Podcast Summary: This Is Woman’s Work with Nicole Kalil

Episode 348: “Building a Brand Worth Fighting For with Laura Ries”
Date: September 29, 2025
Host: Nicole Kalil
Guest: Laura Ries (Brand Marketing Expert, Author of “The Strategic Enemy”)

Episode Overview

This episode dives into the power of building an authentic personal or business brand by identifying what you stand against—your “strategic enemy.” Nicole is joined by renowned branding strategist Laura Ries, who explains why clarity about who (or what) you’re not is essential for cutting through noise, resonating with your audience, and creating a lasting, defensible identity. The conversation goes beyond theory, delivering practical advice for entrepreneurs, creators, and anyone looking to define (or redefine) themselves in a crowded world.

Key Discussion Points

1. The Value of Defining What You’re NOT

• Nicole’s Opener [01:11]:
  Nicole shares her personal journey, reflecting that it’s often easier to know what she doesn’t want than what she does—applicable in life, relationships, and brand-building.

  • “Sometimes the clarity comes not from declaring what you are, but from boldly deciding who you’re not.” [02:54]

• Laura’s Core Principle [04:31]:
  Laura introduces the “strategic enemy” concept, asserting that people process opposition faster than superiority.

  • “You understand opposition much faster than superiority... When you say you’re not, that actually in reverse makes it more clear what you stand for.” – Laura Ries [04:31]

2. Why Positioning Against an “Enemy” Works

• Perception Over Reality [05:14]:
  Brands live in the mind; perception matters more than simply “being better.” Contrasting with what you oppose is both memorable and believable.

• Examples:

  • Dinner choices: It’s easier to eliminate what you don’t want first.
  • Personal branding: Nicole distances herself from “toxic positivity” podcasts; instead, she’s real and candid.

• Memorable Branding Through Visual Language [06:27]:
  Laura emphasizes using visual, relatable words helps cement a brand in memory.

3. How to Identify Your “Strategic Enemy”

• Not Always a Person/Competitor [07:13]:
  Laura clarifies the “enemy” can be a concept, convention, time, or emotion—not just a rival product.

  • Example: A non-profit fighting against the “fast four years of high school,” making time the enemy and their value proposition clear.

• Other Brand Examples:

  • Cakes Body—combats “nipple freak-out” [08:21]
  • Skims—positions against “beige shapewear,” standing for inclusivity and variety [09:00]
  • Bumble—flips dating power dynamics (women make the first move) [09:40]

4. The Value (and Fear) of Exclusion

• Narrowing Your Audience [10:16]: Nicole raises the concern: If you draw a line, don’t you lose people?
• Laura’s Take [10:49]:
  Standing for something doesn’t mean you exclude everyone else—it means you’re memorable. The market is larger than your target; strong imagery attracts a broader base over time.
  • “When you try to appeal to everyone, you don’t have something to stand for... But the target is not necessarily the market.” – Laura Ries [10:49]
  • Example: Marlboro’s “cowboy” targeting men, but their brand became the #1 cigarette among women due to strong imagery.

5. Consistency and Category Matter

• Consistency Builds Trust [13:53]: Laura explains that anchoring your brand (even with small, repeated cues) drives recognition. Variety is fine for people, but powerful brands maintain clarity and consistency.
• Categories in Consumer Thinking [14:52]: People don’t pick brands first; they pick categories—then choose the dominant or most resonant brand within it.

6. The Do’s and Don’ts of Brand Building

• Outsider Perspective [15:51]:
  Branding yourself is tough—having someone else’s perspective is valuable.
• Narrow Focus [16:10]:
  Most important: Decide what you stand for—become a specialist, not a generalist.
• Competitor-Focused, Not Just Customer-Focused [16:40]:
  • “When you’re competitor-focused, you have to look at the landscape to say, ‘What can I do best to set up a difference?’” – Laura Ries [16:40]
• Visual Distinctiveness [17:10]: Visual cues (personal uniforms, colors, accessories) reinforce the brand.
  • “I always wear red. Jensen Huang at Nvidia wears a black leather jacket. Steve Jobs wore a black turtleneck...” – Laura Ries [17:15]

7. Common Branding Mistakes

• Trying to Be Everything to Everyone [19:37]: Broad, general messaging dilutes memorability.
  • “To build a brand...you have to be as narrow as possible.” – Laura Ries [19:40]
  • Example: BMW’s success after focusing on “The Ultimate Driving Machine” [20:03]
  • Counterpoint: Skechers’ “anti-Nike” positioning as comfortable shoes for everyone, not just athletes.

