Podcast Summary: This Past Weekend w/ Theo Von – Episode E559 featuring Laila Micklewait
Release Date: February 3, 2025
In this compelling episode of "This Past Weekend with Theo Von," host Theo Von engages in a profound conversation with Laila Micklewait, the co-founder and CEO of the Justice Defense Fund and founder of the Trafficking Hub movement. Micklewait shares her harrowing journey in combating human trafficking, particularly focusing on her relentless fight against Pornhub's exploitation of child abuse, rape, and sex trafficking.
1. Introduction to Laila Micklewait and Her Mission [00:00 - 01:07]
Theo Von opens the episode by introducing Laila Micklewait, highlighting her extensive two-decade-long advocacy against human trafficking. She authored the book "Takedown: Inside the Fight to Shut Down Pornhub for Child Abuse, Rape, and Sex Trafficking," delving into the dark underbelly of one of the world's most visited websites.
2. The Genesis of the War Against Pornhub [01:07 - 05:37]
Key Incident:
Micklewait recounts the pivotal moment in early 2020 that ignited her battle against Pornhub. A distressing case involved a 15-year-old girl from Broward County, Florida, whose life was saved after a Pornhub user recognized her in numerous abusive videos.
Micklewait [02:05]: "She was found in 58 videos being abused for profit. These are monetized videos."
Initial Realization:
Determined to understand how such heinous content proliferated on Pornhub, Micklewait conducted her own test by uploading a benign video. The revelation was shocking—anyone with an email address could upload content without age or consent verification.
Micklewait [05:37]: "I quickly understood that Pornhub was not a porn site. It was a crime scene."
3. Launching the Trafficking Hub Movement [07:09 - 11:32]
Faced with the enormity of the issue, Micklewait launched the #TraffickingHub hashtag on Twitter to raise awareness about the rampant sexual abuse on Pornhub.
Micklewait [08:00]: "By definition, any commercialized sex act involving a child or induced by force, fraud, or coercion is an act of trafficking."
Her efforts gained traction, leading her to write an op-ed that further amplified the crisis. Responding to public demand, she initiated a petition on Change.org, which swiftly garnered over 2.3 million signatures worldwide.
4. Escalation Through Media and Legal Action [11:32 - 27:02]
Victim Stories and Whistleblowers:
As the movement gained momentum, numerous victims began reaching out, sharing their traumatic experiences of exploitation on Pornhub. Additionally, whistleblowers from within the company provided insider information, exposing the systemic failures of Pornhub's content moderation.
Exposing Mindgeek:
Micklewait revealed that Pornhub's parent company, Mindgeek (later rebranded as ILO), had a near-monopoly over the global porn industry, owning major sites like YouPorn, RedTube, and others.
Micklewait [20:23]: "Mindgeek has a monopoly on the global big porn industry."
Collaboration with Journalists:
Partnering with renowned journalist Nick Kristof, Micklewait facilitated a six-month investigation that culminated in the groundbreaking article "Children of Pornhub." This exposé spotlighted numerous child victims and intensified the scrutiny on Pornhub.
5. Major Takedowns and Corporate Accountability [27:02 - 35:22]
Credit Card Companies Under Fire:
Micklewait and her team targeted the financial backbone of Pornhub by pressuring major credit card companies like Visa, MasterCard, and Discover to sever ties. Their efforts were significantly bolstered by media coverage and public outcry.
Kristof [29:37]: "The pressure was on Visa, MasterCard, the big takedown."
Immediate Impact:
Following the publication of Kristof's article, major credit card companies began disassociating from Pornhub. This financial drought forced Pornhub to delete millions of videos and images in a drastic attempt to salvage its reputation and regain financial viability.
Micklewait [31:28]: "Within days of that article being released, Visa, MasterCard, and Discover joined PayPal in cutting all ties with Pornhub."
