“I’M AN ADULT FILM PRODUCER”

Summary

Therapy Gecko – “I’M AN ADULT FILM PRODUCER”

Podcast: Therapy Gecko (iHeartPodcasts)
Host: Lyle (Therapy Gecko)
Date: December 17, 2025

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Lyle (Therapy Gecko) takes a call from Jack, a 41-year-old adult film producer who specializes in fetish content. The conversation delves deep into Jack's background, how his tumultuous childhood shaped his worldview—especially around trust, relationships, and the adult industry—and reflects on themes of loneliness, family trauma, legal fears, and cynicism about love and marriage. Lyle offers compassionate, “armchair” therapy, encouraging Jack to reflect on his past and the ways those experiences color his present. The episode closes with a contrastingly uplifting call from Sam, who recently left a toxic marriage, moved to LA, and found a new life.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Jack’s Background and Entry Into Adult Film Production

• Fetish Producer: Jack has been making fetish-oriented adult content for 17 years, starting at age 26 after a failed stint at day trading (02:38–06:02).
• Origin Story: His interest in bondage dates back to childhood; early incidents, like tying up a crush during “Kite Day” in kindergarten, hint at longstanding fascination (08:06–08:34).
• Industry Evolution: Jack notes increased censorship and changing cultural attitudes. Even relatively mild content (like the phrase “tickle torture”) is now restricted (06:31–07:53).

“You used to be able to make jokes… you can’t do that anymore in any of the sites. They’ll immediately ban you.” — Jack, 06:38

• Types of Fetishes: Discusses everything from standard bondage to balloon fetishes (10:10–10:47).

2. Family Trauma and Worldview

• Divorce and Domestic Turmoil: Jack's parents divorced following a domestic violence accusation against his father (03:33–05:26). Jack describes siding with his dad, being disowned by his mother, and a childhood filled with conflict.
• Impact on Relationships: The trauma of witnessing his father’s arrest and familial fracture deeply shaped his distrust of women, law enforcement, and authority (11:09–12:07, 12:36–13:29).
• Men’s Rights and Avoidance of Marriage: Jack became a self-described early men’s rights activist, citing legal risks as the chief reason he'll never marry or embrace traditional family forms (13:30–16:28).

“I’ve never gotten married because of it. I’ll never get married. No way. I have my opportunities, but I don’t want to. It’s too much of a risk.”
— Jack, 13:29

3. Jack’s Philosophy on Love, Trust, and Vulnerability

• Deep Distrust: Jack believes the legal system is biased, marriage is a “bad contract,” and love is corrupted by potential legal and financial ruin (16:28–21:26).
• Protective Choices: Emphasizes “controlling risk”—plans to become a parent via gestational surrogacy, refusing to risk custody and assets in marriage (16:28–19:41).

“I just don’t want all my money taken from me… I would just be living my life on the edge, like, waiting for the other shoe to drop.” — Jack, 46:59

4. Social Life, Loneliness, and Community

• Industry Friendships: Adult industry acquaintances are mostly transactional; Jack keeps relationships professional, noting high turnover and the challenges of age gaps (24:06–25:18).
• Loneliness: Admits to sometimes feeling lonely, especially after losing friends over political divisions and after his father’s death—but thinks about building his own family (22:15–23:06).

5. Lyle’s Armchair Therapy: Challenging Worldview & Trauma

• Empathy & Gentle Challenge: Lyle empathetically suggests that Jack is “holding a knife in his chest”—that is, living with unprocessed trauma and a fixed, negative worldview that filters his reality (43:05–44:29).
• Core Insight: Lyle posits that clinging to formative pain creates a self-reinforcing filter: “You find whatever you’re looking for” (26:30–28:46).

“I think that, like, I’m a gigantic believer that you find whatever you’re looking for… If you walk around being like, you know, women are pieces of shit and people in general are liars…”
— Lyle, 27:51

• Jack’s Rebuttal: Jack is adamant his stance is a rational response to legal realities, not merely trauma, though he concedes the pain is inextricable from his perspective (44:48–46:38).
• Binary Thinking: Lyle tries to encourage more nuance, suggesting Jack is locked into a binary “eyes open/eyes shut” way of interpreting experience and pain (54:07–54:14).

6. Jack’s Family Ties & Hope for Change

• Current Relationships: Sibling and mother relationships are strained, but Jack expresses love and a sense of duty, still wishing for connection (33:25–36:18).
• Therapy Experiences: He’s tried traditional therapy but felt misunderstood, often judged for his profession or felt therapists sided with his mother (38:19–40:51).

7. Broader Reflections on Gender & Society

• Gender Wars: Lyle flags the intensification of gender conflict online, noting it’s unproductive: “The constant dick measuring contest of, like, which struggle is worse…is unproductive” (49:06–50:39).
• Jack’s Perspective: Believes feminist-driven laws have undermined families; feels powerless to change the cultural or legal tide (51:01–51:54).

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• [06:38] Jack: “You used to be able to make jokes… you can’t do that anymore in any of the sites. They’ll immediately ban you.”
• [13:29] Jack: “I’ve never gotten married because of it. I’ll never get married. No way.”
• [14:07] Jack (on divorce): “We had a large mutual fund…my mother would not sign the papers…so we lost, like…”
• [16:28] Jack: “If I ever have children, it’ll be via gestational surrogacy. No one's taking my children.”
• [27:51] Lyle: “I’m a gigantic believer that you find whatever you’re looking for.”
• [43:25] Lyle: “You’re just holding, holding on to something, man. Did that resonate with you?”
• [46:59] Jack: “It could happen to me…I could be with a girl and she could just call the police…or get bored with me and divorce me and then ruin my life.”

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Key Segment Timestamps

• Jack’s Introduction & Career Beginnings: 02:38–06:02
• Definitions & Fetish Discussion: 08:00–10:47
• Family Dysfunction Origins: 03:33–05:26; 11:09–13:29
• Marriage, Law & Men’s Rights: 13:29–21:26
• Friendships & Loneliness: 22:15–25:18
• Armchair Therapy — Trauma, Trust, and Letting Go: 25:36–46:59
• Gender Wars & Society: 49:06–51:54
• Closing Reflections: 52:04–54:50

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Second Call: Sam — “Rebuilding After a Toxic Marriage”

[58:49–75:29]

Overview

Switching gears, the mood brightens when Lyle talks to Sam, a recently divorced woman who moved across the country and found a thriving new social life and relationship.

Key Points

• Leaving Toxicity: Sam ended a 10-year abusive marriage, moved from Florida to LA, and rebuilt her life (60:29–61:39).
• New Beginnings: Thanks to an old friend, she found community, happiness, and a healthy new partnership (62:01–63:52).
• Healing Timeline: Sam reflects on happiness in her late 20s/early 30s after years of struggle: “This is the most beautiful season of my life thus far.” (66:16)
• Contrast in Healing: Her story offers a foil to Jack’s—showing it’s possible to create joy after trauma.

“I have so many friends now. I didn’t have any friends where I lived before…I have a new relationship that’s so much better. It’s crazy how much my life has improved in one year.”
— Sam, 60:53

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Episode Tone and Final Reflection

The episode travels from defensive cynicism and guarded pain to hope and creative renewal. Lyle’s empathy and quirky humor soften the intensity, especially in his concluding exchange with Sam—where the discussion playfully spirals from life growth to orgies in Scottish castles to Beauty and the Beast.

Lyle’s parting words to Jack:
“I genuinely sincerely hope that you find some semblance of peace and happiness in your life. I really do.” (52:04)

Lyle, reflecting alone:
“That guy was just holding on to a lot…and just wouldn’t let it go. I don’t know how to get someone to let it go. But, fuck, man…that’s a bummer. I hope he’s alright. I just want world peace and a giant chicken parmesan sub.” (55:39)

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Summary Table of Notable Quotes

| Time | Speaker | Quote | |-----------|-----------------|----------------------------------------------------------------------------------| | 06:38 | Jack | “You can’t do that anymore… they’ll immediately ban you.” | | 13:29 | Jack | “I’ll never get married. No way.” | | 16:28 | Jack | “If I ever have children, it'll be via gestational surrogacy.” | | 27:51 | Lyle | “You find whatever you’re looking for.” | | 43:25 | Lyle | “You’re just holding, holding on to something, man… did that resonate with you?” | | 46:59 | Jack | “I would just be living my life on the edge, waiting for the other shoe to drop.”| | 66:16 | Lyle/Sam | “This is the most beautiful season of your life thus far.” | | 70:22 | Sam/Lyle | (On castles) “Should it be in the ballroom?” “Yeah, where the balls are at.” |

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Closing Thoughts

The episode offers a powerful juxtaposition between holding onto pain and the possibility of genuine transformation. It asks: How much of our worldview is our past, and what does it take to write a new story?

