Tour de France Stage 20 | The Sir Wiggo & Johan Show

Summary

THEMOVE Podcast Episode Summary

Title: Tour de France Stage 20 | The Sir Wiggo & Johan Show
Release Date: July 26, 2025
Hosts: Johan Bruyneel & Spencer Martin (filling in for Bradley Wiggins)

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1. Recap of Stage 20: Kayden Groves' Unprecedented Victory

The episode begins with Johan Bruyneel and Spencer Martin dissecting the remarkable outcome of Stage 20 of the Tour de France. The standout moment was Kayden Groves' unexpected triumph in a sprint finish, a rare feat for a sprinter in such a demanding breakaway.

Johan Bruyneel [00:00]: "The unbelievable victory of Kayden Groves and the way he won... he must have had really, really good legs because to make that breakaway was definitely very hard."

Bruyneel emphasizes Groves' exceptional physical condition and tactical acumen, highlighting his ability to avoid crashes and outpace competitors like Jake Stewart from Premier Tech.

Johan Bruyneel [02:06]: "If you look at the result, it was for sprinters. Gain Groves one. But he won."

2. Team Visma's Tactical Approach and Race Dynamics

Spencer Martin probes into Team Visma's strategy, questioning whether their aggressive tactics inadvertently drained the peloton's energy.

Spencer Martin [05:19]: "Do you think Visma's tactic of making this race super hard worked. It's just the byproduct is they scorched the earth for everybody."

Bruyneel counters by attributing the race's intensity to the peloton's overall competitiveness, noting that this year's Tour was exceptionally fast, potentially setting records for average speed.

Johan Bruyneel [05:32]: "The level of today's peloton is what makes the race hard... I think this year is really extreme."

The discussion extends to Matteo Jorgensen's strong performance despite previous setbacks, reflecting the resilience and depth of Team Visma.

Johan Bruyneel [07:31]: "He was in the break and actually was riding really strong compared to... the lesser performances in the last 10 days."

3. Analyzing the Breakaway Composition and Key Riders

Johan delves into the composition of the breakaway group, spotlighting riders like Matteo Trentin and Jake Stewart. He discusses the strategic maneuvers that led to the eventual victory of Groves.

Johan Bruyneel [19:04]: "All big engines, right?... They split into two groups, but it was wet. And then we have this unfortunate crash..."

4. The Impact of Crashes: Ivan Romeo's Fall

A significant moment in the episode is the analysis of Ivan Romeo's crash, which not only affected his performance but also had broader implications for team rankings and safety protocols.

Johan Bruyneel [21:02]: "His whole side of his body is just open, you know, raw. And the guy just gets up and keeps going because this is the Tour of France and you want to get to Paris."

Spencer expresses empathy for Romeo, noting the emotional and physical toll such incidents take on young riders.

Spencer Martin [21:37]: "He's been in four breakaways at this Tour. Like, you know how hard it is to get in a breakaway at the Tour de France. That's impressive."

5. UCI Points and Team Relegation Strategies

The conversation shifts to the UCI points system and its influence on team strategies, particularly concerning relegation threats. Teams like Astana and Kofidis are discussed in the context of their points standings and the pressures they face to secure their rankings.

Johan Bruyneel [26:43]: "Now for, I mean, three stages for opposing. That's pretty impressive."

Spencer highlights the precarious position of teams near the relegation zone and the tactical decisions they must make to accumulate points.

Spencer Martin [28:05]: "They might only have an extra spot because two teams might merge."

6. Historical Anecdotes: The 2005 Discovery Channel Incident

Johan shares an intriguing historical story from the 2005 Tour de France involving Philippe Gilbert and a contentious race incident that has had lasting effects on team dynamics and rivalries.

Johan Bruyneel [35:29]: "Philippe Gilbert was pissed off with me because he was convinced that... that incident which actually I have only found out two years ago."

This anecdote provides listeners with a deeper understanding of the intricate relationships and tensions that can exist within professional cycling teams.

7. Preview of Stage 21: Champs Elysees Showdown

As the podcast nears its conclusion, Johan and Spencer provide insights into the final stage's challenges, including weather considerations and the tactical landscape shaped by the day's events.

Spencer Martin [32:45]: "132km. Paris with a twist... it's not going to be for sprinters."

They discuss the likelihood of aggressive attacks on the Champs Elysees and speculate on potential outcomes based on the current standings and rider capabilities.

Johan Bruyneel [33:38]: "There's doubts that it might rain... It's not that."

8. Interactive Segment: Trivia and Audience Engagement

The hosts engage listeners with a trivia question commemorating the Champs Elysees' 50th anniversary as the Tour's final stage, encouraging audience participation and offering incentives for correct answers.

