247. Matt Johnson: Jelly Roll’s Weight Loss, Running 842 Miles & Escaping Addiction

Summary

Podcast Summary: The Ultimate Human with Gary Brecka

Episode 247
Guest: Matt Johnson
Date: February 24, 2026
Title: Matt Johnson: Jelly Roll’s Weight Loss, Running 842 Miles & Escaping Addiction

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Overview

This episode presents an inspiring deep dive into the life and philosophy of ultra-endurance athlete and coach Matt Johnson. Host Gary Brecka explores Matt's journey—from overcoming childhood trauma and addiction, to finding purpose through military service and ultra-running, to working with individuals like Jelly Roll on transformative health and weight loss journeys. Both men explore the themes of pain turning into purpose, the power of embracing failure, building community through suffering, and the importance of helping others achieve their best selves.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Mental Game of Ultra-Endurance

• The Real Barrier: The Mind
  • Matt insists that “any fit person can run 100 miles," but mental limits stop most people.

    “I truly believe any fit person can run 100 miles, but I don't believe that. The reason why they don't is because you can't beat this right here.” —Matt Johnson [00:00]

• Overcoming Fear of Failure
  • Both reflect on how many set goals only within their comfort zones to avoid the feeling of failure.

  • "We subconsciously don't want to set ourselves up for failure. We either don't try or we do things that we know we can complete." —Gary Brecka [00:07]

2. Matt Johnson's Background: Trauma, Survival, and Finding Purpose

• Growing Up in Hardship
  • Raised by a young single mother in a small town, Matt survived poverty, abuse, and instability—eventually witnessing his mother’s pill addiction and suicide attempt.

  • “My mom got pregnant with me when she was 17... My dad was out of the picture from the beginning. It was me and my mom.” —Matt Johnson [10:40]

  • “[My stepfather] was a really good guy at first. And then… shit started just really getting bad. It started with emotional abuse, then physical." —Matt Johnson [11:50]

• Military as Escape and Identity
  • Enlisted in the National Guard at 18 to escape his environment, but quickly returned to destructive behaviors—partying, drinking, jail.
• Cycles of Self-Destruction; Turning Points
  • After returning, a self-destructive lifestyle intensified. Hitting rock bottom, Matt discovered help through David Goggins’s book "Can't Hurt Me", which mirrored his trauma and inspired change.

  • “Reading that book flipped my entire perspective on everything... If this guy can do it, why can I not do it?” —Matt Johnson [24:21]

3. Ultra-Running as Therapy and Transformation

• Running to Reclaim Control

  • Running became Matt’s outlet to own his pain, process trauma, and build a new identity. He started ultrarunning only in 2021.

  • “It was the only time in my life that I was able to control the pain that I was in. No one else had any control over me.” —Matt Johnson [26:16]

• Breakthrough Achievements

  • Ran across Texas twice (842 miles in 17 days, both directions—the only person to do so).
  • Transitions into coaching, building community, and leveraging social media for a positive message.

4. Working with Jelly Roll & Transforming Others

• Accountability and Small Goals
  • Matt moved in with Jelly Roll to coach him through a weight loss journey (over 260 lbs lost). His accountability and shared suffering were transformative.

  • “My first workout [with Jelly] was like a five-minute walk and ten seconds of—I use the term run very loosely.” —Matt Johnson [43:10]

• On the Power of Consistency and Team
  • “When you are doing something and you're suffering, when you know that the person next to you is suffering, it changes everything.” —Matt Johnson [33:33 / 62:38]

5. Failure as Foundation

• Most Fail More Than Succeed

  • Matt demystifies his success by sharing that he’s failed more ultra-races than he’s finished.

  • “What a lot of people don't know about me is I've actually DNF'd more ultramarathons than I finished.” —Matt Johnson [46:29]

  • “I'm not afraid to fail. That's why I truly believe I'm different. And if you want to be different, you have to not be afraid to fail either.” —Matt Johnson [46:41]

• Bit-by-Bit Progress Matters Most

  • Set a small goal, accept that you’ll fail sometimes, and know that the real measure is returning and trying again.

  • “Tomorrow, if you're fit enough, go run a mile...you'll want to quit. What do you do the next day? Because what you do the next day defines who you really want to be.” —Matt Johnson [47:18]

6. The Power of Presence

• Being in the Moment
  • Gary emphasizes the importance of presence, especially during extreme events.

  • “This is the last time that it will be the first time. So just be present. Just take this all in, because this is an amazing moment." —Gary Brecka [48:54]

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• “You can't beat this right here.” —Matt Johnson, pointing to his head [00:00]
• “The truth is, I’ve had soccer moms sit in that chair that have had more impact on humanity than the smartest, most qualified PhDs.” —Gary Brecka [02:20]
• “If you want to get into fitness, have someone with you... when you know that the person next to you is suffering, it changes everything.” —Matt Johnson [33:33 / 62:38]
• “I'm not afraid to fail. That’s why I’m different.” —Matt Johnson [47:00]
• “To me, being the ultimate human is helping others.” —Matt Johnson [66:45]

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Major Segments & Timestamps

| Timestamp | Topic/Segment | |-----------|---------------| | 00:00 | Matt on the mental battle of ultrarunning | | 03:34 | Matt’s background: poverty, trauma, addiction, military | | 21:40 | Marcus’s trauma: Losing friends, Matt’s search for self-help | | 24:21 | Discovering Goggins, finding purpose | | 26:16 | Running as therapy, reclaiming control | | 36:54 | Texas Run: The logistics and inspiration for 842-mile challenge | | 41:59 | Jelly Roll coaching relationship, initial state, progress | | 46:29 | Failing at ultrarunning more than finishing—embracing failure | | 47:18 | Advice for people starting out—small, repeatable goals | | 48:54 | Presence during hard moments—“this is the last time it will be the first time” | | 53:48 | Story: Cole’s World Race, coping with adversity | | 56:34 | The real message: Achievement is about doing the unimaginable for you | | 58:31 | New challenge: Running 250 miles from Times Square to White House | | 63:06 | Post-race depression and loss of identity after big goals | | 66:45 | What does it mean to be an Ultimate Human?—Helping others |

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Notable Announcements

• Next Big Goal:
  Matt will run 250 miles from Times Square to the White House on July 4, carrying a flag in honor of Iowa National Guard members lost in Syria.

  “I'm gonna run 250 miles from Times Square to the front lawn of the White House on the Fourth of July.” —Matt Johnson [58:31]

• The Losers Run Club:
  One of the largest running support communities (on Strava & Facebook), focused on mutual encouragement, inspired by Matt and Jelly Roll’s journeys.

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Takeaway Lessons

• Pain—even extreme trauma—can be transformed into purpose.
• Failure is inevitable and not something to be feared; only not trying is true failure.
• Start small. Set goals and recommit after setbacks.
• Community—shared suffering and mutual support—amplifies resilience and success.
• The journey is more important than the destination; cherish the process.
• The ultimate human is someone who uplifts, inspires and helps others.

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How to Connect with Matt Johnson

• Instagram: @mattjohnson
• YouTube: Matt Johnson Runner
• Google: “Matt Johnson Runner”

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This powerful conversation reinforces that extraordinary transformation and achievement start with accepting pain, daring to fail, building community, and ultimately, being of service to others.

Transcript

[Matt Johnson]

I truly believe any fit person can run 100 miles, but I don't believe that. The reason why they don't is because you can't beat this right here.

[Gary Brecker]

I think we subconsciously don't want to set ourselves up for failure. We either don't try or we do things that we know we can complete.

[Matt Johnson]

I have, like, official 100 mile races. I think I've done five, and I think I finished two. Did Texas in 24. I did east to west. I just did it this October, north to south. I'm the only man to cross Texas both ways. Fastest man to do it both ways and the only man to do it both ways.

[Gary Brecker]

It doesn't cost you anything to just get off your couch and set a goal and just start.

[Matt Johnson]

If you want to get into fitness, have someone with you. When you are doing something and you're suffering, when you know that the person next to you is suffering, it changes everything.

[Gary Brecker]

For somebody that is coming from a similar place to where you were, where do they start?

[Matt Johnson]

I'm not afraid to fail. I truly believe, like, that's why I'm different. And if you want to be different, you have to not be.

