Zelensky Leaves Washington

Summary

Summary of "Zelensky Leaves Washington" - The Victor Davis Hanson Show

Release Date: March 4, 2025

In the episode titled "Zelensky Leaves Washington," hosts Victor Davis Hanson and Jack Fowler delve into the intricate dynamics surrounding Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky's recent visit to Washington. The discussion spans geopolitical strategies, internal political maneuvers within the United States, and shifting public opinions within major political parties.

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1. Overview of Zelensky's Washington Visit

The episode opens with Hanson providing a critical analysis of Zelensky's interactions during his Washington visit. He emphasizes the disconnect between Zelensky's expectations and the geopolitical realities he faces.

• Hanson (07:15):
  "Zelensky thinks that our agendas are the same as his. When Trump talked about avoiding a proxy war akin to the Cold War, Zelensky didn't grasp the severity of the situation."

Hanson argues that Zelensky is caught between aligning with European globalists and engaging with American political factions like the "bicoastal elite," which may not be in Kyiv's best interest.

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2. The Role of J.D. Vance in the White House Meeting

A significant portion of the discussion centers on J.D. Vance's involvement during the meeting between Zelensky and Trump.

• Hanson (25:49):
  "When J.D. Vance interrupted, he questioned Zelensky's understanding of Ukraine's internal struggles, stating, 'You don't know what you're talking about because you're over here and you're shanghaiing people.'"

Hanson critiques Vance's performance, suggesting that his confrontational approach exacerbated tensions and hindered productive dialogue. He highlights Vance's background, portraying him as a formidable yet potentially abrasive figure within the Trump administration.

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3. European Pressures and Involvement

The hosts examine Europe's role and its shifting stance towards Ukraine, expressing skepticism about European countries' ability and willingness to support Zelensky effectively.

• Hanson (13:00):
  "Europe now thinks they're independent and are starting to drop their veneer of anti-Americanism. They rely heavily on US military expenditure to maintain critical sea routes vital to European commerce."

Hanson underscores the limited capacity of European nations to sustain Ukraine without substantial US support, pointing out the financial and military dependencies that bind Europe to American interests.

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4. Implications for US Political Strategy

The conversation shifts to the broader implications of the meeting for US politics, particularly the tension between Trump's strategies and those proposed by more traditional diplomatic approaches.

• Hanson (19:39):
  "The weaponization of the executive branch has led to destabilizing actions, such as firing generals who do not align with political agendas, thereby undermining military efficacy."

Hanson criticizes both the current and previous administrations for politicizing defense strategies, arguing that such actions weaken the military's ability to function independently and effectively.

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5. Gallup Poll: Democrats' Views on Israel

A surprising revelation from a recent Gallup poll is discussed, highlighting a majority of Democrats holding unfavorable views of Israel for the first time since the survey began in 1989.

• Fowler (76:29):
  "According to a new Gallup poll, only 33% of Democrats have a favorable view of Israel, while 60% view it unfavorably."

Hanson attributes this shift to decades of left-leaning narratives that associate Israel with negative stereotypes, leading to diminished support within the Democratic Party. He connects this trend to broader issues of anti-Semitism and political alignment within the party.

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6. Byron Donald's Candidacy for Florida Governor

The hosts touch upon Byron Donald's announcement to run for governor of Florida, endorsed by Donald Trump, and the potential challenge he may pose to Ron DeSantis or other candidates.

• Fowler (89:17):
  "Byron Donald is a loyal Trump supporter, fervently campaigning and embodying the MAGA message, which could create a formidable primary challenge."

Hanson praises Donald's dedication and articulateness, suggesting that his candidacy could significantly influence the Republican primary landscape in Florida.

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7. Concluding Insights and Future Implications

In wrapping up, Hanson reflects on the broader narratives of political allegiance, military integrity, and shifting international alliances. He underscores the importance of maintaining clear and consistent foreign policy strategies to support allies effectively.

• Hanson (93:01):
  "There are two Americas—one shaped by coastal elites and another rooted in traditional values. Understanding this divide is crucial for navigating current and future political landscapes."

The episode concludes with Hanson urging listeners to remain vigilant about the politicization of government institutions and the impact of internal political strife on international relations.

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Notable Quotes

• Hanson (07:15):
  "Zelensky thinks that our agendas are the same as his."

• Hanson (25:49):
  "You don't know what you're talking about because you're over here and you're shanghaiing people."

• Hanson (19:39):
  "The weaponization of the executive branch has led to destabilizing actions..."

• Fowler (76:29):
  "Only 33% of Democrats have a favorable view of Israel, while 60% view it unfavorably."

• Hanson (93:01):
  "There are two Americas—one shaped by coastal elites and another rooted in traditional values."

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Conclusion

"Zelensky Leaves Washington" offers a comprehensive analysis of recent geopolitical and political developments, emphasizing the complexities of international alliances and internal political dynamics. Hanson and Fowler provide listeners with nuanced perspectives on Ukraine's leadership, US political strategies, and shifting party loyalties, encouraging a deeper understanding of the forces shaping current events.

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For further insights and detailed analyses, visit Victor Davis Hanson's website at victorhansen.com and subscribe to "The Victor Davis Hanson Show" for future episodes.

Transcript

[Victor Davis Hanson]

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[Jack Fowler]

Hello, ladies. Hello, gentlemen. This is the Victor Davis Hansen Show. I'm Jack Fowler, the host. You're here to get wisdom from the man with a lot of it. That's Victor Davis Hanson, who is the Martin and Ely Anderson Senior Fellow at the Hoover Institution and the Wayne and Marcia Buskey Distinguished Fellow in History at Hillsdale College. He's got a website, the Blade of Perseus. The web address there is victorhansen.com tell you later why you should be subscribing Victor. There's never a day where we can't say, my gosh, what just happened the last couple of days. I mean, there's this like onslaught of dynamic things happening in America in 2025. And as our by this, this particular episode will be up on Tuesday. So the Zelensky, Trump et al fracas in the White House will have happened a few days, but this is the first time we'll get Victor's full take on it for the listeners of this podcast. So that's how we're going to start off today's episode, getting Victor's take and as and more information has come out in the last 24 hours about what happened behind the scenes and prior, why Zelenskyy was playing games. J.D. vance played a big part in the dynamics at that White House meeting. We'll get Victor's take on that and his Overall view on J.D. vance. And there's pretty a ton of other stuff. Byron Donald is going to run for governor of Florida, has been endorsed by Donald trump. What is Mrs. DeSantis potential candidate for governor. Think about that. Terrible poll. Terrible, terrible poll. Gallup poll about Democrat views of Israel and it is now underwater. Gosh, what's happening to that party? That and more of Victor's wisdom on all these things when we come back from these important messages.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Before we continue, I want to tell you about what's really happening to your money. What economists politely call inflation, but what we've come to understand as government approved counterfeiting. Like many of you who've studied history, I've watched the pattern repeat throughout civilizations. The steady erosion of purchasing power as governments print money instead of making hard choices. Folks, I'm deeply concerned. For the first time ever, our nation is spending more on interest payments than on our military. That's why we've asked our friends at American Alternative Assets to share their wealth protection guide. The guide explains how how this hidden tax transfers wealth from savers to asset owners and why smart Americans are moving their retirement savings to precious metals IRAs before inflation steals more of their future. These are true patriots who understand the mechanics of currency devaluation. Right now, they're offering our listeners up to $10,000 in free silver plus a free American made safe. They'll show you how generations of Americans have protected their purchasing power during times of monetary uncertainty. Call 1-800-861-8047 or visit victorlovesgold.com call 1-800-861/8047. Again, call 1-800-861, 8047 and tell them Victor sent you. Before we continue, I want to tell you about what's really happening to your money. What economists politely call inflation, but what we've come to understand as government approved counterfeiting. Like many of you who've studied history, I've watched the pattern repeat throughout civilizations. The steady erosion of purchasing power as governments print money instead of making hard choices. Folks, I'm deeply concerned. For the first time ever, our nation is spending more on interest payments than on our military. That's why we've asked our our friends at American Alternative Assets to share their wealth protection guide. The guide explains how this hidden tax transfers wealth from savers to asset owners and why smart Americans are moving their retirement savings to precious metals IRAs before inflation steals more of their future. These are true patriots who understand the mechanics of currency devaluation. Right now, they're offering our listeners up to $10,000 in in free silver plus a free American Made Safe, they'll show you how generations of Americans have protected their purchasing power during times of monetary uncertainty. Call 1-800-861-8047 or visit victorlovesgold.com call 1-800-861/8047. Again, call 1-800-861-888047 and tell them Victor sent you.

[Jack Fowler]

We are back with the Victor Davis Hansen Show. This is a baseball cap wearing Victor today. Fedora, Fedora. It's off to the haberdasher, I guess.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Well, when I have to wear these, it doesn't work.

