The Tim Dillon Show – Episode 467: Bernie Sanders

Date: October 22, 2025
Host: Tim Dillon
Guest: Senator Bernie Sanders
Book discussed: Fight Oligarchy

Episode Overview

This episode of The Tim Dillon Show features a candid, far-reaching conversation between comedian-host Tim Dillon and Senator Bernie Sanders. The discussion centers on Senator Sanders' new book, Fight Oligarchy, and dives deep into America’s wealth inequality, the influence of billionaires on democracy, partisan shifts, the failures of both major political parties, immigration, social and economic policy, and America’s standing on the global stage. The episode includes sharp critiques, policy proposals, frank assessments of the current political culture, and some offbeat humor, all anchored by Sanders’ trademark consistency and moral clarity.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Core of Fight Oligarchy: Wealth, Power, and Democracy

• Sanders' Motivation for the Book

  • Sanders reiterates the urgency: “This is kind of an unprecedented moment in American history... Who owns the country? Who really has the power?” (01:12).
  • U.S. faces more wealth inequality than ever; 1 person (Elon Musk) owns more than the bottom 52% (over 150 million people) (01:12–02:14).
  • Democracy threatened by “the donor class”: “Trump, Kamala Harris, anybody in my lifetime…is backed usually by the same groups of people. They’re very wealthy, lobbyists, donors. The donor class is incredibly powerful.” – Tim Dillon (02:14)

• Citizens United and Campaign Finance Corruption

  • Sanders: “People with money always had power. But Citizens United Supreme Court decision opened the door in creating a very corrupt, corrupt campaign finance system.” (03:41)
  • Both parties are guilty; “Democratic billionaires play a very important role in selecting who the Democratic candidates are.” (04:20)
  • Sanders advocates for public funding of elections: “Let’s have campaigns based on ideas, not billionaires putting huge amounts of money into ugly 30 second ads.” (04:48)

• Obstacles to Change

  • “Mitch McConnell was one of the leaders... But the big money interests love this.” (05:38)
  • Legislative action, not the current Supreme Court, is needed to overturn Citizens United (05:18).

2. Transformations in the American Political Parties

• Republican Party Shift

  • Sanders: “What Trump has done is really transformed that party... He has created in the Republican Party a right wing extremist party. And also what worries me is... this cult of the individual.” (06:07)
  • Example: Thom Tillis pressured out for opposing Trump-backed bills (07:12-07:55).

• Democratic Party’s Drift

  • Dillon: “The Democratic Party seems to have... undergone a similar transformation away from working people and towards college educated... urban centers…” (08:12)
  • Sanders: “The Democrats more or less turned their backs on the working class... in the 1970s some Democratic leaders... began the process of moving the Democratic Party away from the working class.” (09:39–10:48)

• Achievements & Shortcomings

  • Sanders praises Democratic progress on women’s and civil rights but acknowledges failure to keep economic promises to workers (10:48–12:05).
  • “If your point is that... the Democrats... turned their backs on the working class... I would agree with you.” (12:05)

3. Public Safety, Urban Crisis, and Party Perceptions

• Big-City Challenges and Democratic Leadership
  • Dillon: “There are a lot of cities in America that are primarily run by Democrats... cities that you would... not want to live in.” (13:25)
  • Sanders acknowledges the complexity of governing cities, supports criminal justice reform but sees a balanced policing approach as necessary (15:37–17:25).
  • “Police have an enormously important role... But there are things...” (16:45)
  • Both agree current urban conditions and social disorder are unacceptable (17:25).

4. America’s Paradox of Wealth and Social Failure

• Disconnect Between Wealth and Welfare

  • “We are today the wealthiest nation in the history of the world, right? ...If we are the wealthiest... one might assume... best health care... best education... affordable housing... But nobody believes that is the case, because it's not.” – Sanders (18:18)
  • Power in hands of “a relatively small number of extraordinarily wealthy, mostly big tech type guys... they have the right to rule...” (18:18–19:54)
  • Public consensus on failures in health care, education, and opportunity (20:00).

• Historical Perspective

  • College used to be free or nearly free: “He went to college, Brooklyn College... you know how much he paid?... Zero.” (20:22)
  • Wages and benefits for critical jobs (e.g., childcare) are shamefully low (20:50).

