Van der Poel Dominates as Brennan & Seixas Announce Themselves | Opening Weekend Breakdown | THEMOVE

Summary

THEMOVE Podcast Episode Summary

Episode Title: Van der Poel Dominates as Brennan & Seixas Announce Themselves | Opening Weekend Breakdown
Host(s): Spencer Martin & Johan Bruyneel
Date: March 2, 2026

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Overview

This episode of THEMOVE sees Spencer Martin and Johan Bruyneel break down cycling’s 2026 Opening Weekend races: Omloop Het Nieuwsblad, Kuurne-Brussel-Kuurne, and the Ardennes Classics in France. Their analysis dives deep into the dominant performances by Mathieu van der Poel and rising stars Matthew Brennan and Paul Seixas, with spirited discussion around tactics, race moments, and the future of young talents. The episode’s tone is analytical yet animated, with both hosts expressing awe at the emerging generation and the continuing supremacy of established stars.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

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1. Omloop Het Nieuwsblad: The Van der Poel Show

[01:16]–[22:20]

• Mathieu van der Poel’s dominance:

  • Van der Poel wins solo, 22 seconds ahead of Tim van Dijke and 3rd-placed Florian Vermeersch.
  • His skills, strength, and “art on a bike” are highlighted repeatedly.
  • Notably, he avoids a crash on the Molenberg—demonstrating extraordinary bike handling.

• Race-defining moment:

  • [03:16] Johan describes the crucial crash on the Molenberg and Van der Poel’s unflappable response:

    “It’s a proof of… the kind of artist that van der Poel is on a bicycle—you know, it’s almost impossible to avoid this. And he did avoid it. On top of that, he didn’t get off the bike. He did unclip, but didn’t get off the bike.” – Johan Bruyneel [03:30]

• Tactics in chasing and breakaways:

  • Vermeersch’s choice to work with Van der Poel, accepting that second to Van der Poel is as good as a victory these days.
  • Discussion contrasting “racing for podium” versus “playing for a win” in the era dominated by a few superstars.

• Level of competition:

  • The hosts discuss the psychological effect Van der Poel (and Pogacar) have on the rest:

    “Once they see Van der Poel or Pogacar is at the start, it’s who can be second, which is basically worth a victory.” – Johan Bruyneel [06:56]

• Physicality and style contrast:

  • Mathieu van der Poel’s brute athleticism is compared favorably to Tom Pidcock’s more fragile build:

    “Go check a picture of Tom Pidcock and Mathieu van der Poel. It’s like David and Goliath... Van der Poel is just this massive, strong force on a bike... he never disappoints.” – Johan Bruyneel [18:23]

• Notable moments:

  • [16:12] Spencer notes the stress and danger of the Molenberg and the physical toll on riders.
  • [17:11] Johan highlights Van der Poel’s creative road use: “He goes through corners, goes super fast, the inertia brings him to the outside, just goes on the grass in the corner or uses a little piece of dirt, whatever. It’s art, man.”

• Crashes and attrition:

  • The race’s wet and windy conditions led to increased crashes, affecting top teams (e.g. Visma and young Matthew Brennan’s race).
  • Phillipsen’s physical effort and multiple bike changes are discussed in the context of Kuurne (see later segments).

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2. Kuurne-Brussel-Kuurne: Brennan Announces Himself

[25:55]–[35:51]

• Matthew Brennan’s breakthrough win:

  • At just 20 years old, Brennan wins the tough race in a dramatic sprint, signaling arrival as a force for Visma.

    “Pretty impressive. Having in mind that he crashed the day before and he’s 20 years old, and dealing with that pressure and having that confidence—that was really, really nice. Listen, it’s another step into his escalate towards stardom.” – Johan Bruyneel [28:46]

• Race dynamics:

  • Unexpectedly selective and brutal—many top sprinters (Milan, De Lie, Girmay, Groenewegen) ejected.
  • Credit to Visma for control and tactical savvy, and to Brennan for capitalizing on the support.

• Tactical breakdown:

  • Jasper Philipsen’s aggressive, somewhat puzzling moves and bad luck (multiple mechanicals and bike swaps) weakened Alpecin’s sprint hopes.
  • Dylan van Baarle’s promising form since signing for Soudal noted as a positive for the squad despite no result [29:55], with Spencer advising to “keep an eye on him for the real big classics”.

• Veteran notables:

  • Matteo Trentin, 36, podiums—almost unheard of in modern cycling, where dominance skews younger.
  • Johan quips: “He’s almost getting better in his late 30s, which is super impressive.” [32:43]

• American presence:

  • Luke Lamperti (EF) secures 9th at Kuurne and 10th at Omloop:

    “If you’re top-ten in those races, you have to be in great shape. There’s no secrets, there’s no hiding.” – Johan [33:42]

• Young talents making waves:

  • Hector Alvarez (Little Trek) finishes 29th at 19 years old, with Spencer declaring:

    “Remember that name Hector Alvarez.” [39:15]

  • The Van Dijke twins, now at Red Bull, highlighted as future classics specialists.

• Brennan’s future projections:

  • Potential for E3 Prijs, Gent-Wevelgem, and even bigger wins speculated, given his versatile, powerhouse riding.

    “He has this winner’s instinct. It’s like he doesn’t have to learn anything. He knows how to win.” – Johan [38:30]

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3. Ardennes French Races: Paul Seixas’ Coming-Out Party

[41:00]–[56:28]

• Paul Seixas’s dominant victory in Classic de l’Ardèche:

  • Soloed away on Montée Laurent Jalabert, matching Tadej Pogacar’s historic time from the European Championships.

  • Beat Jorgenson, Martinez, and other top young climbers by almost 2 minutes; team showed supreme confidence letting him ride his own race.

    “Is he going to be the guy who is… who will be able to follow Pogacar in the future? I mean, this is serious performance. This is no joke anymore. That’s the real deal.” – Johan [43:19]

• Historic wattage and future implications:

  • Spencer estimates Seixas rode at 460W (7.2w/kg) for 16 minutes—world class for a 19-year-old.

    “If we’re just going by science… that’s up there. It’s getting close to Pogacar. He’s only 19.” – Spencer [44:48]

  • Speculation on whether he should race the Tour de France or develop further:

    “He’s at the highest level already, so why not [go to the Tour]?” – Johan [46:19]

• France’s hope and pressure:

  • French media and fans place immense expectations on Seixas as their “new savior” for the Tour [44:24].
  • The emergence of multiple French talents, including Lenny Martinez (back-to-back podiums) and Romain Gregoire, is noted as positive for the nation’s future.

• Other notable French prospects:

  • Lenny Martinez: Great early season, though perhaps better as a stage-hunter than true GC contender.
  • Romain Gregoire: Punchy winner in Sunday’s Drôme Classic, showing killer instinct [53:26].
  • Jan Christen (UAE): An under-the-radar 21-year-old who’s already making waves—“that’s a budding talent at UAE, I think.” – Spencer [52:52]

• Matteo Jorgenson watch:

  • Continues to show form (4th and 2nd in France), solidifying his progression as a potential classic and stage race ace.