[Jack Fowler]

Oh, okay. Well, it's all cool. Victor we are again, we're recording on Saturday, March 1st. This episode is out on March 4th. Victor so again, the listeners of the Victor Davis Hansen show have not had your take yet on what happened at the White House. So how about your overall take? And then we can maybe get into some of the skullduggery that this just didn't happen. This was in a way orchestrated and blew up in the face of Ukrainian president. Your thoughts?

[Victor Davis Hanson]

VICTOR well, you know, I, I just wrote down about just a minute ago, I jotted down 10 things and I'd like to go over them very quickly. I don't think Zelensky understands that the people that he feels the most affinity with are the Europeans, the globalists, and here in the United States, the Obama, Clinton, Biden people, the bicoastal elite. And I hope to God he's not being advised as some rumors this morning, Jack, that people like Victoria Newland, Venman, Blinken, Susan Rice were advising him to toughen it out with Trump. Because here's the problem. He's a very supposed to be a very sophisticated person, but the people that he feels comfortable cannot help him. Europe cannot save Ukraine and the left and the Democrats are out of power. The people who can save and get him a good deal are the people whom he does not like. And that's Maga, Trump, Rubio, Vance. So he's got to keep that in mind. Number two, I wrote down he thinks that our agendas are the same as his. And when Trump said, well, we have a two ocean, he said, well, they'll come out. He started lecturing Trump on geostrategy. Ah, they'll come after you. But we have some interest with him. We don't want an aggressive, restless Russia and we'd like your, I guess that. But Donald Trump was trying to tell him about World War Three. He was trying to say, and I'm going to translate Trump ease because this is what he was implying, that you don't have a proxy war under the rules of the Cold War. And maybe that's what we're in with Russia. You don't use a proxy war on the homeland border of your nuclear adversary to get advantage. The last time that was tried was Nikita Khrushchev tried to use Cuba 90 miles away from the US as a proxy to harm us with missiles, etc. And we went to DEFCON 2. That is, we put the bombs were loaded and ready to go. So we didn't tolerate that. So we're playing with fire. And he doesn't understand that. And Trump is also, he wants to, like Henry Kissinger, triangulate. Russia is no friendlier to China than it is to US Vice versa. China is no friendlier to Russia than it is us and he wants to break up that China Russia alliance. And he is a humanitarian. He keeps saying he does not like to see 1.5 million people dead and wounded.

[Jack Fowler]

Before you get to number three, if I could just add, I, I don't know if he said it, but others have used the word partner. And I, I don't think we're partners with Ukraine.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I think no, we're. And he kept saying that we don't have any allegiances except to the United States. And that's when he started criticizing Trump as if he doesn't know that basically he wanted Trump to do what Biden did. Biden called Putin on murder. And Trump said to Zelensky, I'm not going to go call him names and then call him up and try to negotiate. That's what a negotiator does. And if, if, if any never Trumpers are listening and say, victor, you're pro Putin. Ask what Barack Obama did. He had Hillary push a reset button and said we're going to get along with Putin in a way that Bush didn't. And of course, they made it worse. The other thing, Europe now today, and I'm Speaking on Saturday, March 2, is they think they're independent now and they're talking, I mean, that crazy Canadian former foreign minister who said that she wanted nuclear weapon deterrence from France and Britain to protect Canada from the U.S. they really are starting to drop the veneer of their anti Americanism. But here's the thing they keep taking we're going to go in there. We're going to be PK we don't need the United States. Well, they do need the United States, unless they're counting on the 50 or 60 planes that Germany has, or the 10 or 15 tanks that Spain have, but they run up $180 to $200 billion with us. They claim we only pay 16% of the NATO budget, that we're one member. There's 32 nations that's inordinate itself, but more importantly, we spend billions to keep the Red Sea, the Mediterranean Sea, the South China Sea, the Black Sea. All of these were open to, and they're vital to European commerce. And they're de facto under our nuclear shield. I don't think that their nuclear deterrence deters anyone. So they better be very careful about alienating the United States. If they want to play the United States, they're welcome to try Promises, promises. But they're going to have to do two or three things. They're going to have to cut their social welfare budget, they're going to have to get rid of their green deal fixation, and they're going to have to rearm at 3 to 5% or more to catch up. And I don't see them doing that. Another thing, what's kind of ironic is they were very close to a deal. All the, all the issues have been resolved. Everybody knows their arm better than any other NATO continental army. Now, more experience, but they're not going to be in NATO. Nobody's going to give them the wherewithal to take back the Crimean Donbass. So you only have two issues left. How far will Vladimir Putin go back to his 2022 borders, and how will you deter him? And Trump came up with a solution. He said right along the Donbass, where all the rare earth minerals are found and things like uranium, we're going to make a commercial corridor and give us a concession, 50. 50. You supply the materials, we supply the investment, and we'll get other people involved and you'll have a Dubai like corridor. And Putin will not invade because it'll de facto tripwire. And Mr. Zelensky, if you don't believe me, ask yourself, when he did not invade, he didn't invade when I was president. So I think that sort of is ironic because when Zelensky kept interrupting, he didn't quite see that there was hardly anything left to discuss. And he kind of, he didn't give us an alternative either. Jack, what is the alternative? So he goes out, he interrupts and he gets angry. And he's a guest. He kind of insults the host. He's a client, he insults the patron. So now, where is he right now? Well, if Vladimir Putin wants to have a spring offensive, and believe me, he will. They are as J.D. vance, everybody. I should. I suggest everybody look at the Spectator today. There's an article by a Ukrainian legislator with a pseudonym, and he says that it's true what Trump said, that there's only about 10% support for Zelensky. He's jailing his enemies. There's no habeas corpus, that they are shanghaiing people, like Vance said. So my point is, if he wants to not take any more of the 300 billion or whatever it is, nobody really knows the exact number. Then what is his example? If he thinks the Europeans are going to save him, he is sorely disappointed, and I don't think they'll last another month. A couple of other things. If there is a deal, Jack, there'd be what? Elections. After that, peace. And he would restore political parties, he would restore opposition media, he would restore habeas corpus. He says he can't have elections because, unlike us in the Civil War or World War II, his. His country is under air assault. It would be dangerous to go out there. Well, Washington was almost taken by jubal early in 1864. So, I mean, that doesn't. And if you look at Civil War battlefields, which you and I know pretty well, Fredericksburg, Gettysburg, and they're not that far from the Capitol, but nevertheless, if they were to have elections of a ceasefire, what would they find out? Would he win? I don't think he would win. And with the opposition who came in, would they start to be transparent and show us the bookkeeping? So does he have an incentive for that not to happen? I'm just throwing that out. He could look at Netanyahu. Netanyahu was treated much more harshly than Biden, than Trump treats Zelensky. Trump has not cut off bombs or munitions like Biden did to Israel. Trump has not insisted they have a wartime bipartisan cabinet like Netanyahu. Trump has not demanded an unfavorable ceasefire in the way that they impose that on Netanyahu. Trump does not lecture Zelensky on being more selective in your targeting because civilians are getting killed in the way that we tell Israel. And yet Netanyahu came over here in the four years and he spoke with deference to his patron Biden and his host. Can you imagine? And I take Netanyahu, he's the president. Everybody in the left demonizes. But if he was, can you imagine him doing that, Jack, what Zelensky does to interrupt Biden again and again and start lecturing him? I don't think so.

[Jack Fowler]

Treated very hostile ways. He speaks to Congress and Democrats don't show up. I mean, and he kept his temperament the whole time.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

He did. Remember when Obama called him a chicken shit and he didn't. I don't know what his strategy is to stop Russia if we were not there. Is it to give him more territory, strategic space, retreat, Napoleon, you know, like a 1812 strategy to withdraw into the interior of Ukraine? I don't know what it is. I went back, Jack, and looked at the, have you looked at the whole 55 minute tape? I didn't. So all of the left wing media is showing that four minute clip. But if you look at the entire 50 minutes, it was all done. It was very deferential. Everybody was polite. And then they started asking questions. And the person who started lecturing was not J.D. vance. He turned over to J.D. vance and says, you don't know what it's like here and you've not been to Ukraine. He said that. And that's when J.D. vance said, I don't think you know what you're talking about because you're over here and you're shanghaiing people. And that started it all. And then he kept digging down. I was watching Kimberly Strassel, she made a point that maybe there was a linguistic difference. I don't know where that's true or not, but I know that he doesn't seem to understand gestures, space, the tempo of the room. Because anybody who looked at Trump's face and that scowl, they could see that was a warning to him. Just tone it down. You're a beggar and he has the money. It's kind of like you loan your brother in law $5,000. He can't pay, but he needs to buy a car with it. He comes over to your house and you ask him, here's going to be, we're going to have to get this straightened out. And he starts interrupting you while you're feeding him at your house.

[Jack Fowler]

Yes.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

And you say, finally, wait a minute, you borrow the money from me, you're at my house and you're telling me what I have to spend on. And that doesn't, that never works.

