← The Who What Wear Podcast
The Who What Wear Podcast
WWW Parents: Cover Star and New Mom Justine Lupe Talks Feeling Primal, Nobody Wants This Season 2, and Motherhood Icks
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- [00:02]
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- [01:17]
Kat Collings
Welcome to the who what Wear? Podcast, your direct line to the designers, stylists, beauty experts, editors and tastemakers who are shaping the ever evolving world of fashion. I'm who what Where? Editor in Chief Kat Collings. And today I'm excited to announce that who what where just dropped our first ever parents issue. In honor of the launch, I'm sitting down in studio with our cover star, new mom and actress Justine Loop. Justine is best known for her role as Morgan in the hit Netflix show Nobody Wants this which will be releasing its second season tomorrow. You might also know her as Willa in HBO's award winning series Succession. I'm sitting down with Justine to talk about her experience navigating motherhood with her daughter Ellis over the past year. And as a new mom myself, it was a delight to talk to Justine about everything from how relationships change after having a baby to our parenting icks. Justine also shares the advice she got from succession co star Sarah Snook. And of course, we talk about putting together her bombshell Emmys look. It's all coming up on who what Where.
- [02:28]
Hi Justine, thank you so much for joining me today.
- [02:31]
Justine Liu
Hi, thanks for having me.
- [02:33]
Kat Collings
Well, the occasion of us being in this podcast studio is to celebrate your cover with us for our inaugural who what where Parents issue.
- [02:42]
Justine Liu
So cool.
- [02:43]
Kat Collings
Well, you're wearing this. I don't know if you've seen the COVID yet, but spoiler, it is a gorgeous pink cloe dress. We chose that for the COVID and you look phenomenal.
- [02:51]
Justine Liu
Really? No, I haven't found out. I haven't found out what pictures you're using. So that's exciting, though, because I love.
- [02:57]
Kat Collings
That dress that is happening. And then when this airs, the next day, it'll be the eve of season two coming out of Nobody wants this, which, of course, you star in. And everybody I know watches the show and loves it. So it's. It's an exciting moment for us.
- [03:14]
Justine Liu
I'm glad that you're excited for me. I was about to say thanks for being excited on my behalf.
- [03:18]
Kat Collings
I'm like, it's exciting for us here in this pod together.
- [03:20]
Justine Liu
I appreciate it.
- [03:21]
Kat Collings
So we'll talk motherhood and show, and we'll just dive right in.
- [03:25]
Justine Liu
Okay, great.
- [03:26]
Kat Collings
I wanna talk a little bit because it blends so perfectly with two things. I wanna touch on being pregnant while filming season one of the show. So my first question is how? Because as far as I know, nobody has escaped the first trimester extreme fatigue, where, like, you could fall asleep at any moment. You don't get to choose when you nap. Did you have that? And how did you deal?
- [03:50]
Justine Liu
So I actually got the job when I was in my first trimester, and then I started the job, like, right at the end of my first trimester. It was divine intervention in a real way, because, yes, I felt like I had mono through my first trimester. I, like, could not get up. It was so, so tiring. So, yeah, I really lucked out that it started, and then I was in, like, that amazing, kind of reinvigorating second trimester, like, renaissance moment.
- [04:19]
Kat Collings
Like, birds are singing.
- [04:20]
Justine Liu
Yeah, totally. You're like, I can do anything. Yeah. It was a different. It was a very different experience than what I was experiencing a month prior. So, yeah, I lucked out.
- [04:30]
Kat Collings
That's good timing. But even still, like, the energy of being on set all day, I'm sure that was intense. And I feel like you, in my mind, you've joined a class of women, like Rihanna performing at the Super Bowl. Like, just, moms are a different breed.
- [04:42]
Nikki
Yeah.
- [04:42]
Justine Liu
You know, I lucked out in that I got to experience Sarah Snook be pregnant all through Succession Season 4 and see what she could do. And I think there's something psychosomatic about knowing someone can do that kind of work. Yeah, it's like an expander kind of. You know, I felt good. I actually felt really good. I mean, the things that were hardest were, like, you know, I would, like, eat a burrito, and then, like, everything would just, like, pop open. Right. Like, my skirt would just be, like, on the ground, and I'd be like, oh, no. I'm, like, expanding past the capacity of my clothes. So there was, like, a lot of adjusting that the costume department had to do, like, week to week to kind of catch up to my body growing. Yeah, it was more just that they would have fittings week to week, and every week was a different episode. Like, it moves really quick. So we did 10 episodes in 10 weeks. Yeah. Which was actually also a blessing because, you know, there wasn't too much time that I was, like, really, really pregnant on the show. But, yeah, they would bring me in every week, do a fitting, retry things on, refigure out. How do we hide this in a different way? Because, you know, the bigger I got, the more creative they had to get about, like, ok, you're asking a lot of us. Yeah, totally. But they were wonderful. They were really, really generous about navigating that whole process with me.
- [05:59]
Kat Collings
I'm sure you became, like, best friends. Like, had to really, like, spend a lot of time.
- [06:03]
Justine Liu
Is like a very dear, dear person in my life. Yeah, they're all great.
- [06:08]
Kat Collings
And speaking of your former co star, Sarah Snook, I heard she gave you some parenting advice, like, wrote you a big thing. I read that somewhere.
