“I CAN DO MORE PUSH UPS THAN YOU”

Summary

Therapy Gecko - Episode: "I CAN DO MORE PUSH UPS THAN YOU"

Release Date: August 13, 2025
Host: Lyle (The Gecko)
Location: Washington Square Park, Manhattan, New York

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Introduction

In this episode of Therapy Gecko, hosted by Lyle, an unlicensed lizard psychologist, listeners are taken on an insightful journey through conversations with strangers in Washington Square Park, Manhattan. Lyle adopts the persona of a gecko to engage with individuals about their personal struggles, aspirations, and daily lives, especially focusing on moments of vulnerability and self-discovery.

Conversation with Paulina ("Moolah") [02:04 - 13:49]

Overview:
Paulina shares her transition from a hectic, single life to a more stable married life. She discusses the challenges of balancing work, personal growth, and adapting to married life, highlighting the impact of stress and cultural expectations on her mental health.

Key Points:

• Marriage and Stability:
  Paulina explains how marriage has brought stability but also a different outlook on life. She contrasts her previous single, high-stress lifestyle with her current more relaxed state.
  “I have an entirely different, like, kind of outlook on life... I have a husband now.” [05:28]

• Work and Stress:
  Reflecting on her past, Paulina describes working seven days a week, leading to significant stress and physical symptoms like hair loss.
  “I was working so much that I started losing the hair out of my Holy.” [04:24]

• Cultural Background:
  Originally from Russia, Paulina discusses the cultural shock of moving to the U.S. at age ten and the challenges of adapting to a new environment while dealing with language barriers and discrimination.
  “I'm from Russia, but I'm mixed. My grandma's Ukrainian.” [05:22]

• Marriage Story:
  Paulina recounts meeting her husband under unconventional circumstances at Washington Square Park and how their relationship evolved quickly, leading to marriage within a short period.
  “We moved really quick. We’ve been together for 10 months now.” [08:07]

• Future Aspirations:
  She expresses her desire to start a family despite economic uncertainties, believing she can provide a better life for her future child.
  “I want to start a family... I feel like I’d be able to make a life for that child that nobody else would.” [13:22]

Notable Quote:
"It isn't easy putting a kid into that, but I feel like I’d be able to make a life for that child that nobody else would." – Paulina [13:22]

Conversation with Cameron [18:14 - 27:02]

Overview:
Cameron delves into her aspirations to pursue a career in criminal justice, the obstacles she faces due to societal prejudices, and her experiences with substance use as a coping mechanism.

Key Points:

• Career Aspirations:
  Cameron aspires to enter criminal justice to address flaws in the policing system and immigration issues. She discusses the motivation behind her choice and the impact of political climates on her goals.
  “I have a lot of disdain towards how the police system is going right now.” [21:03]

• Challenges and Discrimination:
  She highlights the discrimination she faces based on her appearance, background, and ethnicity, which hampers her job search and academic pursuits.
  “Based on how I look and where I'm from... it's harder.” [19:44]

• Educational Journey:
  Cameron shares her experiences in law classes and her frustration with the limited applicability of her degree in the current job market, emphasizing the stress of balancing work and education.
  “I worked at Chipotle before and I had people that had master's degrees... serving food.” [15:18]

• Substance Use and Coping:
  Discussing her use of marijuana, Cameron explains how it helps her manage stress and maintain calmness, despite the physical repercussions of her allergies.
  “It brings peace to my life... helps me really see things for how they are calmly.” [27:25]

• Philosophical Insights:
  The conversation touches on the concept of dopamine loops and the impact of technology and substance use on mental health, with Cameron providing a nuanced perspective on balancing happiness and longevity.
  “It's all about the joys of life, not the pain. Pain is beauty." [26:15]

Notable Quote:
"I want to make a difference... I have family who have friends and girlfriends who are actively getting issues with immigration." – Cameron [22:15]

Conversation with Veda [30:07 - 63:22]

Overview:
Veda discusses her deep interest in psychology, her experiences with ego death, and her aspirations to innovate within the field to better address pervasive issues like depression and societal pressures.

Key Points:

• Ego Death Experience:
  Veda describes a profound ego death experience that reshaped her understanding of self and spirituality, leading her to embrace a more positive outlook on life and belief in a personal connection with God.
  “I lost all concept of self and separation... It was the most insane experience of my life.” [48:03]

• Psychological Aspirations:
  She aims to be a researcher and public speaker who uncovers new psychological insights to help others heal, frustrated by repetitive advice that fails to address deeper issues.
  “I want to discover some really crazy shit we haven't discovered in psychology.” [53:00]

• Dopamine Loops and Mental Health:
  Veda shares her understanding of dopamine loops and the challenges of overcoming addiction, emphasizing the importance of reducing reliance on high-reward, low-effort activities to restore receptor sensitivity.
  “Everyone's receptors are getting shot... your receptors are picking up on that dopamine.” [44:26]

• Academic and Personal Challenges:
  Balancing her academic pursuits in social work with personal mental health struggles, Veda emphasizes the necessity of self-care to effectively support her future clients.
  “My mental health is a wreck. How can I help them if I can't help myself?” [85:50]

• Representation in Therapy:
  Veda highlights the lack of representation in the therapy field, advocating for more culturally competent therapists who understand the unique experiences of marginalized communities.
  “Less than 15% of therapists are black and less than 4% are queer.” [83:33]

Notable Quote:
"It's just really hard putting a kid into that. But I feel like I’d be able to make a life for that child that nobody else would." – Veda [62:11]

Conversation with Saren [66:03 - 88:37]

Overview:
Saren, a paralegal student aspiring to join the fire department, discusses her familial relationships, academic challenges, and personal growth. She emphasizes the importance of setting boundaries and maintaining mental health while pursuing her goals.

Key Points:

• Family Dynamics:
  Saren describes a strained relationship with her father while maintaining a positive bond with her mother and younger sister. She navigates the complexities of living with an inconsistent parent.
  “He’s really inconsistent. Very strange.” [67:50]

• Educational Path:
  Currently enrolled in paralegal studies, Saren shares her ambition to join the fire department, detailing the rigorous selection process and her commitment to achieving her goals despite setbacks.
  “I want to join the fire department. That’s something I really care about.” [70:07]

• Mental Health and Boundaries:
  Reflecting on her internship experience, Saren emphasizes the importance of setting boundaries with those who may exploit her efforts, highlighting the toll it takes on her mental health.
  “How can I help my students if I can’t help myself?” [85:50]

• Social Support and Relationships:
  She discusses the significance of friendships and support systems in overcoming personal challenges, advocating for open communication and mutual respect.
  “Don’t shut yourself off. Always talk to your friends when you get the chance.” [77:46]

• Advocacy for Representation:
  Saren echoes Veda’s concerns about representation in therapeutic professions, stressing the need for therapists who share similar cultural and social backgrounds to better understand and support clients.
  “I’d rather have somebody black and queer.” [83:54]

Notable Quote:
"Choose love over fear." – Veda [63:17]

Conclusion

Throughout this episode, Therapy Gecko offers a platform for candid and meaningful conversations about personal struggles, societal pressures, and the pursuit of self-improvement. Lyle's unique approach as a gecko psychologist fosters an environment where guests feel comfortable sharing their deepest fears and aspirations. The episode underscores the importance of self-awareness, cultural competency, and mental health care in navigating the complexities of modern life.

Final Thoughts:
"It's perfectly okay to start over whenever you need to." – Paulina [89:39]

End of Summary

Transcript

[Lyle]

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[Lyle]

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[Lyle]

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[Lyle]

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[Lyle]

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[Paulina]

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[Lyle]

C mintmobile.com hello. Welcome. How's it going? My name is Lyle, I'm a gecko. We are in New York City. It is a Saturday night at, I want to say 9pm ish at night. I am here in Washington Square Park. It is a park in Manhattan on the earth. There's a lot of people around and I ate a pint of Ice cream this afternoon at 3pm and let me tell you something. When you get high and you eat a pint of ice cream at 3pm, your day is fucked. I got high, I ate a pint of ice cream, I took a nap, I Woke up at 7:00pm you know how, you know how it feels when you get high and you eat a pint ice cream? You wake up at 7pm after a four hour nap. You feel as though the day is lost. You feel as though it cannot be redeemed. So I thought to myself, how do I redeem this day? How do I make it so that this was somewhat of a productive time? Oh, I know. I'll go to the park and I'll talk to people as a lizard. And let me tell you, the day is one. So if you're listening to this and it's 7pm and you just woke up from a nap after getting high and eating ice cream, just so you know, you can revive the rest of your day. If I can do it, you can do it. Okay. All right. I don't know, the day might still suck. Let's see. Let's talk to some people. As a gecko. Hi.

[Moolah]

Hi.

[Lyle]

Hi. What's your name?

[Moolah]

My name is Paulina.

[Lyle]

Paulina, nice to meet you.

[Moolah]

Nice to meet you too.

[Lyle]

How's life, Paulina?

[Moolah]

Life has been okay. I don't know, it's been kind of medium right now, honestly.

[Lyle]

Is it usually medium or is it. What's it like? Usually?

[Moolah]

Like, usually I feel like it's a little bit of a higher point. But like, right now I'm going through a little bit of a calmer section of my life, I guess I could say, because like before, I don't know, with like being younger and like being single and everything like that, you have a lot of more freedoms and you do a lot of more crazy.

[Lyle]

Okay.

[Moolah]

But like now I'm married.

[Lyle]

Whoa.

[Moolah]

Yeah, now I'm married. And I, like, have an entirely different, like, kind of outlook on life, I guess you could say, because, like, I have a husband now. I have like a stable person that I could come home to. And I mean, I'm not working right now, but like, usually I'd be working fucking seven days out of the week, like just tiring myself out, stressing myself out. At one point last year, I was working so much that I started losing.

[Lyle]

The hair out of my Holy.

[Moolah]

Yeah. Because I was stressing so much. And it's like, especially like in New York. I don't know, the working, the stress of working and like, having to keep up and, like, having to thrive. Like, here you can't be without money. You know what I mean?

[Lyle]

Yeah. It is a very hustle, Hustle based.

[Moolah]

Very, very, very hustle based environment and is just like, I don't know, I used to work so hard just to, like, be able to make my rent, be able to, like, make a living, and, like, be doing all the crazy shit that I used to do, like going to the bars, going to the clubs, paying for my friends and stuff like that. But, like, now I have, like, calmed down and, like, there's just one person to, like, share that with, you know?

[Lyle]

So when did you get married? How long ago?

[Moolah]

I got married in March. March 24. It was a rainy day. And in my culture, it's like a good sign whenever you get married in the rain, because then whenever you tie the knot, you can't untie a knot when it's wet.

[Lyle]

Oh. I was gonna ask you, where are you from?

[Moolah]

I'm from Russia.

[Lyle]

Oh, okay.

[Moolah]

Yeah, but I'm from Russia. I moved to America like, about 11 years ago.

[Lyle]

Cool.

[Moolah]

And I. First I came to New York, and then from New York, I came to Texas. From Texas to Los Angeles, and from Los Angeles to New York again.

[Lyle]

Where did you meet your husband?

[Moolah]

I met my husband here.

[Lyle]

Here? Did you meet him at one of the bars or clubs?

[Moolah]

I met him at Washington Square Park.

[Lyle]

Oh, really?

[Veda]

Yeah, I met him.

[Lyle]

Okay. How did you. How did that work?

[Moolah]

Oh, my gosh. It was actually a little bit of a crazy story because I was with my boyfriend at the time and we were all hanging around the same group. And so my now husband, he used to, like, come over there and try to, like, sneak me away and stuff like that. And I was like, no, no, no, no, no.

[Veda]

I'm in a relationship.

