Podcast Summary: "How To Be You, But Better with Olga Khazan | Episode 288"

Podcast Information:

• Title: This Is Woman's Work with Nicole Kalil
• Host: Nicole Kalil, Bleav
• Episode: How To Be You, But Better with Olga Khazan | 288
• Release Date: March 10, 2025
• Description: In this episode, host Nicole Kalil interviews Olga Khazan, exploring the science behind personality change and how individuals can intentionally improve themselves while maintaining authenticity.

Introduction to Personality Change

Nicole Kalil [01:25]:
Nicole opens the discussion by questioning the rigidity of personality traits, suggesting that many believe personalities are fixed from childhood. She introduces Olga Khazan, an award-winning journalist and author of Me But Better, who challenges this notion by exploring whether fundamental aspects of our personalities can be intentionally altered through scientific methods and self-experimentation.

Notable Quote:

"What if our personality is actually way more flexible than we've been led to believe?"
— Nicole Kalil [01:25]

Olga Khazan's Motivation and Personal Experiment

Olga Khazan [04:00]:
Olga shares her personal journey, explaining that her dissatisfaction stemmed not from external circumstances but from her reactions, which were heavily influenced by her personality traits. She recounts a particularly stressful day to illustrate how her tendency to find negativity in mediocre or good situations led her to seek change.

Notable Quote:

"I was so upset by this day. I was, like, crying, you know, I was, like, screaming to my partner."
— Olga Khazan [05:11]

Nicole Kalil [07:24]:
Nicole relates Olga’s experience to her own, emphasizing the commonality of such struggles among listeners and the initial challenge in shifting ingrained behaviors.

Understanding the Big Five Personality Traits

Olga Khazan [10:25]:
Olga breaks down the Big Five personality traits—Openness, Conscientiousness, Extraversion, Agreeableness, and Neuroticism (OCEAN)—explaining each trait and clarifying that most people fall somewhere along a spectrum rather than fitting into rigid categories.

Notable Quote:

"A lot of people have asked me about, like, the Myers Briggs or similar tests, and what researchers tend not to like about those is that they put people in kind of a category."
— Olga Khazan [11:45]

Personal Change Motivations and Strategies

Nicole Kalil [13:06]:
Nicole emphasizes that changing personality traits doesn't mean completely overhauling oneself but adjusting along the existing spectrum to better align with personal values and goals.

Olga Khazan [15:02]:
Olga discusses that meaningful personality changes often stem from pursuing larger life goals. She shares examples of individuals who increased their conscientiousness to achieve professional aspirations, highlighting that a desire for improvement is crucial for change.

Notable Quote:

"For most of the traits, in order to actually change in any significant way, you have to like, actually want to change."
— Olga Khazan [15:02]

Implementing Change: Practical Tips

Olga Khazan [27:14]:
Olga outlines specific strategies she employed to alter different personality traits:

• Extraversion:

  • Strategy: Engage in social activities like improv classes and sailing clubs to force herself out of her comfort zone.
  • Quote:

    "I signed up for improv. I signed up for sailing club. I signed up for all these meetup groups."
    — Olga Khazan [08:22]

• Neuroticism:

  • Strategy: Practice meditation through an intensive Mindfulness-Based Stress Reduction (MBSR) class, meditating for 45 minutes daily.
  • Quote:

    "I meditated for 45 minutes a day, but it did work. My neuroticism did go down at the end of this MBSR class."
    — Olga Khazan [27:53]

• Openness to Experience:

  • Strategy: Travel to new places to expose herself to different environments and experiences.
  • Quote:

    "Travel really helps increase openness to experience."
    — Olga Khazan [28:09]

• Agreeableness:

  • Strategy: Undergo conversation training to develop deeper, more empathetic interactions.
  • Quote:

    "I did a lot of, like, conversation training, like, learning how to have deeper and better conversations with people, how to be more empathetic."
    — Olga Khazan [28:53]

• Conscientiousness:

  • Strategy: Utilize organizational tools such as atomic habits, to-do lists, and calendar reminders to build discipline.

    "Conscientiousness is really all about the atomic habits, you know, the to do lists and the calendar reminders and, you know, bullet journals and things like that."
    — Olga Khazan [28:58]

Nicole Kalil [29:34]:
Nicole underscores the importance of ongoing effort to maintain personality changes, comparing it to building new habits that need consistent reinforcement.

Authenticity and Sustainable Change

Nicole Kalil [30:34]:
Nicole introduces the concept of balancing change with authenticity, ensuring that personal growth doesn't lead to losing one's true self.

Olga Khazan [31:18]:
Olga shares her own experience of attempting to lead a meetup group to boost her extroversion, only to realize it wasn't fulfilling. She emphasizes the importance of aligning changes with personal values and the freedom to discontinue efforts that don't contribute positively.

Notable Quote:

"If you really are miserable and, like, it's having no benefits for you, I wouldn't suggest continuing to do it just because you already, you know, you already signed up."
— Olga Khazan [31:18]

Conclusion: Embracing Intentional Change

Nicole Kalil [34:06]:
Nicole wraps up the episode by reinforcing the idea that while change is inevitable, intentional personality adjustments are possible and worthwhile. She quotes C.S. Lewis to inspire listeners:

"You can't go back and change the beginning, but you can start where you are and change the ending."
— Nicole Kalil [34:04]

She encourages listeners to view personality as a dynamic spectrum that can be consciously navigated to better align with their authentic selves and desired futures.

Key Takeaways:

1. Personality Is Flexible: Contrary to popular belief, personality traits are not entirely fixed from childhood and can be adjusted through intentional effort and strategies.
2. Big Five Framework: Understanding the Big Five personality traits—Openness, Conscientiousness, Extraversion, Agreeableness, Neuroticism—provides a foundation for identifying areas for personal growth.
3. Intentional Strategies: Employing specific strategies tailored to each trait can facilitate meaningful change. These include social engagements for extraversion, meditation for reducing neuroticism, travel for increasing openness, conversation training for agreeableness, and organizational tools for boosting conscientiousness.
4. Alignment with Values: Any attempt to change should align with personal values and long-term goals to ensure sustainability and authenticity.
5. Continuous Effort: Maintaining personality changes requires ongoing commitment, much like cultivating new habits.
6. Authentic Improvement: Personal growth should enhance one's true self rather than forcing a persona that feels inauthentic.

Resources Mentioned:

• Book: Me But Better by Olga Khazan
• Researcher: Nathan Hudson, SMU
• Therapy Approach: Acceptance and Commitment Therapy (ACT)
• Online Tool: personalityassessor.com

Learn More:

For additional insights and to follow Olga Khazan's work, listeners can visit her Substack or purchase her book Me But Better available on Amazon and local bookstores.

Disclaimer: This summary is based on the transcript provided and aims to capture the essence of the podcast episode, including key discussions and actionable insights.