14. Darth Trump Defies Constitution and Christians Defend Racism (again)

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Tim & April Show - Episode 14: Darth Trump Defies Constitution and Christians Defend Racism (again)

Podcast Information:

• Title: The Tim & April Show
• Host/Author: The New Evangelicals
• Description: Where we unravel faith, politics, and culture.
• Episode: 14. Darth Trump Defies Constitution and Christians Defend Racism (again)
• Release Date: May 9, 2025

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1. Introduction and Setting the Stage (03:01 - 04:50)

Tim and April open the episode by emphasizing their mission to combat Christian nationalism and explore the intersections of faith, politics, and culture. They highlight the importance of engaging with their audience through platforms like YouTube and podcasts, encouraging listeners to participate and provide feedback.

Notable Quote:

• April (04:54): "Joy is an act of resistance."

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2. Star Wars Week and Trump's AI-Generated Image (05:33 - 22:13)

Discussion Points:

• Star Wars Theme: The hosts celebrate Star Wars Week, coinciding with May the Fourth, and integrate Star Wars references throughout the episode.
• Trump’s AI Image: Tim introduces an AI-generated image of Donald Trump portrayed as a Sith Lord wielding a red lightsaber. This image, shared via the White House's official account, blurs the lines between reality and satire, raising concerns about its implications.

Notable Quotes:

• Tim (13:01): "Happy May the Fourth to all, including the radical left lunatics who are fighting so hard to bring Sith lords…"
• April (14:56): "It just makes you wonder, like, how do they do this and really believe it?"

Analysis: Tim and April critique the White House's decision to post such an image, viewing it as a deliberate attempt to normalize absurdity and undermine the professionalism of the office. They express frustration over Trump's apparent disregard for traditional presidential decorum and the contradictory messaging that confuses his base.

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3. Trump's Unconstitutional Actions and Immigration Policies (22:13 - 50:14)

Discussion Points:

• Constitutional Defiance: Tim and April delve into Trump's commentary suggesting uncertainty about his obligation to uphold the U.S. Constitution. They argue that such statements reflect a profound disregard for democratic principles.

  Notable Quote:

  • Tim (27:04): "He literally embodies everything that the Bible says God hates."

• Immigration Policies: The hosts discuss Trump's aggressive immigration stance, highlighting the humanitarian crisis in ICE detention centers. They share statistics on deaths in custody and personal stories from individuals affected by these policies.

  Notable Quote:

  • April (42:06): "It's so disgusting that we're tearing families apart for no damn reason."

Analysis: Tim and April emphasize the moral and ethical failures of Trump's administration, linking his policies to systemic racism and white supremacy. They lament the erosion of due process and the humanization of marginalized groups, advocating for compassion and adherence to constitutional rights.

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4. New Pope Election and Reactions (50:14 - 77:57)

Discussion Points:

• Election of Pope Robert Prevost: The hosts announce the election of Robert Prevost as the first American Pope, portraying him as a progressive and centrist figure. They contrast his approach with the more extreme elements within the evangelical community.

  Notable Quote:

  • April (77:46): "Doesn't sound like Donald Trump."

• Reactions and Implications: They discuss the potential impact of having an American Pope and how it might influence both religious and political landscapes.

Analysis: Tim and April express cautious optimism about Pope Prevost's election, hoping his centrist views will bridge divides within the Catholic community and beyond. They remain vigilant, monitoring how his leadership will address contemporary social and political issues.

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5. Racist Incident and Fundraising Debate (55:38 - 72:35)

Discussion Points:

• Incident Overview: A white woman publicly called a five-year-old Black child the N-word at a park, an act captured on video. The woman subsequently initiated a fundraiser, raising approximately $753,000 to support herself, while a GoFundMe was set up for the affected child, raising about $340,000.

  Notable Quote:

  • April (60:20): "She's going to become a millionaire for saying the N word."

• Hosts' Stance: Tim and April condemn the woman's racist actions and criticize the disproportionate support she received compared to the injured child and her family. They highlight the hypocrisy within certain Christian communities that endorse such behavior while professing Christian values.

Analysis: The hosts draw parallels between this incident and broader issues of racism within white evangelicalism. They argue that the substantial fundraising for the perpetrator, contrasted with support for the victim, reveals a systemic problem where racism is inadvertently or deliberately rewarded within certain Christian factions.

Notable Quotes:

• Tim (62:40): "She's raising a million dollars because she called a five-year-old black child the N word."
• April (65:15): "She is being rewarded for doing the wrong thing."

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6. Christian Nationalism and Racism in Evangelicalism (72:35 - 80:28)

Discussion Points:

• Systemic Racism: Tim and April explore how Christian nationalism within evangelical circles perpetuates racism and supports policies that marginalize non-white communities.

  Notable Quote:

  • Tim (76:54): "Right wing media is a safe haven for racist people and racist ideas."

• Influence of Media Figures: The hosts critique prominent right-wing commentators like Matt Walsh and Ben Shapiro for normalizing and defending racist behaviors and policies, further entrenching discriminatory ideologies within their audiences.

Analysis: The conversation underscores the insidious nature of racism embedded in Christian nationalist movements, exacerbated by media personalities who amplify and legitimize these prejudiced views. Tim and April call for accountability and a re-examination of Christian values to dismantle systemic racism.

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7. Traditional Marriage Roles and Complementarianism (81:27 - 91:58)

Discussion Points:

• Complementarianism Critique: Tim and April discuss the traditional Christian notion that husbands should lead and wives should submit. They share personal experiences of egalitarian marriages to illustrate the flaws in rigid gender roles.

  Notable Quote:

  • Tim (86:05): "Why doesn't someone come out and just say, we have someone, and then closes the door?"

• Impact on Society: The hosts link these outdated views to broader issues of gender inequality and oppression, arguing that enforcing such roles undermines healthy, collaborative relationships and perpetuates patriarchal structures.

Analysis: Tim and April advocate for egalitarian partnerships based on mutual respect and shared responsibilities, challenging the traditional complementarian model. They emphasize the need for modern interpretations of Christian teachings that support equality and partnership in marriages.

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8. Final Thoughts and Closing (91:58 - 94:21)

Discussion Points:

• Hope for Change: Despite the challenges discussed, Tim and April express optimism about the possibility of change within Christian communities. They encourage proactive engagement and accountability to foster a more inclusive and just faith environment.

• Upcoming Segments: The hosts tease future episodes, including a deep dive into the Seven Mountains Mandate, and introduce a potential new segment titled "Tim and April After Dark" for more casual discussions.

Notable Quote:

• Tim (93:45): "We'll keep putting the pressure on. And we will."

Conclusion: Tim and April reiterate their commitment to addressing and challenging injustices within Christian and political spheres. They thank their audience for their support and encourage continued participation in their mission to unravel and rectify the entanglements of faith, politics, and culture.

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Overall Themes:

• Critique of Leadership: The hosts consistently critique Donald Trump's leadership style, policies, and actions, highlighting a perceived betrayal of constitutional and moral principles.
• Racism and Christian Nationalism: A recurring theme is the examination of how racism is perpetuated within certain Christian nationalist communities and the need for introspection and reform.
• Advocacy for Equality: Tim and April advocate for egalitarian relationships and condemn traditional patriarchal roles, promoting a more balanced and respectful partnership model.
• Media Influence: The discussion emphasizes the role of media personalities in shaping and reinforcing racist ideologies within evangelical circles.

Final Note: This episode of The Tim & April Show offers a critical examination of current political and social issues through the lens of faith, emphasizing the importance of accountability, equality, and adherence to ethical principles within leadership and community practices.

Transcript

[Tim]

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[Tim]

I thought that was funny.

[April]

You cut. You cut my fast version.

[Tim]

No, that was the fast version.

[April]

That was the fast version.

[Tim]

That was definitely the fast version.

[April]

I thought it double timed after that.

[Tim]

Should I replay it again for everyone? I mean, Big D says what is the actual. I don't know if our joke went over with people. April.

[April]

Listen you all. We're gonna get a copyright violation for playing the actual Imperial March at the Front of that. Because that. I mean, you knew that was from Star Wars. I mean, there. That was it.

[Tim]

People don't understand that for some reason on YouTube, they are so sensitive to. To music. For example, remember was it two shows ago when we played the horrible Resurrecting Graves for Me or no Defying Graves for Me cover?

[April]

Yeah.

[Tim]

And in that. That was a cover of a church rewriting defying gravity. And YouTube flagged us for it and took away our monetization. So we couldn't, like, we couldn't do ads on that live. So we are very sensitive to doing this because they will flag us for anything and then ad revenue goes down and that impacts the show. So that's why we did it that way.

[April]

Yeah. I think it was Alden, who is our graphics person. Shout out, Alden. That was like, April should just hum the Imperial March for the intro. I was like, say less. Say less.

[Tim]

Like five minutes. I had a version like, here you go, Tim. I'm like, here it is. Well, well, well. Welcome in, friends. Welcome to the Tim and April show. Great to be here. We are live right now. We go every Thursday at 12 Eastern. And of course, this will be saved to YouTube, so you can watch it later. And also on podcast, if you're joining the stream or if you're watching the video, please make sure to give this video a like. It helps get it out into the YouTube algorithms. We are here to help combat Christian nationalism, help you find a better path forward in your faith. And hopefully we can laugh along the way a little bit, because. Crazy. Yeah, crazy.

[April]

You know? So enjoy. Joy is an act of resistance.

[Tim]

Yes.

[April]

And we gotta live. We gotta live through these four years, so might as well laugh at this.

[Tim]

Stupid stuff as much as we can.

[April]

You know, and cry together. Cry together. Laugh.

[Tim]

I feel like every time you and I prep, we're like, is it. Will it ever get better? Like, we truly live in the stupidest timeline. And every. Every week we're like, yeah, just. I think things couldn't get crazier. They did. So.

[April]

Yeah. Yeah. Well, so the reason why, if you don't know, we played the full original version of the Imperial March from Star Wars.

[Tim]

Original, definitely.

[April]

Yeah.

[Tim]

From the Vault. I've never heard footage from Star Wars.

[April]

Yeah. So it's Star Wars Week, specifically. I mean, today is May 8th because we record this live on Thursdays, and then May 4th is always known as Star Wars Day for May the Fourth be with you. Didn't know.

[Tim]

Classic.