- [06:15]
Justine Liu
She's been a good friend through the whole thing. She wrote me when I got pregnant. She gave me some, like, really great podcasts to listen to for, like, the fourth trimester, which is postpartum. And then when postpartum came, she checked in on me. She wrote me another kind of like, breakdown of you're so unprepared for what happens after you give birth. Like, I did a lot of thinking about postpartum, and she was really helpful in terms of being like, you have nine months of pregnancy and you're going to get so much information about being a pregnant woman and people forget about what happens after you give birth. So I had, like, put my mind there, but there's just no, like, preparation possible for the impact of, like, what that is after giving birth. So she was just really helpful with, like, the little nitty gritty questions that I had, like, how do we sleep at all? And like, how do I. Like, did you. Do you have any tips on, like, what my husband can do to help me out in the middle of the night, like, with the swaddling and the feeding and the breast. Like, we're so hands on with the babies. And I think sometimes the guys are like, okay, how can I help? I. And I didn't even know what to tell him. So she was really helpful with that too. Yes. Yeah. Yes.
- [07:26]
Kat Collings
That's amazing to have. I feel like, everyone has at least one fairy godmother who's, like, gave birth somewhat recently. Ish. Before and is still in, like, they're like, oh, my God.
- [07:36]
Justine Liu
Oh, total.
- [07:36]
Kat Collings
Let me help you.
- [07:37]
Justine Liu
Totally. I had a lot, and I feel like I understand it now that I'm on the other side, because it's like, you just. It's this hugely steep learning curve, and you feel, like, proud of all the information that you gather, and you really feel so much empathy for anyone who's about to go through it. So I feel very available to any of my girlfriend, like, girls, I'm ready to go. If you have a baby, I'm ready.
- [08:00]
Kat Collings
To talk, and I will be that person for you and pay it forward. It's like this fun cycle.
- [08:05]
Justine Liu
Yeah, it's really sweet.
- [08:07]
Kat Collings
And there were four people who were expecting pregnant during the filming of the first season right on set. So that's, like, some powerful mom energy.
- [08:14]
Justine Liu
That's a lot of energy.
- [08:16]
Kat Collings
Did you guys, like, commiserate together, share advice?
- [08:19]
Justine Liu
Aaron and I talked a little bit, but it was less about, like, commiserating and more just being like, wow, there are four pregnant women working in this capacity on set. Like, how exciting that this is the day and age that we're in. That that's something that's, like, so welcomed.
- [08:36]
Kat Collings
To your point of, you know, the fact that here we are in 2024, 2025, and I feel like it was Lucille Ball and I Love Lucy who, like, wanted to either show her pregnancy or even say the word pregnancy, and super controversial.
- [08:48]
Justine Liu
Wow.
- [08:49]
Kat Collings
And so just to think.
- [08:50]
Justine Liu
That's crazy.
- [08:51]
Kat Collings
Yeah.
- [08:51]
Just to think how far we've come that, like, people were against it and it was a big moment, and how much has changed since then.
- [08:57]
Justine Liu
I know, I know. And I don't want to ignore that. It's still, you know, after I said. I said something about that last year, like, how wonderful it is that we're in a time that, like, Netflix was, like, behind it, you know, and that all the execs were, like, cheering me on, and it was, like, really a warm reception. But I'm sure there are cases where that's not the case or someone does still feel a little bit unsafe. And it's such a shame. And it's so tricky that women have to, like, think about these things, even when people are welcoming about the whole process. Like, you still have to navigate literally, with logistics, like, okay, if I want to have another kid, when can I be pregnant? When will it show? So it's funny that it's Something that's like, so part of our life. It's so intrinsic to us all being here, and yet that it's like, secretive and sometimes difficult sometimes. Yeah. And I do think, that being said, it's like, clear that there's a really different way of thinking about it than there was back when Lucille Ball was not able to say the word pregnant. That's nuts. Yeah.
- [09:57]
Kat Collings
Season two. I want to talk about it. So this season has some fun new elements. I read about Leighton Meester comes on as a new cast member and she's kind of, you know, I think among fashion girls, kind of an icon. Especially watching Gossip Girl.
- [10:10]
Justine Liu
She's such a cool, like it girl kind of vibe. And she's so goofy on this show.
- [10:16]
Kat Collings
I wouldn't expect that.
- [10:17]
Justine Liu
That's so funny and generous and like, ready to go. Like, she feels like she gives so much. Like, she's so available as an actor and so game for anything. And I. I really, I really like her a lot.
- [10:28]
Kat Collings
I was going to ask about the dynamics on sex. I'm always curious. You kind of described her and I'm curious. Was there somebody who's like the like, set mom or set dad? Somebody who like always had that like, mothering energy?
- [10:38]
Justine Liu
I feel like KB just has like a maternal air about her. She always, like, has snacks and she's always giving tips and advice and like has like an article that she just read. So she's like. Yeah. And she is such a mom. Like she has two girls that she's like such an incredible mom to. So I think that that just like carries into the way that she just interacts with everyone. Is just very warm and like cozy and Mom, Mommy.
- [11:05]
Kat Collings
Let's talk about Morgan. Your characters style on the show, I feel like it's kind of California cool. But then she also, for that bat mitzvah scene in season one, she kind of pulled out the glam moment.
- [11:16]
Justine Liu
Yeah.
- [11:16]
Kat Collings
So I'm curious if there are any outfits that you especially loved wearing or that you feel like the. The public had a strong reaction to.
