30. Feed Thy Neighbor to the Alligators: Christian Nationalist Cruelty Grows

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Tim & April Show – Episode 30: "Feed Thy Neighbor to the Alligators: Christian Nationalist Cruelty Grows"

Release Date: July 4, 2025
Host/Authors: Tim Whitaker and April Ajoy
Produced by: The New Evangelicals

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Introduction and Context

From the outset, Tim Whitaker (01:13, 01:16) and April Ajoy express their profound dissatisfaction with the current socio-political climate. Both hosts convey a sense of frustration and anger, setting a raw and unfiltered tone for the episode:

• April Ajoy (01:16): "I'm not happy today. I'm not happy."
• Tim Whitaker (01:20): "You're not?"

Their candid admission establishes an atmosphere of urgency and concern as they delve into pressing national issues.

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The Big Beautiful Bill and Its Implications

A significant portion of the episode focuses on a controversial legislative proposal referred to as the "big beautiful bill." Tim and April dissect its multifaceted impact on American society, particularly highlighting its adverse effects on Medicaid, national debt, and wealth distribution.

• Impact on National Debt and Medicaid Cuts:

  • Tim Whitaker (05:31): "This will increase our national debt by $3.3 trillion over 10 years, one of the biggest budget increases in recent American history."
  • April Ajoy (10:00): Challenges President Trump's claims, noting inaccuracies in the White House's portrayal of the bill's fiscal impact.

• Wealth Redistribution:

  • The hosts explain how the bill disproportionately benefits the wealthy through corporate tax breaks while severely cutting Medicaid funds.
  • April Ajoy (12:52): "The top 10% will see up to a $12,000 increase in their resources, while the bottom 10% could lose nearly $2,000 per household."

• Political Maneuvering and Christian Nationalism:

  • Tim Whitaker (05:31): Discusses House Speaker Mike Johnson's Christian nationalist stance, comparing himself to Moses.
  • April Ajoy (07:02): Criticizes Johnson's role, stating, "This is the Christian nationalist way," and emphasizes the hypocrisy in their policies versus Christian teachings.

Notable Quotes:

• Tim Whitaker (02:28): "If this bill passes, it's a total nightmare for the poorest in our nation."
• April Ajoy (12:52): "This is the opposite of what Jesus taught us. It is a real photo, friends. They actually prayed over the bill as they were preparing to vote for this action."

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Public and Religious Opposition

The episode highlights resistance from within religious communities, particularly emphasizing a letter from conservative Catholic and Protestant leaders condemning the bill.

• Conservative Faith Leaders' Stance:
  • April Ajoy (19:26): References an open letter describing the bill's passage as a "moral failure" for American society.
  • Impact on Vulnerable Populations: The letter warns of Medicaid cuts leading to 50,000 preventable deaths annually, based on Congressional Budget Office (CBO) analyses.

Quotes:

• April Ajoy (19:26): "The passage of this bill would be a moral failure for American society as a whole."

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ICE and Immigrant Detention Centers ("Alligator Alcatraz")

A significant segment discusses the establishment of detention facilities colloquially dubbed "Alligator Alcatraz," critiquing their inhumane conditions and underlying motives.

• Allocation of Funds and Reality vs. Propaganda:

  • Tim Whitaker (21:27): "80 billion dollars are being allocated to ICE, funding more agents and the border wall."
  • April Ajoy (40:16): Shares personal anecdotes and stories of immigrants like Muhammad, whose family faces prolonged detention due to systemic inefficiencies.

• Immigration Statistics and Misconceptions:

  • Tim Whitaker (43:16): Highlights that only 8% of deportations involve individuals with violent convictions.
  • April Ajoy (51:09): Criticizes the narrative that predominantly portrays immigrants as violent criminals, citing a study where "four out of five immigrants at risk of deportation are Christian."

Notable Quotes:

• April Ajoy (23:45): "It's not about being a Christian; it's about maintaining white Christianity."
• Tim Whitaker (43:16): "Only 8% of the deportations done by ICE so far are from anyone convicted of anything violent."

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Audience Engagement and Emotional Responses

Throughout the episode, Tim and April engage with their audience through Super Chats, expressing solidarity and sharing personal emotional burdens tied to the discussed issues.

• Emotional Reflections:
  • Both hosts share heartfelt concerns about the impact of policies on families and children.
  • April Ajoy (62:59): Describes waking up to her child crying for a parent potentially detained, underscoring the human cost of such legislation.

Quotes:

• Tim Whitaker (69:00): "One of the worst things you can do is to rip children away from their mom."
• April Ajoy (73:17): "This is hell on earth. Congratulations, Christians, you've proved to me that hell exists."

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The "Weird Christian" Segment

Transitioning to a lighter yet still critical segment, Tim and April address a church announcement featuring a pastor promoting the giveaway of AR15 rifles during Independence Day celebrations.

• Critique of Gun Culture in Churches:
  • April Ajoy (84:02): Expresses disbelief and frustration: "He's promoting an AR15, the weapon of choice for school shooters, as part of a church event."
  • Tim Whitaker (86:38): Highlights the incongruity of a pastor endorsing such weapons, given Christian teachings against violence.

Notable Quotes:

• April Ajoy (84:47): "The role of a pastor is to shepherd people. How does giving away an AR15 fit into that?"
• Tim Whitaker (87:28): "These are people who want to shepherd the flock, but how do you reconcile that with promoting weapons of violence?"

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Final Thoughts and Call to Action

In their concluding remarks, Tim and April encourage listeners to take actionable steps against the proposed bill and support their ongoing efforts to combat Christian nationalist policies.

• Encouragement to Act:

  • Tim Whitaker (82:00): Urges listeners to "call their representatives and demand a no vote on this bill."
  • April Ajoy (89:15): Announces organizational changes, introducing Melinda Hale as the new executive director of The New Evangelicals, and emphasizes continued commitment to the cause.

• Closing Emotions:

  • The hosts express a blend of despair and hope, acknowledging the challenges ahead while reinforcing the strength of their community.

Notable Quotes:

• Tim Whitaker (89:58): "We're on the right side of history."
• April Ajoy (92:27): "It's a reciprocal relationship, and we really appreciate you all being here and being part of the show."

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Conclusion

Episode 30 of The Tim & April Show delivers a potent mix of political critique, emotional storytelling, and community solidarity. Tim Whitaker and April Ajoy passionately address the dangers posed by Christian nationalism, the detrimental impacts of specific legislative actions, and the moral contradictions within religious communities supporting such policies. Through personal anecdotes, data-driven analysis, and engaged discourse, the hosts call upon their audience to recognize these issues and take meaningful action to uphold compassion and justice.

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Notable Quotes Compilation

• April Ajoy (19:26): "The passage of this bill would be a moral failure for American society as a whole."
• Tim Whitaker (12:52): "This is the opposite of what Jesus taught us. It is a real photo, friends. They actually prayed over the bill as they were preparing to vote for this action."
• April Ajoy (23:45): "It's not about being a Christian; it's about maintaining white Christianity."
• Tim Whitaker (43:16): "Only 8% of the deportations done by ICE so far are from anyone convicted of anything violent."
• April Ajoy (73:17): "This is hell on earth. Congratulations, Christians, you've proved to me that hell exists."
• April Ajoy (84:02): "He's promoting an AR15, the weapon of choice for school shooters, as part of a church event."
• Tim Whitaker (89:58): "We're on the right side of history."

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Call to Action

Listeners are encouraged to:

1. Contact Representatives: Urge their elected officials to vote against the "big beautiful bill."
2. Support The New Evangelicals: Engage with the organization through donations, purchasing merch, and spreading awareness.
3. Stay Informed and Active: Join the community's efforts to combat policies that harm the least of society and uphold Christian values of compassion and justice.

For more information and to support the cause, visit The New Evangelicals' merch store and follow their Instagram.

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This summary captures the essence and key discussions from episode 30 of The Tim & April Show, providing an insightful overview for new listeners.

Transcript

[Tim Whitaker]

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[April Ajoy]

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[April Ajoy]

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[Tim Whitaker]

You're listening to a new evangelicals production, the Tim and April show where we unravel faith, politics and culture.

[April Ajoy]

Hi.

[Tim Whitaker]

Hello.

[April Ajoy]

I'm not happy today. I'm not happy.

[Tim Whitaker]

You're not?

[April Ajoy]

No, no, no. Everything sucks. I'm ranty today. I'm feeling it, April.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah, me too.

[April Ajoy]

Sorry. Let me try it again. Hi friends. Welcome to the Tim and April Show.

[Tim Whitaker]

I'm Tim Whitaker and I am April Ajoy.

[April Ajoy]

Yes, we're live right now if you're listening on podcast on Friday. Welcome into the show, friends. Good to have everyone here. We go live every Thursday at 12 o' clock on YouTube and we drop a pre recorded episode every Monday. That's that drops on podcast and YouTube as well. Yeah, April, I'm just not happy. I mean, why even banter, why even pretend that we're somehow in a good mood when we're not? We're just not.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah, it's, it's been a heavy week. There's a lot of, there's just a lot of crazy things, bad things happening. You know, when I went to bed last night, I thought that the big beautiful bill was going to fail because five Republicans voted no on it and the time had run out for the vote. But of course Mike Johnson was like, no, we're going to keep it open. And I guess they wheeled and dealed all night long to get it.

[April Ajoy]

I don't know. Look audience, if you're watching this live right now and you are commiserating with me in April, please give this video a like that would help us know that we're not alone. I, I, I don't know about you, April. I have been, we say this, I feel like we're, we're almost, I, I feel like I almost sound like a broken record. But doing this work for several years and I'm still surprised at the level of depravity that I find in the Christian nationalist space every day. Like, there's always. I always think to myself, this is the, this is the bottom right. Okay, we've reached the bottom of the barrel and. No, we just haven't. Like, we have. Not every day is a new thing where I go, how do Christians, people claiming to follow the risen Christ that was murdered by the empire, how do these Christians think that they're somehow in line with that, with that Messiah? I do. It blows my mind.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah. It's increasingly just upsetting and I will say so. We are monitoring. The bill has not been passed yet. Yet. But as we are live, they. I think Hakeem Jeffries is still speaking to Delay. Yeah, he's still going to try to get those Republicans that flipped from no to yes, I guess to give people time to pressure them to go back to no, which is something that we could do. You know, you can. I've been commenting on their Instagram post to say please vote no. Who knows? Anyway, but we're keeping tracks on it. So if it passes while we're live, we'll. We will let you know. So Mike Johnson seems confident it will pass. They flipped some no's overnight and have been pressuring people, which honestly can't just say seems unfair. If you get everybody to vote and it fails, you shouldn't be able to just keep it open and just bully people to change their vote.