[April]

And also, though the conclave for the Pope is like, happening right now. So it's very. It's extra appropriate to say, may the Fourth be with you. And also with you.

[Tim]

And also with you. April, are you a big Star wars fan? I am kind of curious because. And I know. Look, let me just preface. No matter what I say in the next few minutes here, some Star wars fans are going to hate me. I'm never going to be enough, because I am. Maybe what we can call is the casual Star wars fan. Like, do I understand the lore completely? No. Do I watch the TV shows? Usually, you know, I watch Mandalorian. I'm watching Andor season two. I love season one, but it was. It's been such a long time. I'm like, wait, the recap for season one is 15 minutes. Oh, my gosh. But I really do enjoy the Star wars world. But I'm not one of these. Like, okay, so the books from 1996, you know, an episode of book number 45 says this, and that connects to the timeline. And Andor. I'm like, I have no idea. So I am a casual observer.

[April]

I would say I'm. I am that as well. I've watched all the Star wars. Actually. My. We're rewatching A New Hope, Episode four, with our kids currently. Like, we're doing it in chunks at night because they've got school in bed or whatever. So we're about. We probably have, like 45 minutes left in the movie, but they're liking it so far. Like, I. I appreciate Star wars for what it is. I understand the lore. I love Andor. I think season one of Andor was one of the best, like, first seasons of television that I've seen in a long time.

[Tim]

It was really good.

[April]

Season two is pretty good so far, too. And honestly, relatable, you know, I feel like it's a little relevant.

[Tim]

Can I tell you my beef? I do have a beef with some of the more recent Star wars shows. And I. I'm just gonna be honest. I love really good lightsaber battles. Like, I know people love to hate on episode one, and there's many reasons to hate episode one, but Qui Gon Obi Wan versus Darth Maul, that whole sequence is like, it's burned into my. My memory. You know, the music, the choir, the whole. I mean, it was just such a good duel. And I feel like a lot of the newer, you know, Star wars shows and even movies aren't so heavy on the lightsaber battles. They're more heavy on, you know, maybe, like, what's, you know, The. The. The Republic and the Empire and the backstory, which is fine. It's not bad. But I love me a good lightsaber battle. Like, I love them.

[April]

I could see that. I think what I love about Andor is that it's not the main players. You know, it's showing, like, all the side characters and how they fought back, fought the Empire and the Resistance, and I find it very inspiring. But I agree, there is something great about a good lightsaber fight. Also, like, to continue with the Star wars theme, Fortnite. I don't know if you play Fortnite or not, but the whole next season, it's like a mini season of Fortnite. It's Star wars themed, so you can literally fight in the game now with lightsabers.

[Tim]

Wow.

[April]

And it's fun.

[Tim]

That's great. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. We have breaking news. No, no. We have breaking news. No, no. Speaking. Speaking of the Pope, they found a new one.

[April]

No.

[Tim]

White smoke popped from the chimney. Yes, that's what it's. According to New York Times. This is up in it just now. The identity of the new pontiff was to be announced shortly. Cardinals sequestered in the Sistine Chapel reached a decision on the second day of their conclave. Is that.

[April]

Is that pretty quick?

[Tim]

That's how I feel, but I know nothing. I don't know how this works. Is it usually. Oh, my gosh. Okay. This is breaking in the moment, friends, and we are alive. So we'll keep you apprised. But you heard it here. See, this is why you gotta follow the show and tune in live. We break news first.

[April]

It's like Star Wars Episode four, A new Pope. Combine the two.

[Tim]

You are the comedic relief I never knew I needed, April. And true. That's so good. But, yeah, okay, so we'll. We'll keep. We'll keep it going. I mean, I'm sorry.

[April]

So not one of the far right ones, but.

[Tim]

No. Who was the Pope that we played? Who's from the Philippines or the cardinal. Sorry. The Cardinal. That's how.

[April]

I don't. Yeah, there's a couple that are more. More progressive, that are more like Francis was.

[Tim]

I wonder why they do the smoke thing. Like, what's up? I'm sure there's a reason for everything, right? Like, any religious tradition has reasons for why they do what they do. I'm just wondering, you know, what the thing is with the smoke, the brown, you know, black smoke, white smoke, why they do that? Why not just say, why not? Why doesn't someone come out and just say, we have someone, and then closes the door? No.

[April]

Tradition, you know? Yeah, no, it's cool. That's honestly one of the things that I like about the Catholic Church is how tradition and. And, you know, ancient. Like, there's just something that feels very reverent about what they do, which. This is not an endorsement of the Catholic Church. Don't come for me. Like, there's a lot of problems, for sure.

[Tim]

Like, anything.

[April]

Yes, I can appreciate the. The attempt to keep traditions alive in a. In a. In a AI centric world.

[Tim]

I was just going to say that there is something beautiful about tradition. Like, I understand extremes of either or can be not good. And so hyper traditional folks who don't want to ever move or update, you know, theology or beliefs. It can be problematic. But there is something beautiful about. We've been doing things this way for this long regarding our rituals and, like, how we do our Mass and how we choose a new Pope that just kind of, like, it makes you feel more tethered to something bigger than yourself. I think that's, like, one of my critiques of modernism is that sometimes I feel very untethered to, like, history. Like, what are we doing here in 2025America? What is going on? So I understand the allure of why a lot of folks are moving from, like, evangelicalism to more, like, orthodox forms of Christianity, because there is a ritual. There is something that kind of makes you feel grounded in part of, like, a larger. And playing a part in, like, a larger role, you know, in world history. So I totally get it.

[April]

Yeah.

[Tim]

Anyway.

[April]

So, anyway, so it's Star Wars Weeks. We're going to be talking about Trump's Star wars post in a second. But before we get there, let's go to our Trump golf tracker.

[Tim]

Of course, April, obviously, we would definitely do that. Here it is. Boom. Okay. Okay, wait. Okay. We are trending downward. 108 days in office so far. Days spent golfing. 24 equals percentage of 22.22%.

[April]

That is going down. He's trending down, spending more time making AI photos of himself.

[Tim]

Yeah, he. He found a new hobby.

[April]

It does seem like he's been doing more interviews lately.

[Tim]

He's been around. Like, he's been around.

[April]

Yeah, like, he's. He's constantly just talking.

[Tim]

Yeah.

[April]

But you know what? It's gone down. So that it's gone down. Only 22% of his time as president has been spent golfing now.

[Tim]

Congratulations.

[April]

Yeah. Okay, so bring up. Let's just bring up this Star Wars.

[Tim]

Let's just. This one.

[April]

Yeah. Like, the muscle. I, okay. Have we ever seen Donald Trump's arms?

[Tim]

No.

[April]

Like, his real arms? I mean, I, maybe in a golf swing. Like, maybe he's more like a cutoff polo in a golf swing. But I do know for a fact his arms do not look like that.

[Tim]

I mean, I, I, I, we want to be delicate here, right? Like, body types come in different sizes and shapes, and there's nothing inherently wrong with that. It is just really telling that this is how Trump sees himself. Like, bro, I think you might need to see a psychologist if you think that this is a fitting image of you. And for those of you who can't see it, it's like an ultra AI jacked body. Veins popping out everywhere. And then Trump's little head is on this huge body dressed as a Sith with a red lightsaber. And the caption from the White House, by the way, the White House tweeted this or posted this. Happy May the Fourth to all, including the radical left lunatics who are fighting so hard to bring Sith lords, murderers, drug lords, dangerous prisoners, and well known Ms. 13 gang members back into our galaxy. You are not the rebellion. You're the Empire. May the Fourth be with you. The man has a red lightsaber. He literally is representing the Empire in this photo. And the cap is hilarious. Are you kidding me? You're what?

[April]

It's similar to, like, white Christians when they talk about the story of Exodus, how they relate, like, white American Christians relate to the Israelites and the Hebrew people as slaves, when really, like, we're far more like the Egyptians, but they never make the correlation. They're like, no, no, no, we're the ones persecuted. Like, it's similar. Some similar vibes.

[Tim]

It really plays into, like, that. By the way, in this picture, I snapped Melinda Hale. She's, she's on our board of directors. She's great. She commented, go to therapy photo. I was cackling. But yes, you're exactly right, it is. It just makes you wonder, like, how do they do this and really believe it? Like, how do you post this picture of Trump having a red lightsaber, clearly signaling that this is, like, part of the empire, and then have a caption that says, no, no, no, the rebellion is the empire and the empire is the rebellion. Like, it just shows how upside down their worldview is and their understanding of reality actually is. It's a complete tell on themselves. And their followers ate it up. Their followers ate it up. Oh, we love this. This is so great. Dude, you're delusional. I'm sorry.

[April]

You're delusional. It has. It has 260,000 likes, and this is just on Instagram and it was also posted to Twitter. It's just wild to me that you would say the people that have no power in this country currently, y' all are the empire. And us, who have all the power and are making all the laws and are throwing innocent people in prisons in another country, we're actually the rebellion. Like, what are you. What are you even talking about?

[Tim]

And we're under attack by the radical left lunatics as we control the Oval Office, Congress, and the Supreme Court. But no, no, no, guys, we're the rebellion. And. And everyone else, they're the empire. What that.

[April]

So it's interesting because obviously this. This stuff brings outrage. Like, I do think they are intentionally wanting us to be outraged over things because this is trolling. I definitely know that this is trolling. And I've seen some maga, you know, commentators and influencers that are like, oh, Trump's. Like, the left falls for Trump's trolling again. I'm like, it's not that we're falling for his trolling. We know it's trolling. It's the fact that the President of the United States is posting stuff like this under the official White House account. Like, the, The. There's zero professionalism. There's. There's no. Like, this is supposed to be an office that is respected. You know, like, we go back to tradition, like the. The importance of tradition, where he's just bucking that completely, which I do think is a lot of what his base likes, like, to Trump's credit. And I don't like to give Trump a lot of credit, for the record, but I do think there is something to be said of how he does tweet a lot. A lot, A lot. Too much.

[Tim]

A lot.

[April]

But people who follow him feel like they have access to him because they can comment on his stuff all the time. He's just constantly saying whatever he thinks. It's not presidential. I do. I just think that's part of what the appeal was. And also I think all of us are still in shock that this is where we are as a country, too. Like, we don't want to accept it because it wasn't that long ago that Joe Biden was president and there was. There was respect that our nation had worldwide or President Obama.

