Serene (6:57)

You're so sweet.

Pearl (6:59)

Wow.

Serene (7:00)

Because we love you. So you saying any of that, like, even a sixteenth of that, I'm like, oh, my goodness.

Pearl (7:07)

Yeah, right back at you. But. Well, thank you for that so much. We do have so many women in common, though. I feel like our audience, our audience is your audience, your audience is our audience, so.

Dr. Amy (7:18)

Yeah, exactly. Well, as you know, there are so many women struggling right now with a boatload of symptoms, weight being one of them, fatigue, hair loss, all the things. And, and in our world, unfortunately, there's not a lot of answers for women in the conventional medicine system. They can't just go to their family doctor and say, hey, doc, you know, I have all of these symptoms. What's going on? And get a real cared for, honest, working answer that will change how they feel. And I think that that's why we are all in this world doing this work, so that we can give these women real answers and answers that we've experienced, too. So that's really where I want to start with you ladies, is how this book came about. And can you talk about. What I love, too, is that you've both gone through hormonal changes. You've gone through your own struggle. So this isn't just information. This is experience as well. And what you've done, what you've tried.

Serene (8:19)

And what hasn't worked, it definitely comes from. From our testimony and just our passion to thrive once again. You know, we got to stages in our life. We're like, everything that was working is not working anymore. The exercise I was doing and that salad box I ticked every day, tick. You know, exercise, tick now. Not. Not cutting it anymore. We were desp for real answers. We found real answers.

Pearl (8:45)

And we just saw and we found that, I think, like you. We heard your story, and it was kind of one of. Of knockdown and. And pain, and no one could tell you what was wrong with your body until, you know, it was a long journey. And this was kind of like, for us. I mean, we discovered things along the way, but we're authors of a big health movement. We thought we'd found the way to eat, and we had. It was brilliant. It was helping hundreds of thousands of women. And then I went through menopause, and what I was doing, suddenly I felt like a big hypocrite. I'm like, I'm eating in this amazing, healthy way. I'm eating salmon. I'm eating veggies. I'm eating berries. You know, I'm eating my protein, and I am getting kind of gaining weight, but it's skinny, fat weight.

Serene (9:29)

You were inflamed.

Pearl (9:30)

Yeah. And so we dug. We dug deep because the woman, our listeners were going through the same thing. So many of them, and they were like, please, Serena Pearl, please, We're doing what you're telling us to.

Serene (9:41)

And they were told by, you know, doctors and other people to do things that were so unsustainable and just kind of like tragedy upon tragedy. Like, you know, they're already miserable. And then there's miserable approaches, like chains put on them and say, okay, you know, here's your answer. And basically, don't eat. Starve yourself. Like, exercise till you feel like a dying cockroach. And it's just. There was no joy in any of that. And so we wanted answers that kind of gave joy and gave life so that you could enjoy the process of coming out of stuck.

Dr. Amy (10:16)

And I love how you start with the S word stuck, because that's where so many women feel like they are with, with no roadmap to where what the next step is for them to, to go. What, what is that path that they need to take to get unstuck? So I love that you start with with the S word. So tell me your story. How are you stuck now? Are you, I forget, are you in perimenopause, menopause, or are you the younger?

Serene (10:43)

Yeah, I, I, I'm the younger one. I was definitely in the later stage of perimenopause. My story is I'm a baby lover. I just love babies. And, and so I fell in love with my husband because he, he loved babies too. So we were baby making fact, and then all of a sudden, I was miscarriage, miscarriage, miscarriage, miscarriage. Couldn't hold a baby, like, anymore. My body just couldn't do it. And I'm like, something is wrong. And then I started having the hot flashes and just feeling like when I was in the gym, all of my, you know, effort, my muscles were shrinking. Not, you know, I wasn't going anywhere. I wasn't, like, getting goals, hitting goals. And so I'm like, something's up. And I got my hormones tested, and I was definitely in the late perimenopause stage. And I was watching my sister. She'd recently fully gone through full blown menopause, and she came to me one day and I'm like, pearl, you want to talk about. She goes, yeah, I'm telling you, she got in my face. She's like, please don't do what I did. Like, and let yourself fully tank before jumping onto bioidentical hormones. Her advice. And I jumped on the train of bidentical replacement therapy in Perry. So I really have never, I haven't gone through, I won't go through menopause, you know, because I'm just gonna, I'm on that kind of trajectory where you do the full replacement, you know? Yeah, well, it's not just static, but it's a cycle cyclic approach. Yeah.

Dr. Amy (12:00)

Okay, so you're doing, you're doing rhythmic dosing, which I have been doing really up to this point. I've been doing the rhythmic dosing now with our patients, we do more static, and I see the pros and cons of both. So, Pearl, are you doing static dosing then?

Pearl (12:15)

Well, I did, I, let's see, I started two years. I went through menopause at 48, full blown menopause. And so I started bioidentical hormone replacement theory. Static. About two and a half years later. So I'm 54. Up until the last few months, I was static. So just taking your estradiol, your testosterone, your progesterone. Progesterone every night until Sereni started telling me, my little sister, about the benefits. She's like, come on, girl. Come on. Come over to this side. You can have a period again. Of course you can.

Serene (12:46)

You're feeling luscious. Come on over.

Pearl (12:48)

I'm like, no, I don't want to, but I do. Well, with. With flourishing estrogen, I can have better word recall. I can have less aches and pains when I have some nice, robust estradiol levels. And to get them and to be safe and to keep my uterus nice and clean, you know, I started to think, okay, I could do that. Shed every month maybe, and. And I've been doing that and really reaping the benefits, actually. I'm still a big proponent of static. I think every woman is unique, and some people will never go back to having a period, and they're just like, don't even tell me to do that.

Serene (13:24)

They were traumatized by that season and they don't want to go back.

Pearl (13:27)

And so. And so doing it statically is fine. But for me, right now, I'm. Oh, yeah, I don't. I don't know if I'm going to go back. Dr. Amy.

