THEMOVE+ — "Can Isaac Del Toro & Tadej Pogačar Co-Exist at UAE?"

Date: October 17, 2025
Host: Spencer Martin
Co-Host: Johan Bruyneel
Special Focus: The rise of Isaac Del Toro, UAE Team Emirates’ dominance, rider transfers, team politics, and a lively Q&A session.

Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the explosive rise of Isaac Del Toro and what his emergence means for UAE Team Emirates and Team-leader Tadej Pogačar. The hosts, Spencer Martin and Johan Bruyneel, offer inside knowledge on the World Tour’s most surprising results, unravel the implications of team mergers and dissolutions, analyze quirky aspects of the sport’s administration, and take on burning audience questions. The conversation covers not just current racing but the mechanics and politics shaping the future of professional cycling.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Isaac Del Toro’s Meteoric Rise and UAE’s Historic Season

• Del Toro’s 16th Win: Johan highlights Del Toro’s “unstoppable” form and how it contributed to UAE's 95-win season, breaking historical records (00:21, 05:57).
  • “Listen, Del Toro, man... he’s unstoppable. These races, he’s so explosive.” — Johan (05:57)
• Team Tactics and Co-Leaders: UAE’s deep bench, with riders like Adam Yates and Del Toro able to win when Pogačar is absent, raises co-existence questions for team dynamics (06:50, 07:42).
• One-day Race Prowess: Del Toro “a better one day racer than Pogačar was at the same age” — impressive in Italian classics and semi-classics, winning 7 times in Italy during September and October (09:21).
• Del Toro’s Future Ambition: Speculation if Del Toro will bide his time at UAE or seek a team leadership role elsewhere as Pogačar’s shadow looms (06:50-07:58).
  • “If he’s smart, he just stays with Pogačar and then just waits until Pogačar retires, and then he's the man.” — Johan (06:50)
  • "Him going to another team does not make Tadej Pogačar disappear." — Spencer (07:42)

2. Race Roundup

• Tour of Guangxi: Dissected for its puzzling WorldTour status and race quality. Paul Magnier’s sprint dominance (17 wins) noted, but ridiculed as a "money race" for UCI (16:09, 17:25).
  • “Why is this a WorldTour race, Johan? ...the UCI got paid 7 million euros just for that race.” — Spencer (16:09), Johan (17:25)
• Tour of Holland & Semi-Classics: Both marvel at races popping up unexpectedly and question the calendar’s coherence and safety (24:26–25:14).
• Promotion/Relegation Battles: Analysis of the surge of Unox and relegation risks for Cofidis and TotalEnergies. Johan breaks down the complex merger and bankruptcy situations reshaping the lower ranks of WorldTour (11:05, 12:56–15:26).

3. Team Mergers, Management Drama & Finances

• Intermarché & Lotto Merger: Blurred lines between teams, backroom deals, and financial instability highlighted (11:05–14:08).
  • "It’s a bit messy, mergers. There’s too many contracts." — Johan (11:05)
• The ‘Paying Agent’ Explained: Johan provides insight into team corporate structure and liabilities for unpaid contracts (13:32).

4. Equipment Rules & UCI Controversies

• Aero “Madness”: Jan-Willem van Schip DQ’d (disqualified) for extreme bike position. Johan and Spencer debate aesthetics vs. safety, criticizing UCI’s late enforcement (26:44–30:49).
  • “If we don’t protect the aesthetics of the sport, we just become triathlon.” — Spencer (30:23)

5. 2026 Schedules, Transfers, and Mind Games

• Pogačar’s 2026 Calendar Speculation: Rumors swirl about targeting different Grand Tours or classics, but Spencer questions why such planning would be public so early (34:08–37:12).
  • “Why are we even talking about Tadej Pogačar’s 2026 schedule?” — Spencer (34:08)
• Del Toro, Vingegaard, and Giro-Tour Strategy: Hosts speculate if Del Toro’s trajectory could make him a Grand Tour leader soon (37:14–38:06).

6. Gravel Worlds & National Team Tactics

• Professional Infiltration: Road pros dominate at gravel World Championships, challenging the spirit and structure of gravel (43:05–49:44).
  • “The whole point of gravel is you have no teammates... individual sport.” — Spencer (44:44)
• Team Orders vs. Individual Racing: UCI criticized for attempting to meddle in national team (especially Dutch) tactics (46:17–49:44).
  • “Is the UCI now also going to dictate the tactics of which tactics teams have to use in their race?” — Johan (48:28).

