Podcast Summary:

This Is Woman’s Work with Nicole Kalil
Episode 368: Lift Heavy, Live Long: Reclaiming Your Strength with Anne-Marie Chaker
Release Date: December 8, 2025
Host: Nicole Kalil
Guest: Anne-Marie Chaker (WSJ reporter, pro bodybuilder, author of Lift: How Women Can Reclaim Their Physical Power and Transform Their Lives)

Episode Overview

In this rich, spirited episode, Nicole Kalil and Anne-Marie Chaker dig into what it means for women to reclaim their physical and personal strength—both literally and metaphorically. With candor and humor, they challenge the cultural narrative that encourages women to shrink themselves, both in muscle and in spirit, by advocating for the transformative power of strength training. Chaker, a Wall Street Journal reporter turned bodybuilder, shares her personal journey and research, revealing why making “more” of ourselves—rather than less—should be celebrated. The conversation explores aging, self-worth, mother-daughter dynamics, and how refusing to chase the ever-shifting beauty ideal can be the most radical act of self-care.

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Host Admission: Exercise Aversion and Discovery of Strength Training

• Nicole’s Honesty about Exercise
  Nicole opens with refreshing self-awareness, admitting her general dislike for exercise:
  • "I hate exercising. I call myself a reluctant peloton rider... every single time I get ready to work out, I secretly hope for an injury that will give me a legitimate reason not to do it." (01:10)
• Despite this, she discovers unexpected pride and even addiction to strength training:
  • "I’ve started feeling kind of addicted to it again. Not the exercise itself, but the way I feel after and in between." (02:40)
• Crucially, Nicole notes she’s not working out to get smaller:
  "I'm not doing any of this to get smaller or to lose weight… I'm doing it for health, strength and longevity. And in some cases, to have a healthy way to release some of my rage." (02:58)

2. Why Strength Training? Reversing Cultural Conditioning

• Anne-Marie’s Perspective:
  Anne-Marie reflects on her mother’s aging, frailty, and the generational message that women shouldn’t “take up space”:
  • "We have been conditioned as women to, from the moment we're born, to make less of ourselves... It's only since I went down this bodybuilding and powerlifting rabbit hole did I realize how false and fictitious that ideal was." (05:03)
  • "I functioned the best when I entered this world of bodybuilders... who taught me to eat more... lift the heavy weights, and think of my body as something to build and to make more of." (05:53)
• History & Science:
  Chaker cites research on Neolithic women to dispel myths about female frailty:
  • "She [Alison Murray] found that the skeletons of the early women... were most similar to the elite rowers, meaning they had broad shoulders and well developed upper bodies... These women were athletes." (08:06)
  • "They weren't sitting around wondering how to lose 20 pounds... No wonder I feel better as an athlete, as a woman lifting weights and eating lots of protein, because that's what my ancestors did." (09:15)

3. Rejecting the External Gaze and Chasing Internal Goals

• Nicole Calls Out the Male Gaze:
  • "Why are we so worried about what body type is most attractive to? That is not the primary purpose that our bodies serve... Our body serves so many greater purposes than attracting the male gaze." (10:07)
• Anne-Marie on Social Media’s Double-Edge:
  She observes how gym culture for women is shifting—with more young women lifting—but also acknowledges new pressures (e.g., to be both thin and muscular, and the impact of celebrity endorsements of weight loss drugs like GLP1s):
  • "There's also this added pressure to have a layer of musculature on top of the skinny. And I know as a pro bodybuilder that you need fat to build muscle. You cannot build muscle on a calorie deficit... So I have all these complicated feelings about all of this..." (11:11)
  • On Serena Williams promoting GLP1s: "I always looked at her body as a great example of... a superhero physique... What better example of a body that shows the potential... when you build it rather than diminish it?" (12:35)

4. The "Why" Behind Fitness and Body Autonomy

• Nicole on Intention:
  She shares how she discusses finding healthy motivations with her daughter:
  • "We're starting to get in these conversations of really connecting to the why and why am I doing this?... For me, going to the gym and lifting to be strong... to keep up with potential future grandchildren... those feel like very healthy, empowered, productive choices for me." (14:10)
• Self and Others’ Bodies:
  • "Everyone else's bodies are none of my business. My body is my business and my body is nobody else's business. And that is so much easier to say than it is to put into practice." (15:14)

