613: The UFO Conspiracy That Took Down JFK

Summary

---

Podcast Summary: The Why Files: Operation Podcast

Episode 613: The UFO Conspiracy That Took Down JFK
Date: October 6, 2025
Host: AJ Hecklefish
Co-host/Commentator: [Name not provided, referred to as "Co-host/Commentator"]

---

Episode Overview

This engrossing episode weaves together the infamous Maury Island UFO incident of 1947, shadowy “men in black,” Cold War espionage, and the assassination of President John F. Kennedy. Host AJ Hecklefish, with characteristic wit and depth, explores the provocative theory that UFO secrecy and covert intelligence operations were at the heart of a conspiracy that ended with JFK's death. The episode traverses decades, connecting UFO mysteries, CIA "disruption agents," and the powerful military-industrial complex.

---

Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. The Maury Island UFO Incident (00:46–07:50)

• Incident Recap: In June 1947 near Maury Island, Harold Dahl and his crew witness bizarre donut-shaped UFOs dropping molten metal, damaging their boat, injuring Dahl’s son, and killing his dog. Mysterious figures soon begin to threaten and harass them.
• Men in Black: Dahl is visited in a diner by a stranger in a black suit—possibly history’s first “Man in Black”—who knows personal details and warns him to stay silent (04:26).
• Subsequent Paranoia: After going public, Dahl’s son goes missing, his wife falls ill, and his business is attacked.
• Investigations: Fred Crisman, Dahl’s partner, verifies the debris and UFO presence. Kenneth Arnold, famed for his own “flying saucer” sighting, joins the investigation.

AJ Hecklefish (03:02): “He took photographs. The objects in flight, the debris field, the damaged boat.”

2. Escalation, Cover-Ups, and Mysterious Deaths (07:50–12:15)

• Espionage Concerns: Investigators are bugged, anonymous tips leak their discussions to the media, and suspicions rise of espionage (07:50–08:18).
• Military Tragedy: Two Air Force officers, Davidson and Brown, die when their plane carrying UFO debris crashes. The debris disappears, sparking rumors of sabotage and eyebrow-raising FBI involvement (09:04–10:49).
• Admission or Coercion?: Under mounting pressure, Dahl and Crisman publicly recant, but internal FBI memos claim they did so only to protect themselves (10:54–11:25).
• Loose Ends: Reporter Paul Lance (who revealed facts ahead of official sources) dies suddenly; Dahl vanishes; Crisman is recalled to service.

3. Fred Crisman—Agent of Chaos (12:15–15:01)

• Espionage Credentials: Crisman is revealed to have been a decorated WWII pilot recruited into OSS and CIA, working as a “disruption agent” spreading disinformation and political sabotage (13:22–14:17).
• Boeing, CIA, Political Shifts: Crisman’s convoluted career includes moving large sums of money, running shell companies, and feeding damaging intelligence to political opponents.
• Anti-Kennedy Sentiment: By 1963, Crisman is entrenched in far-right, anti-Castro, anti-communist networks hostile to JFK, who they see as betraying U.S. interests.

AJ Hecklefish (14:24): “By 1963, Chrisman was part of a network of far right, anti communist, anti Castro CIA operatives... Kennedy wasn't a president. He was a traitor.”

4. The JFK Assassination Convergence (15:01–19:22)

• Operation Lancer: The pod refers to JFK’s assassination as a covert operation with roots in defense and intelligence communities (15:01–16:04).
• New Orleans Network: Clay Shaw, Guy Bannister, and Fred Crisman’s connections as plotters are explored; Bannister’s office, pivotal in anti-Castro operations, shares an address (544 Camp Street) with Lee Harvey Oswald (17:55–18:32).

AJ Hecklefish (18:49): “This web of conspiracy ran from Puget Sound to New Orleans to Dallas... 16 years of covert operations spanning UFO cover ups and political assassinations.”

• UFO Disclosure Motive: Kennedy’s efforts to collaborate with the Soviet Union on space and push for UFO transparency become critical motives for the conspiracy (19:22–20:00).

5. JFK’s UFO Memos and Their Fallout (20:00–22:23)

• Declassification Orders: Kennedy orders declassification of UFO intelligence and urges CIA cooperation with NASA and potentially the Soviet Union (20:00–20:52).
• Allen Dulles' Role: The dismissed CIA Director, long involved in UFO cover-ups, interprets JFK's moves as treason (20:52–21:38).

AJ Hecklefish (20:18): “Kennedy even proposed a joint U.S.–Soviet space program to explore the moon together.”

• Military-Industrial Complex: JFK’s defense contracts angered powerful allies, particularly Boeing, with Crisman acting as an intelligence asset.

6. The Conspiratorial Cabal and Oswald’s Role (22:23–23:53)

• Conspiracy Mechanics: The cabal assembles CIA, mobsters, businessmen, all linked by shared ties—Crisman at the center. Lee Harvey Oswald, with relevant military and intelligence experience, is set up as the perfect patsy.
• Oswald’s Background: The pod highlights Oswald’s access to top-secret U-2 spy programs and his mysterious return from the USSR under remarkably smooth circumstances.

AJ Hecklefish (22:23): “Oswald had served as an aviation electronics operator in the Marines... The assassination of John F. Kennedy was a coup designed to protect the biggest secret in human history.”