[Tim]

I. Yeah, if. If. If Joe Biden posted this picture, you know, that the right wing folks would be Losing their minds, especially if the White House posts it. And by the way, a lot of us would also be losing our minds. You'd be like, what are you doing? This is so immature. It's so childish. Like, please go fix real problems. See, this is, this is how propaganda works, right? It's such a distraction. We can't get livable wages in the country. We can't get affordable health care done. We can't get affordable education done. We have major issues in the country that need to be fixed. Right. And Trump is in the White House is posting that stuff and their basics. It's hilarious when it's just really a disrespect. It's a denigration of the Oval Office and everything that it claims represent. Right? And it's just we all, I mean, back in the day when Obama wore a tan suit, right wing media, oh, this, this is so disrespectful. This is denigrating the office. These people are jokers. Like, the right wing media world is not based on fact, it's based on propaganda and always maintaining their side being right. And this is the result. The result is you have people doing this. This is so stupid. It's, it is like a 13 year old boy runs this account and it's like a 14 year old boy runs our country. It's crazy, right? It's crazy.

[April]

Well, I think, I think that's part of when you grow up rich, which Trump did, you know, like he's, he's never had a day of where he was struggling financially. Like I, I do think when people go through a struggle, that matures you.

[Tim]

Yep.

[April]

You know, I don't know that Trump has ever gone through any sort of suffer. I mean, he claims the persecution of all his legal troubles, but that was literally just accountability. But I just don't think he's ever, he has never had to mature. He's never had to think about other people because, you know, he, his life was just handed to him on a golden platter. And this is the result. You've got men who are almost 80 still acting like, right? Like, and that's almost 80 years old.

[Tim]

Grow up, dude. Where's the wisdom? Like, like there is, there is a certain amount of wisdom that comes, you know, as you get older, Right. You have life experience, you learn things the hard way and you're able to hopefully impart wisdom on a younger generation. And this is who America decided to elect. Like, there's no wisdom here. There's no truth here. It's immaturity. It's dehumanization, and frankly, it's racism. Like Trump. And what he's doing, what this administration is doing, is just a continuation of white supremacy in this country. And it is ironic that he really posts this thinking that, yeah, guys, I'm part of the rebellion. Like, wow, you might need to see a psychologist for real. I don't think you. You see yourself accurately at all. And we should talk about that.

[April]

Yeah, well, and this was just two or three days after.

[Tim]

Yep.

[April]

The White House and Trump also shared an AI image of him as the Pope. Like, wow.

[Tim]

Wow. I mean, what do you say. What do you say to this, April? I mean, look, can we just take a time out for one second? They want this to be normalized. Right? Like, you think about. You think about how far Trump pushed things to the right. Trump got dinner with white supremacist Nick Fuentes and defended it. Right. These actions are just trying to normalize insanity. They're trying to normalize absurdity. And the more that people accept it, the more normal it becomes. Right? Normal is only normal because people accept it. We can never, ever accept this, ever. This is not normal. This is not okay. This is not anything that. That. That should represent people who hold office in our country. This is crazy. This is crazy. Joe Biden is a Catholic, and he would never do something like this. Trump is. He posted this. Trump posted this. Wow.

[April]

He also denied posting it, too. Do you have that. That video clip? He got asked about this because keep in mind, like, just context, too, one of, like, the Catholic Church just lost a beloved Pope, someone that they love. They're in the process of, you know, finding a new one. If some. Today they found one, we got to figure out who that is. But there's a lot of grief going on, and for him to post that, it's just really insensitive to some people who are really grieving right now, someone that they love.

[Tim]

And also for Catholics, the Pope is like a holy figure, as far as I'm aware. Like, very sacred. You know, like, this is a person who has major authority, who directs the direction of the Catholic Church, can make decrees that people have to follow. And also, most white Catholics voted for Trump, and Trump just mocks them. He just mocks them to their face by posting such a sacrilegious, blasphemous photo. And then this is. This is Trump's response to that, because obviously, Trump got some flack for it. He was asked by reporters, what do you think about Catholics being upset with you? And here's Trump Responding to it.

[April]

The image of you looking like the Pope.

[C]

Oh, I see. You mean they. They can't take a joke. You don't mean the Catholics. You mean the fake news media, not the Catholics. Loved it. I had nothing to do with it. Somebody made up a picture of me dressed like the Pope and they put it out on the Internet. That's not me that did it. I have no idea where it came from. Maybe it was AI, but I know nothing about it. I just saw it last evening, actually. My wife thought it was cute. She said, isn't that nice? Actually, I would not be able to be married, though. That would be a lot. I'd have. To the best of my knowledge, popes aren't big on getting married, are they? Not that we know of, no. No. I think it's a fake news media that, you know, they're fakers.

[Tim]

My question, though, sir, was about the.

[April]

Fact that it was put out on.

[Tim]

The White House account, even though it was AI generated.

[April]

It was a joke.

[Tim]

It was a meme.

[April]

Does it at all diminish the substance of the official White House account to.

[Tim]

Have it go out on.

[C]

Give me a break. It was just. Somebody did it in fun. It's fine.

[Tim]

Why is it fine? That's his response.

[April]

Somebody did it in fun. Also, the White House shared the screenshot from Trump's Truth Social account.

[Tim]

Yeah, it's right here.

[April]

That is Trump. Donald J. Trump's personal truth social account.

[Tim]

100%. And I'm trying to find. I have it pulled up.

[April]

He says, maybe it's AI. What do you mean, maybe it's AI?

[Tim]

Where is it? Oh, here, here. I have this. Here's the Catholic response, like, unlike what Trump said, that no one cares or Catholics don't care. The New York. New York State Catholic Conference tweeted, there is nothing clever or funny about this image. Mr. President, we just buried. Buried our beloved Pope Francis and the cardinals are about to enter a solemn conclave to elect a new successor of St Peter. Do not mock us. So, no, Catholics are not happy, Trump. But again, when you lie for a living and when your whole ethos and personality is based on lying and mocking and. And deflecting, this is the result, right? I mean, we shouldn't be shocked by this. This is how he's going to answer. But it's also, at the same time maddening to watch a man so. So boastful about his own literal stupidity, where he's willing to lie through his teeth, and we just have to accept it like, this is normal. No it's not normal.

[April]

Also, it's the same man who's trying to weed out anti Christian bias. And here he is literally mocking an entire section of Christianity, like one of the biggest ones.

[Tim]

Right, and why is that, April? Because anti Christian bias is code for white Christian supremacists. Like, they don't care about Christian bias. They care about white white Christian supremacists not being able to do white Christian supremacist things in the government.

[April]

Yeah, and, and just the outright lying and the gaslighting that, that's like one of the most aggravating things is he's so obviously lying. He lies all the time. All the time, but his base just believes him. They don't, they don't fact check. They take whatever he says as almost the word of God. I mean, truly, they, they act like he's this. I mean, we've even, we've played several clips in the past of people who have equated him to this Messiah, this God's chosen figure, to, to Moses, to King David, to now Darius, that. You'll see this coming up Monday, we do a deep dive into the Seven Mountain Mandate and we talk about the, the prophet prophecies around Donald Trump. Yeah, it's just, I, I don't under. It's so obvious from the outside. It's just very frustrating how people can't see it when it is so clear.

[Tim]

Yeah, look, we can play this game on their own terms. Right? This is for all the biblical worldview people out there that say that the Bible is what guides your moral compass. Proverbs 6, 16, 19. There are six things that got six things that God hates, a seventh mentioned as an abomination. These include a proud look, a lying tongue, hands that shed innocent blood, a heart that devises wicked schemes, feet that are swift in running to evil, a false witness who pours out lies, and someone who stirs up strife among friends. I cannot think of a better description for Donald Trump and how he behaves. He literally embodies everything that the Bible says God hates. I would love, I would just love for some consistency from these so called Christians who have a, have a quote unquote biblical worldview, who selectively minimize these verses and are never going to apply it to their commander in chief. I mean, it's just clear you don't need to, you don't even need to like ignore the Bible to make the argument that Trump is antichrist, that Trump is dehumanization, that Trump is everything that we're taught as Christians. April, you and I grew up in this conservative evangelical world. By their own standards, as a man, especially, Trump embodies everything I was taught not to be like as a man, literally everything. And somehow we're the crazy ones. You got to be kidding.

[April]

Yeah, but. But you don't have a picture with big muscles and a lightsaber.

[Tim]

True, true. You got me. You know, I'm trying to be. I'm trying. Look, I'm trying to be modest. I'm trying to cover the shoulders, okay? Like Jesus.

[April]

Yeah. Lust a woman. Lust. This episode is brought to you by principles.

[Tim]

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[Tim]

This episode is brought to you by Pacifico Here's a story you've probably never heard. Legend has it, decades ago, a couple surfers went down to Mexico in search of epic swells. But they found something unexpected instead. It was still crisp, lively and smooth. But it had nothing to do with waves. It was Pacifico, a delicious Mexican lager. It's like it was brewed to be discovered. Pacifico find your own way 21+discover responsibly Pacifico Clara Beer imported by Crown Import, Chicago, IL hi, my name's Simon and I'm in Sydney, Australia and I'm a monthly donor for the new evangelicals. I found the tne Instagram in 2021. I'd recently stepped down from my job as a pastor. I was beginning to find a real conflict between what I was beginning to believe about God and the world and the church and the evangelical spaces I was in. But at the time, it was really dark for me. I was really lonely. I was really isolated. I had so many questions, and finding a space where it was okay to ask questions and to share my thoughts and ideas and hear other people's ideas at the same time and just be able to connect with so many people that were going through similar things was incredible for me at a time when.

[April]

I needed it most.

[Tim]

Since then, I've been quite involved with the organization for a while. I was the moderator admin for The Facebook group. And now I've just started out on the New Evangelicals board. I would love to encourage you if you can make a monthly donation to the New Evangelicals. There's some great work happening, and particularly Project Amplify and the opportunity it has. So many voices to give, so many voices a chance to be heard. I know it's something I needed in my dark moments. It's something we're able to contribute to that can help other people as they begin to smell the fresh air outside that basement of fundamentalist evangelical spaces.