For listeners:
Expect a raw, meandering, emotionally complex conversation—swinging from the darkness of familial estrangement and trust wounds, to laughter about orgies in Scottish castles and heartfelt encouragement on finding joy after hardship.

Transcript

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[Sam]

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[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

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[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

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[Sam]

Yeah.

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[Jack]

Guess who, Guess who's back.

[Sam]

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[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

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[Jack]

Hello.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Hey, what's up, man?

[Jack]

Hey, what's up? My name's Jack. How are you?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

How am I? Yes, sir, I'm all right, man. This. The head of this costume is itchy, but I would.

[Jack]

Yeah, it looks itchy.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Yeah, I have. I mean, yeah, it's. It because my beard is growing out.

[Jack]

All right, well, I guess I'll tell you why I called in and all that, I guess, right? Yeah.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Please, dear God.

[Jack]

Yeah, I'm an adult producer.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

You're an adult producer?

[Jack]

Yes, sir. Yes.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Like, you make 17 years.

[Jack]

No, I haven't made any yet. No. Thank God.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

You produce adults. You're an adult producer.

[Jack]

Adult content producer. How about that?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Okay. Yes. Yes, you're an adult content producer. Okay. Interesting.

[Jack]

Yes. Yeah.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

For 17 years, you say?

[Jack]

Yep, yep. Yeah. Mostly fetish work.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Where are you based out of?

[Jack]

Originally? I started in New Jersey New York, which was a great area, honestly. And then I moved down to Florida.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Interesting. Okay, so you. You've mainly been doing fetish work. And how did you get into this business?

[Jack]

Oh, how did I get into the business? Well, I guess that kind of takes me back a little bit. My parents got divorced when I was younger. I learned, kind of shattered my world. My mom made a false domestic violence claim against my dad. My dad got arrested for it with no evidence. I watched it happen. I almost went to jail because I was very angry and screaming at the police and stuff. I was like 12, 13. Still. Still very, very traumatic. Sad, sad time for me. And it just turned my world upside down. It changed my thoughts about the police. It changed my thoughts about women. It changed my thoughts about everything. And, you know, a lot. A lot of my dreams and a lot of, like, what I want to do. Want to be like a pilot and stuff like that, that just kind of like went out the window, you know, my. I wound up living with my dad. The police kind of really hated me for a while because I sided with my father and not my mom. My mom disowned me and everything, you know, so it was a really tough time. You know, I got, like, thrown out of, like, Christmas parties and stuff like that. When I was. My mom would invite me over for Christmas and holidays, and then she'd throw me out because she would say horrible things about my father that weren't true. And if I didn't agree with it, they just, you know, would say, go, you know, get the out. And then they wound up like, eating like a Chinese restaurant or something for Christmas is terrible. So I didn't have a great childhood. I got beat up all the time in school, no friends, and wound up day trading myself online all by myself, like, you know, making a good amount of money with it. And I wound up like, you know, basically. I guess I've always been into tying up chicks and stuff like that. And so I decided to just, you know, start like a side business of it. So that's what I did. Started a side business and wound up losing a whole bunch of money. Day trading on Scott Trade at the time. I don't know if you remember that website, Scott Trade.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

No, I have no idea what that is.

[Jack]

Oh, geez. Scott Trade was like. Yeah, it was like one of the first online trading platforms. And, you know, I was. I made good money on it and I lost my ass. And then the only thing that was making money for me was my stupid little side project. So I kind of stuck with it, and it just kind of became my life, I guess. So that's what I do now for a living. It's, it's. It's. It's interesting, I guess, you know, has its ups and downs, you know, hours. Do your own thing.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Okay, so this was 17 years ago.

[Jack]

I started 17 years ago. Yeah.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

How old are you now?

[Jack]

I am 41.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

So what's 41 minus 17? Does anyone know 41 minus 41 minus 17?

[Jack]

It's 26.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

26. Okay. You were 26 when you started doing this. Interesting. And then what's 20? 25 minus 17.

[Jack]

It's 2008.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

2008. Because that porn is an interesting industry because I feel like it's evolved so much.

[Jack]

Oh, it's gotten a lot more restrictive, for better or for worse. It's gotten extremely censored over the last six years. You used to be able to make jokes. Like, you know how you can make parody on, like, SNL and stuff? You make fun of, like, political figures and everything. Can't do that anymore in any of the sites. They'll immediately ban you.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Oh, man, I. I got people on this. People on this podcast. They got mad at me because I watched the Lego Movie porn. Have you seen that? No, I was watching it live, commentating it. You should watch it. It's good. It's good. Okay. Anyway, go ahead, go ahead, go ahead.

[Jack]

What I wanted to explain about, especially you're talking about the censorship is terrible. Like, for instance, a lot of the stuff I shoot, like I said, is fetish stuff. And the reason I got into fetish is because it was, like, easily profitable. I needed money. And so I got into, like, foot fetish tickling, that kind of silly stuff, because it was easy. It was really easy to do, and it was easy to get girls to do. You know, you just got wiggle your toes for the camera or have another girl tickle your foot. Who cares? But, you know, even that, you can't even do that now. Like, I like if I wanted to make a. A clip and I wanted to put it up and I wanted to say the words, the phrase, tickle torture. Can't do it. Can't do it. Can't say the word. Tickle torture. Okay, that's too much. That's considered.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Let's.

[Jack]

Considered abuse.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Let's, let's. Let's go. Let's go back. Let's go back. Let's go back here. So you're 26 years old. You're tying.

[Jack]

Yeah.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Girls up. What is. What is that. What are you. What are you doing? How do you get into it? What's the first.

[Jack]

Oh, tying girls. Geez. I mean, that, that, that has to do with, like, when I was a kid. I mean, when I grew up as a kid. That's the. I mean, there's always an urge to do that. We had kite day. It's kindergarten. We had kite day. So that means I got 300 yards of nylon string. Big mistake. Big mistake.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Okay.

[Jack]

I had a girl had a crush on, and I said, let's play cowboys and Indians. And I tied her to a tree with the kite. With the kite string. Okay.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

All right.

[Jack]

So that's how it started. It was always. I've always was doing it, and I guess I did it with my girlfriends. You know, I bought a couple books on. On how to tie a girl up because I didn't want to, like, you know, hurt somebody or anything and the right way to do it. So I mean, it was always something, a skill I had, I guess, or not a skill, just an interest.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

This is known as shibari, correct?

[Jack]

Jabari. Yeah. I wouldn't consider myself a master of shibari, but I would consider myself like, you know, intermediate.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

And so are all. Are. Are the. Is all of the fetish porn mainly tying people up or is. Is there a lot of tickle torture, as you say?

[Jack]

Well, I mean, those both go hand in hand. And I. I just mentioned the word tick. I just mentioned the tickling stuff. That's not like a main thing. I'm gonna just mentioned it just because it's a ridiculousness of the censorship. You can't even say the word stickle torture anymore, much less the words like, you know, like force. You can't say the word force anymore even. But anyway, as far as tying girls up. Yeah, most of the stuff involved tying women up. I mean, I did some balloon fetish stuff for a while. That's obviously not tying up. Sometimes you get really, really, really weird requests. You know, I've got a guy who. He likes watching girls stand on uncomfortable surfaces.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Like, what do you mean by uncomfortable? Like a. Like a block of ice.

[Jack]

Like, imagine a girl at the beach and jumping around foot to foot. Oh, it's hot. Oh, it's hot. This guy really gets turned on by that. Oh, interesting. So all sorts of scenarios like that. Yeah, it's hilarious. That requires no bondage. You know, sometimes it's, you know, there's no bondage sometimes. Most of the time there is, though.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Okay, and then what is balloon fetish?

[Jack]

Oh, geez. Again, no Bondage. It's all about the face the girl makes with the balloons. Like when she. When. When. You know how you blow a balloon up. This happens to anybody. You're blowing a balloon up and it pops in your face and you're, like, really surprised. You're like, oh, I'm like, right. Well, the balloon fetish dudes have gotten it into their heads for whatever reason that the face that they make when they. When they get a. When they. When the balloon pops is like, something sexual, like they're having an orgasm.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

So, okay, sure.

[Jack]

That's what they want. That's a. You got to catch that face. If you catch the O face, you know, it's a. That's what they like. So.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Okay, okay. Cameras can be helpful, and this has been. Okay, let's talk more about some of the other stuff you said. So it's the thing with your. Your relationship with your mom had an impact on how you view women, is what you said.

