Tour de France Stage 13 | The Sir Wiggo & Johan Show

Summary

THEMOVE Podcast Episode Summary

Title: Tour de France Stage 13 | The Sir Wiggo & Johan Show
Release Date: July 18, 2025
Hosts: Sir Bradley Wiggins & Johan Bruyneel

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Introduction

In this episode of THEMOVE, hosts Sir Bradley Wiggins and Johan Bruyneel delve deep into the intricacies of Stage 13 of the Tour de France. Focusing on the uphill time trial from Leonville to Peragude, the hosts analyze performances, equipment choices, team strategies, and the broader implications for the General Classification (GC).

Stage 13 Overview

Stage 13 was a pivotal day in this year's Tour, featuring a challenging 10.9-kilometer uphill time trial culminating at a high-altitude landing strip in Peragude. The stage was marked by intense competition, strategic equipment selections, and standout performances from key contenders.

Race Results and Performance Analysis

• Tadej Pogačar (Tade): Demonstrated remarkable strength, maintaining a lead throughout the climb and securing a solid victory.

  "from the start house to the foot of the climb today was four seconds faster than anyone." ([09:59] Sir Bradley Wiggins)

• Jonas Vingegaard (Jonas): Finished second, just 34 seconds behind Tade, showcasing resilience after a lackluster performance the previous day.

  "I was surprised he only lost 34 seconds after yesterday." ([01:03] Sir Bradley Wiggins)

• Remco Evenepoel: Encountered challenges, struggling to match his usual form despite being on a time trial bike.

  "Remco was off his game." ([09:38] Sir Bradley Wiggins)

• Filippo Ganna and Primož Roglič: Both delivered strong performances, with Roglič positioning himself as a potential podium contender in the upcoming stages.

Equipment Choices and Their Impact

Equipment selection played a crucial role in the stage's outcomes. The discussion highlighted how different bikes and gear choices influenced rider performances:

• Time Trial Bikes: Most of the top finishers opted for time trial bikes, which proved advantageous on the uphill course.

  "Except for Pogacar, everybody else on those time trial bikes." ([09:59] Sir Bradley Wiggins)

• Remco’s Setup: Despite using a time trial bike, Remco struggled, suggesting that equipment was not the sole factor in his performance.

  "Whether he'd have been on a road bike or a time trial bike, he just didn't have it physically." ([09:38] Sir Bradley Wiggins)

• Pogacar's Bike: Featured a modified aero bike, emphasizing the importance of aerodynamic efficiency in the time trial.

  "It was like an hour before the start, then Pogacar shows up at the podium with a black pipe, no paint." ([17:07] Johan Bruyneel)

General Classification (GC) Implications

The results of Stage 13 have significant repercussions for the GC standings:

• Tadej Pogačar solidifies his lead, now 10 points ahead in the King of the Mountains competition.

  "He's now in the by 10 points, I think in lead of the King of Mountains competition." ([16:48] Sir Bradley Wiggins)

• Jonas Vingegaard's consistent performances keep him within striking distance, setting the stage for a fierce battle in the coming stages.

  "Psychologically, he's going to continue to ride like this and try and push all the way to Paris." ([05:24] Sir Bradley Wiggins)

• Remco Evenepoel's position remains precarious, with expectations that he may drop significantly in the standings unless he regains his form.

  "I would be scratching my head, you know, if, if I'm the people at the team that hired, that hired him for next year because it's I think it's clear that he's not saying it's Sudal." ([21:28] Johan Bruyneel)

Team Strategies and Rider Transfers

The conversation touched upon potential team dynamics and transfers, particularly focusing on Remco Evenepoel's future:

• Remco Evenepoel's Potential Move to Red Bull: Johan Bruyneel speculates on Remco's possible transfer to Red Bull, citing his exceptional talent and the team's aspirations to reclaim top positions.

  "He's, you know, top three, top five in the world. So obviously, you know, he's an interesting rider for any team." ([21:45] Johan Bruyneel)

• Impact on Team Dynamics: Such a move would bring significant changes, including financial implications and the integration of Remco into a highly professionalized environment.

  "Because if he goes to Red Bull, they have everything, the whole science around the performance covered." ([21:45] Johan Bruyneel)

Preparation for Upcoming Stages

Looking ahead, the hosts discussed the challenges and expectations for the forthcoming stages:

• Stage 14 Preview: A 18.2-kilometer mountain stage featuring the formidable Tourmalet and Super Banier climbs. The expectation is for another intense battle, with Tadej and Jonas likely to make decisive moves.

