The Adam Mosseri Interview with Throwing Fits

Summary

Throwing Fits: The Adam Mosseri Interview

Date: August 3, 2026
Guest: Adam Mosseri (Head of Instagram)
Theme: In a candid and wide-ranging conversation with the Throwing Fits hosts, Adam Mosseri discusses everything from Instagram’s culture-shaping role and the evolution of content creation, to fashion, AI, platform policy, memes, and the perpetual quest for taste. The episode is playful, insightful, self-aware, and occasionally irreverent—just like its hosts.

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Episode Overview

The Throwing Fits team welcomes Adam Mosseri, the head of Instagram, for an unfiltered conversation about:

• How Instagram shapes online culture, taste, and social interaction in 2026
• Navigating the creator economy, reach, and the elusive “algorithm”
• What’s on Adam’s Explore page and the true nature of his IG usage
• Fashion talk, tech bros, and the evolving intersection of style and technology
• Parenting, AI, and the weird world of platform policy
• Candid reflections on both the power and pitfalls of running one of the world’s most influential social platforms

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Notable Segments & Timestamps

1. Sartorial Icebreaker & Fit Check

[00:43–03:41]

• Adam details his New York fit: Percival linen shirt, Scott Fraser flowy pants, German Buntoni shoes, his wife’s borrowed socks (“Behind every great man is a woman with an extra pair of socks”), and Jacques Marie Mage (“JMM”) specs.
• “As a guy, you don’t have a lot of accessories… What kind of frames do you want? Same way you decide your outfit.” (Adam Mosseri, [03:11])
• Underwear: CDLP Swedish brand—“They make the best underwear, man. And best socks too.” (Adam Mosseri, [03:50])

2. Life as IG’s “Big Meech”: Usage Patterns & Personal Behavior

[04:08–07:06]

• Adam’s actual IG screen time: about an hour a day on mobile, much more on desktop for work. (“I do try to create…to experience what it’s like to try to be a creator on the platform.” [04:58])
• Meme favorites: “Depressed Ben Affleck” is his go-to share (“Middle aged, but I feel like it’s relatable—He looks how I feel a lot.” [06:20])
• His Close Friends list is mostly for family/kid content— nothing deranged.

3. Niche Interests, Explore Page, and “Your Algorithm”

[07:30–09:48]

• Sunday league soccer fails dominate his personal DMs.[07:40–08:00]
• Adam explains the “Your Algorithm” feature: users can now see, add, or remove their content interests (“If you hit those little heart sliders at the top right of your Explore, you can actually see what we think you’re into. You can add and remove things.” [09:01])
• “The most common question is some form of ‘how do I get more reach?’” (Adam Mosseri, [10:11])

4. Platform Strategy: Reach vs. Goals & Instagram’s Purpose

[10:11–13:00]

• Adam debunks the idea of a ‘silver bullet’ for reach: be experimental, clear about your goals, and align content accordingly. “Reach is a means to an end, not an end in itself.” (Adam Mosseri, [11:04])
• Instagram's raison d’être: connecting people over creativity and interests. “If you want to talk to people about your interests—that’s really our sweet spot.” ([12:12])

5. Instagram as Dating & Professional Hub

[13:00–14:44]

• “We do know that it’s a dating app. It’s a dating app without being a dating app.” (Adam Mosseri, [13:13])
• From flirting to networking: “Tons of people meet on Instagram just creatively.” [14:09]

6. Platform Improvement, Safety & AI Tools

[14:47–17:05]

• Current priorities: user safety (especially youth), improving ranking and relevance, and building creative tools—especially with the rise of AI content. [14:47–15:26]
• “How can we build new tools that empower creative people as opposed to disintermediate them?” (Adam Mosseri)

7. The Blue Check & Platform Integrity

[17:05–18:15]

• “A lot of money, probably, but I assume it’s a scam.” Adam on bribe offers for blue checks ([17:13])
• Warns against scammers and reaffirms there are no secret blue check brokers.