[Moolah]

I'm in a relationship. And I swore that he was a red flag. And then afterwards, I ended up breaking up with my ex and we ended up getting. I like, gave myself a couple of months to, like, recover because it was a little bit of a. It was a crazy situation. He was like, 30. I was, like 19 at the time. And I thought that older men were, like, more mature. I thought that they'd be able to, like, not only financially help, but, like, mentally as well. Like, kind of be able to, like, guide me and not be, like, as immature as I was.

[Lyle]

Sure.

[Moolah]

But it turns out that he was more immature than me, so I was like, no, I don't really.

[Lyle]

This is your ex that you're talking about?

[Moolah]

Yeah, my Ex that I'm talking about. And then I met my husband, which he's 23. And I realized that he was more mature than a 30 year old man. Like, he was working, he was doing his thing, he was taking care of stuff, like he was helping his mom, everything like that. And then it's like whenever I came into his life, he was doing that like Time Spy for me. And I was like, oh my God. Like it does like an age, like a 30 year old doesn't mean that it's like he's more mature.

[Lyle]

So are you. So you went from working like seven days a week.

[Moolah]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

To now. Is he like bringing home the nut for everyone?

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Yeah. Okay, what's he do? How does he bring home the nut?

[Moolah]

He's a construction worker as well as he does photography on the side. And he like, does photography for like parties. He does photography for skating, videography as well. And then I'm like his little assistant sometimes, you know.

[Lyle]

Okay, so you like work with him.

[Moolah]

Work with him. And I like edit his videos. I help him out with the posting, I help him out with his scheduling, everything like that. Because he like being a construction worker, he's like freelance right now and he like goes all around the place in New York, but. And so it's like really hard to build a schedule around that. But me, the amazing Paulina, I get.

[Lyle]

How long were you guys dating before you got married?

[Moolah]

We. Okay, honestly, our relationship moved really quick. We've known each other for like two years, but we've been together for 10 months now.

[Lyle]

Did you get married in Russia or here?

[Moolah]

We got married here. No, no, no. We did not get married in Russia. We got married here. And I met him two years ago. And then we ended up getting together like next, the year after that. And like two months after I broke up with my ex, we ended up getting together. We made things official in November, we got engaged in February, and then we got married in March.

[Lyle]

So you said that now is a calm time.

[Moolah]

Yeah, now. Now it's a calm time.

[Lyle]

Do you miss the crazy times at times?

[Moolah]

If I'm being honest, yes, I do. Because I was able to say, like, I did everything for myself type of thing. You know what I mean?

[Lyle]

Sure.

[Moolah]

I. I was. I could call myself independent. I could like tell people that, like, yeah, I did this, like, I own this place or like, I rent this place. I paid for this, I paid for that. But like, now it's nice because my husband takes care of me and I don't. And it's like, it's not even. He doesn't even like, put me in the position of like, oh, I'm paying for this, I'm paying for this. No, it's not even that. It's just because I feel like it's my own personal ego, you know what I mean, that takes me to that place sometime because it's just like, man, if I was single, I'd still be doing this, this and this. But like, now I can't, like.

[Lyle]

So when did you move to New York?

[Moolah]

From Russia to New York from Russia? I moved 11 years ago.

[Lyle]

Yeah, okay, you mentioned that. You mentioned it. Why did you come to New York?

[Moolah]

My mom got married to my stepfather and he's an American. And so they fell in love, everything like that. He was their English tutor. And so she ended up moving over here. And my dad didn't really know because, like, the immigration stuff was like really, really off at that time for some reason. And it was really expensive to get papers. And so we lived in New York for a little bit because it's a blue state, you know what I mean?

[Lyle]

And it's easier to not get deported.

[Moolah]

Yeah, it's definitely easier to not get deported. And then once, once we had all our papers figured out and everything like that, we moved on to Texas, and then Texas, from Moscow to New York is like a little bit of a culture shock.

[Lyle]

I'm sure it is. Tell me what the culture shock felt like.

[Moolah]

The culture shock, honestly, it wasn't even from Moscow to New York. The culture shock was really from the point of me, like, not being able to speak English properly whenever I came here. And it was like, really hard because I went to like a predominantly, like, American school and they used.

[Lyle]

How old were you when you got here?

[Moolah]

I was 10 years old. Okay, 10 years old whenever I came here. And people, I don't know, like, kids are menaces.

[Lyle]

Like, yeah, People make fun of you.

[Moolah]

Yeah, all the time. They used to call me like a commie whore. Like, I'm a communist, go back to my country, everything like that.

[Lyle]

Kind of advanced for 11 years old, I'm saying.

[Moolah]

But like, kids are menaces nowadays, bro. Like, I remember all of those times, like whenever my fellow 10 year olds were just like, you need to go back to your own country, blah, blah, blah, blah.

[Lyle]

Your.

[Moolah]

Your country is the one that started a cold war with us, everything like that. Like.

[Lyle]

So I gotta ask you, like, is it, is it like weird being Russian now?

[Moolah]

Honestly? Yeah. Honestly, yeah. With like everything going on in the world, like, with the Russian Ukraine, war, everything like that.

[Lyle]

It's.

[Moolah]

It's a hard time being, like, Russian or, like, calling yourself Russian, but, like, I'm mixed. My grandma's Ukrainian. I was born in Russia, and I grew up speaking Ukrainian, but, like, I ended up just losing it over time.

[Lyle]

Do people in Russia, do they like Putin? Like, does anyone like him, or do they all not like him?

[Moolah]

I feel like it's media manipulation whenever people are, like, saying, like, oh, no, Putin this, Putin that. But he's. I feel like people know that he's not a good leader. They know that he has gotten to, like, he's gotten to the top of power, and now he doesn't want to, like, get it away. You know what I mean?

[Lyle]

You don't have, like, a. Like, a weird uncle or something who's like, nah, I think he's a cool guy. Like, how. You know?

[Moolah]

I bet I do. I feel like whenever I visited Russia last time, which was the last time I visited was in 2019, and there was times of whenever my dad, my stepdad was, like, talking to my mom's friends, and they were like, no, Putin is awesome. Putin is great. And then the war started happening, and they were like, oh, it's not really how it's playing out to be. Like, he's not that. He's not that good of a leader anymore. Like, in the past, I don't know, in the 90s or in the early 2000s, whenever he was in the presidential run, everything like that, maybe he was good. Maybe he was doing good for the country, but now the power has definitely gotten to the top of his head, and it's ridiculous.

[Lyle]

So back to your personal life. Yeah. Do you, like, what do you hope for the future for yourself?

[Moolah]

I want to start a family. I really. I've been dreaming of being a mom, like, ever since I was little, and I feel like starting a family, especially being married, is the next step. It's just. It's just really hard with, like, the economic position, everything like that, everything that's going on in the world right now. Like, it's. It's hard putting a kid into that. But then at the same time, I feel like I'd be able to make a life for that child that nobody else would. You know what I mean?

[Lyle]

That.

[Moolah]

Yeah, it wouldn't matter with anything.

[Lyle]

It's hard. It's weird to, like, you know, I mean, it's hard to be, like, optimistic about the future. I've thought about, like, you know, by the time I'm like, if I have a kid when I'm like say like 37 or whatever, like in 10 years.

[Moolah]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Then by the time that my kid is like 18, I'm ready to go to college. I'll be like 50 fucking 5.

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Who knows what the world is going to look like. There might like I'm worried about like there being like no economic opportunities for my kid. Because even like you like being 18 going to college now is so different than it is like 28 years ago for our parents.

[Moolah]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

You know, like it's, it's worrisome that we have like Gen Z, I feel like has Gen Z and genopa have like. I, I would assume maybe I'm just talking shit, but it seems as though they have much less economic opportunities.

[Moolah]

Yeah, yeah, no, I definitely agree with that. And it's like the fact that I don't know now college isn't really like where at least not guarantee anymore. It's not, it's not guaranteed anymore. Like it's definitely. If you have like a dream to go to college like you can, you can do everything in your power to like go into college and stuff like that. I was just talking about that to my friends today. I worked at Chipotle before and I had people that had master's degrees, bachelor's degrees that were working and like serving food to people. And it's just like you spent all that time, you spent all that money and you're still working a mid eye job.

[Lyle]

It's a huge bummer.

[Moolah]

Yeah, it's a, it's a terrible bummer. And it's like now people that like have business degrees or something like that, they're, they're even dropping that and they're starting to do content creating or they're starting to cook. Like they're starting to make their own restaurants or something like that. They don't even use their degree in what's really what they got it initially for, you know what I mean? And like I went to college for a couple of semesters and it was honestly like, I feel like it was even more stress than working whenever I was working here because like in college.

[Lyle]

Was it more stressful than working at Chipotle?

[Moolah]

I feel like that.

[Cameron]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Lyle]

I feel like I'm very genuinely. I'm surprised to hear that. Look, working at Chipotle looks very stressful.

[Moolah]

It's, it is, it honestly is. And like I used to, I used to do everything. Like I used to be in prep team. I used to be the hostess, like the cashier and I used to be the one rolling your burritos, you know what I mean? And it was like we had to worry about every little thing. We had to worry about having the right amount of food prepped and it wasn't the regular amount of people every single day, you know, so it's like we had to get the amount of food prep correctly, we had to roll everything correctly. We couldn't really waste anything. And it was just, I don't know. And then balancing that on top of school. School with like having to get your assignments in time to have to get good grades, to come out with a good GPA to keep your scholarship, or if, I don't know, if you're like paying for it. It's so hard. It's ridiculously hard.

[Lyle]

I feel like having a job like that is good training to be a mom. Because being a mom is also like. Yeah, it's like, it's like a. You can't like college. Like you can fuck around.

[Moolah]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

You know, but like, if you work at like Chipotle or whatever, you can't just like, like be on your phone the whole time. You gotta like roll burritos, you gotta scoop things, you gotta do shit.

[Moolah]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

You have a kid, you gotta. You can't be on your phone all the time or else child will die. You kind of do have to roll the kid a little bit. Yeah, you gotta roll the kid. You gotta change a diaper. Yeah. I like, like when you're like the logistical mechanics of changing a diaper are kind of seem to be similar to rolling a burrito. You know, you're moving things with your hands and, you know, doing this and the. Paula. Pauline.

[Moolah]

Paulina.

[Lyle]

Paulina. Yeah, well, Paulina. Okay, I want to ask you this before we go because you came up to me before I settled this crap up and you were like, I've been present for a lot of your other gecko sessions and I've always wanted to get on one. Have we covered. Is there anything else that we didn't cover that you want to make sure we cover before we go?

[Moolah]

I feel like this is exactly what I've been yearning for my entire life.

[Veda]

Genuinely.

[Lyle]

Great. Paula, anything else you want to say to the people at the computer before we go?

[Moolah]

Be happy, be optimistic. Life is great. Despite everything that's going on, you create your own shit, Honestly.

[Lyle]

Thank you, Paula.

[Moolah]

Bye.

[Lyle]

Have a good one. Thank you for talking to a gecko.

[Cameron]

Hi, my name is Moolah.

[Lyle]

Moolah, like money. Yeah. What's up, Moolah? How's life? How's it going? What are you doing at the park tonight?

[Cameron]

Right now, I'm just really spending time with my boyfriend, my friends, just getting my mind off of stuff because I've been trying to look for a job, finishing up school and just having a bit stressed. So I'm here. Just take off a little bit of weight from the day.

[Lyle]

See, I'm, like, tempted to ask you what you're stressed about, but the whole thing of going to the park is to not talk about it, so would you like to not talk about what you're stressed about?

[Cameron]

I can talk about it.

[Lyle]

Okay. What are you stressed about? Well.