[Jack Fowler]

I think what makes it even worse is that this did not have to happen in Washington. This could have been signed in, in.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Ukraine and he, he wanted to come, they wanted to come. You know why they wanted to come? It was either one of two reasons. They wanted to get a, a world audience which they wouldn't have got, or they wanted to embarrass him. Every, all the left Saying this was planned ambush. I don't think that Vance and Trump had any idea of ambush. I think Zelinsky did. I think they told him. And there have been rumors, everybody, I don't know if they're true, but if you look at social media, there are people who say that either on a video flight conference or when he was here, he did speak to never Trumpers and Obamaites and Bidenites like as I said, Vindman or Susan Rice or Blinken or those types of people. And they would have told him, apparently, don't sign anything unless you get in writing that the United States will be there. And. And that's was the hang up. He started demanding. He was lecturing us the other. And this is the last one. He thinks it's March 2022 when he has saved Kiev. He has that T shirt, his wife is on Vogue magazine, they're flying all over. He's Mr. Democracy, he's going over to the Black Sea. And the Russians in those two different peace conferences, we are told he walked out on the prompt of Boris Johnson and other Europeans when he was in a good position because the world had seen him demolish that Thunder Road column of the Russians just blew it up. And the Russians were. Everybody thought the war was over. I didn't. But a lot of people thought, oh, wow, now that he blew up that column, Putin is. And he didn't, he didn't make a deal. But now it's, it's three years later. But it's not three years later. It's a 1.5 million dead and wounded on both sides later. And he's no longer the rock star. He's the guy that suspended habeas corpus, political parties, the media. And he might not have 50% support, so he should adjust to that. I just hope that all of this said these 10 things I just said. I felt bad for him, Jack. I mean, I think he's arrogant and he, he's clueless, but when I saw him there in his T shirt, he's diminutive and he had these two big tall American guys with all the power. And I thought all you have to do is be polite. But he was in a. It was almost like he. I don't want to make fun of autism, but it was like he had some kind of syndrome where he couldn't filter the body language and he was just. I was watching that. I felt like, oh my God, don't say that, don't do that, don't do this. But he tried to egg them on. And I didn't understand what the. You know, when you have people like Brett Hume and Mark Thiessen who are very sympathetic to Ukraine aid, and they're, they're kind of shocked. I think the Wall Street Journal people are kind of. I was watching them yesterday, some of them, I don't think all of them have got it right. They think it was a disaster for Trump. And here's what is very interesting. The initial optics of the five minutes make Trump. You know, you don't do that if you're a diplomat screaming, yell. But once you look at the tape and once you filter in retrospect the relative positions, and once you start to see other clips where Trump said, I'm not for anybody except I'm for peace and the United States and I want to stop the killing, he said that over and over again, he starts to look really good and, and Zelinsky doesn't. So as this thing wears on and is digested, people are going to. And Europe is now on their hind legs crowing. But I think when I saw the NATO, the head of NATO today said to Zelensky, you need to go make peace with the United States. Because all the Europeans are saying, hey, this is the European message. They're calling up Zelensky, hey, we want to tell you something. All that bragadocio, we're going to put troops there, and you've got to be tough to these awful American. That was braggadocio. That was all dependent on the fact that you were going to be compliant. But now you, you, you know, you, you told off the United States and we can't help you. We're here for show, not reality. It reminds me when I was at a faculty meeting once, and there was a, a faculty member who had been treated poorly, and, and he was going to all the people. It was kind of like the Cane Mutant. You remember the Fred McMurray character in the Cane Mutant?

[Jack Fowler]

Yeah, he was.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

And he's saying, you know, you got to be, you got to be tough and you gotta, you've got to stand up and all that.

[Jack Fowler]

He egged him on and then chickened.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Exactly. And so that's who the Europeans are. And the faculty, mean all these faculty told this young on tenure, yeah, stand up to the dean and you go, we're here to help you. And then he stood up and he got squashed like a bug. And they said, not me. I'm not next. And that's what the Europeans are. And Zelensky's got to understand that.

[Jack Fowler]

Victor, go ahead. Sorry, did you want.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Well, I mean, if tomorrow he says I need a C17 and I need Kiev is being besieged and I need a half a million artillery shells and 10,000 javelins and NATO rounding a million NATO rounds. I got to get them here tomorrow morning. They can't do that. The only one that can do it is the United States.

[Jack Fowler]

I want to pick up on the theme of ingratitude you just raised. But before that, I want to share with our dear listeners some information about our [e-mail] they make hot, fast Solaire Infrared grills. With rising prices everywhere, you want to make sure your hard earned money is spent well. So here's what you get when you buy a 21 inch and larger Solaire Infrared backyard grill. American made and built to last with all stainless steel, welded design and commercial quality features. Radiant infrared burners that heat up to 1,000 degrees in just three minutes regardless of the outside temperature. High direct heat that results in the juiciest and most flavorful food you've ever had from a gas grill and limited lifetime warranty on the burners, grates and stainless steel. Also, when you buy a Solaire infrared [e-mail] you support our advertiser, which helps them keep our voice and values on the air. I think that's kind of obvious. Learn more about Solaire infrared [e-mail] including their try before you buy demo rental program. That's Best Hot Grill.com BestHotGrill.com and we thank our friends from Solaire for sponsoring the Victor Davis Hansen show, which they've done for quite a long time. Thank you, Solaire. So, Victor, you know, I wonder how this plays out with America, American public. And I do think the American public still, many of us 80, 75 years after the conclusion of World War II, would still say when po'd about the French for something or else we'd say, if it wasn't for us, you guys would be speaking German now. And I think that applies here too. The sense of ingratitude we feel from naturally and rightfully should feel from people who we bail out and then want to kick us in the guilt.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Well, there's two Americas. It reminds me of my mom, my dear mother. I went, I was, we were all on this farm and we never really been out of it. And I went to UC Santa Cruz, the hotbed of 60s insanity. It was a very good school when it first opened and I came home at Thanksgiving for the first time, right? And I started Spouting all the stuff I'd heard, you know, about Vietnam, everything. And my mother said to me, she looked at me and she said, you know, your grandfather needs some help with the walnuts. They're just starting this early. Wilson wonders, I think. And I need you to go down. I said, but, Mom, I've got all this. And I was talking about the dorm line, and she said, victor, this farm is here to save you from where you are. To save you. And I didn't understand, but I quickly did. And what I'm getting at is you ask what the reactions are. So I kind of been schizophrenic for the last, oh, 50 years, because as I drove over every weekend to Santa Cruz, then I drove over as a graduate student at Stanford, then I was a visiting professor for two years on the coast. And then I. Since 2003, I've been over there driving over every week. So I have kind of a split. So I see the coastal elite attitude, right? And here. Here it is. Wow. You know, I was so embarrassed because that crude outburst of Trump. Here we have Europeans and we have the international media, and there are so many nuances to this. And the role of the United States is to be the protector of protocols and world order. And it was so embarrassing to me. I'm almost quoting verbatim, Christiane Amanpour.

[Jack Fowler]

Oh, my gosh. She almost had.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Never in my life have I been all. And then this Vance, this cat lady person, he just burst in, and poor Zelensky, they have no empathy. And then I come back, right? And I see the average person, and they're saying, and they don't have any money like these people do. So if they have to pay 12% state tax, they don't care. They go, well, we gave them the money, didn't we? They took it, didn't we? It's what Coolidge says when, you know, during World War. After World War I, and the Europeans said they were broke and they couldn't pay back the US Money. He said, they rented the money, didn't they? So the average American is trying to pay for all this stuff, and he gets lectured. Well, don't they need us? And didn't they borrow our money? And we don't do that in the real world. When a guy comes into my shop and he wants a loan, and then he starts telling me the conditions of the loan, I kick his out. Excuse me, I kick his rear end out. Yeah, I'm quoting someone.

[Jack Fowler]

Heiny. Yes, yes. So that's.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

That's how they act to it. So the red America and half the country is proud of Donald Trump. When he said I have. He said, well, your allegiance. He said, I don't have an allegiance. My allegiance is to the United States and to peace and to the world. And he's the protector of American interest. And he said, you're. He said, you're flirting with World War Three. Because what he was trying to say, everybody was, if the Europeans don't come through and this guy alienates the last barrier between him and the Russians, which is us, then they're going to be overrun. And the only way to stop Putin is to threaten him with nuclear weapons. If you do that, that's it. And. And Trump doesn't want to go there. So the average pragmatic view. And it was just typical that you go on all those npr, pbs, msnbc, and they bring out the same cast of character. This is Professor X at the center for Strategic Stud Ambassador. And there are. This is a. A former New York Times international reporter who's been to Ukraine 98. 5. 98.5 times. And then they start telling you the same old stuff, and it's just not the street.

[Jack Fowler]

The. The left elite pinnacle is to be a member of the Council of Foreign Relations.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah.