8. Balancing Tech, Parenting, and Mindfulness

[17:58–19:48]

• Adam shares his “dad dates” with his kids, phone boundaries, and why Bluey makes him feel inadequate as a father (“He’s the best dad ever. He’s a cartoon dog.” [19:20])
• Parenting content & fashion: “Dad fashion is a thing! There’s a whole niche.” ([20:26])

9. On Algorithmic Juice, Product Testing, and International IG

[20:47–24:34]

• Adam dislikes getting personal “juice” (algorithmic advantage): “It makes it much harder for me to know is ranking changing or the rest of it.” ([21:25])
• Discusses product tests, rollout strategies, and different usage patterns around the world, especially India and Japan [22:18–24:34]

10. Features Adam Loves: “Your Algorithm” & Restrict

[24:41–26:02]

• Restrict: a subtle way to shadow-mute abusive users without confrontation, originally built from feedback from teens. “It’s almost like a shadow block.” ([25:30])
• Muting and the niche influence of certain features.

11. Meme Backlash, Mistakes, and Policy Controversies

[26:18–28:16]

• “Make Instagram Instagram Again” controversy explained—multiple complaints rolled together, leading to Adam getting “memed hard.” ([27:22])
• On reading comments: “If you have a large account, don’t read the comments right away. The people who comment the quickest are not the most normal people.” ([28:29])

12. Nipple Policy & Content Moderation

[29:41–31:06]

• “Nipples are tough.” Adam breaks down why nudity is (still) restricted, not due to prudishness but safety/consent/age verification. [29:53]
• Enforcement is mostly via AI classifiers, not human moderation teams.

13. Cultural Power & Platform Stress

[31:52–33:15]

• Adam reflects on the pressure: “You get the privilege of working on something that touches billions of people’s lives… It’s exciting and nerve-wracking.” ([31:52])
• Instagram optimizes for originality, timeliness, and helps break small creators—but admits the team can’t predict all outcomes.

14. Platform Features, Product “Holdouts,” and Experimentation

[33:15–34:51]

• Instagram keeps small percentages of users off new features to measure change impact.
• Some users still don’t get ads or new features, but eventually parity is enforced (“Even if it’s 1% of people, that’s 30 million…” [34:34])

15. Men’s Style, Taste, and the Influence Ecosystem

[34:57–38:15]

• Jacob Elordi’s style, the power of subcultural menswear accounts, and the value of influencing influencers vs. sheer follower count.
• Advice to style creators: “You can’t really buy [personal taste], you have to develop it—over time, over failures, over spending a lot of money.” ([36:54])
• The pursuit of deeper, niche influence over pure scale.

16. Shadowbanning, Account Status, and Platform Transparency

[38:39–39:54]

• Adam explains the misunderstood “shadowban”—if your account is non-recommendable you can check your account status and appeal.
• Adam has never had content taken down himself, “I do know I’m very familiar with the rules there, which helps. Wrote them.” ([39:58])

17. Media Literacy, AI Content, and Authenticity

[40:14–44:32]

• With AI-generated content on the rise, Instagram is launching new tools to label content and provide post/account context to help users navigate what’s real (“People are going to need to be more skeptical of what they see…” [42:03])
• Adam’s advice: always check not just what’s being said or shown, but who is saying it and why.

18. Spam, Hacking, and Account Safety

[44:44–46:51]

• “Turn on two-factor [authentication]! … Don’t use SMS.” Adam’s regular security PSA. ([45:45])
• Warns about account-based spam networks and “self-compromise” hacks via login exchanges.

19. AI in Daily Life & in the Bay Area

[47:03–50:17]

• Adam’s perspective on the AI/tech culture in San Francisco—nuance is needed between “AI zealots” and “doomer apocalypse crew.” ([49:11])
• He personally uses AI for productivity, including custom-built apps and bedtime stories for his kids.

20. Tech Bro Uniforms, Taste in Silicon Valley & the Met Gala

[53:46–56:32]

• “Taste” and creative differentiation as a status currency in a tech world obsessed with efficiency. Adam sees himself as a fan of smaller, lesser-known designers.
• “I always try to find somebody small… It’s more fun to find [that] than just buy the big label.” ([56:37])

21. Brand & Fashion Preferences

[61:42–63:02]

• Top personal picks: Kartik Research, Percival, Scott Fraser, Bodhi—“I was really deep on Bodhi early… all really short though.” ([61:42])
• “I have probably too many pairs of green pants—fence the Riddler over here.” ([63:11])

22. Life Hacks, Coffee Obsession, and Health Tracking

[65:05–80:03]

• Adam nerds out on coffee (“I try to keep it under five [coffees a day].” [65:25]), home brewing (Hario Switch, La Micro Marzocco espresso machine), and spending $45+ on high-grade beans (“If you’re lucky enough to afford it, do it once just to see.” [79:02])
• Health/fitness: custom goal-based health app, built for longevity (“If you make it to 90 or 100, like put your bag in the overhead bin…” [80:03]). Admits his wife is a “Disney adult” so he trains for Disneyland walks.