[April]

So another thing that happened in the last week is, oh, there's more. Oh, yeah, is there more? Is there ever not more? Trump did an interview, another one where he talked about. I mean, I don't know where you even want to begin. He was asked about how his tariffs are going to affect the economy because the, the tariffs are not a tax break like Caroline Levitt claimed in a press conference. They do not help the American people whatsoever. He, Trump has started this trade war for literally no reason other than he said he was going to do tariffs. So now he's doing tariffs. Although the tariffs are very wishy washy. It's like a wax on, wax off. Tariffs on, tariffs off. He changes every. Depending on the day. You don't know, is it 50% tariffs, double tariffs, triple tariffs, no tariffs, back on.

[Tim]

Anyway, I had a bad dream. 200% tariffs. I don't know.

[April]

Gosh. So anyway, so he went on Meet the Press, which is NBC, and was asked about it.

[Tim]

This, this whole segment we're gonna play here is wild. And before we do, friends, if you're just joining the live, first off, thank you. If you can give this video a like, it does not take any effort. It does not cost you anything. Just move your little finger over to the like button and hit it. That would be great because it tells YouTube that people are enjoying this video and it pushes us out to more folks. So that would be so helpful if you can hit the like button. But yeah, buckle up. And we're going to pause as we go along because there are several things that this man says. I do wonder, April, if he's mentally okay. There was a lot of talk about President Biden declining cognitively. And by the way, I think especially toward, especially towards the end, there's, there was a case to make of, like, I'm not sure if, like, he's really, you know, with it, how he should to be president. I think that that's a fair critique. I say the same thing towards Trump. Especially after hearing this. Okay, here we go.

[April]

Are you saying that your tariffs will cause some prices to go up?

[C]

No, I think the tariffs are going to be great for us because it's going to make us rich.

[April]

But you said some dolls are going to cost more. Isn't that an acknowledgement that some prices will go up?

[C]

I don't think a beautiful baby girl needs, that's 11 years old, needs to have $30. I think they can have three dolls or four dolls because what we were doing with China was just unbelievable. We had a trade deficit of hundreds of billions of dollars with China.

[April]

When you say they could have $3 instead of $30, are you saying you're Americans could see empty store shelves?

[C]

No, I'm, No, I'm not saying that. I'm just saying they don't need to have $30. They can have three. They don't need to have 250 pencils. They can have five.

[Tim]

Okay, what, what was that?

[April]

This man is rich.

[Tim]

Wow.

[April]

He has never lacked anything in his life. His children have never lacked anything in his life. This is the thing that is also so mind blowing is you have these everyday American MAGA citizens who are struggling, who think Trump is like them, and here he is saying you don't need 30 dolls. They could just get by with three. Like, that is so, like, what is he even talking about?

[Tim]

The man who brags about shitting in golden toilets thinks that the middle class doesn't deserve more than five baby dolls. Again, I just ask people, think about if Joe Biden says this, what would be the headline on Fox News? Big government, Big tyranny. Marxist Joe Biden, the radical left lunatic says that your kid doesn't baby dolls because they're too unaffordable. It's like, you know, it would just be like this whole. It would be this, it would be, it would be playing like a, like a merry go round on Fox News and Oann and all the talk radio hosts. Because Joe Biden, the radical leftist wants to control your life. And Trump just drops this, by the way, with no context. Like he just utters this after saying the tariffs are going to make us rich. Who is us who? If I was talking and I'm a little, I'm a little ranty today, April, I don't know why, but I'm going to go with the flow on this one. So forgive me for ranting, but, but, but I'm just saying, like, who is us? Who is getting rich off of these tariffs? I would love to ask anyone in the middle class who voted for Trump, where have you seen the so called riches that, that apparently America is saving with people with, with organizations like Doge apparently saving us from fraud and waste. How is that going back into your pocket? Have you seen an increase in your wages? Have you seen access to affordable health care? How has it benefited you? Like, it is such. It's actually a brilliant propaganda tool that people like Trump have convinced millions of folks that if these people get more rich, somehow they're benefiting. Like, who is us in the situation? It's crazy.

[April]

Well, it's. The rich get richer and the poor get poorer. And in Trump's mind, as long as he's doing fine, then everyone else has got to be doing fine.

[Tim]

Of course. Also, why pencils? Why can't I have 250 pencils? I want 250 pencils. Why can't I have them? It's a pencil.

[April]

What are we talking about in the lines here? I mean, you got to take everything Trump says with a grain of salt. Oh, yeah, that expensive and like on the scale of things that are pricey, pencils are low on the list.

[Tim]

Yeah.

[April]

And he's saying that you only need five pencils. Insinuating, like, yeah, you, it's okay. You may only be able to afford five pencils, but that's all you need. Same thing with the dolls, you know, like, oh, you may only need, you only need three or four dolls. That's all you're gonna be able to afford, but that's really all you need. Like, he's saying you're not going to be able to buy as much as you've been buying without saying that.

[Tim]

We're so back, baby. America is so back.

[April]

Literally, like, like controlling how many little dolls, little girls, little American girls have in America. That's literally. Like, you would see this, it reads like, like, do you remember in church when they would have like missions trips and they would be playing the little video to get people to donate or to go on the trip. It'd be like, look at these orphans in this third world country. They only have one doll. Like, we want to give them more. Like, and like they're struggling. Like that he's describing that's happening here now, which, I mean, it is already happening here. Like, with the, our poverty line, people are really, really struggling right now. And Trump, it's just, it's so frustrating. Like, Trump is not for you. He is for himself. He is for making himself richer. He does not care about the people that voted for him at all.

[Tim]

I don't know how people don't see this. It's clear as freaking day as. As blue as the sky. Whatever the sky is blue is. It's obvious this man doesn't give a flying poop crap about you. Duh.

[April]

Yeah.

[Tim]

Okay, we'll keep going.

[April]

You're basically saying there could be some.

[C]

Supply shortages to waste money on a trade deficit with China for things we don't need, for junk that we don't need.

[April]

Your Secretary of State says everyone who's here, citizens and non citizens, now we're.

[Tim]

Going to a second part. Mr. President, I don't know.

[C]

I'm not. I'm not a lawyer. I don't know.

[April]

Well, the Fifth Amendment sets.

[C]

I don't know, it seems. It seems, it might say that, but if you're talking about that, then we'd have to have a million or 2 million or 3 million trials. We have thousands of people that are some murderers and some drug dealers and some of the worst people on earth, but it's some of the worst, most dangerous people on earth and I was elected to get them the hell out of here. And the courts are holding me from doing it.

[Tim]

Okay, of course this is a lie.

[April]

But even given those numbers that you're talking about, don't you need to uphold the Constitution of the United States as President?

[C]

I don't know. I have to respond by saying again, I have brilliant lawyers that work for me and they are going to obviously follow what the Supreme Court said.

[Tim]

Okay, I mean, look, I feel like we're just screaming into the void, April, because Trump has been saying crazy stuff like this for years now, right? I only be a dictator on day one, all this stuff. And for some reason his base hears that and goes, no, this guy cares about the Constitution. He cares about America. He wants to make America great again. And now he literally says in direct response to a question, don't you have to uphold the Constitution? I'm not. I'm not sure. I don't know.

[April]

I don't know. How do you know you are President of the United States?

[Tim]

You took an oath a couple months ago that said to uphold and protect and preserve the Constitution. Like, the answer is yes, Trump, like, you are not God. You are not.

[April]

Maybe that's why a king didn't put his hand on the Bible. Oh, because he wasn't going to hold the Constitution.

[Tim]

Isn't it funny, though, how like all these right wingers are like Joe Biden and Obama tried to destroy America. They hate America. They hate the Constitution. And Trump literally says he's not sure if he has to follow the Constitution. They're like, wow, this guy's a true patriot. What are you talking about, dude?

[April]

Not to mention he's still defying a Supreme Court ruling to facilitate the return of Kilmar Abrego Garcia from El Salvador. Also notice, too, when she asks, don't everyone need due process? And he's saying, well, then we'd have a million trials. And some of these people are murderers. Some of these people do violent crimes. That means you are going to be deporting and sometimes imprisoning millions of people where only some have committed violent crimes, meaning that most are innocent. And that's what you need due process for. You don't want to be throwing innocent people who have committed no crime into a prison. You always have to go through due process.

[Tim]

That's the point.

[April]

People being here illegally or, you know, like, who are undocumented, that's not a crime. That is a civil issue.

[Tim]

Yep, 100%.

[April]

So you calling everyone calling undocumented immigrants criminals is just a blatant false misrepresentation of what is actually happening?

[Tim]

Yeah, yeah. Isn't. Isn't the phrase innocent until proven guilty in a court of law? Right. The reason why we have courts is to adjudicate, is this person guilty of what they're being accused of? And we look into evidence and we do all this research. That's how it works. How it doesn't work in this country because we're not. We're not ruled by a king and we're not ruled by a tyrant, supposedly, anyway. Is that by the wave of his wand, he just decrees random shit and takes those rights away from people that he doesn't like? Yeah, that's. That's not how it works yet. His base, that's what they want. And in April. This is a shameless plug for our series, that series that we're doing on Mondays about Christian nationalism. There is a logic to this. Christian nationalism does not like democracy. Christian nationalism does not want due process for people that they don't like. Christian nationalists do not like multiculturalism. So there is a rhythm, there is a rhyme. There is something behind what Trump is saying, and it should scare the hell out of you, because what it. What it equates to is a place where we're not ruled by. By law or by due process or by, you know, a fair trial or by three separate branches who all are intention for with who has power and who can do what. That all gets erased and a God king takes over who, you know, posts really awkward photos of himself as a Sith Lord and just does things to people that he doesn't like and rule. Promoted by the Christian nationalists who elected him. That. That doesn't protect other people, doesn't protect the marginalized. It is a recipe for freaking disaster. And that's what's happening right now.

[April]

Right. And if his concern is, well, then we'd have millions of trials, and we just don't have the capacity for that. Well, then slow down your deportations or just slow down.

[Tim]

Stop the courts.

[April]

Right. I mean, part of the reason they're in. They're making so many mistakes is because they're moving so fast and they're. They're. They're, you know, grabbing. They're literally just grabbing people off the street. They're showing up to people's court dates, which is just gonna keep people from showing up to courts. You know, they. They've. They've ruled that it's okay to go into churches, into hospitals and into schools, places that should be protected. Like, just slow down. Just do it the right way. And then. And then, like, you would. You would not be making all these mistakes a hundred percent. It's so also.