  "Laplandia, of course, Col de la Loz. And then tomorrow, stage on Super Banier." ([26:56] Sir Bradley Wiggins)

• Strategic Moves: Anticipation of breakaways and team tactics aimed at securing points in the mountains jersey and influencing the GC standings.

  "I think it's going to be fast and furious from the start." ([29:40] Johan Bruyneel)

Conclusion

Stage 13 of the Tour de France has set the stage for a gripping continuation of the race, with key contenders battling both on the roads and mentally. Sir Bradley Wiggins and Johan Bruyneel provided an in-depth analysis, highlighting the delicate interplay between rider performance, equipment choices, and team strategies. As the Tour progresses, the tension mounts, promising an exhilarating finish as riders vie for glory in the final stages.

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Notable Quotes:

• "I thought Jonas had a better ride. I was surprised he only lost 34 seconds after yesterday." — Sir Bradley Wiggins ([01:03])

• "I decided to go without a radio today. So I was just relying on the time checks." — Tadej Pogačar ([26:15])

• "If he goes to Red Bull, they have everything, the whole science around the performance covered." — Johan Bruyneel ([21:45])

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Note: This summary excludes sponsorship mentions and promotional segments to focus solely on the core content and analysis provided by the hosts.

Transcript

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Tadeh, once again, you know, I mean the thing that. The thing that I am not struggling to get my head around, but the thing that is remarkable today was from the start house to the foot of the climb, Tade was four seconds faster than anyone else. I'm the 2012 Tour de France winner, Sir Bradley Wiggins.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And I'm Johan Brunel. I directed my teams to nine Tour de France victories. Welcome to the Sir Wiggle and Johan show, our daily show. The where we dive deep into the tactics behind every stage of the Tour de France. Welcome back everybody to our show presented like every day by Kiton IQ. We're going to talk about stage 13 of this year's Tour de France. A uphill time trial from Leonville to 10.9 kilometers. Yeah, I guess not real surprises of who the winner was, but as every day. Bradley Wiggins with us. Bradley, how did you see the stage? What's your take of the day?

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

My take of the day in an avoidance of talking about Tade every day and him being my talking point today. Of course he is. But I'd like. I thought, I thought Jonas had a better ride. I was surprised he only lost 34 seconds after yesterday. I think a lot of us may have anticipated, you know, the worst case fear in Tade catching him for two minutes, but that wasn't to be. And I actually thought Jonas had a good day today. You know, it doesn't change much for the next few weeks in the Tour. He's still four minutes behind now on gc, but in terms of giving Tade a race because Jonas is here to win the Tour, whatever, I don't think he's gonna be happy with settling for second place. You know, he's got nothing to lose really. He's been second in the Tour before, he's won the Tour. So it bodes well for the next two weeks of racing or certainly the next eight days of racing, nine days of racing, with some quite hard summit finishes to come that, that we may see Jonas and Visma, you know, really make it difficult for Tade and not hand this tour to him on a plate.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, yeah, I agree. I was surprised by, by Jonas performance after yesterday and it's clear. And he also said that in his interview after the stage that yesterday he really had a bad day. He acknowledged that, that he was far off his best and today he was close to his best. And so I think it's really good for the race, Radley, because if today we see another huge defeat, I mean it's. He's defeated but it's not a big defeat of Jonas. Right. So I think it keeps the race alive, right?

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

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[Johan Bruyneel]

Good Bradley. So yesterday we already talked a little bit about it but you know, obviously today was a very, very important stage. Some people even said it was the most important stage of the Tour. I don't think it's the most important stage but still, you know, the situation before today's time trial after yesterday's stage was quite special, I think. And especially from a mental point of view, I would say, you know, today was on top, Jonas knocked down but got back up. And then we had this interesting battle between Remco and Lipovic and Oscar only and Johanneson and you know, now today we saw that Primus is back in the game. So what, how do you think everybody of these, especially the main three, four guys, how do you think they woke up this morning? How do they approach this day?