Johan Bruyneel [31:27]: "Today's question marking its 50th anniversary... In what years did Mark Cavendish win on the Champs Elysees?"

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Key Takeaways:

• Kayden Groves' Victory: Demonstrated exceptional sprinting prowess and tactical intelligence in a breakaway scenario.

• Team Visma's Strategy: While aggressive, their approach reflected the high-speed, competitive nature of this year's Tour, contributing to a record-breaking average speed.

• Rider Resilience: Matteo Jorgensen's strong performance despite previous challenges underscores the depth of Team Visma.

• Safety and Strategy: Ivan Romeo's crash highlights the ever-present risks in professional cycling and their impact on team strategies and standings.

• Historical Context: Past incidents like the 2005 Discovery Channel crash offer valuable lessons on team dynamics and rider relationships.

• Final Stage Anticipation: The concluding stage promises intense competition, with weather and tactical decisions playing pivotal roles in the ultimate outcome of the Tour.

This episode of THEMOVE offers an in-depth analysis of Stage 20, blending tactical discussions with personal anecdotes and historical insights, providing listeners with a comprehensive understanding of the Tour de France's complexities and triumphs.

Transcript

[Johan Bruyneel]

Well, I think the main event of the day is the unbelievable victory of Kayden Groves and the way he won. You know, first of all, to be in that group being Kaden Groves, being a sprinter, he must have had really, really good legs because to make that breakaway was definitely very hard. Then he did avoid the crash, but he was already in the little group that had separated from the others. Avoided the crash. And then the way he rode away from the two other guys from Vandenbroek. And who's the other guy? Was it Jake Stewart?

[Spencer Martin]

I'm the 2012 Tour de France winner, Sir Bradley Wiggins.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And I'm Johan Brunel. I directed my teams to nine Tour de France victories. Welcome to the Sir Wiggle and Johan show, our daily show where we dive deep into the tactics behind every stage of the Tour de France. Hi, everybody. Welcome to our show. As every day presented by Ketone iq, we have a bit of a different setup for today. Spencer Martin is filling for Bradley. Bradley had some logistical issues. He's somewhere stuck on a mountain, I've been told in Aspen and couldn't make it. So thank you, Spencer, for joining us. How are you doing?

[Spencer Martin]

I'm great. Happy to be here. Happy to fill in. Apologies that I'm not Sir Bradley Wiggins, but Johan, only fitting to ask you, what is your take of the day?

[Johan Bruyneel]

Well, I think the main event of the day is the unbelievable victory of Kaden Groves and the way he won. You know, first of all, to be in that group being Kaden Groves, being a sprinter, he must have had really, really good legs because to make that breakaway was definitely very hard. Then he did avoid the crash, but he was already in the little group that had separated from the others, avoided the crash. And then the way he rode away from, from the two other guys from Vanden Broek. And who's the other guy? Was it Jake Stewart?

[Spencer Martin]

Jake Stewart, Premier Tech.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And yeah, I mean, yesterday we, we said in Outcomes, Spencer, that it was not going to be for sprinters, but if you look at the result, it was for sprinters. Gain Groves one. But he won.

[Spencer Martin]

So, yeah, it's like. Yeah, we knew it was a sprint stage the whole time. I mean, just a quick question for you. If you're in a group of three like that, what's. What was Jake Stewart's thinking? Like, what was the thought there?

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, I mean, three guys, two guys who are really fast. Then you had Frank Van Den Broek who obviously had no chance. I don't know. I mean, I don't know how, how it happened actually. He got away. He went like to the left and just rode away. And I'm gonna guess that Frank Van den Broek said, okay, well, if this stays together, I'm third anyway, so you're the faster guy. So you close it. And yeah, I think the main, the main thing is, Spencer, that basically they were, they were, they're all super tired and there's nothing left. You know, I mean, the, the at this point, you know, and I've been in this situation as a cyclist also, if at the end of the Tour in the last week, you make it to a break, that's like, okay, mission accomplished. Now what, what, whatever happens, happens. We get to the finish. But to get in the breaks, most of the riders who are in the break have nothing left to basically then, you know, finish it off. And that's what separates. I mean, that's why I think that the ride of, of getting groves today was just unbelievable.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, it was unbelievable. And what else is unbelievable is today's sponsor, Huckberry. Huckberry is building the future of retail for active, adventurous men. It's a one stop shop for men's everything from apparel, footwear, to home and everyday care. They curate and field test the best products. If it's on Huckberry, it's great. They also send out a daily newsletter to millions of guys every day. It has fantastic content. You're actually looking forward to this newsletter and you forget that it's there to sell you things. That's how good it is. And some of my favorite products from Huckberry. You may have seen the now infamous photo of me unclogging the toilet in the move set. I was doing that in Huck per Huckberry's well in shorts. They're sports shorts. They have a liner. They are fantastic. From everything from lounging around, running, playing sports, to unclogging toilets clogged by former professional cyclists in a basement in Aspen. They also have the 72 hour tee. It's the ultimate travel T shirt, lightweight and soft. I believe our producer Gabriel has it. He wore it to dinner the other night. I was jealous the entire time. I wanted that T shirt. I'm gonna have to go onto huckberry.com and get it. And when I do, I will go to huckberry.com themove so they know that we sent you. All right, Johan, also another question for you. So they're in this move. Jake Stewart. I would say you're right. He must have just been so on the limit that he didn't even fully understand what was happening. By the time they know what's going on. Kaden Groves is too far away.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Do you.