[Jack Fowler]

Certainly not the Knights of Columbus for that. To them, that's. They all want to be international geopolitical brainiacs.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Did I ever tell you my Council of Foreign Relations story?

[Jack Fowler]

No. I think we're about to hear it.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Max Boot was a good. I mean, I got along with him, and he once asked me to speak about a book I wrote, Carnage and Culture. I think it was at the Council of Foreign Relations, you know, the office kind of near Central Park. And so I fly to New York. I had to go. I was flying to New York and I have my little map to see where it was. I don't know what this is. 2000. I don't know. And then he emailed me that he couldn't make it. My host. So I walked to this door and I knock on the door and they let me in. I think it was a black door. It looks kind of nondescript building. And I say to the secretary, and she says, who are you? And I said, I'm supposed to give an address to the. An address. We don't have addresses here. Oh, yeah. Mr. Boot said that he couldn't make it. And he organized this. Let me see if it's canceled. And then he said no. So I go into a room thinking, and there's like six people here? Yeah, six or seven. And you know what? They were very nice. I can't even remember who they were, but that was my experience with the doyens of American diplomacy.

[Jack Fowler]

Well, I assume you see some of them when you go away for a week in the summer, but we'll talk about that another time. Victor, we've got more to get your wisdom on. Maybe a final thing about Zelensky and your take on J.D. vance's performance. And we'll get to all that when we come back from these important messages.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

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Foreign.

[Jack Fowler]

We are back with the Victor Davis Hansen show, recording on Saturday, March 1st. This episode will be up on Tuesday, March 4th, which by the way, will be Mardi Gras. And then after that, for those of us who pay attention to the doctrines of Holy Roman Catholic Church, we'll have to start our fasting and all that jazz for 40 days. So Vict oh, by the way, Victor's website, the blade of Perseus victorhansen.com Please do go check it out. Everything Victor writes, link there. Victor writes two special pieces every week for the Blade of Perseus and also a special video and you can access them, read them. If you're a fan of Victor, you're not reading them. I don't know what's the matter with you, but fix that. It costs 650amonth to subscribe and it's discounted for a full year at $65. The Blade of Perseus victorhansen.com Victor, just one last thing on Zelensky and then get your take on JD Vance. Marco Rubio in the Daily Mail today quoted, he says, you start to perceive that maybe Zelensky doesn't want a peace deal. He says he does, but maybe he doesn't. And that active undermining of efforts to bring about peace is deeply frustrating for everyone that's been involved in communications with them leading to today. I mean, I, I what is the alternative?

[Victor Davis Hanson]

There is no, that's what I meant. There is no alternative. But that was my point when I said if there is a deal and if you have a commercial corridor and concessions for rare earth investment and you get the European companies, the Americans in there and they get half of, you know, they could get five or you could get a billion dollars a year and start rebuilding and then they would have, according to Zelensky, there would be no more aerial attacks. So people could go out in the public square and vote. Would they vote for him? He says these over. I mean, his people here say he's got overwhelming support. Trump said 8%. And then I read today that one of the persons there who is anonymous is writing that he doesn't have very much support, that he punishes the media, that if you criticize him, you're off to the front lines. And so is he afraid that peace would then have an open election and then when they had an open election, we would kind of open the books and then see who got what? I don't know.

[Jack Fowler]

I mean, if you look at what happened to Britain after, maybe he's afraid if he's a little student of history, maybe he's afraid, you know, Churchill got dumped, Right? I mean, once there was an election.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Absolutely, they might say, you know what he was, he, he had one great moment and that was saving Kiev. He didn't panic and he did a great job and now is not the time for him anymore. But I don't know what his motivation is. I don't see an alternate plan if he. They say, and again, this was on social media. Two or three people were tweeting it and some people sent it to me. I didn't find it myself, I confess. But they said that he was on a video conferen with, with those people, Susan Rice and Binman and Blinken and some others. And he should be very careful whom he listens to. They have a different agenda than his. Their agenda is to make Trump look embarrassed and sell out Ukraine and then have Russia invade and then they can do the Russian collusion, Russian disinformation 3.0, get the House, impeach Trump and emasculate his last two years. That's not his agenda. His agenda is a sovereign, autonomous Ukraine. And I've written a couple articles about the Finnish War of 1939. 40. It was the same thing, Jack. Everybody said Mannerheim is the hero. Stalin came into his country, he wanted 10%, he was all alone. The Americans were isolationists. The Germans and the Russians had a non aggression pact. They just gobbled up Poland. He was all alone. And then they fought heroically and killed 400,000. They always quote the, the Winter War, that's November to January. They never quote March of 1940. And Mannerheim then sees Stalin, is angry. He sends a million Russians to the front. They grind down the poor Finns who only have about 3 million people. And Mannerheim said, oh, I am going to negotiate. And he says to Stalin, you wanted that 10%, take it, but we're going to fight you to the death if you try to take the whole country. And I think he even gave him an extra percent, 11%. And then they made a deal and he said, we're going to be independent and no matter what happens, we will not invade Russia. And what he was saying to, to Stalin is This non aggression pact may fail. You may be in a war with Germany. Germany is close to us, but we will not when the war, if it were to happen, we were not going to join in attacking your home soil. And they didn't. And they saved their country and they were like Austria. They were non aligned and they survived. And that's what Ukraine can do. But if Ukraine thinks they're going to turn in to the Victoria Newland Anthony Blinken bicoastal project of a vast EU country, the former breadbasket of the Soviet Union and the czars and the Russian Federation. If they think they're going to turn this 40 million person huge country into a EU, NATO, Cosmopolitan, LGBTQ, open the whole progressive agenda right next to this orthodox traditional Russia. That's not going to happen. It's not going to happen. Not that you, whether you want it to happen or not, it's not going to happen. They're not going to allow that. They're just not going to allow.

[Jack Fowler]

What's your take on how JD Vance performed yesterday, by the way? I happen to have seen him in the morning. I was in D.C. and he spoke at the National Catholic Prayer Breakfast. It was an annual event. They were like about 1500 people there. Catholics, probably not, I mean faithful Catholics. Prayer for the Pope, probably not fans of the Pope. So he had a good audience.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I've always liked people.

[Jack Fowler]

But, but he was knocked it out of the park.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

And then I said that I wrote later.

[Jack Fowler]

He's, he's, he's in the midst of this. Your thoughts on how he.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Well, I had a talk with a couple people and I got, I don't know if you remember when he was appointed vice president nominee. And then almost immediately they went after him and called him cat lady and they found up everything he'd ever said. You remember that? And the media thought that they were going to have a frenzy fight and I think they misquoted Trump. But somebody had, there was a rumor that Trump was wondering whether he did the right thing. Remember that? And appointing him the vice president nominee. There was a lot of controversy and I wrote a column and, and I said he didn't appoint him to balance the ticket. He said white male, he's from a red state, now Ohio. He, he appointed him because he's the quickest person on his feet and he's fearless and he will out argue and articulate the MAGA message better than anybody. And they unleashed him on the media and the, by the time the campaign was over, the media was afraid of him. So he is very gifted, and he has, he covers all of the bases that the left seeks to find. They'll say, well, he's a tough guy, but he's. He's a sunshine patriot. Well, no, he joined the Marines. And then they said, well, he was a reporter. Well, there I had been twice to Iraq during the surge, 2006 and 7. I can guarantee you there was no place in Iraq that was not dangerous. So whether he was a reporter or not, he was in a combat. I'll give that to Pete Buttigieg. Even when he went to Afghanistan. There are no such places in those types of wars. So he had the military service. Then they said, well, he's a white racist. No, he's married to someone of Indian background. His kids are multiracial. Then they said, well, he's just an elite Goldman Sachs guy. No, he grew up in poor Appalachia in a dysfunctional family. Well, he doesn't. Not very smart. No, he just. The first novel, he. The first memoir, whatever you want to call it, Hillbilly Elegy was a best seller for two years. So there's no area that they can criticize him on. The only, as I said once, I'll call it, it wasn't a debate. I had a polite conversation with him 10 years ago about Trump when he was. He had just written something in Wall Street Journal. It was very critical of Trump. And he, we disagreed about Trump, but he was the most polite person in the world among this group of people. And then he had called me once or twice, and I really like him. I mean that sincerely. He's very gifted. My only cautionary, and I'm not going to give him advice, is that he is so articulate and he's so fearless that when he demolishes somebody, you might not want to put your boot on the neck for the coup de grace. In other words, when he said to Zelenskyy, here's what I'm getting out, everyone. So he says, what am I Getting at, Mr. Mr. President, with all due respect, I'm getting at this. You came over here and you're asking for this money. Have you said thank you to the president? And by the way, you've been political. Don't lecture us on politics. You went during the election to Pennsylvania and you campaigned against the person who's the only person who's going to save you. And Kaczynski was like, you know, I stepped on a landmine. And so then I would have said this. He could have just added that little escape Hatch. And he could have said, and Mr. Zelensky, I'm not here to out debate you. I'm not even here to lecture you or enlighten you. You're a head of state. I'm just trying to explain what the American position is and how apparently you're not completely sensitive to it. That's all I'm trying to do. I'm not raising my voice. And if he had done that, I think it might have been more effective. But what I'm saying is not that he is not compassionate. He is. But he has such formidable rhetorical skills that he demolishes people. I'm not even sure he knows how effective he is. But there's a Greek trope, laitotes. And it's a word that when you're going to make a point, and you can make a point, you use a deliberate understatement for rhetorical effect if you want to say I'm really smart, or Laetotis says I'm not without talent. Were you an athlete? I was a masterful athlete. I had some good days. And that's what I'm suggesting, that he might add once in a while as a qualifier. But that's a larger issue. I said that on a video. I had an interview with you. You it the other day, whom I greatly.

