America First Here and Around the World

Summary

Podcast Title: The Victor Davis Hanson Show
Episode: America First Here and Around the World
Release Date: April 4, 2025
Hosts: Victor Davis Hanson and Jack Fowler

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Introduction

In the April 4, 2025 episode of The Victor Davis Hanson Show, Victor Davis Hanson and his co-host Jack Fowler delve into a myriad of pressing political and social issues shaping both America and the global landscape. From Trump's economic policies and recent special elections to the complexities of deportations, Tesla protests, and international lawfare, the hosts provide insightful analysis and robust discussions. This summary captures the key points, notable quotes, and significant conclusions drawn throughout the episode.

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1. Trump’s Tariff Policies and Economic Stance

The episode opens with a discussion on former President Donald Trump's recent implementation of tariffs, aimed at addressing economic disparities and protecting domestic industries.

Key Points:

• Investor vs. Working Class Perspectives: The hosts explore the divide between the investor class, who favor free trade, and the working class, who benefit from protectionist policies.
• Economic Competitiveness: Emphasis on maintaining competitive domestic suppliers against countries with unfair trade advantages.
• Historical Context: Reference to America's robust manufacturing past, including shipbuilding and ship carriers during the 1950s.

Notable Quote:

"So the people who want jobs that are well-paying want a liberation day. And the people who offshore, outsource and our investing class don't, but the majority do."
— Jack Fowler [02:59]

Analysis: Jack Fowler argues that Trump's tariffs are a strategic move to restore economic balance by supporting domestic industries and reducing dependency on foreign manufacturing. He emphasizes the potential for tariffs to rejuvenate sectors that have long suffered from outsourcing and unfair trade practices.

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2. Special Elections in Florida and Wisconsin

The hosts transition to discussing recent special elections in Florida and Wisconsin, analyzing their implications for the political landscape.

Key Points:

• Turnout Dynamics: Special elections typically see lower turnout, which historically favors Democrats. However, the MAGA movement has energized new voters who are likely to participate in larger elections.
• Election Outcomes: Republicans secured two key seats in Florida by margins of 14% and 17%, deemed significant despite not aligning with usual high-margin expectations.
• Polls and Future Projections: Most polls indicate a near-even race for Trump in upcoming elections, challenging media portrayals of chaos.

Notable Quote:

"If you get a newcomer in an open jungle race, I mean he still won by 14. That's a blowout. But because he didn't win, the left is trying to say that it doesn't mean anything."
— Jack Fowler [07:14]

Analysis: Victor Davis Hanson questions the media’s inflated portrayal of these special elections’ significance, suggesting that the results indicate a stable Republican presence rather than a Democratic surge. The discussion underscores the resilience of established incumbents and the limited impact of special elections on broader political trends.

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3. Deportations Under the Trump Administration

The conversation shifts to the Trump administration's aggressive stance on immigration, highlighting the expedited deportations and arrests of illegal immigrants.

Key Points:

• Numbers and Efficiency: Over 100,000 deportations and 110,000 arrests within approximately 60 days, showcasing a swift crackdown on illegal immigration.
• High-Profile Cases: Mention of notable deportation cases, including public figures like Joe Rogan.
• Legislative and Political Reactions: Congressional figures like Jamie Raskin demand the return of deportees from El Salvador prisons, reflecting political tensions over immigration policies.

Notable Quote:

"But why would you want somebody in here who is on welfare or who has a criminal record or is not working or just got here under the Biden regime, just send them back."
— Jack Fowler [18:31]

Analysis: Jack Fowler criticizes the leniency of the Biden administration on immigration, advocating for strict deportations of illegal immigrants, especially those dependent on public assistance or with criminal backgrounds. The hosts debate the moral and practical implications of such policies, reinforcing the "America First" stance.

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4. Tesla Protests and Corporate Boycotts

The episode addresses recent Tesla protests, analyzing their authenticity and potential impact on the company's reputation and operations.

Key Points:

• Nature of Protests: Observations that the protests were orchestrated, with evidence suggesting structured plans rather than spontaneous actions.
• Impact on Tesla: Attempts to disrupt Tesla's business through sabotage, harassment of customers, and reputational damage.
• Elon Musk’s Role: Recognition of Elon Musk as a pioneering figure in the EV market, facing challenges from leftist opposition despite his contributions to sustainable technology.

Notable Quote:

"So more importantly they are going, they are trying to systematically destroy a brand and they're trying to do it in three different ways."
— Jack Fowler [13:11]

Analysis: The hosts contend that the Tesla protests are not genuine grassroots movements but rather coordinated efforts to sabotage the company and discredit Elon Musk. They argue that such actions undermine legitimate environmental progress and hinder technological advancements in the EV sector.

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5. Deportations and Treatment of Prisoners Related to Hamas

Discussion moves to the humanitarian and legal aspects of deportations involving prisoners linked to Hamas, exploring their treatment and the broader geopolitical ramifications.

Key Points:

• Cases Like Joe Rogan’s: Profiles of deported individuals, their backgrounds, and the legal justifications for their removal.
• Hamas Criticism: Examination of the treatment of Hamas critics and the brutal tactics used, including torture and dismemberment.
• International Law and Human Rights: Analysis of how these deportations align with or violate international legal standards and human rights considerations.

Notable Quote:

"But they're trying to systematically destroy a brand and they're trying to do it in three different ways."
— Jack Fowler [13:11]

Analysis: The hosts highlight the severe and often inhumane treatment of individuals deported under the guise of combating terrorism. They critique the lack of due process and the brutality of methods used, questioning the ethical foundations of such policies and their alignment with American values of justice and human rights.

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6. European Lawfare and Political Moves

Victor and Jack delve into the European political arena, discussing lawfare tactics used against conservative and right-wing candidates.

Key Points:

• Case Study – Maureen Le Pen: Exploration of Maureen Le Pen's embezzlement charges and their implications for her political career.
• European Lawfare: Tactics used by European authorities to undermine right-wing candidates, mirroring American lawfare strategies against Trump.
• Impact on Democracy: Concerns over the erosion of democratic principles through politically motivated legal actions.

Notable Quote:

"It's very anti-democratic. Now we put her in jail, a house arrest for two years and then suspended sentence and then oh wow, she can't run right when Macron will be running."
— Jack Fowler [33:13]

Analysis: The hosts argue that Europe is adopting similar lawfare strategies to those seen in the United States, targeting right-wing politicians to stifle opposition and maintain the status quo. They express concern over the undermining of democratic processes and the use of legal systems as tools for political gain.

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7. US Policy on Iran and Potential Military Actions

A significant portion of the discussion centers on the Trump administration's strategy towards Iran, including potential military interventions and diplomatic maneuvers.

Key Points:

• Military Buildup: Trump’s plans to deploy bombers and super Hornets to strategic locations, signaling a readiness for potential conflict.
• Nuclear Threats: Emphasis on dismantling Iran’s nuclear capabilities to prevent nuclear proliferation in the Middle East.
• Strategic Calculus: Analysis of how escalating tensions could lead to broader regional conflicts, drawing parallels with historical precedents like the Cuban Missile Crisis.

Notable Quote:

"If I could, I would quote pool the 51 state Panama, invade Panama, absorb Greenland third term talk."
— Jack Fowler [67:57]

Analysis: Jack Fowler critiques Trump's aggressive posturing towards Iran, suggesting that such actions may escalate tensions unnecessarily. He underscores the precarious balance between deterrence and provocation, warning that heightened military presence and threats could lead to unintended conflicts and regional instability.

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8. Domestic Law and Order Issues

The hosts address various domestic issues related to law and order, including DEI policies, military standards, and federal employee obligations.

Key Points:

• Military Standards for Gender: Discussion on Lt. Gen. Pete Hexef’s order for uniform standards for men and women in the military, emphasizing competence and physical requirements.
• DEI Policies Impact: Critique of Diversity, Equity, and Inclusion (DEI) initiatives, suggesting they compromise operational effectiveness and meritocracy.
• Federal Employees Returning to Office: Challenges faced by federal employees resuming in-person work, highlighting issues like workplace cleanliness and maintenance due to prolonged absences.

Notable Quote:

"So if you have a Special Forces team or you're a combat team, you're dropped in. You want everybody to be able to win a knife fight, cut the guy's throat before he does yours. So it's equity."
— Jack Fowler [70:36]

Analysis: Victor and Jack argue that DEI policies have led to lowered standards and operational inefficiencies within critical sectors like the military and federal agencies. They advocate for merit-based standards, stressing that maintaining high operational effectiveness should take precedence over diversity quotas.

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9. Recent Controversies and PR Blunders

The episode touches on recent media controversies, including the Signal Gate incident involving Jeffrey Goldberg, and its implications for journalistic integrity.