[Spencer Martin]

Something I was thinking about is do you think Visma's tactic of making this race super hard worked. It's just the byproduct is they scorched the earth for everybody. Like no one has any energy left. Including Visma.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, I mean, maybe, but I think it's just, I mean you can't just say Visma made the race hard. I think it's just the level of today's peloton is what makes the race hard and non stop and going from start to finish every single day. I cannot, I mean we've seen it coming since a few years now, but I think this year is really extreme. I mean, if you see that, I mean I'd like to see the average speed of the whole Tour de France. Pretty sure it's going to be the fastest one ever. Of course, you know, that's not really a standard because the courses are not always the same. Sometimes there's more elevation, less elevation. But yeah, I mean Visma, they've tried, you know, they've tried. I think it was good to see today also that Matteo Jorgensen was in the break and actually was riding really strong compared to, you know, the, the, the, I'm going to say the lesser performances in the, in the, in the last 10 days. I mean obviously we, we are used much better than, than, than this from Matteo. He's been sick apparently, so it's understandable. But today he was really, really strong. Got cut out with, with, with that breakaway. I mean it was a strong breakaway. I mean if you, if you look, you know, it started full gas, rainy conditions also Spencer and up and down all the time. And it took, if I'm not mistaken, it took about 90km before actually the break that was ahead. Got the okay finally from the peloton that they were going to say, okay, this is now gone. It took 90k, you know, so obviously you're going to have strong guys in there, you know, and if you look, for example, I mean Tim Wellens, Matteo Jorgensen, even what's his name? Jordan Jegat.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Who's, you know, he was in the top 10 now 11 and was in there, got into top 10 finally he got yelled at by, by several guys in the break saying, hey, you don't belong here. I mean, of course he belongs there. You know, it's like he was 11th, he was 30 something minutes down. This is also part of, part of the race. Right. I mean, trying to get in the top 10. And you could see how much it means because, I mean, especially for, for Jegat and for the French team Totalenergies. It's been a while since this team had somebody in the top 10. And even for Jake Walula, who was, you know, unfortunately for Ben O', Connor, he dropped out of the top 10 today because they had no manpower left. They only had Ben o' Connor and Mauro Schmidt who crashed, by the way, who crashed pretty, pretty, pretty bad. So, you know, these are all races within the race and it's. Anyways, you had to be. You had to be a strong guy to be in there. Those were all really strong riders.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

It took so long for it to go. And then it's funny, they didn't want Jordan J got because if you think about it, he's someone you want in a breakaway because he's going to pull all day. All he cares about is the time. He doesn't even care about winning the stage. Like what a motor to have in there.

[Bradley Wiggins]

And.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, and it shows. Just. I, I thought today maybe it wouldn't work at the top of the gc, but stages like this, as you saw, like you just get into the breakaway as a GC rider and then you're pulling timeout because the stage is so fast, it's hard to control. Unlike a mountain stage where we've seen that these strong teams can, can control them. But outside of that, like what. What did you think about Visma's Day? They get, they get Mateo up there, he's ultimately, you know, not in the front group. Do you think they wanted more riders in that breakaway than they eventually got?

[Johan Bruyneel]

I think so. I think so. I think they wanted more riders. They've tried. World Von Art tried. I think Campenas tried a few times to be in there. It was very confusing in the beginning. You know, we didn't really have a lot of information because there was like four groups at some point.