[Jack]

Yeah, it really did. It really did. Because, you know, I mean, to have the police show up at your house and then arrest your dad for something that didn't happen. Like, I was literally laying on. On the bed with my dad watching, racing. My dad used to race professionally before he became an animal behaviorist, so. And then, you know, the police barge in and just, you know, tell my. They. They said that my father put my mother in a vicious headlock. Well, my mom said this is what happened and put a gun to her head. My dad was like a big burly guy. My mom was very skinny and small. Like, my dad had to work two acres of land. He was very strong. So, you know, anybody putting a woman in a viselak to be a mark, putting a, you know, a gun against the woman's head, there'd be a mark. There were no marks in my mom.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Nothing.

[Jack]

It just didn't matter.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Just. Okay.

[Jack]

What she said was the truth, you know, so that's. That changed my thoughts on, like, domestic violence and everything, because anybody could say anything, and it just didn't matter. You had to be present. You just had to be physically present, and they would arrest you.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Okay, so what. So how.

[Jack]

This is the 90s, by the way.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

And so this is the 90s, and this is, like, what year? 15.

[Jack]

I was about 12, 13 when this stuff got. Went really bad.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

All right, and you're 41.

[Jack]

Just old and just old enough to, you know, have some balls. Yeah, I'm 41 now. Yeah.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

And then. So how does the. How does this impact your worldview? You Know all these, you know, almost 30 years later.

[Jack]

It impacted me almost right away. I mean, I became a men's rights activist before they. They wouldn't even have a name for them. So, I mean, you know, I didn't even know what I was. I just knew that the laws were wrong. I thought. I thought at first what happened to my dad was something that, like, he. Somebody had a beef with him in the township. That's how. That's how bad they treated you. Like, I figured that. I don't know, maybe somebody had. We had a kennel, and I thought maybe, you know, they. Somebody had a bad stay and they were pissed at my dad and this is what. But it wasn't tried. As I did more research, I found out, no, this is happening to lots and lots of men all over the place. And so, yeah, that's. And then I start. And I started. I. You know, it's. It's. Yeah, it's just started my journey down, like, men's rights and not, you know, I've never gotten married because of it. I'll never get married. No way. I have my opportunities, but I don't want to. It's too much of a risk.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Okay.

[Jack]

I have a lot of.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I have a lot of questions. I have a lot of questions here. So, yeah, tell me why you don't want to ever get married.

[Jack]

Okay. So after the. After the whole thing, obviously, my parents got divorced. So after the domestic violence thing, you know, we went into. My dad ran a business. We had a lot of land. It got really bad. We had a large mutual fund that my mom had a. Like, it started crashing. The mutual fund started crashing during the divorce, and my mother would not sign, like, sign the papers to get it out of the mutual fund anymore. The. Our financial advisor needed both signatures, so we lost, like.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Can I stop you. Can I stop you real quick?

[Jack]

Yeah, go ahead.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

What's your name again?

[Jack]

Jack.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Jack. Well, I was going to say, you know, I know you're talking a lot about, like, your family history and how that's impacted you to this day. Right. But, like, I mean, as you move. As you've moved through the world, I assume. And I. And I don't know, these are all just, like, questions, you know, like, as you've moved through the world, I assume that you've observed a lot about the world and the people in it and the relationships that are modeled in it outside of just the one that you grew up with, with your family, which, by the way, I totally accept to be one of. If not the most important relationship modeled in your life. But, you know, again, at 41 of, you know, 20 something years of being out in the universe, have you not observed anything, you know, outside of what it was like for you growing up that has not changed your mind, but just provided you with information about what people could be like and what relationships could be like outside of just what you grew up with knowing. Do you know what I. You get what I'm saying?

[Jack]

Yeah. In other words, have I seen better examples than what my parents had? Like, have I seen examples of successful relationships? Yeah. I mean, the problem is, is that I know the laws too well. And I know that although I may see a happy marriage, it's at the pleasure of the wife, that the wife at any time can just say, ah, you, and like, and leave and take the children, take more than half of. That's why I was talking about the money and stuff. Like, you know, because I watched a successful business and a whole, like, huge family business just get destroyed. And like, that really changed my mind about marriage. It changed my mind. I mean, like, if I were to get married now, right? I have a business, she would, after a while, she married for a little while, she would own 50% of that business. If she left me, you have a hostile business partner, you know, she could take your children. If I ever have children, it'll be via gestational surrogacy. No one's taking my children. Yeah, I know that.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

The way the, the, the I get. I get what you're saying, and I'm not necessarily. I. Look, I'm not married. And I think, yeah, good. I don't know. Well, I'm. I'm not married. I'm not necessarily. I'm. I'm still rather agnostic about the way in which I want to go about my own personal life, but I have thoughts and feelings and ideas about it. But I have the luxury of time on my side. But myself, regardless, the, the. How do I say, the perspective at which you're approaching this, I think it has certain flaws. Not necessarily even about, like, marriage in general, right? Like, like if, like, if I were to take your worldview and you're. And you're applying it specifically to marriage, if we take it broader, the worldview I'm interpreting from you is like this one of, I will not submit to anything and I will not trust anything, and I will not, you know, put myself out there to be vulnerable to anything, because in doing that, I set myself up to the, to the whim of the universe to Fuck me over. And that's, and I don't want to do that, you know? And look, marriage is, you know, and I, I, I, I don't, I don't know. I don't, I mean, is, do you? Yeah. I mean, how do you, how do you feel about that? Because it's, it's, I mean, it's the classic thing. It's like what every song is written about is like, I mean, financials, like, I don't wanna, I don't wanna love. I don't want to put myself out there because I'm risking my. I have to trust other people and I fucking hate doing that because all I've understood about other people is that they fucking people over. I saw it with my dad. I see it in the universe, all this stuff.

[Jack]

Well, I mean, there's, there's difference between trusting somebody and, you know, like signing into a bad contract. And I just, this is just a terrible contract and I just refuse to do it. Like, if, okay, like for example, you know, I find my, I find my wife. My wife finds me in bed with her best friend. She divorces me and takes my stuff, right? I find my wife. I find my wife in bed with my best friend, she divorces me and takes my stuff. That there's no difference. Okay? So like, what I'm trying to say is, and this is true with the most wealthy of men out there and obviously I've, I've got some money, right? I've been doing this for 17 years and people are idiots and they keep buying it. So. Okay, and so, you know, look at, look at John Cena. He has to have a 75 page guest house contract, a 75 page guest house contract for her girlfriend just so that she can't take his house from him. Okay? Like in California, they could, Your girlfriend could take your house from you if you're there. If you live with her for too long. I mean, it's crazy. I don't want to do, I don't want to do it. I just thought it's, it's nuts, okay? And I'm much more happy by myself. And I can have children via gestational surrogacy, so I can have my own family and I don't need them. I don't need them.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Do you?

[Jack]

And it's only gotten worse. It's only gotten worse. It's gotten better.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

What's, what's only gotten worse?

[Jack]

The laws, the laws have gotten worse. I mean, look at, look at. All right, look at like, you know, everybody knows Familiar with the term men's rights. Now, like I said, I started when nobody knew who that was. You know, there are people who founded it who are now dead. Like, that's. That's how long I've known about it. So, like. And, you know, like, there's MGTOW now. I'm sure you've heard about that. Men going their own way. There's the red pill. There's, like. There's actually different factions now. It just used to be men's rights. There's millions of men who were totally turned onto this. But you know why? Because they had the same experience I did where they watched their dad get divorced and get everything taken from them. They don't want that to happen to them.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Yeah.

[Jack]

And that's got nothing to do. It's. And it's the law. It's not like a fantasy. It's not just like, oh, just take a. Take a. Take a leap.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

No, I. I get you. I get you. I get you. I get you. I get you. I get you. I guess. Do you? Well, okay, I mean, let me ask you this, because we're talking a lot about, like. We're talking a lot about, like, marriage contracts, money, finances, all these things. Do you believe in, like, I don't know, love or, like, having a close relationship?

[Jack]

No, I believe that there's love. It's been. It's been corrupted and destroyed. It's been. It's been monetized and everything. Like, it. Like. All right, here's another great example. Like, you talk about money, but unfortunately, it's what it comes down to. Like, anything you do in a marriage. Laundry. I had a friend of mine who got divorced. He got. He. They. They. She. You know, all of a sudden, everything his wife did was monetized. You know, if he. If he told her about his problems, it was. She. You know, she was a psychiatrist. You know, if she did the laundry, she was a maid.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

What do you. What do you mean it was monetized?