23. Platform, Money, and Reels Revenue

[71:50–72:44]

• Adam gets paid well as IG boss, but doesn’t monetize his content or take gifts/kickbacks for brand mentions (“That’s double dipping, dog.” [71:57])

24. Constructive Criticism, Influence, and Last Words

[81:10–End]

• Adam flips constructive criticism question back to the hosts, but praises their “if you know you know” influence and unique mirror-shot ‘thing.’
• Parting advice to creators: “It’s better to have a smaller following and less reach that actually helps you achieve your goal than just chase the numbers and lose sight of why you’re there in the first place.” ([82:54])

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Choice Quotes

“We do know that it’s a dating app. It’s a dating app without being a dating app.”
— Adam Mosseri, [13:13]

“Taste… You can’t really buy that. You have to develop it—over time, over failures, over spending a lot of money.”
— Throwing Fits Hosts, [36:54]

“The people who comment the quickest are not the most normal people.”
— Adam Mosseri, [28:29]

“Turn on two-factor. No SMS.”
— Adam Mosseri, [46:21]

“Nipples are tough.”
— Adam Mosseri, [29:53]

“Reach is a means to an end, not an end in itself… don’t lose sight of why you’re there.”
— Adam Mosseri, [11:04, 82:54]

“If you make it to 90 or 100, can you put your bag in your overhead bin?”
— Adam Mosseri, [80:03]

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Summary Table—Adam Mosseri’s IG “Starter Pack”

• Fit: Percival linen, Scott Fraser, JMM glasses, Buntoni shoes, CDLP undies
• Content Diet: Parenting tips, soccer, comedy, fashion, architecture
• Platform Use: Experimental, more on desktop, purposely not getting “juice”
• Fashion Brands: Bodhi (“early adopter”), Kartik Research, Percival, Scott Fraser, (Green) pants
• Parenting: “Dad dates,” anti-Bluey inferiority, silent soccer balls for the kids
• Coffee Setup: Hario Switch, La Micro Marzocco, five-a-day limit (“try the $30 strawberry, just to see…”)
• Life Philosophy: Experiment, embrace failure, keep your eyes on why you’re here—not just the numbers

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Takeaway for Creators

Adam’s consistent advice: define your purpose, experiment, focus on originality and value—not just chasing reach. The platforms will evolve, but if you stay true to your unique voice (and maybe wear vintage Zeppelin tees, swap in some green pants, and hit the gym for future Disneyland jaunts), the right audience will find you.

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Final Call

For more, follow @mosseri on Instagram—and remember: “Think long term. Think long and hard.”

Transcript

[Host 1]

Our guest this week is going off grid to post up at the studio with the fellows and tell his story. Also a Threads pun all the way from the bay. The IGOG is taking time off from running the billion user platform and posting reels trying to convince us there isn't an ideal time to post content. So while he's busy here, now's your chance to share a post that goes against media. Call him Big Meech because he's the boss of the gram. Here to chat AI content creators, tech bros becoming obsessed with taste and what his Explore page looks like. The head of Instagram, Adam Mosseri. Adam, how the hell are you?

[Adam Mosseri]

I'm happy to be here. Thanks for having me.

[Host 1]

Thanks for coming by.

[Host 2]

Yeah. You're a busy guy. Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

But, you know, it's important, it's important to get out there and talk to people who are using the platform.

[Host 2]

Absolutely. We're, we're users, by the way. We're part of the billion.

[Adam Mosseri]

I appreciate it, you know, billion strong. We appreciate your business.

[Host 2]

Thanks, man. Real quick, before we get started, we got a lot to discuss. Adam, could you quickly do a little fit check and break down everything you wore to podcast with us today?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh. Oh, yeah, I. It's hot in New York.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

I feel like it's always about like and smoggy. Yeah, smoggy and smoky. It's a humid. And smoky is a bad combo, which is the vibe right now we hear.

[Host 1]

Yesterday when the smoke rain started pouring

[Adam Mosseri]

down, I was like this. Yeah. I was like, whoa, delicious.