Key Points:

• Signal Gate Incident: Examination of the unauthorized access to Signal app messages, leading to vulnerabilities and breaches of privacy.
• Jeffrey Goldberg’s Involvement: Discussion on how Goldberg ended up on the call and the implications for media credibility and security.
• Historical Comparisons: Reference to past pranks and security lapses involving Democratic staff, drawing parallels to current events.

Notable Quote:

"I don't like the idea that you say you're a journalist, and so anything goes. You have a professional obligation to, I don't know, hurt your country."
— Jack Fowler [83:03]

Analysis: The hosts criticize the lapse in security protocols that allowed a high-profile journalist to gain unauthorized access to sensitive communications. They argue that such incidents undermine trust in the media and highlight the need for stricter operational standards to prevent future breaches.

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10. Conclusion

Throughout the episode, Victor Davis Hanson and Jack Fowler provide a comprehensive analysis of various domestic and international issues, advocating for an "America First" approach. They emphasize the importance of protecting domestic industries, maintaining law and order, and adopting strategic foreign policies to safeguard national interests. The hosts remain critical of both media portrayals and opposing political factions, advocating for policies that prioritize economic competitiveness, national security, and operational effectiveness.

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Notable Takeaways:

• Economic Nationalism: Support for tariffs as a means to revive domestic industries and protect American jobs.
• Immigration Enforcement: Strong advocacy for strict deportation policies to maintain national security and economic stability.
• Defense and Security: Emphasis on maintaining a robust military presence and readiness to address global threats.
• Critique of Progressive Policies: Skepticism towards DEI initiatives and lawfare tactics perceived to undermine meritocracy and democratic principles.
• Media and Political Integrity: Concerns over media breaches and the manipulation of legal systems for political gains.

Overall Insight: The episode underscores a keen focus on restoring American economic and military strength through protectionist policies, stringent immigration enforcement, and strategic foreign interventions. Victor Davis Hanson and Jack Fowler advocate for policies that prioritize national interests, often critiquing progressive social policies and media portrayals that they believe hinder America's progress and security.

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End of Summary

Transcript

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[Victor Davis Hanson]

Customers hello and welcome to the Victor Davis Hansen Show. This is our Friday news roundup where we look at all the news of the week and we got lots of news on the agenda. Trump rolled out his tariffs this week and the elections in Wisconsin and Florida took place, the special elections and we had Tesla protesters this weekend. Those are the stories we'll start out with. So stay with us and we'll be right back after these messages. Welcome back to the Victor Davis Hanson Show. Victor's the Martin O'Neilly Anderson Senior Fellow in Military History and Classics at the Hoover Institution and the Wayne and Marshabowsky Distinguished Fellow in History at Hillsdale College. You can find him at his website victorhanson.com the name of the website is the Blade of Perseus so please come join us there. There's lots of free mater and then there is the subscriber material, two articles a week and a video exclusively for our Ultra subscribers. And we would love it if you would join us there. Well Victor, we had lots of news this week and I thought we'd start with the Trump events and those are he rolled out his tariffs and I wondered if you had any reflection on that.

[Co-host or Guest]

What was that Liberation.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Ah, yes.

[Co-host or Guest]

Well, there's going to be. There's two things about this story. One of them is class. So the investor class, and I mean it overlaps. There's a lot of working people that have 401ks, but I'm talking about the big investor class, the Wall Street Journal class. They don't like any of this and they believe in the following, that absolute free trade, whether it's fair or not, is good for them because they feel that if other countries subsidize their products, it's not sustainable. And they have a point there. I mean, if you look at the per capita income of China or Europe or Japan, it's less than ours. I mean, the only ones that have higher are these artificially inflated oil sheikdoms. So we have a dynamic economy. Number two, they feel that it keeps the domestic supplier competitive. He always has to compete against unfair advantages. And they feel that it, it gives consumers a break. Everything go to Walmart. Half the stuff's made in China, cheap. Okay, it's true. But it comes at the expense of displacing working class people or at least relegating them only to lower paying service jobs when we could be making all of it. We used to be the biggest shipbuilder in the world. We built 27 Essex carriers in two years. We built the USS America at the time. It was the most sophisticated cruise liner in the world in the 1950s. We can do it. So the people who want jobs that are well paying want a liberation day. And the people who offshore, outsource and our investing class don't, but the majority do. That's number one. The second thing about this is it will succeed if he keeps using the word parody. Parody, parody, parody. Symmetry, symmetry, symmetry. Because what the left is doing and people on the libertarian right are suggesting that everything was normal and we were getting along. And then this disruptor came in, this crazy trump with this 19th century Taft type of tariff, right? And he screwed everything up and he alienated the Mexicans and the Canadians and the European. What is he doing? No, no, no. The situation was not stable. We were running a 1.2 to 1.5 trillion dollar trade deficit. We were 37 trillion dollars with national debt, the interest on the debt. And it could go higher. It could really go higher. It was larger than the defense budget and we were spending $3 billion a day printing, borrowing $3 billion to pay the interest on our larger borrowing sum. So Donald Trump is saying parody. And they always say, well, the old order, the rules based Order, the transatlantic, well, the transatlantic alliance, the rules based order was not, was not lawful. What wasn't based on rules, it was based on America's a big fat, wealthy, naive sucker. And we in the Canada are going to whip, you know, we're going to get 63 billion and we in Mexico 170. We in Europe 200 billion and then they're going to subsidize our defense. And if they don't like it, we're going to say you're Donald Trump and you're a disruptor. Well, no, no, no, no, no. It's time for an accounting. So if he can, if he can say I am not a disruptor, I'm a restorer. I just want to have a general rule that anybody who has, and he's going to announce it as we're speaking, anybody who has a tariff will have a tariff. Anybody that doesn't, we won't. It will be just about the same as your tariff. We might even be what he called what generous tariffs. Generous tariffs are. We are a little lower than yours. That will be a persuasive point.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah. What are your thoughts on this recent election, special elections in both Florida and Wisconsin and especially the Crawford election to the Supreme Court of Wisconsin?

[Co-host or Guest]

Well, in all special elections, and that's defined by not federal elections or state elections, that's usually not defined as the four year presidential election or the two year midterms which coincide with state races, but just special ones to replace people. Usually the Democrats do better because their voters, they tend to be more, they're smaller turnouts. But the turnout in those elections tend to be more motivated. On the left problem that the Maga movement has, it's brought in so many new people that they will vote in a presidential election. Young people, Hispanics, African American males. But they're not going to turn out just for one particular election. So we knew that Wisconsin was not going to win. Now they're crowing that the two Florida seats they had once sizable margins of 30%, 25%. But the Republicans only won these red seats by 14 and 17. That's bogus because incumbents, regardless of what party they're in, if you're there forever, like Mike Waltz and Gates, Matt Gaetz, you just keep building up, building up. It's like our congressman here, Jim Costie's been there. You're not going to. It's very hard to defeat him. But the point that I'm making is that if you get a newcomer in an open jungle race, I mean he still won by 14. That's a blowout. But because he didn't win, the left is trying to say that it doesn't mean anything. It's going to give them with Stefanik's retention of her seat, three more seats. It'll be a more comfortable margin. So I don't see big thing any big deal. I looked at the polls today. There's only one outlier, Gallup and he has trumped down by negative eight or something. But most of them are either dead even or he's up a point or down a point. And that's pretty good given the chaos that the media has portrayed.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

The media has made a lot as well of the Crawford election based on they think the Supreme Court apparently will okay the new apportionment that will get rid of two Republican congressional districts. And I was wondering, is that how you saw it? Do you think that it's as significant as that?

[Co-host or Guest]

Well, the Supreme Court has no authority on the congressional districts. The number those are set by the census but they're going to redistrict two that may now they can redistrict it in a spaghetti fashion or a jigsaw puzzle fashion. That would give them two more seats within the static number of se. California is going to lose by the way blue states in general over the next five years at the next census at the population trends continue, I.e. blue State people are less fertile and blue state people move to red state. If that continues, they're going to lose 10 seats. The census will require them. That is the left. But that it was too bad that she that Crawford won but it was nullified by the fact that also on the ballot they had a requirement for you have to show an ID to get an absentee ballot or mail in ballot or to show up in the early voting in addition to regular election day voting. And that was far more important because that is going to be very hard for the Democrats to massage. They really fought that. That won by 62%. So if they keep saying there's never any fraud, you're racist, you're xenophobic, you've made all this up. And then they fight, they fight requirement of a license or. I just went into the supermarket the other day, I didn't see. I saw maybe four people with checks, old fashioned checks. They had IDs. Why did they do that? It was so racist. Voting is not as important as buying food, right?