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Well, I mean look, it's the Tour de France. We know what it's right to ride the Tour de France. You know, you, the Tour de France is a long race and we always say it's a long race, you know, and on paper today is the best rider in the world, perhaps, perhaps the best rider we have ever seen in the sport. Or he's, he's some way to that. And the Tour de France at this stage now, the time gaps are what they are, you know, and you can't get too bogged down with looking at the GC every night at your hotel and thinking, God, how am I going to make four minutes up? @ some point you've got to forget about the time gaps and it becomes a psychological battle in some cases. So for Jonas, he's going to be wanting to go out every day, regardless of the time deficit already at this stage of the tour and improve on yesterday's performance and, And. And look to improve every day or have some really good days and know that he'll probably have a bad day at some point and just hope that Tade. He sees a chink in today's armor at some point and pray that Tade has a bad day when Jonas is having a good day. And so at this stage now that although today won the stage today, Jonas was closer. So I'm not saying that today is going to be affected by that, but in Jonas's mind, going back to the hotel tonight, he's limited his losses as best he could. He lost 34 seconds to Tade today, which is not a lot, you know, and so. And he caught Remco, which is a psychological improvement for him on yesterday. So that was a good day for Jonas, and that's all he can hope to do from this stage on now is continue having good days like that. And, and from his point of view, it's. It's been. It's been a win today because he's not lost a huge amount of time to Tade. He's gained time on all of his rivals behind him. And so this tour, you know, isn't over yet. And I think from his point of view, psychologically, he's going to continue to ride like this and try and. And try and not say expose today or put timing to him, but just remind today on a daily basis now that I'm not going anywhere, I'm not giving up this fight, and I'm going to still be here, you know, and pushing you all the way to Paris.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, I think. I think you're right. I think for.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

For.

[Johan Bruyneel]

For Jonas, you know, you could say, okay, how can I make up four minutes? But you're actually right. You know, every day you start over and you try to get. To get your best performance. You know, they're so focused on the numbers, and you could see a change in his demeanor. He was obviously super, super tired, but, you know, he was happy that he put out one of his best performances ever today. And I think that's ultimately the way you could potentially try to have a chance to win. You know, you try to have your best performance in the key stages, and you hope that one day the other guy has a bad day. That's the only thing I can do, in my opinion. Right?

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And as a team, they. They had a good day all Round, you know, Matteo did a good ride, finished six today.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yes.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Which was an improvement on yesterday. And it looked like from what you're looking at the interviews and, and the quotes of riders, what they're saying, most of the Visma team had a bad day yesterday. Yeah. Individually, they had a bad day collectively as a team because Tade won in the, in the way he did. But listening to the individual, you know, interviews of the riders, they. They had a bad day. You know, you said Jonas had a bad day. Mateo was very clear he had a bad day in his interview. And so, you know, you have very few bad days in the Tour de France when you're in the top 10. But as we know, you will have one or two. But if that's their bad days out the way, then, then there's still to race for this Tour. I mean.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, before, before the stage. Also, we were talking a lot about the equipment choices. Bradley. Yeah, you know, so we had Remco on a TT bike with no, no TT helmet. Jonas, full tt except the Squeel, you know, the time trial bike. Time trial helmet. Lipowitz on a time trial helmet. Oh, time trial bike. And Rock Glitch on a time trial bike. And then you see Pogacha, he's on an Arrow road bike I saw somewhere. It's a modified aero bike at 6.9 kilos, so, you know, the lightest it can be. What do you think of those choices? I mean.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Well, look, you know, it's, it's, you know, there's a, there's a lot of thought, you know, that goes into these equipment choices from these teams, you know, and it's a year in the planning, year in, you know, planning this stuff. They've got, as we know, they have specialist aerodynamicists, they've got specialists in equipment choices and people working with the team, you know, Bora, Hansgro, Red Bull. They've also got Dan Bingham, who's, who's an expert in that field and performance and aerodynamics and equipment choices. So, you know, these people are experts in what they do and they would have studied this, they would have looked at, you know, months in advance and made these gear, you know, these, these selections off of the equipment they have available to them. Because let's not forget, Specialized don't have an aero bike. They have the mountain bike, the climbing bike, and they have a time travel. Now, once again, you know, all their equipment choices are all put into question because of the performance of Tade on the equipment today used. If you take Tade out The equation, seemingly the first four or five guys were all on aero bikes on time trial bikes. So actually it wasn't that bad a selection. Rollich, I thought, had a great performance today and, and has moved himself into a potential podium in this tour in the next few weeks, the next week or so. I thought Lipowitz did the ride of his life today on a time trial bike.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Really good.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Remco was off his game. Whether he'd have been on a road bike or a time trial bike, he just didn't have it physically. And, and today, once again, you know, I mean the thing that, the thing that I, I'm not struggling to get my head around, but the thing that is remarkable today was from the start, house to the foot of the climb today was four seconds faster than anyone.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Else, anybody on those time draw on time travel bikes. And on top of that, we know that Remco, for example, started out with full motivation. You know, he was, he was, he was up there with, he had the second best time right at the split, at the first split, how they averaged.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