- [11:23]
Justine Liu
You know, I had the most fun with the bomber jackets that I would wear with like the little skirts, like the basketball outfit I loved. I. It was definitely in reaction to my belly growing that they were like, let's put a bomber jacket on her in all these scenes. There's something really cool about like a big jacket and like legs with tights on them. Oh, yeah. I like, I've never done that in my day to day life. And now I'm like, okay, it's A good look. It's cool. Yeah. But I like Morgan's style. It's very cool. And they did a really good job of, you know, before they knew I was pregnant, they had gone out and they had gotten, like, this huge wardrobe together of all the stuff that I was going to wear. And it was like a really clear character that they had built with these outfits. And, you know, then I got pregnant or I was pregnant, and I told them because I was out of my first trimester and it wasn't, like, as vulnerable of a thing to share. And they did such a good job of keeping the essence and the character alive in these new outfits that were a little bit more, I guess, conservative or, like, covered up a little bit more. Because Morgan, you know, in the first round, there was a lot of, like, mini skirts and little tiny, like, tanks that showed my belly and, like, did such a good job of keeping that vibe alive. I love the way that Morgan dresses. I'm such a T shirt and jeans uniform kind of gal normally that it was just really fun to embrace, like, something totally different and feel how that felt different on my body. And.
- [12:52]
Kat Collings
Yeah, yeah, it kind of pushes you to, like, try new things, especially when.
- [12:55]
Justine Liu
You have your form. Like, oh, this would be, like, if I dress well. No, no, but you know what I mean? You're like, oh, fashion does something to the way that you carry yourself.
- [13:05]
Kat Collings
Yeah, absolutely. One thing your character struggles with is sort of like feeling like she's losing sister to the hot rabbi relationship. And I think motherhood, too, can be a big one where it's like, things shift. You know, if you've, you know, some friends get closer and some friends, you know, kind of drift a little bit in the show. You and Kristen Bell have a huge, you know, blow up fight over this sort of tension that's. That's happening. And I'm curious if you have any tips in real life how to navigate those, like, shifting friendships.
- [13:32]
Justine Liu
Totally. I think I always go back to whenever I'm having some sort of a feeling is to just be okay. Letting yourself have that feeling, like, letting yourself mourn the loss of a friendship or, like, feeling the kind of heartache that comes with, like, a friend moving on into their love of their life relationship and being honest with yourself, that that's, like, a tough thing. It's a tough thing to watch a friend evolve into a new version of themselves, and it's, like, incredibly celebratory, and you're excited for them. And also it can be hard. So I think just allowing the Feeling to, like, live in you for a little while and to be gentle with yourself about it. And also to know that that's just like a part of life and that it's probably coming for you too, and to let yourself feel all the feelings, the celebration and the kind of heartache.
- [14:25]
Kat Collings
Yeah. I read somewhere that the average person has about seven relationships that, like friendships that, like, stay through their life, which I'm like seven. Like, that means a lot of friends, they come and go. So it is a natural part of life. But I feel like it's a part of life that's not. You know, they don't talk about, like, friendships or relationships dissolving as much as compared to romantic relationships.
- [14:43]
Justine Liu
No. I think that some of the hardest breakups I've ever had have been with friends.
- [14:47]
Kat Collings
Yeah, no, it's true.
- [14:49]
Justine Liu
You go from, like, sleepovers and like, being in each other's beds in your 20s and like, waking up together and, like, going out together and then it's like, you know, losing that is like a big deal. Like, there's such intimacy in female friendships and male friendships. So. Yeah, I. I don't know. I mean, I've been really lucky to hold on to some long, long friendships. And also I've gone through the. With the holding on to long term friendships, you have to kind of evolve through all the different changes with your good friends. And some of that can be really tough.
- [15:19]
Kat Collings
I think everyone's dying to know. Obviously, the cliffhanger of season one was with Kristen Bell's character and hot rabbi. Like, is she going to convert?
- [15:27]
Justine Liu
Are they going to stay together?
- [15:28]
Nikki
What's.
- [15:28]
Kat Collings
What's the thing? And also your. Your character's relationship with Sasha. Yeah. Which is such an interesting. I feel like it's so nuanced. Totally. I love that. So I know usually things can't be shared, but is there anything you can share about the season ahead?
- [15:43]
Justine Liu
I think that Jenny and Bruce and Aaron really, really wanted to give the audience what they loved about last season. So there's a really. It does feel like the show, like the show continues and the essence of the show is still there. It's about what happens past. You know, as relationships evolve, the energy that they have evolves. So, you know, like the first season, like, there's a different feeling to that than there is with the second season. It's about, like, what do we do now that we're in relationships?
- [16:15]
Kat Collings
I have a friend that's pregnant and she. I was like, do you have your programming ready of what you're gonna Watch when you. Cause I feel like everyone has their comfort show. Yeah. Her answer was, oh, nobody wants us. Is coming back for season two. And I was like, oh, of course it is.
- [16:30]
Justine Liu
That's awesome. Good time. So that is the best news. It's so nice to hear when, like, someone just needs a little bit of levity that they turn to the show.
- [16:39]
Kat Collings
I feel like we were in a bit of a rom com desert for a while, and people were really craving that.
- [16:44]
Justine Liu
I think that things are kind of singularly dark right now, so it's nice to have any kind of blip of light, warm, optimistic feeling.
- [16:52]
Kat Collings
A little 28 minutes or however long the show is. Reprieve.
- [16:57]
Justine Liu
Totally.
- [16:58]
Kat Collings
On a totally separate note, I've heard you're a Gemini.
- [17:00]
Justine Liu
I am.
- [17:01]
Kat Collings
And I feel like we're in la. We have to talk about it.
- [17:03]
Justine Liu
Let's talk about it. I can talk about it. Okay. What are you.
- [17:06]
Kat Collings
So you Sagittarius.
- [17:07]
Justine Liu
Oh, great.
- [17:08]
Kat Collings
Which are sister signs? I'm just saying. I'm trying to be weird.
- [17:10]
Justine Liu
No, no, no, no. I love SAG energy.
- [17:13]
Kat Collings
What's the most Gemini thing about you?