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah. And it seems to be broadly supported that people would like to be sure that they are actual citizens. So they're not taking the right of voting from citizens. Victor, I would like to take a moment for our sponsor Wired to Fish Coffee. As you may know, I love Wired to Fish Coffee. Not only for their delicious smooth coffee but for more importantly for their amazing commitment to give back. Wired to Fish coffee gives back 25% percent of profits 25 to conservation, clean water and things like missions and evangelical outreach. Join us and enjoy your coffee while making a difference in the world and join a community of like minded coffee lovers. Subscribe and save today and enjoy discounted coffee and free freight or just give this brand a try with discount code. Just news or just the news for 10% off your first order, head over to Wired to Number 2 Fish Coffee today and make this year a year. You align your coffee with your values. And we thank Wired2Fish for supporting the Victor Davis Hansen show. So Victor, let's turn then to the There was the big Tesla protest this weekend. I think they turned out to be a little bit underwhelming myself. And there didn't seem to in fact, Fox News suggested that in at least one protest all the protesters left at 12 o'clock as though they were being paid and on the clock. I was wondering your thoughts.

[Co-host or Guest]

Yes. There were two other indices that suggest they were less than spontaneous. They showed a picture of a person with a menu and it was printed out say this, do this. And then all of the signs had what pre printed and they were similar. So somebody is doing this and I don't see why they can't get them on RICO or rack racketeering interstate conspiracy charges. Because even if they're not, even if they're claim. Well we didn't know they were going to cut the charger cables. We didn't know they were going to. They knew and we didn't know when we just said we're going to take him down. We didn't think that a lot of people would key his cars. But you could say in court, well what did you say anything after this phenomenon, this epidemic of keying cars? Well we didn't know it. Well, that's not going to stand up. But so more importantly they are going, they are trying to systematically destroy a brand and they're trying to do it in three different ways. They're saying if you have a Tesla, you might not be able to charge it because we'll cut the cables. If you want to go in and buy a Tesla to pick up your Tesla, we're going to be there and we're going to try to harass you. And if you own a Tesla, we're going to try to run you off the road or key your car or damage it and that will suppress sales. Or number four, we're going to so demonize Elon Musk and the brand that you just won't feel giddy of having the best EV on the market anymore and saving the planet. This is what everybody's remarked about. He was a heroic Olympian God to the left because he actually took all of their highfalutin abstract nonsense about EVs are going to save the world. And he actually translated that into a car with a 330 mile range. I used to drive a 1963 Volvo third hand that my father bought for $800 and it had a 10 gallon gas tank and it got 28 miles a gallon, 280 miles. So 330, I mean, it doesn't, that's not great compared to modern cars. But that makes it possible to do places. And I don't know why Mercedes or bm, they can't, none of these people can. It's sort of like the can rival him. It's sort of like SpaceX, the Euro rocket that was launched in Norway. It went. And I, I hope that he gets competition from Jeff Bezos and the other competitors that are private and Boeing, et cetera. But so far, whatever he's doing, it's in the Henry Ford, Thomas Edison, Alexander Graham Bell mode. I don't know how he does it, but it's pretty spectacular. I just don't know why people on the left wouldn't say, well, you don't have to take a chainsaw, Elon. We knew that there was all this waste and here's a proposal. We have gone through the whole government just like your doge do, but we're more kind and compassionate and sober and judicious. But here's our alternate and we can get this same reduction. They have no idea. Instead they want to pay, they just always want to pass bills and it's like, where does the money come from?

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Well, Victor, let's go ahead and take a break and then come back and talk a little bit about the deportations that are going on. Stay with us and we'll be back. Welcome back to the Victor Davis Hansen Show. You can find Victor at X. His handle is at Vdhan Hansen and on Facebook at Hanson's Morning cup, so please come join us there. He's also on YouTube and Rumble, so you can catch Victor Davis Hansen podcast shows in video on YouTube and rumble. So, Victor, we've had lots of news this week on deportations. I would just like to update the audience on We've got Trump has deported over a hundred thousand and he's arrested another 110,000 illegal immigrants. So they are working on the deportations very quickly. It's only been approximately 60 days, but we've had I think his name is Jamie Raskin in the Congress demand a return of the deportees from the El Salvador prison. And we recently had news stories about how they have a father from, was it New Jersey, Maryland, sorry, a Maryland father that they arrested. And finally Rogan, Joe Rogan, who sometimes comes out on the wrong side of things, has said, well, they've arrested he called him a gay hairdresser, I believe, but he's actually a makeup artist. And that they arrested him and sent him to El Salvador. And so Rogan was complaining that this is beyond the pale. And I was wondering your thoughts on any of those new cases coming in. And, and just general reflections on this.

[Co-host or Guest]

Well, he had gang insignia allegedly tattooed all over him. But he's been on the straight and narrow, he claims, since. But he's here illegally and he entered illegally and he's residing here illegally and he can say all he wants. But if he's here illegally and he had a gang affiliation and the gang is a terrorist designated organization, what does he think is going to happen? But why doesn't, why don't his defenders say, well, we have no problem with deporting him because he came here illegally. He has no right to be here. But let's just tell us El Salvadorians to check again and see their experts. They're the experts. They have all sorts of data files. Just see if he's in the files. If he's in the files, then keep him there. But if he's not, then just send him back home. But why would you make the argument he should come back here when he's here illegally? Which is another I get my friend Gary wrote, he writes me a lot. He's a very good guy, very smart. And he said, isn't there not an amnesty? But, but is there a different category? And I wrote about that in Mexifornia 22 years ago, something to the effect that of these and by the way, we have, we had 30. The Yale study years ago said it wasn't 20, it was 30 million. So you bring in 12. We probably have 40 million here illegally. But there is a large number that might fit the following categories. They've been here five years, a B, they've never committed a Crime. C, they're not on any public assistance. D, they're working, if they're working, if they're not on public assistance, if they have no record, then why not say to them, if you pay a fine, I don't know, four or five thousand dollars for breaking our laws, we will allow you to apply for a green card. Under the Simpson act of 1986. When that amnesty went through, only 33% applied for citizenship. Because I mean, we have so watered down citizenship and the distinctions between mere residency and citizenship are almost non existent. And the dying citizen, I asked what can you do as a resident that you can't do as a citizen? Or vice versa? And there's almost the only thing I could think of is run for office and vote in federal elections, but you can vote in local elections now. So it's been watered down. I think most people would just get a green card and then deport everybody else. And I think that would be a fair thing to do. But here's the catch. I don't know if Joe Rogan would support that. I don't know if the libertarian right would support that. I know the left wouldn't support it. But why would you want somebody in here who is on welfare or who has a criminal record or is not working or just got here under the Biden regime, just send them back. And they have an incentive. You know, they have this executive order that says if you get caught here illegally and you are deported, you're going to go into a database and you can't come in under any circumstances for 10 years. And in some cases people are actually going back self deporting. That was what Mitt Romney said. Remember in 2000 he was for self deportation.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Well, if I can turn to another subject on the treatment of prisoners and also just sort of because I feel Joe Rogan needs a perspective. He's talking about the exception to the role of the people that have been sent to the El Salvador prison. And if we turn to Hamas prisoner that was just taken, he was a protester against Hamas and he was a Palestinian. And they didn't wait for anything. They tortured him, dismembered the body or tore the body apart. And then to terrify everybody and his parents dumped it at the doorstep with a note.

[Co-host or Guest]

This is what happens to Hamas critics. And threw him off the roof. And it wasn't one or two, I think a whole mob of 30 grabbed him. These are the same people who when they release a hostage, they all get in their camouflage and they do their goose step. And they all have their mask on. And then they're so terrifying, they think. And then when they actually are mobilized, two things happen. They kill their own people as bullies. And then when the Israelis come in, and as we speak, the Israelis are going in there to destroy Hamas, they understand that you got to go into the tunnels and destroy them. Then they go back into the tunnels. It also raises a very interesting question. Of the 11 million or so 10 and a half million Israelis resident citizens, there's about 2 million people, tends to be in northern Israel for the most part, that are Arab Israeli citizens. I'm not talking about the Druze, but from the west bank or that multi generational few of them had been there since 1947. Okay, what is their attitude about all this? Put it this way. If you were a person on the west bank and you wanted to speak freely, either criticizing Hamas or criticizing Israel, and you were living, you moved over to Israel and you were one of the 2 million Arabs who often demonstrate, who would you. To whom would you fear? Would you hear Hamas? So if you were a Hamas supporter and then you were disillusioned like this person and started criticizing them, would you be safer in the Jewish state criticizing Hamas or in the West? Obviously in the Jewish state. But go one step further. If you were criticizing Israel, would you be safer in Israel and Hamas criticizing or in the west bank or Gaza? And the answer is only in Israel would you be safe. And that's why every time there had been a discussion about the actual course of the Sharon fence and it went into villages, especially in the north, and people, they had to decide where it would go. Include this village, include that village, exclude this. I went there in 2006, I think, or six people were protesting. And I asked my IDF person, look, they're protesting against Israel. He said, no, they're protesting. He said, no, excuse me. He said, yes, they are protesting because they don't want the fence to exclude them from. I said, from their home and their brethren and the. No, no, from Israel. Israel. They want to live in Israel. And I said, why? And he said, well, hang on, Victor. So we were driving through the west bank and they said, now we're going to go into Israel. And it was like night and day as far as everything. Yes, that's so they know that. And that's what's the irony of the whole Middle East.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah, Israel is a place of law and order.

