← This Is Woman's Work with Nicole Kalil
This Is Woman's Work with Nicole Kalil
Why Good Leaders Are Quitting (And We’re Letting It Happen) with Melissa Doman | 410
00:36:17
Leadership burnout is real — and this episode breaks down why unrealistic expectations, lack of support, and toxic workplace culture are pushing good leaders to the edge (and out the door).
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- [00:00]
A
Friend. I'm about to do something I've never done before but have been dreaming about for so long that I can't even remember it not being on my bucket list. I'm taking a three month sabbatical and traveling all across Europe. Different countries, different people joining me at different times. Some solo travel, which sounds dreamy, but it also felt logistically overwhelming. Except it hasn't been because I've used Fora to book pretty much all of it. Hotels, trains, flights, experiences, food, tours, you know, all the really important things that can make or a trip. And Fora and my amazing Fora Advisor made it so I've actually enjoyed the planning part. Fora is a modern travel agency built for people who love to plan travel and help others travel well. Their tech, platform, training and community give you everything you need to turn a passion for travel planning into a flexible, meaningful stream of income. Every hotel, cruise or activity you book as a Fora advisor earns you money in the form of a commission or a percentage of the booking cost. And getting started can be as easy as booking trips for people you already know, like me, because you know this isn't going to be my last trip. You can become a Fora advisor today@foratravel.com woman that's f o r a travel.com w o m a n and make sure you tell them that we sent you foratravel.com woman because you cannot convince me that traveling isn't part of what it means to be doing what woman's work. If you've ever gone down a hiring rabbit hole, scrolling profiles, second guessing everything, wasting hours, you know exactly how this goes. It's not just about finding someone, it's about finding the right someone. Which is especially hard when you don't actually know a lot about what you're hiring for. Like web design and software development, data and analytics, marketing, business operations. You know all the things that go into building a business. Which is why I love upwork and it's a one stop platform for hiring flexible, high quality freelance talent for everything from one off projects to ongoing support. And UPWORK also cuts down the operational hassle by handling things like contracts and payments in one place so you can spend more time running your business. So visit Upwork.com right now and post your job for free. That's Upwork.com to connect with top talent ready to help your business grow. That's upwork.com upwork.com if you love the show, the best way to keep it going is simple. Share it Rate it and support the sponsors who support us. I am Nicole Kahlil, and you're listening to the this Is Woman's Work podcast, where together we're redefining what it means, what it looks and feels like to be doing woman's work in the world today. And today's episode is a continuation of a conversation we started in episode 403 on Leadership Mental health, where we asked a question that I haven't really been able to shake. And that's what happens if leadership becomes so hard, so heavy, so unsustainable, that the good ones just walk away. If you haven't listened to that episode yet, you might want to start there for context. Again, that's episode 403, because today we're going deeper. Now, if you've been here a while, you know this about me. I can be pretty hard on leaders because I expect a lot. But there's a flip side to that, and frankly one that I'm worrying about more and more, and that's that we keep piling on more expectations, more scrutiny, more responsibility for everyone else's experience with very little care for their own. We expect leaders to be everything. Steady, selfless, decisive, emotionally intelligent, always on. And then we criticize, diagnose and dissect them the moment they fall short, or even the moment that we perceive they fall short. We have a lot of opinions about how leaders should support their teams, and we should. But we don't talk nearly enough about how teams, how all of us can support our leaders, because if we don't figure that out, I stand by what I said before. We will lose all of the good ones, the ones who lead with intention, with empathy, with humanity, and what we'll be left with. Well, friend, I think we already have an idea of what that looks like and it's fucking terrifying. So today is about humanizing and supporting leaders. It's about naming the very real mental and emotional load that they carry, the patterns that they fall into to cope, and how we can begin to see and do things differently on both sides of the leadership relationship. Back with us again is Melissa Dohman, an organizational psychologist and workplace mental health expert, a former therapist and the author of Cornered why We need to Talk About Leadership Mental Health. She works with global organizations like Google, Microsoft, and Salesforce, helping leaders and teams have more honest, effective conversations about mental health and communication at work. Melissa, thank you for joining us again. And before I dive into my 1 million questions, can you remind us all what we're talking about here? Why is leadership mental Health, such an important topic, not just for leaders, but for all of us.