[Bradley Wiggins]

But.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, I mean, it doesn't always work. It doesn't always work. I mean, it's. If in the last week, if already, if you have one writer in there, it's already a success. And I mean, I, I think they did what they had to do. You know, I mean, there was nothing. I mean, first of all, there was nothing else that they could do for. To change the gc. That's clear. Jonas. Jonas actually said that yesterday also after the finish that, you know, he has to accept that he has accepted defeat, you know, that it's not going to happen anymore now in the next two stages, including today. But they still tried. They still tried. It's also for Matteo Jurgensen to win a stage like this, it's not easy. It's not easy because there's going to be guys who are in there, they're fast, they're not going to collaborate 100%. I mean, Mateo, when, when, when the second. When he was in the second group and, and then the first, he was driving it all. I mean, he's, he's been pulling all the time with even Wellens on the wheel and Wells didn't even cooperate. So. Yeah, I mean, what else can they do? Spencer Visma, you know, I mean, there was not much else. It's not, it's also, I mean, what, what people need to understand is, you know, like, okay, well, why didn't he send somebody else in the break? I mean, this is not like a remote controller you have, okay, I'm going to send this guy now and he's going to be in it.

[Spencer Martin]

That's not the way it works.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Right. Certain people think, why don't they put more riders in the break? Well, I mean, it would be as easy as taking it and putting them in there. You can do that on a, on a board game or something. But not, but not in, you know, not in the bike race. That doesn't work like that.

[Spencer Martin]

You also, I mean, it's very hard. Like, even if you just go out to your local race and try to get in the breakaway, it's not as easy as you'd imagine. But you also only perceive it once it's done. Like you, if you watch the first hour of this race, there's so many breakaways that are pulled in. It's like, well, the breakaway is only the breakaway after the fact. So it's not like you can't be in every move. You have to.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

Ch. Pick and choose. I mean, when it went, I. I'm just looking at it now. The first hour of this race was 45 kilometers an hour, which might not sound so fast, but it was hard. Started on a 12 kilometer long climb.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

Like it was full out the whole time.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

No, I was hard. And, and, and it was raining.

[Spencer Martin]

Yes.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

And it was like chilly, rainy. Do you think. I mean, maybe this is me just reading into things, but it's kind of an oddball stage to have you here. Usually have a time trial or a mountain stage at least in. Do you think this contributed to Pagacha, maybe riding a little bit more conservatively in the last two alpine stages, knowing he still had to get through this.

[Johan Bruyneel]

I don't think he was worried about today stage. I mean, it's a piece of cake for him, you know.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

I mean, more conservative. I mean. Yeah, I mean, I. I'd like to elaborate a bit on that also, Spencer, because we've seen, you know, like, comments about, you know, he's. He's off or he's, you know, he's not dominant or he's. He didn't attack or. I mean, what do you want the guy to do, man? He already won four stages. He's solidly in yellow. He's, you know, he just wants to get to Paris. His team was good, but, you know, not dominant. So you kind of have to be very conservative and careful what you do.

[Spencer Martin]

I mean, what's the upside of being aggressive?

[Johan Bruyneel]

It's almost.

[Spencer Martin]

No, no.

[Johan Bruyneel]

If I would have been in the car and. Or his director, I would have absolutely recommended the way he was racing even less. Even less, you know, because at the end of the day, you need to take that yellow to Paris. That's the goal now, you know, and he doesn't need to prove anything to anybody. He know. We all know that he can win races and he can win stages.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And he.

[Spencer Martin]

I went back and watched the last two mountain stages of last year's tour, and it's maybe not how everyone remembers, because stage 19, when he won at Easela 2000, he attacks at the bottom of the climb and gets clear. Well, he did the same thing yesterday. He attacked at the bottom of the climb, didn't get clear, and then you have to shift into it. You can't just keep attacking. You're in the yellow jersey. Like, why would you do that? You just shift into a more conservative role. And then stage 20, when he won that, he was parked on Jonas's wheel until they passed Carapaz. Like, he wasn't even trying to win that stage.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

And then it was served up on a platter and he took it, which he probably would have yesterday. It just. The same opportunities didn't present themselves.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, Yeah, I think. I think, you know, I mean, the difference with last year is that last year Jonas was happy to finish second because he came back from the dead almost right. So for him, being second was like, okay, you know, this is great. On top of that, Remco was not that far behind. So Jonas needed. Jonas had to attack in the last stages, and then he kept pulling. Right now it was completely different since there's such a Big gap to third. Jonas didn't have to attack, or he could only attack when Pogachar did all the bulk of the work. But why would Pogachar do all the bulk of the work if you have a four and a half minute buffer? So, you know, it's not that.

[Spencer Martin]

Just a different racing situation than last year.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

Well, had you.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Had you.

