← The Victor Davis Hanson Show
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- [00:00]
Victor Davis Hanson
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- [01:30]
Jack Fowler
Hello ladies.
- [01:31]
Unnamed Co-Host
Hello gentlemen. Welcome to the Victor Davis Hansen Show. I'm Jack Fowler. You're here to get some wisdom and knowledge and perspective from the great Victor Davis Hansen, who is the Martin and Ely Anderson Senior Fellow at the Hoover Institution and the Wayne and Marsha Bussky Distinguished Fellow in History at Hillsdale College. We are talking on Sunday 10th August and this particular episode will be up on Tuesday, August 12th. Victor's got a website, the Blade of Perseus. Its address is victorhanson.com Please go visit it. And later, towards the end of the episode, I will tell you why I think you should be subscribing Victor. So many things to talk about today. And I think we'll kick off the show with your take on the looming Alaska visit, visit meeting, conference, head knocking between Donald Trump and Russia's President Putin in Alaska. And who knows, Victor, what changes will happen between when we're talking right now and when the show comes out. But we will act like it's going to happen next Friday and we'll get to your take on that when we come back from these important messages.
- [02:45]
Victor Davis Hanson
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- [04:17]
Unnamed Advertiser
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- [05:52]
Unnamed Co-Host
We are back with the Victor Davis Hansen Show. So Victor, let's kick it off. Trump Putin Alaska. Assume it takes place. What are your thoughts? Five days, six days out.
- [06:06]
Jack Fowler
Well, I think we're where we've talked on this show before that we all know the parameters of a so called deal. An armistice. I don't know if it's going to be a permanent peace, but it's. Ukraine will not be in NATO. We knew that before. And by the way, the European NATO members, quietly, I think I told you, I spoke to some European diplomats not too long ago, and I talked to some afterwards privately, without reference to their names or countries. They all admitted they didn't want Ukraine and NATO, just because they felt that was a bridge too far on the borders and there was too much corruption and it didn't satisfy eu, much less NATO requirements. But it's a very powerful country now. It's rearmed. So we all know that it's not going to be in NATO. And Putin got that. I suppose he could take back to his masters, whoever they are, military or oligarchic, and then we know that we're not going to get back the Donbass and Crimea. They have a complex history. And you can make an argument that they were as Russian as Ukraine, if not more so. And then we go the don't ask and the areas to the west of those acquisitions, and he's anywhere from 50 to 100 miles. So the question is, how far to Kiev does he get to keep the stuff he stole? And if you reject that, he should have any of it, which in a perfect world is reasonable, do they have the wherewithal to push him back? And they're on the defensive right now again, and he's starting to grind them down, as Russia always does. After all, if you had a discussion and you talked to General Halder, the head of OKW, 11 days into the operation Barbarossa, around, I don't know, the first of July, he would have said, it's not an exaggeration to say that the war is over and we've conquered Russia in 11 days. And then he found himself freezing on December 7 outside Moscow at this first subway station. Couldn't get any closer and never did get any closer. So Russia does very poorly when it's on the offensive in other people's countries. It does very poorly at the outset, and then it grinds you down, and that's what's happening. So the question is, how much do you give him? And that's complicated because Zelensky rightly points out that it's in the constitution of the Ukrainians that no one can cede any territory to anyone without a referendum of the people. The people poll, I think, 60%. They want the war over and they poll 60%. They don't want to give up an inch. So, see, but they don't have the military Wherewithal to push Russia much further back. And Russia I think believes that after a million casualties and they were not able to take Kyiv or absorb the country and that the further west they get, the longer their supply lines, the more exposed they are, the shorter the Ukrainian supply lines are interior lines. They feel that they want to consolidate and get as much as they can, but they're not going to get what they want. And that's what we're looking at. Where is the dmz, the demilitarized zone. And Trump will try to, you know, and the media, of course, hates Trump if you look at what he's done lately. I'm not saying these are lasting pieces, but there's a deal between Cambodia and Thailand, there's a deal between Congo and Rwanda, Serbia, Kosovo, India and Pakistan, Armenia and Azerbaijan and maybe Egypt and what, Ethiopia. So he's got seven or eight regional conflicts that are not flaring up. I don't say they're comprehensive peace settlements. But if he were to get this, then they might be. I mean, the Armenian president said he was worthy of a Nobel Peace Prize. How does he do it? He basically threats, threatens to cut them off on trade or not give them trade status or tariff, things like that, or expel their people from the United States. He has a lot of levers. But it's pretty amazing that he, this warmonger Hitlerian fascist that we were told by the left seems to be intent on saving as many lives in war as possible. He never, he was always like that. He was always attacked by the left for being a neo isolationist, but in particular for doing things like not retaliating when they sent missiles in performance art fashion. After the death of Soleimani, some people on the right attacked him and the left that he didn't reply to the Iranian performance art attack on our base at but he doesn't want to have these forever wars. He never did. And you can really see that. I don't know if it's a, that he's a businessman, he thinks it's bad deal to destroy stuff rather than build it or he's profoundly touched by the waste and human lives of war. I don't know what it is but they have him wrong that he is not a warmonger or I mean he's not killing people with Predator assassination drones like Obama. He's not joking about it at the White House correspondent's dinner and saying, you want to date my daughter? It's spelled P E P R E D A T O Predator. Remember that threatening People making a joke out of predator knows when. You never know. You'll never know when it's going to get you. He said Obama made a big joke out of killing people. And then Brendan, of course, lied and said we hadn't killed any at all collaterally. And then he apologized for lying.
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Unnamed Co-Host
If you look at the last 150 years, Victor, and no one's done it better than you through your various books, just the total carnage around the world is so staggering. I don't know how you couldn't have a president of either party that would be repulsed by the thought of war, unless for the most absolute needs and purposes.
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Jack Fowler
The lesson is there are certain countries that are not attacked. At least Sweden is vulnerable and Finland is vulnerable to Russian aggression. But they haven't been attacked, not Finland, since 1939. And the reason is they're highly. And the Swiss are never attacked. They're highly mobilized and they have arms industry and they have deterrence. The United States had not been attacked until. I think I could make the argument that in the 90s, we sort of let bin Laden think he could do whatever he wanted to the United States without retaliation. We let him go. We had many times a chance to get rid of him. We didn't under Clinton, but under Biden, of course, we lost deterrence. After Afghanistan, we lost deterrence. But if you remember the Roman 5th century, late 4th century 5th century, Vegetas famous adage, siwis pacum para bellum. If you want peace, prepare for war. And if you have deterrence, you're going to. You're not going to be attacked. And everybody said, well, you have to be perpetually armed. You got to spend all that money. Yes, you do. And that's what Ukraine's problem was. It didn't offer a deterrent to this huge country right next to it. And the Europeans didn't either. They were doing the Nordstrom 2 pipeline. They were disarming. They weren't meeting their 2%. They were giving, maybe insidiously and inadvertently, they were giving the message that Vladimir Putin was not an existential threat. We had the former German Gerhard Schroeder, remember him? He was working for Gazprom. The whole Merkel foreign policy was corrupt and appeasing of Russia or if not allied with Russia. So anyway, we had the red Jacuzzi button in Geneva that Hillary pushed and said reset. We're not going to be like George Bush, who was hard on the Russians after they invaded Georgia and Osatia. We're going to be giving them lectures on human rights. And they're going to like us for that. That's what they thought.