- [17:15]
Justine Liu
I am very mercurial. I like talking. I like sharing thoughts. I like hearing people's thoughts. I'm really curious.
- [17:22]
Kat Collings
So your mind is just like. Yeah, going totally.
- [17:25]
Justine Liu
I'm, like, mostly there, up in the air. Yeah. And I just really like learning about people. It's like, my way of connection. So, like, you know, even in romantic partnership, like, I get really excited about talking and, like, could care less about, like, you know, making out. No, I'm just kidding. I also like making out. But I will say that I do feel like my. The. The first way of connection for me is just, like, chat through conversation. Yeah.
- [17:54]
Kat Collings
I love it. And then I feel like you have to find a special. A special man that is.
- [17:57]
Justine Liu
Yeah. My husband is, like, incredibly funny. Loves talking. He's really quiet until he's not quiet, and then he's really chatty.
- [18:06]
Kat Collings
So that's the best kind of person who, like, doesn't, like, reveal it all. And you're like, oh, when you know them, they, like, show their real.
- [18:11]
Justine Liu
Totally. People who don't know him well would be like, that guy loves talking because he's, like, also quite an introvert, but in the relationship, like, the moment that he got comfortable and chatty, it was like, we don't stop talking.
- [18:25]
Kat Collings
I love that.
- [18:27]
Nikki
This episode was brought to you by ebay. Hi, everyone. This is Nikki, one of the fashion editors at who? What? Where? I hope you're enjoying this. Episode with our editor in chief Kat Collings and actress Justine Loop from the Netflix series Nobody Wants Us. Fun fact Loop filled. Nobody wants this while pregnant with her first child. Mom Goals Talking about parenting or just parents in general? My mom and I are best friends. We share many similarities, including our love for fashion. We're big believers in expressing ourselves through our clothing. Recently I introduced her to one of my favorite destinations for authentic new pre loved and vintage styles, ebay. We both love going to eBay.com and treasure hunting as we call it. It's our shared ritual that's sustainable and stylish. The other weekend when I visited my mom, we sat on the couch for a few hours. Okay, maybe more than a few. Scrolling through ebay, unsurprisingly, we found amazing pieces that I've curated into a collection for you@ebay.com WhoWhatWear. Before you visit the site, let me tell you a little bit about the designer bags we found. We came across a lace 1990s vintage black leather Prada tote. It's chic, timeless and a rare find for Prada collectors and fans of the era. Another style was the Ro Margo 15 bag. Made of soft black leather, it's available for $700 less than on the Rowe's official website which currently has no stock. This bag is versatile enough for the office as it can fit a laptop and suitable for the airport as a carry on or for daily use, especially for city dwellers who tend to carry many essentials. One of our other favorites was Bottega Veneda's small Chow Chow bag. This style was among Matthew Blasi's final designs for Bottega Veneta. It's the newest addition to the popular Andiamo family. You can carry it with the long plain leather crossbody strap or the bag's braided brass hardware clad shoulder strap for hands free access experiences or with the classic top handle. Although it doesn't come with the cards, it's brand new and nearly $1,400 less than it's sold for on the brand site. Talk about a steal. When buying pre loved designer bags, verifying their authenticity is crucial. Fortunately, ebay offers its excellent authenticity guarantee which ensures that each qualifying luxury item goes through a meticulous multi point inspection by experts. Giving buyers peace of mind using this feature is simple. Just enter your desired item into the search bar and select the Authenticity Guarantee filter on the side. Now it's time to grab your credit card and start shopping. Don't forget to visit eBay.com WhoWhatWear for unique pieces that can't be found anywhere.
- [21:19]
Justine Liu
Else.
- [21:22]
Kat Collings
Wanted to pivot to fashion.
- [21:23]
Nikki
Really?
- [21:24]
Kat Collings
A fashion moment IRL that you had recently? The Emmys.
- [21:27]
Justine Liu
Oh, yeah.
- [21:28]
Kat Collings
You wore Carolina Herrera, dress by Wes Gordon. Wow.
- [21:34]
Justine Liu
Thank you.
- [21:35]
Kat Collings
There is no question, actually. It's just, wow.
- [21:38]
Justine Liu
Wow. Thanks.
- [21:39]
Kat Collings
I want to know how you picked. How you picked it, how it came to life.
- [21:43]
Justine Liu
Well, you know, I saw a picture of it on the Runway. Rebecca Ramsey, my stylist, sent me a picture of it a while ago, like, right after it went down the Runway, and I had the same exact reaction. Wow. Like, that is gorgeous. And then I sent it to my publicists, and they were also like, whoa, whoa, whoa. Holy smokes, that's beautiful. It was on our radar. And then when the Emmys came up, we were like, well, what about asking about this? Like, could we see if we could get it? And, yeah, it's just like, it feels like a champagne glass of outfit. Like, so, like, it's so fancy and happy and celebratory and sexy. So when they said that they were going to send it, I was like, over the moon.
- [22:24]
Kat Collings
I heard there was a little navigation around the sheerness of it. Yeah.
- [22:29]
Justine Liu
So I had never done anything like this. Like, I'm not like, a. I don't really go for, like, the bombshell, see through kind of thing dress, so I didn't quite know how to navigate, like, just everything showing. And part of the beauty of the dresses is how sheer it is. You don't want to add another layer of, like, thickness to it. You want it to just, you know, be what it is, which is fairly transparent. But also, we were like, is my butt okay?
- [23:00]
Kat Collings
Checking in on the butt especially.
- [23:05]
Justine Liu
And navigating, like, what? Underwear will work with this. And, like, how do we, like, do we see a panty line? Like, what do we do? So, yeah, we went through several steps to try and figure out how to make that work.