[April Ajoy]

I don't know. I don't know. I. Yeah, I mean, look, by the time this drops on podcasts on Friday, it's probably going to be passed. And so we can just pretend that we're all lamenting now because it seems like it's inevitable. I mean, never say never, but yes. In the middle, when I went to bed, the reports were, hey, great news. The GOP does not have the votes to pass this thing. I Woke up at 4 o' clock in the morning because our youngest woke up. He was crying for his grandma. He calls her Nina. Ag said a bad dream. So I checked my phone and, and then I saw that, nope, it turns out they had the votes and people have flipped and that they're going to try and get the, the procedure going and that they should vote, vote on this by 8am and it seems like Hakeem Jeffries right now, who's on hour number seven as of this recording, is essentially just stonewalling. What seems to be the inevitable. But I don't know. I don't know if there are things happening behind the scenes. I do not know. But most likely this bill will get passed. Yeah.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah. As of four minutes ago on cnn, Mike Johnson said he estimates there's one or two GOP holdouts still, that he hasn't slept, but he seems confident that they, that they have the votes.

[April Ajoy]

I do think we need to really highlight here that the people in charge of the House, Mike Johnson, is a Christian nationalist. This is not just a moderate GOP or this is not, you know, a centrist. This is not your George Bush era Republican. This is someone who literally has said that he sees himself as a Moses being sent into government to do the work of the Christian nationalist agenda. This guy partners with far right Christian orgs, prays over the Capitol. I mean, this dude downplays the insurrection. He's as Christian nationalist as you can get. Do not let his calm demeanor come convince you that somehow this guy is not dangerous. And we are seeing exactly what the Christian nationalist agenda wants. Because this, this so called big beautiful bill, I would have, I have other words for it is the opposite of that. It's a total nightmare of a bill. It's a total nightmare.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah, well, and Mike Johnson, even he's, he thinks very highly of himself too. When he was first voted in as the speaker of the House, you know, he compared himself to Moses for like such a time as this, which is infuriating because you know what, should we, should we, should we just get into the bill?

[April Ajoy]

Wait, April, I have to bring something up. Can I talk about something on the air? And I. Sorry, I did this too. You know, I just said a minute ago that he compares himself to Moses. Right?

[Tim Whitaker]

No, I'm sure you did say that.

[April Ajoy]

I did, I did. I'm like, you know, I bet you were reading something. I knew it. I knew it. No, no, don't be sorry. I'm just, I'm pointing it out because we are kind of in the moment, trying to catch up and prep and like, I'm pulling things, so I'm sure I've done that too, where you're talking. I kind of am distracted. And I, I said the same thing that you said.

[Tim Whitaker]

I know, so funny, because you're good, you're good.

[April Ajoy]

I'm just giving you a hard time, but yes, exactly.

[Tim Whitaker]

The dude has compared himself to Moses.

[April Ajoy]

It truly does. It truly does. But yeah, I think we should get into this so called big beautiful bill and talk about it a little bit and kind of what's in it, because there seems to be two narratives here. One is the narrative of, of the Trump regime and their propaganda, and the other narrative is the data of what like all the think tanks, bipartisan ones are saying by just reading the bill what the outcome will be.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah, yeah. So I think it's important that there are things that the Trump administration and Fox News and right wing media are saying about the bill that is true, like no taxes on tips, no taxes on overtime. They're permanently extending the Trump's 2017 tax cuts. All of that is true, at least for temporary. It's. They're not permanent on the overtime and the no tax on tips, it's is temporary. That is in there. And those are, you know, those are positive things. There's nothing wrong with that. But what is not being said in right wing spaces is that this will increase the, our national debt by, I think it's like $3.3 trillion over 10 years, which is one of the biggest budget increases that we've seen in recent American history. Which is problematic for multiple reasons because one, we're in so much debt, I don't even know how you get out of that. But Republicans, at least historically conservatives have been the people that want fiscal responsibility that have been pushing to, you know, decrease the deficit and to lower our national debt. And Donald Trump campaigned on that. That was one of his big things, was that we're going to cut government waste, we're going to lower our national debt.

[April Ajoy]

Right.

[Tim Whitaker]

And I want to point out he is still saying that this bill cuts the national debt. There's a White House article that, and the headline says the one big beautiful bill slashes deficits national debt while unleashing economic growth. That is just a blatant lie. It does not slash the national debt at all. It increases it.

[April Ajoy]

Wait, wait, April, are you saying that that Trump is not telling the truth, is that. I don't know if I could believe that. That man is known to, to be a straight shooter. He's a true teller, April.

[Tim Whitaker]

Right. Which is why there are Republican holdouts like Rand Paul. I have issues with Rand Paul, sure. But at least he has some principles. And his principle is don't increase the national debt, which is why he voted against the bill in the Senate. He, he and a handful of other Republicans. You know, and props to the Republicans who voted no on this because as you seen, the current GOP has become pretty much just a cult of personality. It's not actually about policies that these people believe in. It's about making one person happy. And that one person is Donald Trump. And here is why Donald Trump wants this bill to be passed so hard.

[April Ajoy]

Tell the people I'm ready.

[Tim Whitaker]

Listen, this Wealth. This is one, this is the biggest wealth distribution from the lower class to the upper class that we have ever seen in one bill. There's, there are plenty of graphs on this, but it also cuts. So it'll cut. It's like 800 some billion dollars in Medicaid. Yeah, cuts to Medicaid. $900 billion. Right. That are going to be cuts to Medicaid. That is taking money away from the poorest in our country. Taking money away from people who really, really need that, need that healthcare, need that money and that support. And they're almost, almost an exact amount of money that they're taking and then giving to corporate tax breaks. The richest, the rich, the billionaires, the multimillionaires, the richest of our country are going to be getting a $910 billion tax break that they're pretty much just taking from Medicaid.

[April Ajoy]

Yep, yep. That's a hunt. You're completely correct. That's right. And by the way, Medicaid is something that my kids use in New Jersey. It takes care of their health care, which is amazing. And to watch Trump, by the way, we actually have a little montage here just to disapprove it. You know, Trump, you know, once again, the great truth teller. Here's just a few clips of him talking about how they were never going to touch Medicaid with this new bill. Medicaid, we're not going to do anything with that. Medicare, Medicaid, none of that stuff is going to be touched. We're not cutting Medicaid. We're not changing Medicaid. Here's what I want on Medicaid. We're not touching anything. Just as I promised, there will be no cuts. It won't be read my lips anymore. We're not going to touch it. Well, there you go. And I think what is again just so telling is that these, this is the Christian nationalist way. Right. I mean, you think that, that, that the words of Jesus about taking care of the least of these, taking care of the sick, clothing, the naked, you know, feeding the hungry.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah.

[April Ajoy]

That they would take the heart and that and that. And that would influence how they thought about public policy. But for them, right. The imaginary verses that verses that talk about abortion. Side note, none. There's like nothing that talks about abortion. Somehow that's a biblical worldview. But all the verses that talk about taking care of the poor and least of these have absolutely no impact on how they think about, you know, pushing through federal, federal policy. Ironically, it's actually the opposite. Right. Because like you said, not only does that happen, I have another graph here. This is from the cbo, the Congressional Budget Office. This is a very much a nonpartis organization that Congress uses point blank for any kind of, you know, impact with different kinds of bills. They measure all kinds of stuff. This chart, essentially what it's showing is that the, it's showing the average annual change in resources per household if this bill gets passed. And for folks who can't see it, I'm going to just summarize it really easily. The bottom, lowest percentage of Americans, the lowest and second and third tier, right, they would actually lose resources per household at a rate of almost $2,000 or, or more. And the, the top bracket of our society would see an increase of up to $12,000 in their change in resources. So this literally does take from the poor and redistributes that wealth to the wealthy. That's what this bill does. And this is this again, I want to be clear. This isn't my opinion. This isn't some left wing think tank. I'm not pulling this from, you know, David Pakman. This is from the Congressional Budget Office.gov they're just doing the analysis. Sharon says so a good friend of the show talks about this on her stories. Essentially what she says is that you can see that the top 10% will see the biggest benefits while the lowest 10% will lose money under this plan. And she goes on to say what I just said, that according to cbo, which is a nonpartisan service used by members of Congress who need to have the effects of their legislation analyzed, people in the lowest 10% of income levels will see a reduction in their household resources. That's between access to government programs, SNAP benefits, Medicaid benefits, et cetera. So this bill that is being jammed through our legislature because of Christian nationalists, because of people who insist that we're a Christian country, right. They are literally looking to steal from the bottom, which already is so limited in resources, and redistribute that money to the top. It is, it is the opposite of Rob. It's the opposite of what Jesus taught us. It is, I mean, James 5, right? Is this warning, is this damn, this damning warning a woe to you rich people who hoard wealth because it's rotted? And you'll be, you're and it's the whole chapter is so. Or the whole section is so damning it essentially says woe to you who steal wages from the poor and hoard wealth at their expense. And these Mike Johnson type Christian nationalists instead of what they do. And this is a real, this is a real photo, friends. They actually prayed over the bill as they were preparing to vote for this action. This is from Benny Thompson. He's a, I think a congressman or a senator. And he took this picture with, with a caption. Praying in the House while preparing to vote away benefits for seniors, children and the sick. Hypocrisy at its finest. Yeah, I'm pissed. I'm pissed.