8. Deploying the Strategic Enemy

• Brand Messaging [21:07]:
  Farmer’s Dog vs “burnt brown balls”—fresh dog food positioned against highly processed kibble.
  • “Being very specific, calling out that enemy and then repeating that...is what builds [a brand].” – Laura Ries [21:33]
• Avoiding Backlash:
  Don’t slander competitors; call out what’s visible and relatable.
  • Dunkin’ positions themselves against Starbucks’ prices/wait times (“America runs on Dunkin” vs. “Barista buds”) [22:47].

9. Entrepreneur and Personal Brand Advice

• For Entrepreneurs [25:12]:
  • Create a new category = massive advantage (Tesla & EVs).
  • Chose a strong, specific name (e.g. “The Farmer’s Dog” > “Fresh Pet”).
    • “You think in sounds, not just words on paper.” – Laura Ries [25:34]
• For Individuals [26:47]:
  • Be authentic—persona won’t last.
  • Choose your mantra/anchor and reinforce it consistently.
  • Visual cues can help: style, color, accessory, etc.
    • “Trying to be a new thing every day...instead of picking one lane...You become known for that.” – Laura Ries [27:15]

10. Experimenting and Locking In

• Early-Stage Experimentation [30:10]: You aren’t a “brand” until you’re noticed—so try things until something clicks.

• How to Know It's Working [31:38]: Other people start repeating your tagline, description, or visual cues—your “elevator pitch” resonates.

  • “It’s when other people say it, relate to it, and repeat it—that’s when you know it’s working.” – Laura Ries [31:38]

• Book Titles Matter: Nicole and Laura both share examples of finding stronger book titles by testing responses. Provocative, visual, or strategic enemy-imbued titles outperform generic ones.

  • “Validation Is for Parking” (Nicole’s book) was memorable because it painted a visual and emotional picture. [33:04]
  • “The Fall of Advertising and the Rise of PR” as a provocative title that sparks debate [33:40].

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “You understand opposition much faster than superiority.”
  – Laura Ries [04:31]

• “When you try to appeal to everyone, you don’t have something to stand for.”
  – Laura Ries [10:49]

• “People do have multiple brands...but the most important thing is your brand stands for something, so people know when they want that choice, they go for you.”
  – Laura Ries [13:20]

• “To build a brand...you have to be as narrow as possible.”
  – Laura Ries [19:40]

• “Being very specific, calling out that enemy and then repeating that...is what builds [a brand].”
  – Laura Ries [21:33]

• “You aren’t a brand until you’re noticed and famous—so it’s OK to experiment until then.”
  – Laura Ries [30:10]

• “It’s when other people say it, relate to it, and repeat it—that’s when you know it’s working.”
  – Laura Ries [31:38]

• “Sometimes the clarity comes not from declaring what you are, but from boldly deciding who you’re not.”
  – Nicole Kalil [02:54]

• “Find the hills that you’re willing to die on. Discover who you truly are and what you truly want. Give your finger to the ‘supposed to.’ Torch the old playbook and write your own damn rules.”
  – Nicole Kalil [34:58]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• [04:31] – Why opposition is more effective in branding than claiming superiority
• [06:27] – Using visual language to make your brand stick
• [07:13] – Ways to identify your “enemy”—idea, convention, category, emotion
• [10:49] – The danger of trying to please everyone vs. the power of focus
• [13:53] – Consistency and category thinking in consumer behavior
• [16:40] – Competitor focus and visual distinctiveness in personal brands
• [19:37] – The #1 mistake: being too general
• [21:07] – Examples of strategic enemy in action: Farmer’s Dog, Dunkin’
• [25:12] – Two critical factors for entrepreneurs: category and name
• [26:47] – How individuals can approach personal branding
• [31:38] – The true test that your brand is working
• [33:04] – On finding the right, sticky book title as a parallel to personal branding
• [34:58] – Nicole’s rallying call to listeners to stand strong in self-authorship

Takeaways

• A strong brand stands against something as much as it stands for something.
• Clarity, specificity, and visual cues drive memorability.
• Focus wins over generality—don’t fear narrowing your scope.
• Consistency and repetition may feel boring to you, but it cements recognition in others.
• You’ll know your brand resonates when other people start using your words and referencing your position.

Resources

• Laura Ries’s new book: The Strategic Enemy
  [strategicenemy.com]
• Find more about Nicole Kalil: [nicolekalil.com]