7. Post-Assassination Cover-ups and Lingering Mysteries (23:53–34:43)

• The Three Tramps: The three so-called “tramps” arrested after JFK’s assassination may themselves be covert operatives, with one possibly being Fred Crisman (23:53–25:59).
• Legal and Historical Challenges: Fred Crisman testifies before the grand jury but is never charged; the web of shell companies, questionable testimony, and connections remain shrouded in ambiguity.

Co-host/Commentator (26:36): “Couldn't prove it? ... What do you need? A signed confession notarized by illicit people.”

• Debunking, Doubt, and Credible Strands: Skeptics counter with mundane explanations (slag, hoax for money), but documents, witness intimidation, and confirmed agent status for key players keep questions alive.
• Declassified Documents: New releases show the CIA obstructed the Warren Commission, withheld evidence, and actively sabotaged the investigation.

AJ Hecklefish (33:09): “The CIA withheld thousands of documents. They were holding them still. Witnesses were ignored. Evidence was suppressed. Declassified files now reveal the CIA actively obstructed the investigation. The COVID up is no longer theory, it's documented fact.”

• Kennedy’s Threat and Legacy: JFK’s vow to “splinter the CIA into a thousand pieces” and push for space transparency is positioned as the conspiracy’s true catalyst.
• Final Reflection: While elements of the Maury Island case may be debunked, the links between the events, the overlapping personnel, and the CIA’s documented secrecy make the question of conspiracy credible, if not fully provable.

AJ Hecklefish (34:43): “The UFO might have been a hoax, but the conspiracy it exposed is real. The COVID up didn't end in 1963. The same agencies that probably killed Kennedy still operate with the same secrecy.”

---

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the Men in Black:
  “The stranger in black sat across from Harold at a diner in Tacoma. He ordered breakfast, but he. He never touched it.” (04:18–04:32 | AJ Hecklefish)
• On the intersecting fates:
  “The same people who investigated UFO cases in 1947 show up in the JFK assassination 16 years later. Guy Bannister, Fred Chrisman, Allen Dulles.” (33:09–34:04 | AJ Hecklefish)
• On evidence and denial:
  “Harold didn’t admit to a hoax. He only said he would call it a hoax to avoid trouble. He’d rather be known as a liar than someone who saw a ufo.” (11:15–11:25 | AJ Hecklefish, FBI memo)
• On the legal process:
  “That’s not how the legal system works.” (26:45 | AJ Hecklefish)
• On real danger:
  “America's most dangerous enemy isn't Russia or China or Iran. It's the CIA.” (34:43 | AJ Hecklefish)

---

Important Segment Timestamps

| Segment | Timestamp | |---------------------------------------------|:-------------:| | Maury Island Incident Detailed Account | 00:46–07:50 | | Espionage and Military Crash | 07:50–12:15 | | Fred Crisman's Covert Background | 12:15–15:01 | | Operation Lancer and New Orleans Links | 15:01–19:22 | | JFK’s UFO Disclosure Push | 20:00–21:38 | | Military-Industrial Complex Ties | 21:38–22:23 | | Setting up Lee Harvey Oswald | 22:23–23:43 | | The Three Tramps, Grand Jury, Cover-ups | 23:53–26:58 | | Doubts, Skepticism, and Declassification | 28:10–34:14 | | Final Analysis and Reflection | 34:14–End |

---

Conclusion

Ep 613 of The Why Files is a meticulously researched, wryly narrated journey through some of America’s darkest mysteries. It interlaces the UFO lore of the Maury Island case with the machinations of disinformation agents and the “deep state” surrounding the JFK assassination. While the podcast doesn’t land on definitive answers, it skillfully lays out documented facts, speculative links, and the unresolved enigma at the heart of modern American conspiracy: Did UFO secrecy play a role in JFK’s murder, and are those same forces still protecting their secrets today?

---

For those interested in both UFO history and the JFK assassination, this episode provides a captivating, skeptical-yet-open-minded analysis, blending entertainment with thought-provoking content.

Transcript

[AJ Hecklefish]

Upgrade your laundry routine with a durable and reliable Maytag laundry pair at Lowes. Like the new Maytag washer and dryer with performance enhanced stain fighting power designed to cut through serious dirt and grime.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

And what's great is this laundry pair.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Is in stock and ready for delivery when you need it the most.

[Musical Performer]

Don't miss out. Shop Maytag in store or online today at Lowe's.

[AJ Hecklefish]

June 1947. Boat captain Harold Dahl watched a formation of UFOs drop molten metal over Puget Sound. The debris wrecked his boat, burned his son and killed his dog. Then terrible things started to happen to Dahl. Beginning with a visit from a mysterious stranger in a black suit. Over the next 15 years, about a dozen people connected to this UFO sighting died mysteriously. Investigators, military officers, journalists. But the most dramatic death of all. John F. Kennedy. On June 21, 1947, Harold Dahl was patrolling around Maury island with his 15 year old old son Charles, a crewman and his dog Sparky. They were looking for straight timber that had fallen off of boats. Timber companies paid for any logs returned to them around two that afternoon. Charles pointed at the sky. Six donut shaped objects hovered about 2,000ft above the water. Harold cut the engine. The objects made no sound. Each was about 100ft wide with a hole in the center. They looked like massive metallic tires with portholes around the outer rim. Five of the objects floated in a circle around the sixth, which was losing altitude and moving radically.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Was my ex wife driving? No, because swerving out of control, leaking fluids and ruining vacations. That's her speciality.