[Tim]

Oh, I was gonna say our government is literally kidnapping people. Like. Like, I don't know. I don't know how much clearer it gets. That's what fascists do. That's how fascism works. Like, we're kidnapping people off the streets who are here legally, who have green cards, who have student visas, who are legal US Citizens, and we're just deporting them against court orders.

[April]

Yeah. Not to mention. Not to mention there was a woman in Florida who was in ICE custody who died.

[Tim]

Yes.

[April]

While in custody. She was having chest pain. She had been there for two months. She clearly needed medical help. She was held there. She's 44 years old. Haitian woman died in ICE custody.

[Tim]

This, according to NPR, right here. That's right. Yep. And according to NPR, this is the sixth person to die in ICE custody since the beginning of the year, I believe is what. Yeah, six. Six other people have died in ICE custody since the start of the 2025 fiscal year, according to agency data, with half of those deaths occurring since January. And by the way, I. We actually. On the new evangelicals, YouTube and podcast. You can go check out this interview. I interviewed a family who was arrested by ICE and whose mother was put in a detention center illegally, by the way. We did a full deep dive. The conversation is so powerful, and it will help you understand how complicated and also how broken the immigration system is. And what he said, the son, I talked to the son, his name is Muhammad, he said that his mom was in a detention center, which by the way is owned by a third party. It's not, there's. These aren't government prisons or detention centers. They're owned by third parties who are making a lot of money. No air conditioning. There were women in there who had one month old babies. And what they would have to do is they would have to pump and then bring the breast milk to the family so that way the baby can eat and they had to share the same breast pump. That's the conditions of these places. They are not humane, they are not humanizing. They're the opposite. Simply because of what a random tyrannical megalomaniac says is illegal. Now, that's the only reason why these people are in these places. Not because they're criminals, not because they've done bad things, not because there's some kind of process they're going through, but simply because racist people who are in government are getting what they want, which is they want brown people out of the country. It's wild that this is happening right now in 2025America. And where are the white evangelicals? Oh, I know where they're at. They're at a 72% approval rating of Trump's first hundred days. They love this. This is pew research, by the way. I'm not making this up. 72% of white evangelicals approve of Trump's first hundred days. Think about how ultimately depraved you have to be to read these stories to see the fact that we are tearing families apart for no damn reason. And white evangelicals, the family, the party of family values and the nuclear family, go, Trump's doing a bang up job. Like, you wonder why we deconstructed. You wonder why we left your antichrist whitewashed tomb institutions? Because Jesus would be flipping over your freaking tables if he was alive today. It's ridiculous that we're here, but we are. And it is absolutely maddening.

[April]

Well, it's the, it's the. They make mountains out of molehills. They take a handful of stories and then apply it to entire groups of people, you know, and they claim there's all this violence coming through. But as we've discussed multiple times, you, U. S. Citizens are far more likely to commit violent crimes than undocumented immigrants. But they are focusing on the people who are not white. They're. It is, they're very racist. It's. And also, like, if you are a Christian, we. You are called to love all of your neighbors, not just your American neighbors, not just your white neighbors, all of your neighbors. And we are taught that every single human being is made in the image of God.

[Tim]

100.

[April]

And if you're. You're looking at families who have escaped really dire situations, who come here seeking asylum, and many of them are doing it through the right channels, doing it the way it's supposed to go as Christians, I mean, as human beings, but literally as Christians, we are taught that we're supposed to care for the least of these, that we're supposed to welcome the foreigner. And I cannot imagine looking at a family who came to this country seeking a better life for their children as a mom, myself, and then having Christians who are supposed to care about me and my family, deport me, put me into a prison, have me die, or, like, take my children away. Like, I cannot even imagine how inhumane you have to be to look at that and say, I approve.

[Tim]

I have no notes. April, you're completely correct. It is. It's despicable behavior. It is antichrist behavior. It completely defies the teachings of Christ to care about the orphan and the widow and the oppressed and the marginalized. There is. There are so many verses in the Bible. And again, we say that because we're trying to demonstrate that even by the evangelical Christian standards, this is a biblical idea. Welcoming the immigrant, taking care of the orphan, taking care of the widow, humanizing those who society says are not fully human. These are like core Christian beliefs historically, by the way. Right. It was the early Christians that were the first ones to touch people with leprosy, to try and heal them. Mother Teresa lived her whole life in Calcutta. Right. Reaching with the. Touching those and working with those who were considered undesirable. And in America, somehow Christianity has become the ones doing the oppressing. It's become the thing dehumanizing the immigrant. It's become the thing putting systems in place that are ripping families apart. It's gross. It's gross.

[April]

Yeah. It's absolutely disgusting. And we're going to continue to call it out because it's going to. It's going to keep happening. It doesn't seem to be slowing down. But I think we need to make these white evangelicals. We should. We need to make them uncomfortable. They need to know what they're supporting. I think. I do think part of the problem is they're not seeing the full story. If they're only watching Fox News, if they're only listening to Donald Trump or Caroline Levitt or their pastor, they're not hearing the full story. And I do think, you know, making sure that somehow that information gets to them and appealing to their goodness. Like, the good news is, is that people are changing. There are some people that are starting to wake up.

[Tim]

Yep.

[April]

You know, we were once in that Christian nationalist world. We woke up. So there is still hope. But, yeah, we're just gonna. We have to keep putting the pressure on. And we will.

[Tim]

100. We will.

[April]

Yes.

[Tim]

And thanks for your support. We're able to do it. So thank you for being here, friends, and for being live with us. And, I mean, honestly, I. I know that we. We were going live originally twice a week. It was just too much to prep for all that. But going live is one of my favorite things to do. I feel like we're all kind of in sync and having the same conversation. So it means a lot that you're here, because without you here, going live makes no sense. So this is definitely a tag team effort. So thank you for that.

[April]

Yeah. One other quick thing about Trump that I just want you all to be aware of.

[Tim]

You have gone down the rabbit hole on this one, April. We need a tinfoil hat for you.

[April]

Just like I'm putting on my tinfoil hat. Okay.

[Tim]

This is fair.

[April]

What me talking now is. This is conspiracy, April who? And for the record, I am not a fan of conspiracies. It's something that's been in the back of my mind for a while, but I don't. I don't want to put it out there. I just. This is something that Trump has said. He said it again May 1. He has said it a couple other times on video. Not a lot of people are talking about it, I think, because, like, we don't want to be what the right was back in 2020 with the insurrection and them claiming that the election was rigged and all of that. So I have an aversion conspiracies because of that.

[Tim]

Right.

[April]

But just remember that MAGA stormed the Capitol for far less than what Trump said this past May 1st. And I think this was at a prayer event, I think. But this was from May 1, like recently, like, yeah, a few days ago.

[Tim]

There we go.

[C]

You look at that. June 12, 1775. So we have a very, very special day coming up. You know, we have a lot of them during this term. And interestingly, I had none of them. Had I not had a rigged election, had the election not been rigged, I would have been out of here. I would have been gone. The radical Left would have said we got rid of him finally. But no, now they have me for another four years. We talk about that. And, and in the other four years, you know, he sort of said, I got the Olympics to come in and I got the World cup to come in.

[Tim]

Okay. Then he goes off some really random tangent because that's what he does. I mean, did he just admit that the election was rigged and that's how he won?

[April]

It definitely sounded like that.

[Tim]

I. I don't know what to say.

[April]

Listen, Trump said it. I didn't say it. Trump said it.

[Tim]

Oh, gosh. I. Look, unlike you, I am so hesitant of making accusations about a. Rigged. About a rigged election. Right? I'm like, so hesitant. And also when you say stuff like that, it's like, well, wait, did you guys do something? Did Elon Musk, like, the world's richest or. I'm sorry, I should rephrase. The world's greediest man on the planet. Did he have something to do with this? Like, like, did they pull some strings that we don't know about? Like. But again, I need data. I need hard evidence, and to my knowledge, I have not seen any. And I do not want to become the left wing version of Mike Lindell, the pillow guy. I don't want to do that. But it is weird.

[April]

He said it again back in March of 2025. He said, this is a quote. This is a Snopes fact check. This is a direct quote from Donald Trump. He said, and what happened is they rigged the election and I became president. So that was a good thing. Just saying. Just saying. I'm not saying it was. There's no evidence, but Donald Trump has said it from his mouth. All right, I'm taking my tinfoil hat off now. Just wanted everyone to be aware of this situation. I hope that there are some people up in high places that are investigating this situation.

[Tim]

Okay, so that's the Trump news.

[April]

Trump does say a lot of things. So, you know, you gotta take it with the. With the grain of salt. He does.

[Tim]

He lies all the time. So I don't have a lot of, like, reason to believe him when he says almost anything at this point.

[April]

Right. Like, you do have to take it with a grain of salt, but it is not the first time he said it. And it does, it does just make you go, huh?

[Tim]

Right. 100.

[April]

That's all I'm saying. Do not storm the Capitol. Don't do anything. Don't do that.

[Tim]

Yeah, right, right. We're not saying do not. Don't storm your Capitol building. Don't do anything violent. Just food for thought. Like just, just think about it. That's all.

[April]

But can you imagine if Joe Biden had said something like that?

[Tim]

Oh, I can, because if he did, it would be, it would be talked about. To this day, right wing media loves to let nothing go. They still talk about her, about Hillary Clinton's emails. Like what?

[April]

Yeah.

[Tim]

They still talk about Obama.

[April]

Yeah, they're obsessed.

[Tim]

Obsessed.

[April]

Okay.

[Tim]

By the way, just so you all know, I am currently live streaming the Pope stream. So once we know who the new Pope is, I will interrupt and cut to it and we'll resume our broadcast. Just so you all know, I am keeping eye on this. So.

[April]

Okay. Awesome. All right, our next story, which is also equally infuriating.

[Tim]

What is going on? God.

[April]

Okay, so if you haven't heard, there was a white woman who was at a park, a playground with her kid who accused a five year old black kid of taking something out of her diaper bag and then called this kid, to this kid's face, the N word.

[Tim]

Yep.

[April]

And Tim and I discussed it and we decided that we're not going to play that video. If you really want to see it, it, it's out there. We don't want to give a more, more platform to just outright racism because it is very triggering.

