← This Is Woman's Work with Nicole Kalil
This Is Woman's Work with Nicole Kalil
How To Rewire Patterns That No Longer Serve You with Judy Wilkins-Smith | 323
00:36:45
Ready to break the cycle? In this episode, Judy Wilkins-Smith reveals how to identify the inherited emotional patterns that hold you back—and gives you science-backed tools to rewrite them. Because freedom starts where awareness begins.
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- [00:00]
Ryan Reynolds
Hey, it's Ryan Reynolds here for Mint Mobile. Now I was looking for fun ways to tell you that Mint's offer of unlimited Premium Wireless for $15 a month is back.
- [00:09]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
So I thought it would be fun.
- [00:11]
Ryan Reynolds
If we made $15 bills, but it turns out that's very illegal. So there goes my big idea for the commercial. Give it a try@mintmobile.com Switch upfront payment of $45 for a three month plan equivalent to $15 per month. Required new customer offer for first three months only. Speed slow after 35 gigabytes of networks busy taxes and fees extra.
- [00:29]
Nicole Kahlil
See mintmobile.com.
- [00:32]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
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- [01:11]
Nicole Kahlil
I am Nicole Kahlil and you're listening to the this Is Woman's Work podcast where together we're redefining what it means, what it looks and feels like to be doing woman's work in the world today with you as the decider. Because deciding, choosing what's true and real and right for you and is the whole damn point. But friend, it ain't easy because we're being influenced by a million things. Some that we're conscious of and a whole lot that we're not. Like your DNA. Sure, we all know our genes determine things like eye color and blood type, but what if I told you your DNA is influencing way more than just your physical traits? That it's shaping your thoughts, emotions, behaviors, your success. This concept fascinates me. And judging by the fact that Ancestry.com has over 100 million family trees, I know I'm not the only one. Because we love uncovering where we came from. Who were our great great great grandparents? Were they royalty? Rebels? Criminal masterminds? Did they pass down something cool like artistic genius or super fast metabolism? Or did they leave us with some less desirable hand me downs like generational trauma, limiting beliefs, and the tendency to self sabotage? It turns out we inherit more than just our height and hair color. Science is now proving that emotional DNA gets passed down too. Our patterns of thought, fear, judgments, action, capacity for success and struggle. That gets passed down just like our physical traits and Influences everything like our relationships, money, leadership, career, even where and how we live. Welcome to Genealogy 3.0 where we don't just trace our ancestors, we decode the subconscious blueprints they left behind. Because if you keep hitting the same roadblocks in life, it might not just be you, it might be your great great grandmother's unresolved baggage that's running the show. Mind blasting Right, so how do we figure out which patterns serve us and which need to be rewritten? That's where today's guest comes in. Judy Wilcom Smith is a world renowned expert in organizational, individual and family patterns. An executive coach, trainer and sought after leadership speaker, she spent 18 years working with high performance individuals, Fortune 500 executives and legacy families to break generational cycles and unlock lasting success. As the founder of Systems Dynamics for individuals and organizations, she specializes in helping people reframe challenges, challenges into opportunities using science backed methods like epigenetics and systemic constellations. Judy is also the author of the Hidden Power in youn How Using Genealogy to Explore Ancestral Patterns and Transform youm Life and the international bestseller of Decoding youg Emotional Blueprint. And today she's here to help us understand how to use our family history to work for us instead of feeling trapped by it. Judy, thank you for being here. And I want to start by asking you to explain a bit more about the philosophy and the practical application of what it is that you do, because it really is kind of mind blasting.