[Tim Whitaker]

It is so infuriating. And then especially when you see how much money they're adding to ICE and the border wall and, and just for, for hiring more ICE members, which we'll get into that because we are going to talk about Alligator Alcatraz in a little bit. But I want to, I do want to point out like this is a lot of people upset on both sides, including a lot of Republicans, which you saw, not enough. But some elected Republicans have voted no. There were five holdouts last night that were going to let the vote fail. So I think three. If three flip, the vote fails. We only need three in the House. But I wanna point out there were last week there was a letter from a bunch of interfaith Catholic bishops, some Protestant ministers and nuns. We're talking like conservative pro life Catholics here that have written an open letter condemning the bill and asking their senators to vote no on it. And for the similar reasons that we said is one of just how terrible this bill is going to be for the poorest in our nation, for the least of these, for the elderly, for the disabled, for children. They said too that analysts have said that the cuts to Medicaid alone, which is health care for underprivileged people, that over 10 years could be as much as $880 billion that would strip health care from as many as 16 million Americans that just won't have health care anymore. And that doesn't even include people that their premiums will increase so much that they can't even afford to have their health care. But that alone, the stripping of the health care alone, this is what analysts say could lead to about 50,000 preventable deaths each year. I believe that 50,000 that are just going to die because they don't have health care. And that is according to the National Catholic Reporter. And this was part of the article where Catholics are coming out conservative pro life Catholics and are saying this bill is not pro life. There is nothing pro life or Christian. One of them called it in the letter a moral failing, that if this, if this, they ended the letter actually really Strongly. I'm going to read it. It says its passage would be a moral failure for American society as a whole. And these are, these are conservative faith leaders that are saying this. If you, if anyone who is paying attention to this bill knows this bill only benefits the ultra, ultra wealthy who do not need more money. We already have vast gap and we already have so much wealth inequality in this nation and this is going to be the biggest increase to that gap. We need to be, you know, closing that gap, not making it even bigger. It's so, gosh, it's just so infuriating.

[April Ajoy]

And don't forget this is on top of a health care system that is already so broken. Right? I mean they, they say about roughly one in three Americans have some form of, form of medical debt ranging from a thousand up to $10,000 or more. We all know, right, that, that many other countries in this world do not have these conversations, right? They, this is not a conversation for folks in Australia, in the uk, in, in many parts of Asia, in many parts of, of of, of other parts of the world. I mean, I'm just saying like this is not a conversation that a lot of people have. And the fact that we are already, most of us are too worried to call the ambulance lest we go into medical debt, right? I mean I know friends of mine, myself included, who would, who before I called the ambulance or 911 I'm thinking, well how much is this going to cost me? How serious is my injury or my sickness? Is it really worth that right now? Right? So on top of that system, this, this so called Christian party, the party of Maga, the party of biblical values, is pushing through a bill that would not make that better but only make it worse for more and more Americans. You, we have to be in a dream. We have to be in the stupidest timeline ever to exist. To think that people who claim to follow Jesus say, you know what, you know what biblical means? Let's take away more access to health care for, for more people, especially the least of these, because that's what Jesus would want. Like whitewashed tombs. They are whitewashed tombs. And if there is a judgment, I don't know how it works when we die, but if there is a judgment like how most Christians believe that there will be, I think that they're going to be in for the shock of their lifetime when God asks them, so how did you love the least of these? And Mike Johnson goes, we took away their health care and we imprisoned more of them and we built concentration camps in the World's richest country. Yeah. There was plenty of room for everyone, but we wanted to keep things just for us. My God, Mike, I pity to be you on that day.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah. And you know, the, the amount of money that's in this for, for ICE and for immigration and for the border wall, I think it's like 80 billion or it's billions and billions of dollars that is being allocated in additional funds to what our ICE already has. And what, what is the most interesting and infuriating part about the deportations is that one, I think I. Where is, where is the stat? And we were going to talk about this later, but only 8% of everybody ICE has deported so far has a violent conviction. Only 8%. And they're running on this idea that they're deporting like violent rapists, criminals, gang members, drug dealers. Like they're painting this broad picture. And that is not who is being deported. They're deporting moms, grandmas, grandparents, dads, sisters, brother. Like they are deporting really good people whose only fault is that they weren't born here. And it's also a lie that they're deporting people who are, who have just come in here illegally. Because a lot of these people went through proper asylum channels. Went, went through or have filed the proper paperwork and are still. They don't have their documents because they're waiting for the court orders to give them to that. But they have done everything right. So this idea that they're deporting these violent people who are, who are just have no interest in being a part of American society and just want to mooch off of our tax dollars is just a lie. It's not true. And you're talking about Republicans, right. Who are all about Christian persecution. Christian that like Donald Trump made this whole anti Christian bias task force to weed out, quote, unquote, Christian persecution or Christian bias in America. So the ap, the Associated Press, this article is. This article came out recently that says, and this is based on the statistics of all of the people who are at risk of deportation. As many as four out of five immigrants that are at risk of deportation in the United States are Christian.

[April Ajoy]

Yep.

[Tim Whitaker]

And you just had. There was a couple Iran Iranian Christians who were just arrested and they sought. They literally fled Iran for Christian persecution and they were just arrested. They were asylum seekers.

[April Ajoy]

That's right.

[Tim Whitaker]

Like that is actual Christian persecution. What are we even doing? It's maddening.

[April Ajoy]

This comes from a study that was done in coalition with the national association of Evangelicals. I think a Catholic group as well. They did a full study on who is most at risk by religious identity. Of these deportations, the overwhelming are Christian, either Catholic or evangelical. Only about 10% identify as non religious. But of course, April, you and I know that it's not about Christianity, right? It's about maintaining white Christianity. And, and, and this is again what is just so telling and why you and I for years now have been shouting this from the rooftop on all of our platforms saying it's not about Christian persecution. They use that as a Trojan horse to really protect themselves because they are literally kicking out of this country Christians. Kilmar Alberto Garcia is Catholic. Our government kidnapped him, claimed it was a mistake. He, by the way, he, now, he's, now he's accusing the government of being of, of torture. I'm not sure if you saw the most recent lawsuit, but essentially according to Kilmar and his team, he, he suffered real torture when in house, when he was in the prison in El Salvador. And Trump said, oh, it was a mistake, but we can't do anything about it. And not one right wing evangelical group that thrives in the persecution kink. Right. Said anything about how their president was persecuting a Christian by doing that. Because it's not about that. It's about maintaining white supremacy. Like, like I know some people might hear us and say, Tim, you're so extreme. That's so over the top. Look at the results. Forget the rhetoric, just look at who they're targeting. Look at how many of them are Christians. And no one's talking about it because it's not about being a Christian, it's about maintaining a white Christian state. The foundation of, of Christian nationalism and the MAGA movement is white supremacy. I want to show people I didn't tell you about this, April, but I pulled this clip that I just think only further proves how deep seated this is. And we have to call it out. If we're in the age of high intensity propaganda, we have to be high intensity truth tellers, even when it's uncomfortable. So this, this is a clip I pulled. It's actually a little news story from someone I follow online. I love his stuff, it's really good. And here's what he said. I think his name is Aaron, but here's a headline that he covered the other day. Listen to this, friends, this is a true story. Check it out.

[C]

We have some news right now. Donald Trump's nominee to run the Office of special counsel, a 30 year old man has previously said, according to K File and cnn, that Straight white men are the most intelligence demographic group and should be prioritized in education. This new report published this morning by CNN also shows that post Paul Ingracia also shared a 911 truther video last year on 9 11. He has ties to Nick Fuentes, who is a known Holocaust denier, a racist misogynist, etc. And now in a new video uncovered by cnn, you had Gracia literally saying that straight white men are the smartest group and should be prioritized. This is the man that Donald Trump nominated to be the head of Office of Special Counsel, which is responsible for inventory investigating federal employees. Remember, he still has to be confirmed by the United States Senate. So we'll see if Republicans in the Senate take this and reject his nomination.

[April Ajoy]

So that's who Trump nominated. How much more racist can you get? Can I, Can I rant for one second? April, just, just for a minute. Can I get this off my chest? I've been sitting on this. Okay?

[Tim Whitaker]

Get it out.

[April Ajoy]

I cannot tell you I don't have the words to adequately describe my frustration with this evangelical apologetics industry. Right? These people who make a living trying to tell their audience to seek truth and to be biblical and to stand up for virtue and the those. I'm talking about Alisa Childers, I'm talking about Sean McDowell, I'm talking about Frank Turek. All these people who make a Living on YouTube pushing pseudo apologetic nonsense. They will say nothing about this. They will say nothing about the fact that the person who 80 plus percent of their audience voted for gleefully is nominating people who say that white men should be prioritized because they're more intelligent when it comes to education. They're not. You're never going to see Sean McDowell cover. But we're going to cover in a second from now about Alligator Alcatraz. The fact that we are literally putting people in cages, the fact that we are kicking out Christians in the name of border security and how it's all a lie. These people who insist on standing on truth are the. Are the quietest voices when their audience inhales lives 24 7. And I'm just so sick of it. Like, I'm just so. I'm not. I'm not exhausted. I am fired up more than ever. I'm just so angry, which really comes from a deep sense of sorrow. Right? I'm actually heartbroken. That's what it comes down to. I'm heartbroken that that world really thinks that their shit don't stink. That Sean McDowell will spend all day talking about can you be a Christian and be inclusive of queer people? Yes, Sean, what a stupid question. The question you should be asking is how do 80% of white evangelicals get behind a regime that is deporting brown skinned people illegally and kidnapping people and lying about people and convincing people that to make America great again is not to give them affordable health care or livable wages, or not to make sure that the poor have enough to eat or give them benefits. Right? No, it's to make sure that we're kicking out brown skinned immigrants, by the way, statistically who are half as likely to commit violent crimes as their native born counterparts. Do people know that you're more likely to be assaulted by a white man in this country or be killed by a white man in a school shooting than you are by a brown skinned immigrant? And yet you would think from the propaganda bullshit of Ali Sucky and the right wing media apparatus that the world's biggest threat is the mom down the street trying to provide for her two kids who came here from Ecuador. It's crazy. Like, it is crazy that we are here.

[Tim Whitaker]

As a white Christian woman, I have never once felt threatened or harassed or assaulted by an immigrant or a trans person or a queer person. But do you know who I have regularly felt threatened by? Who has regularly objectified me and sexualized me from a young age? Who has harassed me and I've been assaulted. And you know what that demographic was? White, straight, Christian men.