[Host 1]

Not good for the plants.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

I think this is maybe. I think this is Percival linen. Just because it's hot.

[Host 1]

Oh, nice.

[Adam Mosseri]

And then blokes, the lads shout out

[Host 2]

to homies, the mates.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, they're good, big content creators. Yeah.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

And they do make good summer knits.

[Host 1]

That's true.

[Adam Mosseri]

And then Scott Fraser collection.

[Host 2]

Oh, Scott.

[Adam Mosseri]

Flowy, airy pants.

[Host 2]

Yeah. High waisted.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yes. You got to be. You got to be comfortable in this heat.

[Host 1]

Absolutely.

[Adam Mosseri]

So that's what I tried.

[Host 1]

Shoes, footwear.

[Adam Mosseri]

What are these?

[Host 1]

These are.

[Adam Mosseri]

I don't even remember what these are. Buntoni.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 2]

Italian, German.

[Adam Mosseri]

German.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Uh, no loafers. I feel like, I feel like once I was maybe 35, I was like, okay, I gotta start dressing my age and I gotta put on real shoes.

[Host 2]

Took you a little time there.

[Host 1]

What were you.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, I was a little behind. I was a little behind. I was probably worried. I probably wore sneakers or something. Or boots. I wear a lot of boots. New York kind of. Kind of I don't know if you go back. No, actually, no.

[Host 2]

Thank God.

[Adam Mosseri]

We're gonna.

[Host 1]

We're gonna dig into your sartorial past.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't think I have any auburns. These are actually my wife's socks. I ran out of clean socks. Really grabbed.

[Host 2]

Shout out to her. You're better half.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, they like, barely com. They're great songs. Yeah, no, they're great.

[Host 1]

Shout out, Jenny.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah. She like. I, like. I'm. I'm. We're. We're on the east coast right now. And I came out to New York and I had to pack real quick and I had nothing clean, so I grabbed and I like, she think they were too big for her, so I just snag them.

[Host 2]

Look at that.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Host 1]

It's awesome.

[Host 2]

Behind every great man is a woman with an extra pair of socks.

[Adam Mosseri]

I wish we could share clothes because she's got great style, but she's five foot three and I'm six foot three, so it doesn't really work.

[Host 1]

Hold on. It took three minutes and 50 seconds for him to drop that. He's six. That's a new. Got his ass and the spectacles.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, I forgot about that. Everyone wants to know there's more things than I thought I was wearing.

[Host 1]

You're wearing a lot of.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah. These are JMMs. Oh. Kind of. They're kind of an addiction.

[Host 2]

And really, how many frames do you have from jmm?

[Adam Mosseri]

Probably six or seven.

[Host 2]

All right.

[Adam Mosseri]

But I wear glasses every day, so I feel like it's. As a guy, you don't have a lot of accessories. And so I feel like if you have. If you wear glasses, you kind of have to, like, you don't have to, but it's nice to have it as an option to be like, all right, well, what's my mood today? Right? The same way you decide, like, what kind of outfit you want. What kind of frames do you want?

[Host 1]

I think you're the first guest to come in with optical jmms. Everyone always has the sunnies.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Oh, yeah. No, no. I have maybe one pair of sunnies, but I, I like. I buy them and I get them. My first. I can't see anything, so I get my prescription put in there.

[Host 1]

All that coding.

[Host 2]

Yeah. Blue light, dude. It's the blue light.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Host 1]

What about the underwear? The panties?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, cdlp. Do you know that?

[Host 1]

Very nice. Swedish.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. They make the best underwear, man. And best socks too. Actually, I would normally be wearing those socks, but I, I instead wearing my Wife's.

[Host 2]

Yeah, it happens.

[Host 1]

Man socks are gender fluid. All right, fit check complete. Let's get into the meat and potatoes. Adam, first question we have to ask you. What is your Instagram app? Screen time?

[Adam Mosseri]

Ooh, my phone's the other room. Probably not too bad. I'm on the desktop a lot for work, so I don't. So, like, the. The on screen time, it probably only like an hour a day, maybe a little bit less, if I had to guess. But I. I don't think. I think that undercounts because I. I'm on Instagram a lot as part of my job.