- [15:05]
Unnamed Co-Host
By the way, you mentioned the recent peace settlements or quasi settlements that Donald Trump has helped engineer. Never mind what he did in his last administration with the various alliances he helped create in the Middle EAS between Israel and other countries. But it reminds me, Victor, that the NATO defense secretary, I forget his name, who called him Big Daddy or Daddy. And there really is an aspect of that, isn't there, to him, this Daddy Colossus, the big dude.
- [15:39]
Jack Fowler
Yeah. I mean, you can quote that famous line from Shakespeare's Julius Caesar when I think it's Brutus or Cassius says he betrotheth like a colossus and were small people among his legs. And that's sort of what he was. He started that image at the Notre Dame Cathedral when he was remember that when he first came in. I think that was before he was inaugurate. Everybody wanted to get near him. And the reason they wanted to get near him is that not just that he represented the economic and military power and cultural influence of the United States, but he would use it in a way that Biden would. If he did use it, it would be anemic and it would be anti western. But the Europeans are funny people. They have this outward sort of postmodern leftist veneer, but then, you know, they're aristocratic, they're traditionalist and they understand the United States. They don't like us publicly, but privately they really want want us to protect them. And that's what's so strange. And Trump knows that. He knows it very well. That's why he was able to leverage him to get up to the 2% and the 5%. All he had to say is, well, if you don't want to pay, then I guess you don't want us to protect you. How dare you say that publicly. Privately, we'll pay. We'll pay. Just promise you you'll be here when they invade. That's kind of what it was.
- [17:09]
Unnamed Co-Host
Well, we're going to get to another topic here in a second, Victor, but first I want to tell many of our new viewers and listeners about our friends@besthotgrill.com if you're tired of replacing your grill every couple of years, you'll want to check out the hot, fast Solaire infrared grill from besthotgrill.com Solaire makes these amazing American grills that heat up to 11000 degrees in just 3 minutes. Solaire infrared grills eliminate flare ups and consistently make Juicy, flavorful food. The Solaire infrared grills heat your food directly, not the air around the food like conventional grills do. Solaire has been making infrared grills for 20 years and has really dialed in the design experience. The Solaire infrared grill firsthand with the Solaire demo demo rental program. You can try Solaire before you buy with the foods your family enjoys without a salesman breathing down your neck and see why Solaire is the last grill you will ever buy. Learn more atbesthot grill.com that's besthotgrill.com Try before you buy with the Solaire demo rental program@besthotgrill.com we thank the good people from Solaire for sponsoring once again the Victor Davis Hansen show. He said as he hit his microphone.
- [18:31]
Jack Fowler
Well, this new microphone, I can't. I can't do any facial. Oh, you did my microphone? Yeah.
- [18:41]
Unnamed Co-Host
People like when you karate chop the.
- [18:43]
Jack Fowler
Air in your microphone.
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Unnamed Co-Host
It's fine, Victor.
- [18:45]
Victor Davis Hanson
Everything.
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Unnamed Co-Host
Anything you do is groovy in that regard. Let's talk about, you know, what an unsettling matter. Let's talk about coarseness. Okay? And there are two connected stories to me, anyway. One is the decline and now demise of Howard Stern and his show. The once king of all media, the colossus of media. I think he had 20 million people at one point listening to his show, and now it's. I don't know. I think we may have more people listening to what you say.
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Jack Fowler
Anyway, I just did a newsmac interview where they said that that moment their audience was bigger than Howard Stern's, which means I think he only has 100,000 listeners.
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Unnamed Co-Host
I think that's shocking.
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Jack Fowler
That's shocking. And he cut that deal in 2020 for $100 million a year for five years, which is up now. I don't know why any. Because he was all done by 2020, almost. At least the COVID thing. He went crazy about the lockdown. And in one way, that was good because I was never a big fan. I mean, I would be out pruning in the 80s with people who would listen to him, and I won't mention who they were. And he was talking about having people come into his studio and then undressing. He was looking at their phallic size or size of women's blank, blank. He was crude. He would call up people and what was he? You know, he would call up people and game them and say, did you know that you ordered 20 pizzas or something? You have to pay for them, or I'm the police. I mean, he really. It was kind of like swatting people. And he had all these jokesters, and he was cruel. He was really cruel to people. And he was famous because he made fun of everybody, both sides. And he really trashed politicians, and he hated them. And so what happened was that Howard Stern went from being unorthodox, edgy, I think, pornographic, potty mouth, slutty, obnoxious, crude, but nevertheless, he broke every boundary. He insulted every politician. He wasn't considered left or right. He was just anti establishment in the crudest of all fashions. I didn't like anything he did. He got divorced. He got married. He married a younger starlet. He made these huge $100 million a year, five year contracts. He got 20 million, and it went to his proverbial head. And Covid came. He had all of these huge mansions, places that he. I think he had one in Palm beach, somewhere on the coast, elsewhere, a big place in New York. And he associated with people that he didn't want to insult and politicians that were more in line with his new thinking, which was liberal and progressive, but was not necessarily characteristic of this huge audience. And so the more that he got frustrated, as the audience insidiously dropped off, he began to insult them. The problem was you, not me. I'm just the same Howard Stern. No, you're not. They tuned in for you because you would say things that other people would not. You were a shock jock. You invented the genre. You were pornographic and slutty, and they wanted to hear it, apparently. And then when you became passe and unpredictable and left wing, you became a scold, a sanctimonious Karen. And you were completely invisible from these party hacks in the Democratic Party that were always lecturing people, you can't turn on your gas stove. You have to have an IV. You better get 17 boosters. You better wear three masks. And that's who you became. But the only problem with that is you still expected that somebody was going to subsidize you at $100 million a year. But you never. There's a hundred podcasts, I say a thousand, that have more audience than you did. And you just insulted the genre and said, oh, podcasts are nothing. They don't matter. And the funny thing was, you were on the edge. You were the one that jumped to cirrus radio and subscription radio, and you knew all the new genres, and you had revolutionized talk radio, and you became an old fogey reactionary, and you didn't keep up with the new genre. And somebody in his Garage opened a laptop and he had a bigger audience than you did. But the difference was he didn't expect to be paid $100 million a year. So the bottom line, Jack, was that Howard Stern became a, I don't know, a Stephen Colbert, an overpaid sour puss scold. And he has zero market value now, but he made enough money in his life. That does not going to hurt him. He can just become a fixture at Manhattan left wing events if he wants. If he ever dares to leave his house because he's deathly afraid of coal, I would give him a piece of advice, unsolicited. I had an immune problem and I flew maybe twice a month for the last five years and I spoke to people, 500 to 1,000 shook hands. I got Covid twice long Covid six months, one long Covid a year. And just part of the hazards of the game, Howard, it's not going to kill you. You should go out there and mingle with people and you'll get your immune system challenged. Maybe you'll get Covid, maybe you won't, but it's not the end of the world.
- [24:37]
Unnamed Co-Host
Victor, you have more listeners than he does. Are you getting 100 million a year?