• Seixas hype check/ceiling assessment:

  • Can and should target a major one-week GC win (Catalunya, Paris-Nice).
  • The question of long-form, three-week Grand Tours remains—historical precedents discussed (e.g., João Almeida, Valverde, Yates brothers) [57:02].

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4. Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Van der Poel’s skill:

  “It’s just art. It’s art on a bike… because imagine, first of all, the stress, the nerves, your heart rate is 190 coming into the Molenberg—and then you have this issue in front of you… and you just nonchalantly go around.” – Johan [15:31]

• On new generational change:

  “The French are back! They have good riders.” – Johan [54:14]

• On iconic riders aging out:

  “There’s almost no riders over the age of 31 that win anything anymore. Like, it’s almost unheard of.” – Spencer [32:24]

• On young talents’ fearlessness:

  “It’s like he doesn’t have to learn anything. He knows how to win.” – Johan on Matthew Brennan [38:30]

• On Paul Seixas’ pressure in France:

  “The pressure on him in France is tremendous. It’s like, ‘OK, man, this is the new guy. This is the new savior. We’re going to win the Tour.’ Those are big shoes to fill.” – Johan [44:24]

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5. Timestamps for Key Segments

• Opening Omloop/VdP dominance: [01:16] – [22:20]
• Kuurne-Brussel-Kuurne & Brennan's breakthrough: [25:55] – [35:51]
• Young riders, Twin Van Dijkes, Alvarez, Lamperti: [39:05] – [40:07]
• French Ardennes Classics & Paul Seixas analysis: [41:00] – [56:28]
• Future prospects for young stars: [56:28] – End

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Final Thoughts

Spencer and Johan close the episode awed by the performances of van der Poel, Brennan, and especially Paul Seixas, signaling a shift toward an exciting new era in cycling. The episode is packed with expert race breakdowns, contextual insight, and nuanced discussion on the calculus facing new talents ascending in the current “superstar era.”

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For cycling fans, this episode provides an indispensable wrap-up of Opening Weekend 2026, explaining not just what happened, but what it means for the Classics, the Grand Tours, and the future of the sport.

Transcript

[Spencer Martin]

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[Johan Berniel]

This was Spencer. If you look at Vanderpool, I mean we have seen a lot of close ups from him during the cyclocross season, right? But now again in envelope, I mean the way this guy holds and pulls on his handlebars, these, this, his shoulders, his, his upper arms. It's, it's like, it's scary man. It's scary. It's like, you know, this is not like a fragile tiny bike rider. This guy's a beast.

[Spencer Martin]

Everybody, welcome back to the move. I'm Spencer Martin. I'm here with Johan Berniel and we are breaking down the opening classics weekend which just wrapped up which just occurred this last weekend with amloop News. Blad won by Matthew Vanderpoel on Saturday and K K R Brussel Kern on Sunday with Matthew Brennan from Team Visma. Lisa Bike winning a sprint that doesn't really do the race justice though. Johan, that was one of the hardest end of races that ended in a sprint that I've maybe ever seen in my life. That was brutal. And then we'll also go down to mid South France to talk about the two one day races. The the big highlight there is Paul Sechas just annihilating everyone on Saturday. Dropping Mateo Jorgensen and then soloing 40, 40K to the finish, increasing his lead the whole time. But Johan, what. Let's just start with Amloop. That was the first. The first one that occurred, the. I think the biggest race of the weekend. It was Matthew Vanderpoel first, Tim.

[Johan Berniel]

Tim.

[Spencer Martin]

Tim van Dyk second, Florian Vermeesh third, and then Christoph Laporte winning the sprint from the group in fourth. Vanderpoel was 22 seconds in front of Van Djka, who was with him with Verme in a group before he dropped them on the Moo. What is it? The. Which used to be the big finish for the Tour Flanders. So it was fun to see it's back that it was back. And then the peloton was about a minute behind them. But what was your big takeaway from Amloop other than the fact that Matthew Vanderpoel is an incredible bike handler?

[Johan Berniel]

Well, I mean, it was. It was an interesting race. There was a breakaway, five strong guys, but you could obviously see that, you know, there was a lot of interest in the peloton to. To have their leaders in the final. And with about 45. Between 45 and 50k to go, we saw that. I mean, the Molenbach is usually a very crucial point in any of the races also in the Tour of Flanders. It's because it's narrow. Yeah, it's, you know, you come from almost standst depending where they come from, from the right or the left. But anyways, it is narrow. Florian Vermeers was in first position. And then we had this guy from Tudor, Rick Plumers, the Dutch guy who crashed. And if you see those images, it's. It's, you know, it's a proof of. Of the. The kind of artist that van der Poel is on a bicycle, you know, it's almost impossible to avoid this. And he did avoid it. And on top of that, he didn't get off the bike. He did unclip, but didn't get off the bike. And that was basically the moment where he. And was it Mick van Djk, who. It's one of the Van Dyke twins who just.

[Spencer Martin]

I think it was Tim.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah. And so these three guys bridged up to those other five guys and that was it.

[Spencer Martin]

But.

[Johan Berniel]

But yeah, I mean, it was because of a crash. If not, it would have also been a decisive point, the Molenberg. But maybe some more riders would have joined in first instance. Right. But the fact Is that these three guys who just got ahead of that crash, then bridged up to the breakaway, and those were the three guys who also were in front in the final until van der Poel dropped them, dropped them on the, on the mud of Gerarsbergen without attacking, just, you know, from the saddle, accelerating. Yeah, I mean, I told, I mean, I told you in the, in. In our earlier podcast, Spencer, I saw him race. I saw him train in, In Spain. He looked amazing. And yeah, I mean, he was. He. He wanted to start Omlop Nieblad because he'd never done it before. And we know nowadays, you know, if Andre Pool chooses his program, he chooses, Chooses a race, it's because he wants to win it. He doesn't do any other races. He does not do any races he doesn't want to win.

[Spencer Martin]

And yeah, it's like almost like a track and field athlete. He just helicopters into these specific races after training specifically, and then wins. Yeah, well, I mean, it makes it look easier.