[Host 2]

Sure, of course you're working. That's why I tell my wife, too, when she complains.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, I'm working. I'm working, I'm working. Yeah. So I think it's probably. But I'm on generally because of my job. I'm. A lot of screen time in general.

[Host 1]

Okay, what's your. What's your. What would you say is your general screen time on your phone?

[Adam Mosseri]

Three, four, Three and a half. Four hours.

[Host 2]

That's really low, dude.

[Adam Mosseri]

But I'm on the desktop most of.

[Host 2]

Okay, so if we took the desktop into account, Are you in double digits screen time?

[Adam Mosseri]

Probably right around. Yeah. Because. Yeah, probably. Well, so, like, a lot of zoom calls. Sure. A lot of. A lot of. A lot of emails. A lot of.

[Host 1]

You're creating content.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, I do, but that doesn't take too much time. I do. I do try to create. I think it's important to. I think it's useful for me to try to create content on a regular basis, to experience a bit of what it's like to try to be a creator on the platform. But I'm also really. I'm really booked up with other stuff, so I just. I'd get half an hour a week. Usually we go over what's going on this week. So maybe. Maybe I'm going to do a pod. We talk about that. Maybe we talk about going to an event, and then the last 10 to 15 minutes, we try to record between one and three videos.

[Host 1]

Wow, you're efficient.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

And you just knock them out.

[Host 1]

You ever. You ever do the thing where you, like, you set up the tripod, then you get back into bed, or you hit record, then you get back in the bed and you're killing the life?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I don't think anyone's interested in the day, in the life, or even me again, out of bed with my hair sticking straight up, like, curly.

[Host 2]

Even worse is people that do it like they Film themselves showering.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Oh, yeah, There's a lot.

[Host 2]

I mean, listen, that's a genre of content, I guess it's pretty popular.

[Host 1]

What's the last meme that you shared?

[Adam Mosseri]

Ooh, I don't know that I share a lot of memes. I save them. Well, I guess I share them with friends on DMs. I don't post a lot of memes. I don't know. I got to look back. I. I saw one the other day. I'm a big fan for some reason. I don't know why. I'm not. My wife's from Boston. I'm not a Boston guy. But a lot of the, like Ben Affleck, smoking and upset and tired or sleeping or. Or rolling his eyes. Those hit hard for me. So it's usually it's.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2]

Depressed Ben Affleck.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Middle aged. But I feel like it's like relatable.

[Host 2]

Very relatable me.

[Adam Mosseri]

He looks how I feel a lot. And so it just. It. That's usually if I'm gonna send one.

[Host 2]

What?

[Host 1]

I said, what about we're not lucky enough or blessed enough to be on your close friends? How deranged is your close friends, close friends story?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, it's boring.

[Host 2]

Come on.

[Adam Mosseri]

I've got three little kids, so mostly I use close friends to post pictures of the kids. Okay.

[Host 1]

Right.

[Host 2]

Because otherwise you'd have to cover up their faces. Right?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah. Just the security stuff is a thing if it the. So, yeah, my close friends isn't deranged. If there's anything weird going on, you're

[Host 1]

not posting like deep fried memes and like, no mess. Like AI messy. I wish doing freestyles.

[Host 2]

And I wish you saved that for your fin still. Yeah, I get.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah. Or the dms. I feel like that's where the weird stuff goes out. Like, I've got friends with very specific niche interests and like, their D. My DM touch with them are almost always about those things.

[Host 1]

You have friendships. Like this is like, you know, category of a male friendship where friends that are like, you only kind of communicate via me.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

You have those guys.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Or. Or mostly like, you know, I have a friend, I've known him forever. And we. We do hang out and we do talk, but the majority of our. Our interaction is a very specific niche. So we both like soccer a lot. Shout out to the World Cup. By the way, it's been a pretty crazy time on Instagram these last couple weeks.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

But the niche of soccer highlights that we share are very specific. They're never professional. They're always like 45 year olds on Sunday leagues, Sunday league.

[Host 2]

The best.

[Adam Mosseri]

Making a shot that they will never make again in their entire life. And then everybody just losing their minds.

[Host 2]

Piss ripper from half but hammered.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, just. Just a screamer in the top right corner.

[Host 1]

They're trying to do the Ronaldo suit.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, like, that is a whole genre that. It's probably like four out of five things we say to each other. It's just sending one of those.

[Host 1]

Are you nice? Are you nice at footy?

