The Why Files: Operation Podcast

Episode 611: "CONPLAN 8888: The Secret Plan to Survive the Zombie Apocalypse"

Host: AJ Hacklefish
Date: September 16, 2025

Main Theme & Episode Overview

This episode dives into the real, declassified U.S. military plan known as "CONPLAN 8888," which outlines procedures to defend against a hypothetical zombie apocalypse. Host AJ Hacklefish and the show’s irreverent Sidekick explore the plan’s phases, the scientific plausibility of zombie scenarios, and the broader implications—both tongue-in-cheek and serious—for national preparedness, societal collapse, and popular culture. The episode’s tone is witty but highly researched, blending military analysis, real-world science, and cultural commentary.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Origin & Context of CONPLAN 8888

• CONPLAN 8888 is an actual Pentagon document, drafted by U.S. Strategic Command and released to the public in 2011. It is a detailed, step-by-step strategy for surviving a zombie apocalypse, originally intended as a planning exercise.
  • "The plan that Staff Sergeant Martinez pulled from that cabinet is real. I have a copy of it. You can download it and read it for yourself." (AJ Hacklefish, 01:46)

2. Structure of the Plan: Five Phases

• Phase 0: Shape the Environment (Monitor potential threats; focus on WMDs, outbreaks; communicate with nuclear powers)
• Phase 1: Prevent Initiation (Prevent creation of zombies, reassure foreign powers)
• Phase 2: Seize the Initiative (Assist local authorities, create/enforce quarantine zones)
• Phase 3: Dominate, Respond, Counter (Military retreats to fortified positions for at least 40 days, direct combat with zombies)
  • "US StratCom will shelter all personnel in place for at least 40 days." (Military Document Reader, 04:57)
• Phases 4 & 5: Stabilize and Restore (Recon, assess remaining threat and infrastructure, move towards rebuilding if possible)

3. The Plan’s Brutal Realism for Civilians

• During the crisis’s critical weeks, civilian survival is not the military’s responsibility.
  • "No civilian assistance, no rescue missions, no exceptions. The plan assumes most government officials die within 24 hours. Cities become uninhabitable.” (AJ Hacklefish, 05:50)
• The military’s focus is on its own survival and command continuity.

4. Scientific Realism: Pathogens, Parasites, and Real-World 'Zombies'

• The episode explores real diseases and parasites that influence behavior and could (in theory) create “zombies”:
  • Rabies: Virus causes aggression, foaming; nearly always fatal.
  • Prion diseases: Mad Cow, Kuru—cause aggressive, deteriorating neurological symptoms.
  • Parasites: Jewel wasp and cordyceps fungus manipulate and “zombify” insect hosts.
  • Toxoplasma gondii: Parasitic infection extremely common in humans, subtly changes behavior.
    • "Studies show infected humans take more risks... personality changes, decision making problems, even mental health issues." (AJ Hacklefish, 17:04)

5. Other Theoretical Zombie Classes

• Radiation Zombies (RZs): Created via exposure to EM radiation or nuclear incidents.
  • "A coronal mass ejection could expose entire populations to dangerous radiation." (AJ Hacklefish, 21:25)
• Weaponized Zombies (WZs): Engineered for military use via biotech, gene editing, etc.
• Space Zombies (SZs): Alien microorganisms or toxins arriving via asteroids, cosmic events.
• Evil Magic Zombies (EMZs): Occult-based, immune to conventional or nuclear weapons—requiring, according to the plan, intervention by military chaplains.
  • "The only way to ensure a zombie is dead is to burn the zombie corpse. EMZs are the only class that may not be vulnerable to this measure." (Military Document Reader, 29:42)

6. The Document’s Gaps and Warnings

• USSTRATCOM admits it lacks sufficient resources (supplies, troops) for true zombie defense:
  • "US StratCom forces do not currently hold enough contingency stores, food, water… and US StratCom has no ground combat forces capable of repelling a zombie assault." (Military Document Reader, 31:40)
• Connections to other, classified real-world military contingency plans are clear, though specifics remain hidden.