[Johan Berniel]

It's more difficult than cycling in track and field, because in track and field, if you're the strongest, you have the fastest time, you win. Right. In cycling, it's a bit different. There's other circumstances, but still, you know, the way he was above everybody else, I mean, those 22 seconds don't do it any justice, the difference in level between him and the rest. But yeah, I mean, great, I think, great for the race, great for Mathieu, great for his team. And I think that anybody in the race, I mean, nobody had a chance. I listened to an interview of Florian Vermeers after the race, and he said, you know why? The interviewer said, why did you collaborate? He says, you know, I think it was my responsibility to collaborate. I was in front. I was in a position of being the protected rider of the team in that situation. And, you know, if we ride, we're sure of the podium and you never know if something happens with Mathieu. But he also said that he knew already while they were riding, it was basically only Vermeers and van der Poel. No, I don't think. I don't think van Dijk collaborated a lot. Maybe a little bit, but just now and then it was basically those two riders who did all the work. And he said, you know, he already knew that on the Muir he was not going to be able to stay with van der Poel. But, you know, being the best of the rest, once you are in a situation that you're ahead of everybody, in the case of Florian Vermeers, then basically you say, okay, you know, I'm just trying to go as far as I can and hope I can make it to the finish for second place. And that's the way these riders race now. You know, I mean, once they see that Van der Poel or Pogachar is at the start, it's, you know, who can be second, which is basically worth a victory.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah. And yeah, I have a lot to say about that. But just first of all, I thought UA did a really good job. If you notice, going into the Muhlenberg, they were at the front. They were really putting a lot of resources into getting Vermeesh first wheel into the climb, and they gave it their best shot. He attacks. He had a gap. Vanderpoel, nine times nine, actually 9.9 riders out of 10 crash right there. And Vermeesh probably goes on to win the race. So they tried. He bridged up. And I wish, but. And then also Tim, Tim Van Dyke really, I thought, really savvy. He doesn't make that initial move. Visma's on the front panicking. You know, like correctly saying, this is the winning move. They're giving it everything. The moment it sits up, he has a teammate with him. He bridges the teammate, gets to the front and kind of gums it up. You can see Visma's yelling at them for not working. And then that's it. That's the movement. I kind of wish interviewers, when they ask that question, if they, I, I wish they would state, well, what's the other outcome? So I don't work with Vanderpoel. And then what happens? He sits up. We all get caught. He's going to drop me anyway on. On the final climb. So. And then I'm competing with 50 people for third place, second place versus I, I. And they did a little bit of work. I mean, Vanderpoel was hammering, like, hammering for in between.

[Johan Berniel]

That's why I think, Spencer, you know, you say, okay, if Vanderpool crashes, Vermeers goes ahead and wins the race. I don't think so. I don't think Vermeers would have. Because he wouldn't have stayed ahead because it would eventually have been organized behind. And, you know, I think Visma and Visma and Red Bull together with. Obviously because Vanderpool would have gotten up and then you would have had Alpecin also collaborating. He would not have stayed ahead. Vermeers, I think it was in his interest. He only had one chance to stay ahead if when he was with Van der Poel, because Alone he would have, he would have gone obviously super fast also. But the speed of Vermeers is not the speed of van der Poel. So I think, I think he did what he had to do. I mean, hats off to him to, you know, to not say, hey, you know what, I'm just going to sit on the wheel of Van der Poel and see what happens. The guy took his responsibility and he looked pretty satisfied, I would say, you know, and then his interview afterwards was, was really, really well thought of and he said, you know what I mean? There's gonna come a time when, you know, I have to win against Matthieu first. I have to be there with him. Right? Yeah. I think that's not, that's not, that's not stupid thinking. You know, it's, it's like, okay, let's first be there. If you want to win, you have to become to the, to the line for first. It's like you say, you know, if you don't collaborate, Van der Poel gets sick of it. They get back, back reeled in and then he has to compete again against three, four teams and maybe he doesn't make it in the break in the next move. It's always, you know, that's always a possibility. So I think, I think for me it did the right thing. Shows that he's really strong and he's definitely going to be one of the, of the strong guys in the, in the spring classics in you know, Flanders and, and Rube and get him in

[Spencer Martin]

all those races and he builds confidence. It's also not clear like what, what was UAE's other options back in the group. They don't have a knockdown sprinter.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

So and he builds confidence. Do you know the last time Florian Verme podium that are one day World Tour race is it Perube 2021. So five years ago. So this is not nothing like it's important to get podiums. Tim Van Taika had never been on a world tour one day podium. So these aren't, these are big results for these guys. You can't just throw that away. That's not nothing especially you've worked that hard to get there. We should also mention, I think just mathematically with it was a, a wild number of crashes. I don't know what was going on in the peloton like Visma was chasing pretty, pretty well for Matthew Brennan and then Brennan gets caught out in a crash. That hurts the chase if their band was wet.

[Johan Berniel]

So I mean it was wet. That's obviously a Factor. And it was also quite windy, from what I've been told.

[Spencer Martin]

So lots of stress in the peloton.

[Johan Berniel]

The first big race like this, you know, although you would say, you know, they're professionals and they're used to this, but, you know, they have to get that feel again, because this is a very specific kind of racing. You have to get those instincts back. And, you know, lots of them have been training there and stuff, but if you race there and it's windy and wet, it's. It's a different game, unfortunately, these crashes, which, you know, obviously have consequences for. For some of the guys, you know.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, yeah. Big, big hunt. Especially for, I guess it was the next day, Tim Wellens breaks his collarbone, and then Stefan Kuhn broke his femur. So that was very disruptive to those teams springs. But just mathematically, I wonder if you're up in the breakaway, you're not. You don't have the risk of crashing or just as much. And then you actually might be better off riding with Vanderpoel and hoping he has a problem like that actually might be the best chance of winning.

[Johan Berniel]

It's a strategy. It's a strategy. It's the same, like I say, for the Tour de France, you know, like, how can you beat Pogaar? You know, first you have to be as close as possible to him, and then something might happen, that part of the race, part of cycling. So in the case of the classics, and in the Classics, the chances that something happens are obviously a lot bigger because there's so many different factors you can't control. You know, crashes, punctures, getting blown off the road, whatever. It can all happen. So. So, yeah, I think. I think you need to raise. To be in front independently and not look at Vanderpoel, because most of the time, when Vanderpool is brought in position by his team and he decides to go, I think it shows what we can expect again for Tour of Flanders, you know, like, it's gonna be. It's only Pugachar who can. Who can be with Vanderpool. I think everybody else, they're just a level below.

[Spencer Martin]

And I mean, we're talking about Vanderpol winning, like, oh, it was inevitable. It's easy for him to do this. This is impressive to show up. I mean, Amloop's a big race, not a race around the houses, as the Belgians would say. You don't just show up.

[Johan Berniel]

A race around the church tower. A race around the church tower, that's like a Kermas, you know, like that's a little Mickey Mouse race. It's not a, it's not a race around the church tower.

[Spencer Martin]

Hey, wait. Winning those kermesses. It's not, that's not nothing. All right? Some people work very hard to win those kermses, but it's, this is just a big race. He just showed up and won. I mean if you go back, I think, wow. Ben, our great writer, he's won this race one time in his career. It's not like wow. Van Art does not win every time he starts. So very impressive. Vanderpoel wins. I think it shows us, as you said in the pre show or not the pre show, the race, the show before the race, very fit. I don't know if that's any different than years past, but he's not going away. He's going to be a force this year. I, I was, I was so impressed. I mean that to avoid the crash, it just in. I will say I, I love the guy who's my favorite writer. Wow. Van Art probably goes down right there. Like that's, that's anybody between anybody but.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah, anybody but Tom Pick, maybe Pincock. Yeah, anybody but Van der Poel is. I mean it's just art. It's art on a bike. You know the way. Because imagine first of all the stress, the nerves, you know, your heart rate is 190 coming into the Molenberg. That's for sure. Because it's been a big fight, you know, and then you have this issue in front of you. This guy crashes and you just nonchalantly go around that helmet with your bike. I think he lost three teeth. The Rick Plumbers.