[Adam Mosseri]

I. I have a bad knee, so I. I'm not that good anymore.

[Host 2]

Convenient. Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah. I used to love it, but it's. That's bad now.

[Host 1]

What's your Explore page look like?

[Adam Mosseri]

It's tippy. I. I was just giving my team feedback about this. So we try to make sure that all the different parts of Instagram, you know, make sense. Like, if you. You interact a lot with, you know, football on your feed, then your Explorer should have more football, etc. My reels are in a really good place and my feed's in a really good place, but my. My Explorer just like, for whatever reason, it's like, it's just getting. It's just completely gone. It's all watches, and I just like. And I need more variety. So I've been.

[Host 1]

So what do you do? Do you, like, not engage with the watch content and then wait till, like, a football thing comes up and you just, like, double tap that?

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

So we have this thing now called your algorithm, where you can see your algorithm and you can modify it.

[Host 2]

Right.

[Adam Mosseri]

And so it is working for me, but for some reason, there's some sort of weird bug. I'm in some sort of test probably. And explore for me.

[Host 2]

This is a good excuse for all the, like, clear watches that you're buying in this addiction that you have.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, Ex.

[Host 2]

I believe you 100%.

[Adam Mosseri]

But if you hit those little heart sliders at the top right of your Explorer, you can actually see what we think you're into. You can add and remove things.

[Host 1]

Okay, why is my ig. Why does my tour page just half naked women? Is that what I like?

[Adam Mosseri]

They're not half naked, Tippy.

[Host 1]

Mine's nippy.

[Adam Mosseri]

All right, hold on. We're going to see what your algorithm says.

[Host 2]

Okay. This should be fantastic.

[Host 1]

Why did I hand the head of.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's actually pretty safe. Lately you've been into NBA basketball, watching intense tennis matches, specifically intense ones. And exploring the city of light. Paris.

[Host 2]

We were in Paris for fashion Week.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, it's his. Paris Fashion Week. NBA relaxation and self care. Good on you. Luxury fashion, tennis, New York Knicks, professional tennis.

[Host 2]

Paris, my man, contains multitudes that could have been worse.

[Host 1]

Beautiful.

[Adam Mosseri]

It could have been a lot worse.

[Host 2]

So much worse.

[Host 1]

Beautiful waves. I wish it was a category I could. What. What is the question you get asked the most about Instagram? Because we see you, like, replying to, you know, the AMAs and creating content that's addressing, like, I'm assuming, issues and questions that come with the most singularly. What is the most. The question you get asked the most about Instagram and related. How do we get unshadow banned?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, there you go. The. The most common question is some form of how do I get more reach? That's definitely the most common question. I mean, second to that, maybe like, can I have a blue check mark, it's my birthday kind of thing. Or then. And then, you know, the fair share of complaints, which I think is part par for the course. Yeah.

[Host 2]

Customer service.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Actually about 10 of what I do is customer service.

[Host 1]

Probably 100 of what you do.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, that's true. Different types.

[Host 2]

That's why you're here.

[Adam Mosseri]

But yeah, mostly it's about how do I get more reach?

[Host 1]

And what is your answer? What do you say? Be. Do better.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Be more interesting.

[Host 2]

Drop more bangers.

[Adam Mosseri]

Drop more bangers.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

I don't think that would fly. I wouldn't land that. Well, I mean, look, I try to be honest is that there is no silver bullet. If there was, you know, you, everyone would know it. It's about a couple of different things. I do think, look, I push on a couple of things. One is, okay, reach is important. I get that. I'm not trying to say otherwise.

[Host 1]

Right.

[Adam Mosseri]

That said, reach is a means to an end. Not an end and of itself. So what are you trying to do on Instagram? You're trying to build a brand? Are you trying to sell a product? Are you trying to build a community? You're trying to evangelize a cause, make sure you are clear about your real goal. And then you make sure your content strategy not only gets you more reach, but it actually aligns with that goal. I think sometimes people lose sight of that and they just are chasing the reach, but then they forget why they're there in the first place. In order to get more reach, I think you need to experiment, you need to try new things because what works this year might not work next year. That's happened to me many times. But you've got to Find that overlap between what are, what is content that you can create on a regular basis that people are actually interested in, they're gonna interact with, they're gonna send to their friends, but also is aligned with that goal. Because I feel like too often people forget about the original goal.