[Jack Fowler]

Yeah, I want to talk to you about that.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah, I think I've started with you 20 years ago on his. When he was here. And I could do it in the morning at 6, you know, before he went back east.

[Jack Fowler]

Right.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

But. And I really admire him and like him. But we were talking and I said, I think the Trump team has to have a little bit of the tragic flair. And by that I mean a Sophoclean idea that when you're laying off all these people and you're making much needed changes with people who got away with murder, and you've got 30 million illegal aliens, 12 million, then you've got to get a little bit of the tragic style. Here's what I mean. You've got to say a lot of these jobs were created by elites for their own selfish purposes. But the problem that we're having is that average Americans are working and they're not all partisan. Some of them are very hard working and we can't afford it. We're 36 trillion. So we're going to try to do this. We're going to try to get the private sector going, we're going to get energy and we're going to have programs to get these federal employees into private sector jobs as quickly as we can because we really feel for them. Or we want to get rid of the million, half a million criminals and the million and a half who have already had their deportation orders. And we want to get rid of people who are not working and they're milking the system and they're on public support. But then it gets tricky because we have some people who came illegally and they're working and they're paying taxes. But we're going to discuss that and we're going to find a way, if they have to go home, to do it with compassion and humane, just to say that and be sincere about it. And I think that would help them a lot because they're making such radical changes that you don't want to play into the left stereotype that they're heartless or. What's the word? High five, High fiving. Triumphalist. I got another scalp today. I closed down the Department of Education or I took those NPR sobs and I hung them up. You know, that kind of stuff. You don't want to do that.

[Jack Fowler]

Well, that is, it's the triumphalism. That's, that's.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah, you got to be very careful because you've got half the country on your side, maybe 55%, according to polls. And to keep them, they want to feel that this was much needed and they're going to have neighbors that work. You know, you got to be a guy in Virginia, and there's going to be a guy who was an independent voter or something. He went into the Department of Commerce, he commuted, he had a long commute, and maybe he was drafting papers about ways to support LGBTQ in Rwanda or something. But that's not his choice to do that. And what he was doing was not necessarily worth borrowing money at 7% to pay him. But that doesn't mean that he needs a. Doesn't need a job. You want to help him. You don't want to be like Joe Biden or Hillary. Hillary Clinton lost the 2016 election when she went in and told those West Virginia people they were, you're going to be out of a job. Or when Joe Biden went in and said, you got it, we're going to shut down fracking. You should learn how to code. That's not, that's not right. You've got to show some, some compassion and some sense that what you're doing has to be done, but it has to be done with the idea that you didn't start it or when you're deporting people. You've got Steve Miller needs to say, I didn't start this problem. They did. They were the ones that dreamed up the idea that let 12 million people come here. That's costing the taxpayer who doesn't have the money, billions. You let them explain why your mother cannot get her dialysis treatment because it's being overrun by people who are not from this country. And we're going to try to find a compassion solution and we feel terrible about the tasks that we have to do, but we have to do it. Your anger should be directed at the people at the, at the cancer, not the chemotherapy.

[Jack Fowler]

Right. Right. It's.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah.

[Jack Fowler]

The difference between chemotherapy and scalping. Victor, somebody wrote me about, about this. They listened about the triumphalism your discussion with you. And I want to ask you a little more about. I'm going to read his comment, but first, before we continue, I want to just tell our listeners about what's really happening to your money. What economists politely call inflation, but what we've come to understand as government approved counterfeiting, just what we've just been talking about. Like many of you have studied history, we've watched this pattern repeat throughout civilizations. The steady erosion of purchasing power as governments print money instead of making hard choices. Folks, we're deeply concerned and for the first time ever, our nation is spending more on interest payments than on our military. That's why we've asked our friends at American Alternative Assets to share their wealth protection guide. The guide explains how this hidden tax transfers wealth from savers to asset owners and why smart Americans like you, I hope, are moving their retirement savings to precious metals IRAs before inflation steals more of their future. These are true patriots who understand the mechanics of currency devaluation. And right now they're offering our listeners up to $10,000 in free silver plus a free American made safe. They'll show you how generations of Americans have protected their purchasing power during times of monetary uncertainty. Get your pens. Get your paper right now. Write this down. Call 1-800-861-8047 or visit victorlovesgold.com Call 1-800-861/8047 one more time. Call 1-800-863-8047. Tell them Victor sent you. And we thank the good people from American Alternative Assets for sponsoring the Victor Davis Hansen Show. Victor, to continue the torture of our listeners who cannot stand the sound of my voice. I just need to read this quick little note from Brian commenting about you with your UUIT discussion. He says, of course, that's an important point about the triumphalism and I think the point ranges well beyond the government layoffs. There's a tremendous risk that when the demos gain ascendancy and will happen at some point, who knows when they'll engage in a slash and burn comeback of an even more extreme kind. That may sound paranoia, but it isn't. The weaponization of the executive branch under Biden was very creepy. Who's to say it won't recur? The Trump administration would do well to create in house consistently use set of protocols or guidelines about its public messaging. Victor, your thoughts on. On that. But like, you know, I mean, they're.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Going to do it no matter what. If the Republicans are beyond even a suggestion that they're being political, it doesn't matter when the left comes in, they're going to do it. Donald Trump his first term had people in his cabinet like the anonymous ex, like Rex Tillerson, like John Kelly, like John Jim Mattis, like John Bolton. He had a lot of people who did not agree with his agenda and he tried to be kind of bipartisan and he did not weaponize. They weaponized everything against him from collusion to disinformation to the Axios, ping, ping, all of that stuff. So they're going to do it anyway. But I think the, the reader is right that you want to set up protocols that prevent the politicalization and I'll give you what I mean. And this is very. Did you see Jack, there was a letter written by five former secretaries of defense that was just published and they were Lloyd Austin, James Mattis, Leon Panetta, Chuck Hagel must be 85 or something, and Perry. And they all said that what Donald Trump is doing by firing generals was derelict and politicizing and weaponizing the Pentagon and it has to stop. And they want Congress to intervene. And here was what I thought when I read that. History will adjudicate whether they weaponize. In other words, when they got rid of Mr. General Brown who was political as chairman of the Joint Chief, did they get a better person in there? Did they get recruitment up and why was recruitment down? Did they get a better array of munitions, drones and more for the buck? Did they have a new geostrategy? Are they more so history will record whether the changes that they made are simply revenge or they actually improved the Pentagon. Will they pass for the first time an audit? They started having outside audits in 2017. They flunked three of them onto the last two defense segments. Will they pass the next one? So what I'm getting At is, yes, they're getting generals that they feel reflect battlefield efficacy rather than cultural and social issues. And whether you call that political or not will depend on whether they're good and whether the policies work. But here's what I also think. I am so sick of the public letter. We're having 51 former intelligence authorities, and it has. And then you think that Clapper and morale and Blinken and Panetta and Brennan, they're all thinking, now, how do we sabotage Trump at the debate? Because he's going to bring up the laptop. We know from the FBI who had it a year, that it's authentic. So we got to come up with the right word. We got to get it right during the last debate, right before the election. And we've got to cement the idea that this authentic laptop that talks about Mr. The big guy and 10% and all this sex, deviancy in the fam, all of that stuff, we've got to turn it on its head and say it's proof of more Russian collusion. And then, of course, when they published that letter, the wording was so clever, and Brennan keeps using it. You can't take away my security, security clearance. I said it has all the hallmarks. And I didn't say Russian disinformation. I had all the hallmarks of Russian information campaign. So in other words, we tried to have every little obsequious, crappy little out, but we knew what we were doing. And so what I'm getting at is who weaponized the Pentagon? Who weaponized these agents? They did. Who fired Generals? Obama fired McChrystal. And Mr. General McKiernan hadn't done anything. He just came in and they fired him. They fired McChrystal. They fired. He fired. That was kind of ironic because Jim Mattis signed the letter, but he was fired. Remember, he was CENTCOM commander, and Obama fired him. And he was a good CENTCOM commander. He really was. He had a very realistic idea about Iran, and Obama fired him. And when they fired McChrystal, you know, he said, joe, bite me or somebody. He heard it. He didn't correct him. And they fired McKiernan and McChrystal and Mattis. Did the replacement do any better? No, they did worse. He was political. Joe Biden came in and he fired all 18 of the defense Advisory Board members. And I was on the American Battle Monuments Commission. I got this letter. You're all fired when Obama came in. So they weaponized it. When you look at the Secretary of Defense, I mean, whether you like or not. Jim Mattis was fired. Chuck Hagel was fired. He was fired. Leon, the five people who signed the letter, Leon Panetta. Jack never apologized. Remember, they asked him to apologize.