[Jack]

They sued. Like, in other words, like, these are things that. That she should be compensated for in the divorce. Because this was like labor. It was like, you know, listening to your problems was labor. Doing your laundry was labor. Cooking for you is labor. But meanwhile, when he changes the oil in the car and he mows the lawn, that's not labor. That doesn't mean anything. That's just your husband with duty. Sorry. Yeah, and I just. I don't like. See, and it just. See example after example of this in my life. Right. And like. No, I get example. After example, you clearly could.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

No, you're clearly very clearly very passionate about this. You clearly have had experiences that are like, you know, have shaped the way you think about these things. But, like, I mean, let me ask you this. Like, I mean, I don't know, man. Are you. Are you lonely? Do you have friends?

[Jack]

Oh, sure, yeah. Get lonely sometimes. I mean, that's why. That's why, you know, gestational surrogacy, having kids, you know, that's. That's definitely come across. I lost a lot of friends, unfortunately. I should have seen it coming. My. All my friends were like, different. Different political spectrum than me. Complete, almost completely opposite. And when you're growing up, like, it doesn't matter as much, right? But then, as you know, the Trump era rolled around and everything, you know, it just wasn't no long. It was no longer a difference of opinion. It was, if you're not on my side, we can't be friends anymore, pretty much. And that's what happened. So. So that. That's what happened. Very sad.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

So you're finding yourself lonely?

[Jack]

Not really. I mean, it depends. I mean, sometimes I get a little lonely, but it's not that bad. I had. Me and my father are very close. My father passed a couple years ago. Obviously me and my dad were like, super close.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I'm sorry.

[Jack]

And. Yeah, it's okay. It's all right. I love my dad. He was great, you know, did. And. And it has made me closer to like my other sibling and stuff now, though. So, you know, I still have. I still have some family there. And like I said, you know, I'm planning on, you know, having my own family soon, so. And I have people in the industry. I talk to this industry though, you know, mostly sucks. You really can't talk to too many people. And most people really don't. Don't give a shit about you. It's all superficial, you know, why.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

And you know, I've. I've been to like, avn. I've been around. I'm not like, I haven't like, worked in porn, but, like, I've, you know, friends with some porn stars, have been around the porn industry. I found them, you know, and I have a much more surface level involvement with it than you do, but I've found them to be pretty nice people, at least in my experience. Do you feel like you haven't found friends within that?

[Jack]

I would say it's more of a business. I would say that, of course, you know, it's very difficult. I don't know. It's it's just in my experience, it's better just to kind of like stay, stay friendly and like, keep it like on somewhere, somewhere in a professional level because, like, you become friendly, you come to become friends, and sometimes they wind up working for your competition or it just becomes like, even messier when, when they decide to end their career or their time with you. That's all. A lot of these careers are very, very short. You know, a lot of these girls, like 90% of the, especially stuff I do, the fetish stuff where you don't even have to take off your clothes for, for 50, 60, 70% of it. I mean, you just get girls who just do it for like a few months. You know, it's like they're, they're crazy. So I supported myself in college one summer, you know, doing balloon fetish or tickling fetish or whatever, you know, and that's, and that's like, you know, so it's, there's a lot of time to become friends with, with some of these girls and you know, and now that I'm getting older, it's starting to be a big age gap, you know, I'm hiring you still. You're still hiring, you know, 18 to 30 year olds and now you're 41. So like, you know, it's kind of. Look at them as kids now. I think I've kind of like outgrown a lot of them. Isn't that weird to say that? But it's true.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I think my thoughts on the whole thing of like, can I, I'm gonna, Can I do fake. Can I do fake therapy with you?

[Jack]

Let's, let's do fake therapy.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Let's do fake therapy. Let's do fake. Let's do fake gecko therapy. I'm just gonna throw some. I'm gonna, I'm gonna throw fake gecko therapy out at you. And I'm curious what you think about it. This is a total armchair therapist stuff. Although I guess, I guess that's what this is. It seems to me like throughout your life and, and I, and I empathize with you because it sounded like you had some really fucking traumatic, difficult, horrible shit happened to you when you were 12 of like your parents being pitted against you. And you're fucking 12, man. You shouldn't be having to deal with all that stuff, you know, and then that gives you.

[Jack]

Yeah. And also.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Yeah, sorry, just let me, let me, let me, let me, let me finish real quick. But okay, sure.

[Jack]

So.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

And then, you know, your parents pitting, pitting you against each other. Just like, having to deal with that like you shouldn't have to be dealing with when you're a kid. And then it shapes your view of the world, shapes your view of. Of women, of men, of how people are treated this and then the other thing. And then you. You grow up and you kind of just like, have this like. Like this, like, schema, like core beliefs about the world and the people in it and whatnot that stem from when you're a kid. And they snowball and they snowball and then they. They stay with you all the way up until, you know, your whole. Your whole life. And they are the lens through which you view everything. And then, you know, it takes you to, you know, place places like the Red Pill or places like the men going their own way and whatnot. And, you know, to. To me, I just think, like, just in a pure observation of you as we've been having this phone call, it seems like you have a really, really strong, like, views and opinions about the world and. And whatnot. And I think that, like, I'm. I'm a huge. I'm a gigantic believer in that you find whatever you're looking for. Do you know what I mean? So, like, for example, like, if you walk around the. If you walk around being like, you know, women are pieces of and people in general are liars and, you know.

[Jack]

I don't think women are pieces of.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I don't.

[Jack]

I don't.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I don't think you do. I don't think you do. I don't think you do. I'm just.

[Jack]

I think the laws are pieces of shit and they give. Like, it's like. It's like as if the law, you know, like, as if men had the ability to beat women up or something. You know, it doesn't mean all men are bad, but the laws are fucked up and you could get the shit kicked out of you and not have any, you know, not have any consequences.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Sure, but I'm just saying. I'm just. I'm just saying I think that, like, if. If you walk around with I'm. And correct me if I. Correct me if I am wrong, but you seem like you're carrying around a fairly negative view of, like, people in the world in general.

[Jack]

Yeah, I'm pretty. Just. I guess it's. You can be pretty distrustful after everything that happened. The other. The other thing I just wanted to throw out there just real fast, I forgot to. It is. Is at the end of this with my dad, you know, with all the Accusations and everything. It culminated in him trying to kill himself. He didn't die.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Let's listen.

[Jack]

So, like, that's probably part of the reason it's so intense for me, you know?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Jack, Jack, listen. You don't have to sell me on the fact that you went through some tough shit, man. I really, I'm, I'm sorry to hear about all that stuff. And I understand why it's been so impactful for you your whole life. I think what I'm, what I'm getting at is just that, like, I think when you experience horrible shit at like a young age, it just like, is really defining to the way you view the world. And I think if you hold on to that and you continue to view the world in such a way of like, oh, I can't trust anyone and the world is fucked up and whatnot, it just continues to, it just continues to be reality because it's what you're like, like, that's like, that's what like, manifestation is like. I don't, like, I don't think manifestation is like a woo woo thing.

[Jack]

I get what you're saying. I'm like that I'm letting. Allowing my childhood trauma to overtake things, but I just, I don't, like. I would agree with you, but these, the laws enable this. The laws enable this. Okay? Like, in the state that my dad was in, like, right now, you look up the laws right now. Did you know that given the silent treatment to your wife, you can go to jail? So if she's yelling at you and screaming and you refuse to talk to her, you can be arrested for that. If you growl at her, you can be arrested for that. If you grit your teeth at her, you can be arrested for that. It's all in the law. It's. I'm like, I'm like, I'm quoting the law. And so like, again, you know, this is not something that is like, oh, it's just like, you know, I'm remembering my dad and the bad things that happened. It's, it, it's, it's supported by the law, it's backed up by the law. And like, I, I just can't abide it. I can't abide it. Maybe, maybe it's, you know, maybe one day when the laws change, you know, I have no idea. And, and it, I'm not the only one that feels this way. Everybody knows that no one's getting married anymore. Everybody knows you have a population crisis.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I get, I, I get you. And listen, here's the Thing I don't. I'm not. I. I ain't in the business of talking about. I ain't. I ain't in the business of debating about the laws, but I'm. I'm more kind of interested and curious about just your life. Okay, so, like, what. I mean, what do you do all day?

[Jack]

What do I do all day? Well, let's see. I can. I've been producing for like a super long time, so I have a huge backlog of content. I kind of. I had a girlfriend, got depressed, got dumped, and I have like a whole bunch of extra content so I can stay home and not do anything. I can. I only shoot like two to three times a month. Maybe I could do it as much as I want or as little as I want. I suppose so. I. Most of most, I have, like. I have seriously have probably more free time than, like, probably like, I don't know what to do with it sometimes. It's. I'm thinking about doing other things by now, like trying to move on from this career. So.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Yeah. Yeah, having. Having too much free time will make you go fucking insane, right?