[Co-host or Guest]

It's the only place of law and the only place. There are places in the Gulf. But you can't say anything about the regime or you might be chopped up in the Turkish embassy.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

My gosh, is that the Saudis you're talking about? Well, let's turn speaking of law and order to Europe.

[Co-host or Guest]

I want to say.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Sorry. Go ahead.

[Co-host or Guest]

One thing about law and order, I was gone and I mentioned that in a podcast. And I've been here since 1980 as an adult right in this house. So I've been here 45 years as an adult. But I grew up here just down the road. So I was here my high say 70. I can remember, I don't know, 65 years of this. Not on one case had the sheriff and more than two sheriffs ever come out. But three sheriffs, not on any case, have they come out. They came out here and said somebody had called 9911 because this is the. That was swatting. That's what they do. They said there's somebody here or intruder or something. And the other thing is, I've noticed in the angry readers, I haven't been doing them for the website. The tone is now different. It's not just Uraf Black, you know what I mean? I give them an angry reader score, but now it's beware, watch out. And that's a little weird. And I think what I'm getting at is there's something going on in the country where the more politically estranged and neutered and emasculated the Democrats are and the more that their street theater in Congress, the Jasmine Crockett, the Jeremy Raskin, the Chuck Schumer, we're going to, you know, go down and get in your neighborhood or we're going to get in your districts, Republicans. Or screaming and yelling, Al Green trying to shut down the Trump joint session address, the kickboxing video, the shit senators. The more that that turns people off, the more violent they get. This reminds me of the iterations of the French Revolution. So they are really, the left is really going back to their golden moment from June, July, August, September 2020, when they got away with everything. This is very ironic because they said that anybody on January 6th that even went into the Capitol, even if they weren't, had nothing to do. That'd be like saying, hey, I'm Pam Bondi. Somebody threw a Molotov cocktail at that dealership. I don't care if you did it or not. If you were near there and you were demonstrating, we're going to indict you, you, and then we're going to put you away for four years. That's what I'm getting at is it's going to get, it's getting, somebody's going to have to stop it and tell them if you continue to engage in terrorism and swatting and threatening people, it's going to get very scary. I'm afraid that there's going to go. They're going to cut off some woman on the. Because they always do it with women. They don't do it with some big burly guy in a Tesla. But they kind of cut off and then they run back and ran. I think some armed woman's going to shoot, shoot them. I heaven forbid. Because she thinks she's going to be killed.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Well, speaking of Pam Bondi then before I go on to the European Law Fair, she just recently said they are going to seek the death penalty for Luigi Mangioni, that killer.

[Co-host or Guest]

Death penalty says first degree murder, which means it's premeditated and planned. So he scouted out, he wore a mask, he was off the Internet. He brought a satchel of food and weaponry. He went into a hostel or something, tried to hide himself and then he scouted out the place and then he waited and then he dispassionately, without emotion, shot a aspiring middle class kid and made it pretty well in UnitedHealth who ran a pretty good company and now he's a hero to all of the left. And isn't that first degree murder or is it because the left now is the party of oligarchs and aristocrats and say well he went to a good university, he's good looking, he's wealthy, he's liberal, his family is one of the good people. That's what they're saying. They're so strange. I mean if if there was some guy from southern Kentucky and he got angry at a George Soros like figure or somebody and he went out and did that, they would be saying this person should be tortured. They would, they have no consistent anything. It's like Jasmine Crockett screaming about they need. They can't hold judges responsible. And the judge's will goes and you can't personally attack the judge and you have to play by the rules. And she's. And then Darrell Issa takes one nanosecond to quote her what she said about, you know, attacking judges and impeaching them.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah. She was a co signer of a bill to impeach the justice.

[Co-host or Guest]

Like Barack Obama. You remember during the funeral for what's his name, he said, you know, we gotta get rid of that. You got to get rid of that full buster. It's a racist. Racist relic. Racist relic. Got to get rid of it. Why, why, why? Why would you let a couple crazy people obstruct the majority in the Senate? And then you, 1 nanosecond, never bet against the Internet. 1 nanosecond after he said that everybody has a speech when he was trying to stop Alito, when he was in the minority and he was filibustering. Filibuster is a good way to stop the tyranny of the majority.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I love that Internet. All right, so just then to turn to law and order in Europe. And the Europeans seem to be taking a page from the playbook of the US Left. And they are, are using lawfare against many of their candidates. And there are many of them. But I, I think I noted the big one was Maureen Le Pen, who has been charged and found guilty of embezzlement according to a French court. And they wanted to take her out. And I was wondering, your reflection, out of the race or candidacy. And I was wondering, your reflection.

[Co-host or Guest]

Yeah. They're saying that her EU funds as a member of the EU were used and they didn't have a complete paywall. Other words, she did something maybe like Hillary Clinton. I don't think she even did that. In other words, she gave money to the dnc, who gave it to Perkins Coey, who gave it to Fusion GPS and then gave it to Christopher Steele. And then they said, I didn't do it. But it's so weird. The Europeans do two things. They say that they are preeminent as defenders of democracy and that we are subverting it with Trump. And they can't list anything Trump did. It subverted democracy. And then two, they are independent, they are pacesetters, they are not emulative, they do not follow the United States. And what do they do? They look at the four years of Donald Trump out in the desert and at the, you know, as Judge Kaplan and Eugene Carroll, as Fannie Willis and Judge Engoron, as Judd Merchan and Alvin Bragg, as I should say, Letita James and Fanny Willis, Nathan Wade, they all go after him and they tie him up for four years. They try to take him off the ballot. They raid. And the Europeans go, I like this. Especially when one of these right wing guys or conservatives can win. Now, if they're marginal, we play by the rules. But if they. So The Romanians took Mr. Georgescu and he came out of nowhere. He was right. He won the first round, he was going to win the second. Oh, he's a Russian. I thought they wouldn't be so shameless to say Russian collusion. He's a Russian collusion, he's Putin's puppet. That just. They just copy everything that here and then the alternative for Deutschland and it gets 20. It gets, as we said to Jack the other day, it get 20% of the vote. 150 seats. It's the big enchilada. Who would want. Wouldn't the. The Conservative Party want to. No, nobody can touch it. It's kryptonite. Do they think that's going to stop those people? They're going to get 40% next time. But that's very anti democratic. Now we put her in jail, a house arrest for two years and then suspended sentence and then oh wow, she can't run right when Macron will be running. So. And then the other thing is Turkey is just kind of canceled their elections. Well, I mean they didn't cancel. They put the Erdogan, put the mayor of Istanbul in jail and everybody's protesting and they want Europe to condemn it. And Europe will not condemn that. And why? Because they look at the 32 nation NATO and they say the Turks have the biggest army and now they've got a fledgling big defense industry and we don't want to arm because we're socialist utopians and it's good to have these crazy Turks. And why would we want to have be principled opposition to Erdogan in defense of democracy? That's not who we are. We're crass opportunists who make everybody feel guilty with our highfalutin castigization. Nobody takes those lectures seriously anymore. You know, it's like the Europeans. I did one, I think I mentioned I did. I won't mention the person, but I did an interview with a hostile British and when you talk to them, they don't want to talk about it. Well, let's just have parody. Parody tariffs and let's just have parody. Let's have parity tariffs and let's have parity in everybody equal equity, equity. Everybody pays 2%. We decided to do that 11 years ago in 2014. But you nine of you don't do it. There'd be no problems in the world. You just pay your 2%. You, we have no pateron. You'd be like the United States. Two percent are nothing. We have the fewest terrorists. It's so bizarre. They're so angry at us. When we have the lowest terrorist system in the world, they have one of the highest and they think we're unfair because we complain and now there's a New York. Did you see this? The New York Times ran a secret history of the Ukraine war. Now they tell us they knew it at the time. And it turns out that Joe Biden and his generals and the left were lying about everything. There were Americans that were inside Ukraine targeting Russian assets. There were. And telling them the relative degree of importance they were to the Russian military and which type of ordinance to use. British, France, America, American. And they were inside Ukraine advising them. And we were channeling money that was not really known to the American people, in addition, probably through usa. But the point was they weren't talking about any. We were heavily involved. And they had been getting warnings from the Russians, you better be. They knew all this. And they were saying, oh, they're just braggadocio. They would never do any. So they got us very close, close to the brink. You know, I wrote a column and I said, this is very strange, what's developing in Ukraine. We're breaking the protocols of the Cold War, which said two nuclear rivals will never use a proxy on the doorstep of the other power and arm it. And when Russia under Khrushchev did that in 1962 in Cuba, John F. Kennedy said, there ain't gonna. There's not going to be missiles in Cuba. Excuse me, Cuba. Be no missiles in Cuba. We won't have missiles in Cuba. And so he stopped. He won't. He went to DEFCON 2 to stop that and def. It's. My point is that putting a proxy, I mean arming a proxy right on the doorstep of a nuclear rival is sort of what they did with Cuba. I know that some of you can say, well, Victor, he was that communist dictatorship and Zelensky is a what? Oh, I'm sorry, he's elected president who holds regularly scheduled election. There's a vibrant political opposition active in Ukraine. There's a free press and there's habeas. Oh, none of that, none of that, none of that. And the United States is applying the Israeli model to our proxy. We're using Israel. We like the damage they're doing to Middle east terrorists who saw the type. People hit us on 9 11. So we tell. We we're doing. We have certain rules with Netanyahu, so we do them with Ukraine. So be careful about Ukrainian. Ukrainians, be careful about collateral damage. No, we don't say that. Ukrainians, you must have a ceasefire. There's a million. It's not like 40,000 or 30,000 death. There's a million and a half casualties. Dead, wounded. You've got to have a. No, we don't have a ceasefire, do we? You got to be like Netanyahu. You got to have a coalition. No, we don't say that to Zelensky. You better have an election. It's the most bizarre thing in the world. You should read that article, everybody, about the secret history of. I couldn't believe that all these left wing venues, they were all telling us how wonderful the Ukraine war was and how principled it was and how transparent how. Remember Joel Scarborough said he'd never seen a more fit. And now all of a sudden, these books come out, these articles come out. The Ukraine war was kind of like the secret bombing of Cambodia under Nixon. And Joe Biden was non compos mentis from the outset. And there was a cabal. Molly. It's really weird. They always do that. They. They think, wow, we lost all of our reputation because we're pathological liars. But once the problem is over and our line is of no longer any use because it serves no purpose, Biden's gone the Democrat, then we'll restore our credibility by being investigative reporters who tell the truth and they never wrap themselves up. It's kind of like Gavin Newsom's newscast when he got up there the other day and he was talking with. Is it Bill Maher? And he said, our brain is toxic and we've gone too far to the left. And I thought, well, who gave 500 million in special monies to illegal aliens? Who created a reparations committee? Who blew up four dams on the Klamath River? Who's trying to blow up two of them up in Northern California and Napa Sonoma area? You are. Who was the one that bragged about California was going to be a refuge and not comply with transgender bans on transgender biological males? He was. Who? Who's. It's.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