Dr. Amy (13:34)

Yeah, yeah, no, I hear you. I hear you. You had to find that. That path that works for you with hormones. So this question, I'll go to you first, Pearl. What did you really notice shift and change. And I know you talk about this in the book, but what did you really notice shift and change for you when you started hormones?

Pearl (13:52)

Well, sleep.

Dr. Amy (13:53)

That was first.

Pearl (13:54)

I mean, I think every woman goes through, you know, hormonal decline differently. And some women we, we talk to, they're like, I don't know why I should replace hormones. I'm feeling great. And I wasn't like that. I had. I don't know if it's the worst case of hot flashes in the entire world, but I put myself up in top five.

Serene (14:13)

I mean, she was always ordering those as seen on tv gadgets, you know, that cool your body, cools you down.

Pearl (14:19)

Yeah. The special, your moisture wicking pajama and the sheets and the special fan, I carried it in my backpack. It was miserable, so I couldn't sleep because I would hot flash and every Hour and a half in the night and then get chills after it. So I'd be hot, cold, hot, cold all night. I don't know, some of you might be listening and like, that's me. When I took that progesterone and slept, so many things got better. You know, sleep really helps with adrenal fatigue. What it's like, duh, of course it does. And then the thyroid works better. And of course I'm on thyroid replacement. But just. Just getting that sleep was so incredible. Then the protein I was eating and all the things I was doing right already started actually showing in my body. Like it started working together. I think hormones was the missing piece of the puzzle to me. Word recall started coming back. My mood. I was a happy, I was a happier woman. I wasn't flat, but I was also more emotional. Almost like I was going through my teen years again. Like I'd forgotten what it was to feel like a woman. Like, hey, I'm. I'm quite emotional, but it feels very feminine, you know, And I don't know if you felt that, but it was. It was kind of good in a hard way. And now I'm used to those feelings. But I'd been flat when I went through menopause. I really know how to feel anymore. It was just this flat state and desire, you know, desire for my husband of 28 years came roaring back and. And that was fantastic. So many things, you know, we don't say to woman. You have to get on bioidentical hormones, but we're just living testaments to the absolute joy and glory of it.

Dr. Amy (16:02)

And that's why I love talking to you and getting your experience and serene. We're going to talk to you next because, you know, it's one thing to, let's say, bring a hormone doctor on the show and. And we can go back and forth about all the benefits, bones to the symptoms and the brain and the heart and your breast tissue. But it's different when you actually hear from a woman who has gone through it and experienced it and, and what those hormones did, of course, in addition to various lifestyle changes, what those hormones actually did to change the quality of your life and then for you to write about it and put it out there into the world, it just adds another layer of awesomeness to the whole conversation. So serene. Now, you were catching your hormones early before you actually went into menopause. And that's exactly what I did too, because I saw so many of my patients go into menopause, not on hormones. Maybe Deal with it for five years, get miserable, have their midsections wide and all of that. So did you go through any massive symptoms or did you just decide, you know what, I'm catching this before I do?

Serene (17:07)

You know, I felt a couple of, like, I don't know, compared to Pearl. I couldn't call them hot flashes, but I did feel, like, a little bit hot or chilled in the night. You know, things like that where I could tell that wasn't normal. Maybe it was like a baby hot flash. But I think the thing is, for me is I felt like I so fully in love with my husband. So I had desire, but it was. It was more of response of desire to him, but it wasn't like it was back when decades before. So the thing for me, I think, is that I noticed as soon as I got on the bidenticle replacement was, oh, my goodness, like, honeymoon. Absolutely. Libido just. Was just massive change for me. And so you said to me, if.

Pearl (17:46)

There was nothing, if there was no brain, no bones, no heart, just the libido. So you, like, sign me up forever.

Serene (17:51)

I mean, being married is my new, latest hobby. I mean, chasing him around the house is just like, oh, my goodness, like, I have a hobby. Being home is a hobby.

Dr. Amy (18:01)

Oh, that's amazing.

Pearl (18:02)

Yeah.

Serene (18:03)

No, that is incredible for me. And also, I love to exercise, always love to exercise, but I wasn't getting results, like I said. But that was the game changer, getting that estrogen and testosterone. But it wasn't just the testosterone. I feel like even before I dialed in my testosterone, because we started with estrogen, for me, just. Just alone with the progesterone, I noticed that that's anabolic, too. I noticed a response in the gym where I could just build again. Like I was in a teen, you know, when I was a teen. So inflammation went away, you know, no aches, and. And I just. I kind of feel like I'm 18. I don't look 18, but I feel 18.

Dr. Amy (18:40)

You look maybe 22. How about that? We'll give you that. We'll give you 22. So going back to the libido piece, you mentioned something that I want to expand on because so many women think libido equals testosterone, period, and all they need is more testosterone, and that's not the case. Libido is so multifaceted. Can you talk a little bit more? Expand on the estrogen component as it relates to libido?

Serene (19:04)

Yeah, I didn't even. Like I said, I didn't dial in my testosterone at first. Because the doctor I go to, he's like, estrogen worship. He just loves estrogen. So he was just like, let's just see how you feel on estrogen. Of course we're going to bring testosterone, but I just want you to feel each hormone. I want you to feel what estrogen feels like to your body. Which was a beautiful thing because libido came back with estrogen. But he gave me a nice, robust level and. But that's what I, I felt a. Of sense feminine libido. I didn't feel an aggressive, like, male libido, but I felt such a feminine libido.

Pearl (19:38)

Well, it brings all the lush back to those regions.

Serene (19:41)

I mean. Yeah.

Pearl (19:43)

And it's not just menopause. I mean, I look back now and I realized perimenopause. I was starting to get very dry and I just. Well, you just don't even think about it because it's not at the top of your mind. Like, the list of things to do is not like, have sex with my husband, you know, and then I think when that starts to return, it's this mind, body connection that starts coming back.