[April Ajoy]

I'm literally on the verge of tears. I'm just so heartbroken by this. Like, people, you know, this isn't like a joke. Like we're not, and we're not pretending on the air. Like me and April don't get on here. And we're not like, oh, we have to put on a show for people. Like we sit with this like you do. Like when, when we stop recording, you know, like, I'm so, I'm just so livid. I'm so angry that we are here at this point. And it's, it's, it's not, it's not the radical jihadists that, that is destroying this country. It's not the atheists or the Marxists. It's white Christians. The people who tried to convince me that everyone else was a threat. Turns out shocker alert. They're the biggest threat right now. Sorry, I'm very ranty to them. Just, I've been up, I'm just so aggravated.

[Tim Whitaker]

I felt really heavy when this. The night the Senate. It was a couple nights ago when the Senate passed that Bill. And then that was the same day that they opened Alligator Alcatraz. And my brain could not process just the cruelty of not just people, but people who share my faith, who read the same red letters as I do, who proclaim to follow a Christian, who said, what you do to the least of these, you've done to me. And they just don't care. And I don't know how to get people to care. I know these are, these are human beings that we are talking about, and, like, we're just screaming into this void of, like. I listened when you were on that stage and you said, we love our neighbors no matter who they are, no matter what they come from. I listened when you said, for God so loved the world, and it didn't matter the color of your skin or who your parents were. I listened when you said that we love our enemies. And every, every human being is made in the image of God. And now you laugh at the idea that they could be eaten by alligators. It's just a joke. These are families. I don't, I. It is just such a hard place to be when I just thought the best of these people who raised me. And then you just realize they were just cruel and they didn't actually believe it or they've been radicalized. I don't know what it is. I can't make sense of it because that's not what my Bible says to do.

[April Ajoy]

Well, you know what you're expressing, April? This is toxic empathy. Clearly you have too much empathy for, for your, for your immigrant neighbor, because you know that's that, that, that, that leads to progressive outcomes. Like, it's just, it's, it is, there is, it's just rotten. Like, I, I, I sit like you do, April. I know people in the audience probably do the same thing. You just sit at night just wondering how we got here, bewildered that the people who taught you these values are the ones who are betraying them so blatantly. Thank you so much, Laurel, for the super chat. Amen, April. And someone else had one, too. I have to read that in a second here. They said, thank you, Olivia, for the super chat. It would be more appropriate to call it alligator ostrich yet. For real. But, yeah, I share that, that sense of despair. And, you know, I, I just, I. All these years later, after listening to all the scholars on this, I understand how we are here, but I still don't, I still don't get it. I don't get how my Sunday school teachers that taught me these values that I'M just still holding to are the ones who are happy, gleeful, thrilled about the fact that we have erected a concentration camp in the middle of a swamp in Florida. That is a. By the way, it's a rinky dink like piece of garbage place and we're going to house people there who aren't even criminals. They're just, they're in the middle of going through the process and just in a holding pattern. We're going to house them there. Somehow that makes America great. And this is a so called Christian nation. If this is their version of heaven, then send me to hell. This sucks. It sucks. God. Thank you, Kelly, for the super chat. Frowning face. 100%. Yeah. Anyway, okay, well, you want to get into alligator Auschwitz. I mean, that's what we really should call it. Absolutely.

[Tim Whitaker]

Concentration camp.

[April Ajoy]

That's exactly what it is. Again, we cannot let propagandists control these. Even the term alligator Alcatraz. Right. Was invented by these people to, to, to. Oh, it's kind of funny. That's hilarious. No, this is real. Real people are going to be in a place that looks like this. I mean, how much more cruel can you get?

[Tim Whitaker]

Is it air conditioned?

[April Ajoy]

They said that they're going to have air conditioners. But look, look at. This is a tent. It is. It's like a wedding tent kind of material. You can't keep that thing cool in the middle of Florida in a swamp.

[Tim Whitaker]

Floor is so humid too. I used to live in Florida.

[April Ajoy]

Like, it's this, this picture of Trump and. Is that, Is that Christine? Is that who that is? Is that her name?

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah.

[April Ajoy]

This, this will be in the textbooks one day of. You know how we look back now, April and go, how did we. How did we build internment camps for Japanese people? How did we. How do we allow Jim Crow segregation to happen in America? How do. These pictures, they almost feel surreal. That's what we're looking at right here. That is that picture. We're gonna have to tell our kids and our grandkids that we survived and we were living through and talking about when the president elected by white Christians in America erected these concentration camps and, and people started buying. I'm not going to curse too much because this is, you know, I want to make it accessible but freaking merch to fund it. That's a real thing. I got to play this clip while we're here. I just, I have to be able to express here just the outrage of this. So Benny Johnson, who is one of these right wing commentators, is a, he's a massive Name in the right wing space. Speaks at Turning Point USA Events. Proud Christian. Proud Christian sitting at Christian values. Here's what he posted on Twitter. Listen to Benny talk. I just want everyone to know that there's official alligator Alcatraz merch. There it is, provided to us by the state of Florida. Incredible. And yeah. Would you rock this drip? Look at that. Would you rock this drip? And his caption on his Twitter reads, hi, guys, I have just been handed official alligator Alcatraz merch. I repeat, this prison has merch. Things are going insanely well. Insanely well. Who are these people?

[Tim Whitaker]

I mean, and listen, these are detention centers for immigrants. We're not. We haven't even talked about the problem with mass incarceration that we have in our nation with the 13th Amendment, which is basically just another way to enslave black people. That's like, that's, that's another conversation. That is an active thing that has been happening as part of systemic racism. But to, but like, why are we celebrating people being imprisoned? Why. Why is that a thing to put on a big old smile about? Like, people are going to be trapped here and they can't escape, and if they do, they're going to get eaten by alligators. And isn't that so, so funny? I mean, it. Honestly, when I was reading the article, I. I saw someone. I saw on threads, someone talk about alligator Alcatraz, that it was just opened and I literally thought, there's no way that's real. And so then I googled it and when I was reading the article, it literally read like something you would see in a comic book movie that, that, like a comic book villain would do. Like a Lex Luthor type. Like, it is so out there and maniacal and honestly, a little silly. Like, there's nothing mature about this and the, and. But the fact that it's real is so, like, honestly, I don't know that my brain can fully process it. Like, I just, I live in this world so differently. I don't know what it's like to just not have empathy. And I. I cannot relate.

[D]

Hi, my name's Simon and I'm in Sydney, Australia, and I'm a monthly donor for the New Evangelicals. I found the TNE Instagram in 2021. I'd recently stepped down from my job as a pastor. I was beginning to find a real conflict between what I was beginning to believe about God and the world and the church and the evangelical spaces I was in. But at the time, it was really dark for me. I was really lonely. I was really isolated. I had so many questions and finding a space where it was okay to ask questions and to share my thoughts and ideas and hear other people's ideas at the same time and just be able to connect with so many people that were going through similar things was incredible for me at a time when I needed it most. Since then I've been quite involved with the organization for a while. I was the moderator admin for the Facebook group and now I've just started out on the New Evangelicals board. I would love to encourage you if you can make a monthly donation to the New Evangelicals. There's some great work happening and particularly Project Amplify and the opportunity it has. So many voices to give so many voices a chance to be heard. I know it's something I needed in my dark moments. It's something we're able to contribute to that can help other people as they begin to smell the fresh air outside that basement of fundamentalist evangelical spaces.

[April Ajoy]

So a couple just points for people to have just some data on on. On this con. I'm not calling it an immigrant detention center like the news does. That's it's a concentration camp. So, so what? What what this is a center or immigrant detention centers. The idea of them anyway are facilities where immigrants are held while awaiting the outcome of their immigration proceedings or deportation, which can take anywhere from a few weeks to several years, depending on the case inefficiency of the immigration system. By the way, we know how inefficient the immigration system is. I shared routinely on this show about my friend Muhammad. His family's been in the pending status for many, many years now and just got their court case pushed back another four years. So they're going to be pending again. So to give you guys an example, Muhammad, by the way, his family runs a small business in New Jersey called Jersey Kebab ice. Raided their business in February and detained his mother, put her in a detention center. In theory, she could have ended up here in Florida. Not because she's a criminal or because she was a drug dealer, but because she's pending in the immigration system because of the inefficiencies of this system. That's the kind of people that we're going to put in literal cages with no, adequate, with not adequate shelter, food, etc. The, the, the facility in Florida has faced a lot of pushback, obviously because it's located in the middle of the Everglades swampland, surrounded by mosquitoes, pythons and alligators. During Florida's Hot weather conditions and in the area that's prone to hurricanes. That's another great, that's another great point here. If a hurricane comes through you, do people really think that somehow this facility is going to hold up to a Category 2 or 3 hurricane? It's made out of tents, it was built in eight days. It's a death sentence.

[Tim Whitaker]

And hurricane season is just around the.

[April Ajoy]

Corner, according to House Press Secretary Carolyn Levitt. She said there is only one road leading in and the only way out is a one way flight. It is isolated and surrounded by dangerous wildlife and unforgiving terrain. President Donald Trump and Homeland Security Secretary Kristi Noem joined Florida Gov. Ron DeSantis and other state leaders July 1 for the grand opening. Like it's some kind of department store. Quote, we had a request from the federal government to do it. And so alligator Alcatraz it is. Florida Governor Ron DeSantis said during last week's news conference. Clearly, quote, clearly from a security perspective, if someone escapes, there's a lot of alligators you're gonna have to contend with. No one is gonna, is going anywhere. Once you do that, it's as safe and secure as you can be. I mean, they literally put this in the middle of a place where folks can be, in theory, eaten by alligators. Not. And the only reason why is because they think that those people aren't worthy of the same dignity and respect that they're worthy of. It's dehumanization 101. And this is where it leads when you think other people are less than it is. Unbelievable. Do you want to play the clip of, of Trump talking about the alligators? I mean, I don't know.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah, I do. I do. I just want to remind everybody again, only 8% of the deportations done by ICE so far are from anyone convicted of anything violent.

[April Ajoy]

That's right. That's right. Again, we have to hit the absolute reality, the absolute reality of the propaganda.

[Tim Whitaker]

Thank you, Laurel, for the super chat. She said, tim, the picture you showed looks like a big kennel. It really does. Honestly, a lot of these, these white Christian nationalists that are celebrating alligator Alcatraz would be livid if these conditions were for dogs. Yeah, maybe not Kristi Gnome, though, considering she killed her dog.