[Jack Fowler]

He likes to sign letters.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yes. He's signing a letter about the ethics of the Pentagon when they caught him lying to warp an election. And they gave him an out and said, would you like to apologize? He said, no, he left. And then there was Lloyd Austin signs a letter and then he's AWOL for what, six days while he has a medical procedure. It'd be sort of like, I'm supposed to go to work. I'm supposed to fly out tomorrow morning. I'm going to get up at 3:00, I'm going to fly to Hillsdale and do. It'd be like, I have a medical procedure. I'm just not going to tell anybody. And so I have an audience waiting at Hillsdale, I have a panel and I'm just not going to show up. And then I'm supposed to go back to hoover and lead 100 people in a military history. I get off the plane, I go, I have to do that. I hope everything works like clockwork. It's snowy. But what if I just stay home and I have a kidney stone? I've had 33 kidney stones, three operations. I guess I have a medical procedure. I'm not going to tell anybody. What would the military do for a private who did that? They'd fire him. They would put him up court martial. That's what Lloyd Austin did. He just hid the fact that he had complications from a prostate. And I feel bad for his health, but for him to sign a letter and talk about politicalization and weakening the Pentagon. And so finally I thought, what is the greatest example that these five, these five former secretaries, when they signed this letter saying that the Congress should investigate Trump and HECSEF for firing the chairman of the Joint Chief. Why would he want a joint chief person who is not political? General Brown, right after the George Floyd rights, remember he got on, made a video. As a black American, we don't really, I know you're wondering what my views are as a. No, General Brown, we don't care what you're voting. We don't care what the political views of you or the 300 or 400 other generals and admirals. All we care about is can you defend us and create deterrent. But he started talking about all this and then who was at the congressional hearings and they recommended, remember in 2022, it was Milley and Austin. They Recommended that we read what Professor Kendi, the grifter whose whole anti race project at Boston University $50 million later just disappeared in Stacey Abrams fashion. And so I was thinking, why would Donald Trump not want General Brown to be Chairman of the Joint. Oh, I know, because he came out and politicized the Pentagon and talked about your superficial appearance would be integral to recruitment, promotion and retention. And second, I had an experience with a chairman of the Joint Chief not long. What was his name? Oh, Mark Milley. Yes. I walked over and after they tried to storm and burn the St. John's Church and storm, I just had a photo op just like all and he just started trashing me and said he was used, but that wasn't all he did. Then I learned that he called his Chinese communist counterpart and said if I get an order from this unhinged president, I'm going to warn you first. So he tipped off the enemy. And then I've read the statute, Donald Trump thought and the chairman, the Joint Chief has no statutory power of command. He cannot interfere in this chain of command, theater commander, centcom, African com, whatever they are, they report directly to the Secretary of Defense, four star generals and I advise. But what did Mark Milley do? He broke the law. He said, I want to tell all you theater commanders when you get annoyed, it comes from me. We're in scary time. And if you think that's an aberration, he goes out of office. And what does he say now? It's ex President Donald Trump and he's a candidate this last year. So there's no Article 88 provision. Article 88 of the Uniform Code of Military justice says that a retired or serving officer cannot disparage the commander in chief. Donald Trump was not the commander in chief. So what does he say? He is fascist to the core and he is the most dangerous man in America. And to his credit, when Donald Trump shortly thereafter was elected. Where is Mark Milley now? He's completely muted because he knows something, doesn't he? Have you noticed another thing, Jack? We're not hearing Mussolini, Auschwitz, he's an architect of like Hayden tweeted that about Auschwitz, Bergenthau, death camps. We're not hearing McCaffrey say he's a liar. We're not hearing McChrystal say that, all this stuff. Why? Because I have a feeling they feel that the new non political military will say these are rules, we didn't make them. But they're not rules unless they're enforced. So if you're a general, active or retired, Subject to recall and you call the commander in chief publicly, humiliate him, disparage him, we're going to subject you to Article 88 and you're subject to court martial. And guess what? The experts on deterrence are deterred. And they weren't deterred before because they thought the left had so demonized Trump he wouldn't dare enforce what they were saying about him. Or they thought they were saving the Republic. But my point about all this is when you weaponize the government and then you're out of power and then you start lecturing somebody about weaponizing the government, first of all, you don't have a leg to stand on because you're not consistent. Number two, you created the counter revolution because you were revolutionaries and you destroyed the norms. I'm not saying the five secretaries of defense, but I say you that the left wing movement did.

[Jack Fowler]

Isn't there also an aggrandizing of this whole class of generals and admirals? I thought I saw something recently. The number of generals and admirals there were in World War II when the military was so much vaster versus today. Maybe that makes sense, I don't know. But it seems like there's.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

See the thing, what won US World War II and what won us every time we're in a jam? Sick. Take the Civil War. You start the Civil War out and you got McClellan. He was. He looked perfectly. He knew how to drill. Drill soldiers. He trained them. And then Antietam. He just couldn't do it. I mean, they almost won. He couldn't do it anymore. He never could do it. He was a president of a railroad. He was very Natalie dressed. He was perfect in his comportment dress. But he didn't have it. Neither did Burnside, neither. Neither did Hooker, neither did Pope. None of them did. Neither did Halleck. So who do you want in a time of war? You want an ex drunk like US Grant who was in a grocery store in Galena, Illinois, and you want a madman like William Tecumseh Sherman that they declared mentally insane. And you turn Sherman loose and he starts saying things. Well, there are 300,000 Cavaliers have started this war and they've got to be eliminated. Our U.S. grant Sherman says, well, at the Battle of Shiloh were in pretty bad straits. They almost overran us today. And he said, yep, lick them tomorrow. That's who U.S. grant was. That's who Sherman. Same thing with Korea. MacArthur. I like the guy. But after the Yalu river and Choicen, we were going to lose that war. And then all of a sudden they get a three time divorce. Matthew Ridgeway, who they called old. And I'm not being foul, everybody, I'm quoting. Whom they called old Iron Tits because he had a mess, kept kit on one breast and a grenade on the other. And he said, we're going to have mail, we're going to have hot food, we're going to have ammo and we're going to. We may have to withdraw from Seoul. Then we'll take Seoul, then we'll have Operation Killer, then we'll have Operation Ripper. And then we'll get across the DMZ and we're going to restore all of south. And he did. And it's the same thing every time we get in a mess. Look at World War II. God, if we didn't have nuts like George S. Patton, Omar Bradley wouldn't won the war. Hodges wouldn't have won the war. You needed a crazy man like Patton, who was an authentic genius, by the way. I don't mean crazy in the negative. You needed a guy like Curtis LeMay who you know, bomb him back to the stone age. What he said, those are the people we bring. We open the closet door and we look around and say, where was that general that we demoted? Never promoted, let's bring him out. And we'll say, look, we're the townspeople. You're shame. You got to kill the cattle barons and you got to use that six gun. But after you're cleaned it all up, we're going to relieve you of command. So George, take us to the Rhine, take us to Berlin and afterwards we're going to relieve you of command. And you'll die a death and they will put you back. And then they're going to tell Curtis LeMay, Kurt, you flew 25 missions on a B17. You revolutionized. General Hansel cannot get the B29 program. It's not working. And what are you going to do, Kurt? And he gets that cigar. Take the bombers down to 7,000ft and we're going to get rid of the high explosives and we're going to ride the jet stream and we're going to have napal and we're going to burn out the industrial corridor. Okay, Kirk, go ahead and do it. Then after he does it and we win the war, they think, okay, Kirk, you are crazy. And we're going to make a movie called Dr. Strangelove. We're going to have two characters who General Ripper and we'll get George C. Scott and they'll both have an element of your nuttiness and we'll make fun of you. And then we're going to, you know, you're going to run with George Wallace as an environmental and we're just going to demonize you, you. Because we don't need you anymore. You saved us all. That's what we do. And we need people like that. And where your point is absolutely right. In peacetime, these people are not up to it. And there are people right now, I think General Kurilla, isn't he on. He, he was the one that was going back and forth advising the Israelis. He was sort of a guy during the surge. Eric Kurillo, four star now, I think. Was he on the Joint Chiefs? My gosh, I used to read about him in Iraq. He was just, you know, he had a swagger about him. He just went up and fought as a lieutenant colonel. He was in wounded. Everybody. That's the kind of guy you need. And so they're there. You just don't need them. You don't find them until you have to find them because you want somebody sober and judicious and follows the rules and protocols. And yet if you have those people during a war, you're in big trouble. And we did it in World War I. I mean, that's, I mean, World War II, we, we had those people. That was what the Kaiserine Pass was all about. Yeah, we had poor leadership and anyway.