[Spencer Martin]

Do you know much about Harry Sweeney? There was like a while where he.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Was, man, you know what? Yesterday, Spencer, when we had finished outcomes, I thought, you know what, we should have put this guy in our wild card because he did. He was there for a long time. I mean, by the way, we almost got it. Spencer. Frank van Den Broek. I know, I know. Plus, he was plus 5,000. He was my, my wild card yesterday, man. I was rooting for him so bad. I mean, when I saw him in the beginning of the stage and I saw he had this aerodynamic helmet, helmet on, I said, oh yeah, he's definitely going the break. He finished second. But Harry Sweeney, yeah, I mean, he's on great form. He. If I'm not mistaken, he did a really good time trial in the Tour of Switzerland. Right. That uphill time trial. He was out there.

[Spencer Martin]

Faith in that time trial.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

Which has actually proven to be a very predictive effort.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And I think yesterday in the in. Was it yesterday or was it the day before? I don't remember now. He was there a long time also and not coming from a break. I said, wow. This is actually why I picked Frank van Den Broek because he was with the favorites for a long time. Not coming from a break. Same. Same goes for Harry Sweeney. He's a strong guy.

[Spencer Martin]

Interesting guy too. He has a YouTube channel that is very inside the life of pros. Like, he'll leave it. It's a cold day in Andorra and he shows you, like what he puts on. It's like an interesting YouTube channel. You want to know?

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

If you wanna know exactly what it's like to be a pro cyclist, I'd check that out. Frank. Frank Vandenbrook. Great ride. I feel sad. I feel sad for us and for him. We're all devastated. There is like a points implication of that. But should we do an ad break really quick and then we'll talk about.

[Johan Bruyneel]

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[Spencer Martin]

We say Mateo. Trenton.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Trenton. Matteo Trentin. Matteo Trentin. Exactly.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

So you know, all big engines, right?

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And if you see. Then finally they split into two groups, but as we said, it was wet. And then we have this unfortunate crash in the corner of Ivan Romeo taking out also Gregoire, I think, and Velasco, if I'm not mistaken.

[Spencer Martin]

I'm pretty sure that's right.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

I'm looking at the video right now.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And then we have, we have Groves and Stewart and Frank van den Broek who can kind of sail around it. And that's the decision, right? Man, Ivan Romeo, I don't know if you saw him after the finish when he arrived. Did you see how his.

[Spencer Martin]

No. He looked really hurt though, when he crashed, when he got up from the crash.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, but man, I saw pictures, you know, from, from when he arrived and then when he arrived at the team bus. Ah, it's crazy. I mean, to, to have this in stage 20 in the tour de France. I mean, this, these are things you accept expect in week one in, in the first three, four days of the Tour. Normally, I mean, usually there was never any crashes anymore in the last week, you know, but anyways, today was a full gas day and, and with the, with the rain. But obviously, I mean, Romeo is a strong rider. I, I think you, you you put some money on him, right?

[Spencer Martin]

Well, yeah, I was down in the. In the Huckberry Chill Chamber. He had won a stage of the Dofanate very similar to this. I. I thought he was going to win this stage. This guy's so strong. He's been strong on Tour. And Bradley Wiggins was like, this guy's gonna win. Put money on him and he could. I live bet on him. But I also live bet on Kaden Groves, because I thought, well, for Mayo doesn't win, it's probably going to be he's beaten from a group. Who's going to win from a group? Kaden Groves. So I ended up making money. But, yeah, it was very sad watching him crash like, two seconds after I bet on him.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Young guy, first Tour de France. But, man, what a sport. What a sport. You know, like, you don't see this anywhere else. I mean, he just goes down. His whole, you know, his whole. All his clothing is ripped off. His whole. The whole side of his body is just open, you know, raw. And the guy just, you know, gets up and keeps going because this is the Tour of France and you want to get to Paris and he's not asleep very well tonight.

[Spencer Martin]

You might be crashing, too. It's.

[Johan Bruyneel]

It's.

[Spencer Martin]

They've added a wrinkle. So this guy's 21.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

He's been in four breakaways at this Tour. Like, you know how hard it is to get in a breakaway at the Tour de France. That's impressive.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Also, I mean, he did an amazing ride in the. In the Spanish Championship. It was. And it was really hard.

[Spencer Martin]

It was.

[Johan Bruyneel]

It was on the slopes of. Of Sierra Nevada, and he. He just rode away from everybody. Not really. Really good rider. But anyways, so we see them then. Then, you know, I think the move of the day is. I mean, first of all, the move of the day is this crash, and then the move of the day is gave in. Groves really riding away, like, without even accelerating or getting out of the saddle, just, you know, going. And these two guys are just watching each other and. Yeah, I mean, from that moment on, man, it was still. What was it, 16, 17K to go when he went?