Serene (20:05)

And I found that estrogen was what made me lush. Not testosterone. Right, Testosterone. Yeah. I'm sure that plays a definite part because now I've dialed that in now and it's just. It all compounds upon one another. But I really experienced it with estrogen alone. And I'm like, wow, you know, you don't think that that would be the case, but it definitely was for me.

Pearl (20:24)

What do you see with that, Dr. Amy, with your patients and with yourself? Like, do you. Do you feel like the need for it is there?

Dr. Amy (20:30)

Oh, yeah, it's both. It's definitely both. I mean, testosterone, like you said, it gives almost that little bit of a. Of a male aggressive drive. So I'm sure that that's contributing to you actually wanting to be at home and chasing your husband around. Right. Like, come here, honey. Let's go. But you have to have that estrogen component for, for that balance, for the vaginal lubrication to protect your. Your vagina from atrophying. I've heard stories of women, obviously not on hormone replacement, deep into menopause where literally they're vaginas atrophy to the point where not even a tampon can go in without excruciating pain ripping of the walls. I mean, that's horrible. That's no way a woman should live. Yeah, no, yeah.

Pearl (21:14)

It's tragedy. It's really, really tragic. And. And up until this Time. I mean, I know, I know. Dr. Amy, you said, you know, women are going to their doctors and not getting answers yet. But I feel there's a trickle happening, it's starting to change. Whereas I feel our mothers, our grandmothers lived through all that and didn't even have anyone to ask. Now there's conversations about this. Now there's women saying, well, I don't have to have that. You know, there's something out there. But I feel, I look back and, you know, I think, you know, well, my mother, she's 84, she's on hormones now, but like she didn't get them on, on until her late 60s.

Serene (21:51)

Oh, yeah. She's in her, the depth of her honeymoon. Oh, yeah.

Pearl (21:54)

My dad's in his mid-80s and my mum is dad.

Serene (21:56)

Boat on, man.

Pearl (21:58)

Oh my God.

Serene (22:00)

It's such a, just a beautiful thing that awareness has come because can you imagine if people would be like, oh my goodness, I didn't know that was such a thing as glasses or Lasik surgery. And it was just going to be like, can't drive, can't read, you know, can't hardly see anything. But like, oh, of course, you know, we optimize eyesight as we age and, and now it's just I, I'm so glad it's becoming more and more normal and, and I want it to come to the place one day where it's like, well, of course you optimize your hormones. Like what? Like, you know, you crown your teeth, you put glasses over your eyes, you do stuff.

Dr. Amy (22:33)

Checklist. Yes.

Pearl (22:34)

I mean, teeth don't brush themselves, muscles don't build themselves. You know, sometimes we crunchy folk and you've seen this over and over, we get into this thing. But, but hold on, they're a med, you know, they're a prescription. I don't want any prescriptions. I'm natural. Natural can sometimes mean decline and not about it.

Serene (22:52)

Yeah, yeah, no, not about it.

Dr. Amy (22:54)

Exactly. Exactly. Now, obviously you have built a huge following around your trim Healthy Mama way of eating and I love that. I can't tell you the amount of patients that I have of listeners of followers that I have that absolutely have, have had game changing, life changing experiences following the trim healthy mama way of eating. So you incorporate that into the book. But then Pearl, you kind of kick Serene out for a bit and you start talking about the Wysi way. Now, we're not going to give away the farm here because you got to read the book, but can you go into that, like, why'd you Include this, this section of the book. And who is it for?

Pearl (23:31)

It is for women like me, who. Maybe you've been through menopause, or maybe you're in late menopause, but you have had loss of lean body mass and you haven't realized it. Which was me, because with the loss of my hormones that was creeping down, I was losing my muscle mass. And I didn't know, even though I was eating well, I was doing exercise, but it wasn't lifting heavy. I was doing my toning exercises. Little small weights, you know, Pilates type things, not building anything. And it was the decline. And I didn't realize. And, and we understand that as these muscles decline, they get little fat droplets in them, right? So I wasn't overweight. I was a pretty thin woman, but I had insulin resistance. And this is the case for so many of us, woman, even if we're the same weight we were when we were 30, we're not the same metabolically. So we're all told, add protein. Everyone knows we gotta add protein, right? Add protein. But some of us, our muscles are so puny and they're so infiltrated with these fat droplets. When you add too much protein, your muscles can't even open up. They don't even know how to do it because they're kind of challenged. And. And so they can't open up very well to carbs either. And especially when you put fat, carbs and protein in a meal. You know, they. They're like. Well, you know, the cupboards are small, they're not big. There's nowhere for the food to go. And so in the whizzy way, we take the princess of trim, healthy mama, which is to not leave any food group out, but just to get a bit more wise about how you're gonna do them. So, yes, you've got prot. Yes, you've got carbs, but let's tweak, play around with some ways you can use them in your meals. And then as you get more built, like serene. I mean, she doesn't need this. Look at her.

Serene (25:18)

Actually, I don't even have arms.

Pearl (25:20)

She's so.

Serene (25:20)

I don't even work well.

Pearl (25:21)

She's got a lot of lean body mass, but until such time as we can slowly get there, and then we can take in all the fuels because we've got great cupboards for them to go. This is just a way to not gain weight while you're doing the right things, because at our age, it's so easy to gain weight, right? Do you see that?

Dr. Amy (25:41)

Yep. Oh, yeah. We see it all the time. All the time. So where do you start a woman, let's say, who is walking that same path as you did. She's. She's starting to notice her body composition shift and change. Maybe the scale isn't changing, but it's like, oh, wait, why am I. Why am I squishy here? Why does it look like I got bat wings here where I'm losing my triceps? Where would you start her with protein? And where do you eventually want to take her?