- [24:43]
Jack Fowler
No. I have to look at what I'm getting, but it's not reflected. I think we don't talk about our ratings or anything. I think that if there was a little rule that said that you have a bigger audience than Colbert or Howard Stern, you deserve what they get. I don't know, but it's so weird to see these left wing people who are on the left spectrum outraged that somebody's not going to pay them what they're not worth and that they should be subsidized due to their brilliance, even though their brilliance is losing their parents company millions of dollars. It's so arrogant.
- [25:22]
Unnamed Co-Host
I just wanted to say one last thing about Stern. Just. This is a clip from Kirsten Fleming, who wrote a column about his leaving. And he says last summer Stern, overestimating his own influence, made things even worse by entering the presidential media circus to sit down with a clearly diminished Joe Biden. Biden, the old Stern would have spent 30 minutes at least on the gaffe prone president's mythical neighborhood gang leader and overall bad dude, Corn Pop. Instead, he marveled over Scranton Joe's high school football exploits. He called Biden's family, which consists of a crackhead son he later pardoned and a grandchild he didn't acknowledge until the New York Times bullied him into it, extraordinary. Stern Even offered this profundity. You're the kind of leader I love. We're lucky to have you in the Oval Office.
- [26:11]
Jack Fowler
That's so funny. That reminds me of that guy on MSNBC or maybe it was a network. He was an African American, really well known anchor and he was asked about Colbert and I think they had said, data wise, he had 240 guests or something, one Republican, he said, well, the one thing about Colbert is that, that he has no partisan, observable, partisan leanings. He interviews people and he gets them on both sides. He levels, you know, he levels both barrels on both. No, he doesn't. He doesn't. And people who are supposed to be edgy are not edgy. And yeah, I mean, how can you brag on the old Joe Biden from Scranton, take Trump behind the gym, beat him up, slammed the guy's head, corn pocked, measured off. That was all braggadocio from an insecure bully. Howard Stern, just, gosh, he has no self awareness that he destroyed his brand. He became a misanthrope and a refuge, I guess a hermit. He doesn't like people. He's a missing, as I said, he's misanthropic, but he wants people to pay for that. As if he's out there pounding the flesh and intermingling with crowds and he's doing all this stuff. He used to really attack Rush Limbaugh. One thing Rush Limbaugh never did was A, attack his audience or B, change his methodology or his ideology to fit. I mean, he got married a number of times, but he never changed his ideology because he married another, a younger woman or anything. He was adamant, adamantine in his beliefs. And it's kind of ironic because he was in his own trap. He was an outsider who was so filthy mouth that no one really in the establishment wanted to be seen with him. He was only an underground counter establishment figure. But he always, when he started to make the big money and he had the big house and he had the big name and people started to solicit him for interviews or to appear on his show. He wanted so much to be, I didn't realize that, an establishment fixture in New York. And the problem was how that they didn't want you the way you were. You had to completely repudiate who you were and then become a wishy washy on the one hand, on the other hand, nothing with no sincere or no strong feelings. And that's what they liked about you. And you did. And then you wanted it both ways. Where's my Audience. No, you only had one audience. You appealed to people's words, worst instincts. But you wanted to, I guess, be accepted by the New York literati, political class intellectuals, financial titans, and they didn't want that aspect of you. So mea culpa, mea maxima culpa, you, obsequious, bowed to them. They accepted you on one condition. You don't go back to your profane and obnoxious self, which is why you were well paid.
- [29:38]
Unnamed Co-Host
But he may be having, in his way, not that he thinks of it, the last laugh with just the broad coarsening of our culture.
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Jack Fowler
He didn't reflect it. He was a catalyst for it.
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Unnamed Co-Host
Yeah. So that's another news item I'd like to bring up with you, Victor, before we head to our next break is the throwing of sex toys onto the courts at WNBA games. And we've been very critical WNBA in the past, but just this public display of crudity is becoming, I don't want to say normal, but less abnormal than it used to be. And it shows itself in so many other ways.
- [30:27]
Jack Fowler
I'm getting sick of it. I get sick of it. I don't like when Trump uses the word a lot. S h I t he shouldn't say that. I don't even like it when he said he can go to hell. I don't like it when Jasmine Crockett sits up there in front of the stage and says that Trump is a piece of shi blank. And I don't like these potty mouth on fu House of Representatives and senators that use the word. I mean, they're just foul language. These are our representatives. And it's kind of the broken windows logic of language as this is of crime. When you walk by and throw a rock in a warehouse window and then you see 5, 6, 7, and then people think, well, if the windows are broken, you can scrawl graffiti on it. Well, if there's graffiti on that building, the one next door is okay, too. And do that. And it's insidious and it's infectious. And so the same thing with this language. If you hear a major figure, an outcome, a person in the media, a politician used those words, then you can say, well, I can use them and you can say this and this. And then you go down and you get dilt. Whatever these things are, sex things thrown on the court of the wba. I don't know if that was a homophobic effort to suggest that these women use these things or it was foul, but it was just. And the guy who did it, I think was 19, 18 or 20.
- [31:56]
Unnamed Co-Host
Well, it's been done several years.
- [31:58]
Jack Fowler
Yeah, but even the penalties for it, they were thinking, well, you can't come to a game for, if you do it again for a year, you should just say don't come ever, we don't want you, that's it. And just ban them and see what happens. The part of the problem is there's no deterrence. So everybody knows that, whatever, there's no penalty. There's no penalty. When you have those pro life demonstrations, they got pretty much when those two elderly men, 72 and 84 were beaten up by that creepy guy, that abortion activist, and he beat one of them up and then the other person tried to help him and then he was beaten up and then the judge, an Obama or Biden appointee, gave them no jail time. Yet you could see that he was trying to kill them, step on them. And if they had been in this asymmetrical era of justice, if those people on the ground had been young abortion activists and some and they, excuse me, if they had been elderly abortion activists, 70s and 80s and some young pro life person went and hit them and tried to kill them and step on them, he wouldn't even be getting out of prison. That's why there's this cynicism about this system. And just tangentially, Jack, there's a new mem that goes on right now by the left. Have you seen it this last week it's we're going to get tough. Cory Booker, Jasmine Crockett, Gavin Newsom.
- [33:36]
Unnamed Co-Host
I'm bringing a pencil to a knife.