[Spencer Martin]

Really?

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah, yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

Geez. I mean those cobbles were. It's so wet and I don't. They did not that he did not expect to go down

[Johan Berniel]

specifically. It's. It's one of those tiny roads and the cobbles are like ball, you know, like, it's like, it's, it's like this. So he was not, he was not on the right spot, Plymouth. But you know, can you be on the right spot? I mean, it's the fact. I mean, first of all, he was probably super happy he was in second position. I was like, okay, this is one little win in the race. You know, get to that position at the bottom of the mobile because it's such a big fight and then he goes down. So that, that was definitely, yeah, very unfortunate for him.

[Spencer Martin]

And I don't know if you noticed this, but on the fight to get into the Muhlenberg, you Know, it's. It's really intense, and they're going all out, and Vanderpoel is like, oh, I want to. I want to be in a different spot. And he was moving up on the grass. Like, can you imagine that? I was like, I'm just gonna hop in the grass. We're going 35 miles. And also.

[Johan Berniel]

Spencer. I know. And if you saw it, I mean, while they were away, then, you know, in the breakaway, and then even when he was on his own, the way this guy uses the road, man, it's like he goes through corners where people have to. He goes. First of all, he goes super fast. So, you know, automatically, sometimes the inertia brings him to the outside of the corner, and he just goes on the grass in the corner or uses a little piece of dirt, whatever.

[Spencer Martin]

It's like a berm for him almost.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah, yeah. No, it's art, man. There's nobody who can do this. I was going to say there's almost nobody. There's nobody. Pitcock is an artist also, but Van der Poel is just more often in the front, so we can see it more often.

[Spencer Martin]

Let's talk about Tom Pickock for a second. We hyped him up pretty big for this race. I turn it on, and Tom's already in trouble. He said he was too cold. I did look cold. He was really struggling with the rain jacket. But that just. I mean, to me, Pitcock struggles. And he was off the back. Early shows you just why Vanderpoel is who. Who he is. Like, there's a difference between the levels even of these freaks of the sport.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah. I mean, I was also surprised to see Pitcock. I mean, I don't know if something happened, if he had a crash or a flat before or. It was. He was obviously not on a great day. This is not his level. But, you know, with Pitcock, you never. You don't know. In these kind of races, sometimes he can be good, sometimes he can be completely off. And that's just what makes Van der Poel so great. You know, he's just always there. He. He never fails. Never. And also, Spencer, I mean, one thing, if you just compare for the people, you know, who are. Who are listening and watching me go. Go check a picture of Tom Pitcock and. And Matthew Van der Poel. It's like David and Goliath, you know, it's. It is. Van der Poel is just this massive, strong force on a bike. The way he. I mean, I don't know, the way he holds his handlebars just transmits that pure strength. And then his pedal stroke, when he goes, it's like, it's, it's. It's like. It's like pistons of a car, like of a train. Whereas Pitcock is a completely different type of rider. No, he's more fragile. He's tiny. He's skinny. He's good when he's, you know, when he has his day. But you cannot have two bigger opposite types of riders. But Vanderpool is just always there in these races. He's. He, he never, he never disappoints.

[Spencer Martin]

It also goes to show maybe there are limits to GC riders chasing classics wins. Where like, this is a guy who got podium at the Vuelta and then remember the old days where you couldn't just be like, hey, I'm a GC guy at a Grand Tour. I'm gonna go win on loop. We might be seeing there's okay. For people not named today, Bagachar, there's. There's a limit to what you do.

[Johan Berniel]

It is true. It is true. I mean, Pitcock and Pitcock, because of his constitution, you know, it's. It's clear that for him, Amstel and Liege are a lot better than. Than these kind of races because, you know, the, the pure power, it's not so much. It is, it is a little bit, but it is less a power to weight issue, it's pure power than in races like Amstel, the Ash Flash, where it's really powered to be watts per kilo in Kirna and in Umlop and even in Dur Flanders. It is more based on the brute power. And I think without being. No, I think you're exactly right. But that's, that's what I think is. Is the case.

[Spencer Martin]

There are limits. You can't be 200 kilos. Like, at a certain point it matters, but it kind of doesn't matter. It's just what's the power you're doing? And that's why Pagatra is so lethal, because he's way lighter than these guys and he does almost the same power as Vanderpoel. This could also just be the whole podcast, us being like, Matthew Vanderpoel, so strong. He looks so strong in the bike. Because I thought the same thing. He looked like. You look like a beast out there. It was. I'm scared. I'm scared for everybody else for these rest of these classics.

[Johan Berniel]

This was Spencer. If you look at Vanderpool, I mean, we have seen a lot of close ups from him during the Cyclocross season. Right. But now again, in envelope, I mean, the way this guy holds and pulls on his handlebars, these, this, his shoulders, his, his upper arms, it's, it's like, it's scary, man. It's scary. It's like, you know, this is not like a fragile, tiny bike rider. This guy's a beast.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, he's such a good athlete too. You can just tell the way he rides. Very, very unique. Also, I would say they didn't, they technically didn't win, but Red Bull, they would be winners of the race alongside Matthew Vanderpoel. For me, they looked like a different team than last year. Like a really organized, serious classics team. Something to keep an eye out for. And we'll talk about decathlon when we get to Sunday. But that was my, that was my other note about the race. Do you have anything else before you move on?

[Johan Berniel]