- [23:16]
Kat Collings
That was your first Emmys, right?
- [23:17]
Justine Liu
Yeah. In the beginning, I was like, wow, this is so overwhelming. There's so many people. It's like, such a spectacle. It's so stimulating. And there was, like, a moment where at the very beginning, I was like, justine, you can be nervous about this or, like, be overstimulated or be, like, about it, or you can, like, really lean into remembering that this is something that you grew up, like, aspiring to go to. Like, this is an event that, you know, you used to watch and go like, oh, I wish one day I could get there, and that it's like, such a bucket list moment. Even though it's, like, bizarre and kind of crazy, it's just also incredibly special. And, like, don't let that nerves get in the way. Yeah. And also don't let it, like, just fly by. Like, really let it, like, drink it in. And so I did. I did a really good job of that. My dad sent me some screenshots of, like, the tv, and he's like, I'm. You're smiling. You're smiling in a way that I've never, like. I was just like a little kid in a candy store, just, like, beaming through the whole thing. I had so much fun.
- [24:24]
Kat Collings
Oh, you're, like, happy to be here.
- [24:25]
Justine Liu
Yeah. Just so happy to be here.
- [24:27]
Kat Collings
I want to pivot to parenthood. I feel like we could talk about this for a long time.
- [24:30]
Justine Liu
I could.
- [24:30]
Kat Collings
I have a daughter as well, and you have your daughter Ellis, who I believe is 13 months.
- [24:35]
Justine Liu
Yeah.
- [24:36]
Kat Collings
That's a tender age. Alice is a great name. I have a niece named Ellis.
- [24:40]
Justine Liu
You do? I do. Oh, that's awesome.
- [24:42]
Kat Collings
How did you settle on the name?
- [24:43]
Justine Liu
My husband picked it, and I think he picked it because of Brett Easton Ellis. And then we looked it up, and it meant kind and benevolent, which is always, like, a nice sentiment to put behind a baby. And then he got it tattooed onto his hand before she was born. Oh, yeah. Pretty early on. And I was like, okay, so that's.
- [25:07]
Kat Collings
I thought I was making a commitment by getting some things embroidered before she.
- [25:10]
Justine Liu
Was my daughter was my embroidery. And I raise you tattooing it onto my body.
- [25:16]
Kat Collings
Totally impressive as a parent. Like, there's so many mini milestones that some you didn't even know existed until your child was doing them. What fun stuff is Ellis doing?
- [25:26]
Justine Liu
She just started going. No. She started being like. We'd be like, can I have a kiss? And she'd be like. Which was, like, kind of out of nowhere, because it's, like, so. It's so sassy. Yeah, it's sassy, but it's also, like, silly. Like, no, no, no, no. Yeah, it's really sweet. She has started to, like, make sounds. So we'll be like, what cat? What sound does a cat make? And she'll go. Or like, a dog. She knows wolf. Like, there's, like, random. Just out of nowhere. You'll be like, where's your head? And she'll, like, know where it is.
- [25:56]
Kat Collings
Yeah.
- [25:56]
Justine Liu
It's just all these things that we've been doing and saying around her are like, finally, like, she's, like, online, and you're like, she's revealing that she's been picking them up, which is such a cool. It's such a cool realization to be like, oh, you've been gathering, and now you're able to be like, I've heard you. It's really sweet. Once it starts, it's just like, explosion. Totally. So I'm really excited.
- [26:19]
Kat Collings
Has she come to set? Does she ever come visit you?
- [26:21]
Justine Liu
She's come a lot. I, like, ended up, like, pretty early on. We put a pack and play in the trailer. And my nanny Samantha, who's there, like, a few days a week, she would come to set and bring her in, and between breaks, I would hang out with them, and then I'd, like, go back and she would hang out at base camp with everyone. Come to set, sit behind the monitor. We like, again, it's like, the most welcoming vibes. Like Jenny and Nora and Bruce and Aaron, they're all so excited to have a baby around. They're like, oh, the work is over there. Like, let's go, like, play with this baby.
- [26:57]
Kat Collings
In the show, there's a little storyline about getting the ick.
- [27:01]
Nikki
Yeah.
- [27:01]
Kat Collings
And obviously that's in regards to a romantic relationship. But I kind of want to talk parenting icks, and I'm going to go first.
- [27:07]
Justine Liu
Okay.
- [27:07]
Kat Collings
A parenting ick I have is when people, you know, I think they just really let their. Their lips get a little loose around the things they say to pregnant people. And I have one that was like, a girl I know was like, did you mean to get pregnant? And I was like, well, I know we're in different life stages, but yes. I'm so sorry.
- [27:26]
Justine Liu
I did totally.
- [27:28]
Kat Collings
It was just kind of bizarre.
- [27:29]
Justine Liu
You're like, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
- [27:31]
Kat Collings
And then the other thing that I get, I wouldn't call it an ick, but I am a little weirded out by the windy.
- [27:38]
Justine Liu
Oh, I gotta tell you, I am such a fan of the Wendy, but.
- [27:42]
Kat Collings
I. I mess around with the snot sucker that I get down with, which is another product.
- [27:46]
Justine Liu
The Wendy, like, saved us on several occasions. I understand. I really understand. It's a weird thing, tool, and it's kind of like, is this okay?
- [27:56]
Kat Collings
Right.
- [27:56]
Justine Liu
There were some moments where I was like, this is literally saving my baby.
- [28:01]
Kat Collings
Yeah, right. Like, making her happy and not in pain or whatever, really.