- [33:37]
Jack Fowler
Yes, we're going to get tough like the Republicans did. No, you haven't been acting like John McCain and Mitt Romney. You haven't been playing by the Marcus of Queensbury rules. You people were all knife fighters. Do you remember what you have been doing? You keep saying we're going to have to get mean to save democracy. No, you destroyed it. You impeached a president for the first time in history. Twice. First time in history you tried him as a private citizen. First time in history. First time in history you tried to get a presidential candidate off the ballot in 25 states. You raided a ex president's home to get 0.01% of his 14,000 documents classified. 102 classified documents. You debanked Melania Trump, Barron Trump, Donald Trump. You got Morgan Stanley, you got bank of America to take away a person's ability to conduct commerce, to live by stripping them of their bank accounts based entirely not on their criminal record, but on their political views. You did that, Mr. Left. You were the ones that coordinated five criminal civil suits. And I include E. Jean Carroll, who was bankrolled by Reid Hoffman in that ridiculous lawsuit, and Letitia James. You know, the more we're learning about Letitia James, my gosh, she's up for targeting a political figure by distorting the law. That's ostensibly what they're going after. But she's got a lot more political exposure by filling out affidavits for a second home mortgage, affidavits for a second home in Virginia, in which, if she really did what she's accused of, it looks like she did do it. She tried to get a primary home designation for a second home so she could save on property taxes, save on the mortgage rate. She suggested that her father was, I guess, her husband or her companion in this pseudo primary residence. And then she didn't even think that as a elected official statewide in New York, you have to be a New York resident. Now, she's on record that that was not her primary home. In New York, they can get her for a lot. And here we learn that she went to the White House three times, supposedly for functions, but we don't know who she met. And this goes with Mr. Co Angelo, the third person in the DOJ who came from Letitia James efforts to destroy Trump and then rotated out on November 18th back to Alvin Bragg, the same day that Jack Smith was appointed, the same day Nathan Wade, the paramore of Fannie Willis, was in the White House. This was all coordinated. And so they're talking about, we're going to fight dirty. What more could you do, Gavin? What more could your party do if you're willing to try to destroy a political appointee? If you get the FBI to partner with Facebook to censor the news, if you get the FBI to keep quiet that they have a laptop that's authentic, that they have verified, and you get 51 people to lie to the American people that it's Russian, that if you're doing the Russian collusion hoax and you do all of this lawfare, what more can you want? Now Carville is saying, jack, well, we ought to be real tough. And we're going to get in there. And you know that. Get in there. We're going to. We're going to. We're going to get Puerto Rico. We're going to get, you know, D.C. and they're going to be states, no doubt about it. And we're going to. We're going to Pack the court. Pack the court. You would have packed the court had you not lost the Senate in the House and you not had a waxing effigy as president. You were going to pack the court. You were also going to get rid of the filibuster. And you. You announced that you were going to destroy the Electoral College, which you're pretty close to with the National Voters Compact, that you're getting these state legislatures to vote, that they'll only pledge their electors to the national vote total, not their own state. So I don't know how they could get more radical than they are now. Jack, they do anything. They go after ICE officers, they run Tesla drivers off the road, they try to firebomb Tesla dealerships. They've done everything. I don't know what this idea. They've been meek. They've been. I mean, we had 120 days of riot, looting and arson in May, June, July, August, September of 2020. What more do you want?
- [38:37]
Unnamed Co-Host
Well, you go back to the Supreme Court nomination confirmation hearings with Bob Bork and Clarence Thomas and the gutting of democracy or civilized governance.
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Jack Fowler
Brett Kavanaugh. Last night, Sharon destroyed Brett Kavanaugh with lies from Susan Blossey Ford.
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Unnamed Co-Host
Well, I mean, what won't they do? Sharon and I. Oh, my wife Sharon, we watched Chappaquiddick last night. I don't know if you saw that movie, came out a few years ago. And Sharon's from Massachusetts, so we've actually been to Chappaquiddick. But the movie is very. It tracks what happened. And to think that this was the leader of the Democrat Party.
- [39:24]
Jack Fowler
Essentially, he was the lion. You mean the lion of the Senate?
- [39:27]
Unnamed Co-Host
The lion of the Senate. And just the absolute horrible man he was. And late. Did you hear last week this came out about JFK Jr that he may have been gay and his uncle was going to out him if he didn't show up at that trial, that rape trial for his cousin down in Florida, which Uncle Teddy was of course implicated in, but the Uncle Teddy threatened him to out his gayness anyway. I mean, that's. That's been bouncing around. Actually, the Daily Mail wrote about that the other day. But, yeah, Vic, to your point, they've been this way for generations.
- [40:09]
Jack Fowler
Yeah, I know it. And especially in the era of Trump, they have tried every single thing, legal, unlegal, non legal, unlawful, amoral, immoral, anything to destroy Donald Trump. And they have ruined the reputation of the FBI, the CIA, the doj. They've destroyed the reputation of Joe Biden. They've done Anything, everything and everybody has done this. What do you think the retired military officers were doing when they deliberately violated Article 88 of the Uniform Code of Military justice and came out of the woodwork and said that Donald Trump was a fascist, he was Hitler, he was a liar, he was the equivalent of an Auschwitz jailer, that he should be removed sooner the better, even though we had schedule. I mean, this was pretty tough stuff from four star generals and admirals and yet they did that. And they did that for the short term aim of getting rid of Donald Trump because they hated him. So this has been a coarsening of our culture. They've used every extreme mechanism from going through the first Lady's underwear drawer to trying him as a private citizen in the Senate. They did everything. And here he is back and they can't do anything. So now they say, well, we're going to double down and get really, really mean. Well, what's the next step? You know what the next step is? And you can see it already, Jock. They're talking about violence. They really are. They are condoning violence at ice centers. They're condoning street violence. And you really get the impression that they're saying to themselves, we're 40, 60 on the issues and we won't change. The American people are stupid. I'm not going to be for secure borders. I'm not going to get rid of the Soros attorney, the prosecutors. I'm not going to renounce the new green deal. I'm going not to put up with getting rid of dei, I'm not going to abandon biological men and women's sports. And I don't have the House, I don't have the Senate. I don't have the presidency. I don't have the Supreme Court. I have no power. And I have no power because my issues don't resonate. And my institutional power, which was insidious and gave me this leverage, he's getting rid of, he's getting rid of PBS and NPR's federal funding. He's going after the cherished universities where we violated the Bill of Rights and civil rights legislation. He's going after the blue shoe, blue stocking, silk stocking law firms. He's going after our power. He's going to tax endowments. So they're really frustrated. So I said, what can we do? The more that we talk, the more people hate us. The more that we make videos, the more we put Representative Swalwell out there lifting weights or Jasmine Crockett talking about evil white people, or the more we put on Cory Booker screaming and yelling or Hikem Jeffries with his baseball bat. The more people don't like us. So what's next? I think next is violence. That's what they're talking about. Yeah.
- [43:34]
Unnamed Co-Host
Well, Victor, we're going to talk about.
- [43:38]
Jack Fowler
Well, you're going to talk about.
- [43:39]
Unnamed Co-Host
I'm going to ask you to talk about some accomplishments in the. In the culture war. Illegals having their in state tuition cut. We have Judge Boasberg getting smacked down and we have a bunch of other things to get your opinions on. And we'll do that when we come back from these important messages.
- [44:07]
Victor Davis Hanson
We'll return to the conversation in a moment. But there's something unfolding that directly connects to everything we've been talking about. While we've been examining the reach of government power, 134 countries are actively launching digital currencies that will make every transaction traceable by the authorities. It's no longer theory, it's happening right now. When governments can create and control the flow of money, freedom disappears. People stop being citizens and start being subjects. China has already taken this step. 260 million people are using a Digital yuan that expires on government command. And the IMF has admitted these currencies can limit what kind of things people can own. Thankfully, our friends at American Alternative Assets have created a critical guide, the Digital Dollar. How CBDCs threaten your financial freedom. It details the seven ways digital currencies threaten your liberty and why precious metals may be your last financial safeguard. Call 8332- USA-YOLD or visit Victor loves gold.com to get your free guide. That's 833-287-2465. Now back to the analyses.