- [05:34]
B
You know, I think about the workplace as an ecosystem, and we are all organisms in it, and we're always trying to evolve, achieve homeostasis. And leaders are a very critical part of that ecosystem. And if I'm being very plain and honest, I just don't see how an ecosystem can be maintained when a critical organism is consistently told they shouldn't need support in holding up the ecosystem. Like, I realize that might sound just so reductive, but that, that's how simple it is. You know, you said at the beginning that you're very, very hard on leaders. Who better than to have this conversation with than someone who holds those high standards, but is also like, oh, wait a minute, to achieve these high standards, these people need support. So to me, you're the best person to have this conversation with. And you also make it really fun, which is a bonus and a curse.
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A
So.
- [06:31]
B
And I use fuck as a comma. So we're in very good company with each other. You know what I'm saying? Yes.
- [06:35]
A
So I want to hone in on that, this concept of high standards, because I'm clearly a big believer. But high standards and perfection are not the same things. High standards and impossible standards are not the same thing. How do we differentiate? In your experience, how do we know we're holding to high standards but not crossing the line to where nobody can ever measure up?
- [06:57]
B
Your timing for that question is impeccable because I literally just posted on LinkedIn today, I was like, you know what a, a fun, easy takeaway is for Stress Awareness month, which is you, when we're recording this episode in, in April, is hold your boundaries and respect other people's boundaries. Just a thought. And within that I talk about normalizing realistic capacity. And a lot of people like to pretend like capacity is limitless, which is just total, utter bullshit. And there is a difference between having high standards and being accountable and meeting those things versus being treated like and being expected to act as though you are a machine that is automated. And the fact that people expect us to work like a never ending automated machine in like a Frito Lay factory is just beyond. By the way, I chose that name on my own. There was no endorsement by Frito Lay for, for this episode. But the thing is that there is so much information out there about what, quote, high expectations are. And by the way, I literally despise the term perfect because it's a social construct created by humans that does more harm than good. Perfection is, is Not a helpful term here, but people keep using it because that's a whole nother podcast episode.
- [08:31]
A
Well, yeah, and. And I see it happen a lot in working with women. We think we're supposed to do it all, have it all, be it all look good while doing it, and somehow make it all look effortless. And what I really have found is that it does the opposite of what we are intending it to do. We think that it will make our relationship stronger, that people will like us more, trust us more, value us more. And the reality is it creates distance in our relationships because nobody can ever measure up. They know it, we know it, and it just. Then it's all performance and nothing really meaningful ever happens.
- [09:05]
B
Yeah, it really does quite the opposite and creates a lot of stress. So my word for 2026 that I've become very, very curious about, and I think it does have a place in this conversation. Conversation, That's a new word, conversation, not just for leaders, but also, you know, women in leadership and those who identify as female. Is the term hypervigilance. People are hypervigilant for lots of reasons. Some people chase perfection as a form of hyper vigilance. And when we think about where that comes from, and I'm exploring this deeply, not just on a professional level, but also a personal level, as someone who struggles with hypervigilant, like, scanning behaviors, because I've been like the, you know, emotional caring type since I came onto this planet. I think that looking at the source, why do you feel this pressing need to be hypervigilant? Whether it's how you achieve things, how fast the way you come off to other people, I think it's not something that's explored a lot because typically speaking, talking about hyper vigilant is just relegated within a trauma conversation. But I think it goes so far beyond that and can really also show up in leadership behaviors and how they view themselves and also how they. They hope others will view them. And hyper vigilant behavior is not exact exactly a healthy coping mechanism. But as you talked about a few minutes ago, you know, there's lots of reasons that, that leaders end up in. In different coping strategies. And I think feeling a sense of hypervigilance unfortunately drives part of that.
- [10:57]
A
And I'm stealing this directly from your book, but ultimately what we're talking about is the dehumanization of leaders or not allowing them to have normal human experiences like capacity, like boundaries, anxiety or depression or stress or any. I mean, fill in all of the human experiences. We seem to think that they're not allowed to have those. I want to expand on this, but without going too deep into what we talked about in the last episode. Where do we as other humans, whether that be employees or colleagues or additional members of the leadership team? Where do we have a role to play in supporting our leaders? Mental health.