Pearl (26:09)

Right, so you gotta clean those muscles out. And we talk in the book, we present all the research and more, more than you'd ever want to know about how protein does it. Lean protein does it, but so do plants. Plants are the only things that get rid of that intramuscular fat. You gotta get rid of it. And there's a way to do it. And we talk about stuff. Studies that showed imaging of greater plants in the diet, kind of like cleansing them out.

Serene (26:36)

And then we balance it out because then it's like, okay, well, then it's plants that are like the heroes here. We'll just have a very, like, mostly plant diet. But then, you know, you can't really get a great plant protein that has enough lutein to actually handle muscle synthesis. Synthesis. So it's that beautiful balance.

Pearl (26:54)

But I think. You're asking where. I think we. We tell women, hey, you need a minimum of 25 to 30 grams of protein when you start. So, so get that. It's when they start adding like 50 grams and things of a protein, especially if it's fatty protein that many of them find. I just can't do it. It's not working for me.

Serene (27:13)

There's not enough cupboard to put it in.

Pearl (27:15)

She's there. I'm getting to that cupboard now, you know, But I couldn't do it at first. And so we have. You have to kind of do that slow journey to get there.

Serene (27:24)

It's kind of like that interesting situation where as we age, we actually need way more protein.

Pearl (27:30)

Yeah.

Dr. Amy (27:30)

Yes.

Serene (27:31)

You know, than when we were younger. But the problem is, is we cannot take it in. So, yes, we need it more than ever, but we can't take it in. So we have to do a wizzy way, some kind of a tweak so that we can take in just what we can handle so it doesn't hang around the blood sugar, but that it's enough to be building. And then we can keep enlarging upon that amount as we get those.

Pearl (27:52)

And we use amino Acids, essential amino acids to help us. Because they're like when you can't take any more actual food protein in, but you need more protein to build your muscles. Well, use them to get that extra. So we can build at the same time as cleanse. So we. That. That's a tweak that's huge for many women. We've got thousands of women right now that are finding so much success eating their 20 to 30 grams of good bioavailable protein and then getting more essential amino and making sure that that 25.

Serene (28:20)

Grams of protein is the kind that has that 3 grams of lutein, which.

Pearl (28:24)

Is 2 to 3.

Serene (28:25)

Yeah. Which is kind of like that amino acid that triggers like as you know, muscle synthesis. Because, you know, a lot of people, they're just like, they'll have their pea protein shake and it just doesn't have that anabolic effect to the muscle.

Dr. Amy (28:37)

So it doesn't.

Pearl (28:39)

Yeah.

Serene (28:39)

And then of course, you know, the pills. I'm just kind of boasting a pill. Her wizzy way too encourages, you know, to have those carbohydrates that are so necessary to sing lullabies to our thyroid. But there's not too much that it just inhibits the weight loss.

Pearl (28:54)

And not in every meal either. And that's part of our whole eating plan. You know, if you can't handle it, you don't have to have them in every meal, but they're in essential part of, you know, the ancient path, the way we were created.

Dr. Amy (29:07)

Right. So carbs are not the enemy. It's the types of carbohydrates, like, way different Eating five Oreo cookies versus some berries and a plate full of vegetables.

Pearl (29:18)

Yeah, exactly.

Dr. Amy (29:20)

Do you want to know the biggest health secret that nobody is talking about? Everything. I mean, everything certs in your gut. But every day your gut is fighting the silent war against all the processed foods and the stress and the pesticides and the toxins in the air that you breathe. And then when your gut's in trouble, your whole body feels it, not just your gut. So here's where it gets a little bit crazy. Most people are spending money on probiotics that don't even work. I see this every day in the practice. Why? Because 99% of those traditional brands die in your stomach acid before they even reach your gut. So you might as well just flush them down the drain. That's what makes just thrive spore based probiotic completely different. I have tried it and I am sold. I am totally sold. And when I learned more about it, After I interviewed the founder of Just Thrive, my eyes were opened up. I said, this is why I see no change in patients when they throw in a typical probiotic that they got at the grocery store or at the nutrition shop. You need these live probiotic strains in order to do anything in your gut. Just five is the only one clinically proven to arrive at 100 alive in your gut. That is crazy. 100 and it does something no other probiotic can. It turns your gut into an antioxidant factory, creating protective compounds exactly where you need the most. So that means better digestion, better immunity, more energy, a lot easier weight management. Just Thrive probiotic comes in capsule or berry flavored gummy. So there's an option for everyone in the family. So if you're actually ready to transform your health in 2025, you gotta take this 90 day challenge, love the way you feel or get a full product refund, no questions asked. So to join the gut health revolution and take control of your health Today, visit Just Thrive.com and save 20% on your first 90 day bottle of Just Thrive Probiotic with the promo code Dr. Amy D R A M I E. So don't forget to check out all their other natural clinically proven products too like their newest product, digestive bitters. Focus and memory. Gluten away and more. So that's Just Thrive. J U S T T H R I V E Health H E A L T H.com promo code Dr. Amy D R A M I E yeah, I love that. Now how do you incorporate protein into movement and weight training? You, you go big into one chapter which I love of, of how not to fuel your workout. And I've been saying this for decades to women like you don't go into the gym after eating a bagel with cream cheese. That's not how you feel your workout. So can you dive a little bit more into that, incorporate those amino acids into the workout and then what do you do to fuel your body pre, during and post workout?

Serene (32:33)

Right, there's kind of that trend to workout in a fasted state and you know, we encourage that a woman's body responds best to not harsh abuse. You know like even cold plunges can be fantastic and so anti inflammatory and can heal, you know, inflammation issues and pain. But you know, oftentimes things like that, when done often for women it can be just harsh and turn on your cortisol. So we suggest that in that stage when estrogen is already in depletion and that is your stress lowering hormone estrogen Helps us deal with stress. We're like, don't go into your workout fasted where it's going to be like a cortisol response.

Pearl (33:14)

And some women don't listen to us and do it anyway. We don't say you have to but.

Serene (33:17)

We like, we like people to like put something in there, you know, like whether it's essential amino acids and maybe a little bit of a fast acting.