6. Ongoing Challenges and Partial Successes [35:22 - 56:12]
Residual Content and Rebranding Efforts:
Despite the massive takedown, Micklewait uncovered that Pornhub continued operations by redirecting to its advertising arm, Traffic Junkie, thereby circumventing the cutoff from traditional payment methods. Furthermore, the company's rebranding efforts under "Ethical Capital Partners" failed to eliminate unverified and abusive content.
Micklewait [51:16]: "They still have millions of videos that were uploaded prior where it's only the uploader that was verified."
Legal Battles:
Victims like Serena Flites spearheaded lawsuits against Pornhub and its executives, leading to significant legal victories, including Visa losing their motion to dismiss the cases. The court explicitly stated that Visa's facilitation of transactions was aiding criminal activities.
Court Decision [35:22]: "The judge actually said that Visa gave Pornhub the very tool through which to complete the crime of benefiting from child trafficking."
7. Psychological and Societal Impacts of Pornography [56:12 - 89:43]
Addiction and Mental Health:
The discussion delves into the psychological toll of pornography addiction, including issues like shame, erectile dysfunction, and the erosion of intimate relationships. Micklewait emphasizes the importance of community support and recovery programs in addressing these challenges.
Micklewait [100:11]: "We're running an epidemic of porn-induced erectile dysfunction."
Youth Exposure and Behavioral Consequences:
Children's exposure to online pornography is highlighted as a critical issue, with studies indicating that a significant percentage of minors have accessed pornographic content. This exposure is linked to increased instances of peer-inflicted sexual abuse and distorted perceptions of intimacy.
Micklewait [68:08]: "One study from 2022 was saying that 75% of 13 to 17-year-olds have viewed Internet porn."
8. Solutions and Call to Action [89:43 - 98:14]
Comprehensive Verification Systems:
Micklewait advocates for robust age and consent verification systems to prevent the upload and distribution of abusive content. She underscores the role of credit card companies in enforcing these policies by refusing transactions with sites that fail to implement strict verification protocols.
Micklewait [60:54]: "We have to demand third-party agent consent verification for every single person in every single video that is uploaded to a user-generated porn site."
Public Pressure and Legislation:
The episode concludes with a rallying cry for listeners to support the movement by signing petitions, spreading awareness, and advocating for legislative changes that hold perpetrators and enabling platforms accountable.
Micklewait [112:38]: "Sign the petition at traffickinghubpetition.com and join Team Takedown to support victims in their pursuit of justice and healing."
9. Final Thoughts and Encouragement [98:14 - 114:04]
Micklewait and Von discuss the broader societal implications of unchecked online pornography, emphasizing the need for collective action to protect vulnerable populations and ensure a safer digital environment. They highlight the importance of community support, recovery groups, and continued advocacy to sustain the momentum of the fight against online sexual exploitation.
Micklewait [113:31]: "It's about public pressure and implementing solutions to make the Internet a safer place."
Notable Quotes:
- Micklewait [02:05]: "She was found in 58 videos being abused for profit."
- Micklewait [05:37]: "I quickly understood that Pornhub was not a porn site. It was a crime scene."
- Micklewait [20:23]: "Mindgeek has a monopoly on the global big porn industry."
- Micklewait [35:22]: "The judge actually said that Visa gave Pornhub the very tool through which to complete the crime of benefiting from child trafficking."
- Micklewait [56:12]: "We're running an epidemic of porn-induced erectile dysfunction."
- Micklewait [60:54]: "We have to demand third-party agent consent verification for every single person in every single video that is uploaded to a user-generated porn site."
- Micklewait [113:31]: "It's about public pressure and implementing solutions to make the Internet a safer place."
Conclusion:
Laila Micklewait's testimony in this episode sheds light on the pervasive issues of child abuse, sex trafficking, and exploitation facilitated by platforms like Pornhub. Her unwavering dedication, combined with strategic legal actions and public advocacy, underscores the urgent need for systemic changes to protect victims and hold perpetrators accountable. This episode serves as a clarion call for listeners to join the fight against online sexual exploitation and support initiatives aimed at fostering a safer digital landscape.