- [45:24]
Unnamed Advertiser
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- [46:51]
Unnamed Co-Host
We're back with the Victor Davis Hansen show and I have an explanation to make and Victor has a correction to make. So let me start Victor with the, with the explanation because this show began with me in a different room and now I am at my son in law and daughter and son in law's house because my computer, my WI fi crashed. And it's good to have five children that all live nearby. It's great to have a son in law who's a high tech whiz. So I came over here and he set me up right away. So it's different background, but I God bless Liz and Ben for helping me out here. So that's my little story for the change of venue here. But you, Victor. Yes, I have a correction to you. Yeah.
- [47:35]
Jack Fowler
On a podcast I mentioned Luke Wood, the president of Sacramento State and a recent video that appeared in which he was being interviewed and various clips were posted in which he said he wanted to eliminate whiteness. And he went on about the toxic nature of whiteness. And he was asked by the host, well, to get rid of a manifestation of something, wouldn't you have to get rid of the source white people? And he said no, he was forever. He didn't really answer that. He said, and of course, as I said, other examples were adduced. If somebody said they wanted to get rid of blackness, would black people think that was an indirect or maybe even a direct threat to get rid of blacks or Jewishness? So anyway, in the course of our discussion, and I also talked about it on the Daily Signal, a five minute video I do each morning, I made some errors that were not accurate and they want to correct. They sent a kind of a nasty note. They being his university, California State University Sacramento. He said, he said, I said that Sacramento State, if you didn't know it was near UC Davis. And they said Sacramento School, Cal State Sacramento, also known as Sac State, is the only public university in the world. Fourth largest economy. In the world's fourth largest economy. It's not the same as UC Davis is the only public university in the world's fourth largest economy. It's not in the same city. Do you understand that? California State University Sacramento, also known as Sacramento State, is the only public university in the world's fourth largest economy. That's not correct, Mr. Fact Checker. It's not in the same city as UC Davis. I went back. I did not say, Mr. Fact Corrector, that it was in the same city. I said Sacramento State University is near. Near N E A R U C Davis. But by falsely trying to correct me, you have made a terrible mistake. If that's literally only public university in the world's fourth largest economy. My gosh. There's 23 state campuses.
- [50:20]
Unnamed Co-Host
News to Fresno State.
- [50:21]
Jack Fowler
Yeah, there's 23 of them. There's nine UCs. And so there's a lot. And near, I guess, would be accurate. And then I said that Luke Wood. And by the way, his name is not technically Luke Wood, it's Jonathan Wood. That's his middle name, I think, or his nickname, but probably his middle name. But it doesn't sound as edgy, apparently Jonathan Wood as Luke Wood does. So he could have corrected me and said, don't dare call me Lukewood. Would mine original. My first name is Jonathan. Well, he didn't, but he said that I had said that he had been present about a year. Well, it is two years. Okay. He's been president since 2023. Okay, two years. Well, about a year is a little bit inexact, but you could say about a year. It might be over a year or under a year, but that's not a major error. Next one. He said. I said that he had been at UC San Diego. He was at San Diego State University. I plead wrong. Here's. I plead wrong that I should have said U University of California, not the State University at State University. There's a difference between the CU campus, San Diego and the UC campus at San Diego. You referenced the term blacklighting as a term he coined, which is incorrect. The actual term is racelighting. Sorry about that. But what he. And he defines it racelighting is an act of psychological manipulation where black, indigenous and people of color bipoc parentheses we see, I'm quoting. Receive racial messages that distort their realities and lead them to second guess themselves. I said that I did not believe in blacklighting and that he had created it. Now he says that he is the co creator. Well, you still are a creator. If you're co creator, you're a co creator. And the technical term when you do that to black people is not blacklighting, but he calls it racelighting. But he doesn't really give me an example that I could adjudicate it or you, the listener, could adjudicate, whether that's an actual phenomenon or it's something that he cooked up in his mind because I don't know what you mean. With a psychological manipulation where black, indigenous and people of color receive racial messages that distort their reality and lead them to second guess themselves. Is there something called white lighting? I mean, nobody's putting a gun. You're an adult. You can tell whether somebody is trying to distort reality and lead them to second guess themselves. You know, when somebody I grew up in a Mexican American community my entire life. I think there was 10 of us in a school of 400 between fourth and sixth grade when somebody called me gringo or white boy. And I was called that a lot. I didn't second guess myself. I didn't distort my reality. I just thought the person who was yelling at me was insecure and part of a majority that was bullying. So I don't quite understand that. The other one is the final one. The interview was conducted December 8, 2017. An excerpt was reposted on YouTube July 29, 2025, without a notation that it is from an earlier show, creating the confusion. There's no confusion. I just said a recently circulated YouTube video. It just reappeared. Apparently nobody knew about the original 2017 interview and he didn't want to publicize it because of what he said was objectly racist. When he said he wanted to eliminate whiteness and then somebody saw that and started to repost it without a date. That's what I was referring to. So I don't have any. I don't have any need to, you know, give an apology. If you put something out, if something just appears on the Internet and it's accurate and you haven't changed your views. I don't. Unless I will apologize to Jonathan Luke Wood if now that his original podcast is circulating all over the Internet in a reformulated clip that he doesn't believe that anymore. He could have said, here's what I would have written. The interview was conducted December 8, 2017, when and now I'm ad libbing when Dr. Luke Wood wrongly and mistakenly said that he wanted to eliminate whiteness. That excerpt was reposted on YouTube January 29, without a notation that it's from an earlier show, creating the confusion. Here's me that he still believes it, but he does he still that he does not any longer believe it, but he still believes it. So why doesn't he just come out and explain? I don't understand this. Why doesn't he just say. I mean, he has the university telling me that it's the only public university in the world's fourth largest economy, which it isn't. And then he's saying I said it was in the same city as you, which I didn't. It's 20 miles apart. That's what near means. And I said it was about a year when it's exactly two years. And then I do confess that I confuse CSU San Diego and UC San Diego. And then he says that the term that he uses and prefers is racelighting, not blacklighting, although they mean the same in this context of himself. So I don't understand why he's so angry, other than the real reason that he's so angry is that if you go on and you Google Luke Wood, he's otherwise a non entity. There's a few puff pieces, but suddenly everybody's remarking on this new clip. The clip, Mr. Luke Wood is new. It's new. It's just appeared. And it comes from an old, older interview that you apparently do not want aired. So you're angry that people are not referring you back to the original. If you go back to the original interview, it is even more damning than the recent clip. So I wouldn't advertise that people know that there is a longer version because almost everything you say is tinged with racialism. And when you, as a public servant and a university president at a very large campus, you publicly announce at any time, and you do not withdraw that at any time that you want to eliminate. Eliminate. Eliminate whiteness, the manifestation apparently of white people, then you have to account for that. And he says you can read more about the term in President Wood's research here. I don't believe that's research. I'm sorry. I don't believe there's any data or factual components to your racelighting or your theory that when people talk about other people, there's coded messages that show they're racist and that the people who are the objects of this purported racism don't know. Know what's happening to them, only that they second guess themselves because they haven't read President Wood's research. Don't