- [04:37]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
Hi Nicole, thanks for having me. Yeah, so genealogy 3.0, let's just look at genealogy 1.0 which is where you belong. Right, that's it. Genealogy 2.0 is go spit in a bottle and see where your ancestors came from. And then have a look at the big events that may have happened when they moved, when they said, when they stayed, when, that whatever there are big events that will have affected them. And then you look at how have those events, big or small, cycle down to you. Now as you beautifully said, that can influence everything and anything. So it could be money, it could be relationships, it could be leadership, it could be, you name it, it influences that. And it's called emotional DNA. Your patterns of thoughts, feelings and actions. And yes, those cycle down two ways. You get them from epigenetic imprints, which is number one, that your scientifically studied one. And then you also get them from by word of mouth, by, by word of watch. You watch your parents struggle, you struggle. You watch your grandmother struggle, you struggle. You watch your great grandfather do really well. You have that DNA. You watch Your great, great, great grandfather, who's this fabulous artist, and suddenly you're artistic, that those are thoughts, feelings, actions that cycle down to you and the two come together and they're pretty powerful because. And this is well studied. If you look at the Great Dutch Hunger Winter, the study there determined that PTSD markers are passed down. And they can be passed down in very specific physical ways, too. You can have eating disorders like malnutrition or elevated cortisol as a result of anxiety that results in obesity. So these two are very, very tightly wired together. But the most important part of all of this is you can change that DNA, the emotional DNA, and that is part of what you were born for.
- [06:38]
Nicole Kahlil
Okay, again, incredibly fascinating and a little scary. I think as a parent, you know, I start thinking about what am I passing down to my child and to her children? Like, so, again, it can be. My head is just spinning. I can't imagine I'm the only one. So in my introduction, I said systemic work and constellations. And in full transparency, I have no idea what that means.
- [07:06]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
Cool. Okay. So the three things, of course, that influence or affect emotional DNA or interact with each other are epigenetics, neuroscience, and then systemic work and constellations. Systemic work is the study of you within a system. So unicole didn't just become unicole. You're a result of many, many, many, many, many, many, many generations, all the way down to you. And like I said earlier, you. You're the one who gets to write the next chapter. So it's not about you. It's all about you. It's not about you. So it's not about you because it's all in the system, the study of you in the system. It's all about you because you're the potential change agent. You're the one who can look and say, you know what? I don't like that everybody's angry. I'm going to be the peacemaker. I don't like that everybody struggles with money. I'm going to be really good with money. So you get to change that. You get to define a purpose and go for that, which then has a double effect. It affects what you pass on to your children and communities, but it also affects the context as you cycle back. So it looks like your villain, the grandfather, when you really have a look at him and see how he was abandoned as a kid or see what. Whatever it is, and you understand why he is the way he is, suddenly he becomes a hero instead of a villain because he managed to survive. All of that and have family. So there are so many ways that this works. So that's systemic work. Constellations are a fascinating, fascinating subject within systemic work, but also as a standalone. So what we do with a constellation is WE3D. What's going on in your brain? So you may say, I really struggle with money. I feel terrible about money. I'm useless with money. And I say to you, okay, Nicole, talk to me. When did those thoughts and feelings start? What was happening in your life at the time? What did you make them mean about you? What did you make it mean about those around you? And then I may say to you, so is there anyone else in the family with a similar pattern? Well, my mom's like that, too. Okay, so at a live event, I'll say to you, pick someone to represent your mom, someone to represent your dad, someone to represent you, and. And someone to represent money. Now, here's where the spidey magic comes in, but it's actually scientific spidey magic. So I will then say to you, place those. Those representatives in spatial relationship to one another. So maybe mom's. You and mom are standing close together, dad standing at the other end of the room, and money's wandering around like, I know where I belong. Here. This happens. What people don't understand and what we're not taught is, is that we key into each other's systems keenly every single day. You look at someone and go, oh, she looks terribly upset. I'm not going near her. Or you look at someone else and you go, they look so kind. I'm going to go stand by them. You're keying into their system. And people say to me, how's that possible? That's ridiculous. Well, think about American Idol, the voice. Any of those where you watch somebody suddenly hit their stride and you've got goosebumps, and they're belting it out and the judges are crying, and you've all just sensed into that person's system. So what happens when we then take your representatives and put them out in front of you is they may start to move. I will ask questions about why they're in different places, and eventually we get to the root cause of why you struggle with money, and we see what. What the systemic sentence is. In other words, what is the sentence that runs the show? And then we begin to reframe that. Now, the minute we reframe that, we change the epigenetic imprint. Because if you have a head, heart, gut alignment. So your head says yes, your heart says yes, and your Gut says yes. That becomes your new truth. So you start to rewire. Your brain is starting to rewire the thoughts, feelings, and actions, which means you're starting to rewire that emotional DNA. And you see this in places like kids who come from the project or kids who come from Camden. They. They look at the pattern of failure and they go, no, not for me. I'm doing it differently. And the minute that that message comes from the brain and says yes to the body, when the brain tells the body a story that the body can believe, now you have a whole new coding that's starting to happen. And so what happens there is you've now done a constellation. We. We then begin to give you different words to use. But because you're seeing it and you're hearing the conversation and you're speaking it yourself and you're touching it, you're having a complete embodied experience, which means that you're going to rewire very much faster. And that results in what you know as the aha moment.