- [11:46]
B
I. I wanna start with the term mental health, because I think even there in the same sentence, what's our role and where do we start with? Supporting the mental health of leaders can scare the shit out of some people, and while I have opinions about that, it doesn't make it any less true. So I would even just take it down a notch and I would say, what's our role as, you know, fellow leaders or team members in just supporting leaders when they're having a tough day or when they're going through a lot of stress or when they're stretched too thin? Because why the hell not everybody in a workplace is a chronologically aged adult. I say chronologically aged, not mentally aged because those are often not the same. I just don't see why people can't attempt to just show basic care and humanity when they see another fucking human being in front of them who has more on their shoulders, who's responsible for more, and just ask how they're doing or if there's something that they can do to help. Now, the relationship there may determine whether or not that even happens, because if a leader makes a team feel not psychologically safe, they're very emotionally distant or avoidant, or they tend to act out, you know, in a position of power when they're stressed, that's not going to make anybody want to show up for them. But let's say that's not the case, and let's say that it just seems like they're constantly stressed and drowning, proverbially speaking. I think it's ridiculous that fellow leaders or the people that report into them can't just have the responsibility to say, like, you seem stretched really thin. Is there anything I can do to help? Or, you know, do you want to have, like, a virtual cup of coffee to blow off steam for a while? There's no rule precluding us from doing that. But I understand that the company culture, the team culture, how the leader acts, all of these things determine if people feel they can do it, if they want to do it, if they feel it's, you know, they're accountable to do it. And it's not lost on me. But for God's sakes, just show. Just because they're your boss, doesn't mean that they don't need someone to be like, hey, you good? And I'm not trying to sound so simplistic, but sometimes that's all it is.
- [14:10]
A
Well, it's interesting. This has popped up a lot for me in recent conversations. I'm curious your thoughts on it. This idea of what if you just gave somebody the benefit of the doubt?
- [14:21]
B
Oh, so much easier said than done.
- [14:23]
A
And yes, especially when it comes to leadership. I mean, listen, everywhere we look we can see examples of bad leadership. Like, don't even get me started on politics. I understand the hypervigilance of scanning and looking for bad leadership and being able to find it all over the place. And I've found in conversations with people, I'm sure I do it myself too. This, we're bringing baggage from previous leadership relationships or whatever, and we're bringing into the new one and somehow expecting that to go well. And I just am like, time out. Like, where has this person made you believe all the shit you just made up? Or isn't that your responsibility? If you feel that way because of X, Y and Z, that had nothing to do with this situation or this interaction and this invitation of like, what if you just gave them the benefit of the doubt?
- [15:22]
B
Because that is very scary and people don't like doing that. I hope and assume you watch the show shrinking on up. It's the best. It is. I have cried so much watching that show.
- [15:35]
A
I just don't know how. They're like, every episode I'm like, that's my favorite character. And then every episode is a new favorite character. I'm on Gabby right now, obsessed with her. But like just that show writing, you know, can they lead our country?
- [15:51]
B
Oh my God, I will vote for
- [15:53]
A
Harrison Ford like now.
- [15:55]
B
Oh my God. He's sexy to any age, by the way.
- [15:57]
A
Yeah.
- [15:58]
B
So I can say this line without giving away anything from an episode where someone says, what? What a privilege to be the age of 42 and to be covered with scars of experience. We don't tend to look at it that way because we try to avoid getting more scars where we use our scars to protect us. Because going into something braced, even though it participates in creating a self fulfilling prophecy, creates a perception that it'll hurt us less than if we're not ready for it. So being self protective, while not super healthy can lessen the impact on us than being trusting. That's at work outside of work, you know, this is not new information. This is not my idea. I think it was in chapter one or two where I talk about, like, the mental representations that we create of leaders. And I was citing, like, sociological theory, psychological theory, where we had these, like, ideas we set up in our heads of how leaders should be, how they should act, what we need from them. And then we layer on top of that all the stories and narratives of the ones that we've actually encountered. And of course, we bring this baggage into future relationships because it's so much easier to say, I don't trust you till you prove I can, but you make it hard for that to happen, versus I will lead with trust and open myself up to this person who's totally different sitting right in front of me. Which, by the way, I've even done that myself. Where I left, I was done with a contract at a job with a manager who, like, lived to sabotage me. And they were awful. And then I went to the next gig and I was very clearly shaken by that experience and very paranoid. And my new boss was like, why? Why are you concerned about this? Like, where is coming from? And I explained it to her and she was like, I'm really sorry that happened, but that's not how I do things. And I was like, oh, shit, I need to get a hold of my own stuff. Because they're not the same people.