believe that. I do believe that you're doing a disservice to the vast majority of your college community because you who, if a person was of the persuasion or considered themselves white, who would want to talk to you or deal with you or expect that you would deal with them in a fair and judicious manner after you said you wanted to eliminate whiteness? If you want to talk about exactness, what does your whiteness mean? I think when I've looked at your research, and I did, I think what you mean by whiteness is the predominant Western civilization culture that the United States reflects. And I mentioned that explicitly on our podcast. And that's what you don't like about it. But you do like about it. You do like about it because this culture that you call whiteness is self correcting. The only reason you call it whiteness is the majority of the population who created it and brought it here. And you participate in, you don't like it, and you understand there's career advantages in saying that you don't like it. And there is something called dei, which is a racialist concept that promotes, hires, retains and admit people on the basis in large part of their race. And you're wedded to that idea because in a purely merocratic society and one that holds people to account, I can tell you that if I said at the Hoover Institution that I have a theory that we should eliminate blackness without much explanation and we should eliminate Jewishness or anything or even whiteness, I would be summarily dismissed. And I would never do that, because to do that is racialist and you know it is. And you got away with it and all of a sudden it reappeared and now you're very upset and I don't blame you. If you had honor, if I were you, I would either do one or two things, I would make a video and I would say, an earlier time in my life, a few years ago, I did believe there was such a thing called whiteness that reflected views originally of white people. And I want to eliminate those views with which I disagree. Some people believe that it is by extension means I want to eliminate the people who project whiteness. I don't. I'm sorry about the confusion and I will not mention whiteness again. Or you can resign, it's up to you. And he'll do neither, because he assumes that his fact checker can get away by saying that your whole analysis is flawed, Professor Hansen, because you said that, you see, Davis is near Sacramento State and they're not in the same city. I never said they were. I said I'm a fifth generation Californian. I can tell you when you go from UC Davis to Sacramento, at least the suburbs, you got about a 20 mile drive, which is near in the wider expanse of California, believe me, Fresno is near to my farm, 17 miles to downtown. So this is ridiculous, it really is. But why would you have your flack go out and try to correct the record and make errors in the correction, or then just quibble over a minor little mistake and not get to the heart of the manner that he does really abide by this notion of whiteness and whiteness has to be eliminated. And he won't explain exactly the relation of whiteness to white people and the confusion that normal people would have by eliminating whiteness. You want to, you know, it's like saying, I see a reflection in the mirror and that reflection, I want to eliminate that reflection, but I don't want to break the mirror. I want to get rid of the reflection. How do I get. Because it's everywhere. Well, where does the reflection come from? It comes from someone and you. I don't know what he means by that. I really don't.
- [62:58]
Unnamed Co-Host
I'm so glad they issued a correction because we have so many new listeners and I'm sure they've just thrilled to experience a Victor correction of a correction.
- [63:10]
Jack Fowler
Well, I mean, it's deserved.
- [63:13]
Unnamed Co-Host
It was deserved.
- [63:14]
Jack Fowler
And he didn't send it to me. He sent it to the Daily Signal. But we discussed it on our podcast. But he should have sent it to me. I've had that in the past, just very quickly. To give one example, one morning I woke up and the Stanford Daily said, director Racian should fire Victor Hansen from the Hoover Institution. And I was shocked and I didn't know why. In fact, I was out of town. So I called John Racy and he started laughing. He was our director. He was a wonderful person. Person. He said, well, have you read the Wall Street Journal? I said, no. Well, go read it and call me back. So you know those noble and quotables. I had written an essay about a week earlier that says that affirmative action is incompatible with the American system for a variety of reasons. And I listed them, one of which said, you cannot ascertain the exact racial components of somebody without a DNA test in a multiracial, intermarried, assimilated society. Nor should you try. And more importantly, you can't adjudicate to what degree a person's background earns repertory action in the present. That's all I said. I mean, if you look at the Holocaust and survivors of the Holocaust and Jewish people are not getting special treatment, then it's very hard to suggest that someone else is. Maybe blacks because of slavery and Jim Crow, maybe some fourth generation Mexican Americans that were redlined out of property, but compared to the Holocaust and the trauma of that. So that's what I meant. And then he said, well, there was a person on The Stanford Daily staff that is part Asian. I think that's, I'm recalling something 15 years ago. So I said, well, what are you going to do? And he said, well, you know, they have a program, a policy that anything they print that is controversial and attack on somebody, they will print letters to the editor, so you should write a letter. So I wrote, I think I wrote a little letter. And then somebody called me Rush, call me Lumber. He said, hey, Victor, this is outrageous. I'm going to mention it. And then it was on Mark Levine. And then the next thing, just dozens, if not hundreds of letters came to Stanford. 99% was, you should be ashamed of your people for attacking this. And they printed, they put a little insert. They printed about 15, 20, 40. And then the guy called me up, then he said, I've talked to your director and he says, if you will agree, we don't have to print anymore. I said, well, how many do you have? And he said, too many to print and they're all on your side. I said, do what you got to do. It's your newspaper. But it's the same thing. You don't go to the person. You try to go to the employer or you try to go to somebody and then you quibble, but you can't even do it. Boy.
- [66:28]
Unnamed Co-Host
Don't, don't quibble with Victor, folks.
- [66:31]
Jack Fowler
Well, I try not. I try to be very careful what I said. And I guess I was tired when I said, you see San Diego rather than CSU San Diego. But when you're. Somebody is trying to tell me that. When somebody is trying to tell me, quote, California State University Sacramento, also known as Sacramento State, is the only public university and the world's fourth largest economy. It's, I think he means is the only public university in the world's fourth largest economy as symbolized by Sacramento. I don't know. I have no idea.
- [67:13]
Unnamed Co-Host
The capital of the state, he should.
- [67:15]
Jack Fowler
Have said, is the only public university in the capital of the world's fourth largest economy.
- [67:21]
Unnamed Co-Host
I'm glad he gave you. You have been given another opportunity to make. Give this broader attention.
- [67:27]
Jack Fowler
Yes. He needs to be known that Dr. Jonathan Luke Wood, who has been president for over, over now two years at California State University Sacramento, a few years ago gave an interview with a black college conservative journalist. And the most controversial elements within that interview have now been. There's been a synopsis of them, short though it be, and it is circulating. And in it, the president of California State University Sacramento unapologetically insists, even when challenged to explain himself by a very good host that he has no apologies about it, that he wants to eliminate whiteness. And when he's pressed to show the difference between the reflection or the manifestation and the source, whiteness versus white and he's given examples, blackness versus black Jewishness, he cannot answer and he's stubborn. And finally he just says I'm for all people. Essentially that's what he's says. So I don't know how someone like that can continue as a university president in a multiracial state in which so called white people are only 36% of the population, 45% are Hispanic and I don't understand how you can do that because anybody else who would say such a thing and we saw it in the Los Angeles City Council hot Microsoft a few years ago where members of the city council of Hispanic background said something terrible about African Americans and they, I think most of them either were censored or resigned or took a leave of absence. But that's a terrible thing to say. You want to eliminate whiteness, discourage whiteness, explain what whiteness is. He couldn't even explain what whiteness is. Not fair.