- [28:05]
Justine Liu
But I had a similar thing. I had a lot of. Because my husband and I weren't married before we had Ellis and I had my parenting ick. Or like, the loose lip thing that you said. I had a few people Be like, so, like, you guys aren't married.
- [28:20]
Kat Collings
Like, a little, like, judgment.
- [28:22]
Justine Liu
Totally. There's a lot of older people. You'd be like, yep. No, we're not. When you first said parenting, ick, My mind went to, like, a gross moment with the baby, which is that we were in the bath together, and she farted. And I was like, oh, that smells bad. And then I, like, turned around to, like, adjust the water temperature in the bath, and then I turned back around, and she. This might be tmi. She had a poop in her hand that she was putting in her mouth.
- [28:46]
Kat Collings
I wasn't expecting to say that. And I was like, no.
- [28:52]
Justine Liu
It was the ickiest thing I've ever experienced in my life. I was like, I just saw a human being eat poop.
- [28:58]
Kat Collings
Oh, boy.
- [28:59]
Justine Liu
Oh, boy. And you're like, it was so bad.
- [29:01]
Kat Collings
Like, obviously, it's gross, but is it, like.
- [29:03]
Justine Liu
Is this a health concern? No.
- [29:04]
Kat Collings
Totally.
- [29:05]
Justine Liu
I was like, tyson, you need to get on the. Get on the computer. Like, do all the research. Like, are we okay? I was, like, trying to wash her. Her mouth out in, like, every way that I could possibly confuse. Terrible. It was terrible.
- [29:16]
Kat Collings
I've been surprised at my threshold for gross.
- [29:19]
Justine Liu
Yeah, totally.
- [29:20]
Kat Collings
Like, I'm like, sneeze in my face, please. Like, I like it. I welcome it.
- [29:23]
Justine Liu
Like, eating things that she, like, spit out. Like, she'll like, not be interested in something, and then I'll just. I'm like, it's gross. I've turned into, like, a rat. Like, motherhood is turning into, like, eat it.
- [29:35]
Kat Collings
Then, like, go walk over to the trash.
- [29:38]
Justine Liu
Totally. I'm like, I don't want to waste it, so I'm sure, like, it's my child. Spit, whatever. Like, there's so many. Or, like, picking her nose. You're just like. I mean, you did the snot sucker. Like, it really just brings us back down to, like, the most primal thing. I had a weird moment when I had her where she came out and her, you know, she was, like, covered in blood. And I had this, like, weird, like, primal sensation that I felt like a lion or something where I was like, I want to lick her head. Oh.
- [30:06]
Kat Collings
Like, I want to clean this. I am you. You are me. Totally.
- [30:10]
Justine Liu
I didn't do it, but I was like, that's an interesting. That's an interesting impulse.
- [30:13]
Kat Collings
Did you always know you wanted to be a parent? Do you feel, like, think. You know, that was. You were meant to be a mom?
- [30:19]
Justine Liu
I think so. Yeah. I did. I always have wanted to have kids. I Didn't know when I wanted to have kids or how many kids I wanted. And I didn't really have, like, a vision of it, but my parents were such great parents and they were such involved parents. And I could feel, like, the joy that being parents brought them. And so I think that, yeah, they're. They were incredible. So there's something about seeing them having fun as parents that I think was just instilled in me, like, oh, I want to have kids myself. Yeah. And even now, like, when I talk to my dad, he'll be like, it's an amazing thing to, like, relive being a child with a child. And I feel that, like, I. I feel like I'm seeing things differently. I'm like, absorbing things in a different way. I'm like, kind of catching the way that she's experiencing the world in a way that I haven't in so long. And I feel what he described.
- [31:17]
Kat Collings
I know, the slowing down and the like, awe.
- [31:20]
Justine Liu
I think we're so. I mean, me included, just so on the. In the cyber of it all or in the thinking about the future. Yes. And it's kind of amazing to see someone who's just like, so on the ground. It's definitely been a wake up call for me and it's. It's incredible.
- [31:36]
Kat Collings
What do you think is. Isn't discussed enough with. With parenthood, I mean, so much. But if you had to share a thing or two.
- [31:43]
Justine Liu
I think the hormonal shift when you wean. Okay. Are you still breastfeeding?
- [31:50]
Kat Collings
I am. And. But I've. I only heard about this. Whispers of it.
- [31:55]
Justine Liu
I didn't know about it. And basically when I started working again, I was pumping and she was like, drinking off the bottle when I was at work. And my boobs, like, slowly. Not slowly, quickly stopped. Shut down. Okay, great.
- [32:09]
Kat Collings
We're done. Yeah.
- [32:10]
Justine Liu
It was a wild thing that happened. I had, like, crazy anxiety. I, like, felt really out of. I was like, I don't know what's happening. Like, I felt like a different thing than I'd ever felt. Yeah. Sad, anxious. I didn't know what was going on. Like, I was like, what is this? Is this like me going back to work? Is this like a heady thing? Like, what is happening? Because there was no, like, it was like a physical sensation. And my body was like, like totally out of control. And then my brain would go, like, what's going on? Like, it didn't understand. Like, it was like, what's the rational reason behind my body being this, like, weird feeling?
- [32:44]
Kat Collings
Yeah.
- [32:45]
Justine Liu
And so go on this, like, spiral, trying to figure out, like, what am I anxious about? My. My brain would follow my body, and it was terrible.
- [32:52]
Kat Collings
How long did it last, would you say?
- [32:54]
Justine Liu
It went on for about, like, two and a half months.
- [32:58]
Kat Collings
Okay, that's way longer than I.