27 miles an hour to the foot of the climb and then continued to take time out of everybody by every kilometer.

[Johan Bruyneel]

I mean, you know, to talk about those, those time drawbacks, you know, before the start, I say my thought was this makes no sense, these time trial bikes. But then thinking about what I learned yesterday at the Tour, that aero bikes are actually more effective already at 20 kilometers per hour, more or less. If you see the average speed on this climb is 27, 28 kilometers. The first guys, and on top of that, and as you say, Bradley, these guys have trained this, this is not, they don't test anything here. They. Right. I think when I saw an interview of Klaas Lodewijk before the start, I mean now it's actually not so relevant because Remco had a counter performance. But he said they tested everything, they modified the position a little bit. So it's not the exact time trial position, as if it would be completely aero all the time, but these guys just are able to produce the same kind of power on their time trial bikes. I mean if you see the amount of the, and we talked about it, Bradley Jonas was in the, in the, on the rest day on his time trial bike. So yeah, that was for a reason. But if you see these images when he's on altitude training camps, how many times he is uphill on his time trial bike, it's, it's there all the time on it.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

So yeah, I mean it's Proven today that we were wrong. I mean, me, at least, I was wrong. Second, third and fourth are on time trial bikes. And today doesn't really matter which bike you give him, right? If he would have been on a time trial bike, I personally think he would probably have been faster also. But anyways, his bike is actually also very arrow. It was just his position that was a bit different. But yeah, interesting choices and those speeds, man, I mean, and then Peragude, which is extremely steep and having 28, 29 km average, that's. That's pretty impressive. Before we go on Bradley, I want to talk about Ketone iq, our presenting sponsor. It's proven that ketones are being widely used in endurance sports, especially in the Tour de France. My personal preferred format is the 10 gram shots. No caffeine, no sugar. Take one in the morning, then one before my ride, and sometimes even one in the middle of my ride. It boosts athletic performance. And a study with trained athletes, Ketone IQ has found that ketones boost average print power by 19%, peak power by 13%, gut fatigue by 10%, and spiked blood ketones five times in just 20 minutes. It's also been proven scientifically that it's good for a faster recovery, something that Tour de France riders can use a lot. Ketone iq, as we know, teamed up with Visma Lisa Bike and also with the University of Leuven to explore recovery and high altitude adaptation. Their key findings are in blood, improved blood flow, higher muscle oxygenation, and better endurance and stamina. So go to ketone.com.com and enter the code. The move 20 for 20% off ketone.com the move 20 at checkout for 20% off the results. Bradley, you know, time trial, it's sometimes a bit difficult to go into detail about analyzing everything, but. So Pogachar wins. Jonas is second at 36 seconds, Primos is fourth at 1 minute 20 and Lipovic is fourth at almost 2 minutes. As we said yesterday, you know, after his exhibition yesterday on Otacam, we could have said, and we were even talking, hey, yo, he's probably going to see Jonas. He never saw him. So I think Jonas did a great ride. Do you think Pugachar would be disappointed with his result of today? He wins the stage. Do you think? Do you think? I mean, I think at least maybe we built up the expectation a bit too much, you know, and that's also obviously today's responsibility because he's been spoiling us with.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

I don't think so. I, I think, I think that they will Work every, every day they will go out of work on the basis that Jonas is going to have his, one of his best days compared to last year. And in terms of numbers when, you know, but they'd like to put him in a position where he has to find that out for himself. So yesterday, you know, if Jonas was on a good day yesterday Taddy would have found that out. But obviously knowing now that Jonas was on a bad day and Taddy attacked at the foot of the climb, he could maximize his time gain on, on Jonas. But today, no, I think today, if that was Jonas on a good day today Tade has still put 34 seconds into him.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Exactly.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