No, I think that's it, you know, no surprises. Matthew Vanderpool wins. Matthew Brennan crashed out. So the, the, the substitute leader for Visma. So Visma was still quite present, but didn't seem like they had somebody who could, they could bring back into the race to have a, to have a chance. But still laported fort no.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, big, big result kind of foreshadowing there. They had a lot of bad luck, a lot of crashes in the wrong time. Still get fourth. Still looked good. But let's take a quick break and then we'll talk about Sunday's race. Kurna the move is brought to you by Progressive Insurance. You chose to hit play on this podcast today. Smart choice. Make another smart choice with Auto Quote Explorer to compare rates from multiple car insurance companies all at once. Try [e-mail] Progressive Casualty Insurance Company and affiliates. Not available in all states or situations. Prices vary based on how you buy everybody. This episode is brought to you by Oneskin. If you're like me, your skin might need some extra care this time of year. Between those cold, windy winter rides and the dry air that just feels like it's everywhere, it can feel like non stop stress on your system. That's why I've continued to rely on one skin. It's been invaluable to have a daily routine that delivers both powerful skincare and longevity benefits, all in a few simple steps. At the core of their product is the patented OS1 peptide. The first ingredient proven to target cells. A key driver of wrinkles, fine lines and a loss of elasticity. All signs of aging. And those results have been validated in four different peer reviewed clinical studies. My favorite products that I've been using is their the first one their OS1 face sunscreen. It just comes little little thing like this easy for me to have on the counter. I put it on first thing in the morning and it keeps my skin not only moisturized but protected from the sun. So if I, if I go out for a run or a ride, I don't have to think about putting sunscreen on again. They also have the OS one body SPF sunscreen for your body that also takes care of those moisturizing needs is is really really good on your skin and and keeps you protected from the sun. It's mineral as well so it's going to be reef safe. And born from over a decade of longevity research, One Skin's OS1 peptide is proven to target the visible signs of aging helping you unlock your healthiest skin now and as you age. For a limited time try one skin with 15% off using code the Move at Oneskin co themove. That's 15% off oneskin co with code the move and that's.co not.com after you purchase the last where you heard about them please support our show and tell them we sent you one more time Oneskin Co themove. Okay Johan. A flatter race in theory easier. Colonel Brussels Kern on Sunday. I maybe I don't have a good memory of this race. I thought this thing looked brutal like decathlon came out with the vengeance. Jasper Phillipson for some reason is on the front on these early climbs hammering like he's Matthew Vanderpoel. Maybe he's been inspired by his teammate. Visma was up front a lot pressing the pace. Matthew Brennan looked strong but we had major sprinters, guys that we thought would play a part like Jonathan Milan Bin GR just getting popped out the grun like 90 to yeah grunve like 90 to 70k out like it was carnage. And even when they got over the hill zone let's call it into the flat final 50k the race was still breaking up. It was breaking up and in the last kilometer and Visma was I thought pretty clever. They had riders up there in those moves so they didn't have to pull it back. They get into the final few hundred meters they, they put their depleted resources into a lead out for Matthew Brennan and Matthew Brennan just smokes. That overhead shot of the sprint was unbelievable. This guy's 20 years old smokes. The two door duo of Luca Mazzato and Mateo Trenton they get second and third. Actually Luca if you remember he got I believe was it second place at the Tour of Flanders in 2024. I think this is his first major result since.

[Johan Berniel]

Is that the same guy and then

[Spencer Martin]

it's the same guy. Isn't that crazy? Yeah, because I was like, man, I recognize.

[Johan Berniel]

I think, I think Spencer is becoming also. I mean this was definitely, I mean at least Sunday's Kieran Bristol. Kieran. This was not a race for sprinters. The racing was so hard in the hilly zone that all these pure sprinters, as you said, Milan Delee, Gilmai Groeneweg and many others were dropped. No chance to come back. So the racing was hard and the guys who came back were basically toast when they got back. Also not many teams with, with a lot of manpower left. I did think and I don't really understand his, his way of racing, although we have to say he had a flat tire at a really bad moment. Jasper Phillipson had to take a spare bike from, from a teammate and then had to switch again.

[Spencer Martin]

But I've saw like in the last 15k, I've seen a few, a few

[Johan Berniel]

actions of Philipson that I didn't really understand very well. He must have had great legs because he was strong on those, some of those cobbled clients.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, I didn't get it.

[Johan Berniel]

I don't understand why he did it. Is it to, you know, for his own confidence? Could be. But you know, that's not, that's, that's not how you're going to win the bike race because once you're in then you know, if first of all by these actions Philipson was, he was isolating himself. He. There was no teammates left and then if he gets into a selected group, most of the riders are not going to want to work with him anyway. So I was a bit puzzled by these actions. But listen, Brennan was super strong. Visma was incredibly strong. They were omnipresent everywhere and it was clear that they were all in. For Brennan, pretty impressive. Having in mind that he crashed the

[Spencer Martin]

day before, the day before and he's

[Johan Berniel]

20 years old and dealing with that pressure and having that confidence, that was really, really nice. Listen, it's another step into his escalate towards stardom. I think this guy, he won a lot of races already last year but you know, this is, I mean, universal kuna. That's a big race and you know, normally having Walt von Aert there as the leader and you are, you know, kind of in the shadow without less responsibility, being able to step up and, you know, deliver, that's definitely, that's okay. I'm Matthew Brennan. I'm here for real, you know,

[Spencer Martin]

so,

[Johan Berniel]

you know, we've talked about Visma in, in some of the other podcasts. You know, them having trouble, you know, us being worried for them. A pretty good weekend for them.

[Spencer Martin]

They, they look like they're old jobs. They were, they were all over the place in.

[Johan Berniel]

In Lope, winning, winning. And then, you know, we'll talk about the other races in France where they also had a strong presence.

[Spencer Martin]

So,

[Johan Berniel]

yeah, I mean, the only thing. And you know, another guy who I saw who was strong, Spencer maybe, maybe didn't come, I mean, didn't get a result. Something must have happened in the final. But he was, he looked very strong and I think, you know, I just want to make a note here in this podcast to keep an eye on him for the real big classics is Dylan Von Barle. Dillon Von Barle looked back to his old self. It's a bit strange to see him in the colors of Sedal. Big step. But he looked in very good shape. You know, did a few attacks and then finally didn't make it into the big group. So he must have had some issue. But I think it's very hopeful for him and for Sadal to see him on a good level.

[Spencer Martin]

He was, he was flying, absolutely flying. And you could tell Visma was worried about it because they always had a rider with him. There's this guy, Timo.

[Johan Berniel]

Timo, he comes from Alpecin.

[Spencer Martin]

Okay. Very good writer. And he was marking all these moves so that you could imagine a scenario where Dylan rolls off the front in the hill zone and they never get back. So I, I actually thought that was going to happen at a certain point. But man, he, he looks unbelievable. I mean, same thing with Christoph Laporte. Both these guys kind of fell off the face of the earth the last few years.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah, they're back and about.

[Spencer Martin]

They look back. It's great to see. It's huge for Visma. I mean, suit all, as we went through a few weeks ago, doesn't have any healthy riders. So the fact that they have a rider at the front of these races is big. I also, Tim Wellens, I didn't see it, but Tim Wells crashed and broke his collarbone. I heard it was very bad that he looked like he's in a lot of pain. So we're gonna have to rule him out for the classics. That's a big deal for UAE because he was a key, key, key writer for today Pagachar in every type of one day race and Then Stefan Kung on Tudor breaks his femur. They get second and third on the day, but they also lose Stefan Kuhn, which is not good.

[Johan Berniel]

Second and third in. In Kurne is pretty impressive, you know, And Matteo Trentin, man, he's. How old is Matteo Trenton now? He must be in his late 30s.

[Spencer Martin]

No, he's got to be in his. He's got.

[Johan Berniel]

He's got to be almost as old as he's been in all these races. In. In front already. And again on the podium now in. In Kieran. That's. That's pretty impressive.

[Spencer Martin]

He's 36.

[Johan Berniel]

36. Okay. Well, it's mid-30s, not later. He's. Yet.

[Spencer Martin]

I mean, but if you. I mean, maybe I should lay this out for next week, but man, I don't. There's almost no riders over the age of 31 that win anything anymore. Like, it's almost unheard of. So the fact that he's. He's almost like getting better in his late 30s, which is super impressive.

[Johan Berniel]

I saw. I saw a guy, I mean, little side note, I saw a guy on the weekend who. Who was in his early 40s, mid-40s, and he can. He can jump straight back into the peloton and probably be in front. I met him at the race of my son and man, he looks so fit. It's unbelievable. Crazy. He.