- [18:12]
A
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- [19:26]
B
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- [19:43]
C
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- [20:17]
B
Ask your doctor about eglis and visit ebgliss.lilly.com or call 1-800-LilyRx or 1-800-545-596. Tomorrow morning is knocking. Stock your fridge now. How about a creamy mocha Frappuccino drink or a sweet vanilla smooth caramel maybe? Or white chocolate mocha?
- [20:33]
C
Whichever you choose, delicious coffee awaits.
- [20:36]
B
Find Starbucks Frappuccino drinks wherever you buy your groceries.
- [20:40]
A
Well, I'll also add that, you know, we do have this idea of what a leader is supposed to look like, and that is reinforced in a lot of ways if we look at all the leadership content that is out there. They read mostly like how to. Right. And it very rarely talks about like a user guide.
- [20:58]
B
Yeah. For a machine.
- [21:00]
A
Right, Exactly. And if you do this this way, then it all work and everyone will love you and you'll get amazing results. And it doesn't really talk very much about the dark side, the, the costs, the struggles, the challenges, the feeling like you're being punched on the left and just when you're about to turn that way, you get punched from the right. And that, you know, similar. Like I had an experience where somebody once said to me something along the lines of like this isn't very servant leader of you. And I said, you know, I, I appreciate the feedback, but the miscommunication here is that you think I'm trying to be a servant leader. That is not a leadership theory I personally subscribe to. There's these things that are out there reinforcing and supporting this sort of ideal leader that I don't know if it's serving anyone, but most especially leaders thought.
- [21:50]
B
No offense to Robert Greenleaf. Love you. I know when you wrote this book in 1970 that you meant well and a little missed opportunity for maybe some firmer boundaries around that because people took it and ran with it to their own detriment. And again, like, there are pluses and minuses to every model. But I think that that one in particular, if there's no boundaries around it, is a very slippery slope.
- [22:20]
A
Well, especially as a woman in leadership, I found it was like. I don't know if double bind is the right terminology or whatever, but I just was like, I can't align with it. It goes way too far. And the minute I put that out there, I. I worry about all the things I'm already worried about being double down on.
- [22:42]
B
Well, also, what that person said to you was very manipulative.
- [22:46]
A
Sure.
- [22:47]
B
Big, big disclaimer. It would totally depend who I was talking to. But I'm the type of person who'd be like, oh, interesting. Is it because I don't have a penis that you said that? But then, you know, you can't say that at work. So.
- [23:02]
A
Yeah, no, I went the route of how interesting that you thought that that was something I aspired to. That's not the model or method of leadership that I align with. Or, you know, something along those lines.
- [23:15]
B
I might even be like, oh, what an unhelpful way to deliver that feedback. What made you choose those words?
- [23:21]
A
And I'm sure our listeners can relate how after the fact, you think 700 different things you could have said or should have said, or, you know, like, the words don't come in the moment as well as they do after the fact. But yeah, I've replayed that one a few times in.
- [23:38]
B
In my own mind.
- [23:39]
A
I want to talk a little bit about some of these leadership mental health archetyp that you go into in the book. Yeah, I'll just list them out. I know we won't have time to talk about all of them, but there's the ostrich, the grain mill, the insecurity masker, the mother hen or father goose, the frustrated martyr, the porcupine, and the healthy one, which is the sea otter. I personally think I can relate to, and I'm sure a lot of women Listening in the frustrated martyr. Any thoughts on that? Or any of the other archetypes that we should be mindful of?
- [24:14]
B
You know, I came up with these archetypes based on all the leaders that I've met and spoken to and, you know, taught throughout my career. And I make it very clear to people that they may see themselves in multiple archetypes, which is fine, or they may even feel inspired to, you know, create something new that works for them. But that's also fine, because all that matters is creating an awareness of why the behaviors exist, the. The positives potentially of those, but also how it's screwing you from managing your own mental health and capacity as a leader, and how it may also be affecting the people you lead, how they do or don't show up for you. So the thing is that I would just be very honest with yourself, even if it's uncomfortable, of if you, you know, help people to your own detriment, if you help people, but then hold it over their heads if you keep people at a distance, because, you know, why would I talk about that? And then you're like, why am I in the hospital for three months of leave? Because I broke down? So I think for me, the takeaway is, regardless of the type, just be very, very honest with yourself about which one you identify with. Because it's not a bad thing if you do. It's a good thing, because then you're like, oh, okay, now that I know this, how can I try to address and create, you know, little modicum of behavior change to try to change the outcome?