[Gary Brecker]

Ultimate human. Hey, guys, welcome back to the Ultimate Human podcast. I'm your host, human biologist Gary Brecker, where we go down the road of everything. Anti aging, biohacking, longevity, and everything in between. And today's podcast is going to be a really, really special one because I just followed and. And spent the last 48 hours with this podcast guest. Really got to know him, see his heart, see, see, like, how he thinks and operates. His story is absolutely phenomenal. Get ready to be inspired. Get ready to have the limits of what you think you can accomplish in your life just absolutely blown. And when you hear this man talk about his pain to purpose, I think it's going to be very, very inspiring for you. So welcome to the podcast. Matt Johnson. Yeah, brother, this is. This is awesome, man. We've. We've had a pretty incredible 48 hours.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Yeah, it's cool to. You know, usually when you walk into a podcast. Right. Like, you just know somebody by, like, a sheet of paper. Yeah. Or know somebody by videos you've seen or, you know, but, like, being able to meet you, you meet. You know, us being together for 48 hours is really cool to. Because now I'm sitting here and I just. I feel like I know you.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah, dude. I felt like I spent my whole life, and for my audience purposes, I'm going to talk a lot about your background but this is the fastest man to ever run across a statistic of Texas. And, and when people think like, okay, we ran across the state of Texas, realize that's 842 miles that he did in a little over 17 days. And I want to sort of back the story up because, you know, there's a theme that runs through a lot of my podcast guests. Like some of the most impactful, purpose driven people, passionate people I've ever had on this podcast have solved the problem in their life. And they've either taken the pain in their life and turned it into their purpose and made a big impact, or they solved the major problem. And they're not always the most credentialed. Like, you know, my podcast is about longevity and anti aging and biohacking and, and you would think it's like all these great PhDs or MDs or researchers, but the truth is I've had, I've had soccer moms sit in that chair that have had more impact on humanity than, than the smartest, most qualified PhD. And I think that you fit that category. And I'd love for you to talk a little bit about your background in the military. Not everything was roses. Right. A little bit of time in the popo.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah, you've been in jail a couple of times.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah, a couple of times. But who hasn't?

[Matt Johnson]

I mean, everybody's been in jail. Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

And you know, I would love for you to talk about that. And then I definitely want to get into our journey with Jelly Roll because, you know, I was working with Jelly early on in his weight loss journey. But when you parachuted in and moved in with him, everything changed for Jelly. Like, and his accountability changed, his mindset changed. I mean, you had a demonstrative impact on this man and his capacity to drop 260 pounds. You know, we were talking before the podcast about all of the demons he was struggling with.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

But first I want to tell, you know, your story for, for my audience from military to 842 miles across the state of Texas.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah, yeah, it was very friggin mind numbing. Yeah, it was very unplanned and sorry if I have a raspy voice or my lips are chapped.

[Gary Brecker]

And you did a lot of yelling.

[Matt Johnson]

I did a lot of yell.

[Gary Brecker]

I heard a lot of. Matt yelled for 24 and a half straight.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, we, yeah, the boys at 100 yesterday and 100 miles. And we're, we're, we're a little cooked too.

[Gary Brecker]

Both of us.

[Matt Johnson]

Both.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah, but dude, but I Got to tell you, man, you got my son and Kyle and the Nelk boys and those runners, six of them, safely across a hundred miles. And, dude, it's semi trucks going six feet away from us, 80 miles an hour. I mean, the wind would almost blow us over.

[Matt Johnson]

And I. I mean, a lot of people don't know. I mean, I would say the entire. The entire operation doesn't know that. The crew that made this possible is the Texas crew that I had.

[Gary Brecker]

Oh, really?

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. I mean, it was just me, Drew, who was out there shooting.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Crew chief Rob.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And Amanda. I mean, we're missing one. One of my crew members from Texas. And, yeah, as soon as Kyle hit me up and was like, yo, like, I want to do this. And then I heard about how the operation was going to be, I was like. I was like, I need to bring a couple of people in.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And, you know, just, you know, obviously make this part quick. But, yeah, I mean, it was very, you know, Crew chief Rob crewed me across America. He's crewed Paul Johnson or crewed me across Texas.

[Gary Brecker]

Okay.

[Matt Johnson]

He crewed Paul Johnson across America.

[Gary Brecker]

Okay.

[Matt Johnson]

He holds his own 100 mile records, you know, and he. So he knows how to do that. I'm like, I need to bring Robin. Amanda, you know, my fiance, Amanda. I'm like, I need to bring her in because she's crewed me. You know, she can help crew the boys as well, knowing what they need. Drew, you know, he's obviously the filmer, but he's done. You know, he has so many documentaries on YouTube about running.

[Gary Brecker]

Okay.

[Matt Johnson]

But I knew having him there know Kyle has his own filmers, but I'm like, hey, if you bring Drew on to film, you're going to have a second. You know, you're going to have somebody else that knows what's going on.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And, you know, so, yeah, the.

[Gary Brecker]

The amount of logistics dude was mind numbing to me. I mean, I was in Cole's chase van, so my. My every. Every athlete had their own assigned band, so I was in the one assigned to my son.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

And. Or five of us in there, you know, Andy, who's like the. The. The absolute best guru of endurance running, was blessing to have him. Yeah. But Cole's sister, you know, myself, his fiance Megan, you know, we were all in that van for. For 24 hours. I got in 20 miles on my accidentally.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Yeah. That's how it happens. That's exactly how it happens. Like I. I told Amanda when we wrapped up, I'm like, holy, I'M like, that was 54 miles.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And there was times where I wasn't, you know, I was running back. Like that was just running.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

You know, when I would be running, when I would stay up there, I would start my watch.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And so like, that doesn't even count. Back to the van, to the front of the van, to the back. You know when I would come back to talk to you guys and I'm like, didn't stop.

[Gary Brecker]

No, we, the gun went off and we moved for 100 straight miles. And I was watching the comments on YouTube because they live streamed it and I was watching the comments on YouTube and I would say 70% of the people in the comments gave them a zero percent chance of finishing.

[Matt Johnson]

All 100%. They.

[Gary Brecker]

100% of the people said there's no way six that started are going to come across the finish line together.

[Matt Johnson]

So the beat the odds, for sure. 100%. No one believed in them from the start. Like, like from the time that I got attached to it in November, you know, I was going through comments on Instagram and, and people were like, there's no way you're going to run 100 miles.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. Like Kyle Forgard.

[Matt Johnson]

And but that's the thing is like, you know, which, I mean, we'll probably dive into this later too. But like, there's a lot of people out there that don't really actually know what you're. What they're capable of.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

You know, because running 100 miles is pretty easy. You know, I mean, and when I say that, I mean easy. When I say that I, you know, this is what I called, this is what I told all the boys is I'm like, I truly believe any fit person can run 100 miles, but I don't believe that, that the reason why they don't is because you can't beat this right here. Like, that's why the, the 001% that do finish the ultra marathon, the 100 mile distance, they're able to conquer this.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And that's the problem with everybody else is that they can't conquer this. So they're never gonna know.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. You know, I, I remember when we crossed the, the 32 mile mark, in the back of my mind, I was like, okay, every single one of these guys is in uncharted territory, including my son.

[Matt Johnson]

Y.

[Gary Brecker]

They have. None of them have been further than this point. So up till now, up to 32 miles, they're like, okay, I've done that before.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

But now I need to go more than double this distance. And I have no idea if my body is going to break down and be able to carry this. And, and they were all in that uncharted waters. I mean basically not, not, not knowing if they could finish or not. But I want to circle back to your background, you know, because I, I want to delve into that pain into purpose journey for you. Because a lot of people listening to this, you know, there's another common theme that runs through my podcast. A lot of people are like, well, how do I find my purpose? I mean I, the, the thought of completing a hundred mile race and doing something that epic and that difficult just to prove to no one other than myself that I can do it is not something that I can wrap my arms around.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

And maybe starting with goal that lofty is, you know, way out of bounds. But how did this journey start with you? From the military to ultra endurance, ultra endurance competition. I mean you've got, you, you, you, you've won multiple races in the 5K 100, 100K, 100 mile distance. You know, you covered 840 some miles across the state of Texas. Like go back to the beginning of what did that journey look like?

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. And it's been a process for me of, of doing that on my own now as an adult. Right. Because there's times where I'm living this life and I kind of sit back and I'm like, how the hell am I here? You know, you know, so you know, I think, I think reflection is very important, you know, starting to. How, how did you get to the military?

[Gary Brecker]

Right.

[Matt Johnson]

Like, like, like why? Because that's not a choice that a lot of people make.

[Gary Brecker]

Right.

[Matt Johnson]

And you know, I was born in a small town. We didn't have stoplights. Like it was that small. The nearest Walmart was 15 minutes away.

[Gary Brecker]

Okay.