[Cameron]

It'S just, like, in my life, I feel like there's a lot of people coming to me and trying to distract me from what I'm really supposed to do. Like, I'm really trying to get into, like, law and stuff. And I feel really discredited and discouraged by people around me based on how I look and where I'm from. Because growing up in, like, kind of a poorer area, it's not really expected from people. So I wanted to really, like, do that, but it gets discouraged. So I've been dealing with a lot of, like, setbacks when it comes to even getting work, because it's that automatic, oh, how much do you make. Where do you live at in ethnicity questions? So it's harder.

[Lyle]

So when you say that, like, the people around you are discouraging you from what you actually want to do. Like, is this, like, your friends or your family or, like, just, like, random people that you talk to?

[Cameron]

I say some of my friends and family. Yeah. Like, okay, a better way to describe it is more, like, a lot of my passions and stuff I've came to my family about, they tend to put me down about it and be like, that's not really something you can do. And, like, they just kind of push me down and say, I'm not.

[Lyle]

Do you have. Do you have people in your life who are the opposite?

[Cameron]

Some, yeah. And I try to focus, spending time with them, for sure.

[Lyle]

Okay, can I. I'm very curious. What are the, like, the people in your life when they tell you that you can't do things? What are the reasons they give you for why you can't do things?

[Paulina]

Well.

[Cameron]

I think you can tell, like, I'm kind of alternative. I grew up a bit. Like, I didn't grow up with many good connections, and a lot of my family is, like, kind of not used to getting far. That's a better way to describe it.

[Lyle]

So what kind of Law do you want to practice?

[Cameron]

I want to practice criminal justice because I have a lot of disdain towards how the police system is going right now and how it's just really, like, affecting people. How, like, the political landscape of stuff is really strong right now. And like, I'm really upset about, like, all the stuff going on in the world, for sure.

[Lyle]

Have you been studying law or going to like, undergrad or anything like that?

[Cameron]

I have been doing law classes, yes. And it's something that inspired me more especially seeing the effects on like, certain, like, based on political things, how it affects the policing in the city. And I want to do more to kind of help with that, like, especially with the things like immigration or.

[Moolah]

Like.

[Cameron]

The issues with all that other stuff. Because I know I have family who have friends and like, girlfriends who are actively getting issues with immigration and stuff, even people I know. So I want to make a difference in that.

[Lyle]

Did you grow up in New York?

[Cameron]

Yes.

[Lyle]

What part of New York did you grow up in?

[Cameron]

Lower east side.

[Lyle]

Oh, cool, cool. Did you go to high school here?

[Cameron]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

When did your, like, interest in law begin? Was it kind of around that time or has it been. Been?

[Cameron]

Yeah, I feel like it was. I actually feel like I first started getting interested in it, like, when I was younger, but I changed my kind of outlook to law after I saw how, like, teaching and counseling wasn't really profitable.

[Lyle]

Yeah, that's part of the. Well, you want to do criminal justice, right? Yeah. So would you ever be like a public defender?

[Cameron]

Yeah, I wanted to kind of do it, but at the same time, it's like you got to defend the worst people as a public defender.

[Lyle]

Because I'm pretty sure that is true. You can't choose your fine choose, unfortunately.

[Cameron]

So, like, I. I could get like the best person in America or I could get like the devil.

[Lyle]

Right? Right.

[Cameron]

You really don't know?

[Lyle]

Right. I always. I always kind of wonder that, like, how public defenders have to, like, reconcile when, like. Because, like, there's certain situations where it's like, you know, they did it, you know, so it's like if you're a public defender and you gotta defend them even though you know they did it, I guess there's a thing of like, okay, I know they did it, but I do believe in, like, due process under the law. So, like, I will defend, not necessarily the truth or not of whether or not they did this crime, but I will defend their right to the due process of the law.

[Cameron]

I feel like being a lawyer, the mindset has to go first for the bag. Because morality doesn't really exist.

[Lyle]

That's so. Okay, so you. You want to be, like a lawyer going for the bag?

[Cameron]

Well, I mean, like, if I'm a public defender, then I'm going to work for the bag, and then I'm going to get in my own thing.

[Lyle]

I feel like public defender, I think, is like the. The very not bag. Lawyer.

[Cameron]

That's what I'm saying.

[Lyle]

Okay.

[Cameron]

If you lose in cases, then you're definitely not getting a bag.

[Lyle]

Okay. Morality is not real.

[Cameron]

Not in public defense.

[Lyle]

Oh, I thought. I thought we're talking, like, philosophically, because there are actually.

[Cameron]

Yeah, I think in philosophically. Yeah. Too.

[Lyle]

Well. Yeah, because there's. It's like. You know what? Like, there's a lot of people who do believe there is no such thing as, like, objective morality. Yeah. It's a thing that we are subjectively deciding is both as individuals and as a collective.

[Cameron]

Yeah, it's kind of like we pick and choose what is right and wrong based on what we want to do. Like, even with certain people, they'll be like. Like, for example, with religion, if you were to take out one verse, some people would be like, yes, you need to follow this. But some people be like, no, that's not good. And if you do, that's a sin, and it's like radicals, so. Yeah, I forgot what I was saying.

[Lyle]

No, that's okay. Well, you know, I do think about. I do think about it sometimes. Just, like, look, like in the animal world, they are just killing each other all the time. They're just killing. And there's no. Like. Like, the lion is not like, oh, is it, like, wrong to viciously murder this zebra? But also, I do the same thing. You know, I go to Chick Fil A, I eat a delicious chicken sandwich. I inadvertently killed another living thing by eating it.

[Cameron]

And that's how I feel when I eat shrimp. I'm allergic to shellfish.

[Lyle]

Why do you eat shrimp if you're allergic to selfish?

[Cameron]

Cuz, like, hear me out, okay.

[Lyle]

You sure?

[Cameron]

The Popeyes shrimp Popcorn shrimp. Popeyes has shrimp popcorn. Popeyes popcorn shrimp.

[Lyle]

Yes, Popeyes has popcorn shrimp.

[Cameron]

It's amazing. It's beautiful, but it hurts. But it's worth it.

[Lyle]

What do you mean it hurt? Oh, it hurts because it, like.

[Cameron]

Okay, my throat might squeeze up, It'll itch. My eyes will water. But the taste is beautiful. So I feel like at the end of the day, it's about the joys of life, not the pain. Pain is beauty.

[Lyle]

I'm. I. Okay. I'm trying. I want to dive more into this allegory of Popeyes popcorn shrimp.

[Cameron]

Yes.

[Lyle]

Now we talk about it even though you're allergic.

[Cameron]

Yes.

[Lyle]

As an allegory to life.

[Cameron]

Yes, I.

[Lyle]

Sometimes. You're allergic to life.

[Veda]

Exactly.

[Lyle]

But you just got to keep living it.

[Cameron]

And this is definitely one of the things I feel like I'm discouraged from. My boyfriend will tell me all the time not to eat it because I'm allergic and it'll fuck up my health, but I'm like, dude, it tastes good. And, like, I feel like I'm being diverted from true happiness.

[Lyle]

I gotta be honest with you. In, like, most of the other situations you've brought up where people were discouraging you from things, I would tell you to not listen to them. This one, I would maybe consider listening to your boyfriend.

[Cameron]

But what if I don't want to?

[Lyle]

Or at least a doctor or some shit. But how many more popcorn shrimp you got in you before you go into anaphylactic shot?

[Cameron]

I feel like, what's more important, longevity or happiness?

[Lyle]

You know what? Eat all the popcorn shrimp you want.

[Cameron]

If that's the case, I have smoked at least five blunts every day with perfect virus. Once every day for the last two years minimum. So I feel like I may or may not be immortal.

[Lyle]

Once, man. Do you like getting high or is it.

[Cameron]

It's very fun.

[Lyle]

Okay.

[Cameron]

It brings, like, it brings peace to my life. I feel like all the things inedible for this. It's kind of hitting, but I feel like it helps me really see things for how they are calmly. Because I feel like we're all very angry people and we all get mad at stunts.

[Lyle]

Do you get less angry when you're stunned?

[Cameron]

Yeah, I feel like I'm way less angry, especially when I do want to get popcorn shrimp and then my boyfriend discourages me from it.

[Lyle]

I still have the popcorn shrimp. I don't know. I actually don't. I go to Popeyes semi frequently. I don't think that I've never seen they have popcorn shrimp.

[Cameron]

It is 100% there. I know for a fact.

[Lyle]

Okay.

[Cameron]

I love the Popeyes popcorn shrimp.

[Lyle]

Well, I'm going to try to wrap up this podcast as soon as possible so I can go to Popeyes afterwards.

[Cameron]

You should.

[Lyle]

This is not sponsored by Popeyes. What's your name? Moolah.

[Cameron]

Yes.

[Lyle]

Moolah, good luck on your dreams and hopes in life.

[Cameron]

Yes. I barely know what I was talking about. I can't lie. But I really love Popeyes popcorn shrimp. I'm voting for Popeyes.

[Lyle]

Is there anything else you want to say to the people the computer before.

[Cameron]

We go save the wildlife? I love geckos.

[Lyle]

Thank you Mola yes, the reviews and.

[Ice Cube]

Ratings are in and Ice Cube's big three is the surprise hit of the summer. This Saturday, 4pm Eastern on CBS. With playoff elimination on the line, the sports stars will be flocking to Los Angeles to witness the most physical, fiercest and competitive basketball in the world. Miami's Michael Beasley and Lance Stevenson must win over Houston to make the playoffs, reeling from last week's savage beating at the hands of Chicago's possessed Montrez Harrell. Last time these teams met, Miami beat Houston, but they are a dangerous team having their manhood at stake. Then breakout star Dwight Howard of the LA Riot will battle Gary Payton's Boston squad in a two do a die match for both teams. Will LA avenge their previous shocking loss to perennial basketball Boston rivals? To survive, six teams are allowed for four spots and all must win. Don't miss the Big three, the three on three basketball league everyone is talking about. There's no crying in the big three and the no hold spot action starts Saturday at 4pm Eastern, 1pm Pacific followed by two games on Vice starting at 6:30 Eastern. Presented by iHeart.

[Ryan Seacrest]

Hey, it's Ryan Seacrest for Albertsons and Safeway. Now through August 26th, it's back to Deals time where you can enjoy storewide deals and earn four times points. Look for in store tags to earn on eligible items from Califia Farms, Pillsbury Crescent, Yoplait, General Mills, Prego, Bertoli, Heinz and Kraft. Then clip the offer in the app for automatic event long savings. Shop in store or online for easy drive up and go, pickup or delivery subject to availability restrictions apply. Visit Albertsons or Safeway.com for more details.

[Cameron]

Ugh.

[Lyle]

Come on.

[Paulina]

Why is this taking so long? This thing is ancient.

[Lenovo Representative]

Still using yesterday's tech Upgrade to the ThinkPad X1 Carbon Ultra Ultra Light, ultra powerful and built for serious productivity with Intel Core Ultra processors, blazing speed and AI powered performance. It keeps up with your business, not the other way around.

[Paulina]

Whoa, this thing moves.

[Lenovo Representative]

Stop hitting snooze on new tech. Win the tech [e-mail] Lenovo Lenovo unlock AI experiences with the ThinkPad X1 carbon powered by Intel Core Ultra processors so you can work, create and boost productivity all on one device.

[Lyle]

Huddle up.

[Ice Cube]

We got one play.

[Lyle]

Everything we work for comes down to this quick question. Speaking of workouts, how would you rate your athletic program?

[Ryan Seacrest]

Bro, we're in the middle of the state championship.

[Lyle]

Oh, so like a B then? Dude, get out of our huddle. Well, @holmes.com, we leave it all on the field to get you detailed information on local schools.

[Ice Cube]

Off the field.

[Lyle]

Off the field. Copy. All right. Go sports.