- [25:48]
A
Let's talk a little bit about the sea otter. That is the healthy goal. Tell us about that.
- [25:54]
B
So what I love about that one is that. And it really is based on a lot of their behavior, where they are these, like, kind, caring, nurturing creatures, but when they feel threatened or someone they're protective of feels threatened, they will not hesitate to show that and be clear about it. And so for that, obviously, I'm not condoning, like, physical violence in the workplace, but the message to take from that is that, you know, connecting, giving, receiving care is a healthy practice. And if boundaries are. Are crossed or there's a teachable moment, you know, don't shy away from it. You know, be. Be honest about your needs, be open to other people about their needs. But I know several leaders out there who are doing the sea otter life, and I see it.
- [26:54]
A
Yeah, fairly recently, I think we had two really great examples of it with the NCAA women's basketball tournaments, the interviews with the Coaches after the fact, where I was like sobbing and just so moved and motivated by a clear expression of caring about the humans and the team and yes, winning, but not winning at all costs.
- [27:24]
B
Yes.
- [27:25]
A
And I mean obviously these are, these are two final teams. They were the best, the most productive, the winningest. Right. But they didn't get there by only caring about that. And they didn't get there in spite of the people. And even the way they talked about each other, it was really just the UCLA coach talked about being a place where uncommon women made uncommon choices to create an uncommon result. So cool.
- [27:55]
B
Anyway, I was actually going to share an example as well, if that's okay. Just a brief one. So my husband works in the tech industry and the CEO of his company and this is, I think they have something like 130 people, maybe larger. This is a multi, multi, multi million dollar, well known technology company and he's been there about 5, 5, 5 ish years. I think the CEO is really incredible and I've always had a lot of respect for him, not just with how he builds the culture and his company and like his morals and ethics and how he conducts himself as a leader, but he is very open and posts on LinkedIn with these beautifully written articles and he just published one a few weeks ago about his, how his relationship with his anxiety and how he's realized that it, how it impacts, you know, how he delegates or how he interacts with people at the company and how in certain ways it helps motivate, you know, him and everybody very constructively to get things done in really incredible ways. But he also is like, I'm also aware that sometimes I'm manufacturing, you know, urgency or pushing things too fast or it's me not realizing I need to deal with these feelings and I'm putting it towards other people. And I read it and I was like, oh my God, like just so, so self aware and not, not apologizing for having anxiety, but just being aware of the function it plays, how it impacts him and impacts other people. And I was like, this is how to do it guys. Like, this is. He shows what an incredible leader he is and how success and struggle exist in the same body. And it doesn't stop him from being an incredible leader and shows him being responsible and taking accountability in those moments when anxiety is playing a function that's not so helpful.
- [29:59]
A
Well, and just that reminder of how inspiring and how connecting and how motivating good leadership really can be. I think sometimes we forget about that in today's day and Age. I do think it's important that we acknowledge that leadership is changing and evolving just like everything else, but at a pretty rapid speed lately, just like everything else. You know, even the idea of what a leader is supposed to look like, as you mentioned, I think was 1970s, it was the servant leader. And you know, now it's. I don't know what it is. But you mentioned recently the global leadership forecast. What do we want to know, need to know about leadership today and as we move forward?
- [30:41]
B
Well, folks, the leadership forecast is overcast of stress with a chance of burnout, rain. Uh, the report, fresh off the press in 2025 was like, and this apparently was like the largest, longest global study of its kind. It's like a very, it's available online to Download as a PDF. 70% of leaders globally are so stressed they're going to crack. Of those 70%, 44,0. 40% don't want to be leaders anymore because of the current climate and what's expected of them and what's on their shoulders. I'm like, yeah, no shit, guys. Like, I wouldn't want the gig either. So I was so relieved to see this report come out because it is just untenable and it's only gonna get worse. And so I, I read it and I was just like nodding along and I was like, yes, yes, yes, yes. More of this. Yes, yes. And you know, with all the stuff going on, you know, layoffs happening in inhumane ways, you know, people getting screenshotted and put online for saying the most terrible things, I'm like, this is not a great time to get humanized as a leader because there's so many leaders doing bad things that people don't have any incentive. And it's not going to stop me. It's not going to stop me. I'm not going to let the good ones get taken out with the bad.