[AJ Hecklefish]

She wasn't driving. The craft was directly over the boat, maybe 500ft above them. Harold could see into it through the windows.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Did he see my ex wife in here?

[AJ Hecklefish]

No. Do you want to hear about the UFOs or not?

[Co-host/Commentator]

Sorry, Sorry. I'm still harboring a little resentment. Go ahead.

[AJ Hecklefish]

The wobble got worse. Then there was a deep but harsh crack. Then the craft started dumping material. Thousands of strips of thin metal rained down like confetti. Then came the heavy stuff. White hot liquid metal. The hot metal hissed when it hit the water. Then heavy pieces slammed into the boat. Some the size of a baseball, but some as big as tires. Charles screamed when a piece burned through his shirt. Another hit their dog, Sparky, killing him instantly.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Oh, that's too bad. They should have brought their kid.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Stop it. Harold tried the radio, but the equipment was dead. Harold had seen enough. He fired up the engine and ran the boat onto the beach. They hid in the trees and watched. The damaged craft rose and rejoined the formation. All six accelerated toward the open ocean. The encounter lasted about 20 minutes. Harold said maybe 20 tons of material had fallen from the craft. He took photographs. The objects in flight, the debris field, the damaged boat. That night, he met his business partner, Fred Christman, who doubted the story. The next morning, Chrisman sailed to Maury island to see for himself. He found the debris exactly where Harold said it would be, covering the beach for hundreds of yards. Some pieces were still warm. Then he looked up. One of the craft hovered silently for five minutes before vanishing. He had the proof. Photographs, physical evidence. And now his own sighting. Later that day, a stranger arrived at Dahl's door. Black suit, black hat, brand new Buick with no plates. And somehow, this man knew every detail about the event. Harold Dahl had just met history's first man in black. The stranger in black sat across from Harold at a diner in Tacoma. He ordered breakfast, but he. He never touched it.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Yeah, that's a power move. Men in black art is intimidating when they're eating waffles.

[AJ Hecklefish]

He already knew Harold's name, the names of his wife and son. He knew everything about the incident. The craft, the debris, Charles, burned arm. He knew about Sparky. He even knew that Harold was hiding on the island, watching the craft. The stranger told Harold to keep quiet or bad things might happen to him and his family. Harold ignored the warning. He talked to family, friends, even the press. And the next day, the story hit the papers. Then the tragedy started. Charles vanished. Weeks later, he was found in Montana bussing tables with no memory of who he was or how he got there. And a few days later, he was hit by a car. Then Harold's wife became suddenly ill. His business was vandalized. His family was constantly threatened. Harold got the message. But Fred Christman wouldn't stay quiet. He contacted Ray Palmer, editor of Amazing Stories magazine that covered the paranormal and UFOs and science fiction. Palmer asked Kenneth Arnold to investigate. Arnold was a pilot and deputy field marshal. He became famous for his own UFO sighting near Mount Rainier just three days after the Maury island incident. Arnold described the objects as moving, like saucers skipping across water. Reporters called them flying saucers, and the name stuck. There were so many sightings of UFOs in the area during this time that it was called the Summer of Saucers. And remember, Roswell would happen just a few weeks later. Arnold flew to Tacoma on July 29th with United Airlines Captain E.J. smith. Smith had also seen UFOs that summer. They met Harold and Christman at the Winthrop Hotel and examined the debris. The medal looked ordinary, but Arnold still found the story compelling. Late that night, just as Kenneth Arnold and E.J. smith were getting ready for bed, the phone rang. This message is sponsored by Greenlight. Some things about growing up are universal, like getting your first bit of money and immediately blowing it on candy with no clue how to save or invest. Managing money takes experience, and that's exactly what Greenlight helps kids build. Greenlight is a debit card and money app made for families. Parents can send money easily, monitor spending and set flexible controls while kids and teens get real world experience managing money. The app even has a chores feature where you can tie allowance to actual responsibilities. It's a great system for teaching the value of money and keeping the house running. Greenlight is the easy, convenient way for parents to raise financially smart kids and families to navigate life together. Maybe that's why millions of parents trust and kids love learning about money on Greenlight, the number one family finance and safety app. Don't wait to teach your kids real world money skills. Start your risk free Greenlight trial [e-mail] thewifiles that's greenlight.com thewifiles to get started greenlight.com thewhyfiles the man on the other end of the call was Ted Morello, a reporter from United Press International. Morello said an anonymous source was feeding him every detail of their private conversations. Names, times, even the UFO description. Morello wanted more information.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

Look, Arnold, all I'm saying is I'm going to get the information. I'd rather get it directly from the source.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Captain Smith grabbed the phone, shouted a few obscenities and hung up. At first they blew it off. But after thinking about it, they became concerned that they might be caught up in an espionage plot. They started to panic. They swept the room for bugs, but they didn't find any. But later it was discovered that the intercom in the room is had been converted into a microphone. Someone was listening.

[Co-host/Commentator]

How do they know which room to book?