[April Ajoy]

I was thinking about that.

[Tim Whitaker]

But a lot of them, like, they treat their pets better than they're treating these human beings.

[April Ajoy]

Oh, where's my video? I know, I, I grabbed the video. I had to change the audio because it was such.

[Tim Whitaker]

Oh, yeah, while you're looking for that, I just want to give a quick update, Hakeem Jeffries has now been speaking for more than seven hours. The current record for the longest House floor speech was by Kevin McCartney in 2021, and he spoke for eight and a half hours. So Hakeem Jeffries is still going like, and there's like, just for some good, good news, there are still good people that are fighting this atrocities and, and putting their name on the line and really standing up, you know, and I, there, there, I don't want to say, like, there's just no hope because there are still good people that are willing to fight this. I mean, it's a regime, it's an evil regime at this point, which sounds insane to say, but anyway, yeah, play this stupid clip first.

[April Ajoy]

Olivia, thank you for the super chat. I'm so thankful for the work you are doing right now as the lone liberal. My family thank you. They say I've changed, but they're the ones who have. I. Olivia, solidarity on that and also thank you so much. J24. Keep fighting. So appreciate your truth telling. Fight, fight, fight for the truth. I appreciate that. So this is a clip of Trump talking about this concentration camp that he is all behind. I had to clean up the audio, so it's a little hard to hear, but it's a lot more legible than what it was. And we'll kind of recap it. But here's what he said when he was asked by a reporter about the nature of alligators in the area. And if, you know, if the plan was for them for immigrants to be eaten by alligators at some point and with the alligator, Alpha said, is the idea, then it's done. They just get eaten by an alligator or a snake. I guess that's the concept. This is not a nice prison. I guess that's the concept. If you, you know, snakes are fast, but alligators are. But we're going to teach them how to run away from an alligator. Okay. If they escape prison, how to run away, don't run in a straight line. Run like this and you know what, your chances go up about 1%. The question he was asked was, quote, is the idea of those who held their escape, they just get eaten by an alligator? Is that the idea? Or a snake? And that was his response.

[Tim Whitaker]

He said, I guess that's the concept. What'd he say? It's not a nice business.

[April Ajoy]

Yeah.

[Tim Whitaker]

As he's smiling, talking like he's like a mafia boss.

[April Ajoy]

100%. 100%. Again, like Christians, white evangelicals in particular, actually white Christians. The Majority of white Christians voted for this man. You need to explain to me how you're the one who's holding on to Christian ethics here, because you're just not. You're. I mean, how, how, how does. This is. The President of the United States of America says this makes a joke, that if they, if they run away in a zigzag pattern, there's a 1% chance higher that they'll survive. What is this? The freaking Hunger Games? Like, is it. Is this the. Is this gladiator or are we watching? Like, what are we doing?

[Tim Whitaker]

I mean, I do not believe for a second they're going to teach the immigrants to run in a zigzag. But I will say, as a. As a former Floridian, I spent my high school years there. That is something that they teach you is if you're being chased by an alligator, to run in zigzags, because alligators can run fast, but they can't turn fast.

[April Ajoy]

So just good to know.

[Tim Whitaker]

Just, you know, some alligator 101.

[April Ajoy]

Thanks so much for the super chat, BB. Keep up the great work, Tim and April, and thank you for the super chat. Stephanie, I can't watch right now because I'm at work, but I look forward to your videos every week. And I appreciate you two and the team so much. Thank you. You know, can I just say, Stephanie, from the bottom of my heart, that means so much. April and I often talk about, hopefully this is helping people. Hopefully folks enjoy, you know, the show or they find it helpful. And so that feedback is. Is so nice to hear. Like we said, friends, all Super Chats get read on the air. So thank you for that. And all the Super Chat money goes to making this show possible. So without your support, this show doesn't happen. And frankly, I was going to say. I was going to say this at some point, but, you know, I think that. I know that we help people, but also the people help us. Like, it's. This is. This is really helpful for me to have a place to be able to express, you know, how I'm feeling and how I'm looking at this, because it is. I just. I feel like we're in the Upside down more and more every day. You know, it is. It's. It's just heartbreaking to see. I don't even know what to do.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah. And I think we are. It's. It's just encouraging to not. It helps us not be gaslit. Right. Like, I still have a lot of MAGA family and, you know, people that I knew from church on Facebook that are still very maga that, that go after my mom when she posts stuff on Facebook and it's like, what am I living in an upside down. Like, you just feel like you're going crazy because you're clearly seeing one thing. And it just seems like so many Christians that are caught up in this world just don't see that. And so just having this community, even just seeing the people in the chat that, that are agreeing with us, it's just a. It's. It's just. It's good to know one, we're not alone. There's a lot more of us than they would like us to think. And we are not the crazy ones. No, we're not.

[April Ajoy]

No. Did you see this? I. I hate to even, you know, continue beating. I, I hate to continue showing the level of dehumanization that's out there, but did you see this tweet by Laura Loomer? So for folks who don't know Laura Loomer is like, basically a white supremacist, this is someone who is incredibly racist. Trump was a big fan of hers. They were working very closely together for a long time, and she tweeted out alligator lives matter. The good news is alligators are guaranteed at least 65 million meals if we get started now. Now I have to point something out. Point it out right now. In the right wing evangelical world, you know what gets traction is when, like a former worship person comes out and is queer affirming. That makes, like headline news. Like literally news publications will show, Whoa, this is big news. The fact that we have someone who's a Christian who makes this comment and the fact that it will not make a dent in the Christian news cycle, it just gets accepted as, ah, well, that. That's just who they are, I think is so telling. It's so telling. What is seen as scandal in these spaces and what is not. I mean, wow. Wow.

[Tim Whitaker]

Another important distinction here is there are not 65 million undocumented people in our country. It's. That number is way lower. There are 65 million Latinos in America.

[April Ajoy]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Tim Whitaker]

The number she's referring to is just the, the amount of Latinos, period, like immigrants and American citizens. Like, this is. This is not just anti immigrant. This is blatantly racist.

[April Ajoy]

Do you ever feel, April, like, no matter how much evidence we bring to people in this world, no matter how many pieces of evidence we bring that, that these folks are racist, that they flirt with racist ideas, I mean, Trump sat down with Nick Fuentes for dinner a couple of years ago. And it just seems like no matter how much evidence I bring to someone in that world that they will either. What about, is it about ism? Right. Well, well, Biden. Well, Harris. Or they'll just straight up ignore it or, or downplay it. And I do not know what to do with that. I don't know what to do with that.

[Tim Whitaker]

I, I know I will say so. I've talked about this one of the pushback that I've received from maga because I have some MAGA people that just follow me and they're like my consistent trolls, right. They comment on everything. And what they're saying is, well, were you upset when Obama threw families in cages? Because the initial cages from Trump's first term when he was separating families at the border, I mean, it's not like he's just recently become inhumane. Like I remember being livid about separating children, little children from their parents at the border and then throwing them in cages. Totally. But they say, well, Obama did it. Were you mad when Obama did it? I mean, listen, when Obama was president, I was mad. I couldn't stand Obama, but I didn't know about the cages at the time. And I'm against it for, for then too. But it was also different. It was temporary and they weren't separating children unless they thought the children were being trafficked.

[April Ajoy]

Well, and also on top of that, we weren't ICE was not emboldened to literally arrest people on a whim for no reason. We've seen US Citizens get arrested. We've seen sitting lawmakers be arrested. We've seen ICE arrest people who are on student visas. That has not happened under Biden or under Obama, especially to this kind of scale and with this kind of support from the president. Right. And in his side of things, the fact that we have, I mean, think about this for a second. Think about how mind bogglingly hypocritical this is because right wing maga, right. They're so afraid of big government. Oh, we don't want the government persecuting Christians like us. Oh, we're afraid of big government overreach. We don't want. We don't want. You know, remember during COVID oh, it's the Gestapo. O look at how they weaponize the police to, to do terrible things to citizens for enforcing mask mandates. Right, okay. And by the way, it wasn't even to this degree. Now we have a federal agency invading smaller state, invading states against their consent and their will, and randomly arresting people without any Due process without any actual credible reason to arrest them. And suddenly this is, this is making America great again. Suddenly this is good. So, and this goes to my point that we've made many times, there's the illusion of Republicans want small government is just that, it's an illusion. What they care about is who gets to wield the power of the government. Who gets to wield the power. Did you know, April, that ICE agents now have technology on their phones to scan people's face and fingerprint to ID them in the field? Yeah, talk about, talk about big tech overreach. Talk about big government overreach. We literally are. It's almost like I have a Hollywood movie where have these people who are masked up, you don't know who they are, they don't identify themselves, they can arrest you, scan your face, get all your information just like that, without any kind of due process or any kind of, you know, right to privacy. That's all throughout the window because these people have, you know, just a blanket permission from the President to just do what he's telling them to do. And in this big beautiful bill, they're getting funded to the hilt to keep doing it.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah, another, I mean, another problem that this presents is that, and I've seen videos of conservative MAGA people buying ICE vests and ICE jackets from Amazon, walking around impersonating ICE and just terrorizing people for fun because they're not IDing themselves. And when you're not going through due process, like people are not thinking this through. If you can deport someone who's undocumented without due process, without giving them a chance to present their papers or to go to court and say, listen, here's my facts, here's how I was here, here's my documentation, here's who I am without going through that there could easily deport and detain American citizens. It's not going to stop with undocumented immigrants.

[April Ajoy]

April, do you remember, I mean, or do you. I know you're aware of, you know, all, all the worry from these MAGA people about, about trans women in the bathrooms because we have to protect girls. Right. You know that there are people who are literally impersonating ICE officers and are sexually assaulting women. There's a story that came out in January 29th of this year, manicues of impersonating ICE officer sexually assaults women he threatened to deport. Yet weird, I don't hear any concerns from these so called, you know, a protector of women about the fact that ICE agents are masked up and don't identify themselves and how that could be a threat for people to do bad things. That. Apparently that is an issue. But we're all worried about. About the trans woman in a bathroom. Are you kidding me? Are. You're joking, right? You are. Absolutely. You're. You are joking. You are joking when you say that.

[Tim Whitaker]

Affecting women and girls in sports.