They just use that word toxic, and they don't have any thought behind it whatsoever.

[Co-host or Guest]

Like, he should have just got a mirror if he was going to be honest and looked in the mirror and said, gavin, you're toxic. And then Gavin would say, no, I'm not Gavin. He said, yes, you are. You had reparations. You blow. No, I didn't. And that would have been much more honest than.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

You sound like you would think he should be Smeagol Gollum talking to himself.

[Co-host or Guest]

Except the good Smeagol. I mean, there was the bad Golem and the good Smeagol, but he's bad, bad unless he does that and says, I'm going to talk to Smeagol Gavin. And Smeagol Gavin says, well, you can't. You shouldn't blow up dams. They give you electricity and recreation and agricultural irrigation supplies and flood control. And then the Gavin Gavin, the bad one says, yeah, yeah, but I left. We don't. We want to restore California to 1848. And then Smeagol Gavin says, but where do you have the fourth largest reserves of natural gas and AI? It needs a lot of electricity. We could go on the Monterey Shale formation and make huge clean burning natural gas and have big AI forms and keep all those jobs high paying. And then the bad Gollum Gavin says, no, we're not, because it's going to heat up the planet. And I'm not going to fight with those crazy people in Marin county and the Sierra Club, Save the Earth. That's how they are. He's just, he is a schizophrenic. Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

You have to hand him credit for saying that men in women's sports. It was unfair. That's what he said. I think definitely feel after he ensured.

[Co-host or Guest]

That he would resist a federal order. Yeah, he's going to try to run for president. And he's. No one just says to him, you're, you're the one that did it. Even Michael Savage and, you know, Charlie Hurt and all of them, they said, you are the one who did it. And if he asked me to be on there, I would say that to him. I really promise my audience, I would say, you did it.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I don't think you're going to be asked to be on his show. Last thing before we go to a break, you were talking about Russia and the Ukraine war. And this week we found out that Trump's peace deal in Russia is on a very thin string because Russia has said that the peace with Ukraine is, doesn't address the, quote, unquote, root causes of the conflict.

[Co-host or Guest]

The root causes.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

There's two things that there's that cause.

[Co-host or Guest]

We want all of Ukraine. That's why we try to take care.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

And then the second thing is the United States policy is to try to use sanctions to press Putin in his in, in coming into these peace talks. China's supplying him.

[Co-host or Guest]

I know, but this is the ying and the yang of any discussion. Discussion. It always any discussion to end. It's like the Russo Japanese war. We talked on our Saturday edition. They went back and forth, back and forth. Versailles Treaty, back and forth, back and forth, Armistice, back and forth. So as soon as he criticized Zelensky and said Zelensky should have never, you know, he said, you don't have the car. Then Putin's thought, ah, I'm going to get on my hind legs and start making greater demands. And now, now he's criticized Putin. He said, I hope that's not true. He's going to be in big trouble. Then Zelensky says, well, maybe I should be in NATO. And I don't think we need more money out of that rare minerals deal and we need more sophisticated weapons. So whatever side that you chastise, the other one then gets on their hind legs and gets emboldened. But it doesn't change the strategic calculus on the ground. If you're a Harvard professor, Graham Allison, or you're Jacob Grego, all these people who write extensively about it, most of my colleagues at the Hoover Institution, they all have, they're all on the same page. Ukraine is on the same page. Everybody knows. One, it will not be in NATO. Two, it's got the most effective military in NATO right now by being outside of NATO and it will be fully armed. Three, Vladimir Putin military was embarrassed and it's shell shock shocked. It will recover, but it will never be able to take a you fortified and fully armed Ukraine. Number four, it is wearing Ukraine down. 12 million people have left. It's got 10 times the natural, the GDP, it's got 30 times the area, it's got four times the population. It will eventually grind them down. I don't, I don't think it can take the whole country, but it can kill a lot of more people than it is. And number five, everybody knows the peace. The peace is you stole Crimea and you stole Donbass, and Obama let it happen. And Trump never said that he should go to war to get them back, and Biden didn't either. So you've got them. You got your 8 million speaking Russians. They're back into the Russian fold. Okay, we got that. And, and the question is, how far will Putin go backwards? So wherever he goes back to his embarkation point, you have a DMZ like Korea, and you have a hot peace. It's not a good peace, but it's peace. It's like the Koreas. You have a dmz, and then right next to zmz, you have a rare earth mineral corridor of economic activity, and that's about what you're going to get, and they all know it. So what are they fighting over now? They're fighting over. Putin wants to get as westward as he can and get as much territory, and Ukraine wants to push him back and that's about it. They're fighting over Maripol and Odessa and make sure that all that Ukraine has ports. And I, it's, it's going to happen is what I'm saying. And when it happens, we know what will happen. It, they'll say Donald Trump had nothing to do with it. Nothing to do with it. He's still Putin's puppet. He's Putin's puppet. It's Munich, it's a sellout, it's appeasement. And then they'll go along with it and then we'll have an end to a million and a half dead, wounded, missing and killed. The meat grounder, the Stalingrad, the Verdun, the Psalm. Yes, no, it's so weird about leftists. They're so self righteous and anti war and yet they really went into this war and they think that a, do they think that a horrific existential war is better than a messy peace or a hot piece? I don't understand that at all.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Well, I was wondering because Russia's actual claims to the root causes might have something to do with the territory that it feels like it needs in order to have those warm water ports that it's always seeking. It looks like if you look at the Black Sea, that the Ukraine got all the best territory when it had the.

[Co-host or Guest]

It has Crimea right now. Crimea's got true Sebastopol is a great.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

But that's one of the arguing territories.

[Co-host or Guest]

That they're not, no, they're not going to get back.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Ukraine has said fine, Russia, no.