[Tim]

She is proud of what she did. Like, if you see the video, she is happy what she said. She, she doubles down the person say it exactly. Like it is very clear. This person wasn't like, oh my God, I made a mistake. It was like, no, I'm proud I said that. You know what? I'm gonna call you that word now. Like it's a very dehumanized, indisputable video. And frankly, it doesn't need more airtime. So that's why we're not, that's why we're not going to share it. Yeah. It is one of those things where you see it and you're like, wow, like that, that, that happens like that. That's a real thing in America. And again, like both of us, April, obviously were white. And so this is an experience that we do not have and that we don't really see in our world. Right. Because it's just not what happens. But seeing it on camera and seeing someone so defiant and so proud of, of this and owning it and saying, yeah, I don't give a crap that I said I'm gonna say it again. It's truly gross.

[April]

Yes. So a man filmed kind of after the initial incident happened, filmed it Confronted the woman was like, how could you say that to a child? We're talking about a child, a five year old child. And then the man who filmed it claimed to be to know the family of, of the kid, the black kid that this woman was antagonizing there. The family's from Somalia. And he said that the kid also is on the autism spectrum as well. So that's a lot. Like, I, I can't even. Like a 5 year old kid, I can't even imagine one just degrading someone else's kid in public. But using what I would say is like the most hateful word you could use against somebody. Especially giving the context of this country and how we have treated black people historically. For a white person to say that to a black child and then double down and then. So this goes viral, obviously, this video, because this is like un, like usually when you see racism today it's micro aggressions. It's from people who claim they're not racist and they don't see color, but they're still racist. You know, it's a more subtle race.

[Tim]

You know, black on black crime, things like that.

[April]

Right. Most white people, for the most part, I think, would say they're not racist. Like would admit that racism is bad even though they are. You know, it's the same thing with white evangelicals. White evangelicals saying they're not Christian nationalists, they're just Christians despite being Christian nationalists. Right. So the reason this goes so viral though is because this is so like blatantly obviously racist. Like there is no way you can get around the fact that this is just straight up racism.

[Tim]

Yeah. I mean, she literally says I called him that because that's what he is. Okay. It's gross. Like, it's, it's, it's, it's vile. It's just a clear case. It's a clear case of like, look, this happened and you're right, she went mega viral and then she decided to fundraise off of it because that's what we do in America.

[April]

Well, she claims that she was starting to get death threats and that as a result that she had been doxed. And so she felt like she needed to move. You know, she's got. So she made a fundraiser on Give Send Goal, Give Send Go.

[Tim]

Yep.

[April]

Which is a Christian site. Totally bt Totally a Christian site. I find it very odd that she set the goal at a million dollars from the beginning. Like, you don't need a million dollars to move. But, but she has raised a quarter of a million dollars so far.

[Tim]

No, she's raised $753,000 so far.

[April]

Sorry, yeah, three. I meant to say three quarters of a million dollars.

[Tim]

Yeah. I mean, is. Because that's what America is, right? Like, this is more money, by the way, than what's been raised so far for the child who was called that word by this person. They, I think that they raised about, I think close to, I think 400,000. I could pull up in a second here, but I. Yeah. And you see here, if you're watching this with us, you can see on the right, they have a recent donations and all says anonymous giver. That's because they had to turn this feature off because people were saying things like protect our own. Donated a hundred dollars.

[April]

Or using white lives matter.

[Tim]

White lives matter. Or, or, or reversing certain letters and certain words to still say the N word without saying the N word. Like it was, it was a blatant display of white, white American racism on full display. Raising this woman $753,000 because she's the victim. Remember, April? It's so ironic, right? Because the right will tell you how the left's always playing victim. They're always, they're always playing the victim complex. They're, they're, they have, they have a victim mentality. This is exactly what they do, right? This person Shiloh, did something egregious, did something horrible, said one of the most vulgar things that you can say in America. And instead of even owning it and admitting she was wrong, that she's sorry, she doubles down and says, no, no, no, I'm the victim now of all this and I need a million dollars. And white America says, no problem. Here's $753,000 to date.

[April]

Listen to how she words like, from her perspective, what happened, right? This is, this is what she writes on her own, like, fundraiser site. Hello, my name is Shiloh and I have been put into a very dire situation. You put yourself there. Okay, I re. I recently had a kid steal from my 18 month old son's diaper bag at a park. Context. An autistic five year old.

[Tim]

Look, can I just say, I have a 4 year old who's on the spectrum and even if he wasn't, he's a four year old. And they don't. They're learning. They're learning boundaries. They're learning what's theirs and what's not theirs. I've had my kid take someone else's toy. I've had my kid had his toy taken away by someone else. Like the Kids. He's. He's five years old. Like, he's five. A five year old doesn't even know that he's stealing something. Like, ridiculous.

[April]

Right then she says, I called the kid out for what he was.

[Tim]

Wow.

[April]

Again, the N word. Another man who was recently found out has had a history with law enforcement. Not sure how that's relevant, but I don't even know if that's true. Proceeded to record me and follow me to my car. He then posted this. These videos online, which has caused my family and myself great turmoil. Literally no regard for how much turmoil she's caused the black kid and his family. She says her social, Social Security number has been leaked. Her address and phone number have been given out freely. My family members are being attacked. My eldest child may not be going back to school. Even where I exercise has been exposed. I'm asking for your help to assist in protecting my family. I fear that we must relocate. I have two small children who do not deserve this. Blah, blah, blah. And then at the end, she says, we cannot and we will not live in fear.

[Tim]

Well, she's right about one thing. She has two children who don't deserve this because of her racist actions. Like, where's the accountability? Where's the. Where's the. Where's the, you know, pull yourself up by your own bootstraps, take responsibility for your life. Where, Where? Why doesn't that logic actually get applied to the people who espouse it? Because Shiloh did all of this. She literally did this. She doubled down while she was being filmed. She doubled down. She could have said, oh, my God, I'm so sorry. It was a huge mistake. I'm saying, you know, I'll do whatever I can to. Right? Yada, yada, yada, yada, yada. But no, she goes, no, that's what that boy is. That's what you are. Says the word again. And now she's, oh. Oh, guys. Oh, I've been under attack. Have you. It's like, have you seen that meme where it's like a kid with like a boot on his face?

[April]

Yeah.

[Tim]

And then you zoom out and it's his own boot. That's. That's what's going on here. But white America goes, oh, my God, one of our own being attacked. She's raised $753,000 so far. And the comments had to be turned off because they were so racist.

[April]

She is now profiting off of being a racist.

[Tim]

Totally.

[April]

She did something bad, learned nothing, is being rewarded for it.

[Tim]

Yeah, exactly. She's Going to become a millionaire for saying the N word. Think about that for a second. She's going to become a millionaire because she called a five year old child a child the N word and then doubled down on it. And a Christian website that says we want to be, we want to be just like Jesus, that has a Bible verse on their, on their about us page goes, yes, you can raise the money here. Yes, of course. No, absolutely. Raise the money. Yeah. You think that white America has a racism problem still. You think that white evangelicalism has a racism problem. Yes, but what are they going to say? Oh, we don't see color. No, it's just one bad apple. Oh my God. Like they just don't see it. They don't see it. That in America, this is the only place I know where you can be a blatant racist to children and make $1 million off of doing it. Jesus.

[April]

Well, and people have obviously called for the, the site gives and go to take down her fundraiser because of how racist it is. So the only thing they've done is they did they turned off the comments. One of the, I think is the co founder. Yeah, co founder James was in an interview where he said the clip of Shiloh went viral immediately there was backlash against her, I think somewhat rightly so, for the things she said. But then it moves beyond that. And he says cancellation isn't the way to move the narrative forward. It's actually the diversity of the ideas, even toxic hard ones we have to deal with. They bring the issue, the story to the front and then culture can start to wrestle with them in the open, where they should be. And then he said, someone asked him, like, well, does this go like it's. Are the allegations against Hendrix emulative of Jesus's teaching? And he said people can make claims about the teachings of Jesus all the time. Obviously Jesus called people to a higher place, to higher living. And the story and the message of Jesus from the very beginning is that humanity is broken and that Jesus is the only perfect solution for us.

[Tim]

I want to vomit.

[April]

That is also like the biggest problem with how white evangelicals handle racism is that it's not a systemic issue. It's not something that we can do anything about because it's a heart issue and only Jesus can change hearts. So there's really nothing that we could do about it. Like it's just, it's such a cop out to just continue to let racist system and racist people continue to harm black people, indigenous people and, you know, other people of color. Like it's it's just an excuse to do nothing.

[Tim]

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[C]

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[Tim]

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[C]

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[April]

Morning decisions A creamy mocha Frappuccino drink. A sweet vanilla, maybe a smooth caramel or that white chocolate mocha. Whichever you choose, delicious coffee awaits. Start your day with bottled Starbucks Frappuccino drinks. Pick up a bottle near you wherever you buy your groceries.

[Tim]

Also, maybe let's point something out here. I think this is an important part of the conversation. I believe. I know you do too, April. That anyone can repent from harmful behavior and turn and go the other way. Right? What Shiloh said is inexcusable, but that doesn't mean that she's irredeemable. She's a human being. People can change. People can acknowledge, yeah, I really did something egregious. I caused a lot of damage. Right? And she can take ownership and then start the healing process. And there's a path there. But it starts by acknowledging that what you did was wrong. And Shiloh, instead of doing that, doubles down, says, no, it's not wrong, and then cries foul when the Internet goes real hard after her. Right? Like real hard. Right? They, apparently they, they found her Social Security number. They doxed her. Okay, I get that. I know that's painful for anyone for sure. But also, you've taken no responsibility for your incredibly racist actions and you're raising a million dollars off off of it. So what that tells people is that you're actually not sorry, you're actually proud of what you've done. And now you're going to play the victim for your white wing, your right wing grifter base and become a celebrity in that world because you can't acknowledge that calling a five year old black child the N word is egregious and inexcusable. So again, it's not that people couldn't find a redemption story through Shiloh over time, but the fact that she can't even acknowledge her own mistake tells me, I'm going to keep holding your feet to the fire because what you're doing is causing so much damage. It's causing so much damage. And again, the fact that people have raised her $1 million is telling of the system and cultures that we live in, where those things are, are totally okay. And of course these people are not going to post their full Name, Right. The people who are donating to this campaign are going to use racist dog whistles or just straight up racist names or be anonymous and they're not going to say their full name because they know what they're doing is shameful and they should be ashamed of it, by the way. They should be absolutely disgusted for giving to this campaign.