Pearl (33:26)

Fruit, like little tiny bit because it's going to be burnt.

Serene (33:29)

Yeah.

Pearl (33:30)

In your exercise window either it's not going to sit in your bloodstream. You know we're talking, I mean a third to a half a banana, a handful of like you know, grapes or, or melon, you know, some quick, quick.

Serene (33:41)

And that's what you do it in the morning. But we also love it when people can have a really good grounded breakfast. You know, whether it's oatmeal or eggs or something, you know, to just really get those ingredients so that they can perform well because you know you're really only going to restore respond to your workout when you put the right stimulus in. And you can't put that right stimulus in when you don't have enough energy. And so it's great to just get in that gym when you're all fired up to bring it.

Pearl (34:05)

And then let's talk about post.

Serene (34:07)

Yeah, post we just like definitely that's the time where it's just integral to get that 3 gram bolus of luchine and of course at least 25 grams of protein.

Pearl (34:16)

Yeah.

Serene (34:17)

So we usually do that in that window as more of like a fast acting protein, you know where it's just in the system because that's when the muscles are.

Pearl (34:25)

So we like essential amino acid, we love whey protein powder for it. I mean it's brilliant because it's got the fast action but it's also got the sustaining action. Way, way takes a little bit longer, you know, fueling your muscles. It's kind of more drip feed or people if they don't want to do.

Serene (34:39)

Well, it's not as drip feed as a case but you know, of course the essential amino acids are straight in your system. You know, get that, get that synthesis going and then the whey protein just allows for a more of a longer window.

Pearl (34:52)

But some people like, well, pearl and serene. I'm not going to use powders, it doesn't go with my lifestyle. Don't want to just tell me what to eat. So we're like hey, get you some chicken breast or get you a bioavailable Protein, that's about, you know, 25 to 30 grams. And nature has that 3 grams of lute chain in there anyway, so it's perfect. You want to do it that way. You can, you don't have even have to do a special ingredient.

Serene (35:14)

Exactly.

Dr. Amy (35:15)

Yeah. And expanding on that window too, I think that's important for women to, to hear about what that window is because how many of us drive to the gym or to Pilates or whatever and then we chit chat after the workout with our friends and then we take a shower and we get dressed, put on our makeup, do our hair, get back in the car, then we're driving home or we're stopping somewhere before we go back to work. That window is passed, right? Yeah.

Serene (35:41)

You know, and there's a debate out there and you can google it and look up all the, you know, the conflicting ideas and it's like, well, really, the real no doesn't really matter. It just really matters, the overall protein content of your day. But you know, we've looked into those studies and you're missing so many windows of opportunity where, because every three hours you can stimulate that protein synthesis again, you know, especially through that luchine pathway with a 2 to 3 gram bolus of lutein in a snack or, or even a meal at that time. And to just, just lose out on that post window, that's like your best window, the post exercise window. But you know, to just think, well, I'm gonna basically get busy, work out, you know, chit chat, do all my stuff, hardly eat in the day, and then just have this big steak and a protein shake at night and do it all in the evening. It you really only you can, your body can only use a certain amount of protein at once. So we love to kind of slow drip protein like 4 to 5.

Pearl (36:33)

When I finish my workout, I just think I have a visual picture of my muscles being torn, all the little micro tears and I'm like, let's get them band aid up right now. I want them better. Come on now. I'm going to leave them for hours.

Dr. Amy (36:46)

That's exactly what happens. So that's a beautiful analogy.

Serene (36:49)

Yeah, yeah.

Dr. Amy (36:51)

You are breaking down to build back up. So when you break down, if you don't give your muscles something to rebuild, you almost stay in that torn apart rip. Yeah, yeah.

Pearl (37:00)

And I don't want to go back to the no muscle tone pearl. I mean, it was, I couldn't burn my meals. I was eating like the healthiest, optimal way to eat and I couldn't burn through that food. So I want muscles. Thank you. So I'm going to feel them right after that workout.

Serene (37:15)

No way.

Pearl (37:16)

I'm gonna get in there and do it.

Dr. Amy (37:18)

I love it.

Serene (37:19)

You're having, like we were saying before, having a little something in the tank beforehand has really been one of my secrets and made a difference for me because, you know, I used to be kind of like, well, you know, I just, I'll have. Maybe I'll go in fast, it'll have something just as so light. And I didn't really understand that full concept of coming into the gym revved and ready with like a full tank of gas to go. And I feel like the more I bring it in the gym, the more energy I have to really give it my all. In all of those sets, I, my muscles respond better because I have brought more stimulus to the gym.

Pearl (37:54)

But I think, you know, it depends who's listening. Like, Serene works out. She's a beast. You know, I'm not, I'm. We're different people. I'll never be as beastly as her in the gym. I've tried and it wrecks me. Me, like, I'm just different. I do half an hour workout, she's a full hour. Hers are heavier than mine. I'm heavy for me. And I'm like, I'm so impressed with myself right now. This is brilliant. But I'm not Serene. We're different body types. So I feel like, hey, if you're going in there and you're doing half an hour and you're medium, kind of like me, and you're, you're on a journey, I feel like you don't have to be as fueled up as Serene. There's different needs and different preferences. So we, again, we're a little bit different.

Serene (38:32)

Yeah, we do everything, sure.

Dr. Amy (38:33)

But I do love the fueling beforehand because I, I was in that camp, especially coming from the whole bodybuilding world, where fasting, cardio, fasted cardio, because that's what's going to tap into your fat stores. And then it's interesting, really, this is just a few years ago, I hired a trainer and he's actually a professional MMA fighter. And he said to me, just something, you know, when somebody else says it to you and you know it inside, but you need to hear it from an external source. He goes, okay, so you're going to the gym, you're trying to put on muscle, you give your muscles nothing beforehand, nothing during the workout. And then basically what I said to you, then, you have to, you know, get Cleaned up, go home. By the time you make your shake or eat your protein, another half an hour, hour has passed. And when he said that to me, I'm like, oh my gosh, there's nothing on board for to feed my muscles during that whole workout. And that's when it clicked for me that I need those amino acids on board before enduring and then in that window after as well. So I love that you mentioned that.

