Podcast Summary: Ep. 353 "Monuments Are Memories" with Irvin Weathersby Jr.

The Stacks, hosted by Traci Thomas, delves deep into the intersections of books, culture, race, and politics. In Episode 353, released on January 8, 2025, Traci welcomes Irvin Weathersby Jr., a writer, educator, and activist, to discuss his debut book, An Open Contempt: Confronting White Supremacy in Art and Public Spaces. This comprehensive conversation explores the role of monuments in society, the pervasive influence of white supremacy in art and public memory, and the pathways toward meaningful change.

1. Introduction to Irvin Weathersby Jr. and His Book

Irvin Weathersby Jr. introduces himself as an author focused on unraveling the complexities of race and history through art and public spaces. His book serves as a travelogue that not only examines American history and systemic inequality but also engages in the ongoing public fight for racial justice.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [00:16]: "Monuments are often memories that we hold dear to ourselves. They are relics that we possess and pass down to each other."

2. Defining Monuments: Beyond Physical Structures

The conversation begins with defining what constitutes a monument. Irvin emphasizes that monuments are not limited to physical statues or structures but also encompass personal and collective memories that shape societal narratives.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [00:59]: "Monuments can be a number of things. They are relics that we possess and pass down to each other."

3. The Scope and Journey of "An Open Contempt"

Irvin shares the genesis of his book, which began as a fiction project about a rebellious slave in Cuba. The events of 2017, notably the removal of monuments, pivoted his focus toward a non-fiction exploration of white supremacy's imprint on public spaces across America, from New Orleans to South Dakota.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [04:16]: "An Open Contempt is the story of America as told through New Orleans. It specifically looks at how art informs everything we see around us, especially white supremacy."

4. Personal Experiences and Conversations

Irvin recounts his experiences visiting various landmarks and engaging with diverse communities. He highlights poignant interactions, such as conversations with white individuals in South Dakota who express selective appreciation for Black people, revealing underlying racial tensions.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [19:42]: "I don't feel like a monkey at all. I don't feel like I'm in some sort of cage zoo."

5. Monuments in Museums: Challenges and Solutions

The discussion shifts to the challenges of addressing problematic art in museums, where monetary value complicates the removal or amendment of artworks. Irvin advocates for including more diverse voices and perspectives in the art world to create a more inclusive and representative narrative.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [14:04]: "Include more voices now to say, look, when we talk about the Louvre or these masters, we have the opportunity to open the landscape for people to do different things."

6. Education and Teaching Approaches

Irvin delves into his educational background, discussing how his experiences at the University of New Orleans and Morehouse College shaped his critical perspective. He emphasizes the importance of contextualizing historical figures and events within a broader, Afrocentric framework.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [25:45]: "I try to find myself as Irvin Weathersby and also as a black American to figure out where we fit in this story."

7. Audience and Purpose of the Book

Irvin articulates that his book is intended for anyone committed to racial justice, including college and high school students, educators, and general American readers seeking a deeper understanding of history and its modern implications. He aims to empower readers to engage critically with public spaces and monuments.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [35:50]: "It's really for everyone who is committed to trying to have a better future, whether you're white, black, Asian, or other."

8. Future Outlook and Political Context

Addressing the potential impact of a second Trump presidency, Irvin anticipates increased chaos surrounding monuments and public memory. He expresses hope that this turmoil will create opportunities for change and the dismantling of white supremacy structures.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [39:18]: "I want conflict. I want this book to be banned. I want that platform for change."

9. Concept of Progress Amidst Contradictions

Irvin reflects on the paradox of celebrating progress, such as Juneteenth, while still honoring problematic figures through monuments. He questions how society can reconcile these contradictions and push for genuine reparations beyond symbolic gestures.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [42:17]: "Progress is happening. But the wealth gap is still the wealth gap."

10. Comparison with Similar Works

Irvin discusses other influential works like Clint Smith's The Word Is Passed and Imani Perry's South to America, noting how each book contributes uniquely to the discourse on race and public memory. He sees his work as a complementary memoir that intertwines art, history, and personal narrative.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [46:44]: "My book is focused on art, has some history, but it's also really more like a memoir."

11. Writing Process and Personal Insights

Irvin shares his disciplined yet organic writing process, balancing parental responsibilities with his creative endeavors. He prefers writing longhand with notebooks and gel pens, finding that this method fosters a deeper connection to his work.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [52:02]: "I write everything longhand. My brain is not going to function that way on a computer."

12. The Significance of the Title "An Open Contempt"

The title stems from a passage in Frederick Douglass's autobiography, encapsulating the dehumanization and open contempt faced by Black individuals. Irvin aims to convey the pervasive hatred and the necessity of overcoming it through awareness and action.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [49:00]: "Frederick Douglass describes what it felt like to recognize that he was a slave, the moment of 'open contempt' for our humanity."

13. Closing Thoughts and Future Endeavors

Irvin concludes by expressing his dedication to dismantling white supremacy and fostering racial justice. He envisions his book as a catalyst for ongoing conversations and transformative action within society.

Notable Quote:

Irvin Weathersby Jr. [44:46]: "My life's work is really to try to dismantle some of these ideas of white supremacy and racism so we can move beyond where we currently are."

Conclusion

Episode 353 of The Stacks offers a profound exploration of how monuments and art reflect and perpetuate systemic inequalities. Through Irvin Weathersby Jr.'s insightful discussions, listeners gain a deeper understanding of the intertwined nature of art, history, and racial justice. His book, An Open Contempt, emerges as a powerful tool for education and activism, urging society to confront and amend its public memories for a more equitable future.

Notable Timestamps and Quotes:

• [00:16] Irvin defines monuments as both physical structures and cherished memories.
• [04:16] Irvin introduces An Open Contempt as a narrative of America through New Orleans.
• [19:42] Irvin shares a personal encounter highlighting racial tensions.
• [14:04] Solutions for diversifying voices in museums.
• [25:45] Irvin discusses his educational journey and its impact on his work.
• [35:50] Target audience for An Open Contempt.
• [39:18] Anticipated impact of political changes on monuments.
• [42:17] Reflections on the nature of progress amidst societal contradictions.
• [46:44] Comparison with other contemporary works on race and history.
• [52:02] Irvin's personal writing process and preferences.
• [49:00] Origin and meaning of the book's title.
• [44:46] Irvin's commitment to dismantling white supremacy.

This episode serves as an essential conversation for anyone interested in understanding the profound impact of monuments and art on societal structures and collective memory. Irvin Weathersby Jr.'s insights provide a roadmap for engaging with and challenging the remnants of white supremacy embedded in public spaces.