[Jack Fowler]

All right, well, Victor, we're going to come into the final chapter of today's episode. We'll get your thoughts on these surveys about Democrats and their stand on Israel and your take on Byron Donald says a candidate for governor of Florida, where he might face Mrs. DeSantis, the current first Lady. We'll do all this when we come back from these final important messages.

[Unknown]

If you've been with us at all over the last six months or so, you are probably familiar with one of our favorite new brews, Wired to Fish Coffee. As you may know, their coffee is delicious and smooth. But more importantly, the company has amazing commitment to getting give back. Wired to Fish coffee gives back 25% of profits, 25% to conservation, clean water and things like missions and evangelical outreach. From river cleanups and initiatives for fish habitat to programs that give people in slums clean water and spread the word about Jesus. Wired to Fish Coffee is in it to make the world a better place. They also have just launched a medium roast decaf. And for avid coffee lovers, their much loved brew is now available in 2 pound and 5 pound bags. Join us and enjoy your coffee while making a difference in the world and join a community of like minded coffee lovers. Subscribe and save today and enjoy discounted coffee and free freight or just give this great brand a try with discount code. Just news or just the news? For 10% off your first order, head over to Wired2Fish Coffee today and make this year a year you align your coffee with your values.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

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[Jack Fowler]

We're back with the Victor Davis Hansen show recording on Saturday, March 1st in like a I know it's like a lamb today here in Milford, Connecticut. Kind of nice. And this episode is up on Mardi Gras March 4th. Victor I titled this Dem Jews Gallup survey finds 60% of Democrats are Anti Israel More than half Democrats are anti Israel. According to a shocking new poll, only 33% of Dems surveyed by Gallup said they have had a favorable view of Israel, while a whopping 60% said they viewed the Jewish state unfavorably and 4% had no opinion. It's the first time ever that a Gallup survey showed a majority of members of the main US Political party had a negative opinion of the Jewish state. With the question being asked since 1989. I don't think you're Surprised by this Victor? Maybe?

[Victor Davis Hanson]

No, because see, you've had 20 years of two or three, four, no, might be 10 million people going into universities every year and that's all they hear is how awful Israel is. And then you've had massive immigration. And in a very brilliant fashion the left took the Palestinian issue and grafted or fused it upon the civil rights issue. So suddenly somebody who was pretty upscale from the Middle east and educated coming over here, then they were a non white victim and they were victimized by white settler Jews. They grafted the whole Middle east problem onto the victimizer, victimized Marxist binary. So that's what that, that's what that's about. And by the way, did you say dim Jews? Are you quoting the Reverend Jeremiah Wright?

[Jack Fowler]

I, I was, yes.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

When they asked him, have you talked to your former parishioner, parishioner Barack Obama? No, I didn't. Because them Jews have him locked up somewhere. They won't let me speak to him. That's. Remember he was the one that told us that the Israelis made missiles with guided guided missile system whose nose cones could detect Jews from Arabs.

[Jack Fowler]

DNA bombs.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah, we were supposed to. Remember they asked Obama, I think the Chicago Sun Times in 2008 said, you were married by Reverend Wright and you know, do you really go to church? And he, at that time he was trying to win over the. Because the black community was suspicious of him. He had lost to Bobby Rush as a congressional district and he wasn't quote unquote authentically black, they felt. So he wanted to brag that he was at this holy roller black inner city church. He said, yes, I go, you go, I never miss a service. And then unfortunately for Obama about a couple months later that God bless America. No God, blank, blank America. Chickens, chickens coming home to roost. Remember that? And all of a sudden they went back to Obama. I wasn't there. Now, yes, he, I did get married there. Yes, my children are baptized. Yes, I did say I never miss a servant, but that particular one, I wasn't there. So funny. The thing about that Reverend Wright rant was not what he said, which was horrible, but the reaction of everybody in the audience. Remember when they were all clearing and standing up and wildly cheering him when right after 9, 11, he was bragging that the chickens came home to roost and we were, it was our fault that we deserved to lose. 3,000 people praised. Despicable. He's a despicable person.

[Jack Fowler]

Yeah.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

And like to have it. He was getting rich off it too. He had a really nice home and everything. So go ahead. Yeah. So the Democratic Party is lost. It's a lost soul party. It really is. They can't distinguish. I guess when they looked. So that poll you quoted, Jack, I guess they looked at the latest hostage release. So they had these coffins of a mother and her two children that were brutalized, tortured and killed and then. And beaten up their corpses so they could say the Israelis bombing attack killed them. And then it was surrounded by all these brave young men who came out underneath the hospitals and the mosque and the schools where they were hiding in tunnels, put on the regular garb, the camouflage, the Katifa kafiyah, whatever it is, and the Hamas brand, and then had their little AK47s and their RPGs and they were screaming at how brave they were because the Israelis were not going to do anything to them during a ceasefire. They side with that. That's who the Democratic Party sides with. It doesn't side with the only democracy and open, transparent society, liberal society in the Middle East. And they can't tell that moral distinction. Then they're not really a party anymore.

[Jack Fowler]

Yeah, well, maybe then when we record our next episode, which I hope are our good friends here.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

What was the Republican again, Jack? Was that 80% or 75% supported?

[Jack Fowler]

85. 85.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

85%. How dare you left. Try to keep mentioning Charlottesville and right wing anti Semitism. That right wing anti Semitism is a vestigial artifact of a bygone century. Everything in the last half century came that was anti Semitic in this country. Almost everything came from the left. Not that there's a ossified little right wing cabal of crazy people, but 85% of mainstream Republicans, or any Republicans support Israel and you don't even have 40%. And that's because of anti Semitism. It's also because we haven't. Again, you've got 16% of your population was not born in the United States and California is 27%. So we haven't assimilated integrated immigrants. They don't feel they have any obligation to understand the American traditions. And they come, they're chauvinistic about. When I was about 10, my Swedish grandfather, I remember we went down to downtown Kingsburg, which was a Swedish. Everybody spoke Swedish and they had all these Swedish flags. And my father even bought a 1959 Volvo used because it was Swedish. Anyway, we're talking about all the flag and I said to my grandfather, wow, Sweden's so good. And yeah, it's so good everybody left. It's so Good that everybody left. And then I said, well, why do they leave? Well, your grandpa. My dad left. He took us all. He left because there's no stones in the ground here. The sunshine. Yeah, all he had there was cold weather and stones in the ground.

[Jack Fowler]

You know, when you're there in July and I have been. I know you've never been to.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I want to be there. I want to go there.

[Jack Fowler]

Yeah. I was in Stockholm at a. And I forget what island on. On a National Review cruise way back. But it was beautiful. But yeah, it's a. It's a narrow slice of time and layer on to that. Now that cruise is about, hey, can.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I say one last incident that you'll like it, but I think I'll lose some listeners if I do.

[Jack Fowler]

You do whatever you want.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

So when I was 33, the dean at Cal State Fresno said he needed. He wanted to take a 30 day trip to Greece with 20 of his donors. I had mono at the time. I was really ill. But he said, I want you to lead it. And I didn't have tenure. And so I, I went on it and I took 30 days a lot. And he didn't have. I mean, it wasn't like a tour that I led where they had nice hotels. We just had an old bus and everybody stayed at kind of low rent hotels. And you know what the price was for 30 days with airfare? $3,000. 3,000. $3,000 for 30 days. And I had to get the budget for a hundred dollars a day. So anyway, we're doing them. Get the bus. And there was this old Swedish guy and he was a wonderful guy. And he. Two things had happened to him. He had dropped a gun and it shot him. And he just recovered from a bullet wound and his wife had died and he was a farmer living all by himself. So he called me up, he said, Mr. Hansen, are you Swedish? I'm a first generation second. I said, yes, can I come on your tour? I said, yes, does my age matter? And I said, no. And he said, I'm 84. I said. And he was like. Like his head was as square as mine is. And he was about 6, 2. He looked like he was about 50. Anyway, he was very depressed and solemn the whole time, but he was very learned. He was really interested in Mycenaeans. And I talked about the boar's head tusk and Homer. And we saw the actual boar's tusk helmet in Argos or near the. In the Argolet. Anyway, so he was saying, you know, I miss my Wife and I don't out. And I thought, we're in Rhodes now. And I was giving a tour of the hospitality, the. The St. Mark and all of the Crusaders castles and their hospital. And then I remember there was this famous nude beach. And I remember this particular time of the year, Swedish girls went. So I said, I think his name was something like Harold. I said, harold, you know, you're pretty in good shape. Why don't you just take a walk with me? Everybody's had their lunch and they're shopping. Yeah. I said, let's go to the beach and just. It's just, you know, we'll go to the beach and you'll just relax. So we go down and. I'm not kidding you, jack. There was 50 beautiful Swedish girls, and they were stark naked, swimming. It was a nude beach. I looked over to him, he goes, oh, my God, you think they speak Swedish, Victor? And I said, well, let's try it. So I sat there and he walked up and he didn't stare. He was not gross at all. But they walked by him and he spoke fluent Swedish. He learned, you know, he was a Swede. And then I said, after, he goes, I think we better go back up the cliff. He had his five minutes and he took his shoes off and he walked in the water. He walked along with a Swedish young woman. Could not believe that an American was there at that age that spoke Swedish. And he was telling me about all the dialects. And then we got back and my parents were on the tour and they said, how did you do it? Your son is an angel. And for the rest of the trip, all he talked about was talking Swedish to these beautiful young women. But he didn't mention to anyone that they were sunbathing. And I thought about that later when he died, that he had a very good time. I really liked him. He used to write me a letter every week.