- [69:34]
Unnamed Co-Host
In one way, not enough, but so be it. We're going to take one little quick topic, but first I'm going to let our listeners know that they need to take control over their money. Because right now 134 countries representing 98% of the world's economy are building central bank digital currencies. These systems are designed to make every transaction visible, trackable and controllable by government authorities. It's a level of financial oversight that mirrors the tactics used by authoritarian regimes throughout history. Look at China. 260 million citizens are already using a digital yuan. I can never say that right, but it's their dollar that can expire if not spent, if not spent by government deadlines. And it's not just a theory. The IMF admits these currencies can be programmed decide what people are allowed to own. Once cash disappears, so does the last real protection individuals have against financial control for thousands of years. And that's why our friends at American Alternative Assets put together a must read guide. The Digital Dollar How CBDCs Threaten your financial freedom. The free report explains how digital currencies represent one of the greatest threats to personal liberties and why physical gold and physical silver may be the last line of Defense. Call 8332 USA Gold or visit victorlovesgold.com to claim your copy. Now that's 833-287-2465 or victorlovesgold.com History has shown us what happens when governments gain total control. Don't let that happen again.
- [71:13]
Jack Fowler
Again.
- [71:13]
Unnamed Co-Host
And we thank the good people from American Alternative Assets, I'll say that again, American Alternative Assets for sponsoring the Victor Davis Hanson show. Victor, I'm going to push off till after the break, the final break, your thoughts on that in state tuition story. But let me just quickly say something came up on the news this morning, one of the morning shows JP Vance was on and he was sticking it to the media about the focus on Epstein and he said something to the effect of like we've got it. Bill Clinton, the records hot. Bill Clinton visited Epstein Island 26 or 28 times. Maybe the Democrats shouldn't be making a big.
- [72:00]
Jack Fowler
I don't understand that because they leak. That's one of their brands. Their signature is leaking things. We saw that with a Mueller investigation, everything was leaked. We saw that with James Comey. He had a private conversation with the President of the United States in which he assured him he was not the object of the ongoing Crossfire Hurricane investigation. When he was doing exactly that, investigating Trump, he went out into his car somewhere and he memorial what he called memorialized that conversation on an FDI device and then he sent it to a third party party to leak to the New York Times. So I don't understand. Everybody knows that they had complete control over these so called Epstein files and they chose not to release it in four years. And they would have been quiet today except Pam Bondi jumped over her skis and had had information that she thought could be released. It wasn't a formal list. It was just a bunch of names that had appeared in the trial and the interrogatories and text and email. And apparently when that reached the general public, they were prominent donors. I would imagine they would be more on the Republican side. But when I looked at the list, they had people as Diverse As Leonard DiCaprio, Bruce Willis @ had come into contact, Alan Dershowitz, so big and nobody knew the status of them. So then Pam Bondi was probably said, if you release my name and I didn't do anything, I'm going to be ruined. And the people who did do things and she probably thought, okay, we won't, but she had said she would. That was the extent of it. And I think they would have been better off just to release all the names and let the investigative journalist left and right go after each name and try to see whether there was any culpability or not. It's not a fair system but that's where we are. So my point is that was when they got angry because of the inconsistency, but not the content. They had four years and they would have leaked this if there were two things that were in there. One, if Donald Trump had been on that plane at that island, they would have leaked it in a nano scene.
- [74:26]
Unnamed Co-Host
Second.
- [74:27]
Jack Fowler
And two, if Bill Clinton had not been on that plane, they would have leaked it. And the reason that they did not leak it was Bill Clinton, as you said, had been on that plane not at the New York apartment alone, not at his office at Harvard alone, but at Epstein's private, whatever we call that den that was sort of a fortified sex fortress. And he had been there. And they did not want that to get out. And so they didn't release it. And they couldn't find anything there that proved that Donald Trump had been on that flight down to the Caribbean. So they didn't release it. That's clear. So I don't understand their strategy. I really don't. Release the Epstein, release the Epstein, release the Epstein. I would release it, everything, and then maybe we would learn why they did not release it. And any collateral damage to a Republican donor or grandee or politician. If they did not engage in intercourse or sexual activity with someone under the age, depending on which state the plane was flying over, whether it was 16 or 18, then that they just showed bad taste or they were crude. But they're not a statutory rapist. Let them deal with it. Get it out. But I don't think they want it out. I really don't.
- [75:54]
Unnamed Co-Host
Well, Victor, we're going to take a little break and we'll come around the home, turn down the stretch and we'll get your thoughts then on this in state tuition break for illegals. And we'll do that right after these final important messages. It shouldn't be this difficult to get.
- [76:15]
Victor Davis Hanson
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- [77:19]
Jack Fowler
What you eating? The new banana split cookie from AM.
- [77:22]
Victor Davis Hanson
PM all freshly baked with real butter.
- [77:24]
Jack Fowler
With banana, chocolate and strawberry flavors. That sounds amazing. Can I have a bite? I'm sorry but no. But you can't split the banana split. Not even a little. Not even a crumb. What if.
- [77:34]
Victor Davis Hanson
No, please.
- [77:37]
Jack Fowler
Mine when it's too legit to split. That's cravinians. Get a 3 pack for 99 cents with our app ampm. Too much good stuff plus tax where applicable. Prices of participation may vary in terms of conditions apply.
- [77:52]
Unnamed Co-Host
And we are back with the Victor Davis Hansen Show. We're recording here today. A little mangled up, I apologize but Sunday that the. What is it? It's the 10th and this episode will be up on Tuesday the 12th. Victor's website, the Blade of Perseus, is a must for fans of Victor's writing and wisdom that he shares. He does two exclusive articles every week for Blade of Perseus and one exclusive video. And you'll find the archives of these podcasts, links to everything else Victor writes, his other links to his other appearances. So it's $65 a year. It's $6.50 a month if you want to stick your toe in the water. But discounted $65 a year. The address is victorhanson.com and it's the Blade of Perseus. Check it out. So Victor, here's the headline from ap. So this may be a little slanted one way or another, but thousands, Thousands lose in State Tuition Breaks Under Trump's Immigration Crackdown Tens of thousands of US College students without legal resident status are losing access to in state tuition prices as part of President Donald Trump's crackdown on immigration. The Justice Department has been suing states to end tuition breaks for students without legal residency, starting with Texas in June. It also filed lawsuits in Kentucky and Minnesota and most recently Oklahoma. Last year, Florida ended its tuition break for students living there illegally. The federal law prohibits aliens not lawfully present in the United States from getting in state tuition benefits that are denied to out of state US Citizens, the Justice Department argued in a lawsuit this month. In Oklahoma, there are no exceptions, Victor. For a lot of conservatives, this is one of the most maddening. It is that illegals you know, how come my kid can't even get into the school?
- [79:47]
Jack Fowler
Because they're clogged.
- [79:48]
Unnamed Co-Host
Foreigners and illegals.
