The Stacks – Ep. 395: DIY Fame with Jade Chang

Host: Traci Thomas
Guest: Jade Chang (author of What a Time to Be Alive)
Date: October 22, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode dives into Jade Chang’s new novel, What a Time to Be Alive, which follows Lola Treasure Gold, a thirty-one-year-old woman thrust into accidental internet fame after her impassioned speech at a friend’s funeral goes viral. Traci Thomas and Jade examine the intersections between influencer culture, grief, personal reinvention, and the commodification of self. They also touch on writing craft, audience, and the realities behind both literary and influencer economies. Through vulnerable and lively discussion, they expose the double-edged nature of online visibility and unpack the emotional currents underpinning virality, grief, and guidance.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Novel’s Premise and Genesis

• Plot Summary:

  • Lola Treasure Gold, at a low point in her life (age 31; best friend dies), gives a speech at a funeral, which goes viral after being edited and reposted online.
  • The video’s popularity thrusts Lola into the position of a potential self-help influencer—and she must navigate what it means to guide others, all while still deeply steeped in her own grief.

    “She essentially holds forth on what she thinks would be an ideal cult to start...it goes viral. And then all of a sudden, Lola finds that she has all these people kind of following her.” – Jade, [04:03]

• Inspiration and Writing Journey:

  • Jade attempted this novel over 20 years ago just after college—originally set before widespread social media; an early draft, hand-written in a notebook, was lost.
  • The rise of social media and its democratizing of fame provided renewed relevance and motivation to revisit and rewrite the story.

    “Back in the past, people were occasionally suddenly thrust into fame...but every person did not go through life kind of thinking that it could happen to them.” – Jade, [10:13]

2. Influencer Culture & DIY Fame

• The Ubiquity of Influencer Aspirations:

  • Chang and Thomas agree everyone is, in some form, engaged in DIY fame.

    “DIY fame, baby. It’s true.” – Traci, [10:50]

  • Discussion on how the lines between living and ‘posting’ have blurred; virality feels accessible to all.

• Originality vs. Imitation in Influencing:

  • The distinction between authentic influencers with a true point of view, and those simply regurgitating trends.

    “There’s no point of view...what is important for people who are successful as influencers is that they have a point of view about the thing in which they’re influencing.” – Traci, [14:03]

• Satire vs. Earnestness:

  • The novel resists pure satire, opting for a more emotionally grounded exploration:

    “There’s a version of this book that is like satire. And then there’s the version you wrote ... it’s definitely like a heart book.” – Traci, [30:07]

  • Some elements, like depictions of the influencer economy and certain parodies, carry satirical undertones, but grief remains central.

3. Grief as Core Motif

• Centrality of Loss:

  • Chang insists that Lola’s journey into internet fame is inseparable from her grief; every story turn is meant to be “emotionally earned.”

    “You feel like you’re interacting with the world in a different way ... you’re also...you do have this sense that life is short, you don’t know what’s going to happen. Let me try.” – Jade, [17:30]

  • The co-existence of pain and strange delight in grief is explored, capturing the unexpected “pleasure” in shared mourning:

    “We never talk about how there’s a corner of grief that feels like pleasure...To experience something so overwhelming that there’s no room in your body for a single other thing...It’s a kind of love.” – Traci quoting Jade’s novel, [18:10]

• Literary Approach:

  • The aim was to interrogate grief from all possible angles, challenge “taboo” feelings, and seek honesty in emotional depiction.

4. The Writer’s Craft: Voice, Audience, & Process

• Authentic Voice:

  • Written entirely in first person (a first for Chang); she explored different registers to find one that balanced cleverness and sincerity.

    “I went through a few different ... trying to get at that thing that felt real...when she was writing a post...a more self-conscious turn of phrase...she would...want people to know she’s smart, you know?” – Jade, [24:59]

• Relationship with Online Writing:

  • Chang is less judgmental of “online writing” than Thomas (who admits she hates and does it anyway). She prizes the immediacy and authenticity that online writing can enable.

• Reflection on Audience:

  • Chang’s experiences with her earlier novel (The Wangs vs. The World) taught her she can’t predict her readers.

    “You do not know who your audience is...the range of people...it was thrilling, actually.” – Jade, [27:13]

  • She now aims to respect the reader’s time, focusing on emotionally earning their engagement rather than targeting a niche.

• Writing Structure and Process:

  • The novel is structured over a single calendar year, each month as a chapter—providing a sense of pace, seasonality, and emotional arc.