[Saren]

How'd he even get in here?

[Ice Cube]

Homes.com.

[Lyle]

We'Ve done your homework. Hello.

[Cameron]

Hey.

[Lyle]

What's your name?

[Veda]

Veda.

[Lyle]

Veda, What's.

[Veda]

What's your name?

[Lyle]

Lyle.

[Veda]

Nice to meet you.

[Lyle]

What's up, V? How's life?

[Veda]

Life is good. I just moved here. I'm going to school here. It's a big change.

[Lyle]

What are you studying?

[Veda]

Psychology.

[Lyle]

Psychology.

[Veda]

Wait, wait, wait. How's your life?

[Lyle]

How's my life?

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

No one ever asked how my life is.

[Veda]

Why not?

[Lyle]

No, that's. That's not true at all. People ask me how my life is a lot, and I don't. And I deflect.

[Veda]

You don't like talking about yourself?

[Lyle]

I like talking about myself sometimes.

[Veda]

Is this why you do this? To talk about other people?

[Lyle]

Yeah, sometimes I do do this to talk about other people. It's fun to talk about other people.

[Veda]

You don't like talking about yourself?

[Lyle]

I do like talking about myself. I would be completely, utterly lying if I said I didn't like talking to myself about myself. I talk about myself fair. A fair amount on this show, I think. How am I doing? Well, I mentioned at the beginning of this that I. I had, like, a big plan for today. I was gonna, like, edit a bunch of stuff. I was gonna get a bunch of stuff done. It was gonna be really productive. And then my friend texted me, and he's like, yo, there's a block party outside of our house. And I was like, do you live here? I live in New York. Yeah. I live in Brooklyn. And I was like, all right, I'll go to this block party, because that sounds fun. And then I made a mistake that I've made many. I make the same. You know what's so annoying is I've made the same mistake all the time. I quit smoking weed for, like, three days. It was awesome.

[Veda]

Oh, three days.

[Lyle]

And I got high during the day, which is bad, because if you do that, if you. If I get stoned during the day at this, like, block party, the rest of the day is fucked.

[Veda]

You're fucked.

[Lyle]

I'm fucked? Yeah, I'm fucked. And so I got stone during the day. And then I went home, I took a long nap. Then it was 7pm you ever take a nap at 4pm and you wake up at 7.

[Veda]

Yeah. And then, and then you wake up and you feel like really anxious cuz you're like confused as fuck and like it's like the end of the day and like you feel like, what the fuck happened?

[Lyle]

Yes, yes, exactly. Exactly. And so I go. And so I was in that state and I was like, all right, there's no way I'm gonna be able to like sit alone on a computer.

[Veda]

Wait, what about that? Did you eat ice cream? Didn't you say you ate ice cream?

[Lyle]

I tried to gracefully skip over that, but yes, I did also eat ice cream. Okay, get the Verona Ver. What's your name?

[Veda]

It's like think of Darth Vader. Vader.

[Lyle]

Vader. Vader Vader. They have. Normally I'm a Ben and Jerry's guy. Haagen Dazs.

[Veda]

Oh, I like Haagen Dazs.

[Lyle]

Haagen Dazs just came out with black and white cookie ice cream.

[Veda]

Black and white cookie.

[Lyle]

I promise I'm not sponsored by Popeyes or Haagen Dazs. I wish I was.

[Veda]

Yeah, maybe you should be.

[Lyle]

Maybe I should be.

[Veda]

You keep advertising for food.

[Lyle]

Haagen Dazs. Black and white cookie ice cream. Okay. Vanilla bean ice cream. They put swirls of.

[Veda]

Wait, that's what you got?

[Lyle]

This is what I got.

[Veda]

This is.

[Lyle]

Okay, yeah. This is the second time I've gotten it. It's great. And here's what I always do. I eat like pretty much all of it except for like.

[Veda]

Wait, what size is this?

[Lyle]

It's like a pint.

[Veda]

Okay.

[Lyle]

I eat pretty much all of it and then I save one bite and then I was like. And I throw it away and I'm like, well, at least I didn't eat the whole thing.

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Do you, do you ever do that?

[Veda]

Yeah, all the time. You save the last and then throw it away and makes you feel better.

[Lyle]

Yeah. So 4pm I got a whole pint of ice cream in me. I'm not knockout. Three hours, wake up, confused, sweaty, feeling like, what the. This is. You know, what am I going to do with my life? And then I was like, all right, I can't. I have to save this day somehow. I'm not going to be able to sit alone on my computer and do stuff. But I do. I think I could summon the energy to go to the park and talk to people because I like, I like doing this. This is fun.

[Veda]

No, no, same I. The whole entire day. I got really anxious in the beginning of the day. No, listen, so first I needed to get My pants, my jeans, like, hemmed and, like, altered. So I, like, looked up this place and I knew it was gonna be expensive when I had to go to the 10th floor for it.

[Lyle]

Oh.

[Veda]

So I go up the 10th floor, and I'm thinking, like, I mean, how much do you expect it to be to, like, hem your pants or, like, you know, shorten it or, like, alter it?

[Lyle]

If you asked me to define what hemming is, I don't know if I could.

[Veda]

I mean, like, it's just like, when they shorten, like, I said, oh, okay.

[Lyle]

Okay, yeah, yeah. Okay. So they, like, you tailored or.

[Veda]

Yeah, yeah. Or like, they, like, make it a little bit tighter. Like, how.

[Lyle]

How much.

[Veda]

How much do you think it is?

[Lyle]

Where did you get it done? In Manhattan? Yeah, on the 10th floor. Where?

[Veda]

Manhattan floor, dude. I don't know. I just moved here on the 10th floor.

[Lyle]

Okay, the 10th floor of a building to get your jeans hemmed? $150, literally. Was it 100 exactly?

[Veda]

Well, like, she said it was like 150 to 170. Like, that was, like, one of the numbers she gave me, depending on, like, what she wanted to do. But, like, when I heard that, I.

[Lyle]

Was like, to buy a new pair of pants at that point. Jesus.

[Veda]

I had to get the dad jeans, like, the thrift store, and they were, like, good. The design was good, so I just needed to get them tighter. But she said that, and I was like. My whole body was, like, super tensed up, and I, like. I walked all the way here, and I'm like, I'm not fucking. No, I'm not. They wanted, like, an arm and leg for just hem my freaking jeans. I thought it was gonna be, like, 10 bucks.

[Lyle]

Oh, welcome to Manhattan.

[Veda]

No, literally, welcome to Manhattan.

[Lyle]

Where did you move from?

[Veda]

Florida.

[Lyle]

Florida. Oh, welcome to Manhattan. Yeah, Florida is like, where in Florida did you move from?

[Veda]

I was in undergrad before, so I was in Orlando for, like, five years. But before that, I grew up in, like, Fort Lauderdale area.

[Lyle]

So why'd you move to New York?

[Veda]

For my masters at nyu.

[Lyle]

Oh, cool. Okay. So Florida is everything that we assume about it. Correct.

[Veda]

What do you assume about it?

[Lyle]

I assume a lot of people there are kind of crazy. Like, you know, I mean, like, here. That's a good point. Well, you know, like, Florida, man culture.

[Veda]

I mean, yeah, like, the people, the driving there. Like, you know, they say, like, oh, Florida, like, horrible drivers, I guess. But I thought people in Florida are pretty cool.

[Lyle]

Are you, like, excited to be here in New York? No.

[Veda]

Definitely. I really like it here, because nobody gives a About what you do.

[Lyle]

Like, do people in Florida give a. About what you do?

[Veda]

I mean, I guess more in the way where, like, if you walk out here and you dance or, like, shao or wear whatever you want, like, nobody blinks. Like, no. Like, nobody cares. And I With that, totally, so. Because I can just do whatever I want and, like, nobody remembers your name. Nobody cares about you.

[Lyle]

Nobody cares about you at all. You could scream at the top of.

[Veda]

Your lungs, you're wearing a lizard.

[Lyle]

I am wearing a lizard costume, and I'm wearing a lizard. I, I. Yeah, nobody cares about you here. It's great. I mean, you could be, like, I could. Here's the thing. Like, I could see right here. I could lay face down on the ground.

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

For an infinite amount of time before anyone gave a shit. Which is as. Which is a little sad, but. But true. You. I could scream as loud as I want. Nobody would care. You can. New York's a great place to cry. I don't know if you've cried in public yet.

[Veda]

I have already.

[Lyle]

And did anyone bother you? No, I. I was with my friend the other night, and we saw a lady crying in public, and my friend was like, should I go over and, like, say something? I feel bad. I was like, which it. Which is nice in theory. Oh. But I. I mean, I'm curious what you think. I. Because I feel like if. If I'm a lady crying in public, I probably want to be left alone.

[Veda]

Was your friend a guy?

[Lyle]

Yeah. Okay, well, okay, so if you're crying in public and, like, like, someone came up to you, would you want that, or would you want to be like, I'll leave me alone?

[Veda]

Honestly, it depends on the state you're in. If you're, like, really, really stressed out, someone coming up to you probably would get you even more aggravated. But if you're in a little bit of an open state where you're okay, like, you'd actually wish someone was here for you. Because, like, I don't know anyone here. That could have been, like, a nice thing for me. Like, I don't have any friends here. I don't have my family here. So I was crying in here the other day, and if somebody came up to me and asked, I'd probably be like, that's nice.

[Lyle]

Like, can I ask you what you were crying about?

[Veda]

Yeah, honestly, it was just tears of joy, actually. But, like, I think it was mixed with bittersweet. It was because, like, I was feeling a little bit kind of sad or Like, I had, like, a little insecure moment. Like, we all have insecure moments. And. But right after, like, right before I could even sink into the funk of that insecure moment, the waiter of the restaurant I was at gave me a rose. Like, he was like, here, like, here's your rose.

[Lyle]

Oh, you're crying at a restaurant? No, no, no, no.

[Veda]

I cried after tears of joy because I felt like, God sees me. I was like, that was really nice. I. I think. I mean, I don't know what your concept of God is, but I don't really think God is, like, a man in the sky or like, just a ball of energy. I think it, like, has a personal relationship with me and is, like. I think God is love. I think any, like, loving, gone.

[Lyle]

Do you believe that God is something, like, external, that like. Like, there's an external thing that's keeping an eye on you?

[Veda]

I think God is within us.

[Lyle]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Veda]

I think God is within us.

[Lyle]

I'm with that. I'm with that.

[Veda]

And I think that any experience that has, like, love in it, warmth in it, authenticity in it, I believe, like, that's God working through people and working, like, orchestrating events to make you feel seen. So to me, when I was, like, feeling sad and then that waiter gave me a rose, I was like, what the fuck? Like, I feel so seen. And I just walked and I cried. It just made me feel better.

[Lyle]

I. Maybe. Okay, I may be. I'm not convinced on the idea that there's an external or even like an internal God that is orchestrating events in your life.

[Veda]

You think things are just coincidences?

[Lyle]

Totally. I think everything. But I believe that because we live in an inherently meaningless world and God is within us, we as God are free to attribute meaning to whatever we want. And that meaning is completely valid because we're God. And because if nothing is valid, we get to decide what's valid.

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

So if you want to create some. Whatever narrative you create in your brain about your life and about the world, you as God, that narrative is correct and valid.

[Veda]

You know, I mean, and also because, like, neuroscientifically, your brain is going to go out of its way to prove your narratives that you live on.

[Lyle]

Yes, sure. All the time.

[Veda]

Like, so whatever you believe to be true or whatever your preference perception is of life, your brain will scope it out or it will see everything in life and make that meaning. It reflects back whatever you think.

[Lyle]

100%.

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

You study psychology?

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

How long have you been studying psychology?