[Host 1]

What I mean, speaking of, like, that's a personal, like, personal goal, you know, what is the end to the means. But in from your position, like, what would you say is the point of Instagram in 2026, besides sharing photo dumps of your Euro summer to make all your friends jealous?

[Adam Mosseri]

I mean, the whole. The hope is that we're connecting people over creativity, whatever that might mean to you. For some people, it's fashion. For some people, it's sports in, you know, the World cup right now. For some people, it's, you know, poetry that's its own little subculture. On Instagram, we're not the best place to just message a friend. Like, it's faster to WhatsApp or iMessage someone if you're late for lunch. We're not the best place to just watch TV or watch video for a couple hours. Like, Netflix is better at that. But if you want to talk to people about your interests, that's really our sweet spot, you know. So for my brother, I talked to him about Stand Up a lot. I just sent him, you know, funny clips. My sister's into. She's a furniture designer and a lighting designer, so we talk about architecture and furniture. That's, I think, where we really sing. Where, like, you can explore your interests, whatever they might be, and then connect to people over those interests.

[Host 1]

Does Instagram know, and this is like a joke, but it's based in some solid truth and. And personal experience and experience of our friends. Does Instagram internally know that it's effectively become the number one dating app in the world?

[Adam Mosseri]

We do know that it's a dating app. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host 2]

Okay, good.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's a dating app without being a dating app.

[Host 2]

Right. So effective.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, I mean, well, I mean, message is DM specifically, and DMs not just for dating. They are a great way there. Well, we have what we call conversation starters. Right. So it's awkward just to cold message someone whether or not you have a crush on them or not. But you've been there. Yeah, but you can reply to a story, you can send a funny meme,

[Host 2]

you can like a story.

[Host 1]

You can post a story that's singularly

[Host 2]

targeted to your crush, just to that person.

[Adam Mosseri]

Theoretically. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Just over and over.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, so we, we. We do know that a lot of people use it to meet people and to. And to flirt, to date and to the rest of it, I mean, it's

[Host 1]

become like, not, what's your number?

[Host 2]

Like, what's your ig, what's your ignition?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, but that's also true of on the professional side. Like, my brother is a film score and a musician, and he doesn't have a website or a business card.

[Host 2]

Right.

[Adam Mosseri]

They just ask for his handle. I was surprised by that when he told me that because we're not. We're not good at listening to music. But he's like, but no, but it's my taste. Like, they come to my Instagram, they see something, some sign of my taste, my interests, and then they meet. Right. It's the same thing. It's like if you are interested in an artist and you follow them, and if they see that, they can DM you and it goes straight into your inbox. Tons of people meet on Instagram just creatively.

[Host 2]

The grid is the portfolio, right?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah.

[Host 1]

So it's, it's the number one dating app is also the number. It's where all the deals go down. Deals go down in the. Seriously, like.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah.

[Host 1]

What? Okay. Where can Instagram be better?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, it can be better in so many different things. Your priorities, I mean, this. Right now, our biggest priorities are certainly. There's a ton of work on safety, particularly around young people. There's a ton of work on ranking and relevance, making sure that we're helping you explore your interests. Just go deep on where you want, not go deep where you don't want. There's a ton of work on creative tools, especially with all of these new AI models and all of the anxiety around that. How can we find some ways to build new tools that empower people, that empower creative people as opposed to disintermediate them. There's work to do everywhere. Yeah.

[Host 1]

What the one product about, like, tweaking your algorithm, which I feel like that's maybe one of the first explicit instances where people can, like, train their own algo versus just, you know, interacting or engaging and knowing that you're like sending signals to the algo.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

How. How would people use that in a way that surprised you?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, I don't know if there's anything surprising. There's been some more powerful moments. Like, I think that, well, look, there's still a lot more work to do. So right now, the way your algorithm works is you can see the topics you're interested in. You can add topics, you can even remove topics or say, don't show me anything about this. But there are a lot of other requests people have, Right. They want, maybe they want to see more from their friends or maybe they want more funny content or more uplifting content. So we're working to be able to support other types of requests. So I think it will probably surprise us more when we make it open ended and you can ask for anything. Then I think we'll start to really learn. But right now we are just trying to make sure that we're only offering things we know we can deliver on.

[Host 2]

Sure.