[April]

And if you want to, if there's something practical that you'd like to do to help the family of the black kid that was called this N word, there's also a GoFundMe for that family that the local, the Rochester branch of NAACP put on. They've raised so far about $340,000, which is not nothing. I would personally love to see this one get more than the racist lady. A hundred percent, if there's any justice in the world.

[Tim]

The link is in the description on YouTube Friends right now. So if you scroll down, you'll see two, two donation campaigns. One is for the videographer because he posted how his life's been destroyed through this. We'll play that video in a second. And then one is for the child who was called this word. So you can donate right below. We made it really easy for you. I think this would be a good time to share his video, the guy who actually filmed this, so people can understand, you know, exactly the kind of backlash that he's getting for posting the video of the woman being racist. So here's what he has to say.

[April]

Hi, my name is Shermati Omar. I'm the guy who recorded that video.

[Tim]

Of the racist woman that was insulting a five year old child on the at the park here in Rochester, Minnesota.

[April]

May I remind you guys, I have a clean criminal record.

[Tim]

I've never committed a crime in my life. I am being punished for standing up, speaking up for a child.

[April]

My address got leaked, my phone got leaked.

[Tim]

I'm getting death threats by the minute. I have four children, the youngest one on the spectrum.

[April]

He needs to go play outside every day.

[Tim]

He can't anymore. So doing the right thing gets you.

[April]

Punished and doing the wrong thing gets you rewarded.

[Tim]

Make that make sense, America. There you go. There you go.

[April]

His GoFundMe also, it's also on GoFundMe and he's raised so far 45,000, $000.

[Tim]

So doesn't hold a candle.

[April]

And that is such a. His point too is he's being punished for doing the right thing, where that woman is being heavily rewarded for doing the wrong thing. I do think in general our culture could do better on the whole death threat front, you know, like, I don't think we should be sending death threats on either side. I mean, I've. I've received death threats before. Yeah, it's terrifying. It's terrifying. It's really scary. It's a. It's a scary place to be. And also, we've lost the whole idea of, like, being held accountable of, like, what accountability means of apologizing, of turning the other way, of. Of. Of caring, of empathy. Honestly, like, even if this woman felt that she was right, like, felt that she didn't do anything wrong, but learned that she directly harmed this little kid and this kid's kid's family and, And. And just caused a lot of trauma. Where is the empathy to say, like, I'm sorry that I caused that in you. Like, I'm sorry that you. You know what I mean? Like, April, basic human decency.

[Tim]

That is toxic empathy, okay? We all know that empathy is a sin. Where have you been? Don't you know the newest evangelical trend? Empathy is a sin. Empathy is toxic, okay? You can't be. You can't think about it like that. Like, look where it got us, okay? Like, yeah, you're exactly right. You're exactly right. I think we should go here now to Matt Walsh and Ben Shapiro. I think we should talk about that for a second just to kind of demonstrate how the right wing media is talking about this. And then, I mean, if you want to share the videos of that, you know, horrible, racist person on Piers Morgan, we can if you want, but, like, I'm not sure if we need to belabor the point. I'll leave it up to you. But I. I do want to share this. Where is it? Oh, still nothing from the Pope. By the way, I am watching the stream. I'm checking in. Nothing going on. All right, so. So this happens, right? Friends, we. We just shared the story. We obviously know what has happened. And Matt Walsh and Ben Shapiro both make a video. One says from Matt Walsh, how the Shiloh Hendricks case killed cancel Culture. And by the way, Matt, in a different tweet, I don't have it offhand, said that he wishes that Shiloh raises another, like, million dollars. Like. Like. Like he thinks that she should only raise more money off of this. And Ben Shapiro says, stop giving your money to crappy people. So Ben Shapiro is part of the Daily Wire. Matt Walsh is part of the Daily Wire. Obviously, there's a difference of opinion here, which is, I mean, I guess, kind of good for Ben. Although judging by the thumbnail, the guy on the left. I'm blanking on his name. Is it Carmelo Anthony? He is currently under investigation, has been arrested for stabbing a fellow classmate in the heart. Okay, now that's the thing. And right wing media has picked it up as like one of these, you know, oh, it's. It's a reverse racism crime. Details to be announced. We're still discovering what's going on there. But so Ben's trying to compare that and this as the same thing. So I still don't give Ben Shapiro a pass on it. But Matt Walsh in particular, I really. I want to zoom in on him because Matt Walsh has said some of the most racist things to date over the past year. In fact, I call him the grand wizard of 2025. This is a man who says that, you know, black boys are out of control and they're violent animals, which is. I mean, it's not even a racist dog whistle. It's just straight up racism. And he says that, you know, hey, Shiloh, Shiloh should be raising more money off of this. And I think it just demonstrates what many of us have been saying for a long time. Right wing media is a safe haven for racist people and racist ideas, whether they're dog whistle ideas ideas or whether they're directly racist ideas. This is what happens in the right wing world all the time, where this is accepted. Right? April, you and I are not true Christians because we affirm queer people and are fighting for our immigrant neighbor. But Matt Walsh, who can literally be a straight up racist, is welcomed in that space as a good Catholic man who is telling the truth how it is.

[April]

Yeah, no, I know it's. I do. I know it's wild because they don't. That that's my biggest problem too, with white evangelicalism is because you have pastors who maybe are not racist themselves, but racists feel comfortable going to those churches. Also, apparently the Pope's been announced. Who is it?

[Tim]

I'm looking. I. I don't know. I'm.

[April]

I know I keep refreshing my news and they haven't said, here, here's what I got. Oh, Robert Prev. Prevost. Prevost has been elected. He's the first American Pope.

[Tim]

It says this on the Internet. He's an American Catholic prelate who is the prefect of the. I can't pronounce these words.

[April]

Is he good? This CBS article says Provost is seen as a progressive on many social issues, but overall, many view. Many view him as a centrist.

[Tim]

I'll take it.

[April]

Hey, that's better. There were some Very right wing people that were in the running.

[Tim]

So 100. 100%.

[April]

Okay. We'll keep an eye on that.

[Tim]

Yeah, for sure. Okay. Yeah, that's great. Okay, cool. Well, that, that could be good. We'll see.

[April]

Doesn't sound like it was the worst decision.

[Tim]

So it doesn't sound like it's. Yeah, maybe it's somewhere in the middle. I don't know. We'll, we'll keep you all prized on that as, as we follow along this story. But yes, we have a new pope. That's great, great news. So.

[April]

And it's not Donald Trump.

[Tim]

Yeah. Soccer alert. Okay. All right. Anyway, where were we?

[April]

So we were going to talk about. So Lily Gaddis went on Piers Morgan. She. We don't have to play her if you don't want to.

[Tim]

Look, she's, here's the bottom line. She, she's literally an a self proclaimed race racist woman who brags about saying the N word all the time. To Piers Morgan. And to Piers Morgan's credit, he calls her an actual racist. I mean, you can go see the clip if you want online. I don't want to give that woman any more airtime. She's a blatant Christian. She's a trad wife. All we're trying to do is to demonstrate that right wing America has a serious racism problem. I know that's not news to most of our audience, but like, and they're Christians, like, I think this was so frustrating. April is like, as you and I deconstructed, we engage with new, for us, new scholars, right? Like Jamar Tisby, the Color of Compromise. And you start reading for the first time about like, the history of American evangelicalism and its legacy of racism. And you're like, whoa, I didn't know, like, how bad it was. I knew that there was racism in America, but I didn't know that my tradition was like, responsible for so much of it. And then you're told by evangelicalism that, well, we solved that, you know, with Martin Luther King Jr. And racism doesn't exist anymore. But that's not true. And all we're trying to demonstrate is that racism is alive and well and shocker alert, it's deeply embedded still in white evangelical media spaces. Right? Because let's face it, the audience of Matt Walsh, the audience of this woman, what's her name, Lily Gaddis. The majority is not atheist. They're not Buddhist, they're not Muslims. The majority is white Christians. Okay? That's, that's the kind of stuff that they consume and it is just absolutely despicable and discouraging and infuriating that white America, in particular, white Christian America, not only endorses racist policies like what Trump is doing to immigrants, but also gives up to a million dollars for a woman who blatantly calls a five year old the N word. That's all we're trying to say. It's despicable.

[April]

Yeah. Yeah. And I think it is fair to say that most white Christians probably would not say the N word and would condemn that.

[Tim]

Yep.

[April]

And also people that are overtly racist feel comfortable being in those spaces. And I personally, like, I, I think our knee jerk reaction is to say, well, they're not true Christians. You know, they're. They're not Christians. We shouldn't be calling them Christians because they're doing everything that is the opposite of what Christ called us to do. And while they're not following Christ. And I would agree with that. I do disagree with the saying that they're not true Christians because that's like a no true Scotsman fallacy. And when we say that, that it's almost like a cop out for us to. To rid ourselves of them. Like, well, they're not true Christians, so I don't need to worry about them because they're not actually part of our group, but they are part of our group and we have to call them out as such if we want to actually make change within our own faith tradition.

[Tim]

I don't have notes to give you. I agree. Like, yay. Co sign. I 100 agree with you.

[April]

All right, well, shall we move on to our final segment?

[Tim]

Oh, yes. Oh, I moved. I moved some stuff around on my computer and so it can't find the files that I had because I moved them and I have to find them in real time because I'm a big doofus. So do I have it here? I'll just do it this way. I don't have the singer today. I'm sorry. It's been a long couple days. Okay. But I do have this. Where is it? Where is it?

[April]

Here we Christian.

[Tim]

The thing didn't play. My bad.

[April]

Today we have for you. Her name is Jenny Weaver.

[Tim]

Oh, boy.

[April]

And for those listening on podcast, it is a video of. They're. They're in a church service. Her husband. They're hold. Her and her husband are holding hands and they are both chanting things. Her husband is in front of her and they're walking around holding hands. He's in the front. She's following. They're holding hands for context. Virginia Weaver, she is someone who claims to be.

[Tim]

Who is this?

[April]

She's someone who claims to be an ex witch. So she's very charismatic, very anti Halloween. She. She's also someone that has a kind of a tragic backstory. She was addicted to method. She's. I think she. I think she says she's had an abortion before. Like, she was, I think, been arrested in her past, like, before Jesus and her conversion. So it sounds like her life was not going well. She has this encounter with Jesus, and so now she's very anti, you know, witchcraft anti, but believes it's all real. Right. And I do think her life is better now. You know, obviously, she's not almost like ODing or anything. Like, there's something to be said.