[Co-host or Guest]

But nobody in their right mind thinks that Ukraine either has the power to get Crimea back or people are willing to arm it to get that power. And they realized that when the Soviet Union broke up. I think it was, I'm just doing this by memory, but I think it was somewhere between 91 and 93 there was a republic of Crimea, kind of like the old Byzantine period when it was independent and both Russia and Ukraine wanted to steal it because they knew it was weak and Ukraine beat him to it and absorbed it. It, Ukraine absorbed it, took it. And as far as the Donbass, that was part of Russia and Nikita Khrushchev was born near the border of Ukraine and Russia. And he wanted as a gesture to the Ukrainians because they had an always had a liberationist movement. They were joining the Nazis In World War II, a majority of them did. So he wanted to make sure it was quiet. So he changes the internal borders of the Soviet Union so that they could say the Donbass is part of the Soviet Socialist Republic of Ukraine, and that's what they did. But the whole border thing is completely, if you go back, it's just a mess. And as I mentioned before in this podcast, Western Ukraine until 1939 was Roman Catholic, European and Polish speaking. And Stalin invaded it in cahoots with Hitler on September 1st of 1939. By the 20th, they controlled it. They split it in two. After the war, Roosevelt and Churchill said, hey, Joe, we're now going to respect the original borders and we're going to take in count. Poland is a free country. It was invaded by Germany and you, so you've got to give it back. And Stalin said, how many? It's Roman Catholic and it's Polish speaking. He said, how many divisions does the Pope have? Try me. And so then they said, oh, we're sorry, Joe. We'll take east. We'll take East Prussia and Pomerania and give the whole thing to Poland, and they'll come out about the same. So Ukraine, there is a Ukraine in the center around Kiev that's been there for a millennium. But the periphery has undulating borders. It always has.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

So then I just want to ask you, and I know we kind of probe this question all the time, what Putin is up to. But what is Putin up to, given the fact that he is being supplied by China with what he needs? He's got greater numbers. He's winning right now. To the extent the war is being fought right now in the Ukraine, he's gaining territory because he's got to go.

[Co-host or Guest]

Back to the Russian people. And I think his numbers are quiet. But there are. We've had people at Hoover have said this that have been over there. I think there's probably a million and a half casualties. Somewhere around 900 to a million are Russian. By casualties, I mean the wounded and the dead and the missing and the sick. So he's got to go tell the Russian people, I did this, I preemptively, and here's why I did it. And he's going to try to say, I got them out of NATO and they some people, but I don't think they're going to be in. Yes, they were going to be a NATO, but only that. Only my invasion stopped, okay? And I got back the Donbass in Crimea and they're going to say, well, we already had them. He said, but I institutionalized it. You'll never go back to Ukraine. Okay? But still, that wasn't enough. And then he's got to say, I push the borders from Ukraine even Further to the west. And that's what he's trying to do right now. He's trying to terror bomb, send rockets, drones, kill civilians. And he thinks he has momentum and get his each mile, mile, mile. So he can go back and say, okay, I hit the magic point. Now I'm this many miles from. And he's going to say, I came in 100 miles. I got back for this special military operation, got 100 miles. And so Trump, when he ostracized Zelensky, he knew that Putin was going to take advantage of that. So now Putin has taken advantage of that. And now Zelensky is back on his hind legs and says, oh, you're going to get tough on Putin, then I'm going to take advantage of that. So what he's going to have to do is get tough on both of them. And what he's going to have to say is to Zelensky, if you're not going to cooperate, 50, 50, you go deal with your beautiful Europeans. They talk a great game, they all have togas, they have robes, they're philosophers. But they're not going to put on a cow camouflage uniform and get in a tank, a leopard tank, and go over there and fight those Russian drones. They're not going to do it. I can guarantee you they're not going to do it. They're not going to take a thousand of their sophisticated jets and start running missions of ground support. I can guarantee you that they're not going to do it. Those horrible Americans that you hate and make fun of, they're the only people that have the wherewithal to deter Russia. That's what he's got to have to tell him. So you're going to have to go and he's going to have to tell Putin we're going to embargo your oil. And I don't mean your oil, I mean India, who buys your. I mean China, who buys your oil, I mean Iran, who buys your. Or anybody who buys a freighter full of oil is not going to have any trade relation for the United States. And he's threatened to do that. And that will stop his oil, especially if the United States. And this is what I think Trump is doing because he is a businessman. He's now demanding open anwar get this Keystone settled. Just we had a new federal lease. The lease was $40 million sale. So he wants Russian oil off the market so the price goes up so he can supply it and get the price down with additional Americans oil. So that's what he's going to do. And I think it could work. I don't think it's going to work tomorrow. But there's no. See, the left always says, remember Joe Biden? How long is this going to go on? Until what it takes until it's over. We'll give him whatever it takes. And you think you, they had no plan. It was just feed the meat grinder kind of. It was very like, it was very similar to the first battle of the, of the Psalm are Verdun. They just kept feeding it and feeding it and feeding it. It was madness.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I think Putin's only going to stop when his people get angry enough at him.

[Co-host or Guest]

I think they're very angry at him because the moment he stops, it's like musical chairs. As long as he can say, I'm engaged in a special military operation to recover Russian population that was stolen from us and get territory and get, get treat Russia with respect and then it's peace. And everybody said, how many people got killed? Tell me how much money we spent and how many miles did you get for each dead Russian? And that's what he's afraid of.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Well, Victor, we received news this morning about Trump's plans for Iran, and we'll go ahead and talk about that when we come back from these important messages. Messages, stay with us, and we'll be back. Welcome back to the Victor Davis Hansen Show. Victor. So we got news, and this is, you know, I don't know, it might be hearsay, but apparently a man by the name of Dan Hodges said, told, I saw it in the Daily Mail that he knew that Trump might bomb Iran and he had gotten that from Israeli sources. So that's where the story came.

[Co-host or Guest]

Well, everybody, I mean, I think HR McMaster has said that publicly that they're going to have an operation before the end of the year. So Trump has said to Iran, here's the art of the deal, just cut off Hezbollah and cut off Hamas and cut off the Houthis and stop the terrorism. You've shut down the Red Sea, the Eastern Mediterranean and you're just let Lebanon live and, and we have no problem. And then just don't make a nuclear bomb. That's all we ask. And Iran looks at themselves and says, well, if we don't have a bomb, we can't threaten people and we can't say we're, we're going to destroy the scientist entity. We're nobody. We're just a corrupt kleptocracy, I guess. Corrupt kleptocratic theocracy with all restive population that can't even keep the power on. So they don't want to do that. So he's got now two. He's got one. Is that the Carl Vinson? The new one, the Gerald Ford. That's the Gerald ford class, that's 105,000 tons, 80 super Hornets. So we get another one in there, maybe it's the Carl Vinson, it's almost as big. Nimitz class. So you'll have 160 planes. And then in addition to that in Gadar and all of the round bases that can hit Diego Garcia, you probably have five, four or five bombers that can hit B1s that can hit, bring in the 30,000 pound mother of all bombs, you know, the bunker buster. So they're building up this huge arsenal in that area and it's pretty impressive. But I don't know how long you can reach maximum alert. You can't just take, you know, this huge amount of men and material and get them to a high readiness and then just stay there for a year. So if he's really building up as everybody says. And the Arab nations are reporting that there's hundreds of cargo flights going in to regional airports, Jordan, Israel, and they're getting all of their anti missile batteries, Patriots, tha everything because they don't know whether they do have a nuclear bomb. But if I were Iran, I would cut a deal because he's going to if they unleash this. And you know, we know what Trump told the Taliban and we know what Trump told Putin before, but I think he's got a list. And he said to them, we're going to first of all, take out your nuclear if you continue to shoot, we're going to take out your oil facilities. If you continue to shoot, we're going to take their military bases. If you continue to shoot back. Here are a list of all your theocratic democratic wealthy enclaves. And they're all corrupt. It's kind of like Malibu or Beverly Hills and the hills around Tehran. And we're, and we're going to do it. So please, it's your choice how that will play back here. Given the signal. Conversation with JD Vance and all of that disagreement about the maga. MAGA is Jacksonian. Don't tread on me. No better friend, no worse enemy. It's not optional. Military. So there'll be people in the MAGA movement who will say one of three things. How much did this cost? 50 billion. So you're, you're cutting 50 billion or they will say we don't Start fights, we end them. Or they will say, you're working for Israel. So they've got to be very careful how they present this. And they've got to say, we do not want a nuclear Iran supplied by China. So that you have a quartet, a quartet of four nuclear powers. Russia, China, Iran and North Korea. We know what North Korea does in its neighborhood. It causes nothing but trouble, terrifies the South Koreans, the Taiwanese, the Australians and the South Korean. We don't want that in the Middle east because if he get, they get a nuke, nuke, Israel will build even more nukes. But more importantly, Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Kuwait, they're all going to want to go nuclear and they all have the money or the expertise to do it.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

To what extent do you think that this was an accidental or a leak that was not supposed to go, or was it something purposefully put into the news media to get Iran to rethink its.

[Co-host or Guest]

Well, the bombers have been photographed on Diego Garcia in the Indian Ocean, so they obviously didn't put them in bunkers to hide them. And the cargo flights are not coming in at 2 in the morning, so that people at the various regional airports are seeing these huge, you know, C5s probably coming in with all sorts of stuff. And they want to be seen. That's the point. So they're ramping up pressure, pressure, pressure. And we'll see what the Iranian people, maybe they can. I hope they have some type of information. Campaign leaflets are constant Internet telling the Iranian people, this is, this is what's going to happen to you if you keep going with these crazy theocrats.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

So purposeful insertion into the media of a threat to Iran that Trump might do that.