5. Billionaires, Taxation, and Political Power

• Sanders’ Stance on Wealth Accumulation

  • “Do I think that is acceptable [Musk’s wealth]? No, I don't. I think we should have at a certain point the tax on wealth. My own guess is most people can make it on a billion dollars.” (24:26)
  • Calls for a wealth tax: “Billionaires pay an effective tax rate that is lower than a truck driver or a nurse. Does that make sense? Not to me.” (24:37)
  • Points out the need to reform America’s culture regarding wealth — respect innovation but recognize the obscenity of infinite accumulation (25:30).

• Billionaire Influence & AI

  • The unchecked power of Musk, Bezos, Ellison, Altman in AI/robotics is “kind of creepy... you’re looking at a revolution, a huge economic transformation... Who is determining what's happening? ...A handful of people are really determining the future of the world. That's scary stuff.” (26:55–28:16)

6. Immigration, Labor, and American Workers

• National Borders and Secure Border Policy

  • “So long as we have nation states... you got to have borders, right?... We should have a secure border, period.” (31:02)
  • Both parties have failed to secure the border; “Biden didn't do it. Those before him did not do it.” (31:39)

• Exploitation and Economics of Immigration

  • Sanders and Dillon agree the focus should be on targeting employers exploiting undocumented workers, not the workers themselves (32:39–33:09).
  • Points out the crime rate among undocumented communities is lower than average (34:19) and they pay taxes without receiving benefits (35:09).
  • Comprehensive immigration reform and a path to citizenship is overdue (36:55).

7. Social Policy, Culture Wars, and Democratic Strategy

• Trans Issues, Culture Wars, and Strategic Blunders

  • Dillon critiques Democrats for allowing the trans children/medicalization issue to dominate conversation, calling it “sucked the oxygen out of a lot of the conversations that you want to have…” (42:56)
  • Sanders responds: “The answer is yes, you're right. ...And I think Democrats and perhaps myself have not done as good a job as we can in dealing with it.” (42:56–43:12)

• Distraction from Core Issues

  • Sanders: “Why are we not talking about the fact that we are the only major country on earth not to guarantee health care to all people?” (44:03)
  • Healthcare, minimum wage, housing — these are the transformative issues that get lost amidst social controversies (44:24–45:34).

8. Elections, Democratic Failings, and the 2024 Outcome

• On the 2024 Loss
  • Critique of Dem party politics: “The machinery of the Democratic Party allowed that to happen... delivered the country [to Trump].” (47:35–48:19)
  • Sanders: “Kamala did not run a campaign focused on the needs of the working class... on the issues that working people are struggling with right now.” (48:19)

9. Foreign Policy: Israel, Palestine, and Ukraine

• Israel-Gaza Conflict

  • Sanders: “Hamas is a terrorist organization... Israel had a right to defend itself... [but] they went to war against the entire Palestinian people... 65,000 people are dead, 160,000 have been injured... mostly women, children and the elderly… and behind all of that was American money...” (49:35–51:36)
  • Calls Netanyahu a “war criminal” and criticizes ongoing U.S. military support (51:56).

• Change in U.S.-Israel Relations & Lobbying

  • “The very good news is [AIPAC’s] influence is beginning to wane. ...Even established Democrats are saying, ‘Not only don’t I want you, I’m going to return your donation.’” (57:58–58:32)
  • Younger Americans in both parties are “disgusted with what has gone on in Gaza” (58:32).

• Ukraine/Russia

  • Sanders argues U.S. must resist “Putin, a disgusting human being” (53:35–55:55); stopping support for Ukraine could embolden further aggression.
  • He does not support U.S. troop deployment or escalation: “Would you commit American troops...?” – “No, no, no, absolutely not.” (55:52)
  • Sanders opposes giving Zelensky long-range missiles capable of hitting Moscow (56:00).

