growth as fast as you've had it and the fact that you keep showing up, keep delivering and I think learning about yourself in this process is really beautiful. And keep serving. It's really cool man. And I just am excited to know that you're continuing on this journey that you're going to keep showing up. I don't see you stopping anytime soon. No matter what happens with books and projects and other stuff, just keep serving. And I really acknowledge you for being authentic to who you are, man. It's a beautiful, beautiful thing to witness. My final question. What's your definition of greatness? Ah,

[Emmanuel Acho]

that's definitely changed since my definition of greatness? Oh, my definition of greatness would be stepping outside of the box that others have built around you and constantly becoming the greatest version of yourself. I don't like using a definition of definition. So stepping outside of the box that other are built around you and constantly becoming the best version of yourself. Constantly evolving. We have to constantly evolve and learn to fall in love with the evolutions of ourselves. So now step outside of these boxes bro. Cuz there is a box there. Step outside of it. Let's evolve and let's just become the best version of ourself man.

[Louis (Interviewer)]

My man. Appreciate you freaking brother. Good stuff.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

I hope you enjoyed today's episode and it inspired you on on your journey towards greatness. Make sure to check out the show notes in the description for a full rundown of today's episode with all the important links. And if you want weekly exclusive bonus episodes with me personally as well as ad free listening, then make sure to subscribe to our greatness+channel exclusively on Apple Podcasts. Share this with a friend on social media and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts as well. Let me know what you enjoyed about this episode in that review. I really love hearing feedback from you and it helps us figure out how we can support and serve you moving forward. And I want to remind you of no one has told you lately that you are loved, you are worthy, and you matter. And now it's time to go out

[Louis (Interviewer)]

there and do something great.

[Podcast Host / Advertiser]

Imagine never buying gas again. Just plug in your car like you plug in your phone. That's the power of driving electric. It's not just good for the planet, it's actually more convenient and more affordable. I've actually been driving a Tesla for a couple of years now, and I love it. I can charge it overnight in my garage, and when I'm on the go, I hit a fast charger and I'm back on the road in no time. No gas stops, no oil changes, just smooth, quiet, reliable drives. EVs are built for real life, with daily range that lets you go wherever you need to go without worry. And the savings? Up to $2,000 a year just by skipping the gas pump. And with over 100 new and used EV models available right now, there's truly something for every lifestyle and budget. The way forward is electric. Learn [e-mail] in business, there's no room for guesswork. Every shipment matters. Every deadline counts. When you're trying to keep operations running smoothly, the last thing you need is uncertainty. That's why reliability is at the core of USPS Ground Advantage. Each package moves through a secure nationwide network tracked from door to door with affordable upfront pricing and delivery you can depend on. Because knowing your logistics are handled lets you focus on everything else. Visit usps.com ground advantage to start shipping with confidence. USPS Ground Advantage we mean business.