[Matt Johnson]

So we had a gas station and like a convenience store.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And was born and taken back to a double wide trailer. And my mom got pregnant with me when she was 17. My dad was, you know, was out of the picture from the very beginning. And it was me and my mom.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And you know, my grandparents, you know, were around and my mom was working two jobs all the way. You know, I mean, shoot, until as far as I can remember, she was working two jobs, she was driving, she was commuting an hour to work a 9 to 5 and driving an hour back and then working overnights at the gas station. And then, and so I was rotating a lot through my grandparents house and you know, fast forwarding my mom Got married when I was probably 10. And that was where. That was where all of the trauma really, like, where it started. And at that point, I had a little brother who was probably three. So actually I was probably 12. My little brother was about four or five. Because, like, we would have same dad. No.

[Gary Brecker]

Okay.

[Matt Johnson]

No. No. So my brother and I. My brother and I both have. We have different dads. And then my mom was engaged to his dad. And then that broke off, and then she. She got married. She's been married once. And, you know, she was married to this man who was. He was a really good guy at first. And then, you know, about six months in, shit started just really getting bad. There was a lot of. Started with, you know, emotional abuse. Like, I remember a time that I tell a lot where my mom went to work and my little brother and I were locked in a bedroom the entire time that she was gone. Like, just like you, like. Like dare, like, chair to the door. And we were locked in a bedroom for 10 hours. Wow. And trying to comfort my brother through that as I'm 13.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

You know, and I'm not understanding, like, why the hell am I locked in a bedroom? You know, And I'm trying to figure out, and I can't get out. And then, you know, then it turned into physical abuse. And, you know, he was. You know, we. We moved around a lot. We were moving around to different. She was a government contractor. And. Yeah. You know, it got to the point where, you know, I remember a time where my mom was drug by her hair to her bedroom, and I watched that happen. My little brother watched that happen. And it got to the point where my mom started. My mom became addicted to pills because she was trying to exit that life.

[Gary Brecker]

Right.

[Matt Johnson]

Or. Or at least numb it.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And unfortunately, in the pill addiction, you know, she. She got so far deep, she tried to commit suicide.

[Gary Brecker]

Wow.

[Matt Johnson]

And. And I tell the story of me coming home and finding her face down on the floor in the kitchen.

[Gary Brecker]

How old were you at that time?

[Matt Johnson]

I was in high school at that point, so probably 16.

[Gary Brecker]

Okay.

[Matt Johnson]

And she was taken away for, like, three days. Like. Like. Like, if you. If you. I guess if you, like, try to commit suicide, they take you and they, like, lock you up, like, in a facility.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Especially if it's. Yeah. And so I remember, like, she was gone for, like, three or four days. She came back and she, like, sat me down and, you know, because I was old enough, she's like. She's like, I didn't want to. Like, this isn't me.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Like, I just. We. I have to get. We have to get out of here.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And. But. But she was scared. And, you know, that process led to. That conversation led to. He smashed her face off of the front of a car and knocked her teeth out. And it became a big debacle. And he left. Like. Like, we might. It was a big ordeal that doesn't need to be talked about, but he left and. And at that point, you know, there was a. He put us in a situation where my. Like, he didn't want my mom to work, you know, the controlling or. He had access to everything, the bank accounts, the cars, the. And when he left, he took everything. We had nothing. I mean, he drained the bank accounts. We had no car. Like, it was. It was. I remember it was just. It was bad.

[Gary Brecker]

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[Matt Johnson]

And from that point on, you know, obviously everything started to get better, but then I had to watch my mom, like, battle, you know, kind of like I did when I was a kid, right? Like, where she did everything she could to put food in and. And give us shelter. You know, just, you know, back to working two jobs, right? And she was working overnights. I was taking my brother to school. She was, you know, she was grinding. And that is where I get my endurance from. I know that I. I know that I get my endurance and my drive and my will. And why I am here is because of. Because of who I watch my mother being.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And, you know, so. But I think in that process that led me to, like, you know, 17, as I turned 18 and I was a senior, I was like, I need to get out of here. Yeah. Like, I've been like, I didn't, like where, like, Amanda and I talk all the time. She's like, I want to. I haven't. We've been together three years, and I haven't taken her back home because I. I don't think I want to go.

[Gary Brecker]

Right.

[Matt Johnson]

And I haven't been back to that town since I. Since I left.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. And you know, now is your brother still in pictures? Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. So he actually, he just moved to Austin.

[Gary Brecker]

Did he.

[Matt Johnson]

Okay. Yeah. So he, you know, he, he went through. Actually the. He went through a big trauma that led. That ended up me is. That's why I'm here. But yeah, so he, he lives in Austin now. But, you know, so I, I joined the military and what age?

[Gary Brecker]

18.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah, 18. And I left for basic training at 19. Okay. So I had like a seven month waiting period until I left for basic training. And yeah, it was, you know, I actually, we were talking about this. I think I was talking to Kyle or somebody yesterday while you're running. I was like, there was no, like, I was a child. Like, I can't.

[Gary Brecker]

We're talking about 18 year baby.

[Matt Johnson]

I had no clue. Like, I didn't even know. I didn't know how to do like, you know, I mean, I knew how to do laundry, but you know what I mean? Like, like, like I don't know how to wake up on my own, you know, like, when you're 18, you can't

[Gary Brecker]

find your ass with both hands.

[Matt Johnson]

No. And like when I got there, and that was my first time ever away from my mom and obviously through the single motherhood, to my brother, to all that trauma. Like that, like, that got me.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Being away and like, that was hard. And you know, basic training, they just, you know, they break you down. And it took me, it probably took me a little bit over a month to really adapt and be like, oh, like, I'm not leaving. Like, like, like I made this out of this. I made this choice. And like, I, like, I'm here. Like, this is it. But so what I did is I joined the National Guard because I was nervous going active duty and leaving my mother like that. Because National Guard, you come back home, right? And it's like, oh, two weeks, two weeks in the summer, you know, one week in a month. So this. So I go, I leave basic training, I come back home, right back to that toxic environment that I left and that turned into. I lived with four dudes. We were partying, drinking, doing drugs every night. I went to jail twice. I was fighting, you know, Like, I'm so surprised those couple. I was not kicked out of the military. Like, I was a. I was not a good. Like, I came back and I just, I got swept into this toxic environment of, of where I grew up. But now as an adult, and now I can make my own decisions around Here, like, you know, like, just in. And I just, I look at that timeframe and I'm like, holy shit. Like, how did I not really implode?

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And I mean, because I, I, when I first got in the military, I like, I have a picture of myself from like, 2014 of just, like, man boobs. Like, like, I, I, I was this body and I was almost £180.

[Gary Brecker]

Oh, my God.

[Matt Johnson]

From drinking, smoking weed every day. Just like, just horrible. I mean, I'm talking every single day. I was drunk every night, like, just, just all the time.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And it was, I think, because I just never, I never faced those demons that I had. I tried, I left.

[Gary Brecker]

Right.

[Matt Johnson]

But then I came right back to that same environment. It's what happened. That's why people end up failing at things they try.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And what led me to the ultra running. Right. I think is where we're, where we're, where we're going with this.

[Gary Brecker]

I want to hear.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. So to 2021. In that, in that time frame, I moved out of that town. I got out of that partying phase. I actually, I went act. I got an active duty job in the military.

[Gary Brecker]

Okay.

[Matt Johnson]

Such a blessing. So I'm, I was in the National Guard, but I did almost five years active duty.

[Gary Brecker]

Okay.

[Matt Johnson]

Where I worked full time at Camp Dodge, which is Iowa's largest National Guard base. So I worked at. Crazy enough, Right. Like, like during those days of me doing drugs, I got a job at Midwest Counter Drug.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Where I was, I'm not even kidding. Like, I'm pretty sure I was still, like, smoking weed. And, and I was going to work at Counter Drug, where we were training law enforcement to, like. Yeah, to, like, kick indoors and find drugs. It was, it was crazy. But got an active duty job, moved up to Des Moines, the capital, you know, was making, I made E5 sergeant. Was making probably, you know, four grand a month. Got married very young, probably 20, 22, 23, to someone who was 19, 20. And it was, you know, it was a, it was a, it was a great marriage, but we were babies and I was, and I was still a very shitty person.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And you know, that, you know, that led me to. When I moved to Austin, you know, there's more. I'll cover in the middle. But, you know, went through a divorce, moved to Austin. But what got me into the ultra sport was Marcus, my little brother in 2021, had two friends that were murdered, and he was, Marcus was 16. And then those two boys, the two brothers were 7, were 16 and 18.