[Veda]

So I did my Undergrad in it, which was like, four years. But everything was online because of COVID so I don't think I got to learn as much as people would if it wasn't in Covid.

[Lyle]

This has a scientific basis to it, right? The idea that, like, what you like, the narratives you craft in your own brain end up having some effect on your external reality.

[Veda]

Not some. It's like your whole entire external reality is a filter through your inner world.

[Lyle]

Which makes you God. I'm the God. I'm God of my own external universe.

[Paulina]

Exactly.

[Veda]

Yeah. I definitely. You could see it that way.

[Lyle]

What do you want to do with psychology?

[Veda]

I want to be a speaker, writer, and, I don't know, advice therapist, I guess. Like, work one on one. I just want to. I want to discover some really crazy shit we haven't discovered in psychology and then use that to help people heal. Because I feel like there's so much brokenness. And I'm like. And there's a. We have found out a lot. But I'm like, there has to be something else we don't know, because everyone is still really, really depressed. Or, like, maybe I can explain an idea in a way that nobody has before.

[Lyle]

So what you just said, everyone is. I want. We want to discover something new because everyone is still really depressed. We kind of know why everyone's really depressed.

[Veda]

What do you think?

[Lyle]

Well, because, I mean, a lot of reasons, like economic turmoil and overuse of technology and dopamine loops and less reasons.

[Veda]

What do you guys know about dopamine lubes?

[Lyle]

What do I know about dopamine loops? Probably. I know. I know about them only through anecdotal experience. Nothing. No, you probably have significantly. As in 100% more text.

[Veda]

This isn't a test. I just wanted to know. I just was, like, doing some research about it.

[Lyle]

Okay.

[Veda]

Last night. And I, like, realized. You know how people tell you, like, oh, like, just get off your phone and enjoy the present moment. Like, why is everyone, like, addicted to, like, weed or your phone? Like, being real life? It's not as easy as they say it is because chemically, your receptors. Everyone's receptors are fucking shot. Yeah, exactly. So if you wake up and you go on your phone, if you ever. Every time you're stressed out, you, like, grab your joint. If every time you're upset you go eat food, your receptors are getting. Your receptors become more sensitive to that dopamine. But it's high reward with really low effort. So anytime you do something that is higher effort with low reward, maybe, like, a skill Like a puzzle or meditating. Like, your receptors aren't picking up on that dopamine. It literally, chemically does not feel good to you anymore.

[Lyle]

Yeah, yeah, but our receptors. Can they be. Tell us, Veda. Can our receptors be restored to us?

[Veda]

Definitely. Yeah. It's. You basically are just gonna have to dial down your usage of whatever vice you're kind of addicted to that's giving you too much high reward with really low effort. And then what? Go ahead and then replace it with something else, which is gonna feel uncomfortable, obviously.

[Lyle]

Are you in any dopamine loops? Do you have any vices?

[Veda]

No, I. Recently. I mean, I'm sure I do, but they're. I really tried to. I have replaced them with healthier things because I recently quit alcohol, weed, and nicotine and coffee just because, like, I got quick coffee. Yeah.

[Lyle]

So one of those. Yeah.

[Veda]

Well, no, because, like, your nervous system, everyone's nervous system is really sensitive. So every time you feel that, like, jitterness, like, sometimes it could be from insecurity, or sometimes it can be from coffee. And I want to be able to know if it's because I'm insecure or, like, if. If I'm having an insecure moment, if I'm having, like, a wound come up. And it's harder to tell if I'm drinking coffee because now my nervous system is, like, feeling jittery from that food. I still drink Matcha and, like, tea, but that is crazy. I just stopped coffee just because I want to be able to track my body a little bit more accurately.

[Lyle]

Was it difficult to quit all those. Did you quit all three of them at once?

[Veda]

Yeah, I honestly just had a really. I experienced ego death. And through that, I was able to quit because I wanted to try really hard to be able to retain everything I felt. And I thought if I did it scientifically, I could do it. And that was just one of the ways that I found that I could kind of keep a healthier state. But this. It sounds crazy.

[Lyle]

No, it doesn't sound crazy at all.

[Veda]

Okay, well, so that's why, like, I. I don't like to compare my experience to other people, because if I didn't go through that, I would. It would have been way harder.

[Lyle]

What did your ego death look like?

[Veda]

Honestly, dude, it's too personal. And I haven't been wanting to talk about it. One day I'm gonna write a book on it.

[Lyle]

Okay, you don't have to talk about.

[Veda]

It, but, yeah, I just thought I might as well share that. It's been, like, it Was so intense that I, like, I didn't share it with anyone because I.

[Lyle]

When did it, when did it happen?

[Veda]

At the end of March.

[Lyle]

How do you define an ego death?

[Veda]

When you lose all concept of self and separation and you have no. I lost concept of time.

[Lyle]

Was it terrifying?

[Veda]

It was, it was scary at first because I didn't understand what was happening.

[Lyle]

Yeah.

[Veda]

And then I. It became honestly, like, surreal. And it was the best feeling. It's what made me believe in God. Honestly. Like, that is why, like, I. I am so passionate about, like, love and like God with him. Because before that I had so much resentment towards religion and like, because I grew up really Christian.

[Moolah]

Like, my.

[Veda]

My mom was super strict about it, but I had so much like, guilt and like fear based religion. Like, I, I just, I hated it. I. I grew very resentful and I like just stopped caring about it for a while. Like, for honestly most of my college years. And then after this, like, my brain fucking. It's exploded and like, I never went back.

[Lyle]

So it's interesting that you say that your ego death was a beautiful thing because I. I had an ego death back in February that led to, like, existential depression because like, once, once I realized just how much I don't matter, like, that's how I kind of feel. Like, the ego death is. It led me to a bit of a state of nihilism which I've been able to overcome, you know, but the ego death was a very unplay. It made me feel like I was like in a Coen Brothers movie. You know what I mean? Like, I'm like, oh, what the fuck? This is like, what an insane cosmic predicament I've never actually thought about, you know?

[Veda]

Yeah, no, I see that a lot of people have different experiences with it. Like, I. So that's what I'm trying to do research on is like, what ego death actually is and how many people actually go through it. Because there has to be different definitions for the different types of experiences.

[Lyle]

And you had a specific experience.

[Veda]

I had the most, like, Dude, I had the most insane fucking experience in my fucking life.

[Lyle]

So you want to discover. I was back to like, the studying of psychological concepts. Yeah, you want to discover something that we have not discovered before.

[Veda]

Yeah, I want to. I have this thing where, like, I get really angry seeing the same things all the time. Like, seeing the same advice being given all the time. And I get.

[Lyle]

What is the advice you see given all the time?

[Veda]

Just like, repetitive things like, oh, like, you know, your inner world reflects your Outer world, like, things we've already talked about, or like, get off your phone, like, meditate, like, and I get it, those things, like how. But like, maybe it needs to be explained in a way or like, I need to fight. I just don't want to say the same things. Like, I think here's the thing.

[Lyle]

And by the way, fully, fully supportive of your vision to discover a new thing. But I feel like the answer probably lies not within, like, the, the answer, if there is an answer. But like, wouldn't the, wouldn't the answer if there was one not lie in the discovery of new information, but in the application of the information we already have?

[Cameron]

Yeah.

[Veda]

So I'm not saying that everything I know is based upon the research we've already have. Like, without it, we would, we would not be able to.

[Lyle]

So what is, what is there that I'm so fascinated by? What you, what you mean by you want to discover something new? What is there new to discover?

[Veda]

There is so much new to discover. Like, there are so many things today that people like 20 years ago never even knew. Like, all neuroscience research or psychological research, like, it's, it's keeps growing and growing. And I, and I know it seems like we probably already know everything, but I refuse to believe that, Like, I don't know.

[Lyle]

I don't think, I don't, I don't think we already know everything.

[Veda]

I just, I don't know. I have a big fixation on like, inventing something. Like, I don't, I don't know. I just hate saying the same shit everyone already knows. I just want to discover something that nobody's ever talked about. And I like psychology, so I'm like, okay, it'll be in psychology. Because I'm obsessed with psychology.

[Lyle]

Would you ever be a therapist?

[Veda]

Not, like, when I think of a therapist, I think of like a really boring person who doesn't like their job and is doing this because they wanted a fast degree. So I'm sure it's not always like that. But like, I think of a therapist, I think of, like, I just think of that like a person who's not as passionate. So I want to be a researcher, but use my research to also do one on one work with people. So I guess, yeah, that's a therapist.

[Lyle]

But what you want to do, be a researcher? You want to be like a coach?

[Veda]

I know well. And I want to be a speaker. I want to be a public speaker.

[Lyle]

Cool.

[Veda]

And I guess what, Coach, public speaker, a writer, just all of that. Anything that has to do with Talking and sharing, but in regards to psychology, so I don't really care about labels.

[Lyle]

I support the vision. Beta.

[Veda]

Yeah. What do you want to do?

[Lyle]

I've wanted to do the same thing for, like six years, which is travel around the world and talk to people.

[Veda]

Nice.

[Lyle]

So I, I, I actually, I, I, I do think a lot, like, what would I do with my life? I could do anything.

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

And it is, it's like, well, everyone.

[Veda]

Should think like that, though.

[Lyle]

You know, travel the world and talk to people. So I guess that's what I'm doing right now and, you know, host, like, events.

[Veda]

Is it as fulfilling as you thought it would be?

[Lyle]

Is it as fulfilling as I thought it would be? No. Nothing is ever as fulfilling as you think it's going to be.

[Veda]

You think?

[Lyle]

Yeah.

[Veda]

Or maybe you just haven't enjoyed any of it.

[Lyle]

Well, is it actually. Hold on. Is it as fulfilling as I thought it's going to be? I enjoy, I'm enjoying this right now. I'm enjoying. It is fulfilling. Yes, it is fulfilling. It is a feeling. But you always think that, like, the things that. You always think that when you achieve your dreams, it's going to ascend you into something beyond your whatever, but you're still, you're never, you never escape your life. Yeah, that makes sense.

[Veda]

Yeah. Well, it's because you think it's going to bring you some sense of security or something, because you think it's going.

[Lyle]

To bring some sense of security. But I'm slowly realizing every year I get older and every dream I accomplish that security does not exist.

[Veda]

Are you sure? Or that you just haven't reached it on your own.

[Lyle]

We're gonna die. There's no such thing as security. Well, when I say we're gonna, we're gonna die and we, A, we're gonna die, and then B, we live in an unpredictable, chaotic world. There's no, there's no security ever. And so therefore, all you, all there is is the present moment.

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

And so security is kind of a bit of a myth.

[Veda]

No. So let me rephrase. When I think of security, I think of the feeling of wholeness. Like, you're completely like, without any of this. And that's the thing. People are thinking that their achievements or their promotion or their partner is going to give them that feeling of wholeness, that security feeling like, okay, now I feel good. But it never gives them that because it's never going to be outside. It's going to be.

[Lyle]

Oh, yeah, of course I felt. Well, I feel whole sometimes. I don't think feeling whole for me is not a one and done. Oh, I feel whole now. Like, I felt like I. Like, I didn't feel like I was. When I was at this block party thing smoking weed today, I felt something was off. I felt a lack.

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

I was like, I'm not. I don't. I feel like I'm off in some way. Yeah. Or like, I. Like, I'll be, like, out of the thing or doing something. I have moments in my life where I feel a strong sense of a lack, and I feel a strong. Whatever the opposite of whole is. And then I was like, I was just on the subway one morning and I was like. And I had a moment of wholeness where I was like, I feel my life is great. My life is exactly how I ever wanted it to be. I live in New York. I do. I have a cool thing I do as a gecko. I have friends. Like, everything is great. I have no need for anything. This is great. I have moments of wholeness, but wholeness is not like a I am now whole forever. It's a thing you have to constantly get in touch.