- [12:02]
Nicole Kahlil
Okay, that triggers lots of questions. The first one is this seems similar but very different to an affirmation, right? So there is a process that, as you mentioned, is. It involves a physical experience going back into your process, right? As opposed to just picking a new affirmation or a new word. It's not as simple as just reframing a sentence. There is an experience that goes along with it.
- [12:32]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
All right? And here's the deal. If you don't have people around you that you could do that with, you have pieces of paper. If you write down the mom, dad, money, me, and you put it down on a floor, on the floor, and you then start to walk around that as you're saying those new sentences for yourself, you can get to the same place, because we're very good at transferring emotions onto inanimate objects, too. So you can do that. But the reason why affirmations don't work is that we keep saying, I, I'm rich, I'm rich, I'm rich, I'm rich, I'm rich. And it stays in the brain. I'm rich, I'm rich, I'm rich, I'm rich. Yay. Hasn't hit the heart, hasn't hit the gut. It's when it hits the heart and the gut and the head, heart and gut, all agree. And you combine that very importantly with an elevated emotion, which may be happiness, excitement, enthusiasm, permission, joy, or any of those, and you feel it, and you can feel that energy. That's when your affirmation is going to be a yes, and you'll move in that direction. The other very important part of that is whatever it is that you choose has to be bigger than your current circumstances or you're not going to move at all. So you've got to choose a stretch. And if you look at life, life grows, life isn't. Growth is in service of life. So it's really important that you have wants, you have wishes, you have dreams, but most important, that you solidify that in your entire body and spirit and then go for it. Sitting on a lotus bloom, meditating on the sunlight is not going to do it. If you don't couple that to elevated emotions and movement, and that then creates that emotional DNA that you're doing.
- [14:22]
Nicole Kahlil
Okay, this is really speaking to both my brain and my heart and my gut, because we all have experienced or witnessed people who want to do better or who want to change something but don't. And I think there's that element of it has to be bigger or better than your current situation. And I think a lot of times we hold onto things because it's comfortable, whereas even something bigger or better feels uncomfortable because it's unknown.
- [14:56]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
So what you're talking about is. And you're exactly right, that's a beautiful description. We hold onto it. In other words, we have an unconscious loyalty to what came before us. And we find ourselves being sucked into a systemic trance. So now you're sitting there going, I know I should do that, but it's so much easier because this is so familiar. I'm just going to sit here. This is. This is easier. And then we sabotage ourselves because that systemic trance is very strong. However, the system is also begging you to go do something to expand it. And people don't realize that. They go, well, I can't go do that, because if I do, my mom's going to be sad because she didn't get it right. Now I've got it right. No, wrong answer. People, the whole point is your mom's going to be very glad because when you go and get to do that, the first thing you're going to do is turn around and say, hey, mom, come look. Because that's what we do. So I always say to people, don't be scared of going for that beautiful, shiny, big thing that you want, because when you're there, you get to turn around and say, come and look. So it's really important. And I would also say, you know, some of the most important lessons I've learned in life have not been from my parent. They've been from my daughter. We've got to be aware that you learn from your children as well.
- [16:23]
Ryan Reynolds
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- [16:53]
Nicole Kahlil
Close your eyes, exhale, feel your body relax and let go of whatever you're carrying.
- [17:00]
Ryan Reynolds
Today, while I'm letting go of the worry that I wouldn't get my new contacts in time for this class, I got them delivered free from 1-800-contacts. Oh my gosh, they're so fast.