    “I need a superstructure...with a year...I had a structure I could then slot in the emotional ups and downs and the plot arcs within.” – Jade, [37:05]

  • Jade writes in communal settings; “Pomodoro Posse” is her writing group with other LA-based authors (Angela Flournoy, Asia Gable, etc.), embracing a collaborative, structured ‘work-burst’ approach.

    “I am not a great worker. I have a really hard time working at home...give me noise and somebody else’s desk...So I asked several friends...” – Jade, [42:04]

5. Naming, Details, and Character Construction

• On “Lola Treasure Gold”:

  • The main character’s name originated from a blend of cultural influences and maximalist sensibilities. Treasure is a common endearment in Chinese families; the last name Gold, a translation/adaptation of a Chinese surname, is part of the character’s backstory.

    “I like a name that packs a punch...her mom is ready to just give her a Chinese name...but there is another influential caretaker...Treasure is a very common nickname in Chinese...her actual Chinese last name...she changes it to the English.” – Jade, [35:22]

• Astrological Details:

  • Lola’s birthday is in December (Sagittarius).

    “I 100% thought about it in the sense that...I didn’t want to make her a Gemini and have people read so much into that Gemini designation...” – Jade, [41:22]

6. Book Recommendations and Literary Kin

• Unexpected Book Influences:

  • Jade: Tao Te Ching (Dao De Jing) inspired some of her thinking; she also recommends works by Ken Liu, Ursula Le Guin (on Taoism), and Margo’s Got Money Troubles by Rufi Thorpe.

    “If this book came out of any book, it is that...” – Jade, [53:09]

• Comparable Themes:

  • What a Time to Be Alive is in dialogue with books that approach internet fame, the economics of influence, and self-undermining self-help culture.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “I really, really wanted every story turn to feel so emotionally earned.” – Jade, [00:00]

• “Did you feel attacked or did you feel seen?” – Jade, playfully teasing Traci about recognizing herself in influencer culture, [05:56]

• “You can just, like, put yourself out there. DIY fame, baby. It’s true.” – Traci, [10:49]

• “I think we really seek emotion. You know, I think we...want to be filled with emotion. And that is especially in those moments where you have a shared grief.” – Jade, [19:00]

• “You do not know who your audience is. Like, the range of people. It was thrilling, actually.” – Jade, [27:13]

• “There’s a version of this book that is like satire. And then there’s the version that you wrote that is like, very—it’s like big hearted.” – Traci, [30:07]

• “I like a name that packs a punch...Lola Treasure Gold.” – Jade, [35:22]

• “We would gather...during the Pomodoro times, which are 45 minutes apiece, where we’re working. If we have any funny comments or little bits of gossip or questions, Emma makes us write it down on the agenda...” – Jade, on her writing group, [44:43]

• “My favorite is...a slow beer I love to have. Truly a beer that takes an hour and a half to two hours to drink.” – Jade, on writing snacks, [48:18]

• “Embarrass is so hard. I can’t spell embarrassed.” – Traci, [49:18]

• “If you could have one person dead or alive read this book, who would you want it to be?”
  “...I guess my answer would be Maxine Hong Kingston, who was the first Asian American author that I read when I was younger, who wrote a book that I felt, like, blown away by...” – Jade, [55:41]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Book Summary and Premise: [03:09]
• Influencer Culture and Personal Reflections: [05:21–15:22]
• On Grief as Motivation and Motif: [16:04–20:19]
• Craft, Voice, and Audience: [21:44–30:07]
• Satire, Heart, and Book’s Tone: [30:07–32:05]
• Naming Characters & Personal Process: [35:01–38:35]
• Writing Group & Pomodoro Process: [41:44–46:01]
• Writing Snacks & Fun Questions: [47:40–49:40]
• Book Recommendations & Literary Kinship: [52:43–54:44]
• Who Should Read the Book: [55:41]

Tone & Takeaways

Jade Chang and Traci Thomas foster an atmosphere of conviviality, candor, and intellect, with much laughter and mutual respect (as well as a healthy dose of self-deprecation). Listeners leave with a richer understanding of how internet fame and grief can intersect, how novels navigate between satire and ‘heart,’ and how the work of writing is both solitary and deeply communal.

For readers and writers interested in the emotional realities of online culture, the role of grief in personal transformation, and the hidden architecture of novels, this episode is essential listening.