[Jack]

And you know, you can only stare at like, your bank account and your crypto investments and your mutual fund for so long. It's kind of like, okay, I'm bored with this. I've been working out more. I've been working out a lot more. My dad had a bad heart condition that eventually. That eventually took them. So, you know, I try to eat heart healthy and work out. So I do that work. I try to. You know, I'm like, I'm really seriously, like, researching gestational surrogacy options to start a family and stuff because I'm getting old and I better make a decision on that.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

So when you're so. So I'm curious about the. Okay, so when you're. You say you have too much free time, right? Like when you have all this free time and it. I assume you naturally gravitate unconsciously towards stuff when you're idle. What is that stuff?

[Jack]

Well, like, nowadays it's just like looking to, like, do something different. Like, I really want to talk about what the ideas I have to do. Like, go off into the vanilla world. The vanilla world means anything that's not adult. So, like. But I'm. I am looking to make a transition into the vanilla world, which I can do because, like, no one knows my face, you know, Jack. Jack isn't my real name. So.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Okay. What is. What is. What is. What is your transition into the vanilla world? Look like.

[Jack]

Well, like I said, I just don't want to get too specific with it, but it will obviously not involve the content probably anymore. But. But at the same time, like I said, I have a huge backlog. So, like, I have like six, five, six years worth of stuff I can just release and still make money if my vanilla. If my vanilla ventures don't work out. So probably, you know, you know, looking. Looking to be an entrepreneur like my dad. You know, my dad was an entrepreneur his whole life, and I have been, too. So.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Do you have. Do you have siblings?

[Jack]

Yeah.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

And what's their deal? How are they doing?

[Jack]

He or she went with my mom and. And I love them a lot. I really care about them. And, you know, unfortunately, you know, they bulldozed by my mother and her. Her side of the family and just a whole bunch of. And I think my siblings slowly coming out of it, though. My mom's older and she can't really keep her stories together anymore. And she says lie after lie about my father, and now she's come up with some really ridiculous, silly lies. And, you know, now my sibling is kind of like, you know, do you.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Do you have much.

[Jack]

All the time.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Do you have much of a relationship with your mom at all?

[Jack]

I love her. I think I love her still. After my dad died, you know, I. Things changed a little bit for me with my mom, but she still carries, like, all this anger and hate and everything else, and it's. It's just depressing to listen to, I guess. And it's so. It's like. It's. It's hard sometimes, I guess. You know, there's no way for me to, like, you know, get her. I mean, after divorce, my dad never, you know, made his piece of my mom and never told me never to go see my mother or anything like that. Never said that. And no matter all the terrible things that she said. But. But even. Even though my father's dead, my mom still says terrible things, so. You're very particular.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

You have one other sibling.

[Jack]

You know, possibly. I don't want to get too specific, but.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

All right.

[Jack]

Unfortunately, I've had my family attacked over my business, so.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Do you have a good relationship with any of your siblings?

[Jack]

Yeah, I think. I think that they've. It's been repaired somewhat. I would say, like, on a scale of 1 to 10, it was like a 2 and now it's probably like a 5 or 6. Like average, maybe a little. I want to hope above average. Hard for me to know, man, because I haven't had such a good, I haven't had a good, healthy that family dynamic with anybody but my father since like, like 1999, like so 26 years or something like that. So, you know, it's really tough for me to gauge this. Everybody, I'll tell you this, all right? Like, you know, when, when after my dad passed and everything, people were a lot nicer to me then and you know, things seem to have cooled off a little bit. I don't know, I don't really know what that's about. I don't know if that's because like everything has been like dispersed estate wise or what. I just don't know. So like, I guess time will tell, you know. I hope so. I love them. I, I get my siblings, I have like, you know, nephews and nieces and I get them presents and I try to be a good uncle. So I mean, you know, that's all I can do. Right? There's really nothing else I can do. So excuse me.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Do it.

[Jack]

I definitely offer to hang out with, with them more than they offer to hang out with me, I guess.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Does, did your, did the that happened in your family like affect any, anyone else, like as much as it seems to have affected you?

[Jack]

Well, my, my parents were kind of estranged from like their cousins and their aunts and uncles through other weird stuff that happened before I was born. So I mean like, they really didn't seem to care too much the rest of my family. I mean it affected my siblings very negatively. One of my siblings, you know, had kids really early and really shouldn't have, but it happened. So, you know, and then I'm grateful for my nephews and nieces, so it's okay. But you know, it just, it just, she, you know, this, the, the stereotypical story of you know, some. A divorced girl, like with daddy issues, you know, and you know, she has a kid really young. And so like that, that happened and that was very stressful, you know, and that was also very hurtful because whenever the, remember the, you know, whenever there was a baby or anything, you know, that was also used to kind of like just hurt me and my dad. Like, you know, they wouldn't tell us about the pregnancy, you know, the invite my dad to the hospital for the birth, you know, that kind of thing. And it lasted, it lasted a long time. Like when, when my, when my dad passed, like there was another baby and they had not told me and me and my dad about it for months. And then like after they did, like the only time she sent like pictures to him was when she, you know, was with like, unfortunately it was when like, you know, things were too far gone in the hospital and he never even opened them, unfortunately. So I mean, it's, it's sad, but it is what it is. So, I mean, you know, so, yeah, things, things really suck there.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I, I, I, I'm very curious. Have you ever talked to a real therapist about any of this stuff? And if, oh God. Okay.

[Jack]

All right, Okay. I had, I had so many of them just ask me what I did wrong to like have my mom. Like, like not like me. Like that's pretty much what turned into is like, what would you do? You know, it was always, they always wind up siding with the mother. I only had like one decent therapist who told me like, and this is when I was younger and he was like, look, if your mom is like very hostile towards you and says very negative things about you, you just have to get away from her because everybody's gonna like take what your mom says at like with a huge amount of weight to it. So like, you just have to get away from her. And so like I did that for a while, you know, and you know, she doesn't, she just seems to attack my dad lately, not me anymore.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

So are you and your mom still like, do you see it sounds like you see her often.

[Jack]

Yeah, I mean, if I'm, yeah, if I, if I want to, if I want to see, you know, if I want to see my siblings, you know, I got to see my mom sometimes. So, you know, I mean, I, I don't, I, like I said, it's weird. Like it's a hard thing. It's a very hard bond to break, you know, a parent child bond. So, you know, you could beat it with a sledgehammer and hit it with an ax and sometimes it doesn't break and it's so, it's kind of like still there. Like if somebody hurt my mother, I'd be very upset and I'd be looking for you. You know what I mean? Like, I wouldn't be happy and I wouldn't, I wouldn't sit there and be like, oh, just desserts, haha, you know, ding dong the witch is dead or something. I wouldn't, I wouldn't be like that. Yeah, maybe if I was in my, one of my teenage years, I might have told you that because of how much, how fresh it was. But now it's like, you know, so, so I still, I still care about my mom. You know what I mean?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

You strike me as you strike Me as caring very deeply about your family in general.

[Jack]

Yeah. You know, could be part of the reason. You know, my family's mostly Italian, so, you know, like, other parts of my family that I've seen are very warm with each other. This is not. Not so with. With my. With. With me, though.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

So you've never. You've never had a real therapist tell you anything remotely helpful about all this? Because I. Listen, I'm just. I'm just. This is just armchair.

[Jack]

It's tough. I've had a lot. I've had a lot of people. I've had a lot of people because, you know, like, I. I kind of, like, start hinting them in the adult industry, especially with female therapists, they want to throw me out. I had one female therapist. Not. Not that she. That didn't matter if she was female.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

This.

[Jack]

For this one. But, you know, she was nutty about the COVID shots. And, you know, because I didn't get a Covid shot and I had gotten monoclonal antibodies, she was upset and threw me out. Like, I was like, okay, see you later, lady. I coughed on my way out just on purpose. Well, so. Well, let me tell you something else, too. I'm sorry.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Go ahead. Okay, but listen, listen, you. I'm just. I'm just.

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[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

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[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I don't know why I feel inclined to continue to play armchair therapist here. Although I. What, okay, you, we can.

[Jack]

What's your job? That's what you do.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

We can both agree here, Jack, like, you, you're not, like, you're not a, you're not a dunce. Like, you, like, like, you know you're holding on to something, right? Like, you, you have to be aware enough.