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, 6. 17K, basically.

[Johan Bruyneel]

16.8.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And he. I mean, he initially, you know, it took him a little bit, but, man, I mean, I think he finished with like a minute.

[Spencer Martin]

No, 40, 54 seconds over van Brook.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

Like, really strong. I mean, an atypical effort you'd see from a sprinter. I mean, how often do you see a Sprinter right away and win. And there's debate about whether he's a sprinter or not, but I would just say he's won 10 Grand Tour stages. Nine of those are from bunch sprints. So he's clearly a versatile rider, but he's fast enough to win out of bunch sprints. So this is super impressive, like almost, almost Sagan esque or something. You know, like that type of versatility is not super common.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Well, I mean, if, if you think back, Spencer, to week one, you know, in week one, when we do the outcomes, Caden Groves on some of those stages, like the punchy stages with these little climbs at the end where basically where Bar and Jonas rode away from everybody and then got caught. Kaden Groves was considered one of the candidates to win some of those. One of some of those stages, you know, because he's that, he's that, you know. How do you say that? Versatile. Yeah, you know, I mean, also today with winning the. In his first Tour de France participation, he wins the stage. He's now joining the select club of riders who have won stages in all three Grand Tours, which is, you know, very unique.

[Spencer Martin]

He's eighth amongst active riders in Grand Tour stage wins.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yes.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And, and also Spencer, nine of his nine last wins were Grand Tour stages. Nine of his nine last wins are Grand Tours. I mean, wow, that's pretty impressive, that.

[Spencer Martin]

I wonder if that's a record, like an all time record.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Wait, wait, they said it on tv. I'm trying to think if it's nine of his nine last World Tour state wins or something. Anyways, it's definitely.

[Spencer Martin]

If you look at his list of wins, it's his last 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9. Yes.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Nice.

[Spencer Martin]

Nine wins total.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Not just brief stages.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah, yeah. Wow.

[Spencer Martin]

Do you want to. I, I would say so. We still have 14 teams without a stage win. Another team that has already won stages, wins three stages.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Now for, I mean, three stages for opposing. That's pretty impressive.

[Spencer Martin]

Also with three different rocks, you know.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Day one, they win with Philipson, he crashes out. Then afterwards goes home. Matthew Van der Pool wins the stakes, take stage, takes yellow, gets sick, goes home. And now the third big name of the team, Kane Groves, wins. Wins his stage. I mean, they just keep pulling it off, you know, the, the road Hoff brothers, they, they're, they're impressive, man.

[Spencer Martin]

They're impressive and who knows how efficient. I'm just looking at a list of the budgets, fairly well sourced and there's only six or seven teams with a lower budget. Than them in the World Tour.

[Johan Bruyneel]

What are they listed at? Total budget?

[Spencer Martin]

I mean, this is a wide range. 15 million to 25 million euros.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

Probably is somewhere in there.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, I think it's just. I think it's somewhere north of 20, but below 25.

[Spencer Martin]

And then you think about all these teams like FDJ, I'm sure they have a decent budget. Movistar, Decathlon, Bora Bahrain, they've none of those teams have wanted to stage at this tour, unless I'm mistaken. So. And it's interesting to me, they don't have any GC riders. Like they know what they're good at. And remember Jay vine was on the team and they let him go to uae.

[Johan Bruyneel]

You know, that's one of the things, you know, they know they actually made amazing choices on who to renew and who to let go.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

It's like their great strength.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, it's pretty impressive. It's pretty impressive.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

They let a lot of riders walk at the right time, which is key.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Spencer, let's talk a bit about that crash in the peloton, man. At the end. I mean that's. So you have Kaden Groves coming in alone, then the remainder of the breakaway and then what is it? Six minutes behind is the. What remains from the peloton. So race over, Right?

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And we see this crash in the peloton. I. I know you guys talked about it in the move and I. And I think you're absolutely right. This is because of the point system in the UCI and the relegation. If you look who are first and second is two Astana riders.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And who was the first guy to crash they coffee? This rider. The guys who are up for relegation.

[Spencer Martin]

I mean, I didn't have a very captive audience, Johan, when I was trying to explain this, but.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, I know, but I absolutely agree with you. That's the reason.