Pearl (39:33)

Have you seen a difference?

Dr. Amy (39:35)

Oh, yeah. I have more muscle now than when I was competing. I just said to my husband this morning, I'm like, look at these guns, honey. He's like, those are great. I'm like, I wish I had these muscles back when I was actually competing. I didn't because I burnt my muscle away doing fasted cardio.

Serene (39:51)

And are you exercising a little less now? You have more of a balanced lifestyle. Isn't that interesting? Yeah, that's an answer too. I just feel like I used to be, I'm always extreme at everything I do, but I used to be like more of a, like, okay, every day must be good. If it's good one day, let's just do it every day. And I didn't give my body those proper rest periods and you know, I didn't have much muscle to show for all of that extremeness.

Dr. Amy (40:15)

I agree totally. All right, I'm going to shift gears just a little bit because I have not had anyone on the show yet. Talk about the incretin hormones. Now, of course we talked about GLP1. We'll save that for last. I want to pick your brains on that. But the, the gastric inhibitory polypeptide, the coli. How do you even say that? The CCK and the PYY hormone. We haven't talked about these. Can you ladies talk about those? Very interesting.

Pearl (40:44)

PYY is my favorite.

Dr. Amy (40:46)

All right.

Pearl (40:47)

I think, I think PYY is going to be a biggie in the future. I think it will probably end up with a special name that people are, you know, spending hundreds of dollars on. But I get it through, through a research base. I mean, you saw in the book, they did these research studies on plain old, little old, old fashioned psyllium husk.

Dr. Amy (41:06)

Okay.

Pearl (41:07)

Starting with a meal. I think it was 10 grams. I have to go look at the research. It's in the book before a meal. And they looked at the PYY hormone. It's like GLP1. It's like GIP, you know, in Manjaro, whatever, that it increases satiety, it fat burns and it Balances of course, elevated insulin and blood sugar has pretty much the same things going for it. All those bennies, you get it powerfully through psyllium husk and it raises it for a 90 minute window. Now that's huge for an incredent hormone because incredent hormones go boop down. You know, they're very short lived and.

Serene (41:47)

As you'll see in that wizzy way for anyone who goes and checks that out, Pearl has like head psyllium and nearly all of her recipes. I don't know why you don't look like a psyllium.

Pearl (41:56)

I don't know. But I love psyllium. Like my every bowl of oatmeal that I do and it stops the big.

Serene (42:01)

Blood sugar spike chases me around with it too. When we go and we travel and we share hotel room, she's always like pouring from her zippy from her parcellium in all of my meals. I'm like brilliant.

Dr. Amy (42:10)

Just pulse it through the. Yeah.

Pearl (42:12)

Oh yeah. No, I love it. It's pretty much in my meals. If I'm having a drink, you know, psyllium and I just, and I stay so satiated, I'm a burner. I, I find, you know, we're not against incredin hormones, medications when they're needed. That's fabulous for those who need them.

Serene (42:28)

And some people really do. My husband is on, you know, the actual medications and it was a game changer for him. I can just you know, stimulate my own through food and that's what all I need.

Pearl (42:37)

Exercise stimulates. There's a lot of natural releases of course, but, but psyllium before a meal too. It is especially GP1 GIP. But yeah, psyllium is a big, a big one for pyy.

Dr. Amy (42:47)

Okay, now I'm with you. I think that that will be probably a pharmaceutical drug with a very high price tag coming soon. Now what about, what about the cck?

Pearl (42:56)

CCK is another one. And, and the found that the bitter releases the foods release CCK and even foods like you know, coffee. What are some other ones? Cacao.

Serene (43:08)

Cacao And I have made this little basically satiety trail mix that I keep in my purse. Pearl has psyllium. I have this little bitter sour trail mix and I put like the, the darkest chocolate that I can, cacao nibs or even 100% chocolate. And I just break it up into little pieces. Raw walnuts, goji berries and any little sour like even if it's like a real sour golden berry and just a few of those. Basically it's the dark chocolate and the walnuts. And I don't have a lot of it, just a little bit if I'm out and about. And I just need that those satiety hormones to kick in. And it works powerfully. The sour and the bitter release the CCK and the pyy.

Dr. Amy (43:49)

Now what's the benefit of the cck? What does that do in the body?

Pearl (43:52)

All the ingredient hormones have similar benefits. Honestly, it's your insulin and blood sugar into play. The funny thing is, you know, everyone for a long time and I think things are changing now was like, keep insulin low, you don't want to push your insulin up. And now they've realized with, you know, as there's more understanding of incredent hormones.

Serene (44:10)

Because they work with insulin.

Pearl (44:12)

They actually like, okay, let's get more insulin to push these things into your muscle cells so that they actually go in and then clear it. Clearing is everything, right?

Serene (44:24)

It's so weird to want blood sugar to be this constant dirge. It's not even seen in nature. This natural ebb and flow in nature, you know, the waning of the tide and the ebb and flow and just the way that the, the just the rhythms of nature where there's just a gentle rise and then a clearing. And that's where insulin is healthiest, when it is allowed to have a gentle rise. And then the body knows how to give that full clearing.

Pearl (44:51)

That's what incredent hormones do. When you raise them, they clear, they help insulin get pushed in and then they help insulin clear the blood sugar. So it's a really beautiful thing. And we do want rises, right?

Serene (45:04)

Because people that are not allowing their body to do that, then their body actually loses the ability. And then, you know, they're on these unsustainable diets that have like zero to very small amounts of carbohydrates and then say they're somewhere and they end up with having a little sweet potato fries or something. And that's like a donut to their system because it's like, ah, they do this big wild surge to that because the body's like, oh, glucose, I can't handle it, I don't know what to do, can't clear it properly. So we love just to train our bodies to, yes, this is wonderful to have this wonderful rise. But let's know how to clear it properly and those satisfied.