[Gary Brecker]

They were brothers.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. And they were his best friends. And, and to try to kind of just be completely transparent and tell you the bond that they had. My little brother's mixed and is dark, like dark skin. And we lived in, in rural Iowa. Right. Where that is not. He was the only dark kid in this town.

[Gary Brecker]

Right.

[Matt Johnson]

And these two kids, I have their names tattooed right here. Devonte and Malachi. They moved into town and they were also mixed. And so there was a bond between them because, you know, there was a lot of racism towards them and hatred. And they bonded because they were all, you know, when they, when they became friends, they were, I don't know, seven, eight, nine years old.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

You know, and then they grew up together. Unfortunately, they, you know, they were murdered. Not in this small town up in the city, in Des Moines when they were splitting time with their moms. I think they just got caught up in the wrong crowd, in the wrong crowd as they were getting older and they were splitting time between mom and dad. So I started looking for ways self help. I'm like, because my brother dropped out of high school, he just, he locked himself in his room, said, I'm not, I'm not going to school. He gained over 150 pounds.

[Gary Brecker]

Oh my God.

[Matt Johnson]

And, and like, like at one point he was, I'm pretty sure he was three hundred and some pounds at, at five foot five. I mean he, and he, he just locked himself in his room, wouldn't leave, wouldn't, like, wouldn't do anything but just eat. And so I, I, I'm like, I like, like you're he's going to die.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

You know, and I'm like, I need to. And this was seven, eight months that this happened like that, you know, because this was January. They were killed. And I didn't, I didn't get to this point until fall.

[Gary Brecker]

Right.

[Matt Johnson]

So I just got on Google and I'm like, self help books.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And sure enough, first thing that pops up is Can't Hurt Me by David Goggins. And I, and, and the only reason, the only reason I was attracted to this book is because it was wrote by a Navy seal. I had no idea. And I'm like, oh, like this guy's in the military, writes a book, you know, like, cool, let's read it. Reading that book, you know, I was like, Marcus, like, we're going to read this book together. Reading that book flipped my entire perspective on everything. And it wasn't the fact of like the stay hard, woo woo bullshit is not what drew me to Goggins? It was the. If you go and you read those first three chapters. He was abused. His father was an abuser. His. Like, they were poor. Yeah, they were. It was him and his brother I related to. I'm like, how in the hell did this guy write a book and go through this?

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And I'm like, who am I?

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

I'm like, I'm like, that was me. Like, like, I, I. That happened to me. I'm like, in this guy's writing books and is one of the most well known runners of all time. I'm like. And at that point in my life, I hated the military. I was making excuses. I was still drinking. It was post Covid.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And I was in, like at that point, I was still drinking. I was, you know, just, I still just wasn't a good person. I wasn't where I wanted to be. So what I did is I am not a great reader or writer. I started listening to the book and three times a week I would go out to the, the track on Camp Dodge and it was a two mile like loop and I would run four loops, eight miles, and in like Walmart shoes. You know, like, I just, I. And I didn't, you know, in a hoodie and a sweatpant. Yeah. No clue what I was doing. And I just would. And I would listen to his book. And I'm, I'm not kidding. I probably listened to that book since 2021. I've probably listened to that book 15 times.

[Gary Brecker]

Wow.

[Matt Johnson]

And to just remind myself like, who I can be. Because he did it.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

You know, not the stay hard, you know, no rest days. Like, no, no, that's not me at all. It's just like, if, if this guy can do it, why can I not do it?

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And that's what I'm trying to preach to my audience.

[Gary Brecker]

That was the early days of you just starting to run. Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Like even. Even.

[Matt Johnson]

And I didn't start running until I didn't start actually running full time. Like running 30, 40 miles a week until April of 2021.

[Gary Brecker]

Wow. And now we're here because Texas was 2022, right?

[Matt Johnson]

No, Texas was 2024 and 2025. I've done it twice.

[Gary Brecker]

Right.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Wow. So I mean, would you say that you just fell in love with that or it was an escape? Because, I mean, that's like really hard for me.

[Matt Johnson]

I think the reason I fell into the love of running is because it was the only time in my life that I was able to control the pain that I was in. No one else had any control over me.

[Gary Brecker]

Right.

[Matt Johnson]

And I controlled the pain. I controlled, like, if you want to quit, you can quit.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And, and, and I've been through a lot of things in life and a lot of situations where I was unable to have control over what was happening to me.

[Gary Brecker]

So you, you sort of start to fall in love with this. Maybe not for the reasons that most people think, like conditioning and.

[Matt Johnson]

No. I was running early on. I was from everything.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

I was using that time of running as long as I could.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

70, 80, 90 miles a week. And I had no idea what I was doing. I wasn't even eating food while I was doing it. But I was using that time because I was able to. In that moment, I was able to exit the fact that I hated my marriage, I hated the military. I wasn't who I wanted to be. And I just. And when I ran, I was. I found out that I like that person.

[Gary Brecker]

And so then this morphs into you reconnecting with your faith.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

You kind of really dedicating yourself to the sport. I mean, because you're, you're an iconic figure in the sport and eventually it morphs into you moving in and, and living with jelly roll.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Which is, I mean, you know, the, the, the, the 16 year old you looking at, you know, the 28 year old, you would have to be like, wow.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

I never thought that I would be here.

[Matt Johnson]

No.

[Gary Brecker]

You know, literally earning and gaining the trust of one of the most iconic, you know, musicians. Maybe, Maybe in all time. Certainly in the, in that crossover rap country.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Right now, for sure. Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

So, so you start running. Did you set this goal for yourself? That said, I'm just going to do something really, really epic because, you know, Jesse Itzler talks about this all the time. The Masogi.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Right. Yep. That, that, that one thing you should do every year that, that, you know, you only have a few. 50. 50 shot.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

completing. And I think most of us don't. I think we subconsciously don't want to set ourselves up for failure. So we either don't try or we do things that we know we can.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Complete. So we set our goal so low. So for you, when was the, when was that big, bold, audacious goal set where you were like, okay, I'm going to run 842 miles across the state of freaking Texas?

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Okay, you want, you want to fast forward to Texas?

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. So what happened was, you know, just to, to Quickly get to. Quickly get caught up. Yeah. February 2023. You know, I had. I had been travel, like, I had been traveling. I'd been racing, you know, Iron Mans. And I was in the military. And the military's like, you know, we don't want you doing this. And at that point, I was a recruiter and I was like, hey, like, I can. Like, that's what Goggins did. I was like, I can recruit kids by using this Instagram platform if I can build it. Like, can you guys help me? And they're like, no. Like, we don't. We don't. We don't like this. Like, we don't want you doing this.

[Gary Brecker]

What you think?

[Matt Johnson]

I don't know. I. I think, you know, I. I don't think that's the military in general. I had horrific leadership.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Like, everyone on my team was fat. Everyone was out of shape. Like, it was the small town Iowa. It was the small town Iowa vibe within the Iowa boys in the Iowa National Guard. Like. Like, you know, well, that's not normal. We don't do that, you know, And. And, like, they didn't. They didn't. I didn't have any type of support from me saying, I want to do hard things and post about it on Instagram so people can see it. But I never even had. Like, I didn't even think. I never once in my life was like, I'm going to be an influencer.

[Gary Brecker]

Right?

[Matt Johnson]

Or, you know, like, I was just like, hey, people are loving. Like, people are telling me that I'm just inspiring them to run. And, you know, like, this is cool. Really. Like the biggest moment of my entire life, the turning point moment was I came home from Austin and my ex wife met me in the kitchen and was like, I want a divorce as soon as I walked in the door.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And I. We had been having horrific problems. I was. I was a horrible person. I was a liar. I was a manipulator. I was. I was horrific.

[Gary Brecker]

And.

[Matt Johnson]

But I never. I knew that I didn't. I knew I needed to get out of that, but I, as a man, couldn't make that choice.

[Gary Brecker]

Right?

[Matt Johnson]

Because I felt like it was my job to, like, I don't, I guess, be a shitty person, but I was in this, you know, I'm like, I can't say no. Like, I'm in. You know, and she met me in the kitchen. She's like, I want a divorce. And that was. I got home from Austin on Monday. That was Monday. On Friday night, I was sitting in My upstairs bedroom. She immediately left. My mom had come over. My brother was there, and I was sitting. My upstairs bedroom. And I loaded a shotgun and put it right to my jaw.

[Gary Brecker]

Wow.