[AJ Hecklefish]

Well, when Arnold got to Tacoma, all the hotels were booked. But for some reason, the WINFREP had a room registered in his name. Arnold assumed Ray Palmer had bought him his room. He didn't. The next morning, he called two military intelligence officers he trusted. Captain William Davidson and Lieutenant Frank Brown. They specialized in UFO cases. They arrived two days later. When Arnold told them about the room being bugged, they weren't worried about it. This didn't help Kenneth Arnold's growing paranoia. Harold refused to speak with military intelligence, but Chrisman was excited to he relayed every detail of the story. The meeting lasted for hours and before he left, Chrisman gave the officers 30 pieces of metallic debris in a cornflakes box.

[Co-host/Commentator]

I hope alien metal doesn't get soggy. And milk.

[AJ Hecklefish]

The officers left after midnight with the UFO samples. Their B25 flew out of McCord Air Base at 1:30am Two hours later, the plane went down. Two hours into the flight, the B25's left engine caught fire. Davidson tried to stabilize the aircraft and Brown ordered the two crewmen to strap on parachutes and bail. They landed safely. Investigators did not. The bomber crashed near Kelso, Washington. Davidson and Brown died on impact. Their bodies were recovered, but the UFO debris was gone. And nobody knows what happened to the evidence, but some think it was taken by the FBI. The FBI was quietly following the Maury island incident. They quietly followed all UFO reports. In July 1947, the FBI investigated a UFO case in Twin Falls, Idaho. A crash disk was found and turned over to Special Agent Guy Bannister.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Yeah. He said wait for it. Okay.

[AJ Hecklefish]

All of this is documented in FBI files labeled security matter X. SMX for short. The FBI's real X files. They dealt with strange cases, UFOs, unexplained phenomena. Things that they couldn't acknowledge to the public. Researchers were aware of the X Files, but the FBI didn't discuss it. They weren't officially declassified until just a few weeks before. I wrote this. The Moray Island UFO incident attracted the attention of FBI Director J. Edgar Hoover. Reporting for the Tacoma Times, Paul Lance released the names of the officers killed before the military announced them. He also reported that an anonymous source told him the plane was shot down with a 20 millimeter cannon.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Who shot it down?

[AJ Hecklefish]

Well, the official report is that the left engine had a mechanical failure.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Yeah. Cannon sized hole, dude.

[AJ Hecklefish]

It's FBI agents interviewed Harold and Fred and the pressure was getting intense. Two Air Force officers were dead and the press was calling it sabotage. Harold wanted out. After retelling his story, he finally admitted there were no UFOs. Fred Crisman also said it was just a joke. J. Edgar Hoover told the agents to close the case, but Special Agent Jack Wilcox corrected Hoover. We have the memo Wilcox wrote. The doll didn't admit to a hoax. He only said he would call it a hoax to avoid trouble. He'd rather be known as a liar than someone who saw a ufo. Privately, he still said the story was true. And so did Christman. Soon after the investigation, Paul Lance, the reporter, died of sudden meningitis at age 29 doctors never found the cause. The Tacoma Times folded a year later. Fred Crisman was recalled to military service and sent to Alaska. Harold Dahl disappeared from Tacoma. Someone was tying up loose ends. But Fred Crispin would resurface in Dallas 16 years later when he was photographed near the grassy knoll in Dealey Plaza during a presidential motorcade.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Holy shit.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Fred Chrisman wasn't just the harbor patrolman who witnessed something strange over Puget Sound. Years later, classified documents revealed there was much more to his story.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

Pacifight Experimental. Nobody knows what those words mean, but that's what they mean. Pacif will serve the forces of freedom and will be the number one airplane in the world today. There's been a good deal of discussion of the long and hard fought competition to win the TFX contract. But very little discussion about what this plane will do.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Crispin was a decorated fighter pilot who flew 211 combat missions in World War II. In 1942, he was recruited by the Office of Strategic Services, the oss. After the war, the OSS became the CIA and Chrisman went with them. The easy papers exposed his real job. Career disruption agent. He monitored targets and fed them disinformation.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

Chrisman has served many years as an active agent for the old OSS and later the CIA. He is rated an extended agent. He is an information specialist and highly trained in internal security. He has worked overseas and has served as a regular United States Air Force officer. But his primary training has always been slanted in the direction of disruption work inside the borders of the United States.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Chrisman ran businesses that existed only on paper. No goods, no services, no employees. In 1966, FBI informants tracked him moving $100,000 in cash to California. The FBI looked the other way. Then there was his political work. He gathered intelligence on American politicians and submitted more than 1,000 reports to the CIA. He fed damaging information to political opponents.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Now this guy sounds like Christopher Steele.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Ah, what's our rule?

[Co-host/Commentator]

Yeah, yeah, I know. We don't joke about the Clintons.