Pearl (45:41)

We have a whole chapter of like tricks like this. We've got something called the food piece preloader, which you know, you can do before meals that and we bring in all the nerdy research of how these things are studied. You know, you can buy many things off the Internet. It's like, you know, we'll raise your GLP1, but we tried them. Oh, yeah, yeah.

Serene (45:57)

So.

Pearl (45:57)

So we just looked at the research and what actually works. And so we've got some little tricks and tips.

Serene (46:02)

In fact, it works so well. I was not even hungry anymore for my meal, so we had to, like, not do the food.

Dr. Amy (46:08)

Yeah, well, you're, you're. I'm not going to say this properly. The bao. Baobob, that. That works. That does calm down your appetite. It's crazy.

Serene (46:20)

Yes.

Pearl (46:20)

Yeah. And it's amazing. I mean, if you look at the studies of what it does to slash elevated blood sugar, you put that baobab.

Serene (46:26)

With dark ko powder and plain whey without all the flavors and additives and everything. And then you put that in a little tiny bit of kefir, just a citrus small amount. And that's the real sour. You got the bitters, you got the sours, you got that whey protein that all of these ingredients are releasing, that CCK pyy and the ingredient hormones and wow. Like, it's incredible for food. Peace.

Pearl (46:49)

You know, baobab, you might have read the study where it showed it's actually.

Serene (46:52)

Delicious, by the way.

Pearl (46:53)

It is a breakfast of just like orange juice and a white bread breakfast. It didn't contain much protein and then they added baobab to it. The same. Same breakfast plus baobab. And the difference in blood sugar was literally startling at what it can do. It's that sour. But it's also what it does to the gut. It's a gut modifier. It's a prebiotic, probiotic. You know, it causes. Yeah.

Serene (47:15)

More antioxidants and acai and blueberries put together. I love it. I just love the stuff. Do you love the flavor of it?

Dr. Amy (47:22)

Oh, I love it. I put it in my shake every single day. Every day.

Serene (47:24)

I like to put it in savory foods, too, as all chili is made better with baobab. Anything with tomato in it because it has that citrusy almost like in savory. It's kind of like when you put hot sauce into something or anything like tomato soupy, it gives that acidic addition to a savory meal.

Dr. Amy (47:41)

I want to play with that. Definitely. I love that. And I love that you're giving people options to get the benefits of those increasing hormones like GLP is, which everyone has heard of, because they're not affordable to everyone. But I do want to get your take on the GLP medications, Serene. Like you said, your husband's on them. I'm a huge fan of even micro dosing for, for the inflammation for. I've been able to come down on my thyroid hormone replacement just by adding in that microdose of glp. So I want to pick your brains. What's your opinion on GLPs?

Pearl (48:15)

Tell you mine. And then, you know, our audience is a super crunchy. And when we came out and said, hey, these are excellent for some people, you can do everything right. And some people just through genetics or dieting history or, hey, when you get into the perimenopause season, they go down anyway.

Serene (48:35)

Yeah, but can I just interrupt on that dieting season.

Pearl (48:37)

Yeah.

Serene (48:38)

I mean, there are studies where if you harsh diet for a certain extended period of time, your body can just be ruined in that area.

Pearl (48:47)

Yeah, they've did studies. They saw even years later, you weren't making as many. So many women have done that. So many women at our age have lowered incredent hormones. So we came out and said, hey, guys, they're great for some people if you need them. We're, we're kind of cheering you on here, you know. And there was a lot of. Oh, we were not liked for saying that. A lot of people, yeah, somehow, you know, they think, well, big farm is out to get us. And this is all just, just, you know, it's going to ruin people in the end. But I'll let you talk. But Serene had seen just, just such a personal history with her husband.

Serene (49:19)

Yeah, well, you know, years ago, before it was a big weight loss craze, we were at an anti aging doctor's summit in Las Vegas with alternative doctors. And they were all sharing about it for the anti aging, but nothing to do with weight loss. It was all about fighting Alzheimer's, fighting cancer. Yeah, because just keeping that blood sugar stable and just keeping the, you know, the crashes out of the body.

Pearl (49:43)

This was before COVID before 2020 or anything, was just, just being heard about, you know, I was like, oh, my.

Serene (49:48)

Husband, I just know that he's got issues with blood sugar genetically because he eats what I put in front of him. And it was just, it was definitely a family thing in his family. And I'm like, I got to get my hands on. Because we have tried all of the food encouraging, you know, the foods that encourage natural hormone and Cretan secretion, and it just wasn't working. And so we saw his blood work.

Pearl (50:09)

Yeah, we put him. But we got a doctor.

Serene (50:11)

Yeah, we got a doctor. We put him on him, but, you know, we chased the doctor down, got, got him a prescription. And I'm telling you what, he under serum, like, you know, in his blood work, he was. He looked like two decades younger. His inflammation markers were down. His blood sugar, his glucose levels, his A1C started to be so CRP1.

Pearl (50:29)

You know, that inflammation market, it was so elevated. Now it's beautiful, stinking beautiful.

Serene (50:34)

And he didn't go on it for weight loss. Yeah, he had about 15 pounds to lose, but he went on it for his blood sugar and for just this inflammatory aches and pains. He just felt old. And he is a new man. He is a new man and like, I don't care if he has to be on it for life.

Dr. Amy (50:49)

Right.

Serene (50:50)

Maybe he can wean off. He's on such a low dose now. But I'm like, I don't care. Like, this is fantastic. This is amazing. It has brought my husband back from the grave. From the grave, because he's now into all kinds of everything. He's just got a zest for life again. And it's just absolutely amazing. And I'm like, I can't handle all of these sensationalist stories out there all over the Internet, all hate, hate GLP1. I'm like, it's made him healthier. Right?