[Veda]

Yeah, of course. You don't think you can feel a whole when you're sad, too, though.

[Lyle]

Yeah, sometimes when I feel sad or depressed, I guess I feel whole in the sense of. Like, I've accepted that this is just. Just happens. This is just part of life, you know, because there's no security. And so when you think that, oh, eventually I'm going to arrive at some version of my life that is completely devoid of problems, completely devoid of sadness, completely devoid of anything, which I have often and still a little bit do believe I will one day achieve, which is good. It's good to have that. It's good to want things. It's good. The lack is good. It motivates you to want to keep doing stuff. Because if I just felt whole and amazing all the time, I'd never try to do anything, you know?

[Veda]

So you think you can only want to do things whenever you feel, like, sad or insecure about not getting there?

[Lyle]

It's. I don't think I can. I don't. I don't think I only can. But it's a damn good motivator, is it not?

[Veda]

You don't think, like, you could feel motivated if you already were secure in yourself, like, just out of, like, pure interest, like, that looks cool. I want to do that.

[Lyle]

Yeah, No, I can. Okay. I think so. I think I. A little bit of that. And then sometimes I'm like, then Sometimes I. I'll chase things out of. I'll chase things. I've had times in my life where I felt like I was chasing things out of security, and then times I felt like I was chasing things out of insecurity.

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Have you ever chased. Do you ever chase, like, in your life, do you only chase out of insecurity?

[Veda]

No, I only used to.

[Lyle]

I'm sorry. Do you only chase out of security?

[Veda]

Well, I mean, it's not like a choice I can consciously make all the time, but, like, I think for most of my life, and if everyone were honest with themselves, a lot of their driving factors of wanting to get somewhere is because they want to prove something to themselves or prove something to other people, not because they genuinely find. Maybe it's like half and half, like you said. But I realized that I don't want to do things to feel better about myself. I want to do it because I actually like it. And then feeling better about myself is going to have to come. Well, yes, but also, like, true security in yourself can come, like, without the job, without, like, the friends, without the accomplishments.

[Lyle]

I. I think about. I. I think about this all the time. And I used to believe. And it's a very stoic. But it is. There's a lot of stoicism I think you're talking about.

[Veda]

Yeah, I think I'm very stoic. I guess I've.

[Lyle]

I've in my life been very stoic, too.

[Veda]

But you said now you're a nihilist, right?

[Lyle]

No, I don't identify with any of this. I'm just. I'm a gecko.

[Veda]

Oh, fuck. Yeah, I forgot.

[Lyle]

I'm just a gecko. But I thought a lot about the idea of, like, could I live a life where I. I talked to my sister about. I said this to my sister once. She just makes fun of me about it. But I said to my sister once, I'd love to live a life where I had no money, no friends, no accomplishments, and I was naked on a beach and I felt happy. And then like. But she didn't understand what I meant by that. I don't. And so now ever. She's like, lyle, do you ever. When you told me that you want to not have any friends, I was like, you know what I'm trying to say? But I said that. And that's what I, you know, that's what, like, that's. That's the dream of a life of only intrinsic happiness.

[Paulina]

But that's.

[Lyle]

That's unrealistic. I think a lot of life I just think you're bullshitting yourself if you think that you can, like, you know, only live a life of completely intrinsic happiness. You need other people. You need the world.

[Veda]

Well, you do. Well, science. That's not what that means. It means that you don't need them to feel happy. You do need them, like, socially. When I say happy, I mean, like, you don't need it to feel secure in yourself, but scientifically, yeah, you need to talk to people. Like, we are social creatures. Yes, you need, like, a home, and you need money to live. But what I mean is, if you didn't have your fan base, if you didn't have this, if you didn't have your accomplishments, who do you believe you are? Like, can you still, like, feel complete and whole without every external thing? Like, that's the question. And, like, that's what I'm trying to practice is, like, feeling like I don't need. I don't need anything exterior to keep myself secure in myself.

[Lyle]

Well, you're in school now, right?

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

If the school said to you, you're banned from school, you can never study psychology ever again because you, like, ace you.

[Veda]

I failed my.

[Lyle]

You failed your test and you got kicked out of school. How would that. And. Or your friends, right.

[Veda]

If all your friends really not here.

[Lyle]

Well, okay. All your friends back home, if they. If all your friends were like, hey, we don't want to talk to you anymore, and your parents died, you have a little bit of. You have any money in your bank account?

[Veda]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

If it all went to zero and all these things happened at once, and you have cloth clothes in your wardrobe that you like, that you're getting hems, you know, if everything went away. You're telling me right now that. That. You're telling me that wouldn't suck?

[Veda]

No.

[Lyle]

You're telling me after all that you could still be, like, still feel secure. Not secure, not. Not stupid. But you're telling me that you wouldn't feel like. How would you. I'm sorry, I'll phrase that question. How would you feel?

[Veda]

So there's a. I think there's, like, different definitions here. You can feel secure in who you are while still having sad moments in life. Your life. There's always gonna be painful moments like, yeah, family's gonna die. Yeah, if I got kicked out of school, that would suck. I would still feel sad, but I wouldn't make it mean anything about my worth is basically what I'm saying. Like, understanding that you're always worthy and to always believe in yourself, no matter how many people are watching. No matter how many friends you have or no matter if that school accepts you, like if the school didn't accept me, if nobody wanted to be my friend, if I didn't have money or any status, I should still know that I am worthy and I should still like myself. It's not contingent upon if you accept me.

[Lyle]

If that makes sense, that makes a lot of sense. And that makes a lot of sense. And I buy that. That makes a lot of sense. Veda, is there anything else you want to say to the people of the computer before we go?

[Veda]

Choose love over fear.

[Lyle]

Thank you Veda. Good luck with your journeys.

[Veda]

Thank you so much for letting me speak.

[Lyle]

Of course. See you Veda.

[Ice Cube]

The reviews and ratings are in and Ice Cube's big three is the surprise hit of the summer. This Saturday, 4pm Eastern on CBS with playoff elimination on on the line, the stars will be flocking to Los Angeles to witness the most physical, fiercest and competitive basketball in the world. Miami's Michael Beasley and Lance Stevenson must win over Houston to make the playoffs, reeling from last week's savage beating at the hands of Chicago's possessed Montrez Harrow. Last time these teams met, Miami beat Houston, but they are a dangerous team having their manhood at stake. Then breakout star Dwight Howard of the LA Riot will battle Gary Payton's Boston squad squad in a do or die match for both teams. Will LA avenge their previous shocking loss to perennial basketball Boston rivals? To survive, six teams are allowed for four spots and all must win. Don't miss the Big three, the three on three basketball league everyone is talking about. There's no crying in the big three and the no hold spot action starts Saturday at 4pm Eastern, 1pm Pacific followed by two games on Vice starting at 6:30 Eastern presented by iHeart.

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[Cameron]

Ah come on.

[Paulina]

Why is this taking so long? This thing is ancient.

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[Paulina]

Whoa, this thing moves.

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[Lyle]

Homes.com has collaboration tools to help home shoppers search, share and discuss home shopping with family, friends and their agent directly through the site. Though it was fun to get that email from your husband about that three bedroom in the hills. To which you replied via text that you would never live in the hills and you'd like to find a three bedroom closer to the beach. To which he replied, why are you so uncompromising? A fun way to spend an afternoon, but we think it's just a tad bit it easier our way.

[Lenovo Representative]

Homes.com we've done your homework.

[Lyle]

Have a seat. What's your name?

[Saren]

Cameron.

[Lyle]

Ammo?

[Saren]

Cameron.

[Lyle]

Cameron, what's up, Cameron? Did you. Cameron. Cameron, were you here just now for that whole conversation?

[Saren]

I did not hear like.

[Lyle]

Oh, you didn't hear any of it?

[Saren]

I heard like maybe 20%.

[Lyle]

Okay. That's okay. We can, we can, we can be in our own conversation.

[Saren]

I heard some stuff about like ego death.

[Lyle]

We did talk about ego death. We talked about. We talked about a lot of stuff. But you know what? That was that interview and this is this one. And how is your night at the park going?

[Saren]

It's just getting started.

[Lyle]

What are you gonna do later?

[Saren]

I have no idea.

[Lyle]

You have no idea, but you know you're gonna do something. You know that the evening's just getting started. Yeah. How do you know that? The. But it's like. What? It's what, what. What time is it right now?

[Saren]

It's like 10 something.

[Lyle]

10 something? Yeah. Is this your, is your girlfriend? Oh, no, sorry.

[Saren]

That's my parole officer. He, he makes sure I don't like get into any trouble.

[Lyle]

Okay. Do you, do you normally get into trouble? Yeah. What do you get into? What kind of trouble you get into?

[Saren]

I don't think I'm allowed to say it on camera.

[Lyle]

You don't have to. You don't have to do anything.

[Saren]

Okay.

[Lyle]

Yeah. What do you do for fun?

[Saren]

For fun. I'm also not saying that on camera.

[Lyle]

Okay. We're gonna, I'm gonna keep going until we get to something that you can say on camera. Okay. What is your relationship like with your parents?

[Saren]

My mom is really nice and with my Dad. I hope he's not watching. It is weird. Like, he's really inconsistent. Very strange.

[Lyle]

I mean, how long has that been happening?

[Saren]

I want to say since like, 9, 10. It's like, as you grow up, you kind of see the cracks, and you're like, he's still my dad, but it's kind of horrible. As a human being, he does some bad things. So I'm just. I don't get it.

[Lyle]

Do you guys still talk?

[Saren]

Yeah, well, we live in the same house. Yeah, but it's like, some days he's tolerable to be around. Other days, it's like I'm doing everything in my power to stay away from him. Like, right now, I don't want to go home because I don't want to see him. He's not really someone you want to talk to.

[Lyle]

But your mom is nice.

[Saren]

Yes. Really nice.

[Lyle]

What is nice about your mom?

[Saren]

Even though she has, like, a New Yorker attitude, like, normally, you know how we are, we don't like talking to people. We keep it pushing. She's still really kind. If you approach her the right way, she'll always find, like, something nice in people told me, always be kind, respectful, things like that. She's just a really nice lady. Even if she wasn't my mom, I would say that.

[Lyle]

Do you have any siblings?

[Saren]

I have a sister.

[Lyle]

You have a sister?

[Saren]

Yeah, a younger sister.

[Lyle]

What's her deal?

[Saren]

She's just a teenage girl. That's all I'm saying.

[Lyle]

Do you guys have a good relationship? Yeah.

[Saren]

She's gonna be annoying from time to time, but yeah.

[Lyle]

Do you go to school in the city?

[Saren]

I go to LaGuardia Community College. That's in Long Island City.

[Lyle]

Cool. How's school? Done. Get me the out of here. Get out of what? Wait, where's here? Is that at a school?

[Saren]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Okay, I thought you meant. I thought you were like, I can't handle this interview. These are too many. How's school going? Is too hot. Seed of a question, what was I gonna say? Why do you hate school?

[Saren]

I went into it way too early. I should have taken maybe a year to think about what I want to do, but I'm more dead set on something else rather than what I'm pursuing in school.

[Lyle]

And what are you pursuing in school?

[Saren]

Paralegal studies.

[Lyle]

Okay, that's. It's like the other lady wanted to be a lawyer.

[Saren]

Yeah. She want to be a full lawyer. I'm just. What I am to a lawyer is like what a nurse is to a doctor.

[Lyle]

Sure. Right.

[Saren]

Not doing really? Anything?

[Lyle]

Is that. Is that your vibe? Is that what you want to be? A paralegal? No. What do you want to be?

[Saren]

I want to join the fire department. That's something I really care about.

[Lyle]

Oh, okay, wait. So what's preventing you from joining the fire department?