[Matt Johnson]

And I was sitting, and I was going. I was going to take my life sitting on the floor in my bedroom. And by the grace of, like, God, calling me to Austin. I'm not even joking. I get a text message from a friend, this text message, phone call. I don't know. And. And it pops up, and I see his name, Harrison Zacher. And he was in Austin because he. He. When I. When I was leaving Austin on that Monday, he was like, oh, because he lives in the Midwest and it's cold, and that's why we bonded. And he's like, I'm not. He's like, I'm not leaving Austin. He's like, I'm gonna stay here for like a month. He goes, he's online coach. And he's like, I'm just gonna chill down here. As soon as he texted me, something in me, I saw his name, and it said, go. Like, within me. It was like, go to Austin. And I. I picked up my phone, I texted him, I was like, are you still in Austin? And he's like, yeah, dude. And I go, I'm coming tomorrow. I'll. I'll explain more.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And he's like, okay. And I. I packed a duffel bag. Yeah, Actually, it wasn't a duffel bag to be completely real. It was a, like, broken hamper that I'm pretty sure we still have that. That black hamper that's, like, missing a handle. This hamper means so much to me. I, like, put. This hamper means so much to me. I, like, packed up this. This black hamper and just all my. My clothes and stuffed them in there and grabbed my dog and I drove to Austin.

[Gary Brecker]

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[Matt Johnson]

Blue heeler.

[Gary Brecker]

Okay.

[Matt Johnson]

And he is. He is incredible. I drove to Austin, and I called my mom on the way down to Austin, and I was like, I don't give a shit what is about to happen. I'm gonna figure it out. I had $3,000 in my bank account, and I was like, I'm like, I'll be an online coach. Like, I don't care. I was like, all like, I'm. My. My idea was that I was going to use. At that point, I had about 25, 000 followers. I was going to be an online fitness coach.

[Gary Brecker]

Cool.

[Matt Johnson]

And okay, to make that story, quick, got down to Austin, lived in an Airbnb, lived in 5 Airbnbs over 61 days. Ran out of all of my money. I. I had just won a marathon and did an Ironman within the same week. And right after the Iron Man, I had a friend that. That gave me this bike. I sold that bike to put a deposit down on a duplex, and I slept on the floor of that duplex for two weeks.

[Gary Brecker]

Wow.

[Matt Johnson]

And I just started grinding of, like, people like, you want. I'll coach you. A hundred dollars a month.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And I just slowly, like, next thing you know, I got a couch for $100 from the market right down the road.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

I got a mattress pad. Like, I have a picture of the mattress pad with a blanket and a pillow. Yeah, it was laying on the floor.

[Gary Brecker]

Damn.

[Matt Johnson]

And then I got a tv.

[Gary Brecker]

Not a mattress. A mattress pad.

[Matt Johnson]

Mattress pad.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. Yeah, the little.

[Matt Johnson]

The little pad.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Fast forward there. Just started. Just kept going. Just kept. I just kept going.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And the Instagram following started to grow very Ketone iq.

[Gary Brecker]

Oh, yeah. Yeah. I love those guys.

[Matt Johnson]

Michael Brandt. And they sent me a message and like, yo, we'd love to pay you 500amonth to promote our product. I know. I was like. I was like, are you kidding? I was like, I will give you my. My right arm for $500.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And, you know, over the next two or three months, I signed another deal. The second deal was an alcohol deal, which was like, at that point, you'll take whatever. I probably shouldn't have done that one. But, you know, I signed the alcohol deal. I started blowing like, it was like, all of a sudden, everything started changing. And I met Amanda, and this amazing woman was like, she is amazing. Like, first. First day we're together, she's like, well, she's like. It was Saturday night, we go on a Date. She's like, what do you. Do you want to go to church with me tomorrow?

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And I'm like, I'll go wherever the hell you want me to go. Like, take me, take me wherever.

[Gary Brecker]

Amazing. Started going back to church 24 hours.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Started going back to church. The ball started rolling, the followers started skyrocketing. And, you know, that led me, that led me to my, my Masagi. Right? Like, like the big, the big one and late 2020, all in that time frame when I, when I went back to church, right? Like, like, and I, I, I had met. I think I met Amanda after the leg injury. So I was running. I spent 20, 23 running from everything, anything. Yeah, run. Just run, run, run. And I, I was like, oh, my leg hurts. I kept running. My leg hurts. I kept running. I did 100 mile race on a broken leg and I had no idea my leg was broken. I just thought it hurt. Couldn't finish this race. Go to the doctor. They're like, you, you have three fractures. Like, like, I have the X ray of like, like, you could see that it fractured in the calcium deposits. Like, I can feel the calcium deposit right here because it's trying to heal itself stuff. And she's like, you're done for six months

[Gary Brecker]

and that's your identity at that point?

[Matt Johnson]

Yes, that's. That's everything I have.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And it was in that moment where I had to, like, sit with myself. I had to sit with God. I had to, you know, where I'm like, what do I do?

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And one day, just one day, I went to the gym and I remember exactly where I was sitting outside the gym. I still couldn't run. I still was walking with a limp. And I texted one of my best friends and I was like, I want. I don't know how it came. I don't know. I have no clue. I said, I just popped in my head. I was like, I want to run across the whole state of Texas.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And I texted my friend and I was like, I want to, I want to cross Texas. And he's like, you're a logistical nightmare, but I think you can do it.

[Gary Brecker]

That's a good friend.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

You're out of your fucking mind, but I think you can do it. Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. So that's, that, that was kind of, you know, obviously it took a little bit there, you know, but that's, that's how we got there.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And, and, and it was, it was 20, 20, 24 is what changed my life forever.

[Gary Brecker]

But the, the Money and the logistics. I mean, you know, for 17 days to just be absent. Obviously, you're not coaching during that time frame. You're not earning money during that time frame. You get sponsors and. Yeah. And you just lived in a van.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah, yeah. So what happened is, you know. Yeah, just like. Yeah, the operation that we had was the exact operation. You know, we had an RV scale down. Yeah. Yeah, we had. We had an RV and a sprinter van.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

But, yeah, I just, you know, I. I overworked my team at that point. You know, I didn't have a lot of, you know, I mean, I had 200,000 followers. I had a little bit of poll on the social media side from brands, but I just started hitting up. I was like, yo, like, how much money can you give me to use your product while I do this event? And, you know, I feel like it was so good to do that because now I know so much about business, and I had to teach myself all of these things because I didn't go to college. I went to the military.

[Gary Brecker]

Right.

[Matt Johnson]

And, like, oh, like, we'll give you five grand for three reels and a thousand stories. You know, like, it was just. They were just getting me, and I'm, like, done.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah, yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And, you know, like. And we accumulated $60,000 the first year.

[Gary Brecker]

Wow.

[Matt Johnson]

Through 40 brands. Like, it was. It was. It was.

[Gary Brecker]

I. I tie my shoes with things.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Drew, who you met. Drew, is now total profit.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Now one of my best friends, and he was. He was the lead content guy out there, and I just put him through the ringer with the things he had to do. But, yeah, we got. We got $60,000. And the operation was the. We. We. We cleared. We had a. I had a thousand dollars left when we were done. Like. Like, we were. And then we don't. And then I donated it to Valor Fix. I was doing it to raise. Raise money for charity. But. Yeah. Yeah, that was.

[Gary Brecker]

That's awesome, man.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

And now, you know, so I saw none of that side of you in the last 48 hours. I mean, the. The precision with which you ran this operation to. To get these guys 100 miles, like I say, including my son, across the desert in the middle of the night, because I. I don't think most people realize, like, running for 24 and a half hours like these guys did, just the sheer grind and the. I mean, we got pulled over three times by the police.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Right off the bat. Yeah, right off the bat. Dude, we were barely in a night. I see the popo come by and he bangs the U turn, throws his lights on and parks and parks in

[Matt Johnson]

front of the convoy.

[Gary Brecker]

Of the convoy.

[Matt Johnson]

Facing the convoy. That was the cr. Like, that was like, facing felt malicious. Like, Like I was like. I was like, you're going to turn and face you.

[Gary Brecker]

So nice to, like, how are you, officer?

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. And I'm like, just keep shift.