So today's just going to work on anything more than that is a bonus. Yeah, but that, that shows the true numbers. Yeah, and, and don't forget today we always talk about Jonas with the Jonas, we don't know if Tada is having bad days based on his crash the other day. You know, Tanny had that fall the other day. We questioned, you know, he was, there was talk that he had a cold as well, you know.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

And he still did what he did yesterday on that.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Today could, today could actually have been the worst day after the crash. Normally it's, you know, exactly until 72 hours after, after. So yeah, I mean I saw, I saw the interview of Geneti afterwards and you know, then you see how much, how much detail they have put into the preparation. Right. I mean I even saw a feature on the bike today was going to use. A journalist published like a whole bunch of pictures and a video that he had been given access by the team to the paddock of where they were and taking pictures of the bike he was going to use. And it was the Arrow bike, the Colnago aero bike, but it was the white bike. So this guy just published all the pictures. This is the bike Pogacho is going to ride. It was like an hour before the start, then Pogacho shows up at the podium with a black pipe, no paint, you know, so yeah, now they put, they put a lot of detail into the preparation. They have left no, no, no stone unturned, you know.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah. I mean today now is also, you know, within 30 points of Jonathan Milan for the green. And you know, the likelihood is Taddy will win a few more stages in this race. So that's looking like a possibility. And also he's now in the by 10 points, I think in lead of the King of Mountains competition.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, it could be, it could be what we said that, you know, since Eddie Merckx, another writer, is going to win all jerseys except white.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

I, I'm kind of thinking, Bradley, when Eddie did that, I think he was 24. And there was no white jersey yet.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

No, there wasn't. No.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Okay. So otherwise he would have won four.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah. What do you think about ASO this morning, increasing the time delay today? Because based on the performance of today, and had it been 33, which is about seven and a half minutes, we'd have had quite a few outside the time deliberate today. At least 10.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Wow. I haven't checked the result. Would it have been 10 riders?

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, Spencer had a look. It would have been about 10 riders. Nine or 10.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Wow. And not today? Nobody, Nobody home?

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

No, no, not today. No. Because they increased it to 40. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Wow. 40. Wow. I mean, yeah. I mean, listen, they know what they're doing, you know, and I. But did they do that before the start already?

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, they did it this morning. Yeah. Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Okay.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Well, hey, yeah. And rules are there. I mean, normally you would say rules cannot be changed during the game, right? Yeah, but no, I mean, listen, I think nobody should, Nobody should go home at this point in this, in the race because of a time trial. You know, I mean, it's. If it's a hard mountain stage, but. But I mean, it's true. I mean, I think yesterday Bradley, I mean, if I'm not mistaken, it was very late for me, so I may have misunderstood. But didn't we say it was going to be like about 35 minute effort?

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, I thought it would be. Yeah, yeah. It's.

[Johan Bruyneel]

It was 23.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

I know, I know. Incredible. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

That's crazy. That's crazy. What do you think about. I mean, you know, silently and, you know, the thing. What? I. What? I'm still a bit doubtful he has a little bit his ups and downs, but Primos primus is there.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

I'll tell you what, he has ridden a very crafty race, particularly with what he was saying at the start of this tour, that he wasn't interested, he doesn't care about the Tour, you know, but for, you know, this has been the only tour I can remember for a long, long time that he stayed upright in the first.

[Johan Bruyneel]

He hasn't crashed. He has not crashed at all.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

And that was obviously fingers crossed.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Fingers crossed.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

And you know what? You know, had he committed in the first part of this race and ridden how he normally does and gone for the win? I think he knows now and he's already Said, I'm going to start going to races that today doesn't go to anymore. He's accepted that Tad is unbeatable in his eyes.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

But getting on in terms of getting on the podium, he's ridden the perfect race to this point.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

You know, and we. We anticipate that Remco is going to fall away from the GC massively. You know, I can't see how he can turn.

[Johan Bruyneel]

I'm afraid. I'm afraid so. I'm afraid so.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

So you take Remco out of that third place at the moment, you've got Lipovitz, only Vaclan and Rolich, that little foursome, and now going for that third place. And I would. I would put. I wouldn't put money against Rollich.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah. And Johanneson. Johanneson is also in the game. Yeah.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah. A little bit further off.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah. But Primo's a solid guy, you know, Solid. And. And now when he sees an objective there, because for Primos, that third spot, that would taste probably like a victory.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

In any other Grand Tour, it would be equal. A victory in the Vuelta or the Giro, in my opinion, behind those two guys. Right.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

And how did he play it with Lipovich?