[AJ Hecklefish]

I know. By 1963, Chrisman was part of a network of far right, anti communist, anti Castro CIA operatives. But this network had a problem. John F. Kennedy wanted to dismantle the CIA and make peace with the Soviet Union. To people like Chrisman, Kennedy wasn't a president. He was a traitor. A group of men with deep ties to the government, military and intelligence community decided JFK had to go.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

Yeah, pack your bags. Operation Lancer is a go.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Understood.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

With a combined military civilian defense payroll of well over a billion dollars. I don't recite these for any partisan purpose. They're the result of American determination to be second to none. And as a result of the efforts that this country has made in the last three years, we are second to none. In the past three years we have increased the defense budget of the United states by over 20%. Increased the program of acquis. From Dallas, Texas. The flash, apparently official. President Kennedy died at 1:00pm Central Standard Time, 2:00 Eastern Standard Time, some 38 minutes ago.

[AJ Hecklefish]

New Orleans was chosen for planning. It was close to Latin America and Cuba and local authorities were infamous for being on the take. And the city was full of anti communist operatives. Clay Shaw was a New Orleans businessman connected to two CIA front companies. He provided cash and intelligence while maintaining his cover as a respected community leader. Shaw denied CIA involvement, but years later the Agency admitted he was a valuable asset. In 1967, New Orleans DA Jim Garrison launched the only criminal investigation into JFK's murder. Shaw was charged and arrested. His first call after arrest, Fred Chrisman. Chrisman made repeated trips to New Orleans and Dallas in 1963. Some suspected he was one of the shooters at Dealey Plaza. Then there was Guy Bannister, the FBI agent who investigated UFO crashes in 1947. Batister coordinated with military intelligence during the Maury island investigation. Fred Crisman is thought to be the anonymous source feeding him information. After leaving the FBI, Bannister became a private investigator in New Orleans. But he wasn't running a typical PI business. Witnesses saw crates of military grade weapons moving through the building. And Fred Christman's trips to New Orleans that year weren't vacations. Witnesses saw him at Bannister's office multiple times, meeting with other conspirators. Some say he delivered cash, others say he delivered something else. Documents from the Maury island investigation, reports about a UFO crash and debris that didn't match any known aircraft. Banister's office was the primary hub for plotting against Kennedy. Now this might sound unlikely, but the conspirators overlooked one detail that connected them all. Bannister's detective agency was located at 531 Lafayette street in New Orleans. But the building sat on a corner. It had another Entrance, another address. 544 Camp Street. Now this address is important because it was the home base of the most famous conspirator of all. Lee Harvey Oswald. Hey, this is Sarah. Look, I'm standing out front of a.m. p.m. Right now and well, you're sweet and all, but I found something more fulfilling, even kind of cheesy. But I like it. Sure, you met some of my dietary needs but they've just got it all. So farewell, oatmeal. So long, you strange soggy.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

Break up with bland breakfast and taste.

[AJ Hecklefish]

AM PM's bacon, egg and cheese biscuit made with cage free eggs, smoked bacon.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

And melty cheese on a buttery biscuit.

[AJ Hecklefish]

AM P M. Too much.

[Musical Performer]

Good stuff.

[AJ Hecklefish]

This web of conspiracy ran from Puget Sound to New Orleans to Dallas. 16 years of covert operations spanning UFO cover ups and political assassinations. And the COVID operators had a motive powerful enough to kill a president. President Kennedy engaged in secret peace talks with Soviet Premier Nikita Khrushchev. They discussed cooperation, not confrontation. They talked about ending the Cold War. Kennedy even proposed a joint U.S. soviet space program to explore the moon together.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Oh, the Russians would have liked the weather in Burbank when they filmed.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Not now, please. To prove his commitment to peace, Kennedy made a gesture of ultimate trust. He decided to reveal America's most protected.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Secret why hot dogs come in packs at 10, but buns only come in packs of eight.

[AJ Hecklefish]

No.

[Co-host/Commentator]

How to fold the fitted sheet.

[AJ Hecklefish]

No.

[Co-host/Commentator]

What's really in a McRib?

[AJ Hecklefish]

No. He wanted to declassify all UFO files. On November 12, 1963, just 10 days before his death, Kennedy issued two memos. The first was National Security Action Memorandum 271.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

I have initiated a program for the orderly declassification of all UFO intelligence files affecting national security. I have instructed the CIA director to prepare a program for the sharing of this data with NASA where it can be put to use in the context of the space and lunar exploration program.

[AJ Hecklefish]

The second memo was classified top secret. Kennedy sent it directly to the director of the CIA.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

Furthermore, I have requested that the CIA develop a program of substantive cooperation with the Soviet Union in the field of outer space, including the development of specific technical proposals. I have asked that the CIA work closely with the Department of State and other agencies as appropriate in developing this program. Foreign.

[AJ Hecklefish]

CIA Director Allen Dulles, who Kennedy had fired after the Bad Pigs disaster. This wasn't diplomacy. It was treason. Dulles had overseen the UFO cover up since 1947. He'd investigated the Maury island incident. He knew what technology the government had recovered from alien craft. Kennedy was demanding access to the biggest secret in human history. And he planned to share it with America's enemy. Ending the Cold War might be good for humanity, but it was bad for business. The defense industry was already furious with John F. Kennedy. He awarded the largest defense deal in history to General Dynamics. Everyone expected it to go to Boeing. The cornerstone of the Military industrial complex. But because of jfk, Boeing and its network of powerful allies had just lost a fortune.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Especially on of people in Congress who bought Boeing stock ahead of the announcement.