[Spencer Martin]

And astana, they get 25 points. They're probably safe. This has been drilled into them probably because they might have all lost their jobs if they didn't get points. So they're like a pit bull. Like they're going to go for these points. Kofitis, what is Kofit has gotten out of this tour? Like they are a 19th, meaning they'd be the first team relegated. It gets a little complicated because there might only be. There might be an extra spot because two teams might merge.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

But do you know who's right behind them? Uno X. And you know who's has stage results and GC results that still haven't like that are still pending in Unox. So like they'll probably pass cos by the end of this tour.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And what about. I mean and Picnic nl? They're safe. No, I mean especially now with Oscar only scoring a lot of points.

[Spencer Martin]

They are I guess technically not safe but they are trending up. They're in the safety zone. Yeah. Oscar only is going to get them a lot of points and even think today like Frank, Frank Vandenberg.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Second, second.

[Spencer Martin]

You know like they're really good at actually picking up these points and tough races.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Well also Spencer, listen, the season is now over. You know we still have lots of races. We have still the Vuelta, you know. So these teams need to keep the pressure on. You know like Kofi this, you know x2door, picnic NL and even Astana like 14th, 15th or 17th.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, this is like in the aggregate three year.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

Rankings are six.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, okay.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah but it's really like it's only 1500 points basically is what they're safe by. So if you think 25 free points basically like you're gonna go for that. Yeah, yeah, for sure.

[Johan Bruyneel]

For sure. Now that was unfortunate to see. I mean like. I mean there you see Spencer, it's not over till Paris. I mean this guy could have taken Pugacher out easy watcher was there. He was there. You know he just had to go around. He there just next to the crash.

[Spencer Martin]

Can you imagine that?

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, that would be. That would be. That would be horrible.

[Spencer Martin]

I actually want to ask you about potential crashes tomorrow. How that would be handled. But should we do ventum trivia of the day?

[Johan Bruyneel]

Let's do a phantom trivia before we talk about tomorrow State Spencer as every day. So yesterday's question was. In the final kilometers of the difficult La Plaque climb, riders will pass or have passed another historic alpine sporting venue. What is it? The answer was it's the 1 1/2 kilometer LA Plagne Olympic bobsleigh track. That was the answer. Today's question marking its 50th anniversary since it first appears as the final stage at the final stage of the Tour de France. The Champs Elysees is arguably the most iconic stage of the Tour. With four wins over his storied career, Sir Mark Cavendish currently holds the record for wins here. In what years did he win? So in what years did Mark Cavendish win on the Champs Elysees? This is the last chance to enter. Tomorrow we will announce the winner of the contest in the episode of the Move. So send your best guests to ventomracing.com themove to be entered in this year's grand prize. It's $5,000 of store credit on the whole site towards any vent and bike you want to purchase. There's also, and that's only tomorrow left, a standing discount on the site. 10% off using the code the move. 10 and 20% off any NS1 built with the code NS120.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Tomorrow's tomorrow stage.

[Spencer Martin]

You just got it in this one.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Is that. I got an NS1. Yeah, I just got an NS1. I, I tried it for the time yesterday and I was. Because I'm used to riding the GS1, which I used both for, for gravel and road with two pairs of wheels. I'm now convinced that the NS1 is better for the road. It's a faster bike. I only used it once, but I'm already. I mean, today and tomorrow, Today and tomorrow I can't ride because I have to bring my, my son to the bike races. But on Monday, Monday morning, first, first thing, I'm on my NS1.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, I've been on the, the GS1 on road tires for the last month. Monday morning, before I fly to London, I'm taking the NS one out. When I finally get home, I'm going to test it side by side. But tomorrow's stage. 132km. We did. It's funny because we previewed this on outcomes. This is like deja vu. 132km. Paris with a twist. You have three laps of the traditional Champs Elysees circuit, then they pop off and they do the climb of my mantra, which if you remember is from the Olympics last year. It's two laps of that, three passes of the climb. We, we, we went through who we think's gonna win and we got information.

[Johan Bruyneel]

I don't know.

[Spencer Martin]

Can we say this? That.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, we got information. Yeah. So, yeah, apparently the, the, the general consensus in the Tour de France peloton is that it's not going to be for sprinters. Not because they can't get over it, but because it's extremely difficult to control on this circuit with the manpower that's left in the teams. And so apparently it's more appropriate for people who want to attack. I'm still thinking about my pick.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, because he's a good attacker because he won today.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Apparently. Apparently there's rumors that Poacher wants to win tomorrow in yellow on the Champs Elysees. What would. That would be nice.