[Gary Brecker]

Small talk. But. But, you know, the. The. I was impressed with, like, you know, your unrelenting commitment to the safety of the runners. I. I think none of them understood the task that they were. They were getting ready to do. Like I said, there's semis blowing by us six feet off the, you know, side of the road. Half the shoulder was not wide enough for the vehicles to get off the road. And. And the first thing that cop said was, you need to be on the other side of this white line.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

The entire. Entire time you're down. So half the time we're driving on all that, like, gravel. It was pretty crazy.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

I was pissed off because I couldn't sleep. Sleep. I wasn't gonna complain about it. Old sister sacked out in the back. But, you know, so you. You. You do this iconic race in. In. In. In Texas. But how. How does that jump to you moving in with Jelly Roll? Because I do remember during my journey with Jelly Roll, this dude Matt, and I didn't know who you were, you know, like, was moving in with them to train him, and I was like, oh, who. Who's Matt?

[Matt Johnson]

Literally everyone. Every, like. Like.

[Gary Brecker]

Like, how did this kid.

[Matt Johnson]

News stations were like, who is this random.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Person? It was super jelly.

[Gary Brecker]

Random. Yeah. I didn't have any, you know, necessarily a problem with it. I'm like, well, look, man, he's got a. He's got a chef, he's got a, you know, he's got a coach. I mean, it sounds like a great idea, but, dude, when you parachuted in and. And were with him 24 7, you were traveling with him, everything, right?

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Yeah. So we went to Hawaii, like, in April.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And he was landing in LA for, like, a West coast stint of, like, he had things that were, you know, so they got a. They had a house up in Beverly Hills. And when I was flying back from Hawaii, Amanda was gonna fly home, and I was staying, and I ubered to this $30 million Beverly Hills mansion that, like. Yeah. And I'm like, all right. And it was. Yeah, it was the entire month that I was out there. We were traveling and, you know, training together.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. And I mean, because at that point, Jelly hadn't even walked a 5K. Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. I think. I think the first, you know, my connection to him was Ian. Larry is his coach. So crazy enough, 20, 23, when I was grinding when I first moved to Austin and I was grinding for, you know, selling coaching to people, I get a call and this guy's like, yeah, like, I'm on tour. You know, I want to run on that. I want to run around the island of Bali. And I'm like, oh, like you're like a musician? And he's like, no. He's like, I'm Jelly Roll's chef. And I was like, holy shit. Like, that's crazy. And then come to find out, he's like, he won Chef of the Year for the ufc. And, like, and I'm coaching this guy. So that's how I got the in with Jelly, is I gained the trust of Ian. And Ian was like, oh, like, you know, Matt's personality, who he is, like, you know, and he pitched it to Jelly where he's like. Because Ian wasn't there the whole time. And the problem was. And you probably saw this with Jelly, Jelly and Ian are, like, side by side at all times.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And Ian was going to be gone, and Jelly wasn't going to have anyone to train with.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah, yeah. And so it was lack of accountability, is it?

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So they. So they brought in a secondary chef, but then they wanted to bring me in to kind of play that Ian role, to help him, you know, to have somebody there to train with.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

But, yeah, I remember my first workout. I wish I. I could. I could pull it up on my phone, but my. The first workout was like a five minute walk and like ten seconds of, like. And we use the term run very loosely.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah, yeah, 10.

[Matt Johnson]

10 seconds of as fast as you can.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

You know, and then. And then. And that was done. Yeah. And then we got in. By the time. By the time that I got done right before the 2 bears 5k, he had. He had ran 1 mile without stopping.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah, dude. And for. For him at that time, I mean, that's.

[Matt Johnson]

Even. Even when I was out there, he was still three. He was still right at three. Three, Three, three thirty, maybe.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. And that's a big boy. Because when I look. When I look back at him now, when we were out there, like, I look at photos and I thought he was skinny then.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Now, comparatively, now, he's like, he's.

[Gary Brecker]

It's a game now. You.

[Matt Johnson]

You look at him and you're like, oh, guys, this guy's skinny.

[Gary Brecker]

So many people.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

So I, I, I love how to me, this is like two stories. This is like a story of two, like misfits, like, with very kind of similar backgrounds, you know, doing something really iconic. Because if, you know, even if you've never done a 5K, I mean, to think that you're going to take a 350, 60 pound man and move that mass over, you know, 3.2 miles is a major feat. I mean, getting to the mailbox is a major feat. I, I remember one of my first conversations with Jelly and he was like, where do I start? And I said, you just start by walking to the mailbox. Like literally. Yeah, just, you know, bite size, bite sized goals. And it sounds like when you parachute it in, like you, you just started chipping away with this with these little bite size goals.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

I love how you say we use the term running loosely.

[Matt Johnson]

We use the term running very loosely. That is a, that is a full sentence quote from Jelly himself.

[Gary Brecker]

Really?

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Y' all know we use the term running very loosely around here.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But you had a major impact on him. And then, you know, finishing this 100 mile race with these guys. I know that had a major impact. They raised almost $400,000.

[Matt Johnson]

And the documentary, it'll, it'll go well over 500K.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

With the documentary coming out and. Yeah. Incredible.

[Gary Brecker]

And I think for the people that are listening, so, you know, what does all of this mean? They're like, okay, he had a rough life, Jelly's had a rough life. But look at them now. I mean, there's somebody sitting on their couch right now, maybe listening to this podcast that in a similar situation to you, and they have to take that first step. Like literally just take that first step. What I like about what you did and what I like about what you do is, is that it doesn't cost you anything to just get off your couch and set a goal and just start. So where does it, for somebody that is coming from a similar place to where you were, where do they start? How does it start tomorrow morning? What do they get up and do?

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah, you know, I think that, you know, I've said this multiple times. You know, if you, you, you, you have to set a goal. And I feel like the problem with people is that you're scared to fail and you truly can't be scared to fail. What a lot of people don't know about me is I've actually DNF'd more ultramarathons than I finished.

[Gary Brecker]

Wow.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. It's true. Like, official hundred mile races. I think I've done five, and I think I finished two. Wow. Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And, you know, I. I'm not afraid to fail. That's why that I truly believe. Like, that's why I'm different. And if you want to be different, you have to not be afraid to fail either. And what. What is a failure? You have to define what a failure is. Right.

[Gary Brecker]

You know, failure is not trying.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Yeah. You know, but if you're sitting on the couch right now and you're like, where do I start? What do I do? Well, you know, tomorrow, if you're fit enough, like, go run, you know, set a goal. Hey, I'm gonna run a mile. Going to run a mile Monday through Friday.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

You know, and like, like, like set a goal. And here's what happens. Monday you run a mile. Tuesday, you run a mile. Wednesday, you wake up and you're like, I'm sore. I don't want to do this anymore. And then you quit. Right.

[Gary Brecker]

Right.

[Matt Johnson]

What do you do the next day? Because what you do the next day defines who you really want to be.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And you have to be okay with that failure because. Because what you do the next day, if you want to. If you want to sit in chairs like this, that the. The people that are here, guess what? They woke up the next day and they started over.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And then you start on Thursday. All right, I'm gonna go Thursday, Friday, Saturday, Sunday, Monday, I'm running a mile. And then, you know, next up, the last time, you got two days. Next up, you're going to get four, and you're going to fail again. And that's okay.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

You know, you'll get it. Just you have to be okay with failing, and that's it. Like, people, why don't you start? Well, because it's hard, and I might not be able to do it.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah, well. And, you know, I noticed, too, like, you're. You're very present also, like, you're not somewhere else when you're doing these things. I. I'm. I'll never forget. We had just left the 93.5 mile aid station, and my son was in really pretty good shape. But I pulled up next to him, and I was. I got about a mile in with him, and my mind was, like, wandering around somewhere else. And you pulled up right behind Cole and I, and you were probably your hand on our back when started running with us. And you're like, hey, guys, never forget that this Is this. Is. There will never be a first time for you to be in this. In this situation. This is the last time that it will be the first time. So just be present. Just take this all in, because this is an amazing moment. You know, you'll wish that you were right back here.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

At some point. And you sort of just. And then you backed off, and. And it was just such a cool moment for Cole and I, because I've been in that situation with Cole before, you know, in Antarctica and when he did the great world race. And there's nothing to me, like, no place I'd rather be than in one of those situations with one of. One of my kids. And I was like, you know what? He's so right. This is. This is the last time that it will ever be the first time that you've run a hundred miles in Vegas. And in my mind, just instantly cleared, and I was like, I'm just not going to do anything but be present right in this moment. And what was so cool was the sun was starting to rise, and that sun was like caffeine. These guys, I saw the mood change.

[Matt Johnson]

Even you. Even you, because you came up, you're like, the sun's up. It's caffeine. Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Because it was so cold. It was so dark, and it just sucked for them. Not. Not for me. And I look over, and I could see this sphere, and they had the sphere that was like a. Like a sunrise. I've never seen that before. And. And it was just that. That. That cold, bright morning. And at that moment, I was like, these guys are actually all gonna finish this.