[Jack]

That's so I know that I'm not.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Like, dude, like you, like, you know that. You have to know. You don't need a therapist to tell you. You have to know. It's blame seems to be blatantly obvious in your life that you're a whole. Like, just fucking whole. It's like a, you're like holding on to a knife stuck in your chest or something like that. Like, you're just holding, holding on to something, man. I don't know. I, I, I, like, did that resonate with you? Like, that's just the vibe I'm getting is that you're just like, you're holding deeply on to this crazy weight that is permeating through.

[Jack]

It's funny, it's really funny you mentioned the knife because I got, I got stabbed when I was a kid, so it's not there anymore. I mean, I get it. I've got, I'm holding on to weight.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

But like, and I'm not a real therapist or, or a God or whatever. I don't know what it takes for you, I don't know what it takes for you to, to, to drop it and let, and take the knife out of your chest. And I don't, I don't know what, I don't know what that looks like for you to let it go, but.

[Jack]

I don't think it'll ever happen. I had a beaut, man. Let me tell you.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Why do you think, why do you, why do you hold on? Why do you. And again. And I'm gonna tie this back to what we, I was saying earlier of like, you find what you're looking for, right? Why do you think you'll never let it go.

[Jack]

Again. I guess I just told. I told you. It just comes down to the fact that this stuff is enshrined in law. It's. It's. It's enshrined in law. Like, I had a great forget about.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I. Forget about the laws for a sec. I just, I'm like, just your own life, dude. Like, you know what I mean? Like, just forget, Forget about the, the, the, you know, the, the Just. You forget about your own life for. Forget about the laws for like, just like your own life, man. Like whatever it is you feel like you're holding on to. Like, why. Why are you still holding on to it?

[Jack]

Like, when you say holding on to it, so you mean like, I guess like the stuff with my mom and my dad and all that kind of stuff? Is that what you mean?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I mean, I guess it's like it's evolved beyond. I mean, I'm, I'm. I feel bad because I'm like, just playing full armchair therapist, but like, it's. Yes, the stuff with your mom and dad, but it's evolved into a multi branched thing within you, it seems.

[Jack]

Right. I guess, you know, it just. I don't know. I guess it's just. It just. It was like you said, it was a bad time in my life and it really affected me and it, it, it opened my eyes. You know how you, like, you know, once you see something, you can't unsee it. You know, like, once you find out that certain, certain Christmas characters aren't real. I don't want to ruin anything for any kids who might be listening, but like, like, you know, that's it. You can't, you can't undo it. And like, the magic was gone that day. The day that my mom called the police on my dad and made up a story. All right? Made up a lie and said jammed a gun against her head. That changed my life. It just changed. Was a lie. And it didn't matter. I watched. I watched my dad get in trouble for it anyway. The police threatened to arrest me if I didn't shut up. I was 12. Like, they treated me like I was an adult.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I.

[Jack]

So like, you know, it was unbelievable. It was unbelievable. All right? So, like, I just. That's what. That's. It's just never gonna. I don't know. It's. How am I supposed to.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I know.

[Jack]

And I get away from that. And like, I'm, I'm.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I don't want. Listen, man, I don't want to sit here and be like, Just. I'm not gonna sit here and be like, why don't you just drop your childhood that easy? I don't. I don't think it's that easy. If it were that easy, everyone, it's just.

[Jack]

Because. Because it could happen to me. It could happen to me. I could be with. I could be with a girl and. And she could just call the police. She didn't even have to call the police. And forget about the police. You just get bored with me and divorce me and then ruin my life and, like, it's just like, not worth it to me. Look at all the rich guys who aren't married. Who aren't married. Lyle. Look at it. Look at them, dude.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

But dude, I. Again, I'm. I'm gonna, I'm gonna. Again, I'm gonna respond to that the same. Like a rock could fall out of a tree and hit you on a billion horrible things could happen to you. But every day, dude, taking a bunch of horrible things can happen to you as a result. Like, just. It's just like a. It's like a. I just don't really. And by the way, I'm a huge hypocrite because I do this.

[Jack]

You're not married.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Hold on, hold on. No, no, no. Let me just let me finish because I'm speaking broadly here. I'm a huge hippocrate because I do this, but I'm like, I'm. I'm really not a fan of, like, fear based scenario planning. I don't think that fear based life living and scenario planning is a good idea. I know from experience that it's not a good idea.

[Jack]

I'm not afraid. I'm not afraid of anything. I'm not afraid. I'm not living in fear. I just don't want all my money taken from me. Oprah's not mad either. It happens with rich, rich women too. She said she got to date some dude for. She's been dating some dude for like 29 years. Why? Since she married him. Because she doesn't want to want him have access to his money. To her money. Duh. I mean, like, it doesn't, you know, it's just like. I'm sorry. The laws have changed to the point where we're like, you're just going to be a miserable. It just. It can be a misery if you find the wrong, wrong gal and she decides to ruin you. She could take your children. She could go raise your children. I've watched my friends have kids and then their sons get raised by, like, sacks of shit. The worst people because they, you know, because you can't control it. After she has custody, you can't control who she dates, that, you know, your kid comes back to you with a busted up lip and everything. You can't do anything about it. I would never be able to deal with that, Lyle. I'd be in a prison cell. So there's no way in the world that I put myself in that position where that could happen to me. I would just be like, living my life on the edge, like, waiting for the other shoe to drop.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I'm not. I understand. I'm not telling you, by the way. I'm not telling you that you should get married. That's not the thesis of what I'm attempting to say at all. I want to say this too. I've been looking for an opportunity because I've been thinking about this a lot and maybe you're the guy to have this argument with, but. And I'm gonna. I'm gonna say a bunch of hippie shit right now. Okay, But I've been thinking about it is.

[Jack]

I. I should have smoked a bowl first.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I. I'm kidding. I just. I think that like, like the gender wars are like, peaking really hard right now. And like, you see it on the Internet and whatnot of like, you know, people being like, men are like this, women like it. And I think, I think it's. I just think it's kind of. I think it's stupid because it's like, no matter who you like, if there are things in the world as a man that are, you know, struggles individual to that experience, and then there are things in the world as a woman that are struggles individual to that experience. And like this, the constant like, dick measuring contest of like, which struggle is worse. I, I think is, is like, unproductive.

[Jack]

Yeah, it's terrible. It's horrible. It's destroyed. It's destroyed relationships and love and all sorts of things. Yeah, I agree with you. It's terrible. I mean, there's nothing I can do about it though. You know what I mean? I'm not. I'm not a. I'm not stronger than feminism and neither are you. So, like, what. What do you do?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

It's not about being strong. What do you mean by stronger than.

[Jack]

Well, well, like, in other words, there's, you know, been a huge, huge push for all these domestic violence laws, right? VAWA and all that stuff. Violence against women's act and all that kind of stuff. There's something called the Duluth model, which was, which was cooked up by some big fat, big fat in. In Michigan. It's the thing that got my dad arrested. Where in the absence of. In the absence of, like, evidence of force, like, in other words, marks on someone's body or something, you arrest the person who looks more likely to. Who looks more likely to commit abuse, which, of course, is always, always the man. So that's what I mean. So, like, it's these. These forces have been, you know, fighting against the family unit for many, many years. And this is me. I'm a porn producer telling you this. I'm a porn producer telling you guys this. You guys should really take note of that, that this is coming from a porn producer, that I'm telling you that this stuff has destroyed families. I'm not. I'm not a professor. I'm not anybody qualified.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Jack, are you there? Jack?

[Jack]

I'm here. Yeah, of course I am.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Jack, I'm gonna. I'm gonna let you go. But before I do, I want to. I want to say this. I genuinely sincerely hope that you find some semblance of peace and happiness in your life. I really do.

[Jack]

And I appreciate it. I think I'm pretty close to it.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

You know, that's really all I have to say to you, I think, is that I. That's.

[Jack]

That's.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

That's. That's the main. That's the main thesis of what I'd like to convey to you before we end this.

[Jack]

All right. Well, I'm sorry if I upset you or anything.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

No, you. I swear you didn't. You didn't. No, no, no, no, no. You didn't upset me at all. I. And I. You didn't upset me at all. And I, I. Listen, I appreciate you being vulnerable with us and, like, sharing this stuff. I hope that this conversation was productive in some way, shape or form to, to your life, even if miniscule. Yeah.

[Jack]

It feels good to get it out, man. I really appreciate it.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Okay, good. Yeah, just. I don't know, man. I, I, I wish. I wish I could help you let go of whatever it is you're holding on to, but, you know, I just. I hope you find some semblance of peace. I really do.