- [32:21]
A
Agreed. And I'm like, okay, we have to figure that part out. We have to. We have to. And it seems incredibly daunting because the bad ones are so bad and so public and so powerful that it is really hard to not make assumptions about the leaders that we're not seeing on the day to day that may not be as successful or as powerful, extremely hard. And what I think is happening is a lot of those, I'm just gonna call them good leaders that we're not seeing or hearing a lot about is they're not getting the upside, but they are getting the downside of the results or the. I don't know what the word is. But of all the crap leaders that we're seeing, and it wouldn't surprise me if those weren't the 40% that are thinking about leaving. And we need them so desperately. Like, I'm so afraid for politics. Cause I can't wrap my head around how a good human would want to do that because of what we've turned it into, because of what it is. And not a perfect human, a good human. So I think what I'm trying to ask is how do we. Well, how do we encourage the good ones and how do we take the bad ones to task?
- [33:45]
B
I don't know if you're gonna like my answer, but I'll be honest with you. For the good ones, the place to start is acknowledging that they're getting the shit end of the stick. I think that there is no conversation happening, not that I found around taking the good leaders aside and acknowledging how hard that impression management is as a good leader, because they actually care about it. And it's much harder for them than for the bad leaders who couldn't give a shit. So I think acknowledging the struggle first and not to sound too crunchy, but actually feeling seen for that is something that a lot of leaders, overwhelming majority, won't have said to them. So I think that that's the first piece, is acknowledging the struggle. I think also there's another opportunity for again, that narrative shifting within organizations about the importance of. About our last conversation, about the differences between call out culture and cancel culture. Because good leaders get tossed in to cancel culture when they shouldn't. So this is basically. It's almost having like a reparenting conversation with everybody and being like, stop getting mad at the king and queen of the jungle gym. When you have someone else offering to share you a toy right in front of you like that, that's like the best way I can describe it. I think that the good leaders need to be acknowledged that they're under the microscope even more and they're not being appreciated. And also to have a larger narrative conversation about celebrating the good wins of good leadership when they happen. Because typically speaking, and this should happen, leaders are, you know, doing the shout outs for their team members. Absolutely. Keep doing that. And when you have leaders who are doing good, why the hell aren't people giving them a shout out? They need a good job too. These are small things that can be done every day. And it may motivate them not to jump ship if they're starting to feel a modicum of appreciation for not being an asshole. Yeah, Just a thought.
- [36:07]
A
Yeah. Or for caring and doing their best. I mean, that's ultimately what I think the vast majority of people, leaders, really are doing. They are caring and they are doing their best. The problem is some of the biggest leaders are not. And it's just. Yeah, Infuriating. Okay, Melissa, I could talk to you all day. I want to remind people to go get the book Cornered office available wherever you buy books. But let's keep our local bookstores in business. And you can visit Melissa's website@melissa doman.com we're going to put those links as well as all the other ways to find and follow Melissa in show notes. Melissa, thank you for doing this important work. Thank you for standing up for leaders and their humanity. And thank you for being here today.
- [36:51]
B
Thank you so much. It was great to be back.
- [36:52]
A
All right, friends. We say we want better leaders. Hell, I'd argue that we're desperate for them. But we need to acknowledge the paradox. Yes, leadership is both a privilege and a responsibility. We should hold leaders accountable. We should expect growth and demand better. And also leaders are human, which means we should also support them. We need to communicate, take responsibility for how we show up, too, because leadership doesn't exist in a vacuum. It's a relationship. And we all help create, shape, and contribute to those. And if we keep expecting leaders to carry everything, be everything, and never crack, we won't end up with better. Leaders will burn through and burn out the good ones, because the quality of our leadership is never just about them. It's a reflection of us. Want better leaders? Yeah, same. So we get to be better, too, in how we communicate and show up and giving people the benefit of the doubt and in how we support each other. Because all of that leading, supporting, growing together, well, that is woman's work.
- [38:06]
C
Have you ever gazed in wonder at the Great Pyramid? Have you marveled at the golden face of Tutankhamun? Or admired the delicate features of Queen Nefertiti? If you have, you'll probably like the History of Egypt podcast. Every week we explore tales of this area, ancient culture. The History of Egypt is available wherever you get your podcasting fix. Come, let me introduce you to the world of ancient Egypt.