[Matt Johnson]

And you.

[Gary Brecker]

You could feel, like the energy of the group starting to pick up a little bit. Yeah. And so thank you for that, by the way, because it was like that I needed that reframing of. Of. Of that moment just so I could be present. I think a lot of times we just go through life and we never stop to realize it's not the destination, it's the journey.

[Matt Johnson]

Yes. Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Like, you want to enjoy the journey.

[Matt Johnson]

And that's the biggest thing is, like, even downstairs this morning. Right. What were the boys talking about? All of the painful times.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

You know, like. Like, they're like, oh, the finish line. Right. Because that's probably about damn near the only good time that they had.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

But. But they're just. They're taught. They're talking about those who. Horrible.

[Gary Brecker]

They were in the painful moments cave.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

I remember, you know, some of them couldn't even move their hips. They were doing this like sidewalk and I didn't know you know exactly what I'm talking about. It's like they had braces on their legs and couldn't bend their knees or their hips. And they were doing this sort of weird because they weren't waddle.

[Matt Johnson]

They weren't supposed to do that. Yeah, you know, they, they trained for 71 days.

[Gary Brecker]

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[Matt Johnson]

You know, it depends on where you're at in the process. Right. Like I would say, honestly at this point with me, I would say 95% of it is all mental and 5% of it is, is, is physical. Once you're in shape to run that distance, like, you know, just like, just like you saw. You know the reason why Cole feels so good today.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. I was shocked.

[Matt Johnson]

Is because he's already done this type of stuff before. The seven marathons in seven days, his body is already like, oh, I remember this. You know, so once that you kind of build that base. Yeah, it's all, it's all here. And I even told, you know, right at the very beginning, even after looking at those guys, I told, I don't know, somebody, Amanda, I was like, if Cole was doing this on his own, he would go under 20 hours. Yeah, like, you know, he's just Cole. Cole was probably number. I call it one, Kyle at two, Brad at three. And, you know, the rest of them, I mean, that was actually pretty much how it was.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. Yeah. You know, that's exactly.

[Matt Johnson]

And yeah, but, you know, once you get there, it's all mental. Just like I said earlier, any. I truly believe anyone can move that distance if you are a fit human. But not everybody can. Can. Can do that. And that's what. That's what. That's what sets people apart.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. When we were on the great world race, it was. We were six marathons in, and Cole had gotten a really bad stomach bug on. On the flight from. From Istanbul to Cartagena. And I mean, just throwing up, diarrhea. Probably lost four or five pounds on the flight. He was still sick as a dog. He was fully fasted, had no fluids.

[Matt Johnson]

Oh, boy.

[Gary Brecker]

And I remember telling my. Telling Max, my. The head of our production team who went with us before the race, I was like, there's no chance he's finishing this marathon. And Cartagena was so hot. And it was such a hot, humid, sunny, long, unforgiving course. And like, just the dehydration alone is gonna. Is he's gonna DNF it. I actually ended up running the entire marathon. And I'd never run a marathon and I didn't train at all. Um, but I ended up doing that just because I was so worried about my son. And. And he just went to this place he locked in because he was in the pain cave from, like, mile six, just so dehydrated. And every two and a half miles, or these rest stations. And it's Cartagena, right. It's like Third World country. So the rest stations were like Third World rest stations. They just basically had a porta Potty and a little table with some bananas and. And he would go into the porta Potty and he'd throw up. And I could hear him. He had diarrhea. He would sit on the little Porta Potty toilet and then throw it into the urinal. And then he would get back out and start running again. And I was at. At. At the end of the race, I was filling little bottle caps full of coconut water and he would sip on a bottle cap while he was running. It was like, the only nutrition he could take. And to this day, I don't know where he got the fortitude to go through that because, uh, you know, my level of concern for for him was, like, at a 10 out of. Out of 10.

[Matt Johnson]

Especially when you're in a third world country.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And you're like, we don't have a lot of access as a medical facilities.

[Gary Brecker]

And I'll never forget, like, I start to get a little delirious. Like, I was all full of vigor at the. At the. You know, at the. At the start line, I pull up next to Cole, and I'm like, listen, if you don't give up on this race, I won't give up on you. You know, I'm going to stay with you this whole race. And then, like, mile 18, I was like, you want to throw in a towel? Dude, I'm all in. I mean, there's a lot of quitters in this world. The quitting's not as, you know, bad as.

[Matt Johnson]

People quit all the time.

[Gary Brecker]

People quit all the time. Thomas Edison quit 35,000 times. The light bulb. I didn't say it. And then I would start to get, like, sentimental, and I was like. Because I was half delirious, and I was like, you know what, Cole? It's no place I'd rather be than right here with you right now. Someday we're going to wish we were right back here. And he looks at me, he goes, dad, shut the up.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

I was like, pull a letter.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Because he was just.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Yeah. That.

[Gary Brecker]

He apologized to me, Anthony.

[Matt Johnson]

Oh, no. For sure. I give. I give Amanda that same thing all the time, where she's just. And because. Because that's it. That's when you're in there.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

You know, when you're in there, and it's just like you're. You're trying to battle yourself, and you just can't have anything from the outside world come in.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. Yeah. So I think. I think that's the big takeaway from these. It's such a metaphor for life. And, you know, if you're sitting, listening to this podcast, you're like, I'm never gonna run 100 miles. And maybe you never will.

[Matt Johnson]

But about that.

[Gary Brecker]

But it's not about that. It's. It's. It's literally about accomplishing something that you never, ever thought you could. Every single one of those guys broke down in tears at the end.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Of the. You just saw every emotion. Even as we were coming up to the finish line. Brad. Brad just.

[Matt Johnson]

Brad was going through it.

[Gary Brecker]

He was man. And. And I don't think most people never find that place in themselves. And it's such a beautiful thing.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

You know, and it's not just the pain. It's that overwhelming sense of accomplishing something really, really hard.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And that's. You know, I've heard that. You know, it's. I said that after Texas, where I was like, I hope. I hope that anyone out there in an Instagram store is like, anyone out there can feel this type of happiness within my body.

[Gary Brecker]

Amen.

[Matt Johnson]

Like, it is the most incredible thing in the world. It's not about. Just like we said, it's not about running. You know, it's not even about fitness.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Like, you know, if. If you. Changing your life looks like you're scared to just leave your job and go to a new one like that. And then. Oh, no. Like, what happens if I don't like that one? Then find another one. Yeah, then find another one. Then find another one. That's the same thing as run one more mile. One more mile. You know, like, that's. You have to figure out where you can apply. You know, this type of mental, like. Of like, you can't be afraid to fail.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

It doesn't need to be fitness.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. So what's. What's next for you? Like, what are you. What is. What's your next big, bold, audacious goal?

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. July. The fourth of July this year. Yeah. Yeah, we're. Yeah. I haven't announced this yet at all. It's not a.

[Gary Brecker]

Drop it, dude.

[Matt Johnson]

Drop it.

[Gary Brecker]

Hold back.

[Matt Johnson]

All right. This is a. This is 90% conference confirmed.

[Gary Brecker]

Okay.

[Matt Johnson]

All right. So that's why I haven't really dropped it yet.

[Gary Brecker]

We'll keep it between you, me, and 20 million people that watch.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

I'm gonna run 250 miles from times Square to the front lawn of the White House on the Fourth of July. And my goal is one of our Iowa National Guard units was deployed in Syria, and two of our boys were killed about a month ago. You probably saw that.

[Gary Brecker]

I did see that. Um, that was the Iowa National Guard.

[Matt Johnson]

Yes, that was.

[Gary Brecker]

Wow.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. And my goal is to get a hold of them and get their deployment flag, and I want to carry their deployment flag to the White House. That's in honor of them, while raising money for a veterans charity.

[Gary Brecker]

So cool.

[Matt Johnson]

So that's. That's my. That's my goal this year. It'll be part of the White House. So, you know, the 200. You know, this is our. This is America's 250th birthday.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

This year. So happy birthday, America.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

So, you know, 250 miles for 250th birthday. And then, you know, hopefully I can get a hold of that deployment flag and, you know, carry.