[Johan Bruyneel]

Well, I mean, Lipovitz, listen, it's. I mean, it's not a bad situation to have for Red Bull. Right. So, I mean, Lipovitz is obviously discovering himself. Looks great. I mean, today was a stellar performance. You know, for a young guy to be still at that level after 13 days, after this incredible ride yesterday, that's. That's impressive. I mean, I don't. I don't like. I don't dislike it for them, you know, I mean, they could have one guy on the podium and two guys in the top five. That's.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

And what do you think? What do you. How do you think this bodes for next year if indeed Remco has gone to Red Bull? And, you know, what does that mean for Lipovic if Remco is coming there?

[Johan Bruyneel]

Well, you know, listen, we have to. I think we have to, to if. If it's true, and I think. I think it's either done or it will happen. Remco goes to Red Bull. Let's not forget this is a super class rider. Right. I mean, let's just take the tour out of the equation.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

He's, you know, top three, top five in the world. So obviously, you know, he's an interesting rider for. For any team. And also in the case of Red Bull, I would say if you really aspire to become one of the best teams again. And you look at who's available, all the best guys and the best prospects are with UAE and there's Del Toro and there's Ayuso and there's Almeida. They're all there on long term contracts and they don't seem to want to leave. Right. So there's not that many options. Remco is the guy, you know. And then also what we need to take into account is can Remco still improve when he's in a super, super professionalized environment? Because with due respect, I think the environment at Sudok Quickstep, it is super professional, but they have more limited resources and I think that some of the initiatives probably come from Remco himself. If he goes to Red Bull, they have everything, the whole science around the performance covered and it's brought to you and you just need to buy into it and then everything gets done for you to get to your objective. So I think from that point of view, I think Remco can still improve now. Can he improve so he can beat at this moment the level of today? And Jonas, I'm going to say no, no, I don't see it happening. He would need to improve a lot. But listen, let's not forget this guy, okay? Last year he was third. Now it seems to be not going to work out. He's still in third. He's still in third. Right. So. But also, you know, he had a very, very defective beginning of the season. You know, he was four, four months stopped after that crash.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

This can all catch up now. You know, he came back very strong, won his first race, then he almost beat today in the Arsenal, you know, in his second race. And then it kind of went down a bit and he hasn't been at that level that he expected, you know. So, yeah, I mean, I feel, I mean, I think right now for Remco, it's. Or listen or maybe something. And maybe he's sick or maybe he's getting sick. Who knows? You know, it can happen in the Tour, right? Obviously now for Mel, for Remco, it's going to be a mental, a mental game. It's going to be how strong he's mentally and can he hang in there and will he fight for fifth or sixth or will he lose time and go for a stage win? We don't know. Um, but yeah, I mean, I would be scratching my head, you know, if, if I'm the people at the team that hired, that hired him for next year because it's I think it's clear that he's not saying it's Sudal, so whether it's INEOS or Red Bull, I was. I was scratching my head because I would assume that in order to make that transfer, they paid a lot of money. A lot of money. First of all, the salary, which in my opinion is huge, and then the buyout. Right, yeah. And then obviously also some people around him who are going to come and come with this director, gonna come with him as one year, a mechanic, a teammate. It's a big package, you know, So, I mean. Yeah, obviously, listen, today. Today is the. That's. I think that's the disappointment of the day. But, I mean, I feel. I feel bad for him because, you know.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, I'm sure, you know, I mean, we see where it goes from here, but, yeah, you know, it's. As we know, you can have a bad day in the Tour.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

You know, it's a test of his character now, isn't it?

