Podcast Summary: This Guy Sucked — Godwin Sturt & Thomas of Monmouth with Elise Wang
Host: Dr. Claire Aubin
Guest: Professor Elise Wang
Release Date: September 18, 2025

Overview

This episode of "This Guy Sucked" takes a deep dive into the lives and disastrous legacies of Godwin Sturt and Thomas of Monmouth, two relatively obscure 12th-century figures who became the creators of the notorious "blood libel" conspiracy theory. Host Dr. Claire Aubin and guest Professor Elise Wang explore how their actions and writings ignited centuries of antisemitic violence, shaping European (and global) history and conspiratorial thinking up to the present day. The show combines scholarship with a caustic, often darkly humorous tone, exposing how opportunism, resentment, and petty grifting can have horrific consequences that echo through time.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

Medievalist Vibes and Motivations

• Elise talks about her academic background, love of medieval studies, and the escapist, eccentric appeal of medieval literature.
  • [02:10] "We know so little about him… William Langland...wrote this 7,000 line poem...It's insane...and they spend their whole lives interpreting these various...little Easter eggs." — Elise Wang
• Medievalists often gravitate toward the bizarre, mysterious, and esoteric, which contrasts with the often bleak reality focus of 20th-century historians.
  • [04:47] "We're not researching the present, so we just surround ourselves in the atmosphere." — Claire Aubin
• Elise’s current research explores the origins of conspiracy theories, a prescient topic in both medieval and modern contexts.

Meet the Suckers: Godwin Sturt & Thomas of Monmouth

• Godwin Sturt: An English parish priest in Norwich, locally respected but not powerful in the church hierarchy.
  • English identity is important, as he is from pre-Norman stock.
• Thomas of Monmouth: Norman, Benedictine monk at Norwich’s cathedral priory, highly educated, may have noble origins, functionally trilingual and self-styled as a writer.
  • [13:35] "Godwin is your standard issue English priest…Thomas is actually very well educated...completely fluent in English, French and Latin…he fancies himself a writer." — Elise Wang
• Both men are otherwise unremarkable in the historical record, but become deeply consequential via their conjunction in a single horrific narrative.

The William of Norwich Blood Libel: Event Breakdown

• William of Norwich, Godwin’s nephew by marriage, is found dead in 1144 at age 12.

  • Godwin accuses local Jews of murder at the Synod, seeking revenge and vengeance—an accusation with little traction at the time.
  • Godwin starts a side business selling "relics" from William’s corpse, notably only taking the teasel (thistle) from his body rather than the body itself.
  • [19:13] "How do I make a buck off of this tragedy?" — Claire Aubin
  • [19:17] "He’s so hateable…he's destabilizing the trust in his community so he can get this poor woman's last chicken for a little bit of water he's dipped the teasel in." — Elise Wang

• Five years later, a Jewish moneylender is murdered; a Norman knight is responsible, but the trial is derailed by the bishop, who revives Godwin’s old accusation (as it suits the bishop’s interests).

  • [22:07] "Out of pure love of justice and no ulterior motives...the bishop says...not until the Jews are punished for a murder of their own." — Elise Wang

• Thomas of Monmouth enters, turning Godwin’s crude rumor into a literary and theological weapon.

  • He authors "The Life and Passion of William of Norwich," crafting a story of ritual Jewish child murder for Passover (the first complete "blood libel").
  • [23:23] "This is the beginning of blood libel...hundreds of pogroms...it continues throughout the medieval period...You might recognize it from QAnon." — Elise Wang

Historical Impact and Spread

• The blood libel narrative spreads from Norwich across England and Europe, appearing in dozens of similar accusations, pogroms, and saints’ cults.
  • [31:12] "You can trace it going across England...then across the continent...Simon of Trent..." — Elise Wang
• The same conspiratorial logic is adapted and weaponized beyond Christian/Jewish relations, informing bigotry against numerous minorities globally in new forms.

The Psychology and Sociology of Conspiratorial Grifting

• Neither Godwin nor Thomas fit a "downtrodden" or "desperate" profile—they are men of relative privilege resentful at not having more.