[Jack]

I mean, like I said, I just don't feel like I'm. I don't know. I don't know if holding on to something is right. It just. It's affected me. It's. It's opened my eyes to, like, what the dangers are, you know, and I just. I can't unclose my eyes, you know? What? I mean, I just can't close them again. So, like, I can't, you know, erase it.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

But it's not about. It's not. I don't think. But it's not about the. Like, you're operating on some kind of, like, binary. You're operating on, like, a binary system of the eyes closed and the eyes shut.

[Jack]

Or.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I'm sorry, that was. I fucked up. You're operating on, like, a binary system of, like, the eyes closed versus the eyes open. And I don't.

[Jack]

I don't have a shut.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I'd like to introduce a z axis here where there's multiple ways to interpret the. There's. There's multiple things to have your eyes open to and multiple ways to interpret them versus this binary that you're living in. Of like, I have taken the red pill and I now fundamentally understand the existence and. And I fundamentally understand how society works. I don't. I think that's. I don't like that binary way of thinking. I don't think it's good.

[Jack]

I wasn't red pill even when I was thinking that stuff. There was no such term. You know, it was just. It was just me reading the laws and being like, wow, I don't want to do this. That's me sitting in the library and. And, you know, in my. In my town reading the laws and saying, like, I. I don't want to do this. That's. That's really what happened to me. I mean, it's that I wasn't. This was all before, like, you know, any kind of, like, you know, red pill guy or whatever. Any guru. There were no gurus back then. There was nobody.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Well, Jack, is there anything else you want to say to the people at the computer before we go?

[Jack]

No, nothing really. I mean, thanks. Thanks for having a chat with me. I'm sure. I'm sure some people probably think I'm crazy or stupid or really smart, you know, whatever. Who knows? So. I don't know. Have a good one and, you know, keep doing your show, man. I really enjoy your show. It's a really good show.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Thank you, Jack. I appreciate it, man. You have a good rest of the day.

[Jack]

Have a good one, man. You too. But.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Goodbye, Jack. I was an interesting phone call. I don't know. I want. Well, I don't know. I. I mean that. I think I'm playing such armchair fucking therapist right now, but I think, yeah, I mean, it's just. I don't know, it's just sad. I mean, I could tell that. That guy was just like holding on to a lot and just. Would you just. Just. We just wouldn't let it go and I don't know how to get someone to let it or if you can get someone to let it go. But like, fuck, man, just, you know, that's a bummer. I hope he's alright. I don't know. I just want. I just want. Just want world peace and a giant chicken parmesan sub would be nice. Anyway, thanks for listening to that phone call. Hey folks, I'm here today to tell you guys about TikTok's hashtag live fest2025. I know a lot of you guys are TikTok scrollers. Maybe that's how you found this show in the first place. Maybe some of you are content creators yourselves, doing wacky dances or singing songs or sharing stuff from your life on there. But whichever one you are, you're going to want to be part of TikTok's Live Fest 2025. There will be all kinds of performances, challenges, battles and big community moments for you to dive into. Anything can happen and that is the magic of TikTok Live. Creators of every kind from all over the world are gathering together. And from December 10th to the 22nd, Live Fest is going full throttle. So whether you are a fan or a creator, search hashtag live fest 2025 on TikTok to catch everything happening during Live Fest and let's celebrate Live together.

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[Savage Mike]

Trainer Games on Prime Video January 8th.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Watch the trailer on trainergames.com.

[Sam]

Hello? Hello, is this Lyle?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Yes. Who is this?

[Sam]

Oh, my gosh. I'll go by. Hi.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Hi, Sam. How was. How's life? How's life? How's it going? For me? It's going good. Actually, I think it's going pretty good. I'm enjoying being live.

[Sam]

Glad to hear it.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

You know what though?

[Sam]

Life's crazy, man.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

It is crazy. The worst Part about, like. I was gonna say the worst part about, like, getting out of a depression cycle is when you start liking life again. And then you're like, oh, fuck, this is gonna. I don't want this to end. This is good. And that's depressing. No, I'm. I'm enjoying life. I'm enjoying life on a very normie plain plane right now, and I'm liking it.

[Sam]

And what was the good part of the depression cycle? That you didn't want to leave or the good part?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Yeah, well, no, like, I guess what I meant was, like, if you're depressed and you. And then you start thinking about, like, oh, we're all gonna. And then you get, like, nihilistic, and you're like, we're all gonna die. You're like, all right, well, at least this will be over. But then when you get happy again, you're like, oh, I don't want this to end. This is nice anyway. That's a lot.

[Sam]

Totally identify with that right now. No, no, no, no. That makes total sense.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

That's a lot. You know what we can talk about. We can talk about that, but I don't think I want to right now. I'd rather talk about anything else. What's going on with you, Sam? How's life? What's up? What made you want to call on.

[Sam]

The Meg Echo show today right now? I've been trying to call you for months. Earlier in this year, I actually. I got a divorce and ended like a 10 year toxic abusive relationship. And I moved across the country by myself and everything's been great since then.

[Jack]

Wow.

[Sam]

Yeah. I don't really know where to start. I have so many friends now. I didn't have any friends where I lived before. I was pretty isolated, and I now live near someone I actually grew up with in middle school. I didn't move back to my hometown, but, yeah, she's introduced me to a bunch of new friends. I have so many new friends. I have a new relationship that's, like, so much better. And it's crazy how much my life has improved in one year, you know?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Cool. Remind me again when you said you made this move.

[Sam]

So I moved officially in July.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Okay.

[Sam]

Packed up my two cats, put them in the car, and drove across the country with my dad. Now I live in California with my mom.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Where did you meet all these new friends.

[Sam]

In California? Here, where I live. I live in LA now.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Well, I guess, like, through what means? I mean.

[Sam]

Oh, through my one friend that I grew up with. I went to middle school with her and she happened to move out here a couple years ago. She works in the. In, you know, la, out here. She works in video games and she just, like, is friends with everyone else in LA that makes video games. It seems like she has so many. She knows everyone here, it seems so. Yeah. I've kind of just got sucked into her friend group. It's been really fun.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Cool, cool. And how'd you meet this new. This new boyfriend?

[Sam]

I also met him through her.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Oh, wow. This lady's done a lot. Done a lot for you.

[Sam]

Yeah. Oh, my gosh. I feel so blessed to be able to just reconnect with someone who I've been friends with for such a long time. And, like, a lot of people tell me they moved to LA and it's a big city and it's really hard to make friends as an adult. It's so difficult. But just having someone here who, you know, is basically just handed me so many friends, she's sharing all her friends with me. It's been great.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Nice, nice. That's good. Yeah. A lot of people, they don't want to mix their friend groups. A lot of people are kind of antsy about that because there's a lot of, like, they feel some sense of responsibility if it doesn't go well. You know, they feel some sense of responsibility for things to mesh, so they don't want to do it. But your friend seems like she's very generous with her life. That's nice.

[Sam]

Oh, my gosh. She's so generous. She's the nicest. She's. I love her so much. Yeah. I've never understood why people don't like to mix their friend groups, but, yeah, I guess what you just said makes sense. I feel like they have to maybe facilitate the relationships, then the friendships.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

So do you work in video games?

[Sam]

I do not. I work as an analyst. I do a boring office job. I get to work remotely, which is pretty cool.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Pretty good.

[Sam]

But no, no, I mean, it's good. It's so nice to have a job, especially when so many of my friends are, like, struggling to get jobs in industry right now. But I just feel, like, so unfulfilled doing spreadsheets all day.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

What would you do if you could do anything?

[Sam]

I could do anything.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Yeah.

[Sam]

I would, like, learn how to sew. I already like to crochet. I'd probably maybe learn how to knit and, like, I just like to make blankets. I would want to learn how to make clothing. And this is, you know, in an ideal world where I don't actually have to make a profit or an income to live. And I would just like, make clothes and blankets and give it to people who need them. I don't dream of, like, making money.

[Jack]

Mm.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Sounds like you have a nice life. What happened? So where did you, where did you move from? You don't have to give me the longitude and latitude of it, but like, what part of the country I moved from?

[Sam]

Florida.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Florida. And do you still have any ties to Florida besides like, that, the bad relationship? Like, do you have friends there or family there?

[Sam]

I have a couple of friends. 1. I have one family member that lives out there, but, but for the most part, no. No, like strong relationships, no strong ties.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Is that where you grew up?

[Sam]

No, I did not. I grew up in Ohio.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Anything going on in Ohio still?

[Sam]

Nope. No friend or, Sorry, no family left out there. So really no reason to go back. I have one good friend out there that I grew up and went to high school with, but it's been probably two or three years since I visited him.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Okay, so in your new friend group. And I like this, I think this is an inspiring story because. How old are you?