[April Ajoy]

Totally. Thank you so much. Is it Marcel? Hope I said your name correctly for the super chat. Love and support from Switzerland. I've always loved the States. What's happening there now is horrifying and heartbreaking, but you guys give me hope. Keep up the good fight. Thank you so much. And thank you, Olivia, for the super chat as well. Facial recognition doesn't work well, particularly for people of color. A number of representatives were misidentified as felon by facial recognition. Great shout out. Thank you for pointing that out.

[Tim Whitaker]

To know. Terrible.

[April Ajoy]

It's terrible, man. And it's hypocritical. It's. It's vile. It's. It's full of lies. And they smile while doing it. And what do they do, April? They pray. They thank God. They thank God for that. For this opportunity to vote for such things.

[Tim Whitaker]

I know. We have another Super. Super. A super chat.

[April Ajoy]

A super chat. Wait, did you say a super chat?

[Tim Whitaker]

I don't know. From Michelle. She says Jesus is empathy. He chose to become one of us in flesh and walk in our steps, show us a better way, the way. There is nothing toxic about Jesus. We agree. Thank you, Michelle.

[April Ajoy]

100%.

[Tim Whitaker]

This is what is one. Oh, you know what? We did forget to mention about the bill, which I'm still keeping a track. I believe Hakeem Jeffries is still talking because they haven't updated CNN five minute update ago. No, he's just still talking.

[April Ajoy]

He's nearing the modern day record for longest house for speech.

[Tim Whitaker]

He's getting close to it. Go, Hakeem. We totally forgot during the bill. Elon Musk still very much against this bill, too.

[April Ajoy]

Yeah, he.

[Tim Whitaker]

He tweeted before the Senate voted.

[April Ajoy]

Oh, I had this one. I'm not sure what tweet you wanted.

[Tim Whitaker]

Oh, you. I just can't read it. That's why I paused. Here, I have. I have one. I don't know if it's that one because I can't read it.

[April Ajoy]

It's a picture of Pinocchio and it says anyone who campaigned on the promise of reducing spending but continues to vote on the biggest debt ceiling increase in history will see their face on this poster in the primary next year. Essentially, he's Threatening to go after everyone in the primaries who voted for this.

[Tim Whitaker]

Here's. Here's the tweet I was talking about. I texted it to you.

[April Ajoy]

I'll grab it. Text it to me.

[Tim Whitaker]

It's. He said every member of Congress who campaigned on reducing government spending and then immediately voted for the biggest debt increase in history should hang their head in shame and they will lose their primary next year if it is the last thing I do on this earth.

[April Ajoy]

He's.

[Tim Whitaker]

Wow, the richest man in the world. I mean, he. He had major influence in this last election, and that is no small threat.

[April Ajoy]

I have. I. I'll be honest, I have no tolerance for Elon. I mean, after the damage he did with Doge. I'm glad. Elon, you're saying the quieter part out loud for you, but I don't believe your motives for a second. This man lives on the government teat. Talk about nanny state government. Elon's, you know, funds and his tax breaks and the subsidies that have made. What is it? What's the name of his NASA rocket thing?

[Tim Whitaker]

SpaceX.

[April Ajoy]

Yeah, SpaceX. Where they. Have you seen the rockets keep blowing up, by the way. So we're paying for Elon to make these rockets. They keep blowing up. But, I mean, this guy is one of the biggest recipients of government welfare in America. And I'm glad, I guess, Elon, that you're mad about this, but also, like, go kick rocks, dude. Go kick rocks. You absolutely gutted usaid, which has taken food out of the mouths of starving children around the globe. I don't want to hear it from you. I just do not want to hear it from him at all. He can go eat rocks. That's the nicest way I can say it. Humanizing him.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yes. And don't add me, April. And I will root for him as he attempts to take down the MAGA movement.

[April Ajoy]

You know, do you think he will, though?

[Tim Whitaker]

Like, what's that saying? Like, if your enemies are fighting each other, just shut up and just let him go.

[April Ajoy]

Let him go, let him go, let him go.

[Tim Whitaker]

Like, you know, we will take little wins where we can, even if it's by the worst but person, you know? You know, speaking of.

[April Ajoy]

Speaking of. Sorry. Catch you up there. Got it. I was just gonna say, speaking of Wayne, if you want to help this video, Wayne, you can give it a. Like, that'd be super helpful.

[Tim Whitaker]

So small wins.

[April Ajoy]

I gotta laugh somehow. Okay.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah. Thank you, Joseph, for the super chat. He said, I'm absolutely appalled at this bill. Same.

[April Ajoy]

And by the way, I Gotta say, props to. Props to Democrats. Okay? I have a lot of beef with Democrats for a lot of reasons. Not one of them is voting for this nonsense. So that's great. I mean, thank God, you know? Thank God for sure. You know, props or props are due, but my goodness. Oh, and also, thank you so much. Is it Seraphim for the super chat? Let these injustices inspire and not lead you to despair. And in action. Love you all. And of course, abolish ice. Hell, yeah. We should make merch that says that in some fun way. Abolish ice. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I'm over it. Can I say something that's. That might be controversial?

[Tim Whitaker]

Please?

[April Ajoy]

Okay, Go and go for it.

[Tim Whitaker]

And remember, friends, I don't necessarily agree. I don't know what it is.

[April Ajoy]

Totally fair. Totally fair. And remember, we can walk and chew gum at the same time. I am never one as a Christ follower. I do not believe that violence is ever the answer to anything. I do not believe that. Also, I can understand how people can get violent. I can understand it.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah.

[April Ajoy]

I can understand when you see things happening that are so injustice or unjust and so outrageous. Right. And are so clearly harming either you, your family, your neighbor, your friends. I could totally understand why people resort to acts of violence, whether it's against property or whatever. I. I can. I totally get it. Because there is for sure, I think, a lot of us, this sense of, like, what can we do to get these people to wake up and pay attention? Right? And I can see how folks can get there for sure. Because I feel that. I mean, the fact that we are gonna have people in a tent in the middle of the swamp in Florida just for existing, for the. For. For the body that they're in, it makes me so angry, and it makes me feel so like, I'll do whatever I need to do to get those people out of there, you know?

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah. Oh, God, no, no, I. Yeah, I feel you. I think. I think of that movie. Did you ever see that movie, John Q With Denzel Washington?

[April Ajoy]

I've seen parts of it. I've seen parts of it.

[Tim Whitaker]

It's like. I mean, it's a moral dilemma, right? It's one of those conversations that you talk about in philosophy class. But, you know, in the movie, his son needed a heart transplant or he was going to die. And so he goes to a hospital and basically holds the doctor to gunpoint and, like, makes him save his son. And, you know, it just started this whole debate of, like, you know, is that okay? I mean, it's violent, but also his son was dying and like, what would you do to save your kids life?

[April Ajoy]

What would you do?

[Tim Whitaker]

You know, I just think we just. There's just not condoning violence. No, by any means. And also violence is constantly being done to the least of these.

[April Ajoy]

Exactly, exactly, exactly. We do have to really consider why can we. Why can the majority, majority of Americans watch people being detained and their rights withheld from them violently, by the way they are forced to be arrested. Right. Or they're being tackled and we think, well, that's not great, but is what it is. But the second Protestant gets out of hand or they, you know, or they attack cars like the Waymo cars in la, suddenly, oh, this lawlessness, this violence, it's all part of the system that is constructed to maintain the status quo. Right. Empire does not mind violence. Empire will use violence whenever needed to maintain their version of law and order. Right. State violence is a thing that we see all the time and we're kind of conditioned to accept it as okay. But then when people revolt and that gets violent, whether it's looting or it's destroying a Walmart or destroying Waymo cars, suddenly, oh, we're out of control. Hey, that's not how we do things here. No, that actually is how we do things here. That's how America operates on a policy of violence. Period. Period. That's how it works.

[Tim Whitaker]

America has a very bloody past and present, and that's putting it mildly. Yeah. And present like this idea that. Which I think is part of the reason you see this rewriting of history for Christian nationalists and this demonizing of WOKE ideology and anything CRT is because they don't want to admit our violent past and that we were ever the bad guys. Because this is a Christian nation and God supernaturally blessed our nation and, and to, to create it and, and to form it. And so you have to close your eyes and just be ignorant to awful truths. And that's like, that's what I wonder if a lot of Christians are doing. Obviously we're not talking about the people that are buying alligator Alcatraz merch, but I'm just wondering how many people actually know what's happening. You know, and to be fair, it's not just MAGA people that, that like history will look down upon. It's also a lot of moderate people or people who are just digging their heads in the sand and going about their life because it doesn't affect them. They not, they may not be cheering on the alligators and cheering on Donald Trump and what they're doing, but they're not saying anything.

[April Ajoy]

Totally. No, no, no. I mean, this is what Martin Luther King Jr. Says was the most problematic. It was the white moderate Christian. Right. It wasn't the extreme because he already knew about the racists. Right? He knew about them. He knew how problematic they were. It was the people who watched it and did nothing in the name of just preach the gospel or, well, hey, both sides, or hey, we have to be peaceful. I mean, these are the people, right? In their, in today's world. These are your Sean McDowell's, right? Sean? To my knowledge, I've never seen Sean McDowell ever talk about Trump or endorse Trump publicly. But he also won't say anything either. Right? That is what, that's, that is exactly what I'm talking about. And that's why. Okay, so not to get too off. Off the market, but I think it's important while we're here, you know, so Christian nationalism is on a spectrum. You have, you have adherence and you have sympathizers. Right? So adherents are like your Charlie Kirks sympathizers are people who might believe like three or two of the five statements and maybe be sympathetic to the rest. Those people are the ones that allow the adherence to flourish. Right. White evangelicalism. I'm not saying every white evangelical is a raging blatant Christian nationalist, but they created an environment where that ideology thrives, not dies. Right. And so this white moderate, this white moderate just preached the gospel. Hey, you know, we have to be. Both sides have their problems. They are actually enabling what we're seeing today with the erection of this detention center or the concentration camp, with how Trump behaves, with what's happening with this bill. Because ultimately they're going to vote Republican. They most likely are going to vote Republican. And they enable it. They don't actually check it. They don't actually call it out. And that, that's part of the problem.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah. And the ideology has built in defense mechanisms. Right. You have people that don't want to know, like they're intentionally not reading up on it. They. And when you bring it up, they're like, oh, well, I'm sure it's not really that. You know, they're just.