[Gary Brecker]

I'm sure families will do that for you.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Carry that the way. So, yeah, I'm, I'm excited about that. And, you know, there's, there's, there's some partners involved. I'm just going to leave that. I'm going to leave them out of it for now. Yeah, yeah. I'm very, I'm very excited to do that. And then, you know, the next one is getting married, I guess. Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Got to. I got a beautiful. Got to get that thing going right off camera. Bruised up from the fall that she took on the side of the road. I was following her, and I saw her eat it at the side of the road, but she bounced right back up. Yeah. And so getting married, accomplishing this goal, that's. That is phenomenal. I'll also put in a shameless plug for, you know, Jelly and your Run Club, which is now one of the biggest run clubs.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah, yeah. The Losers Run Club. Yes. Large Strava Group. A Facebook group. Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. So we're gonna try to break the Guinness Book of worlds record on April 19th in Vegas with Dana White. Yesterday, I was in Dana's office and, and I got him to commit to running the 5K. He's like, I haven't run a mile in 15 years.

[Matt Johnson]

That's crazy. When I think of Dana White, I'm like, yo. Like that. Like, that's wild.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah, that's wild. And I know Dana because Dana is one of those guys if he, he's either kind of all in or all out. Like, when I first started working with him, and he was like, I'll do whatever you say for 10 weeks. I can do anything for 10 weeks in. He was like, I'm never giving this up. But he committed. And so I, I brought his assistant in, I brought his, like, right hand, Elliott in. I, I, I got as many witnesses. I took a video of sending Jelly roll, and I was like, jelly, Dana's in, so he's going to run it. And, and the whole idea is not to set a land speed record, but just to inspire a lot of people.

[Matt Johnson]

For sure.

[Gary Brecker]

We want to carry the weight that, that Jelly lost over that, you know, over that 5K.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

That just show people that it's just like, what you've overcome, what he's overcome, and, and just inspire people to, to maybe choose movement and exercise as an outlet.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Rather than drugs or alcohol or, or, or just isolation. And, and what I find that happens Every time I'm around one of these groups, like the great world race or the 100 miles that you guys just did, the unity, the community that comes out of accomplishing something like that is absolutely palpable.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Like, you guys love each other. Like, you guys.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. I told Kyle, I said, yo, like, after this run.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Like, like, the six of you will

[Gary Brecker]

have a bond that.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

Different than any other.

[Matt Johnson]

You guys think that your friends now, like, you will, like, these will be the greatest friends that you have for the rest of your life.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Because you suffered together.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

That's the type of camaraderie that you see the military.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. You know, and I've interviewed a lot of. A lot of seals and.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

DJ Shipley and, you know, Sean Ryan, other guys that, like, talk about how that, that, that, you know, that pain is a unifier.

[Matt Johnson]

Yes.

[Gary Brecker]

You know, that's.

[Matt Johnson]

Because when you're, you know, and that's something to the audience as well, you know, like, like, if you want to get into, you know, fitness, have someone. Have someone with you, you know, you know, if you're just trying to get off the couch, call up one of your friends. Maybe they're just waiting for you to call.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And.

[Gary Brecker]

Because maybe they need the same. Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. Because when you are doing something and you're suffering, when you know that the person next to you is suffering, it changes everything. Because. Because then you can, you know, in your own head, you're like, well, you know, if I'm suffering, If Gary's suffering next to me, then, you know, if he's doing it, then I can do it.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

So. Yeah, so.

[Gary Brecker]

So the last thing I want to touch on is, is you. You talked about suffering some depression after your Texas race.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah.

[Gary Brecker]

And like post race depression, post accomplishment depression, however, whatever you want to call it, how did you. How did you grapple with that? Because now you accomplished this insanely bold, audacious goal and. And you fell into depression. And. And I've had. I've had a lot of athletes talk about that, that I. That I know, including, like, Jon Jones and Michael Chandler. You know, they've always talked about how your identity becomes this iconic figure. DJ Dillashaw talked about the same thing. You know, three time UFC champion, and then you're no longer a UFC champion, and like, your accomplishments are yesterday's accomplishments. And now you're, You're. You find yourself in this really strange identity crisis. Like, well, who am I now?

[Matt Johnson]

What's next?

[Gary Brecker]

Do I have to keep doing this to. To. To get Validation. And how did you crawl out of that?

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah, well, you know, I want to be completely transparent right off the bat is that, you know, the, the, the depression was, you know, imagine. Imagine going for 17 days and having people tell you all day long, you're the greatest. You're so good. Like, you're the best. You're inspiring me. No other people can do this. You're the go. Like, you know, and then, and then, unfortunately, when that ends, whether it's running or, you know, carrying a, you know, UFC world title or anything like that, when it ends, no one cares.

[Gary Brecker]

Right?

[Matt Johnson]

They don't. Like, you know, and like, yeah, okay, maybe you have fans out there that care. Yeah, sure. But, like, the noise stops and when you fade from the ufc, right, like, if you're not fighting

[Gary Brecker]

somebody else is somebody else.

[Matt Johnson]

The world just always continues to move on.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And so what I found is, you know, just like what you said, it's an. It's identity. You know, I don't like Matt Johnson, the ultra runner. You know, the, the Matt Johnson underscore. Underscore. The Instagram guy. Right. Like, that's, that's not who I want to be.

[Gary Brecker]

Right.

[Matt Johnson]

I want to be Matthew. Like, I want to be me.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And, you know, what does that mean? And you know, for me, it's like, even this year, right? Like, like, for me, it was, it was so big. I told Amanda after the Texas run, you know, because I did Texas in 24. I did east to west. I just did it this October, north to south.

[Gary Brecker]

Okay.

[Matt Johnson]

And so I'm the only man to cross Texas both ways.

[Gary Brecker]

Wow.

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah. So fastest man to do it. Fastest man to do it both ways. And the only man to do it both ways. Place.

[Gary Brecker]

Wow, that's cool.

[Matt Johnson]

But I told her I was like, I don't want to do anything next year. Like, I don't. I don't want to do this again. I don't want to. Like, I, I don't. I don't. I will. I don't think I will ever do a 20 day event ever again.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

It's just too hard on the body.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

And. But I told her, I'm like, that's when I became, you know, and then, and then I had the opportunity with Kyle in November, you know, October, November or. Yeah, October, just to become Matt Johnson. Coach Matt.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

You know, so then it's like, okay, like, now I'm Coach Matt. Like, now I have something. So then it was November, December, January. I was wearing the coaching hat, and I'm just Training, you know, I'm just training on my own. I'm running 50 miles a week. I'm lifting in the gym, you know, but, like, I know that, like, this big event yesterday is coming and, you know, so it's just, it's not putting your eye for weight. Yeah, you have to.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah. So it doesn't become who you are. So I, I wind down all of my podcasts, and I can't wait to hear your answer here by asking my guests the same question. There's no right or wrong answer to this question, but what does it mean to you to be an ultimate human?

[Matt Johnson]

It's easy to me. Like, being the ultimate human is, is, is helping others. Like, I, I believe that we, we are put on this earth to, you know, to not just be for, for us, but to be for others. I get my most fulfillment when I am, when I am helping others. I never had anyone there for me.

[Gary Brecker]

Yeah.

[Matt Johnson]

I never had a dad there for me. I never had anyone telling me how to run, how to lift. Like, I had to go to the gym and just watch people doing, you know, tricep, you know, tricep push downs. And I'm like, okay, like, I'm gonna copy that. Right, Right. I never had anyone there for me. Like, if you know something, share it with somebody.

[Gary Brecker]

Somebody.

[Matt Johnson]

Be there for somebody. And that, like, to me, like, that is the ultimate human. Like, just showing, just showing love to others is just like, that is.

[Gary Brecker]

That's amazing, man.

[Matt Johnson]

That's it.

[Gary Brecker]

It's helping, I gotta say. Like John Maxwell, one of the greatest success authors of all time, he talks about the difference between living a life of significance and living a life of service and, like, being in service to other people and, like, how much more fulfilling it is, brother. Mad respect for you, man. Thank you for getting my son 100 miles through the desert. Saf. Appreciate you. We're going to follow your story. Absolutely. How does my audience find you if they want to know more about you?

[Matt Johnson]

Yeah, Instagram, you know, I have Instagram page at Matt Johnson, Google Matt Johnson Runner. You'll find all the crazy stuff. And then YouTube. Yeah, on the YouTube. You know, we're trying to, I'm trying to. My, one of my goals this year is I want to hammer down on the YouTube, just doing, doing cool stuff and documenting inspirational stuff. You know, I, I, I built the Instagram following through all the funny bs, but now I want to really show people the life I'm living and hopefully they can figure out how to get there for themselves as well.

[Gary Brecker]

Sounds great man, Matt. I hope you come back on the Ultimate.

[Matt Johnson]

Thank you so much for having me.

[Gary Brecker]

And until next time, message science.