[Sam]

I'm 29. I'm turning 30 in two months.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Turning 30 in two months. And just now coming into what? The way you're talking about this sounds like it's like the most beautiful season of your life thus far. I don't know if that's true.

[Sam]

Man, I'm so happy right now, but let me, I've been struggling just this entire year. I, I, I don't know where what even to start talking about, but this time last year, I actually like, had just married this person who treated me so horribly and we had a terrible relationship for years. And I think we got married very quickly to just try to like save the relationship. And it very quickly was apparent to me that that was the absolute wrong thing to do. And. Oh, I've always wanted to tell you that, like, just like going through bad times in that relationship, I would spend a lot of like my spare time listening to you. So sometimes, man, like when it's getting really tough, I would, I would be like, what would therapy Gecko tell me to do?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

What the would I tell you to.

[Sam]

Do you would tell me to do? Makes me happy, man.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Oh man. No, I would probably tell you to. No, I'd probably tell you to invest in a combination of both foreign and domestic index funds in a combination of taxable and non taxable accounts that you can defer towards retirement.

[Sam]

We're gonna, are we Gonna start my Roth IRA now?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Yeah, it's probably. Yeah, anytime. Just for the record. And if anyone listening to this is thinking, like, what would therapy Gecko tell me to do? He would tell you to start a Roth ira.

[Sam]

I've looked into it. It's. It's. There's a. There's a lot of. It looks like a lot of responsibility.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Anyway, I'm. I'm happy for you, though. That sounds awesome. It's. I'm really. I'm really, like, genuinely. It's very cool. I think there's so much, like, doomerism surrounding, like, getting older and going through life, and so much classification of this period of time is supposed to be the best period of your life and this and that and the other thing and, you know, being some age or some position in life and being like, oh, it's over. I'm. And then, you know, so I like a nice story of, like, being able to find a beautiful season of life after. Hold on, I have to sneeze. Fuck. I like. I like being able to. The story of finding a nice season of life later on in it. I think it's cool. So I'm excited for you. How many. Who's the craziest? Who's the wackiest member of the bunch of the new group of friends? Who's the. Who's the real wild card?

[Sam]

Oh, they're all kind of. They're all so crazy in their own way. They're all video game developers. I. I'm just friends with a bunch of, like, the queer LA nerds. I love them all so much. I've got one friend that just like, travels around the world and throws orgies with other people that want to meet them, you know, where. In a castle in the middle of Scotland or whatever, and throw a big sex party. It's crazy out here.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I just heard a cat. A sex party castle in the woods.

[Sam]

Yeah. One of my friends. I don't. They were at a castle for, I think a LARP event. And I think it turned some part of the castle turned into a sex room. And I don't know all the details, you know.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

You know, I. Is there any reason to build a castle if you don't have a designated sex room?

[Sam]

Yeah. If not, what is even the point?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Exactly. Exactly.

[Sam]

Should be in the ballroom. No.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Should it be in the ballroom?

[Sam]

Yeah, where the balls are at.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Oh, I like that. Now, the ballroom is where you get all fancy and then you, you, you know, people court each other. Did the Beat, did in Beauty and the Beast. Did they. Did they have sex in that movie?

[Sam]

I don't think it explicitly showed it, but, yeah, I think they definitely fucked.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

When. That's. I. When I think of ball. When you said the word ballroom, I was thinking about that ballroom scene.

[Sam]

Mm. Mm. Yeah. They didn't show that part that guy earlier was talking about, like, covers the eyes of the young teapot, though. That's. That's why. That's where it was leading to say that again. Mrs. Potts, like, rushes away the little teacup chip. Because he's a kid, she rushes him away. She's like, you don't need to see what's going on here.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Which is interesting because even the. The teacup presents as a child. He's. That the cup itself has probably been around for, like, hundreds of years.

[Sam]

You're right. Like I was talking about would take on the memories or the experiences that that teacup lived through in a time.

[Jack]

Oh.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

When it becomes sentient.

[Sam]

Yeah.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I'm really glad, you know. You know why the Disney movies work? Have you ever had. You ever had a fucking idea? You ever. I know. I have friends like this, and I hate them. You, like. You ever have, like, an idea for something and then someone immediately starts telling you why it doesn't make sense.

[Sam]

Okay.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I think, like, if they were in the writer's room or whatever of Beauty and the Beast, and they veered away from the story and whatnot to, like, focus in on. Why does, like, it doesn't make sense that this cup is sentient or whatever. I think that they'd make a bad movie. I think a lot of making great things is about asking as few questions as possible, just doing. Doing the thing. That's why I'm inspired by both Beauty and the Beast in that regard.

[Sam]

Yeah, I see what you're saying. That makes sense.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

That guy earlier was talking this. I just wanted to finish the thought, but it's not funny or interesting. But that guy earlier was talking about, like, porn censorship. And I wonder if, like, the. If it's. You can't. He said that you can't make porn parodies anymore. I don't know if you heard that guy earlier.

[Sam]

I did hear that guy. He said that you can't make porn parodies.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

And it's funny because now that I think about it, there has been a distinct lack of porn parodies.

[Sam]

Right. Where's the. I'm not gonna start listing what I want a porn parody of, but, yeah, where are they? If you could turn any. Anything into a porn parody that you don't Think has been done yet. What would you choose?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I want a porn parody of Stephen King's it called Stick. Called Stick it in My Ass.

[Sam]

Damn. What the. Oh. Oh, God.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

What about you?

[Sam]

Have you seen the new Knives out movie? Wake up, dead man.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Oh, Knives in my ass.

[Sam]

Yeah, exactly.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I like that. Sam, is there anything else you want to say to the people of the computer before we go?

[Sam]

Have a good day, guys. Thanks for listening. I'm glad I finally got to talk to you, Geck. Oh, Geck, hit me. I saw you live when you were in Tampa, I think a year ago. Swag, you were great.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Oh, thanks, man.

[Sam]

As I was walking to my seat, I actually, like. They walked me past the backstage area and you were back there looking at paper or something.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Yeah.

[Sam]

Oh, hi, Geck. You remember that?

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

I actually do remember this. Yeah.

[Sam]

I've always wondered if you heard me because the guy, like, closed the curtains right behind you right as I said it.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Yeah, I remember the late. I remember the layout of that place. Shout out to Tampa. Improv. I'll try to come back. I'm going on Tour again in 2026. I'll try to do some Florida shows. We'll see what.

[Sam]

I'm in LA now, so I don't.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Okay, well, I'll definitely. Well, great, then I'll definitely be in la, so.

[Sam]

All right, Gag. I'll see you there, Swag.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

Thank you, Sam.

[Sam]

Thanks, man. Bye.

[Therapy Gecko (Lyle)]

That was nice. That was a nice phone call to end on. This has been the Therapy Gecko podcast. My name is Lyle. That's. Those are the two main things that I said just now. Thanks for listening. Thanks for listening to the show. I'm gonna keep. I'm gonna keep talking about this. I mentioned I'm going on tour in 2026. I'd love for you guys to come, and I'd love for you guys to know when I'll be in your town. So in order for me to do that, it would be of great help to me if you are a listener of this podcast, if you could go to therapygeckotour.com and give me either your phone number or email. I am not gonna send you a fucking text every day or even every week or even every month or maybe even every year. But if you do that, I will just be. I'll text you when I'm near your city and doing a Gecko show. At these Gecko shows, I tell. I do like some comedy storytelling about my life. I do some live therapy Gecko sessions. This. This will be my fourth tour. I'm really excited about it. So go to therapygeckotour.com and put your phone number and whatever the fuck in there. I'd appreciate it. Thanks for listening to this podcast. Thanks for indulging my existence on this earth and validating it by putting me in your ears. Go to Twitch TV Lyle Forever and follow me on there to get a notification for when I'm streaming live. And that's how you can call into the show. I stream at random times when I feel like it. Try your best. Don't kill yourself. Hail Satan, Whatever. Okay, thank you very much. Bye bye.

[Podcast Host]

This is Sophie Cunningham from Show Me Something. Do you know the symptoms of moderate to severe obstructive sleep apnea, or OSA in adults with obesity? They may be happening to you without you knowing. If anyone has ever said you snored loudly, or if you spend your days fighting off excessive tiredness, irritability and concentration issues, it may be due to osa. OSA is a serious condition where your airway partially or completely collapses during sleep, which may cause breathing interruptions and oxygen deprivation. Learn more at don'tsleep on OSA.com this information is provided by Lily, A Medicine company. Live Fest 2025 is taking over TikTok right now and the hottest creators on your feed are going all out to claim the top spot on TikTok Live. Here's one you can't miss.

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[Jack]

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[Podcast Host]

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