Pearl (51:17)

But you did it, right? You did it with protein. You did it with.

Serene (51:20)

Oh, yeah, he had five servings of protein every day, 25 grams of protein, three gram bolus of fast. No, he worked out every day to complement and say, you know, because it does make you lose weight. And weight loss takes muscle tissue away too, but not as much when it's slow. I think people are just, you know, they, they use it to help them lose weight fast and they have a little bit of junk food while they're using it. And I think they have incredible fast weight loss where they just. Most of it's muscle tissue.

Dr. Amy (51:49)

Yes.

Serene (51:49)

And I think that's the danger. And then of course, there's rebound weight gain because now they're. Metabolically, they're not as much of a burner body anymore. They are. They have less lean body mass and their metabolisms away in the tankers, so.

Dr. Amy (52:01)

Exactly, exactly. Well, thank you for commenting on that because I really want to pick your brains on that. And I think coming from, just like you said, coming from the place where you're teaching women how to eat for their body and how to have the proper body composition, not lose rapid weight, keep their Muscle. But to hear you ladies speak on the GLP is as a possible tool in addition to everything that you're teaching regarding food and exercise. I think is, is absolutely beautiful. And of course hormones and thyroid and all the things you talk about in the book.

Serene (52:33)

No, I was just gonna say I feel like, you know, when people use hormone replacement therapy or medications like the GLP ones and they use them just as like a band aid or a fix all or you know, a special like lottery ticket, like, yeah, this is my ticket to being, you know, healthy without having to do anything. I think that's when they get that whiplash. I feel like when these hormone replacement therapies and these GLP ones are used as almost like just the key to make everything else work better in your life. That's when you know, when you don't give up on all of those foundational steps to health. This is just the foundation to make all those steps work better.

Pearl (53:10)

Dr. M. If you've encountered that same stigma around GLP1s as well, or not so much, but we have not received a lot of backlash on, you know, replacing. Some women are like a scared, fearful of replacing their hormones at first until they understand, you know, most of that fear is completely unfounded. And the WHI study was, was not, you know, showing the real thing, but when it comes to incredent hormones which are, you know, what our bodies make too and which also decline such a different stigma which I feel should be normalized too.

Serene (53:42)

Yes.

Pearl (53:42)

That when a hormone goes no matter what it is and we need it, the return of it for vitality, why stigmatize it?

Dr. Amy (53:50)

Right? Exactly. No, I'm the same way. You know, that's our, our goal is to properly educate women so they can make the best decision for themselves, whether it's bioidentical hormones or adding in a GLP to take them to that next level because they're stuck and, and I find nothing wrong with it. I think it's all in the education and, and how you use it and using it the right way.

Pearl (54:13)

So true.

Dr. Amy (54:14)

Yeah. So ladies, this has been absolutely amazing. You need to tell the listeners where they can find you and especially where they can get trim, healthy wisdom. This, this book that it just, I mean it is packed full of beautiful information, but in a way that is digestible, easy to understand, very relatable to all women, perimenopause and menopause and beyond. So please let them know where they can find you.

Serene (54:39)

Pearl's going to tell you where you can find it. But I Do want to say there is, you know, at the end of each chapter we have a page that's just broken it all down into bullets and just a paragraph of just a simple takeaway just in case somebody is like, I need answers. I mean, answers now. But it's going to take me a year with my busy hectic life to read that big fat thing. You can get simple takeaways. You can, that can make changes in your life now. And as you have time, if you're like, whoa, I just want to get the backstory of how this is really working in my body, then you can sit down while you're, you know, on the toilet. You have extra time or audible listen to it.

Dr. Amy (55:15)

That's how I do my books.

Pearl (55:17)

Yeah, we're audible on Amazon. Finally there. We're finally there on Amazon. But the big book, that paper copy is on our website, trimhealthymama.com and just want to thank you, Dr. Amy, because we have learned so much from you. Oh, yes, and your podcast and your expertise and your trailblazing for thyroid for hormone therapy.

Serene (55:35)

We binge listen to you. We're fans.

Dr. Amy (55:37)

Ditto.

Pearl (55:38)

Ditto.

Dr. Amy (55:39)

Thank you. Absolutely. Well, ladies, we'll definitely have you back on. I love, I love hanging out with you and just picking your brain. So. But thank you for your time today and thank you for writing that book. It, it's, it's going to change the world.

Pearl (55:51)

Analysis. Just saying. There's a coupon code for all your listeners if they want to get booked from our website too, so.

Dr. Amy (55:58)

Oh, beautiful. Well, I'll grab that. We'll make sure we put that in the show notes.

Pearl (56:01)

Okay. Thank you.

Dr. Amy (56:02)

All right, ladies, thank you so much.

Pearl (56:05)

Foreign.

Dr. Amy (56:08)

The information shared on the Thyroid Fixer podcast is intended solely for informational and educational purposes. It is not a substitute for professional medical advice, diagnosis or treatment. Always consult with your physician or other qualified healthcare provider with any questions you may have regarding a medical condition, treatment or before making changes to your healthcare regimen, including medications, supplements or other therapies. Use of the information provided in this podcast does not establish a doctor, patient or client provider relationship between you and the host or between you and any other healthcare professionals featured on the show. Any medical opinions or statements made by guests are their own and do not necessarily reflect those of the host or affiliated parties. Statements regarding dietary supplements or health related products mentioned in this podcast have not been evaluated by the fda. These products are not intended to to diagnose, treat, cure or prevent any disease. Some episodes of the Thyroid Fixer podcast may include sponsorships or affiliate links. The host may receive compensation for discussing or promoting certain products or services. Any such sponsorships or affiliations will be clearly disclosed during the episode. All opinions expressed are those of the host or guests and do not necessarily reflect the views of any sponsors. The inclusion of a product or service does not imply endorsement by any health care professional featured on this podcast.