[Saren]

Nothing really. I already took the test, but it's like a long process. So even though I took the written test, I still got to do the physical, then psychiatric and whatnot. That's gonna take a while.

[Lyle]

Do you think you're going to do well on the psychiatric and the physical?

[Saren]

Yes. Yes.

[Lyle]

It's funny that it took you a second to think about it.

[Saren]

Probably better than the written.

[Lyle]

Than the written?

[Saren]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

What is involved in the written firefighter test?

[Saren]

It is like basic English and math questions. But, like, the day of when I took it, I only got maybe four hours of sleep because I was stressed out.

[Lyle]

Oh, no. Really? Do you. You seem like. I mean, I don't know you very well. We've only been talking for a little bit, but you seem like a low stress guy. Or is that just like, probably what.

[Saren]

It looks like on the surface, but like, it's like up and down.

[Lyle]

Okay. What stresses you out the most in life?

[Saren]

Myself.

[Lyle]

Why do you stress yourself out?

[Saren]

I'm gonna skip that one.

[Lyle]

Huh?

[Saren]

I'm gonna skip that one.

[Lyle]

Okay. Yeah, it's okay. Trying to think if I have any. I feel like I, you know, this. I gotta say, this isn't meant to be like a therapy session. It just ends up being that for most of these interviews, we can. We don't have. We can talk about random ass.

[Saren]

I can see why it ends up like that. Because, like, when you meet someone like one time, it's easy to just say things like that.

[Lyle]

Yeah, totally.

[Saren]

It's like I would say, but, like, I'm surrounded by people, so it's like kind of more like, ooh, don't want to say that.

[Lyle]

Yeah. Well, it is weird because we're around a circle of people, but I feel very. This is very. This feels very chill. Like, I just feel like I'm just looking at you. I feel like we're just talking. You admit why? You know, all of my, like, inherent curiosities are probably about, like, therapy questions. Oh, somebody's asking you something. Oh. So do you want to talk about anything that's not therapy? Ish.

[Saren]

I want to ask what makes you want to do this? I know you probably get that a lot, but, like, it's my first time seeing you.

[Lyle]

What makes you want to do this? I mean, it's a fun thing to do is, you know, you get to hang out with random people.

[Saren]

How the idea come about, like, why a gecko in particular?

[Lyle]

Do you believe you can be anything.

[Saren]

You want if you try hard enough? Yeah. Bless you.

[Lyle]

Why not be a gecko?

[Saren]

I feel like in an alternate universe, you probably chose, like, a rat, because if it's New York City, much better.

[Lyle]

There is another guy who does. Well, he doesn't really do this, but he does dress up as. As a rat.

[Saren]

Nice.

[Lyle]

What do you want to be when you grow up? The firefighter.

[Saren]

Yes.

[Lyle]

What do you say that's appealing to you about the firefighter life?

[Saren]

Well, for one, it's not as high stress as you think. You're not always going to go into a burning building. But I like the aspect that it's kind of like military because you have a brotherhood with you without actually doing, you know, questionable stuff like the military. You're just saving people, helping them out. It may be someone who's, like, having a panic attack, someone who needs medical help, or just someone in a burning building. That's a lot better than, like, going overseas and doing some crazy sauce. I rather do that.

[Lyle]

Who is this person that keeps talking to you? This is your friend?

[Saren]

This is my close friend. I met him. He goes by he him. I met him in June, and we've been hanging out constantly ever since.

[Lyle]

Where'd you. Where'd you guys meet?

[Saren]

It was a friend thing. So basically the whole day we had people rotating in and out. I had taken, like, a little ferry thing around the city, and I took a trip to Brooklyn with my friends, and we were eating at the restaurant. He shows up and the whole time thinking, I'm going to meet this person one time in my life, and now he's one of my close friends. I don't know how it happened.

[Lyle]

What do you do? Like, do you have any hobbies?

[Saren]

Working out? I like to. Honestly, I love walking. Just everywhere.

[Lyle]

Me too.

[Saren]

Everywhere.

[Lyle]

That's my favorite thing about New York is you can just walk everywhere. It's fucking sick.

[Saren]

It's really stimulating.

[Lyle]

You go to the gym, you said, what do you bench?

[Saren]

225.

[Lyle]

Oh, sick. That's. That's awesome.

[Saren]

It's nice. My friend, he keeps pestering me because he's like, if you keep going more, you can do more than that. And I'm just like, I already hit 225. This is where I clock out.

[Lyle]

What do you squat?

[Saren]

I do not squat. I do hack squat.

[Lyle]

Yeah, yeah. It's annoying though, because, like, do you, do you, what? Do you. What's your overhead press?

[Saren]

I don't overhead.

[Lyle]

Will you just bench for shoulders when.

[Saren]

You talk about overhead? Like, I just do cable stuff.

[Lyle]

Oh, okay. Yeah, that's cool. Where do you go to the gym?

[Saren]

This is gym called Retro Fitness. Like, not too far from my house.

[Lyle]

Sick.

[Saren]

That's where I go.

[Lyle]

Is it a nice gym?

[Saren]

It gets the job done. Like, yeah, I won't complain about the conditions if I can get big.

[Lyle]

Yeah. Yeah. Dude, I don't know this. You can get. You can like get a pretty damn good workout just like around the house. Like if, like. Oh, I sometimes, like, if I don't have, like equipment, I'll just curl a chair, you know, like, grab a chair by like the legs.

[Saren]

That's very, you know, you can just get it right now you do calisthenics.

[Lyle]

But calisthenics do push. How many push ups do you think you can do?

[Saren]

I want to say 20.

[Lyle]

20.

[Saren]

20 clean ones. I'll say that.

[Lyle]

Okay, that's pretty good. Like 20 right now.

[Saren]

Right now in front of you.

[Lyle]

No, no, no, no. Wait, what did I mean? No, no, that. I'm sorry, I didn't mean right now. What I meant was that was me subliminally being like, I want to. I want to see you do push ups. But I'm not going to do that because this is an audio podcast and I think us doing a push up contest. It would look funny for the video, but it would be. It wouldn't make a lot of sense.

[Saren]

Okay.

[Lyle]

For the audio of it, that's fine. We could do one. We have to. All right. Yeah, we'll do one. Okay, Brandon, we're going to cut this. Well, you can leave this part in me telling it. Brandon, who edits, edits this podcast. Shout out to Brandon. We'll leave this in, but Brandon will cut out from the video. From the audio version of this. We're gonna cut out the push up contest, but in the video version we'll keep it in. But also this speech mentioning that we're gonna cut it out of the. Of the audio version, but keep it in the video version. We'll keep that in.

[Saren]

All right.

[Lyle]

Okay. So yeah, let's. Do you want to do some push ups together? Yeah. Okay. All right. See how many we can do. Well, how many did you get?

[Saren]

He said 35, I think.

[Lyle]

35. Okay, I got 25, so you win. GG's. That's pretty good. Oh, thanks. That was. I felt like that Was pretty. My max that I've ever done in the world was 30, but I could only do 25. I feel good about that.

[Saren]

That's really.

[Lyle]

How do you. Do you feel good? Isn't that a good. We just did a whole long conversation about dopamine. I got it. It's really nice. It feels good to do push ups.

[Saren]

I'm coming off the high.

[Lyle]

Yeah. Oh, man. Okay, what do you. What do you want to say to the people now that, like, now that you feel good from doing from. They feel high from push ups? Huh? Oh, wait, wait. What do you. What do you. What do you want to say to the people?

[Saren]

You should talk to your friends more. They're really nice people.

[Lyle]

What's your name again, man?

[Saren]

Cameron.

[Lyle]

Cameron. Oh, wait, I guess I already did the. What do you want it. But do you have any final things you want to say to the people at the computer before we go?

[Saren]

Don't shut yourself off. Always talk to your friends when you get the chance. Please, please.

[Lyle]

Cameron, thank you very much for talking to a gecko. Feel like I could have done more. No, I couldn't have. 25 was good. Hello, what's your name?

[Paulina]

Saren, sir. Saren.

[Lyle]

Sarod.

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

S E R E N. Sarah. What's up, Sarod? How's life?

[Paulina]

It's okay.

[Lyle]

Oh, Sarah, can you a favor and just hold the mic up?

[Paulina]

Yeah, sorry.

[Lyle]

Sarah, Sarah, Sarah. What's Sara.

[Paulina]

Saren.

[Lyle]

Sorry, one more time. Seren.

[Paulina]

S E R E N. Oh, Saren.

[Lyle]

Okay. Like serendipity. Yeah, there we go. All right. Saren. What's up? Saren? Saren, have you been. How long have you been hanging out here for watching this scrap?

[Paulina]

Well, we were here since setup, if that's what you mean.

[Lyle]

Oh, yeah. Oh, okay, cool. All right, so bring us home, Sarah. What did we learn?

[Paulina]

Well, not gonna lie, it's been kind of hard to hear you. All this music, all these people, it's very overstimulating.

[Lyle]

Very overstimulating.

[Paulina]

I've noticed you got the social worker nod thing going on.

[Lyle]

Social worker nod thing?

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Oh, what's the social worker nod thing?

[Paulina]

Like the. What you call it? The affirmative. Active listening.

[Lyle]

Yes, I do have an annoying active listening nod. There was some reel on Instagram that was like, pov. Your friend is an active listener. And it was like a clearly like very like annoyingly active listener person. And my friend sent it in, like our group chat. And it was like Lyle, when he goes therapy gecko mode on you. And I was like, damn, that sucks.

[Paulina]

Do you have a social work background?

[Lyle]

No, I don't have a social work background. I'm just. I'm just curious about the world and shit.

[Paulina]

Makes sense. Nya.

[Lyle]

So who are you?

[Paulina]

That's a great question. I've been trying to figure that out because I've been masking my entire life. So I'm slowly trying to, like, bring myself to, like, actualize who I am, what I like, what I want to do with my life, all these different things.

[Lyle]

What's the process of figuring that out?

[Paulina]

Well, we haven't started it yet. Not in totality.

[Lyle]

Okay. But you've been thinking about it.

[Paulina]

No. Yeah. The only reason I haven't started it is because I'm still in school. Like, once I'm done with school, though, then we can start to, like, completely deconstruct my routine that I have that's keeping everything in place.

[Lyle]

Sure.

[Paulina]

That's just how I see it, because my routine is what's keeping me stable.

[Lyle]

Yeah.

[Paulina]

And once there's no.

[Lyle]

And you don't want to disability.

[Paulina]

Yeah, not until I'm done with school.

[Lyle]

Okay. When are you done with school next?

[Paulina]

It should be next June. Honestly. Yeah.

[Lyle]

Next. When?

[Paulina]

June.

[Lyle]

Next June. Okay, so you've got about a year before you have to deconstruct yourself. Yeah, that's pretty good. Yeah, that's pretty. Enjoy. This year, once you start deconstructing yourself, it's.

[Paulina]

It's.

[Lyle]

I don't know. It's like opening a bunch of Pokemon cards. You might get fucking Groudon. You might get Bidoof. Okay.

[Paulina]

I mean, I don't know those characters too well.

[Lyle]

That's okay. It's Gen 3, I think. But anyway, what do you go to school for?

[Paulina]

I'm in social work school, actually.

[Ice Cube]

Oh, you are?

[Lyle]

Okay, cool. Very cool.

[Paulina]

I'm in social work.

[Lyle]

Okay, so you also have a social work nod?

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Oh, yeah, definitely. You know, I'm gonna start taking more pride in my. In my social work nod.

[Paulina]

Nah. Yeah. I mean, it's fun. I love my classmates. Some of the teachers are very interesting. It's great. It's very nice. Would I recommend going through it this young? No, because I'm 22, so, like, my classmates are anywhere from, like, 25 and up. Most of them are 25 and up. Some of them are closer to my age, but it's. I feel very separated from everybody because of it.