[April Ajoy]

Exactly.

[Tim Whitaker]

Because they don't want to know, because they're comfortable. They don't, it's not, it's not affecting them. And they don't. They want to be able to sleep at night.

[April Ajoy]

That's right.

[Tim Whitaker]

You know, I mean, there's a piece of me they say ignorance is bliss and that that's for a reason. You know, sometimes when I can't sleep and I'm up till 2am because I just can't get the idea of children being ripped away from their mom.

[April Ajoy]

Yes.

[Tim Whitaker]

Like, that is like a deep fear of mine as a mom. That's like the worst thing. I think one of the worst things you can do in this world is to rip children away from their mom. I would love to not have to think about that at night, you know, but that's the reality. And then I don't feel like a good person if I just go about my life like everything is normal. But then also, it is unsustainable to be in a constant state of grief. You know, it's just. It's a very weird time to be alive and to be a mom, you know, Like, I want my kids to have a great childhood, and I don't want them to feel these burdens and the heaviness of this world. So I'm fighting for them and putting on a brave face for them and still playing stupid little games with them. And they don't know, but it is so hard. Like, I want them to have a good future. And I'm scared, and I don't. I don't know how to be a mom right now.

[April Ajoy]

I had this moment a couple nights ago. Harper, our youngest, he's like three, he woke up, said his legs were hurting him because he. The kid jumps off of, like, everything and runs around all day. And he's crying. He's crying for Daddy. He's crying for Mommy. And his big thing now is when we go into the room, he goes, will you lay down with me for a few minutes? And he's sobbing. And I had this, like, moment the other day where I'm like, the thought of my child asking for me or for Sarah, and one of us being not available because we're detained for no reason in a detention center, like, rips my heart out. And it's understandable why parents would do whatever they needed to do to get out of there, to get back to their kids. And again, this, to your point, April, there's always a defense mechanism, right? So we call that now toxic empathy. And that's how we get around the very human reaction to, well, I would never want that to happen to me and my kids. So I don't want that to happen to my immigrant neighbor and their kids. Well, no, no, that's toxic empathy, because they deserve it and you don't deserve that. That's how their logic works. And it's, it's, you know, it's just startling to think about that. The fact that right now there are kids in this country who are crying for their mom at night, but mom is in a detention center. I mean, I don't want to, look, look, I don't want to overplay, okay, the emotional side of this. I think it's important here. When I was talking to Muhammad, I actually interviewed Muhammad on the TNE YouTube channel. We shot a two hour conversation in his family's restaurant. And he was telling me this whole story. It's really worth watching. It will just change your whole perspective on the immigration system. He was telling me that when his mom was there, she was taking care of other women because she's a little bit older and there were younger women there. And one of the women had an infant and she would literally have to breast pump the milk out and give the milk to her family to feed the infant who was, who was separated from her mom. And I'm just thinking to myself, like, you know, I, I watched Sarah breastfeed both of our kids. If that was, if my wife was in a detention center and had to share a breast pump with other women just to give my kids the nutrients that they needed as humans, it would drive me to, to anger and rage. I would probably consider doing something extreme to get my wife out of there. Right. Because again, how is that a pro life ethic? How is that a pro family ethic? How does that, how does that keep the quote, unquote nuclear family together? It doesn't. Because these lines that we hear all day about the importance of the family unit and family values, they're actually just a Trojan horse. That really means maintaining our family units and our family values, not our neighbors. We don't give a shit about our neighbors, especially if they're not from here or if they don't look like us or talk like us. And it just, like, it just guts me to think about that. And again, to see it come from Christians who taught us songs like, Jesus loves all the children of the world. Red and yellow, black and white, they are precious in his sight. But in reality, it's no, throw those kids in a detention center, throw their parents in an attention center. Wow. Wow what? I mean, this is hell on earth. Congratulations, Christians, you've done it. You've proved to me that hell exists. You've built it in Florida.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah, well, and they, you know, they defend it well, when you went in the few interactions I've tried, like, how are you okay with Ripping children from their parents. And the response is, well, their parents should have, shouldn't have broken the law. And I, honestly, I. Jesus himself said to break the law when it came to helping people. That's why religious leaders were so pissed at Jesus. He regularly bucked the law in favor of human beings. And I, I don't, I don't fucking care about the law. Like, at a certain point, who cares about the law? We're talking about children who need their moms and their dads who have done nothing wrong. You are now traumatizing children because of a law, because of a man made law, because of man made borders. Like, I don't. It enrages me and infuriates me and saddens me to a point that I don't, I don't know what else to say or do. Like you either care about people or you don't. And I think I'm just grieving how much people don't care.

[April Ajoy]

The second laws prevent human flourishing. They should be broken.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah, I mean, people that, that were hiding Jews during the Holocaust.

[April Ajoy]

Exactly.

[Tim Whitaker]

We're breaking the law.

[April Ajoy]

Exactly. The Underground Railroad, they were breaking the law. They were breaking the Fugitive Slave Act. Right. We don't look back and go, well, those lawbreakers, you know, they should have went through the proper channels to free the slaves. No, we don't look back and think about that at all. We go, thank God someone had the moral guts and fortitude and moral clarity of the moment to say, this law is unjust and is wrong and I will break it for the sake of my neighbor. Period. That's what I would love Christians to be in trouble for. I would love to see Christians in America persecuted for breaking immigration laws for the sake of their immigrant neighbor and keeping their families together.

[Tim Whitaker]

This is the same people that raised me to break the law if I was being persecuted for my faith. Right? We were always taught like, oh no, you always have to break the law. If the government ever comes in and says, do you believe in God, yes or no. And if you say yes, then they're gonn, you know, kill you on the spot. Like you're always supposed to say yes. You're supposed to do the underground church if Christianity is banned, like these people don't actually care about the law. I was taught that my faith was more important than any law.

[April Ajoy]

Right.

[Tim Whitaker]

And my faith tells me to care about the foreigner and the stranger and the least of these and the queer person and the poor person and the disabled person over the law. That's what my Faith teaches me.

[April Ajoy]

They also taught us to smuggle in Bibles into countries where it was illegal. Yeah, so they had no problem breaking the law.

[Tim Whitaker]

They don't care about the law. They're just racist.

[April Ajoy]

Trump pardoned every January Sixer. Blanketly, they don't give a shit about the law. I gotta read this comment. It's such a good point. Being here, quote, unquote, illegally is a misdemeanor. Should we treat everyone who ever got a traffic ticket like this? Exactly. Exactly. No one who gets a traffic ticket thinks, oh, well, you know what? I broke the law, so you should separate me from my family and I should be locked away in a detention center because I broke the law. No, obviously that's not what we're talking about here. You know, again, can we. I have to. We have to say this over and over again. This system is built against legal immigration. This system is overwhelmed. They don't want to fix it if they could build a concentration camp in eight days. And by the way, I think the funding it takes, they're estimating $450 million this year just to fund that thing. If they can figure that out within a matter of days. You're telling me we can't figure out our immigration system? You're telling me that we could put men on the moon, we can build rockets that go to outer space, we can track when the next asteroid is. It might, might even come within 10,000 miles of planet Earth, but we can't figure out a healthy immigration system that does keep, of course, violent people out, but allows the mother and the father and the children to come in to be functioning members of society. You're telling me we can't figure that shit out, America, Are you kidding me? And that's why I get so angry. Because we could figure out, we could figure out affordable health care if we wanted to. We could tax the ultra rich and use that to fund programs to help people. We could force Walmart to pay livable wages. We could do it. We have the money. We have the resources. We have the ability, we have the ingenuity. We could do it. We just don't want to. Because the system is set up to maintain the status quo. And this big beautiful bill, this bullshit bill, is only going to further cement unequal wealth distribution. It's going to continue to be a huge burden on the poor underclass. It's going to. It's going to fund ICE agents who are going to continue to act in such barbaric and lawless ways, targeting families for no damn Reason. And this is all brought to you by white Christian men who insist that God has given them a divine mandate to rule over America.

[Tim Whitaker]

Mm.

[April Ajoy]

Get me out of here.

[Tim Whitaker]

I know.

[April Ajoy]

God, I'm so ranty today.

[Tim Whitaker]

I think it was a well deserved rant. One thing I want to point out, too, on the bill is I'm trying to fact check it in real time, because I've seen this in several places, but I haven't actually checked on myself.

[April Ajoy]

We could do it together.

[Tim Whitaker]

That the bill itself, they're hoping to pass it this week, but that it would actually not go into effect until December of 2026, which is after midterms. Okay, that was what I read. Which. Which is the intention of. They don't want to screw a bunch of people up before midterm so that they can get voted back in. But I'm trying to fact check that in real time.

[April Ajoy]

What I'm reading here from the Bergen Record is that the Medicaid cuts proposed in the bill will be. Would take effect as early as December 31, 2026. So maybe different parts of the bill get implemented later on or at different parts or different times. I don't know.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah. Well, and the Medicaid part, I think, is what even, like, really big Trump supporters will be directly negatively impacted by Medicaid. And that part, so it does sound like is going to be delayed until after the midterms, of course. So you're not going to feel these effects until we vote again, which is. It's just. It's just so manipulative and deceitful.

[April Ajoy]

By the way, if folks want to support our work in a different way, you can buy merch. We have this shirt and other shirts on our merch store. We also sell these mugs. I commit sins of empathy, is what it says. Is my camera gonna focus in? It never does. Let's see. Will it focus? Come on camera. No, it's not going to do it.

[Tim Whitaker]

I see it.

[April Ajoy]

Yeah. That's all available on our merch store. Okay. Do you want to get my.

[Tim Whitaker]

My book?

[April Ajoy]

Yeah.

[Tim Whitaker]

Star Spangled Jesus, April's book.

[April Ajoy]

It's so good.