7. The ‘Psyop’ Hypothesis and Pop Culture Influence

• The host speculates (playfully) that mass pop culture—like "The Walking Dead" and zombie games—acts as subtle social training for preparedness.
  • "Millions of Americans absorbed zombie apocalypse protocols through entertainment. The training was subtle but effective." (AJ Hacklefish, 32:27)
• Ultimately, the host concludes the timing is likely a coincidence, not a coordinated military Psyop.

8. Practical Survival Advice

• The episode closes with real, pragmatic tips for surviving disaster scenarios—zombie-based or otherwise.
  • Get out of cities quickly.
  • Prep supplies in advance: water purification, food, shelter, basic medical, quiet weapons.
  • Build skills (hunting, first aid, defense), and know your community.
  • "When the end of the world comes, the most dangerous thing you’ll face isn’t zombies. It’s other people." (AJ Hacklefish, 42:28)

Memorable Quotes & Moments

• "Whoa, whoa, whoa... Wait, this is a real thing? Army versus zombies?"
  (Co-host, 02:55)
• "Eating the brain helps the spirit reach the afterlife... So how was grandma's funeral? A little chewy. I don't feel so good."
  (Co-host and AJ Hacklefish on Kuru, 11:42–11:57)
• "If you trust a house cat, you deserve to get eat."
  (Co-host, commentary on Toxoplasma gondii, 16:44)
• "The only way to ensure a zombie is dead is to burn the corpse. EMZs are the only class... not vulnerable to this measure. The Chaplain Corps may prove integral."
  (Military Document Reader, 29:42–30:31)
• "But dismissing this as just a joke would be a mistake. Con Plan 8888 connects to real military plans… The real military capabilities stayed hidden."
  (AJ Hacklefish, 46:23)
• "When society collapses, nobody’s coming to save us. We are the first responders. So train like one, prepare like one."
  (AJ Hacklefish, 47:55)
• Repeated dramatic readings and parodies of Vincent Price’s “Thriller” monologue—(Co-host, various timestamps e.g., 35:38, 38:56, 42:14).

Important Segments & Timestamps

| Timestamp | Segment / Topic | |------------|-------------------------------------------------| | 00:46–05:50 | Story intro & CONPLAN 8888’s outline, phases | | 09:37–12:11 | Real diseases & parasites as “zombie” models | | 13:38–17:04 | Toxoplasma gondii, pet-to-human infection risk | | 21:25–23:52 | Radiation, weaponized, and space zombies | | 29:33–31:40 | Evil Magic Zombies, supernatural threats | | 31:40–32:27 | Plan’s logistical failures & lack of resources | | 32:27–35:38 | Civilians as “the secret army,” cultural psyop | | 35:52–38:56 | Step-by-step survival advice | | 42:28–47:55 | Real value of CONPLAN 8888, prepping mindset | | 46:23–47:55 | Conclusion—hidden annexes, actual preparedness |

Tone & Style

The episode is witty, fast-paced, and blends lighthearted banter (including frequent quips about zombie tropes and pop culture) with serious, well-researched analysis. The host maintains a conversational, sometimes conspiratorial tone, but always anchors the discussion in verifiable, documented sources.

Summary Takeaway

While the Pentagon’s "zombie plan" started as an exercise, its depth and seriousness highlight how fragile modern society could be in the face of rapid, catastrophic threats—biological, technological, or otherwise. CONPLAN 8888 may use zombies as placeholders, but the survival lessons, resource gaps, and societal risks apply to real emergencies. The episode insists that preparedness, not panic or fantasy, is our best defense—not just against zombies, but against any societal collapse.

“When society collapses, nobody’s coming to save us. We are the first responders. So train like one, prepare like one. The difference between a life lost and a life saved could be you.”
— AJ Hacklefish (47:55)