- [79:49]
Jack Fowler
And that's, you know, you know, they have a lot of exposure, the left. Because if you look at the articles that appear today, yesterday about this topic, they don't tell the truth. Big surprise shocker. They say things, things like, Trump cuts off tuition grants for students. No, what he does do is saying if you are not a US citizen and you are here illegally and you are living in a different state in which you are now your primary residence was in a different state than where you originally were, you would have been subject to out of state tuition. And citizens are subject to that. Okay, we all agree on that. However, if you are illegal and you are living in the state, the left is saying, well, you're now a state resident. You are a state resident, but you're not a U.S. citizen and you're not a legal green card holder. So you are breaking the law. But you are claiming that you get a. And usually, Jack, it's about a two thirds discount on tuition when it's not legal to do so. But more importantly is the asymmetry. You are telling the American citizen that he is not eligible for that sizable discount because he lives in a different state, but you're telling the illegal immigrant who's breaking the law that he is eligible even though he's unlawfully here because he happens to be in the same state in which he goes to school. This came up. I wrote a book. I wrote an article for City Journal called Mexifornia. That was a name that was very popular in the California penal system among Mexican gangs. It was a term of pride that they had taken over the prison in California. And so I used that term, Mexifornia. And in 2003, Peter Collier @ Encounter Books asked me to enlarge that essay. And I did. And it came out as Mexifornia as a long essay. But here's why I wrote it. One of the reasons I wrote it is I had about, oh, 60 or 70 students that regularly took both classic courses in translation when I was teaching at Cal State University, Fresno, and Greek and Latin. And one of them was one of my brightest students. Brightest. He was here illegally. He went to a very prestigious Ivy League graduate school. And I didn't know he was illegally until he told me, or I should say he told me after someone else told me. Who was the other person? Person who told me he was a classic student who lived in Texas and his family had just. I don't know. They had been in California for a while, but they were permanent residents of Texas. And he came from Texas and enrolled in Fresno. And they told him that he had to get a job in Fresno and reside in California. I think it was over a year before he would be eligible for in state tuition. And he was very angry. And he said, x, your student is here illegally, and he gets 2/3 off CSU tuition, and I have to pay the full price even though I'm a U.S. citizen. And he said, do you know the argument? And I said, I guess it's because they figure that he buys stuff in California longer than you do, and sales tax, or his parents pay California property tax if they own a home, or they pay California state income tax, therefore they're contributors to that and they don't care about the law. And that your parents are in Texas and pay those same fees to Texas. That's the theory, but it should be nullified by the fact that you are obeying the law and he's not. And you know what was weird about it, Jack, is that I mentioned it to this person and I kind of forgot about it. And then about a year or two later, when it came time to apply to graduate school, he got into one of the most prestigious Ivy League PhD programs and classics in the country. And then he came and reminded me that he was here illegally. And I called up the chairman and I said, I got to be very explicit with you. This student is very bright. He's done very well. He did very well on the gre. I think he really deserves to be in your school. But he did not accurately answer the question of whether he was an American citizen or not. He's not. He is a citizen of Mexico, and he's here illegally. You know what the person said to me? I think I mentioned before, that's even better, Victor. That is great. So we have somebody who's a person of color, and now he's an undocumented. That's great. And that was. I had another student who was just as bright and kind of eccentric. In fact, I would say this other student was the most gifted natural philologist I'd ever had as a student. By that I mean, after about six months of studying classical Greek, he could read it almost like English. He was that intuitive. He was very strange. He was a loner. He had very long hair. He happened to be white. And when it came time to apply to graduate schools, I had about four students that year, and four of them qualified as minorities. One, maybe dubiously, they were one quarter this or something. He had no. And all the four got into the Ivy League and he did not. He got into, I guess second tier school, but he got. We were able to get. But he was by far the best skillologist. And these were programs were in philology. And he came to me and he got very angry at me and he said, you are a perpetrator of this unjust system because you emphasize that these students were minority students and you know that I can read Latin and Greek better than they can. And I said, yes, I do, but there's other elements that are involved. Study habits, personality, compatibility, manners, unlike you being so rude right now. But anyway, I liked him and he did not get it. There was nothing for him is what I'm trying to say. And one of the students was this person who earlier had got in tuition break and was illegally here. And I didn't tell him that, but it got around that X was an illegal alien and got into the best of all the program and he didn't. And he was considered the best philologist. And I just say that because that happened a lot in my 21 years there, a lot. Because I was the main advisor for Classics Humanities along with Bruce Thornton. And we probably, as I said, sent 50 or 60 people to PhD programs over 21 years. And it was just a reoccurring theme that a person who was so called white could not get in from a third tier school like Cal State Fresno, even with a master's degree. But you could, because it was known as having what I would call genuine minorities, not people who were, you know, fourth generation Argentinian or something. And it was really frustrating because the people you talk to on the other end who were governing the department chairman did not care. They did not care about the truth. They just wanted to get punch boxes. And I tried to reason. I said, you're making decisions on these people's lives and you're not doing it meritocratically. And the people that you are letting in are my students and they're very good students, but they're not deprived any more than these other students are. It was at that time, you know, 30 years ago, we were dealing with the second generation of the Oklahoma diaspora. These were people's parents who came from Oklahoma in the 30s and early 40s who were dire poor and they still hadn't emerged from poverty. And poor whites from Oklahoma and Arkansas, but no one cared.
- [88:42]
Unnamed Co-Host
Well, as regular listeners of this podcast will know that you've explained many times that Dei is not a recent thing. It goes back many decades.
- [88:54]
Jack Fowler
It's affirmative action rebranded to include people other than black. It was redefined by Obama and said that we're no longer in a black white binary. We're in a white everybody else but white. And it's not 9010, it's 3070 demographically. And that started under Obama. It really did. Among all the other pernicious things he did. Yeah.
- [89:23]
Unnamed Co-Host
Yes.
- [89:25]
Jack Fowler
Gosh. Long list.
- [89:27]
Unnamed Co-Host
Destroyer of our, of our, of our country. Well, it's not destroyed yet. Hey, Victor, we've, we've. Because of my idiocies here.
- [89:35]
Jack Fowler
Did everybody realize that there was a scene change with Jockey? Scene one to scene two?
- [89:41]
Unnamed Co-Host
Actually, you should know mentioning Mexifornia, that yesterday I went to a store to buy something to supposedly amplify my wi fi at my house. It failed. But while I was shopping, I had a National Review T shirt on. A guy buttonholes me. Hey, National Review. And he started talking to me about Mexifornia and you and Raymond Abraham, the book you did together way back. So it's funny you mentioned Mexifornia now, but we were talking about you in a Target store last night in Trumbull, Connecticut, Victor. So hey again, want to thank you for all the wisdom you shared. Thank folks for checking out Victor's website. There's also on Twitter or X Excuse me, Dhanson. There's a great friends of Victor Davis Hanson fan club on Facebook book. And for me, as for me, I write Civil Thoughts, the free weekly email newsletter gives 14 recommended readings. It comes out every Friday. Go to civilthoughts.com sign up. It's free. We don't sell your name. You're going to like it. I know you will. Thanks, Victor. Thanks for your patience and tolerance and thanks to our listeners and our many new viewers through YouTube and Rumble. And we will be back soon with another episode of the Victor and Davis Hansen Show. Bye bye.
- [91:00]
Jack Fowler
Thank you everyone for listening and viewing.
- [91:05]
Victor Davis Hanson
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- [92:22]
Unnamed Co-Host
Com.
- [92:23]
Victor Davis Hanson
Until next time. Remember, those who trade liberty for convenience end up with neither.