[Spencer Martin]

He could be. You better watch out. He might be racing Strata on Saturday. Was that in. Was that in Murcia?

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

I was on the highway and I saw like the sign to Mercia and he's the first person I thought of. I was like, oh, that's Valverde's hometown. I don't know if you noticed. Luke lamperti American on EF got it's 9th at Kurna, 10th at Amloop. Not only is that a big result for ef, that's a big result for. For this guy. 23 years old. Yeah. Kind of struggled at suit all quicks up to find a home. But those are good results.

[Johan Berniel]

Listen, if you'd obtain in those races, you have to be in great shape. There's no secrets, there's no hiding. Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

And to get top because a lot of people, you know, maybe do well in one. You rarely see people do well in both on consecutive days. That's. That's an elite. Elite duo there any other notes? What did you think about Alpecin outside of Philipson and Vanderpoel, I mean, they.

[Johan Berniel]

Listen, I mean, especially in Kurna, we have to see also what happened because there's A lot of things that happened, crashes, mechanicals that we didn't see. Right. Especially in Kirna. I expected them to be more present around Philips. Me.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, me too.

[Johan Berniel]

Because at the end, Philipson, I think he was, he was definitely paying for his efforts earlier on because he could never make it back into a good position in the last kilometer. But there was also nobody left. There was one rider left, I think, with him, but he couldn't really bring him up there. But I think, I mean, even if Phillipsen would have been in a good position, I don't, I don't think there was anybody who could beat Matthew Brennan on Sunday. He would not have won against Brennan, I think. Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

Which is just crazy to say because Philipson was, you know, he, he was considered the unstoppable guy at this race just a year ago. The separation Brennan put into them.

[Johan Berniel]

He's strong, though. I mean, that's this, you know, to say, Spencer, we, you know, we, we said about Phillips, you know, we haven't seen anything from him yet. You know, he didn't do great in Algarve. Okay. He didn't get the result it k. But man, he was one of the strongest guys in the race. So, you know.

[Spencer Martin]

Well, Andy rode a teammate's bike for like, he's gonna be, he's gonna be.

[Johan Berniel]

He's gonna be there in the classics like Milan, Remo and Parube is. Philipson is going to be up there.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, I, I think that's, that's fair. And I guess at the end of the day, Alpecin, they lean on those two like you're. Yeah. I mean, they could.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

She wouldn't be shocked if he won. Game up. The thing I was most surprised by about Kerna is Jonathan Milan has finished on the podium at Gatmobile Gum. Benny and Vermize won it and they look like anchors. They just. The race was. These are legitimate classics guys and they're just getting popped out the back like it's nothing. And then. Yeah. For Philipson to be doing the damage tells us how strong Phillips is.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah, I mean, if you look at Milan and Gilmay and Paul Manier also had a flat. He had a flat and then could never make it back. But, you know, they were all suffering so much in them in the hilly zone. And then, you know, the racing in the wind, it just took so much out of them that because it's not like these races, you can ride super protected in a bunch, you know, it's, it's a lot of, a lot of These stretches are just single file where everybody's on the limit, whether you are. I mean, even if you're in the wheel, you're not riding in a bunch, which is different to other races where you can actually take advantage of the aspiration and the vacuum of the peloton.

[Spencer Martin]

K seems to have a lot of paved climbs as well.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

And the speed is just so high on those. It's. It's not as advantageous to be a really big rider because you're just flying up these paved climbs. It was. I, I thought that was maybe the best race of the weekend. I, I really enjoyed Kern. Brussels Kern.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, obviously was great, but, you know, we all knew from the. If nothing happened to Vanderpool, he was going to win. It was still nice, but, I mean, luckily he decided to not go too early for the fans. But, yeah, K was super, super, super good to watch. We didn't know until the end who was going to win. And a lot of changes in situations also. You know, it's been like, I've seen like three or four situations. I said, okay, this guy's. This, this group is gone. This group is gone. And it always came back. So that, that was very entertaining.

[Spencer Martin]

What do you think, Matt? What's Matthew Brennan's ceiling this spring? Is this the biggest race he wins or does he win another big race?

[Johan Berniel]

E3 or he can win. He could even win Gander game, I think. I'm not going to say Flanders or Rube. That's different. Although, do not let this guy go in a breakaway. You know, that's.

[Spencer Martin]

Do you remember last year he was. I feel like he never left the top 10 for the first half of Roubaix.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

It was a guy. He's a teenager. His first ever.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

I mean, he, I. He almost reads older, the way he rides and the way he conducts himself. I at least thought he was older than he is.

[Johan Berniel]

He's. He has this winner's instinct. It's like he doesn't have to learn anything. He knows how to win.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah. I'd be curious to see who's the youngest ever winner of this race. I don't know. Might be. Could be him young here. Youngest, Oldest. Oh, it's not going to show me. But what he's doing at 20, it's almost incomprehensibly good. Um, I'm curious to see what he can do the rest of the spring. I'm even more curious to see what he can do the rest of his career. But speaking of young riders, Teenagers. Johan. The. There was two races and another before

[Johan Berniel]

we start about the French races, another teenager who made a big impression in in K was actor Alvarez, 19 years old.

[Spencer Martin]

Oh yes.

[Johan Berniel]

If I'm not mistaken, he's still on the development team of Little Track. Just so he got brought in because Kurtney is not a world tour race though that's allowed. And he was up there all the time. I saw him bridge across a few times and then also was escaped for a while. 19 years old. So remember that name Hector Alvarez when

[Spencer Martin]

he gets 29th on Sunday at Kurna. Only little truck rider in the top 50. You had not, not, not a great, not a great weekend for them. And our Tim Van Dyke and Mick Van Dyke. Are they twins, Johan? Yeah, twins. Crazy identical. Do we know Fraternal?

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, yeah, they, they, they look the same. Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

And they were previously on Vis.

[Johan Berniel]

They were on Visa.

[Spencer Martin]

Is that right? That it's. I mean Visma is clearly doing good. They've, they've got some good options. But those were big pickups for Red Bull in retrospect to get two identical twins that are classics machines. So good, good job Red Bull. But yeah, going, going to France. So we had two one day races. This is kind of the Arden analog to the Flemish Classics opening in Flanders and then in France it's these, it's like a Hillary Hill Hillier profile. One day races. Phone Ardesh and then the phone Drome I believe is the one on Sunday. The one on Saturday in my opinion is the bigger headline though because Paul Seychas did it and Paul Seychas won. And Paul Seas didn't just win, he destroyed everybody line lined them out on the climb. And did you remember this is the climb from Championships? Yeah, Songworld men de lurps lurps 7k long at about 7 1/2 percent. It took Paul 16 minutes which is really fast. Exactly the same time as Tadipagar at European Championships. And he just, he just got to the front. He said, hey guys, try to hold my wheel. And he was just popping like Egan Bernal popped so hard Mato Jorgensen had to come by. Young Christian was holding on and then it was just Mato Jorgensen. This is a double parry N winner, defending champion of Paris. And he just pops him. He's sipping, sipping out of his water bottle, dropping them. I, I don't know if I've ever seen anything like this from a teenager. But then we've got problems, right? 41k to the finish is not Andy Is a strong group. It's Pato Jorgensen, Young Christian, Lenny Martinez. The who we used to think was the. Was the talented upand cominging French rider. They're all chasing him. They're going to catch him, right? No, he's extending the lead. He continues to extend it until he sits up in the final. K wins by almost two minutes with it is I did not have the top three in front of me. It I believe Young Christian was second.