5. The Realities of Bodybuilding: Behind the Scenes

• Anne-Marie on Competition:
  She describes the intense, often unhealthy extremes of competitive bodybuilding:
  • "In the weeks ahead of competition, we cut pretty dramatically in order to showcase all of this muscle… and let me tell you, it's not pretty. It's really not fun to have to give up pizza and date nights and wine... It's a body that is meant for a moment on stage and it's not meant for long term." (19:05)
  • "When you see these bodies on the cover of a fitness magazine... They've dieted hard in order to gain that physique... It is not meant to be a physique that you live on. It's just not healthy... It drives me nuts that people think that that is a healthy body. It's not." (21:36)

6. Principles for Building Strength In and Out of the Gym

• “Lift Principles” from Chaker’s Book:
  • 1. Taking Time for Yourself:
    • "As women, we are so engineered to care for everyone else and put our needs last... For me, like the hour I take to go to the gym is just, it's a non-negotiable." (26:09)
  • 2. Redefining Self-Care:
    • "Self care isn't necessarily feel good... It is like move your butt, get to a place where you are going to put in an investment to yourself... Give yourself 30 minutes, lift some heavy shit and like you'll be so much better for it." (26:59)
    • "You will come back to your desk or whatever thing is waiting for you and you will feel so much... I come back from that lift a remarkably better person. It gives you compounded dividends not just for the long term, but also just for the immediate term too." (27:56)
  • 3. Motivation Comes from Action:
    • "Motivation is a fleeting thing. I don't look for motivation ’cause it's not gonna happen most of the time. I really don't want to do this... It's just like the habit I have every day. I'm going to do it... because that is who I am, that is what I do." (26:27)
    • Nicole echoes: "Motivation isn't something that comes, it's something that we create. And we create by getting in action toward it. I always love: The universe listens to action." (28:48)

7. Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Rewriting the Narrative:

  • Nicole: "We've been told for far too long to shrink, to take up less space... But what if the real flex is in building, building strength, building confidence, building a body that supports the life you want to live for the long haul... Stronger is better than smaller because it's for you. It's not about how you look. It's about who you're becoming. So lift, build and grow. Because all of that is woman's work." (30:29)

• On the Immediate Rewards of Lifting:
  Anne-Marie: "You can't bottle this stuff.… After I come home from lifting, I will be a brand new person… I’ll have a more positive outlook… I come back from that lift a remarkably better person." (27:56)

Timestamps for Key Segments

• Nicole’s honest take on hating exercise – (01:10–03:59)
• Why lifting is uniquely empowering, according to Anne-Marie – (05:03–07:18)
• Historical research on women’s strength – (08:06)
• Discussion on the male gaze and shifting body ideals – (10:07–11:11)
• Mother-daughter dynamics, teens, and social media – (11:11–13:38)
• Intention-setting and body autonomy – (14:10–15:23)
• Behind the scenes of professional bodybuilding – (19:05–22:17)
• What draws women to bodybuilding, from Anne-Marie’s view – (23:20–25:49)
• Anne-Marie’s “Lift Principles” for everyday life – (26:09–28:34)
• Redefining self-care and the myth of motivation – (28:34–28:48)
• Closing reflections on rewriting the narrative of “woman’s work” – (30:29–31:31)

Tone and Closing Thoughts

Nicole and Anne-Marie create a conversation that is authentic, witty, and layered with both personal vulnerability and critical analysis. They are united in challenging outdated expectations—turning “woman’s work” from a shrinking, silent role into something expansive, strong, and self-defined.

For listeners seeking both inspiration and practicality, this episode affirms that true self-care, strength, and autonomy don’t come from following society’s script—but from writing your own.

Further resources:

• Anne-Marie Chaker’s book: Lift
• Anne-Marie’s Substack: "Lyft"
• (See show notes for links)