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, no, listen, this is. This is. We'll see how. We'll see how mentally how strong he is. Just want to touch one more. One last thing about today, Bradley. You know, the. Everything's prepared, you know, equipment, communication and strategy. I. I have this quote here from today. It' interview after the stage. She says, I decided to go without a radio today. So I was just relying on the time checks. At the time points. I saw that I was ahead in green at the first check. The second one was a bit bigger, so I knew I was doing a good time trial. I didn't want to blow up, so I reset for the final 3km because I wanted to come to the steep last steep part with good legs. And then when he came to the finish, which is also very rare, as you see here in the picture behind me, he saw the green and he made the victory salute, which is rare for time trials. You did that? No. In your last time, probably the Tour. No.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And the Olympics also.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

No, not the Olympics. No, no.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, yeah, listen, stage 13, I mean, I cannot. I mean, Bradley, if you look at the race book and you see the stages, they still have a head. It's quite something.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, yeah, we've got. We've got Montvantou after the rest day. That's going to be a big one. Yeah. Laplandia, of course, Col de la Loz. And then.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And then tomorrow, stage on Super Banier. So before we talk about that, I want to talk about our daily Ventum Trivia Bradley Yesterday's question was about the Hotakam first. First time featured in 1994, the Rotakam has earned the reputation as an infamous climb in the Pyrenees, including stage 12 yesterday. How many times has it been featured in the Tour de France? The answer was seven times in total. Today's question A climb in today's stage, the high altitude landing strip and finishing location of today's uphill time trial in Peragude holds a special significance to one host of this year's the move to coverage. Who is it and why? So, the high altitude landing strip in Peragude of today's time trial holds a special significance to someone on our team. Who is it and why? I know the answer, of course I'm not going to say it. Send your best guess to ventomracing.com themove and you can enter into this year's grand prize $5,000 of store credit towards any Ventum bike you want to purchase. You don't want to wait until the end of the Tour for the contest. Ventum is also offering during the remainder of the Tour a standing discount of 10% on the whole using the code themove10 at checkout and 20% on any NS1 road bike you want to purchase with the code NS120. So phantomracing.com themove tomorrow stage Bradley stage 14182 kilometers so for a mountain stage, quite a long stage. 5,000 meters of elevation with the two big climbs are the Tourmaline and Superbanier. There's two other climbs, there's the Aspen and the Payra Sud. So what they did today until the turn, they do again. So they come from Louisville, they go up the Paris. Yeah, I mean it's a hard stage, but what do you think? GC day.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Breakaway.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

I think. I think Tado win again. Yeah, I think it's going to be very similar to. I think it's gonna be very similar to yesterday. I think there'll be a big break in the morning again because everyone will want to try and get into the break. Lots, lots for that to go as far in the stage as possible. The mountains jersey's still up. There's some big points on the mountains tomorrow and also lots of people want to get into the break for sliding space to help their team over the tourmaline. So I think that it will be flat out from the start. Of course you'll have little trek as well that will want to try and keep Jonathan there as long as possible for the Sprint intermediate sprint before the tourmaline, which will be a difficult one for them. So I think it's going to be fast and furious from the start. Yeah. And then of course we hit the tourmaline. You know, it's a long, long tourmaline side tomorrow. And I think, you know, naturally through the day as the racing picks up Visma, I'm going to be, stay quiet through the race. They're going to, they're going to, they'll have a. We don't know what tactic they're going to deploy tomorrow, but, you know, and I think it all come down to Super Banier tomorrow and there will be a race and whether Jonas tries something or not tomorrow, whether Mato tries to go in the break and get some space, who knows. But I think it will be very similar to yesterday and today will probably make a move again. Yeah, that's as I predict.

[Johan Bruyneel]

I mean, Super Bonier is hard. It's a horse category climb also. I mean, anyways, Otakam is also a horse category climb. I personally think that if, if, if Jonathan Milan is not in the break, the breakaway has no chance at all. They need to get those points at the bottom of the tourmalet. And I mean, if I would be little track, I mean, I would just go for that, you know, I mean, it's their only objective. They, they have nothing else to do in today's tomorrow stage.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

No, no.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And once you get to the tourmaline, then it's clear that nobody of the breakaway is going to make it because I mean, even if there's some tactic tactics going on on the tourmalet, which you could potentially say at the beginning because the, the first slopes are not so steep. No, no, but still, you know, you can never get far enough ahead with the breakaway to make it to the finish if, if the break hasn't gone from long before the tourmaline. So what is it? Is it. If we, if we look at the profile, what is it? Is it, what is it? 70K to the, to the bottom of the.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, 70K.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, yeah, 70km. So yeah, it's gonna be difficult to get a big. I mean yesterday was 120km to the, to the Sulor and they never got more than two minutes or three minutes or something at some point. Right. So we'll be back tomorrow. Bradley, thank you. Like everybody, thank you and speak soon.

[Sir Bradley Wiggins]

See you later.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Bye.