[Johan Berniel]

Second. Martinez third. Jurgenson fourth.

[Spencer Martin]

Jurgenson fourth. Poor, poor Mato. He did get second the next day though. So we got a podium but 148 in front of that group.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah, it would have been two minutes if he didn't sit up. I mean it was impressive.

[Spencer Martin]

Spencer.

[Johan Berniel]

I mean to first of all the way and also the confidence the team had in him, you know. So they went to the front, they started to accelerate, lined it up. Then Seychelles took over. Don't think he really attacked. You know, he just accelerated from the saddle and then bit by bit they all blew. And I mean the fact that Jorgensen popped like that. It was. I mean, yeah, but if you say that the time is the same time as as Pugach did in the European Championships and so early in the season, this is serious, serious, serious stuff to. To. To think about. Is he going to be the guy who is. Who will be able to follow Pogacha in the future? I mean this is serious performance. Yeah. This is no joke anymore. That's the real deal.

[Spencer Martin]

But this is true. I, I agree with you. It's like we got to take this over to members only. This is so provocative. We almost shouldn't say it publicly. But I, I don't know if I've ever seen anything like this. So it's 35 seconds faster than the last time he did this climb, which wasn't that long ago. That was in September. So he's improved since then. You said. Is this the guy that can follow Pagachar? If we're just going by science, I mean, I guess technically we gotta say

[Johan Berniel]

though different, he's not gonna follow him yet, but he's. I think, I think right now it's probably the guy who's. I mean if he's. If he's improving still and he's. He's going to improve and, and let's assume that Pogacha is not going to improve a lot anymore. Maybe a little bit. The gap could get smaller. You know, the thing is now for Paul said just poor Paul says the pressure on him in France is tremendous. It's like, okay, oh, man, this is the new guy. This is the new savior. This is the new guy. We're going to win the Tour. Those are big shoes to fill.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, he should move to LA and join Georgia's team or something like. He's got to get away from this pressure cooker. I am a little worried about him. I mean, I did, I did a little power calculation and this is unbelievable. I. And this is conservatively, this is with some draft.460 watts for that climb for 16 minutes. So if we say 64 kilos, that's 7.2 watts.

[Johan Berniel]

I've read that somewhere too. I think you. Yeah, that's very, very accurate.

[Spencer Martin]

And as you say, that's not quite. If you think of the best. Pagacha 20 minute powers. The climb to Komblu is. Remember at the Dofine this last year, he was like way better than that. The time trial to Ota, not Otakom Peregud, he was a little better than that. But this is up there. It's. It's getting close to bagatra. He's only 19. I. I think you said last week, Bernard, he knows, said you should only go to the Tour if you think you can win it. I think we're getting to a point where I don't think he can beat Tate Pagacha this year. But if we're talking about like what you said earlier in the show, you just got to be. Stay close to him, hope something happens to him. I think you'd be getting into that Tyrio Han this year.

[Johan Berniel]

I think he could be one of

[Spencer Martin]

the three best riders.

[Johan Berniel]

There's still different, different, you know, steps to be made. You know, we need to see how he performs during three weeks. Right. That's.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, he's never had a job.

[Johan Berniel]

Very, very, you know, this is another, another level. There's no reason he won't be able

[Spencer Martin]

to do it in the future.

[Johan Berniel]

I have no doubt about that. I think the rule, I mean, the, the indications are that Decathlon is going to take him to the Tour this year.

[Spencer Martin]

I would have disagreed last week. I think, though, that's.

[Johan Berniel]

Well, you know, you should not make decisions, you know, in the heat of the enthusiasm. But hey, you know what? Why not? I mean, if he go.

[Spencer Martin]

But what would you be waiting for?

[Johan Berniel]

I do another Grand Tour, Giro Vuelta. But listen, I mean, he has other level. I mean, there's. There are no five other riders at this level in the peloton. So there's no reason to say, hey, you Know what? We still need to wait and let him develop and save himself a little bit. He's at the highest level already, so why not?

[Spencer Martin]

And you see it, I mean you'd say 19, is he mature enough? Is he ready? Not every 19 year old would be, but you know, like even in the, in the NBA, one of the best young players, maybe the best young players. 19 years old, it's very young to be in a professional top level league and he's doing well. But like Quinn Simmons, super interesting interview. Talked about him. You know, he was the best junior writer that he had ever met. Quinn Simmons was. I love that confidence also. It's like I was the best rider I'd ever seen. And even, and even he struggled when he turned to pro. So it's not for everybody. But Paul Seychas, at least physically I would say seems like he could handle it. But yeah, now that you mentioned it, even Pagat chart His first grand tour was not a tour, it was the Vuelta and he did quite well. And then he wins the tour when he goes. So that would be the case maybe for doing a different Grand Tour, but I don't. Yeah, I don't know. Do. Is that get in his head though? If you have a writer like Paul Seychas and you don't send him to the Tour, does then he feel like you don't have confidence?

[Johan Berniel]

No, I think if, you know, if, if he doesn't go, it's going to be a mutual decision. You know, it's also, he's, he's also, he's going to be part of that decision for sure. I, I think he's going to go, man. I mean it's like what's, what can stop them, you know, decathlon. Felix Gal was their top rider. He's doing the Giro and the Vuelta, I think good writer, top five candidates, maybe podium. So if they want to go to the Tour with, with the GC guy, they have to take pulse.

[Spencer Martin]

What about Matthew Ricatello?

[Johan Berniel]

He's not going.

[Spencer Martin]

You think he's not going to the Tour?

[Johan Berniel]

I don't think so. He's gonna, I think he's gonna do zero.

[Spencer Martin]

Interesting. Yeah, I guess I could see that. And then Lenny Martinez a, a good, a good reason not to go to the Tour de France. Lenny Martinez, good weekend finishes third. Boat days shows the French have like. The French are back six total podiums available. They get four of those podium spots. Lenny Martinez went to the Tour last year. This guy's very good. Like wore a leader's jersey at the Vuelta. He's 22 years old. He's finished not below the top five of any race he's done this year. And he showed up to the Tour and you could just watching him, I could tell how much harder the Tour was than any other race he'd ever done. Yeah, like he just looked.

[Johan Berniel]

I think he started sick, you know, because I remember in stage one or two, he was dropped by himself in front of the broom wagon coming back.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, that was the first stage one.

[Johan Berniel]

So, you know, I mean, a guy like, obviously he was sick. If you start like that, it's super difficult to come back from that, man. Because they rise, they race every day so fast that even if you feel better physically, you're already worn out. So it takes it. I mean, he had a few good

[Spencer Martin]

stages, he finished top 10 in that time trial.