- [17:09]
Nicole Kahlil
And breathe.
- [17:10]
Ryan Reynolds
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- [17:21]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
1-800-Contacts.
- [17:24]
Ryan Reynolds
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- [17:54]
Nicole Kahlil
Okay, so some of these things might feel obvious to us, like our relationship with money or trauma or. But any tips about how to identify what are the existing limiting, systemic and epigenetic patterns that we're living from? Let me start there and then I have a follow up question.
- [18:18]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
Sure. Yes, absolutely. The minute that you find yourself stuck, the minute that you find yourself feeling limited or frustrated, stop and look at what it is that you're frustrated with. And then have a look at. Is that a pattern for me? Am I always frustrated by not being able to go to the next position at work? Do I always find myself limited to being second best or third best or fourth best when it comes to money? Do I find myself super frustrated because I don't get beyond X? Because we also have money bandwidth thanks to our family systems? And when you have that, sit down again and write down what everything all of your thoughts, all of your feelings, all of your actions around whatever subject it is. And when you see all of the Frustrations and limitations. Understand that that is a pattern that comes from somewhere else and it's asking you to stop it. It's asking to stop and then have a look at. So what is it that I really wish? What is my deep heart's desire? That is the pattern to trying to start through you. So that's the epigenetic pattern that's calling and saying, please, I'm here. Can you do something? Come on. And then you've got your two patterns. The one trying to stop and the one trying to start. Now the one trying to stop. The biggest mistake people make is they go, well, I'm done with you, you're out. I'm giving you your eviction notice. No. The whole purpose of a pattern that stops is that it contains wisdom. When you're moving ahead and you may hit a brick wall, go back and look at who else hit a brick wall, then you know how to move beyond it. Go back and look at who struggled. So you know how to not struggle. It's a very, very big source of wisdom. It's why you don't ever reject your parents. Doesn't matter what they did. They're a source of wisdom for you. So you're the one who struggles if you do that.
- [20:13]
Nicole Kahlil
Okay, so then my follow up question is for people who maybe don't know their long history, if some of this is being passed down many generations back, I might know my great great great grandparents story or what happened. How important is it to know that or understand that? And how do we move through it if we don't know?
- [20:37]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
Here's the deal. So if you don't have it, timeline your own life. And if you timeline your own life, you're going to see patterns popping up. Then what you do is you say, okay, clearly these are patterns in my life and absolutely they came from somewhere. I might not know exactly where, but I know that this pattern doesn't belong to me. I've taken it on and I've inherited it and it's time for me to set it down. And then really it's with respect and acknowledgement that set it down. Tell it, I will use you as wisdom when I need to. And then turn around and face your purpose and go. It's an interesting thing when you face your purpose and go and you really engage with it. There are a couple of things. You've got to commit to it and you've got to take action as well. It may not be obvious action, but take action. A step leads to a step leads to a Step. When you see somebody who may be aligned with something that you're doing, don't sit there thinking, oh, I'd love to speak to so and so, because I bet they'd be the next step. Speak to them. Get 4 degrees out of your comfort zone and speak to them. Always be a little bit out of your comfort zone. And don't give up on that thing that. That you want. It may take a little time, but don't give up on it. I always tell people. The simplest example of that for me was we moved to the US and we had to leave all our money, allowed to bring money. So we came out with nothing. Scariest thing I've ever done in my life. So we started from scratch. I had been to Disney World before and fallen in love. It's my favorite place on earth. Anybody who sees me or meets me will see. I wear the Disney necklace. My. My phone is Disney. Everything is Disney. But that's because I made a promise to Disney when I was 9 years old that I would keep the magic alive. And so as we're struggling here and we have nothing but ourselves and we're setting up and working, the thing that intrigued me the most was I had seen people come out of Disney timeshare resorts and they all looked happy and they all looked like they were having fun. And I said to myself, you know what? I want to buy timeshare at Disney. I want to be one of those people who can bring my family to Disney and have fun. And we had nothing. And if I'd have said it, that's your other piece. Don't voice your deepest desire to people who won't appreciate it, because they're going to tell you how stupid it is. So I didn't. But I started an envelope and every time I got a bit extra from somewhere, it went into the envelope. Didn't look at it, didn't touch the envelope. That's called my don't touch envelope because I'm going for my purpose. And then one day my brother said they'd like to come and visit. And I said, I'll see if I can help with the accommodation. And I went to the envelope and I opened it and it had exactly the right amount to put down as a deposit to be able to buy timeshare. And so now I get to do that. I get to take my family every other year and we go for two weeks. And it's amazing. And I don't ever forget how amazing it is. And when you've accomplished a dream once I promise you it's addictive. It'll pull you out of that trance. You're going to keep wanting to do the next dream and the next dream, and when you do that, it's not selfish. You're serving your system and you're serving society. You're daring to go bigger and you're the vessel that can be used.