[Co-host or Guest]

Ratcheting is like an old ratchet. You're ratcheting up the pressure very slowly and you're going to see who blinks.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

And to, to what extent do you think Trump, as a businessman, he's used to getting things done and he just looked at the situation in the Middle east and said, iran's the source and let's immediately adjust our policy to address that source and the addressing.

[Co-host or Guest]

He thinks that Iran was empowered and he's correct that Obama had this crazy. I'm just a community organizer. I'm always for the underdog. And the Shia and the Persians always been treated bad. So what I'll do is I'll empower Iran with the nuclear deal. They'll get a bomb at the end, then I can play them off against the corrupt Saudis and the Kuwait and the Arab Sunni overdogs. They're just like the bankers in Chicago. And so you need street. And then we'll get the Israelis on their side, too, and then they'll have creative tension, and then they're going to call somebody up to adjudicate. That's going to be me. That's how he thought about. He really did. He saw no moral, political, economic, social difference between this renegade theocracy in Israel or even Jordan and Egypt. He created it, this monstrosity. So, I mean, it was always that way. And so Trump, people came to him and said, you know, it's never going. You're Gaza, Gaza is Vegas or Gaza is Miami. It won't work with Iran in the neighborhood because the Houthis will still bomb it or they'll do anything. The only thing you have to do, you have to go cut off the head of the snake or the octopus in the head or shell of the big spider. You've got to hit it in its face and then the little legs collapse. Otherwise you're going to be dealing with Houthis and Hamas and Palestinian authorities Authority and Hezbollah forever. And I don't know if you can do it or not, but if Trump is walking a tight wire, everybody should realize that because he inherited an unstable Ukraine war, he inherited this war in the Middle east, He inherited a 37 trillion. Not that he. He spent a lot himself, 5 trillion because of covetous, but it had to be addressed. And so everybody's saying. Blaming him after what, 80 days? And say it's his fault. His fault? No, no, but he's actually proactive. He knows something. If he can get half a trillion cut this year, a trillion cut next year, and control spending, and right before the midterms forecast a balanced budget, and if he can get even a ceasefire where there's nobody dying, and when there's nobody dying and there's a ceasefire, then the truth comes out in war. And there's going to be the most horrific stories coming out of what happened. And they're going to hear all sorts of embarrassing stuff about the Biden administration, the Europeans. That's what happens in war. The truth comes out even during a ceasefire. And if he can get Iran neutralized or neutered, those three things alone will be amazing. And if it's true that he has 3 to 4 trillion dollars in foreign investment and most people say 10 billion, 10 billion, get you a million jobs and you get 20, 30 million jobs, that would be astounding. And I think that's really why, and this is all aside from Emasculating the whole left wing project and it's, you know, it's incestuous relationship with government in NGOs, government, USA universities, institutions, foundation, it's all part of that nexus. If he can cut that, cut the Gordian knot, just cut it, then that will be amazing. And I, my only suggestion is I would quote pool the 51 state Panama, invade Panama, absorb Greenland third term talk.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I was going to ask you about that.

[Co-host or Guest]

It's all chaotic and it keeps people off their guard. And yes, Donald Trump would say to me, well Victor, why do you think Denmark just gave Greenland a billion dollars? Why do you think they're giving more aid? Why do you think that's happening? Why do you think that we're in these negotiations with BlackRock buying the entry and the exit to Panama? Maybe they're going to try to welch out the Chinese. They probably are. But we're talking about it. And why do you think that Canada and I are discussing, discussing what would be the appropriate tariff rate. Why? Why? Why? It's only because I was crazy. And so I think those, I did read Art of the Deal and I did read Art of the Comeback.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I did think those anti Hamas protests that took place in Gaza were part of Trump's influence though. I think that it gave people a sense right that to the extent there's any anti Hamas, I said that on.

[Co-host or Guest]

An earlier broadcast when he said and, and we can just make Gaza like a, a beautiful, big, beautiful city and it's got prime real estate beaches and they'll have to go be displays for a while. Then we'll check people as they come back and Netanyahu's going yes, but he was so freaked out. And then the thing about Trump is it's like he throws this gigantic rock into the pond and all these ripples freak everybody out. And then they look at it and it calms down. I think wow, that was something. And now they're thinking about and they're talking about, I think half the population of Gaza said they would like to leave and go somewhere else and then the other would they would like that if you could rebuild and make. I hope there's not one penny of American money. I hope it's all Gulf oil money. But Saudis should, instead of building this, what, $2 trillion Echo City in the desert that the Saudis are building, it's never going to get built. They should just go over to Gaza and do it and make an echo city and then get an all Arab police force to keep out Hamas but they can't do it because none of them are legitimate governments. There's no election. So they're always afraid. They have no public support.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Well, the last thing or last two things. One is smaller issue. Hagseth has ordered the same standards for both men and women in the military. And I was wondering your thoughts on that.

[Co-host or Guest]

He's going to be hit. But I will tell you a secret.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Tell me a secret.

[Co-host or Guest]

I. When this women were going to be placed in combat units, I was in an audience where I heard, I think, two generals speak. And the general said the following. We support equity, but these special forces, there is a degree that they must attain in physicality and combat effectiveness. And yes, you can enhance them by getting brilliant women who are sober and judicious in decision making, or they'll look at a map and see insights. But they also have to have the physical element. So they said, we have no objection to it as long as they meet the physical requirements. So then what happened under Biden? Immediately they realized that 90% of the women probably couldn't make the physical requirements. So then they attacked the physical requirements. And they said they didn't just say, these are for men, these are for women. They lowered them. But there was more competition with the men. So that didn't really affect the men, but it brought a lot of women in there. And Pete Hexseth said, if you. You're a Special Forces team or you're a combat team, you're dropped in. You want everybody to be able to win a knife fight, cut the guy's throat before he does yours. So it's equity. And this is at a time, remember, when everybody is saying that biological males have no advantage in female sports. We're told that again and again by the left. Remember that? Oh, that's just not right. They have no women can do anything. If that's true, then there's no problem because women will easily pass the same physical standards. And everybody grew up with sisters and they all knew the sisters beat them up. Is that what happened?

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I don't think so.

[Co-host or Guest]

I don't think. I don't. Unless they were 10 years older.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Right? And last thing is my favorite story of the week, that federal employees, as you know, Trump has forced them all to return, return to the office. And they're coming back and they're complaining that bathrooms are not clean enough for them, trash is not taken out enough for them, and that these abandoned buildings still have maybe in it. And yeah, it's like complainers.

[Co-host or Guest]

So I have this old Victorian Farmhouse, Right. And I think I have four bedrooms, and then I have two annexes. Six, six bedrooms. I don't know. I have an outdoor bathroom, six bathrooms. And I leave for about three years. And then I say, you know what? I think I'm gonna go back to my place of occupation. And I come in, I said, oh, my God, it's not clean. Who left the. There's a rat in there. There's a mouse. The toilets need cleaning. And it's like we had no responsibility to clean up our own workplace or get back there to ensure that doesn't happen. It's just going to be some poor guy who has to go in there and clean, clean. Don't they have any sense of obligation to keep their workplace clean? Why wouldn't they go in there? Why wouldn't they? What did they expect that everybody was going to say, well, we'll just come up here and clean, clean, clean, clean, clean, when there's nobody, not one soul here. Let's just clean it for the moment. Golden. So the thing about Elon Musk is he has 65% innate support for cutting. All he has to do is get the messaging. Right? Get the messaging. The messaging is here is we just want federal workers to be treated exactly like no better, no worse than people. All of you in the private sector, and you know that if you sell cars or you work for the power company and you don't go in for two years and you look at your PG&E truck, what it's like sitting in the parking lot, and then you blame people they didn't keep it up for you, why you abandoned it, or you haven't been in the sales room in three years and suddenly you go to your carrel and you say, oh, my gosh, it's not the same. What did you expect? You just were going to abandon for the rest of your life and just sit home in your pajamas and do zoom?

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yes. And it shows you what little princesses they were as hired and federal employees as well.

[Co-host or Guest]

I just read stuff that I. There was that story also about the air traffic controllers, that they had a fist fight in the tower at Reagan Airport and they expelled one guy. And I. You would think that after that wreck, that tragedy, horrific, preventable accident could have been prevented, that nobody ever would get in an argument in that control tower. Not that it was their fault, or maybe it was, but to have a fist fight. That's a federal employee. I was talking to someone the other day and it's so funny about people on the left and they said something to the effect, well, I don't fly because of the Trump, the Trump air traffic controllers. I'm thinking the Trump air traffic controllers mean the last 80 days they all of a sudden took off their little caps and put on maggot caps and now they belong. No, no, no. They were not hired in the last 80 days. Their protocols were not made in the last 80 days. If you mean that people came in there and were horrified of the quality of people that were there and had the greatest number of near misses in history the last four years over a four year period of the modern era. And you don't think that's going to be disruptive to try to tell them that they have to behave and be professional and you get new avionics and compute, that's going to be disruptive. The improvement. Yes, but he didn't cause the problem.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

No, he didn't. And he said he's actively seeking to let in all of those who were denied because they weren't, weren't the right race or the right gender, etc. The D, they missed the DEI quota.

