How we are finally figuring out Plant nutrition with Landen Schilling

In this month's Seed Chat, Greg Peterson and Bill McDorman welcome Landon Schaelling of Sacred Soil Solutions to explore the emerging science of rhizophagy, the process by which plants consume microbes for nutrition. The conversation examines how endophytes, fermentation, compost, and seed saving may work together to improve plant health, resilience, and flavor. They also discuss practical ways gardeners can introduce beneficial microbes into their gardens while highlighting the rapidly evolving research that is reshaping our understanding of soil biology and plant nutrition.

Our Guests: Landon Schaelling is the founder of Sacred Soil Solutions. He is focused on bringing optimal and approachable microbe inputs to gardeners and homesteaders, while also teaching farmers in the American West how to implement soil building solutions at scale.

And Bill McDorman has committed his life to community-based seed stewardship. In 1984, he started Seeds Trust High Altitude Gardens, a bioregional mail order seed company that he ran for 28 years. He authored the book Basic Seed Saving in 1994, and in 2010 Bill and his wife, Belle Starr, founded Seed School.

Key Topics

Rhizophagy (root-eating process)
Endophytes and plant microbiomes
Soil microbiology
Seed saving and local adaptation
Horizontal gene transfer
Fermentation for microbial cultivation
Compost and fungal soil biology
Microbe Master Mix
Effective Microorganisms (EM/EM1)
Dr. James F. White
John Kempf's Plant Health Pyramid
Dr. Christine Jones
Biochar and Terra Preta
Sacred Soil Solutions

Key Questions Answered

What is rhizophagy?

Rhizophagy is the process by which plants absorb living microbes through their root tips, consume many of them for nutrition, and release others back into the soil, creating a dynamic relationship between plants and soil biology.

What are endophytes?

Endophytes are beneficial bacteria and fungi that live inside plant tissues without causing disease. They become part of the plant's internal microbiome and contribute to nutrient cycling, resilience, and overall plant health.

Why is this research changing how we understand plant nutrition?

Emerging research suggests healthy plants obtain much of their nutrition by consuming living microbes rather than relying solely on dissolved minerals in the soil, expanding traditional models of plant nutrition.

Why are locally saved seeds so valuable?

Seeds saved in a local environment gradually adapt genetically to regional growing conditions. Local microbial communities appear to undergo similar adaptation, potentially increasing plant vigor over time.

How can gardeners introduce beneficial microbes?

Gardeners can inoculate seeds, apply microbial solutions as foliar sprays, drench transplant roots, build high-quality compost, and encourage living soil ecosystems through mulch and cover crops.

Why are microbial fermentations useful?

Fermentation allows gardeners to rapidly multiply beneficial microorganisms that can be applied efficiently to seeds, soil, and foliage while adapting to local growing conditions.

Does treating seeds with microbes improve plant performance?

According to Landon Schaelling's experience, treated seeds often produce stronger root systems, healthier foliage, improved nutrient uptake, greater vigor, and enhanced flavor.

Is feeding the plant different from feeding the soil?

The discussion suggests both are important, but directly supporting plant microbiology may allow healthier plants to build better soil through root exudates and microbial partnerships.

How does drought affect soil microbes?

Dry soils reduce microbial activity. Maintaining mulch and consistent soil moisture helps preserve beneficial microbial populations.

Can microbial communities adapt to new environments?

Yes. Through horizontal gene transfer and rapid reproduction, microbial populations can adapt to local conditions much faster than plants themselves.

Episode Highlights

Greg celebrates the Urban Farm Podcast approaching its 1,000th episode.
Bill McDorman introduces the emerging science of rhizophagy and why it has changed his perspective on gardening.
Landon explains how plants consume microbes through root tips rather than relying solely on dissolved nutrients.
The conversation explores how endophytes become part of a plant's internal immune and digestive systems.
Bill shares dramatic improvements after using microbial treatments on greens grown in sandy soil.
The panel discusses microbial fermentations as an accessible alternative to intensive compost production.
Audience questions cover drought, raised beds, honey versus molasses, wheat adaptation, and sourcing microbial inoculants.
The episode concludes with a discussion about nature's intelligence, seed adaptation, and the intriguing tradition of placing seeds in one's mouth before planting.

Calls to Action & Resources

Attend future live Seed Chats — https://seedchat.org
Listen to previous Seed Chats — https://urbanfarmpodcast.com
Learn about Sacred Soil Solutions — Contact Landon Schaelling directly for information on Microbe Master Mix and educational resources. Instagram: @sacredsoilsolutions
Facebook: Landen Schaelling
Email: Landen.schaelling@protonmail.com

Recommended Research
Dr. James F. White — Rhizophagy Cycle research
John Kempf — Plant Health Pyramid
Dr. Christine Jones — Soil carbon and regenerative agriculture
Effective Microorganisms (EM/EM1) fermentation methods

Visit www.urbanfarm.org/996 for the show notes on this episode, and access to our full podcast library!

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