[AJ Hecklefish]

No doubt about that. Jim Garrison did some more digging. He found that Boeing used to have an employee they called a chaos agent. The man allegedly committed corporate espionage. He spread disinformation. He even killed people on behalf of the company. And that chaos agent was Fred Chrisman.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

Chrisman is a former employee of the Boeing Company. In intelligence terminology, this ordinarily means that the connection still exists, but that the former employee has moved into an underground operation. Chrisman has been engaged in undercover activity for a part of the industrial warfare complex for years.

[AJ Hecklefish]

The Cabal assembled the team. CIA operatives, mobsters, Cuban exiles, businessmen like Clay Shaw brought in locals like David Ferry and Guy Bannister. And the man nobody talks about, but who shows up everywhere is Fred Chrisman. The network that silenced Harold Dahl was activated again. But this time they needed someone to take the fall. Someone with the perfect background to be blamed. And that man was Lee Harvey Oswald. Oswald had served as an aviation electronics operator in the Marines. In 1957, he was stationed at Naval Air Facility Atsugi in Japan. One of the most secret bases in the world. Home of the U2 spy plane program developed at Area 51. Oswald worked on the radar systems. With crypto clearance. He tracked U2 flights. He knew their flight patterns, altitudes and capabilities. And two years after Oswald left Atsugi, the Soviets shot down a U2 over Russia. The man accused of killing the President had direct access to America's most sensitive technology. And somehow the Soviets got that same information. The assassination of John F. Kennedy was a coup designed to protect the biggest secret in human history. We were just weeks away from ending the Cold war and full UFO disclosure, but.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

But all of that ended on 22 November 1963.

[AJ Hecklefish]

In 1969, a photograph surfaced. Three men being arrested behind the grassy knoll at Dealey Plaza minutes after Kennedy's assassination. They're known as the three Hobos or the three tramps. But these men don't look like hobos. Clean clothes, well fed, fresh shaves. Jim Garrison believed they were intelligence operatives, part of the plot to kill jfk. Possibly even the shooters. Researchers spent decades trying to identify them. Some say E. Howard Hunt and Frank Sturgess, both intelligence operatives. Both part of the Watergate break in team. The White House plumbers. Woody Harrelson's father, Charles Harrelson was a contract killer. Forensic analysis matched him to the youngest tramp career criminal Chauncey Marvin Holt claimed he worked for the CIA on multiple operations. The Bay of Pigs invasion targeting Communist leaders. He said the CIA sent him to Dallas. And look at tramp number three. The older man with the hat that looks like Fred Chrisman. But nobody knows for sure. Dallas police didn't cooperate with early investigations. They finally released their records in 1989. They identified the tramps as John Gedney, Gus Abrams and Harold Doyle. When spoken with a Texas accent, Harold Doyle sounds like Harold Dahl. These photographs weren't discovered for four years. Private researcher Richard Sprague found them buried in newspaper archives. By then, the men had vanished. Garrison subpoenaed fred Crisman on October 31, 1968. Remember when Clayshaw was arrested, he made one phone call. Not to his lawyer, not to family, to Fred Chrisman. Chrisman testified for about an hour before the grand jury. His testimony doesn't match reality. He said he'd never been to New Orleans before 1970, 1966. But records show multiple trips in the early 1960s. He said he didn't know Clayshaw or Guy Bannister. Multiple witnesses place him in Bannister's office. Chrisman did admit to knowing Thomas Beckham, a local entertainer and anti Castro activist. When pressed about their relationship, Crispin said he was helping Beckham get into the record business.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Yeah, he was gonna help him make a few hits. See what I did there?

[AJ Hecklefish]

Very clever. But Beckham was also filing documents for anti Castro operations and handling money for Guy Bannister's network. In 1966, Chrisman and Beckham incorporated seven businesses in Olympia, Washington, most of them shell companies. Beckham testified that he visited Bannister's office all the time. Frank Crisman said he knew nothing about that. Garrison believed one of the bullets that hit Kennedy came from the fence behind the grassy knoll. And he believed Fred Crisman pulled the trigger. But he couldn't prove it.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Couldn't prove it? The guy's connected to CIA UFOs and a guy who got the first phone call. What do you need? A signed confession notarized by illicit people.

[AJ Hecklefish]

That's not how the legal system works.

[Co-host/Commentator]