[Spencer Martin]

That would be nice.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

It's. I'm still struggling to see. I mean, he would have to ride away by himself. There's gonna be somebody who can stay close, you know. And okay, he's fast, but there's also other fast guys. And if he wants to win, he's gonna have to ride from the top of the climb to the. To the finish. Nobody's going to want to work with him. So anyways, they. There's doubts that it might rain, you know, we don't know. I have a really a good story about sean with rain. Spencer2005 so Lance's last victory in the Tour Discovery Channel as usual. You know, there was a normal, a normal stage as usual. Then it was a tradition that, that the team of the yellow jersey get. Enters the first as first on the. On the Champs Elysie and the race basically goes loose. I don't remember how many, right. How many laps. It was eight laps or something. And there was a young new professional Belgian guy on francaise de jeux called Philippe Gilbert who had the marvelous idea to not respect the agreement among the peloton and attacked just before the Champs Elysees. And when he looked back he saw the whole Discovery Channel team except Lance on the cobbles, on the floor. They all crashed. And then he came back, he got shouted out by the whole peloton and they started shouting and he attacked again.

[Spencer Martin]

I didn't know that part of the story.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And you know, I mean I. And I have found out. So this was 2005. Let me think. I have found out last year, no, two years ago. So 18 years later that Philippe Gilbert, I mean he apparently. I never knew him. I never knew him. I've never spoken to him before. But I had heard that he was pissed off with me. I didn't know why I've never spoken to him. And I found out two years ago that Philippe Gilbert was pissed off with me because he was convinced that. Because of that, that incident which actually I have only found out two years ago. I had never knew. Known that the, the. I mean I knew the guy's crash, but I didn't know it was because Gilbert attacked. But he was convinced that I. For revenge. There was a race, a classic race called Paris Tour a few days later. And we had a writer on Discovery Channel. It was called a Belgian guy Stain. The Volder who won the Tour of Flanders twice was escaped with Philip Gilbert for Pirate Tours and Par Tours is known for its last like 2 kilometer finish. And of course Gilbert was fast and the Vol. Was not fast. And so Dir de Mo, who was the director there gave the instructions to stay in the. To not Pull anymore. And they got caught with 200 meters to go. Gilbert was convinced that I, from my house had made the call to dig the mole, to not let the Voldem cooperate because for revenge for what he had done in 2005, something I didn't even know that happened. So we cleared that up two years ago at the dinner. I mean at least I cleared it up for him. Whether he believed it or not, I have my doubts. But, but yeah, that's the story of 2005. The whole discovery Channel on the, on the, on the, on the crashed out because the attack of Philippe Gilbert.

[Spencer Martin]

Well, they were talking about that in the studio today. I didn't know that full story, but.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, that's the full story.

[Spencer Martin]

What happens if Pagacha crashes tomorrow? Like is it live time? Like what are they doing here?

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, well, I mean first of all, let's hope it doesn't, it doesn't rain.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

If it rains. I mean with this kind of circuit, I mean I, I kind of think they can't, they can't make the decision that the times are going to be caught at the entrance of the Champs Elysees because it's going to be, I mean it's on this, on this course. It's, I mean the guys are just going to sit up. That's not the purpose of putting all this effort and going through a lot of, a lot of, I mean, controversy and you know, to, to change, change it and you know, wanting to go up Montmartre. I mean, I think it's been publicized. I mean basically the whole peloton is against it. So it would be, it would be quite, you know, the irony if they have to, have to decide to, you know, to neutralize the race time wise. I think it's unlikely it's going to rain if it rains. I mean if they have to neutralize the race, that would be definitely not, I mean I, I, I mean I would be for it because you don't want anybody to lose the race because of the rain on the cobbles in Paris. Because the cobbles in Paris, they're flat and they're slippery.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, yeah, but that's why you have the original circuit, you know, and now with this circuit it would look ridiculous because no one would be racing. It would be a group of 10 people. Yeah, the whole thing seems. I, I did hear though that remember the winners press conference always used to be tonight, like the evening after stage 20. Well, apparently it's not till tomorrow night. So that would suggest, ASO thinks that it's the race is live until the end of stage 21.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Yeah, I think so.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

Anything else, Johan, before.

[Johan Bruyneel]

That's it, I think. Yeah, it's. It's late here. It's almost 30 past midnight, so. Oh, boy.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

And I have an early morning tomorrow. I have to drive my son to. To one of his races. So let's, let's call it a day.

[Spencer Martin]

All right, well, thank you for joining us. And there'll be, there'll be.

[Johan Bruyneel]

No, not.

[Spencer Martin]

This show will not happen. Tomorrow Johan will be on the move and we'll have everybody together for like a super show.

[Bradley Wiggins]

Yeah.

[Johan Bruyneel]

Okay, Spencer, thanks. All right, speak to Johan. Bye.

[Unknown]

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