[Johan Berniel]

But, but, you know, overall it was definitely not, not his race. I struggle to see Lenny Martinez do well in the Tour de France. Overall, I think he's not. I mean, he's getting still young, but, you know, his time traveling is okay, not great. But then I think he suffers a lot in the transition stages.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah.

[Johan Berniel]

And, and you know, he needs a whole team around him. But still, you need to pedal yourself also. Right. And he's. This guy's a pure climber. He's a pure climber. He has this talent to be there, suffer, and then has this last kick. He's very race savvy, knows how to win. But I see him more for stage wins than for the overall, to be honest.

[Spencer Martin]

Well, it's funny, kind of goes back to the. I feel like we were talking with your son about this, that he's like a big Lenny Martinez believer. And we both think maybe for the Tour, not a great GC writer. But it goes back to the power you talked about. Like the raw power on transition stays stages is what matters. If you're 52 kilos, you don't have to put out that much power on a climb to do well. But it hurts you if you're, you know, that's why Naira Canton is a magician. You know, this guy is at a huge disadvantage on these crosswind stages, and he got to a point in his career where he could navigate them quite well. But it, it, it's very hard to do. Especially, I mean, I'm looking at. Martinez is kind of an interesting rider. He gets second at Roman D. He does pay a price in that time trial. But the thing about one week stage races is there's not as many transition stages I agree with you that a French transition stage for the Tour de France seems like that's not his friend, but I could see him doing well at a. You could see him doing very well at Azure Italia in the future, I think. Could probably win one.

[Johan Berniel]

I don't know if he has a Grand Tour in his legs.

[Spencer Martin]

He seems like the top.

[Johan Berniel]

He's.

[Spencer Martin]

I feel like, though I would have said the same thing about Simon Yates or something at the same part of his career. Like, I don't think he can win a Grand Tour. And then he.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah, you're right.

[Spencer Martin]

But the Yates. Yates brothers were track riders, which does help you a lot. Like, that's a skill that transitions to those Grand Tours. Any thoughts on Matteo Jorgensen? How's our. Our den's project?

[Johan Berniel]

Obviously in good shape. He, you know, he was beaten and dropped fair and square by Seychas, but he is in. In good shape. You know, he finished fourth on Saturday and second on Sunday. Those two races are very hard and he must be in good shape. So he's. I think he's. Yeah, he's on the right path to be in good shape for the. For his objectives later on this spring.

[Spencer Martin]

Do you know who's a really good young writer that I feel like doesn't. He gets talked about, but never in the context of being a really good young writer is jan Christian.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

21 years old. Like, he's had an amazing year so far. Wins the Lulu Tour, wins youth classification at Ruto del Sol. And then he was. He got dropped, obviously, but he was looking very strong on Seychelles's wheel on Saturday. I. That's someone to keep an eye on. Like that's a little better. Yeah. That's a budding talent at uae, I think. Yeah. And as you said with Mateo, seems like it's off to a good start to get second and fourth when you don't have a great finishing kick and you're going to the lineman with people both days. Pretty good results.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah. Yeah. And then Roma Agrigoire, you know, on. On Sunday again, you know, big talent still young rider with a great punch, but also was able to stay with Matteo Jurgensen on that climb and then basically smoked him in the. In the. In the last 100 meters. That guy's a winner, you know, on group. Group fdg. I. I don't know if he. I think he. Did he win there already or not before?

[Spencer Martin]

Yes, he did, actually. Well, he won the day before last year.

[Johan Berniel]

Okay.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

So I, I was having the same deja vu I'm like, man, I remember him winning this race. He's a very good rider. 23 years old. The French are back, Johan.

[Johan Berniel]

They have good riders. They have good riders. But now the hype around Seychelles will be incredible.

[Spencer Martin]

To me, it almost helps these guys like Gregoire and Martinez, because they would normally have all the hype on them and they're not. I love, I love both of them. They're not the rider that's going to live up to what the French need them to be. But now they can operate in the space where they probably deserve. It's. I think it's great for them that they have this new guy coming along that's eating up all that.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah, yeah, for sure. Nah, Seychelles is the real deal, man. It's. He started the season with a bang, you know, like, he was great in Algarve and now with that demonstration, you know, it's not against the real big engines, but these guys are all like, you know, these are young Christian, Martinez, Jorgensen. Bernal was up there also, I think, you know, it was, it was against really, really, really dangerous rivals. And he rode away. I mean, didn't just win the race, he rode away two minutes from them.

[Spencer Martin]

He was, yeah, that. To me, that's the most impressive after doing that effort on the climb.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah.

[Spencer Martin]

And he probably, I don't know if he did it on purpose, but he didn't attack, which it was just visually odd to see. It almost looked like he was going slow, but he's riding away from everybody.

[Johan Berniel]

It was steep,

[Spencer Martin]

but then he conserves, you know, he probably doesn't really go that much above threshold, even at 460 watts. So then he can just continue to push. Like the fact that he's not attacking, I thought it was just an. The last two weeks I thought he's just looked so intelligent, like way and beyond his years, which is what you want to see. You don't want to see someone that just smash, smash, smash all the time. Like, I feel like Vanderpoel started as just Vanderpoel. See Vanderpoel smash. And he's gotten smarter as his career has gone along. But Seychelles looks. The race awareness is unbelievable. What do you think? Right here, right now, what does Paul Seychelles have to accomplish to be considered like fulfilling his potential as a prospect?

[Johan Berniel]

I think right now, probably win a one week stage race like Catalonia, Paris, Dauphine, Durf, Switzerland. He can do that. I think that should be his next best country. That should be his next realistic objective. That's definitely doable.

[Spencer Martin]

Okay, what about podium at the Tour de France.

[Johan Berniel]

Listen, I mean it's possible. I'm. I'm a bit, I'm a bit,

[Spencer Martin]

you

[Johan Berniel]

know, worried still about the three week effort. Three weeks.

[Spencer Martin]

Who are rider who. Who have we seen in the recent past that's looked amazing as a stage racing prospect than has not panned out in three week races. I'm just trying to think of examples where this. It's like man, this guy's bulletproof at one week's and at one week races. And then they don't put it together

[Johan Berniel]

in Grand Tour for example.

[Spencer Martin]

Juana youo for sure. I mean yeah, even I know you want a Grand Tour but Valverde was a little.

[Johan Berniel]

Oh, Valverde was something else. I mean he, he won the Vuelta and he podiumed in all in the Giro and the tournament.

[Spencer Martin]

Yeah, I. Well yeah, I guess if I use so wins.

[Johan Berniel]

Yeah I uso was third in the in the Vuelta already in his maiden year as a pro. But you know, since then he has.

[Spencer Martin]

He's not shown us that consistency. Yeah and he. And you're right, he looks really good at one week races. Like really good. The world's best perhaps. Yeah. So that, that would be the question. Like can he hold it together for three weeks? I'm excited to see him try though. Anything else Johan before we take.

[Johan Berniel]

I think we've covered everything Spencer that's about it.