[Jack Fowler]

Wow. All the trips I've been on, you know, I've been on a ton of them. I never had any experience like that. People almost choking to death, those kind of stories.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Well, I didn't know if it was still. I mean, when I went there in 1980, I hadn't been there since 79, and I never went to a nude beach. But I remember being in Rhodes and there. There's nude beaches, right? Everybody talked about them, and you could. They weren't shy. Topless completely. So I didn't know what to expect. But I did think there would be topless beach there. And I thought that maybe after his widowhood he might want to talk to some Swedes because I knew Swedes hung out in Rhodes and I hit the jackpot.

[Jack Fowler]

So just talking alone. All right, Victor, let's head over the finish line.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I'm going to be censored by the Stanford Faculty Senate. I'll come up again because I, I was derogatory, I was sexist.

[Jack Fowler]

Dr. Hansen, your medical doctor. Okay. Donald Trump endorses Congressman Byron Donalds who a couple days ago did then announce that he was going to run for governor. And I don't think she had announced but certainly it's been talked that Casey DeSantis, the first lady of Florida is interested possibly in running. You met her?

[Victor Davis Hanson]

We talked about her nine days ago. Yeah, nine days ago I sat next to her and I heard her. She gave a speech. They were giving me an award at Scott Atlas's Liberty center and she was a speaker before me and she gave a very, very rousing, informative speech about what was happening in Florida. She's very beautiful, she's very vibrant, she's very well spoken, she's a cancer survivor. But you would never know it. She's so vigorous and healthy and she's done it all. I mean she's first lady of Florida, she's got children, everything. But I've also. But Byron Donald see the problem that Trump was in, I don't think it's because of his former rivalry. Byron Donald was not just a Trump supporter, he was a fanatic campaigner for Donald Trump. You couldn't see a rally in 2024 that Byron Donalds was not at. He went out of his way to campaign. Campaign. Some people say, well Victor, he did it to get, I don't care why he did it. He was a loyal trooper. Trump had no choice. It's too bad because they're both excellent. The thing about them is they're very similar in the sense they're both very well spoken, they're analytical, they're very calm and they're very admirable people. And if they have a knock down, drag out primary flight, I don't know what's going to happen. There were rumors that because Ron DeSantis will, you know, he'll finish his term and I didn't people I thought maybe he had appoint his wife to take Marco Rubio's place. But he didn't do that because that's been done before. But what's he going to do in the future? And people have argued that in their fashion of Earl Warren or Oliver Windell Holmes or Charles Evans Hughes. That you could get somebody with a political background and put them on a court. Right. And he'd be a good Supreme Court justice. He'd be excellent, actually. He knows the law. Ron DeSantis would. But I don't know what's going to happen about that.

[Jack Fowler]

Okay, well, let me end this with a quick, total curveball. I didn't tell you ahead of time we're going to talk about this since we're thinking of Florida. Pam Beyondi, the Attorney General. The Kraken. The Kraken never seemed to get released.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

I know. I felt so bad about that. It was kind of like Geraldo's Al Capone vault.

[Jack Fowler]

I watched that when it actually happened. That was. It was worth it in hindsight just to say. You did, but. Yeah. Anyway. Okay, Victor. Well, so she.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Yeah, I mean, I think that she thought that because Cash was there at the FBI and she knew that these incriminating things were there and they had some folder. I don't know if she'd had a chance to look at it, but she just assumed that automatically the FBI deep state was over with. So when you would call up Cash, hey, can I get the FBI files? Yeah. But she didn't realize that it's a vast organization with all sorts of cells and eddies and ripples, and it's very hard for Cash to know who's got what yet. Right. So I think she. She's got to wait another month, and then he will find it, if it exists. But it's going to take a lot of digging.

[Jack Fowler]

I think a rule should just be release what you got when you got it, and don't. Don't create the build up.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Exactly. It's. That's. That's what we were always taught. Don't. I don't know what the word was. Our coach said, no showboating, boys. No showboating.

[Jack Fowler]

Well, you've been your usual terrific. A mix of great political analysis and walks on nude beaches. That's a.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

It's. It's. Yeah. I was forced to. I was forced to endure that for the greater good of a person who was a wonderful, sweet man.

[Jack Fowler]

Souls in purgatory, I think.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

So I told my father about it because my mom got really angry at me because there was nudity there. And, you know, that was not fair to subject him to that. And my dad goes, Pauline, he's 84, and now he's going to live to 90.

[Jack Fowler]

Happy. Well, Victor, we have so many listeners now, and they comment in so many ways. On your website, people can comment on the podcasts and on Victor's articles on Apple. People can. Can do that, do that. In fact, they rate the show 0 to 5 stars. Again, practically everyone gives Victor 5 stars. I have a comment that somebody left and it's from. It's from Valentina. HR it's titled. Thank you for enlightening us. It's. It's an absolute delight listening to vdh. His analytical capability is fascinating. I love his humor, his way to narrate personal anecdotes, history, facts and geopolitics, connecting them all in a masterful way with current events. A great scholar to listen to and not be afraid of indoctrination into communism. His experience in working the land speaks of the integrity and honesty and wisdom he learned there and applies it in his life in academia. It also transmits the legacy of the backbone of this beautiful, exceptional and blessed country. It reminds me so much of my dad. I'm so glad I found your show.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

That's very nice to hear that.

[Jack Fowler]

Yeah, it's wonderful. Thank you, Valentina. Thanks everybody else who does likewise. We. We do read the comments. And for those of you who have encouraged the firing of Fowler, it hasn't happened yet, but you never know who said that. Oh, Victor, please. Who hasn't?

[Victor Davis Hanson]

So, no, I've never heard it once, actually. No, I'm serious. Who would fire you? Me. Who's me? I don't even own it, do I? Who? I don't even know who.

[Jack Fowler]

John.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Or maybe I have to ask Sammy permission. I don't know.

[Jack Fowler]

A few, few last things. Victor's on on X and his handle is at VD Hansen on Facebook. He's got VDH's Morning Cup. So if you're on Facebook, follow that. And also maybe check out the friendly Victor Davis Hansen fan club. It's not official, not related, but they're good people there, so you might like that. Again, vda, Victor Hansen's dot com. That's the blade of Perseus. As for me, Jack Fowler, I among the many things I do in life, I write Civil Thoughts, the free weekly email newsletter for the center for Civil Society at Anfield, where we are trying to strengthen civil society. Every Friday it comes out, 14 recommended readings. I know you're going to like it. It's free. We don't do anything with your name. Not selling them. Not, you know, no monkey business here. Go to civilthoughts.com sign up and you'll begin to get it. So thanks for those who do, Victor. You've been terrific folks. Thanks very much. And we will be back soon with with another episode in Lent of the Victor Davis Hansen Show. Bye bye.

[Victor Davis Hanson]

Thank you everybody for listening. Much appreciated.

[Unknown]

If you've been with us at all over the last six months or so, you are probably familiar with one of our favorite new brews, Wired to Fish Coffee. As you may know, their coffee is delicious and smooth, but more importantly, the company has amazing commitment to give back. Wired to Fish coffee gives back 25% of profits, 25% to conservation, clean water and things like missions and evangelical outreach. From river cleanups and initiatives for fish habitat to programs that give people in slums clean water and spread the word about Jesus. Wired to Fish Coffee is in it to make the world a better place. They also have just launched a medium roast decaf and for avid coffee lovers, their much loved brew is now available in 2 pound and 5 pound bags. Join us and enjoy your coffee while making a difference in the world and join a community of like minded coffee lovers. Subscribe and save today and enjoy discounted coffee and free freight or just give this great brand a try with discount code. Just news or just the news? For 10% off your first order, head over to Wired2Fish Coffee today and make this year a year you align your coffee with your values.