- [33:00]
Justine Liu
It's long. But I also, like. I mean, people do slow weaning, like, right. Kind of like. And I. Mine just went from, like, 100 to 0. And I didn't have any, like, postpartum depression or anything like that, but this was, like, real, and I didn't know anything about it. And so finally, I kind of just started being, like, open with friends who had had babies about it, and then, like, do you guys know? And they were, like, sending me articles from, like, you know, all kinds of publications, and I was like, oh, this is, like, a thing. And it has been talked about, but it's not really talked about that often. And it really was helpful to know that, like, oh, right, duh. Like, your body's been, like, sustaining, feeding another hormones and person, and now, like, all the hormones that made that happen are gone.
- [33:41]
Kat Collings
And there should be guidance, too, from, like, your. Your doctor, your pediatrician, and my girlfriends.
- [33:45]
Justine Liu
Were ready to talk about it once we talked about it. Right. Right. Yeah.
- [33:48]
Kat Collings
That's long enough to feel like you're like, is this my new normal? Like, is this me?
- [33:51]
Justine Liu
Totally. It was a little bit scary.
- [33:53]
Kat Collings
Yeah.
- [33:53]
Justine Liu
Yeah. And I was working through it, so I was like, yeah, it was kind of a weird experience.
- [33:59]
Kat Collings
Is there, like, a kind of euphoria that comes after the sadness?
- [34:04]
Justine Liu
I mean, I feel great now. I feel really good. I feel like I'm like, everything's kind of even now, and I'm feeling great. And also, like, yeah, I feel, like, more like myself than I felt for that amount of time. I loved. I loved the first stages of being a mom. But I will say, like, I finally am feeling, like, okay. Like, yeah, I'm getting back to myself.
- [34:25]
Kat Collings
A little bit more, a little a handle on things.
- [34:27]
Justine Liu
Yeah, I feel good. So don't worry. It's gonna be okay. I'm like, okay, okay.
- [34:32]
Kat Collings
I'm learning a lot. You mentioned your family. What aspects of your upbringing do you think you would like to, you know, bring to your own parenting?
- [34:40]
Justine Liu
My parents were incredibly playful. My mom was incredibly maternal. Really, like, touchy feely, cuddly. Like, I felt so safe with her. So that's something I really want to give my daughter is, like, the feeling that my mom gave me in of, like, just being, like, a cozy place. They were incredibly supportive, like, always. They encouraged, like, any kind of exploration of any kind of subject that I wanted to go for. So I never had that thing where people are like, you want to be an actor? Like, my parents were, like, always, like, behind me and really available. I think that the thing that I would want to change is I think my parents, they gave every single part of themselves to being parents and, like, never went on a vacation. I never had a babysitter. I had a babysitter one time because I begged my parents to let this lifeguard that I had a crush on be my babysitter for a night. And then I ended up hiding the whole time in my room and, like, didn't even interact with the guy because I was, like, so nervous, actually.
- [35:40]
Kat Collings
Like, I want this man in my house, but I've got to be in a separate room.
- [35:42]
Justine Liu
Totally. I was like, I do want you around, but also I'm, like, terrified. You're so cute. So I think that I want to keep the connection alive, like, the romantic connection alive with my husband. Like, go on dates, like, maybe go out every once in a while. Like, have a little bit more of a sense of my own, like, agency, you know? My mom, like, kind of gave everything to us, and I think that when we grew up, it was, like, a little bit, like, empty nest syndrome extreme because she had just been so committed to us as men.
- [36:14]
Kat Collings
The identity has to totally.
- [36:15]
Justine Liu
So I just. I guess, like, I would prioritize, like, date night in a different way than my parents did and taking some time. For me, it's so nice being with her, but I do feel like it's important to, like, go and have a date. Yeah.
- [36:30]
Kat Collings
Yeah.
- [36:30]
Justine Liu
Like, my therapist was like, go on a date once a week, and you don't talk about the baby the whole time. Hard, hard, hard.
- [36:38]
Nikki
Totally.
- [36:39]
Kat Collings
Yeah. The relationship thing is interesting. Adding a baby to the mix. For me, I was just like, there's a triangle now. And before, it was just, like, this one, one thing. And now the love is, like, moving around, and it's. It's interesting.
- [36:51]
Justine Liu
Are you enjoying it?
- [36:52]
Nikki
I'm like.
- [36:53]
Justine Liu
Like, I'm obsessed with it. Like, I feel like my husband is, like, it's so cool seeing him be this person.
- [37:01]
Kat Collings
Yes.
- [37:02]
Justine Liu
I'm so excited by how good of a dad he is, and I really love, like, the unit. Like, I love feeling like, like, this.
- [37:11]
Kat Collings
Is our little pack.
- [37:11]
Justine Liu
Yeah.
- [37:12]
Kat Collings
Yeah.
- [37:12]
Justine Liu
It's very special. Yeah.
- [37:14]
Kat Collings
Very special. But I do. I think the encouragement to. To also nurture, like, the relationship going.
- [37:20]
Justine Liu
Too sort of, like, always this.
- [37:21]
Kat Collings
Yeah. Is as well. Makes a lot of sense. Totally to your point about the being your own person as well, in addition to a mom. I feel like growing up, I remember my mom, like, it always stuck with me. I'm like, oh, you do? You took an upholstery class. You went and got a bikini wax. For some reason, I knew about that.
- [37:37]
Justine Liu
Your mom? Yeah. And I was like, job bomb.
- [37:39]
Kat Collings
That. For some reason stuck with me that, like, hobbies are good. Like, you know, just doing something for yourself.