10. Immigration, Culture, and National Cohesion

• Cultural Integration and Political Cynicism

  • Dillon: “There is this knee jerk reaction to call everybody a racist that has concerns about culture... groups of people are using and exploiting... not only America, but other successful countries... they don't care about the laws, rules, customs, culture of the country.” (59:49–62:01)
  • Sanders: “If I come into your house... You are my host... And I respect that. ...I think that basic principle is correct.” (62:01–62:10)

• Focus of Progressive Local Leaders

  • Sanders defends backing candidates like Zoran for New York, focusing on “how you can govern in a very difficult circumstance. ...how you control housing... make childcare available…” (64:11–64:33)
  • Stresses caring for both undocumented people and citizens in need, but not at the expense of either group.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Wealth and Power:
  • “Who owns the country?... Is that really what America is supposed to be about? Top 1% owns more wealth than the bottom 93%. ...60% of our people are living paycheck to paycheck.”
    — Bernie Sanders (01:12)
• On Public Funding of Elections:
  • “Let’s have campaigns based on ideas, not billionaires putting huge amounts of money into ugly 30 second ads.”
    — Bernie Sanders (04:48)
• On Campaign Finance:
  • “Mitch McConnell was one of the leaders... But the big money interests love this. Why wouldn’t they? If you’re a billionaire, you want to pick your candidate for president, hey, what’s a few hundred million dollars to you?”
    — Bernie Sanders (05:38)
• On Party Realignment:
  • “Democrats more or less turned their backs on the working class of this country and the enormous crises facing working people, I would agree with you, if that's your point.”
    — Bernie Sanders (12:05)
• On American Wealth Paradox:
  • “If we are the wealthiest nation in the history of the world, one might assume that we have the best health care system ...but nobody believes that is the case because it's not.”
    — Bernie Sanders (18:18)
• On the Bizarre Power of Billionaires:
  • “You have much say in it now? Got a handful of people who are really determining the future of the world. That's scary stuff.”
    — Bernie Sanders (28:16)
• On Immigration:
  • “You got to have borders, right? ...We should have a secure border, period. I think most people in the Congress agree with that.”
    — Bernie Sanders (31:02)
• On Cultural Integration:
  • “If I come into your house... You are my host... And I respect that.”
    — Bernie Sanders (62:06)
• On Health Care:
  • “We are the only major country on earth not to guarantee health care to all people... If you end up in a hospital in Canada, you know what the bill is? Zero.”
    — Bernie Sanders (44:03, 44:46)
• On Israel-Gaza:
  • “They went to war against the entire Palestinian people. ...mostly women, children and the elderly… and behind all of that was American money.”
    — Bernie Sanders (49:35–51:36)
• On AIPAC:
  • “AIPAC has spread money around all over the place... They have played a terrible, terrible role in trying to win support for Netanyahu. ...their influence is beginning to wane.”
    — Bernie Sanders (57:58)
• On His Image:
  • “I talk to my European friends, they say, hey Bernie, I don’t want to hurt your feelings, but in Europe you would not be considered all that radical.”
    — Bernie Sanders (59:21)

Timestamps for Important Segments

• Main theme and book intro – 00:30
• Wealth inequality & oligarchy – 01:12
• Citizens United & Campaign finance – 03:23
• Party transformations (GOP & Dems) – 06:07–12:05
• Urban crisis, crime, policing – 13:24–18:18
• Billionaires & AI/Robotics Fears – 24:06–28:16
• Immigration (economic & social issues) – 28:36–37:53
• Trans/’Culture War’ issues – 42:56–44:03
• Healthcare, economics, focus of politics – 44:03–45:34
• 2024 Election, Dem party failure – 47:36–49:22
• Israel/Gaza, AIPAC, U.S. role – 49:22–58:32
• Ukraine/Russia – 53:29–56:18
• Integration/cultural issues – 59:49–62:10
• Local politics, Zoran, NYC – 62:17–64:44

Conclusion

This intense, free-wheeling interview reveals Bernie Sanders’ commitment to challenging entrenched power and championing economic and social equality. At the same time, it spotlights how his positions, once considered radical in the U.S., are increasingly mainstream among ordinary Americans frustrated by inequality, establishment party politics, and cultural gridlock. With Tim Dillon as an incisive, often sympathetic interlocutor, Sanders lays out both the problems and the pathways forward — targeting oligarchy, restoring democracy, and building a society where economic security is not a luxury and public discourse can move beyond artificial divides.

For more:

• Fight Oligarchy by Bernie Sanders
• thetimdillonshow.com