The legal system, that's what they want you to believe. The real system involves secret handshakes, LSD and making sure your star witness doesn't accidentally fall out a window.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Christman was dismissed and never charged. Clay Shaw was found not guilty. But Garrison never stopped believing that. For some reason, a man who witnessed the ufo crash in 1947, a man with deep ties to the intelligence community And a man who is openly and loudly, extremely far right and anti communist was on the grassy knoll at Dealey Plaza on November 22, 1963. This isn't supposed to be a JFK video. I've tried to stick with Fred Chrisman and the Maury island ufo. If you want a deeper dive on jfk, let me know. There's plenty there. The claim is that the assassination of JFK wasn't just political. It was an operation to protect the biggest secret in human history. The discovery and reverse engineering of UFOs and rabbit holes don't get much deeper than this. So what's true? Well, 60 years later, some facts are documented, others remain speculation. The debris allegedly on the B25 disappeared. Skeptics say the metallic rocks were industrial slag from a nearby smelting company.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Piece is a ufo? Is industrial slag. That's like calling a Faberge egg a chicken rock.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Skeptics also point out that after Kenneth Arnold saw his flying saucers near Mount Rainier, UFO sightings exploded across the country. Now, Dahl and Chrisman might have been lying for money trying to get their story published. Chrisman did have a letter published in Harper's magazine in 1946 where he described battling creatures in an underground cave. He published a second letter in amazing stories in May 1947, two months before the Maury island incident. Fred Chrisman does have connections to the JFK assassination, but the evidence is circumstantial. Jim Garrison was criticized for making connections without hard evidence, relying mostly on witness statements. The House Select Committee on Assassinations said there was likely a conspiracy. They never confirmed Crisman's involvement. And the photograph allegedly showing him near Dealey Plaza is grainy. It looks like Crisman to me, but it's hard to be sure. To this day, nobody knows for sure who they are. The plane crash happened. That's documented. But the military said it had nothing to do with the Maury island investigation.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Oh, the military said so. Well, pack it up, everyone. The military never lies. Case closed.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Lee Harvey Oswald did work on the YouTube program at Itsugi base in Japan, but thousands of people did. Thousands of people had clearance for classified programs. It doesn't prove that he was part of a UFO cover up. But some facts won't go away. In 1959, Lee Harvey Oswald defected to the Soviet Union. He renounced his citizenship and said he'd provide military secrets, which we know he had. He found a job. He met his future wife, Marina. Then in 1961, he came back. And typically when a defector wants to return from the Soviet Union, they face intense scrutiny. They have to negotiate with both governments. It's a long, difficult process. Permission isn't always granted. But Lee Harvey Oswald came back with no problem. The US State Department even loaned him the money. They provided his wife with a visa.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Ah, the old secret agent welcome home package. Comes with a loan, a wife and an alibi. Nice work, if you can get it.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Oh, there's more.

[Co-host/Commentator]

There always is.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Special Agent Jack Wilcox's memo to J. Edgar Hoover directly contradicts the official narrative. Remember, Wilcox reported that Dahl didn't actually admit to a hoax. He said Dahl would call it a hoax to avoid trouble, but privately insisted the story was true. And this is in declassified FBI files. Crisman also said the UFO sighting was real. He said so in 1967. To UFO researcher Gary Leslie.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

I will tell you this much. The Maury island incident was no hoax. The FBI and the Air Force know it was no hoax. The pieces of the UFO that are still in our possession have proven that it was no hoax. Most of you play games. Make a silly hobby out of a matter that should scare you to death. I have little patience with most of your organizations.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Fred Crispin's CIA involvement is confirmed in the easy papers. He was a career disruption agent who ran disinformation operations inside the United States. Guy Bannister investigated the Maury Island UFO case for the FBI. He operated out of 544 Camp street in New Orleans. Lee Harvey Oswald worked at that same address. This connection is documented. Kennedy's November 12, 1963 memos are real. He requested cooperation with the Soviet Union on space exploration. He demanded access to UFO files 10 days before his assassination. Allen Dulles, who Kennedy fired, was appointed to the Warren Commission investigating his death. And nobody can explain why. Allen Dulles, who despised the President, was put on that commission. And publicly. Attorney General Robert Kennedy accepted the Warren Commission Report. But according to his son, RFK Jr. He privately called it a shoddy piece of craftsmanship.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Shoddy? That's an insult to shoddy craftsmen everywhere.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

There's a 60 year cover up, you know. The Warren Commission was run by Alan Dulles, who was the head of the CIA, who my uncle fired. Congress found that. Yeah, it was a plot. It was a conspiracy. There were multiple people involved. Oh, it was my father's first instinct that the agency had killed his brother.

[AJ Hecklefish]

And we all know it happened to rfk.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

Senior Kennedy has been shot. Is that possible? Senator Robert Francis Kennedy died at 1:44am Today, June 6, 1968, the Warren Commission's.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Investigation was deliberately incomplete. The CIA withheld thousands of documents. They were holding them still. Witnesses were ignored. Evidence was suppressed. Declassified files now reveal the CIA actively obstructed the investigation. The COVID up is no longer theory, it's documented fact. Kennedy awarded a major defense contract to General Dynamics instead of Boeing. This cost the military industrial complex billions. Fred Christman worked for Boeing. The biggest mystery isn't whether UFOs dropped debris over Puget Sound. It's the connections that followed. The same people who investigated UFO cases in 1947 show up in the JFK assassination 16 years later. Guy Bannister, Fred Chrisman, Allen Dulles. Same addresses, same witness intimidation, same classified operations. Now maybe Harold Dahl made up the UFO story. Maybe the plane crash was mechanical failure. And maybe every connection is a coincidence.