- [37:44]
Justine Liu
I think it's so cool. And I, like, had a little bit of a crisis about, like, career and parenting at the very beginning where I was like. Like, I'd been with her for six months straight. I'd been, like, with her for six months straight. And I, like, getting into the woo woo of it all. I went to an astrologer, and I was like, you know, it was like a kind of a therapizing moment. And I was like, I'm like, what do I do? Like, I don't want to miss out on working and, like, expanding in this part of who I am. And also, I'm, like, obsessed with my child, and I really want to be an available mom, and I really want to be present for her and feel like I'm. I'm there. Like, I'm really there. And she basically was like, you're a Gemini. This is Gemini energy. And it's really important, and I think it applies to anyone. I don't know if it's really Gemini or not Gemini, but.
- [38:33]
Kat Collings
But you probably really deeply weigh both sides of the two niches.
- [38:37]
Justine Liu
She was like, you need both.
- [38:38]
Kat Collings
Like, you.
- [38:38]
Justine Liu
Those. Both of those parts are so important, and they're so part of who you are. And, like, you actually need this to be good at this, and you need this to be good at that at this moment in your life. And it was really a liberating realization that, like, their holistic, realized version of myself is the one that can hold both of these things. She was like, you know, just be there when you're there. Like, be really there. Like, don't be over here. Don't be over here. Be like, here. You know, and same goes for that. And you know what? It's like everything else. It's like, I just have to remember that I'm. This is the beginning and that it's a steep learning curve and that, like, in the same way that I had to learn to, like, like, swaddle and burp a baby, I'm now having to learn how to manage these two things, and then it will get more and more comfortable and more and more familiar the longer that I have to do it.
- [39:28]
Kat Collings
That's a good point. What do you hope your child, Ellis sees when. When she looks at you, like, not just as a parent, but as, like, a woman working and pursuing your passion?
- [39:36]
Justine Liu
I hope she sees someone who is kind and who tends to her relationships, and that gives attention to the connections that I have with people in my life. I hope she sees someone who's hardworking, but someone who's, like, also incredibly playful and enjoys fun and the beauty in life. I hope she sees someone who's constantly trying to be a better version of themselves and, like, sees life as an opportunity to just get. Get better at who. Being. Being me and gets better at being a person in the world.
- [40:18]
Kat Collings
Yeah. Is there a moment with. With her recently that maybe it was an ordinary moment, but that kind of, like, touched your heart or melted. Melted you a little bit?
- [40:25]
Justine Liu
A day ago, she was sitting on me, and then she just laid deliberately, like, it felt like a real choice to, like, lay herself on me and wrap her arms around me. And it was like. Like something I'm sure happens all the time when you're a parent, but there was something about, like, me feeling the choice in her, that it wasn't, like, a primal thing of just, like, holding a baby. That. But she was like, I want to hold my mom.
- [40:51]
Kat Collings
Yeah.
- [40:52]
Justine Liu
And it felt like a kid doing it or something like that. It was like a fully realized moment that she had, and that was really cool.
- [40:58]
Kat Collings
Like, I am choosing you, and this is what's.
- [41:01]
Justine Liu
Like, I really want to hold you right now. It was really cool.
- [41:04]
Kat Collings
That's amazing.
- [41:05]
Justine Liu
Yeah.
- [41:05]
Kat Collings
I hope you write it down.
- [41:07]
Justine Liu
Yeah. I'm pretty good about, like, writing these little.
- [41:10]
Kat Collings
Cause it's so. I mean, even just thinking back, it's easy for it to become blurry, I think.
- [41:14]
Justine Liu
Totally. I'm like, I also wrote all these letters to her when I was pregnant, and it's really funny to read them back. All the things that I forgot I was, like, going through. I'm like, wow, that was an experience. Pregnancy. Oh, sure.
- [41:29]
Kat Collings
My last question for you.
- [41:30]
Justine Liu
Okay.
- [41:31]
Kat Collings
When you think about legacy, what feels most important to you to leave behind, you know, both in your work and your family?
- [41:39]
Justine Liu
I think that, honestly, being kind and, like, bringing people joy and levity and connection and feeling like, that I, like, witnessed my friends and I witnessed my husband, and I was, like, there for people that I love and people that I work with and people that I, like, met on the street, that there was, like, a, like a little bit of, like, positive. Yeah, I just want to have positive impact on people. And I don't really think about legacy work wise. I, like, I just. I don't know how to even, like. Like, that's crazy. It's crazy to think about, like, leaving a legacy behind you with work. I guess I just, like, hope that, you know, when I hear stories like your friend who's postpartum and that they want to, like, tune into the show as, like, a way to kind of, like, lighten up their moment or like, there was a show that I was on and I remember my aunt sent me a text saying that her friend had texted while she was in the hospital. And then, like, I watched the show and it just, like, brightened my day. Like, those little things, like, just to bring some sort of an escape or some sort of lightness to people's lives. I think is makes me feel really good.
- [42:46]
Kat Collings
That's beautiful. Well, thank you so much for sitting down with me. This is a treat to talk to a fellow mother and an actress I admire.
- [42:53]
Justine Liu
Thank you so much. Thanks for having me. This is awesome.
- [43:02]
Kat Collings
A huge thank you to actress Justine Liu. Make sure to subscribe to our show wherever you listen to podcasts so you don't miss an episode. And while you're there, I'd also be so grateful if you'd rate and review us. If you have guest suggestions or any other feedback, drop us a line at podcastwhatwear.com or you can find us on social @whowhatwear. See you next week Wednesday on the who what, Where? Podcast. This episode was produced by Hilary Kerr, Summer Hammerhous, and Natalie Thurman. Our production assistant is Raven Yamamoto. Our editor is Ko Takasugi Chernevan. Our audio engineers are at Glen Canyon Audio, and our music is by Jonathan Leah.