[Lyle]

Because of the age gap?

[Paulina]

Yeah, because of the age gap. And they have a lot more life experience and stuff. Like, I grew up very sheltered and shit. So, like, it makes sense. I. I'm like, just trying to go into it and, like, figure it out, get it done, get it over with, you know?

[Lyle]

Yeah. What's the ultimate goal? Is it to be a therapist? Yeah, that could be cool. Yeah, that could be cool. Do you have a therapist?

[Paulina]

I do currently, yes.

[Lyle]

What do you like about your current therapist that you want to take into your.

[Paulina]

I'm looking for a new therapist.

[Lyle]

Oh, wait, I'm sorry, is that what you said?

[Paulina]

No.

[Lyle]

Okay. Oh, you're looking for a new therapist?

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Okay. Why are you, like, why do you not like the therapist you have?

[Paulina]

I feel like the. Well, unfortunately, because she's white and I'm black, there's this. What is it called? She doesn't have the level of cultural competency. I feel like she should.

[Lyle]

Oh, interesting.

[Paulina]

Yeah. So like 90%, 80%. All of my experiences are completely surrounded because, like, by being black. Yeah. I'm black, I'm queer, Like, all these different things. I'm autistic. Like, that's how my view of the world is. She can't really understand that because it's mostly informed. It's because of how people see me, how I'm perceived. I'm always perceived as a threat.

[Lyle]

See, I've always wondered, like, in my own therapy search, I'm like, do I want somebody who, like, do I want another white guy or do I want somebody who's very different from me that can, like, have a different perspective?

[Paulina]

That's all up to you. I just know that, like, I would rather have somebody black and queer.

[Lyle]

Yeah. Now, have you had a black therapist before?

[Paulina]

I've had a black therapist, absolutely. And now I have a queer therapist. Okay. So I'm like, maybe a mix of the two would be very nice because I'm also black and queer. So. Yeah.

[Lyle]

So because I think you can do that. Right. You can go on the psychology today and like.

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Hit the check boxes.

[Paulina]

Yeah, yeah, I've done stuff like that. But, like, the stuff that I'm looking for is highly specific. Okay. Like trauma informed and like ADHD and like ptsd, all these different things.

[Lyle]

Sure.

[Paulina]

And therefore it very much limits. And then those people that have those things are not black. So. Yeah.

[Lyle]

Okay, wait, but like, trauma informed or like, has had trauma.

[Paulina]

Trauma informed. So, like, how to deal with that, how to process it, how to sit with your emotions.

[Lyle]

So you try to find a black, queer, trauma informed.

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Therapist.

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Is that, Is that that hard, like, to find?

[Paulina]

I mean, shockingly, yes.

[Lyle]

Okay, well, I guess. I guess it's good that you're trying to become one now.

[Paulina]

Yeah, yeah. I feel I literally did my grad essay, like, my entrance essay for this. I did it about, like, representation.

[Lyle]

Yeah.

[Paulina]

And the lack of representation in the field and stuff. Because only what I think less than 15 of therapists are black and then less than 4% are queer. And there's no overlap in those two right now. I didn't do the overlap. I didn't look it up. So I'm assuming it's a lot smaller.

[Lyle]

What kinds of things are you learning in psychology?

[Paulina]

Social work.

[Lyle]

Social work. School. Yeah.

[Paulina]

Well, what do you mean? Because we have different types of classes.

[Lyle]

Do you go to school today?

[Paulina]

School let me know. We're on break, so.

[Lyle]

Oh, wait, well, it's Saturday. Are you on break because it's Saturday or on break because it's the summer?

[Paulina]

Summer.

[Lyle]

What was the last thing? What was. What was your biggest takeaway from last semester?

[Paulina]

Honestly, how to set boundaries with people who try to take advantage of free labor.

[Lyle]

Oh.

[Paulina]

Because we have our internship. So, like, for instance, I was in a. I was in a school and so because I was working with the guidance office and I was basically. I'm sorry, this is so much my school, the social work school placed me at an agency, and that agency placed me out of high school.

[Lyle]

To do social work?

[Paulina]

Yeah, to like, help the kids, the students and whatnot. Which I loved. I loved being there. But there was just so many people involved and me trying to do regular stuff, like call out. I was just like, I can't do this. And then they wanted us to stay until the end of June, but that was what the school wanted. My school said, no, you can only stay until, like, you've done your 450 hours. Because after that you don't have. Like, the school's not liable for anything that happens. So now it's a back and forth between them and I'm in the middle of it, just trying to help my students. My mental health is a wreck. How can I help them if I can't help myself? That doesn't make any sense. And I'm not going to be any benefit to my students if I can't figure out what I need.

[Lyle]

Oh, yeah, of course. No, yeah. If you, if you, if you're showing up less than your full self.

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Then, yeah, you're not gonna be a benefit.

[Paulina]

Exactly. And I didn't want to, like, put that on my kids because I know how they are or word, rather. And, like, I love seeing them grow and all that. But I had to make sure they understood that. Like, it's just a lot of stuff going on. And specifically because they had their own stuff going on. You don't always have to just sit there and take it.

[Lyle]

Sure. Yeah.

[Paulina]

You can actually say something and like, say what you got to say, do what you got to do. Respectfully, there's a position of authority and all that. So. Yeah.

[Lyle]

I'm trying to think of any. Any other. Any other questions. Okay. So, yes. So you. You back to saying that in a year you're going to deconstruct yourself?

[Paulina]

Yes.

[Lyle]

What is that? What's the first step of deconstructing yourself?

[Paulina]

Honestly, just getting rid of, like, this. I've been to school my entire life. I'm 22, been in school my entire life. Went straight through. So what to do without the school being there?

[Lyle]

Yeah. Once the str. Oh, yeah, I know. That's a perfect time to deconstruct yourself because once structure. I mean that it literally is what you're doing.

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Once the structure is deed.

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Externally, you can d. The structure internally.

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Spooky, but yeah. Interesting. Yeah. Kind of like your own version of ego death.

[Paulina]

Yeah, pretty much. I think it'd be really cool.

[Lyle]

Saren?

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

Saren, it's nice talking to you.

[Paulina]

Thank you.

[Lyle]

I'm trying to think if I have any because I was talking to Cameron about non therapy things. Okay. So wait, so Cameron's your homie, right?

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

And he said that the night is just getting started. And I asked him and I was like, what does that mean? And he. He didn't really have an answer. What. What are you. Are you guys about to go do something crazy?

[Paulina]

Honestly, we could. We could figure it out, honestly, because I don't know. We've been hanging out a lot, so we usually get into, like, stupid.

[Lyle]

What kind of stupid?

[Paulina]

Honestly, where. What was it? Coney Island. We went to and stuff.

[Lyle]

And we. Yeah. Went to Coney Island.

[Paulina]

Yeah.

[Lyle]

That's not stupid. That's fun.

[Paulina]

No, it is fun, but, like, being out there at night and stuff is not the best idea.

[Lyle]

Being out of Coney island at night?

[Paulina]

Yeah. Like recently, like, it was his birthday and stuff, and we went out. I planned this whole thing and it was fun, it was nice. But, like, we were out here at like 12 in the morning just taking photos and stuff. It was just.

[Lyle]

That sounds fun.

[Paulina]

It is fun, but it's not always the safest.

[Lyle]

Have you gotten into any issues?

[Paulina]

Well, no. Right now we're both sober, thank God. But like.

[Lyle]

Okay. Cool.

[Paulina]

This is great.

[Lyle]

It sounds like you guys got a fun night ahead of you.

[Paulina]

Oh, yeah, we'll just see what we get into.

[Lyle]

Keep an eye on Cam'. Ron. He's a loose cannon. Wait, actually, hey, listen, listen. This guy did 35 push ups, all right? If shit goes down, you know, I think he could take care of it.

[Paulina]

I mean, I don't know about that, but no disrespect, you got to be more aware of your surroundings.

[Lyle]

Saren, thank you very much for chatting with me. Is there anything else you want to say to the people at the computer before we go?

[Paulina]

Yeah. Respect. Basic respect is given. Absolutely. Always respect. People younger than you, people older than you, people your age. Absolutely. The second they start to disrespect you, though, you don't gotta stand there and take it. You don't gotta sit there and take it. You can leave. You don't gotta be in a situation that you don't want to be in. Okay? Do what you want to do. Do it safely. Don't be too crazy out here. And if you are taking drugs, drinking, anything like that, substance related, test your. Please test it. If you gonna do it, do it. But test it. Get clean supplies and all that. Do what you need to do and be safe out here.

[Lyle]

Okay, folks, this has been talking to a gecko at the park. This was a great. I feel like, again, if you're listening to this and you just woke up from a nap at 7pm, 8pm, 9pm the day can be saved. If this is, this is a message to you, the folks. If you took an. If you got too high and ate too much ice cream and you took a nap and you believe that the day is over, you can save it.

[Paulina]

Can I say one more thing?

[Lyle]

Yeah, you can say one more thing.

[Paulina]

It is perfectly okay to start over whenever you need to.

[Lyle]

I like that.

[Paulina]

Doesn't matter what time of day it is, how old you are, tomorrow is a new day. Do whatever the fuck you want. Shit.

[Lyle]

Tomorrow is a new day. 9pm is a new hour. 9:02pm is a new hour.

[Paulina]

Exactly. It don't gotta be on the dot. You do what you need to do for you. You don't have to live by anybody. Anybody else's rules, anybody else's timeline. Do what you got to do.

[Lyle]

For you, I'm a gecko. I'm signing off. Thank you guys very much for listening and see you. See you again very soon. Hello, folks, it's Lyle. This is the end of the episode. This is. And I'm Recording this. Not in the park. I'm recording this alone in my room on my phone. And I'm recording this to tell you all that if you want more IRL episodes, I am actually releasing a bonus episode today of IRL interviews that I did two years ago in Melbourne. I think that's how you pronounce it. Melbourne, Australia, on the streets of Melbourne, Australia. It's an IRL episode just like this one. I recorded it two years ago. It's been sitting on my hard drive. I never got around to do anything, doing anything with it. But I am releasing it today as a bonus episode on therapygecko.supercast.com if you want to support the podcast and you want to get not just this bonus episode, but access to all the bonus episodes that I have done over the years, then you can go to TherapyGecko Supercast or check the link in the episode description to, to sign up and view it. And here, right here, I'm going to put. We're going to have a little clip from the interviews that I did in Melbourne, Australia. So here's our clip from this week's bonus episode. And she was telling me, she was like, I'm having trouble because I don't think there's any straight single men left in Sydney. So I don't know how I'm supposed to date. So it's funny to hear that, that it's. I thought she was just bullshitting, but it's funny to hear other people say that, yeah, Sydney has big gay history. They had like the first sort of pride movement in Australia. But their, their nightlife isn't. Isn't the same as it was. How's the nightlife here? Not bad. Yeah. Do you go fucking crazy? We go party. We go to raves. That's fun. Yeah. You ever. Do you do crazy drugs? No comment. Once again, if you want to listen to that, if you want to support the podcast, if you want to get the rest of the bonus episodes that I've got on there, you can go to therapygecko.supercast.com or check the link in the episode description to sign up. Anyway, that's it. That's the end of the words that I have to say today. Thank you for listening to the Pod Geck. Bless you. Thanks for being here. Thanks for still listening. You haven't clicked off yet. You're still. I'm still rambling. I'm just sitting in this jump, sitting in this chair, drinking a little bit of water. It's nice. Life is nice. Sometimes I complain too much. Life is really nice. Thank you. Thank you for listening. Bye bye.

[Ice Cube]

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[Lyle]

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[Lyle]

This is an iHeart podcast.