[Tim]

We celebrate that.

[April]

Right, Right. I do think a lot of people who come from more tragic backgrounds who become Christian or. Or really join any religion or whatever can really get sucked into their way being like, all truth. Because for them, they have had a drastic life change, and they're putting that into this new belief system as after absolute truth because it's worked for them when in reality, I, I, you know, I think their life just got better. But that doesn't mean. Oh, that doesn't mean that their beliefs are true for. For everybody.

[Tim]

There is something to be said, though, and we talked about this off the air that I think is worth mentioning, that people can go from, like, leaving a tradition to kind of critiquing that tradition. I mean, that's what you and I do, you know, and that's what Jenny does. Like, she has a book out about, like, the problem of witchcraft. Right. I'm sure there's a psychological phenomena that happens, but there is a pattern. I've noticed with a lot of us were like, we grew up one way, we believed it wholesale, then we turned against it and didn't just leave it, but we started really critiquing it and exposing it for the problems that it has. And Jenny has done that too. But in this case, from witchcraft to this, like, evangelical charismatic theology.

[April]

Right. Which is still witchcraft. Totally a lot of similarities.

[Tim]

What is a fire tunnel?

[April]

Something different.

[Tim]

Manifesting. I mean, what is it? Bethel had that viral video where they manifested gold falling down. Like, it sounds like straight up Harry Potter or witchcraft stuff, but they use Christian terms, so it's all good.

[April]

Yeah.

[Tim]

Yeah.

[April]

Anyway, so that. That's some background over who is in our video for this week.

[Tim]

Yeah. And for those of you watch listening on podcasts, this audio might be a little hard to hear. So we'll unpack it afterwards, but just buckle up. This is very intense. Here we go. Your rightful place. Take your rightful place. Take your rightful place. Place. Take your rightful place. Take your rightful place. Take your rightful place. Take your rightful place. Take your rightful place. Take your rightful place. Okay, so what I gather from this is he's yelling, take your rightful place while leading his wife off stage, and she's saying, you lead, I follow. Is that right?

[April]

Yeah, she's saying. She's saying, this is the right order. He leads. This is the right order. He leads. So he's dragging her off the stage, and she's following while he's just going, take your rightful place.

[Tim]

Like, it's like tribal drums.

[April]

Basically, this is complementarianism, where she's saying, as the wife, she has to follow him, and he's being so, like, take your rightful place. It's so.

[Tim]

You know. You know what's funny? I'm not sure about how you and Beecher have always been, but even when I was still a conservative evangelical, I always found that idea of, like, well, Tim, you have to lead and your wife has to submit just gross. Like, I hated that word. I think it's just a gross idea. Because why, like, wouldn't. If we're married, wouldn't my partner have strengths that I don't have? And wouldn't I have strengths that maybe they don't have? And don't you want to kind of of do it together? Because there are things that Sarah does really well that I'm just not good at. And there are things that I do really well that Sarah's not good at. And at times she leads things. At times I lead things. Like, I don't want to always be leading. Like, that sounds exhausting. I don't want to do that. It's annoying.

[April]

Yeah, no, I, I, I never really bought into it either. I was kind of. I was always a little bit of a feminist. Even when I was in the nationalist world, I was like, no. Like, I love my spouse, but totally. They don't have, they don't have, like, automatic more authority than me just because they were born with different hearts than I was born with.

[Tim]

It just feels. It always felt gross. Even when I grew up in complementarian spaces, you know, I just didn't. I'm like, but why? Just because of their genitalia. Like, because of what's in between their legs, they can't do this thing. Like, I don't understand how that works. Like, especially. By the way, can I just say, this was really Reinforced after I watched my wife give birth the first time. I was like, why do we put women down? They're amazing. I dropped the F word here for emphasis. But truly, I was like. But I was like, dude, watching Sarah give birth to our first. I was like, first off, I don't use words like miraculous or holy these days, but that was all of the. That and above and more. Like, it was like a holy moment. But also, my partner just grew a human and gave birth to one. It had all 10 fingers, all 10 toes. Like, it was wild. And I'm like, wait, why do we put women down in society? Like, they are so freaking strong and. And, like, their bodies are unbelievable what they can do, and somehow I have to be the one who's in charge of all this. Like, are you kidding me? Like, I can't. I can't do what she just did. It was amazing. So, yeah, I never understood it.

[April]

Yeah. And like, they. You know, they obviously base it off the teachings of Paul, and it's where the whole umbrella graphic comes from, where you have Christ and then the husband and then the wife and then the children underneath the. The wife. But you know what's really been fascinating to me, though? I know personally a lot of pastors, wives, who would say that their husbands are the head. Right? Or just, like, a lot of Christian wives in general. Because I've gone to all the women's groups, like, and I knew the dynamics who claim that they are husband leads and they let their husband lead. But I know for a fact that woman is in charge of that marriage.

[Tim]

100%.

[April]

Yes, but they. But it's like this showmanship of, like. No, no, no. Like, even that joke, like, well, the husband is the head, but the woman is the neck that controls the head. Like, there's those jokes that happen all of the time where even the people that are pushing this belief aren't actually following it. I mean, a lot. I mean, to be fair, there are people that do, and there are a lot of women in abusive and oppressive marriages because of this belief system. But I also know there are a lot of people that push this belief system that aren't actually following it themselves.

[Tim]

I was really fortunate because I grew up witnessing a really healthy marriage. My parents always had a really strong marriage. They. They rarely ever fought. They were always connected. And they would say, like you said on paper, that my dad leads and my mom follows, but my mom runs my dad's business. Like, she keeps everything together, you know? And, like, it's evident to me that, like, in action. They actually live very egalitarian. My mom does a ton of stuff and in many ways leads things, and my dad follows and finds vice versa, you know, and so I agree with you. Like, I have noticed that too, where there is. And again, to your point, there are many women who live in horrible marriages because of this misogynistic patriarchal view of headship and stuff. So I'm not saying this doesn't happen, but in my experience, in my. In my world, my parents would say that, but they lived very egalitarian in practice. And honestly, I think that's part of why their marriage is so great to this day. I think they just celebrated did 38 years of marriage, and it's like, yeah, I get it, because you guys really are a team.

[April]

Yeah.

[Tim]

It's not like my dad rules over his roots. My mom's like, oh, whatever you need, you know, that's not how they operate. And I think that's part of why their marriage is so healthy.

[April]

Yeah. And just to be clear, if. If that situation works for some people and they want, like, people want that trad life, you know, the more traditional wife, like, more power to you. The problem with clips like that is you are now taking your beliefs and saying, everybody needs to do this totally. Every woman, you know, and it goes. It's. It leads into Christian nationalism, upholding the patriarchy, where people want, you know, household voting, where the wife doesn't even get to choose who they vote for because they have to vote for who the husband says. Like, it is all interconnected. But the problem is, again, like, you can't do that because it goes against my beliefs versus I won't do that because it goes against my beliefs.

[Tim]

And therefore, the country and government has to reflect these values. Right? Because you're right. I mean, marriage is. We're both married to amazing people. Right. We have amazing partners. And my marriage probably looks very different than your marriage does. And that's fine because you're different people. Right. Like, I know people, for example, where the wife really handles finances. In my situation, Sarah's like, I don't want to think about money. Just handle the finances and let me know if we're good or not. Like, great can do. Right. I would never want to be like, well, a godly marriage is. Is where I like how I live is prescribed for everyone else. That makes no sense. This. This is flexible stuff. So I totally agree with you, April.

[April]

And we're the exact opposite. I handle all of our finances.

[Tim]

That is hilarious.

[April]

But Beecher does. Beecher does all of our cooking because they're actually a really good cook. And I always like over cook things or that's funny things, me.

[Tim]

And neither of us are the best cooks, but Sarah just tends to by necessity do more of the cooking because usually I'm doing work like during the day like this and she's, you know, doing different types of work that's more towards, you know, like, I don't know, food shopping, things like that. So yeah, it is funny that we have such different marriages, but it works. I love it, you know.

[April]

Yeah. And everyone should do what's, what's best for them. Just stop dictating what other people should do and let people.

[Tim]

100%. 100%. So. Wow, what an episode. April, we got through a lot today and a new pope was elected during the stream.

[April]

I know it was because of us.

[Tim]

I would agree. And don't forget, friends, we broke it here first. No one else in America covered this story like how we covered it.

[April]

Wow. Breaking news. Yeah. So join us Monday too. We have a new episode dropping Monday where we do a deep dive into the seven Mountain mandate.

[Tim]

Yeah.

[April]

Which is will be a fun time. So. And then join us again next Thursday.

[Tim]

I would love your thoughts. Friends, if you're listening to this or watching just what you think about the direction of the channel so far. I know we kind of changed things up after our break. Honestly. We've got gotten great feedback over the deep dives on Christian nationalism, so we want to keep doing those and there's a whole universe of topics that we can cover. But we really do take your feedback seriously. So we're always thinking about ways to do this better and to engage you guys better to kind of build something on the Internet that is just a little bit different, you know, I don't know. We're always trying to do things that are unique and hopefully educational and fun and kind of here for you as we navigate the next four years. So let us know in the comments. You can always email us the Tim and April show atthenew evangelicals.com with your feedback. Always open to hear it. And also one last thing. We are experimenting with an idea. I tried it on TNE yesterday. We're calling Tim and April After Dark, which would be. Yeah, that sounds, you know, you know.

[April]

We gotta change DNA as our initials.

[Tim]

You know, I, I that those words came out too soon as I, as I said them, I'm like, wait, that doesn't sound right. It makes more sense for T and E After Dark. But we're working on thinking about maybe a once a month segment where we go live late at night, we order some food a little more casual, and we just. We just respond to crazy or weird Christian that we couldn't get to throughout the month just to kind of do something a little more light hearted so we can all kind of relax, unwind from a long day. We'll keep you posted.

[April]

Yeah. And then also, we just shared in the chat too. There's a Google form if you have story ideas or if you see weird Christian beep throughout the week. You can submit that there too.

[Tim]

Awesome. Love it. All right guys, have a good day. Enjoy this outro. It's a special one. Bye. Sam.