  • [40:32] "Godwin’s not suffering...he’s not suffering. I don’t buy it." — Elise Wang

• Their conspiracy gains traction not through grassroots rumor, but through dogged, opportunistic effort—a hustle amplified by church bureaucracy and opportunistic authorities.

  • [70:52] "They created this whole cloth. You know, this isn’t like rumors are going around. In fact, everybody seems to be pushing back on it." — Elise Wang

• Thomas’s supposed visions and invented witnesses (e.g., "Theobald" the convert) expand the antisemitic universe and provides a model for conspiratorial narrative-building today.

  • [54:35] "He claims every year Jews from across the world gather…in which to sacrifice Christian child…this is building out the lore of the antisemitism universe." — Wang

• Thomas’s writings are obsessed less with Jews and more with castigating doubters and "perfidious serpents," cementing the epistemic structure of conspiracy theory:

  • [51:07] "Books two through seven are basically all about the evil people who do not believe Thomas…evilness of people who doubt Thomas’s story." — Wang
  • [69:53] "He provides this, like, conspiratorial structure of, like, the secret that is being hidden from you by bad actors...he built the whole, like, epistemological structure of the conspiracy theory..." — Wang

Quotes – Notable and Memorable

• [13:35] "Godwin is your standard issue English priest…Thomas is actually very well educated...completely fluent in English, French and Latin…he fancies himself a writer." — Elise Wang
• [19:13] "How do I make a buck off of this tragedy?" — Claire Aubin
• [19:17] "He’s so hateable…he's destabilizing the trust in his community so he can get this poor woman's last chicken for a little bit of water he's dipped the teasel in." — Elise Wang
• [23:23] "This is the beginning of blood libel...hundreds of pogroms...it continues throughout the medieval period...You might recognize it from QAnon." — Elise Wang
• [40:32] "Godwin’s not suffering...he’s not suffering. I don’t buy it." — Elise Wang
• [51:07] "...books two through seven are basically all about the evil people who do not believe Thomas…evilness of people who doubt Thomas’s story." — Wang
• [69:53] "He provides this, like, conspiratorial structure of, like, the secret that is being hidden from you by bad actors...he built the whole, like, epistemological structure of the conspiracy theory..." — Wang
• [77:38] "Grifting is usually a pretty good guess." — Wang

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [09:08] Introduction to Godwin Sturt & Thomas of Monmouth
• [14:21] William of Norwich’s murder and the seeds of blood libel
• [19:13] Godwin’s transformation from grieving uncle to seedy relic-grifter
• [22:05] The trial of Eliezer, antisemitism, and the bishop’s intervention
• [23:23] Birth and consequences of blood libel—past and present echoes
• [44:16] William’s relationships and humanizing the medieval setting
• [50:18] Thomas’s personality and the personal grudge at the heart of a myth
• [54:35] Discussion of Theobald and mythmaking
• [65:17] Thomas’s grift escalates: relic theft and bending monastic rules
• [68:27] The persistent legacy of blood libel in modern antisemitism and conspiracy
• [69:52] Conspiracy theory is a tool of resentment, not a product of powerlessness
• [76:47] The limits of historical knowledge, and the allure/danger of invented certainties

Themes & Takeaways

• Medieval roots of modern hate: The episode makes clear that some of today’s most destructive conspiracy theories can be traced directly back to petty, opportunistic individuals motivated by personal gain and resentment—not just mass ignorance or spontaneous rumor.
• Intersection of power, resentment, and storytelling: Godwin and Thomas wielded narrative (rather than formal influence) to accrue personal profit and power, with devastating consequences.
• Echoes in modernity: From Nazi propaganda to QAnon, the blood libel structure adapts and persists—still leveraged by political opportunists today.

Final Thoughts

In dissecting the origins of one of history’s most destructive conspiracy theories, Claire Aubin and Elise Wang reveal how seemingly minor grifts and resentments, when wedded to narrative ambition, can spawn horrors that last for centuries. Their discussion is scholarly yet irreverent, underlining the importance of critical reading of history—not just to understand the distant past, but to recognize its active legacy.

Find Prof. Elise Wang on BlueSky @EliseWang, and her book The Making of Felony Procedure in Middle English Literature via her website elisedwong.com.