[Tim Whitaker]

Nationalism. And one reason I get so upset is because I come from this world. Yeah, right. I know this world. So, yeah. But yeah, you can. You can buy that. Where? Wherever books are sold. Shall we land this plane? Hakeem Jeffries is still talking. He's nearing the the Record. So we might end the show before. It looks like we're going to end the show before they officially vote. I will say if you can't get a hold of a lot of the Republican Congress people. Chip Roy was one. You can look at the list of the five who originally said no, then were persuaded to say yes. If you can't call their office, comment on their Instagram, on their Twitter, on their Facebook pages, like, go to their actual social media presence and just say, please vote no for the American people. Vote no on this bill. Like, you can still apply pressure as of, you know, Thursday at 1:20pm Please do it.

[April Ajoy]

Please. If you're listening to this and the. The bill has not been voted in yet, please make the phone call. And also, thank you so much for the super chat, Laurel. From what I understand, the Republicans want people to scream at the Democrats for this damage. They can be at power in 2028. That makes sense. I believe that. So. All right, shall we get to our final segment of. Of the. Of the show?

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah, let's. Let's land this plane, Christian.

[April Ajoy]

Ding. Finally.

[Tim Whitaker]

So the first hour or so of this show was terrible Christian. And now we're just gonna get to weird Christian.

[April Ajoy]

This one kind of. It can go either way. April, you said the F word.

[Tim Whitaker]

I know. It was just in a moment. I was just like, I. I even hesitated, like I wanted to say it. It was like my instinct because that, it felt like that level. It needed that word. And I almost said freaking. And then like, it just doesn't do it.

[April Ajoy]

And I was like, sometimes that word is needed. It just has to be said.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah.

[April Ajoy]

So this weird Christian bleep. It's. It's honestly not as weird as one would hope. It actually happens too often, but, you know, it is. It is 4th of July this weekend. I'm taking off for the weekend. It'll be good. Yeah. Yeah. Independence for white people. Great. Yay. And this church is doing a giveaway. I'm not. Let's not spoil it for the podcast audience. Let's just play the whole video and let them hear and then we'll describe what this person's holding. Here we go. Hey, everyone.

[E]

Pastor Kyle here. As a church, we can't wait to celebrate Independence Day with you. You guys, this weekend as a church. Starting off at Saturday at 6 o', clock, we have our prayer service. Sunday morning, 10am, we have our Sunday morning main event where we'll be giving away an AR15 to somebody who is of age. Could pass a background check and all that good stuff. And then we're also going to have a church barbecue at night on July 6th. So can't wait to see you guys there, bring a friend, and let's celebrate the freedoms that God has given us as a nation and as a people who call him our Lord.

[April Ajoy]

I cannot believe that video. This bro. This bro is doing church announcements. Like, you know, typical church announcements. He's wearing a backwards white cap, T shirt, shorts, and he's holding an AR15. The music is all happy. It's like, you know, hey, hey, church. Welcome, family. You're home here. Hey. It's gonna be a fun weekend at the church. We're doing picnics, and we're doing church stuff. We're also giving away this weapon that's used in most school shootings called AR15, because we just love God so much. Anyway, children's service starts in a couple of minutes. Make sure you get your kids over there. Do, like, what is happening?

[Tim Whitaker]

He also. Okay, is it just me, or is he holding it kind of awkwardly?

[April Ajoy]

I will tell you. I will tell you. My dad's a gun owner. I have. I have shot many guns in my life responsibly, and that he is not holding that gun in a really common way. I'll just put it that way. It's not very common.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah, he's just kind of like. He acts like he doesn't really know what to do with it, but he's like, this is the cool thing. We're gonna give away AR15. Because I'm a man. He's kind of. He's, like, holding it.

[April Ajoy]

I mean, I just wonder if the role of a pastor is to shepherd people, right? These are people who want to shepherd the flock, so to speak. I just don't know how giving away an AR15 fits into that mold at all. I mean, dude, give away a Bible, give away. I don't know, give away a Nintendo Switch 2. That'd be fun. That's family, you know, unifying. It's a fun thing to do. An AR15, like, out of. By the way, out of all the guns to give away, you're gonna give away the one that is used as a weapon of choice for school shooters. Like, that's. That. That's what you're giving away. Not even, like, a shotgun for hunting. You're giving away an AR15, which is only used for one thing. And you're a pastor who's shepherding people in the way of Jesus. The one who said to put away your sword, the one who was murdered by the state and resisted nonviolently. That one. Really, bro?

[Tim Whitaker]

I don't. It's so stupid, but, like, the. The. The Saddest part about this is I've seen several churches in the last few years that have given away AR15 as they're, like, at men's groups, men's events, July 4th. Honestly, I like, also like the peppy music in the background while he's holding, like a killing machine. I mean, that AR15. The intention of that gun is to kill the most people in the quickest amount of time.

[April Ajoy]

Listen to this music again, just for a second. Hey, everyone.

[E]

Pastor Kyle here. As a church, we can't wait to celebrate Independence Day with you guys this weekend.

[April Ajoy]

While holding.

[E]

Starting off at Saturday at 6 o', clock, we have our prayer service. Sunday morning, 10am we have our Sunday morning main event.

[April Ajoy]

Like. Like, the math ain't mathing, Pastor. Like what? I. I'm sorry, I. I have a hard time trusting you to properly exegete the word of God while you hold an AR15 promoting your church. Just something seems way off about that. I'm no Bible scholar, April. I just don't think, though, that's like, a Jesus ethic. I mean, call me crazy.

[Tim Whitaker]

I still just can't get over how he's holding that gun. I mean, I'm from Texas. I was raised with guns.

[April Ajoy]

Yeah.

[Tim Whitaker]

I mean, I guess he's trying to display it because you would.

[April Ajoy]

I guess it's just. It's weird.

[Tim Whitaker]

Like, you're. You're supposed to, like, hold it. Look at us. Look at us, Libs, teaching this guy how to hold a gun.

[April Ajoy]

Well, there is a. There is a horseshoe, right, where you go from, like, MAGA gun owner to leftist gun owner. That's the thing.

[Tim Whitaker]

They're.

[April Ajoy]

Yeah, a lot of leftists are like, no, dude, I own guns for a good reason. I mean, I hear you, dude. I hear you. Thank you for the super chat, Joseph. This is what happens when you mix Jesus with. With Republican politics. Absolutely. And Olivia, super chat. If only it was to overthrow an evil regime. That is a good point, Olivia. You would think that the people who have been hoarding their guns in case the government gets too big and starts arresting citizens, you would think they would start, you know, getting ready for war. But some. For some reason, they're just silent. Like all these gun owners who've been waiting for the big bad government to arrest its own people and have a military that's been weaponized against citizens. Like what happened in la. I guess it doesn't. No, it's. That's okay.

[Tim Whitaker]

No problem.

[April Ajoy]

No problem.

[Tim Whitaker]

I do have a positive announcement. Hakeem Jeffries has just set the Modern day House record with his marathon magic minute House floor speech.

[April Ajoy]

Yeah, love that.

[Tim Whitaker]

So, you know, he, what he is doing, the purpose of this is to buy time to get people to pressure those Republicans to vote no on this bill.

[April Ajoy]

That makes sense. So he's actually, he's not just stalling for fun. He's like, no, I'm giving you guys time.

[Tim Whitaker]

He's not stalling for the inevitable. He's stalling to put pressure on the representatives who can be flipped who initially voted no until Mike Johnson and Donald Trump spent all night basically who knows what they promised them to get them to vote yes.

[April Ajoy]

Right.

[Tim Whitaker]

But bullied them to get them to change their, their vote. So, right. This was going to fail at the final vote count last night when the, all the votes were in. It was set to fail and Mike Johnson refused to close the vote until he could get everybody. Until he could get the votes that he, he got. So. But it looks like it'll probably, I mean, we, I don't want. There's still hope. Go, go pester these, you know, leave comments. You could try calling their offices. We can, we could still put pressure as of Thursday, but probably tomorrow when this is on podcast, the vote will have been done. So we'll, we'll see.

[April Ajoy]

Can I make a brief announcement that we should probably tell people about some changes that are coming? Sure. So, friends, I'm not, I'm not sure how many people here know about the organization that actually like makes this show possible. The new evangelicals. I'm the founder of that organization and we recently announced this week some pretty big and great news. I am stepping aside from the role of executive director and we have a new executive director, Melinda Hale. She is amazing. She's awesome. We did a whole video on the TNE YouTube. The whole video is there. Introducing Melinda and our board members. President Rebecca giving you all kind of a sneak peek of what's to come. I have moved to the role of founder and creative director and this is a dream come true. I've been telling my board for a while that I need to be able to have, you know, someone else do the organizational development part while I could do the content part. And Melinda is an amazing human. I am so pumped for her to be in that role. So it's actually a great, great and welcome change. But there is some changes that happen behind the scenes. Nothing that's going to impact this show or how often we do it or anything like that. But when it comes to the organization, that's. That makes this work possible. We have had a shift and frankly, I feel already so relieved that there are other people handling the workload of the organizational structure that needs the attention that it really needs. So Belinda's an amazing person and we'll keep you guys all apprised of, of, you know, any big changes that are coming. But like I said, nothing is planned for changing the Tim April show. In fact, me and April keep talking about how we're only more committed to doing the show, how much we love doing it. And you know, as we said earlier, I know a lot of you feel like you're not alone with our rants and frankly, we feel like we're not alone with your responses. So it's very much a reciprocal relationship and we really appreciate you all being here and being part of the show. Tuning in for the live or maybe you listen on podcast or you watch this afterwards. Either way, if you're someone who participates in the work that we do, either on the new evangelical side or on the Tim and April side, I want to say a sincere thank you for being here. It really means the world. Doing this work is a total privilege and honor and we don't take it lightly. And we are committed to being here as long as we need to be with you guys doing this work together.

[Tim Whitaker]

Yeah, we appreciate all of you, all the super chats, all the comments, all the likes, all the subscribes, all the things, the reviews on Apple podcasts help out a lot. But yeah, you're not alone. We're not alone. We'll get through this time, we'll keep fighting and at least we can sleep at night knowing that we're on the right side of history.

[April Ajoy]

Yeah, for sure. Friends, have a great weekend. Enjoy your holiday weekend if you're taking time off for work. And we'll be here again next week live at 12:00 Eastern on Thursday. And we drop a pre recorded episode every Monday and we drop this live on podcast on Friday. So tune in anywhere you want. Follow us on Instagram. We'll talk to y' all later on. See ya.

[Tim Whitaker]

Bye, Sam.