- [24:16]
Nicole Kahlil
Thank you for sharing that story. I think all of us can relate in some way of this feeling of we know we want something and it feels impossible and the idea of sharing it publicly with somebody feels like we'll just get laughed at. And yet somewhere deep down we know that. We know that, we know that this is something that matters.
- [24:40]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
What you've just said is super important because when you know that, you know that you know and it matters. That's part of your purpose. Don't give up on it.
- [24:50]
Nicole Kahlil
So powerful. Okay, I want to get into a little bit more of the how to. You've given a lot of things so far, but for someone listening in and they are thinking, in addition to getting your book, which we're going to talk about, but in addition to that, they're thinking, I want to address this trauma or pattern or belief that's been passed down. That isn't working for me. It's not getting me closer to my purpose. It's not in alignment with what matters. What do we do?
- [25:20]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
You buy yourself a book, you make it look as pretty as you want or as plain as you want, because that's up to you. And you write down what is the thing that I want the most in the world? And the first thing that's going to probably happen is all of those inner voices are going to say, here's why you can't have it. Those are not, by the way, your inner voices. Those are multi generational voices. So they're actually giving you information. They're telling you all the. All the obstacles that you might encounter. Okay? Write them all down, right? Until you're exhausted. Then write down all of your thoughts about it, all of your feelings, all of your actions. Why do I run away when there's money? Why do I refuse to look at money? Why do I spend it as fast as it comes in? What are the sentences that I tell myself about that if easy come, easy go, Money doesn't grow on trees, I'm not worthy all of those. I want you to look at them. And then when you've got all of that, understand, ask yourself the question, to whom does this belong? Because it may feel like it's yours. But your chances that it are are very small. There are people who will start that pattern and if you do, it's the result of an event. The event starts creating or you start creating thoughts, feelings and actions in response to the event. That event, by the way, is often a multi generational event. You'll find that this happened to you, but it happened to this one and that one. So what you want to do is whether it's the event that's yours or the multi generational one, is to say, thank you, I can see you. So you write down that I can see you. What is my bottom line sentence, I'm not worthy. Is that true? No. Okay, so put that down and then turn to the purpose and start writing. Never mind. All of the little voices that come in do the same thing. Thoughts, feelings, actions, write them down. Then look at the ones that belong to someone else and tell them, thank you, but it's time for this to change. So I'm going to turn the page. Turn the page, go to your purpose and then ask your purpose and your brain will speak to you. Ask your purpose. What, what emotions do you need from me? What sentences, what thoughts and feelings do we need to lock in to keep me on track? I'm worthy. Of course I can do this. I can figure this out. From now on in, I'm going to put 10% into an envelope or a savings account that I'm not touching. And it's for that if it's, if it's something like I want to learn to be a teacher or whatever it is, start asking yourself, what are the resources I have now that I don't need to pay for? There are lots. What is online that I can go and learn? How do I manage this? A bite at a time until I get there. But most importantly, what are the emotions that I need? And then there's another piece. So I want this. I know there are going to be obstacles. What do I do when there's an obstacle to keep myself on track right now in the moment? So you've got to construct for yourself a fail safe. I know that. I'm getting there. Hey, when I last looked in my envelope, there was X amount. We're heading in that direction. So it's one of the most important things, and I speak to very, very successful people is they've trained the toilet talk to shush. So when those sentences come up, when those feelings come up, they will say to them, enough. You do not dominate me and you don't belong where I'm Going stop.