7. Transfer Fees, Arbitration, and Contract Law

• Big Money Moves: The intricacies of major buyouts—Remco Evenepoel to Red Bull and Juan Ayuso to Lidl-Trek—for rumored €7–10 million, their risks, and ramifications (51:03–56:43).
  • “If those amounts are true… it’s too much. It’s exaggerated. It’s not…” — Johan (55:57)
• What Is the UCI’s Arbitration Board?: Literal confusion over the new or newly publicized UCI arbitration board as Derek Gee’s transfer dispute lands (51:03–53:57).

8. Lidl-Trek Leadership Problems

• Skjelmose, Ayuso, Milan & Pedersen: Tension is expected as so many high-profile riders vie for leadership and resources, with hints at possible internal friction (58:44–61:12).

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Del Toro’s Potential:
  • "Man, that guy. 16 wins for a rider like that… imagine if he still improves and gets a bit stronger. What we're going to see next year, maybe in two years." — Johan (06:49)
• On Why the China WorldTour Race Exists:
  • "This is a race that historically, when Hein Verbruggen was still president, he started it… The owner or the rights owner of the race is the UCI. And I do know… UCI got paid 7 million euros just for that race." — Johan (17:25)
• On Sprinters Winning Every Stage:
  • "You say the sprinters are so good they can't be dropped. So you get a lot of sprint stages. But to have a stage race where the first five stages are sprints, like, why are we doing this?" — Spencer (25:30)
• On Aero Disqualifications:
  • "You know, it's just too much and he's known for this. ...if he rides by himself, let him do it. But if you ride in a peloton like this, I don't think it's acceptable." — Johan (29:51)
• On Team Management and Internal Drama:
  • "As soon as Contador took yellow, he had his own jerseys made, like, behind my back." — Johan, on Astana 2009 (73:08)
• On the ‘Gravel Spirit’:
  • "Gravel is an American sport. The whole point … you have no teammates. It's an individual sport." — Spencer (44:44)
• On Team Cohesion & Personality:
  • "Personality was very important for me. Very important. ...Whoever was considered to be on the long list for the Tour needed to fit into the philosophy of the team." — Johan (77:54)

Important Timestamps

• Isaac Del Toro and UAE dominance: 00:21–07:58
• Italian semi-classics & Del Toro’s one-day racing: 09:21–10:16
• Team mergers, financial instability: 11:05–15:26
• Tour of Guangxi/China race and UCI profits: 16:09–18:57
• Jan-Willem van Schip’s disqualification and aero controversies: 26:44–31:37
• Pogačar/Del Toro leadership question: 34:08–37:12
• Gravel World Champs and UCI struggles with gravel: 43:05–49:44
• Major transfers & contract disputes: 51:03–57:16
• Lidl-Trek leadership drama: 58:44–61:12
• Cyclocross audience Q&A: 76:24–77:27
• Personality vs. power for team selection: 77:54–80:42

Listener Q&A Highlights

• Jersey Design Oddities: The story behind Lance Armstrong and Alberto Contador’s different Astana jerseys due to sponsorship and fabric preferences — including Contador secretly supplying his own (70:35–73:08).
• Choosing Riders for Grand Tours: Johan emphasizes that personality and the ability to fit into the team’s philosophy matter as much as raw numbers — perhaps more so (77:54).
• Cyclocross Fandom: Both hosts, especially Spencer with his son, tune into cyclocross, finding it “nice weekend viewing with coffee” (76:49).

Overall Tone & Style

Lively, irreverent, and deeply insider. The hosts mix detailed technical insight with dark humor and industry skepticism, never shying away from criticizing cycling’s quirks and politics. The episode is rich with race breakdowns, anecdotes from within the sport, and unfiltered takes.

Useful for Listeners Who Haven't Tuned In

This summary brings forward the key drama, both in the peloton and behind the scenes, and provides a roadmap to the complex politics, personalities, and evolving culture of modern pro cycling. Whether you care about racing tactics, team intrigue, or the business that fuels it all, this episode is packed with perspective straight from insiders who’ve lived it.

Skip the ads, skip the filler. THEMOVE+ this week tells you everything you need to know about the state and soul of pro cycling in one wild, wide-ranging ride.