[Co-host or Guest]

I don't think people realize United Airlines was bragging that 50% of all the people that were going to be admitted to their pilot training programs were going to be dei. They were going to be picked on their gender, their race, their sexual orientation. And they had literally thousands of white males who had military experience. They'd been, they were pilots, they had been air traffic controllers and they couldn't get a job. And it was, I don't understand that.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

So Trump's probably going to get some good people that were overlooked because of DEI policies.

[Co-host or Guest]

That's a larger issue. I was thinking of that the other day when I looked at his cabinet and I saw the Energy Secretary, Rubio, Bondi, Hexef. It's not like 2017. There isn't a Rex Tillerson. They don't have the corporate Steve Minutian, they don't have him as Secretary of Treasury. Besson is really good. There's no Rex Tillerson types, there's no Besson, there's no Washington Apparat. There is nobody like Bill Barr, whom I had no problem with. I know a lot of listeners are very angry at him, but there's no Bill Barr and there's no John Bolton. And then in the military there's no John Kelly, there's no Jim Mattis, there's no H.R. mcMahon. Okay, so what I'm getting at is this cabinet has, is very different. Number one, it's loyal. I don't mean it that the others were disloyal, but they get an order. Their attitude is not Donald Trump is crazy. I'm the expert. So I'm going to try to find a way to nod to Donald Trump and then stop it or I have to turn it into bureaucratees and I have to modify it. But rather it's this is what he wants and I see if I can even improve on the efficacy that he expects. Number two, I'm so it's loyal. And then number two, they all are wonderful communicators. They've either been in the public eye like Rubio and the Senate giving speeches for years on years or they're HECSEF or Vance. They've been on television, they're expert communicators. And then three, they don't leak. There's no I'm Miles Taylor and I'm a senior fellow. That little minor guy in the Homeland Security, I think he was chief of staff of the and remember he was anonymous. We have an organized cabal inside that we're resisting everything from them. So my point is that he's got people who are good communicators, very loyal and they're on the same agenda and they're really. That's how he's able to do this. And this is a, this is a. I know when you're in the middle of a revolution, this is a counter revolution. You don't really appreciate the magic magnitude.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

What do you make of the people that are they've turned from left, like Tulsi Gabbard or RFK Jr. And or even Elon Musk. I know he's not part of the Cabinet, but nonetheless, they've turned from the left and they've joined Trump's forces. There's no reason to be suspicious of them.

[Co-host or Guest]

Well, if you were the people that criticized me when I'm at work, if I was hate Victor, I would say this. What do you think? He endorsed him? Victor. He's head of hhs. You think Kelsey Gabbard would ever have been Director of National Intelligence? Victor, you think Elon would ever get a contract? So they all look at it as crass quid pro quo? I don't think so. I think it's more like David Sacks who has a job at crypto, but it's more Marc Andreessen. It was more the more I got to know the left, they tried to destroy people. So they tried. When Robert Kennedy ran as a third candidate, they had some of the most vile, vicious hit pieces on him remember the bear and all, he killed everything. Sex his wife hung herself on. And it was just unrelenting. And Tulsi Gabbert was a flake that was named after T. And, and she was. And they went after every one of them. Same thing with. And so I think they just saw that these people are very vicious and the right didn't do that to them. Even Bill Maher said that the other day. He said, I endorsed Obama, I endorsed Biden, I endorsed Clinton, I gave money to. I never got invited to the White House. And Trump invited him to the White House.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Elon has that same resume. As far as his politics, he did the same thing.

[Co-host or Guest]

He voted for Hillary and he claims he didn't. But he's on record, I think in a video that he did say that he voted for Biden, but he understood something with when he got out of California, they were shutting down launches, you know, at a federal base. They didn't want him. Mr. Or they were giving going that he was going to have to hire LGBTQ XYZ people at his Tesla. He understood that. So he was, he also understood another thing he'd been when he got X, he understood that he was on the wrong side of the left. And he looked at what they did to Donald Trump and he knew that they, that's what they do. And they're, they would have him lawfare. And he said that if Trump loses the election, I'll be in jail because that's what the left is doing now. And I hope that they, they have to pass legislation that says that no local or state prosecute counties, municipal, state can file a indictment of a president or ex president, unless it's, you know.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I don't know, capital murder case or.

[Co-host or Guest]

Something for anything he's done while he was president, I suppose. But when you have these freelancing DAs and you have the state DAs that try to take him off the ballot, and you've got rogue FBI agents at Mar Lago, you can't do that.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah, you sure can. Well, Victor, we've come to the end of our podcast and I have a reader who was talking about Signal Gate and he was looking at the possibility that signal app was put on was already on these phones. So maybe the old administration did a practical joke, but he brought up a historical fact and that's what I, I wanted. This is a little bit of history.

[Co-host or Guest]

What they did do with Clinton to Clinton did the Bush.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah, hold on. So let me have this guy say it. But you're right, I was listening to your recent PODC regarding Signal Gate and was reminded of the ridiculous pranks the Democratic staff did when George H.W. bush became president. They removed the W key on the computers or tried to render the key dysfunctional. I thought maybe someone decided to pull a prank on Signal app the phone of walls to by putting in the phone number of the Atlantic editor. I agree with your thoughts about this. I agreed with your thoughts about this was too unique to be a mistake with your thought that it was too unique. And thank you, David Kent Smith, who wrote that to our website.

[Co-host or Guest]

Just a question. I think everybody realizes that Waltz didn't want him on there and didn't know. And he was. He said mea culpa maxima culpa. He knew that he should have checked that they should have had a little aid that said every five minutes. I'm just looking at at all the people on this chat and I'm checking their initials and their names. They didn't do that. They should have. And then it's just a question of how did he get on there and not, as I said on earlier broadcast, 340 million other people. And the answer is he was Jeffrey Goldberg, hater of Donald Trump who made up that story that Trump loves Hitler. I wish I could have generals like Hitler had. And he immediately stopped that right before the election, then the suckers thing and made fun of a gold star, all that stuff. That's what he does. So he was on there and that was deliberate. Somebody put him on there. So the question is, what was the motive? Was the motive to achieve what was achieved? Massive embarrassment or was it a prank? Kind of. They thought that they would catch it, let's say. I don't know that answer, but I do think they're going to find out that there was some aid to Waltz that either was so derelict or negligent that he should be fired or there were people in there that wanted Goldberg on it. The only thing I would say, finally, I'm getting tired of him, him being on all the new shows and saying how he's been attacked by people. No, all you had to do, you were on there for about 11 days. Any person with any dignity and professionalism, I don't care if you're a journalist, you are American citizen. If you are inadvertently, you knew that in one nanosecond that you were on a list of government, your government officials discussing an attack and you knew you weren't supposed to be there. It wouldn't have taken anything just to write an immediate email and say Hello, I am the editor of the Atlantic, Jeffrey Goldberg. I don't think I was intended to be on this, and I want you to verify that this is whom I think it is, and I will depart. And then after the. He could have written a note and said I was inadvertently. That's fine. But he sat there day after day after day, absorbing that, thinking, when does the big story come? And then it came. And so he's a disreputable person. He really is. And he acts like he's the wounded fawn. Now he's on all these. Oh, they're after me. Oh, they're lying. Oh, they're doing. And he. He actually said in his thing that it was classified. It was not technically classified. I know that's a distinction without a difference. You. You don't want that. The embarrassing thing was that you heard people talking back and forth. If you actually read the transcript, it's no big deal, but they shouldn't have been able to read. Nobody should be able to read that transcript. So I just don't like the idea that you say you're in a journalist, and so anything goes. You have a professional obligation to, I don't know, hurt your country.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah. So we have to agree with David Kleinsmith, who is agreeing with us that it probably wasn't an accident, that it was no mistake at all. So thank you, David. Mr. Klein Smith, we appreciate the comment to our website and thank you, Victor, for all of your thoughts today. It's been really very enlightening, as usual.

[Co-host or Guest]

Happy. Thank you. I'm. I'm on week four of this flu and I gotta get better because I'm sounding like a toad.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

You sound pretty good. You sound a lot better than you did two or three weeks.

[Co-host or Guest]

Yeah, well, I just have no energy, but I sound like a toad or a frog or a salamander. How's that?

[Victor Davis Hanson]

All right, Mr. Salamander. This is Sammy Wink and Victor Davis Hansen, and we're signing off.

[Co-host or Guest]

Thank you.

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