- [29:13]
Nicole Kahlil
Yeah.
- [29:13]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
So train your toilet talk. It's like training taming your dragon.
- [29:17]
Nicole Kahlil
Yeah. I call it head trash because I want it to sound as dirty and disgusting as it is. I like toilet talk.
- [29:22]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
I call it toilet talk talking because it's really that. It's that.
- [29:25]
Nicole Kahlil
Yeah. There's a quote too that I love that I always think of when my head trash kicks in. And it's something to the effect of, you can't prevent a bird from flying over your head, but you can prevent it from building a nest in your hair. And what I think of is like, we can't prevent the negative thought from popping into our mind or the toilet talk from saying what it's going to say, but we can prevent it from. From taking up space in our brain from allowing it to stay in there. And I think that that is super important. Super. Right.
- [29:58]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
I would say when you have the little bird flying over and it pops up that thing, I would say, what is your counter sentence? What is the counterintelligence for that?
- [30:09]
Nicole Kahlil
The counterintelligence. I like that. So we're reframing the sentence or the belief that has been running the show and choosing something that works for us, that we have an emotional connection to.
- [30:20]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
And we've got to get determined and committed.
- [30:23]
Nicole Kahlil
Yeah. And get into action. Right. One foot in front of the other towards what matters most.
- [30:28]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
Absolutely. Get into action. It really doesn't. It doesn't matter how small the action. You know, I had something happen to me yesterday where I was, I was talking to someone and put down the phone and then thought, this could be a really good piece over here. Picked up the phone and called them back and said, hey. And they went, oh, my goodness. When you feel the action or you feel the thought that says move, listen to it. Because if you don't, it will subside. Pay attention and walk with it.
- [31:01]
Nicole Kahlil
Yeah. Great advice. Okay, one last question. I do think that there is the potential. When we think about things being passed down from our parents and grandparents and so forth and so on, I think that there could be the tendency to shift into blame, maybe not from multiple. Like I don't blame my great, great, great, great grandparents for anything. I don't know them. Right. But the closer we are in relationship, I think the higher the potential is to fall into the blame game. Any advice for that?
- [31:34]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
Absolutely. You're a grown up. It's not their fault. It's your choice.
- [31:38]
Nicole Kahlil
Thank you. So good. At some point we raise our damn selves. Right.
- [31:43]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
Like, exactly. At some point you raise your damn self. It's exactly that. I look at people all the time who come to me and say, well, it's my mother's fault. She was a narcissist. Yeah, well, it's your fault because you didn't pick it up and run. It may have begun with your mother, it may also end with your mother. And you're the change agent. It all begins with you. It all begins with you.
- [32:06]
Nicole Kahlil
So good. Okay, I know people are going to want to learn so much more. So to remind you all, the book is called the Hidden power in youn DNA. Judy's website is judywilkins-smith.com and you can find and follow Judy on all the social medias and YouTube. We're going to put all of the links in show notes. Judy, thank you for a fascinating and just wildly important and impactful conversation.
- [32:34]
Judy Wilkins-Smith
Thank you for having me and good luck everybody. It's an adventurous world out there. Go have an adventure.
- [32:42]
Nicole Kahlil
I love it. All right. And if you're looking for more episodes on a similar topic, be sure to check them out in show notes. So if this conversation has taught us anything, it's that we're carrying more than just our own stories. Our thoughts, fears, strengths and struggles didn't all start with us. Some of them were handed down, stitched into our DNA, passed along like family heirlooms. But just because we've inherited something doesn't mean we have to keep it. We are not bound by the patterns that no longer serve us. We can rewrite the beliefs that hold us back. We can break cycles, create new narratives and choose a different path. Because while we may not get to decide where we come from, we absolutely get to decide where we go from here. So if there is something in your life that feels like a roadblock, whether it's self doubt, scarcity, thinking, or some invisible force keeping you stuck, maybe it's time to ask, is this really mine? And do I want to keep carrying it? Because the truth is, some things were passed down. But choice, Choice is always ours. And being the change agent, my friend, is what it truly means to be doing woman's work.