[Co-host/Commentator]

No such thing as a coincidence. That's like finding out your proctologist in your dentist's shared office. Something stinks and it take the fluoride.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Kennedy did demand UFO disclosure. He planned to share classified information with the Soviet Union. Two years earlier, Kennedy laid out his vision for space.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

Now it is time to take longer strides. Time for a great new American enterprise. Time for this nation to take a clearly leading role in space achievement which in many ways may hold the key to our future on earth.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Kennedy threatened the military industrial complex. And about the CIA. He said, I will splinter the CIA into a thousand pieces and scatter it to the wind. Ten days after demanding access to the UFO files, he was dead. The UFO might have been a hoax, but the conspiracy it exposed is real. The COVID up didn't end in 1963. The same agencies that probably killed Kennedy still operate with the same secrecy. The same classification systems still hide the truth. The CIA says they're protecting America from its enemies. But the more you look, the more you realize they're protecting themselves. America's most dangerous enemy isn't Russia or China or Iran. It's the CIA. Thanks so much for hanging out with us today. My name is A.J. you know Hecklefish, I'm just a patsy. This has been the Wide Files. If you had fun, learned anything, do us a favor. Hit like subscribe, comment, share. I'm told that's stuff still helps the algorithm, but who really knows? Like most topics we cover on this channel, today's was recommended by you. By a lot of you. So if there's a story you'd like to see or learn more about, go to the y files.com tips or just email us at team the y files.com and remember, the why Files is also a podcast. You can take us on the road twice a week. I post deep dives into the stories we cover here, and I also post episodes that are a little too hot for YouTube. Anyway, it's called, wait for it, the Y Files Operation Podcast, and it's available everywhere you get your podcasts. And if you are listening on a podcast platform, do us a favor. Hit like, follow thumbs up, whatever those buttons are. That stuff actually really does help out. Now, if you need more Y Files in your life, you may want to adjust your medication. No, I'm kidding. You could check out our Discord server. I think we're over 80 members over there, so 24. Seven, there's someone on Discord. They're talking about the same geeky, weird stuff we talk about here. It's a great community. It's a lot of fun, it's really supportive, and it's free to join. Now, speaking of 24. 7, check out our 24. 7 live stream on the Y Files backstage over there. We run episodes back to back with a lot of unique, fun content in between. And I pop in there sometimes, say hello, and you never know when you're going to get hit with a free membership. We drop a lot of fun stuff in there. You know what? Now that I think about it, the videos are fine, but it's the live chat that's a lot of fun. If you want to follow what's going on with the Y Files, you can check out our production calendar. It's at the y files.com cal there you can find our episode schedule, upcoming podcasts, live streams, all that stuff. Special thanks to our patron who made this episode happen and made the whole channel possible. Everything on the Y Files is dedicated to our Patreon members. I could not do this without you, and I appreciate you sticking with me through the hard times. If you've been with this channel for a while, you remember those. But I'm back almost. And if you'd like to support the channel, keep us going and join this amazing community. Become a member on Patreon for as little as $3 a month. You get access to all kinds of perks. You get to see videos and podcasts early with no commercials, exclusive merch only available to Patreon members, plus two private live streams every week, all just for you. And the whole Y Files team is on the stream. So there's my big fat faces on there. And you can see Victoria, Jen, Gino. Everybody's there. And you can turn your webcam on Jump up on stage, ask a question, tell a joke. If you want to learn more about a topic or suggest a topic, it's a great way to use who engage with us and get to know us as people because we are allegedly. Another great way to support the channel is grab something from the WI Fi store.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Grab the heck of his T shirt. Oh, one of these fist of a coffee mugs you can stick your fist in, but if it gets stuck, don't, don't call me. Go to the emergency room. I claim no responsibility for your fist. Or get a hoodie or shut my face on it. Or get one of these adorable squeezy animal talking. Look how cute he is. One of these chunky deltoids.

[AJ Hecklefish]

But if you're going to buy merch, make sure you become a member on YouTube. I know, hear me out. YouTube members get 10% off everything in the Y file store and it's only $3 a month. So if you're going to spend $40 on t shirts or fistable coffee mugs, if you become a member on YouTube, you get the coupon code. It pays for itself. And look, if you want to cancel after you shop on the store, that's totally fine. The membership is there to save you money, not make me money. In fact, all the money from YouTube memberships goes to my great team.

[Co-host/Commentator]

Yeah, but keep that. Keep that a little secret between us.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Those are the plugs. I didn't add any more this week, did I? I got some more coming though. Some more plugs are in the works, so that's going to do it. Until next time, be safe, be kind, and know that you are appreciated.

[Musical Performer]

I played Polybius in Area 51 a secret code inside the Bible said I.

[Narrator/Guest Speaker]

Was.

[Musical Performer]

I love my UFO and paranormal fun as well as music so I'm singing like I should but then another conspiracy theory becomes the truth my friends and it never ends no, it never ends I feel the crab cat and got stuck inside mel's home with mk outrun I feel only 2 aware.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Did.

[Musical Performer]

Stanley Kubrick fake the moon landing alone on a film set or were the shadow people there? The Roswell aliens just fought the smiling man I'm told and his name was cold I can't believe I'm dancing with the fish Head of fish on Thursday night Swing they all through the night all it was to just hear the truth so the W balls on my feet all through the night the madman sightings and the solar storm still come to Agatha the secret city underground.

[AJ Hecklefish]

Mysterious.

[Musical Performer]

Number stations Planet Surf O2 Project Station Dark gave and what? The Dark Watchers Foundation. Don't you worry though the Black Knight satellite So I can't believe I'm dancing with the fish handle fish on Thursday night with a J2 and the weapon up to the All I ever wanted was to just hear the truth of weapons on my feet all through the night Love to dance on the dance floor because she is a camel and camels love to dance when the feeling is right Always in time.