[Adam Mosseri]

Because it's just, what's the point of saying offer asking what do you want to do if we can't do anything about it?

[Host 2]

Right.

[Adam Mosseri]

But we're pretty excited about getting in and learning at that point.

[Host 2]

So we're approaching Pandora's box. Can ask for anything?

[Adam Mosseri]

Well, you should. Yeah. Well, you should be able to

[Host 2]

more championships forever.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I Want to see 20, 2027 Knicks

[Host 1]

Champions OG tipping on repeat forever.

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh my God.

[Host 1]

Is that your whole feed?

[Host 2]

Yeah, yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

That was insane. I thought, did you see the interview with them? And they're like, how, what was going through your mind? How do you feel? He's like, I was trying to dunk it.

[Host 2]

He's the best dude.

[Adam Mosseri]

I was like, you're the best.

[Host 2]

Perfect specimen, perfect brain.

[Adam Mosseri]

Well, you should be able to see your algorithm and you should be able to talk to your algorithm eventually, but that's going to take some time.

[Host 2]

Right.

[Host 1]

Okay. Okay, please be honest with us. As you have been through the entirety of this interview so far, what's the most that you've been offered by someone to get them a blue check?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, a lot of money probably, but I assume it's a scam. I'm sure that's. I mean, I feel like there's a lot, there's a lot of scammers out there who are trying to sell or buy.

[Host 2]

Oh yeah, we get the messages all the time.

[Adam Mosseri]

Don't participate.

[Host 1]

Like, okay, so there's no blue check brokers. Like if, if you're listening out there and you get a DM from someone and you have like foreign followers, you've never posted and someone's like, I got you.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, it's bad sign.

[Host 2]

They probably don't got you.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, you might, you might want to

[Host 1]

report continuing on with just like your personal usage of Instagram and technology. How long do you think you can go without being on your phone?

[Adam Mosseri]

How long can I. Yeah, I don't know.

[Host 1]

Before you get fired.

[Adam Mosseri]

Before I get fired? Yeah, before I get fired. Probably a couple days.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

I try to get some time. Like, well, there's phone and there's also. So I know I resisted this forever, but I have two phones. I've got one for work and one that has no work on it. And so often what I'll do is just, like, leave the work phone. So my. My kids, I got three boys. They're 10 and 6. They don't understand that dates are supposed to be romantic. And so they're pissed off that mom and dad go on date night. So, like, I want to go on a date. And you're like, I'm not going to even explain why. That's weird. Like, cool, we'll go on a date. So I do these dates. They call them dad dates. And so. So, you know, that'll be like two hours. But then I just. I bring my. I just always leave the work phone.

[Host 2]

Sure.

[Adam Mosseri]

Because that way I'm like, you know, sometimes you just want to protect that time. Yeah.

[Host 2]

Do they have phones, your sons?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, too young. Six. They have iPads.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

They've got. They've got sort of boundaries. They're only allowed to use them on the weekends for a certain amount of time. Louie or. Oh, my God. I love Bluey Bandit. Makes me feel bad about myself as a dad, though.

[Host 2]

Okay. We're not actually familiar with.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, well, I'll explain.

[Host 2]

We don't watch baby shit.

[Adam Mosseri]

But, yeah, you know, I do. I do. Oh, my God. Bluey is a show, like, by, like, the Australian Broadcast Corporation, and it's like, the dad is a dog. It's a cartoon dog dad designed by Australian parental psychiatrists. That just makes me feel bad about my dadding.

[Host 1]

Damn. That's how they get you, like, insufficient. You need to keep watching.

[Adam Mosseri]

He's the best dad ever. He's a cartoon dog. But, like, how.

[Host 1]

What have you learned from Mr. Bluey that you've applied to your fatherhood in real life?

[Adam Mosseri]

I. So he. He's Bandit. Bandit. This is not what you thought we were going.

[Host 2]

Yeah, okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

Bandit. Bandit will get real creative. He'll be like. He'll just make. Oh, sorry. He'll just make up games that entertains the kids. And so I try to do that

[Host 2]

sometimes, but there's a whole writer's room to come up.

[Adam Mosseri]

He's much better at it.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Is your reels tab, is it full of, like, cool dad content or like, how to.

[Adam Mosseri]

Like, I get some good. I got a good amount of parenting Advice.

[Host 2]

Yeah. I get.

[Adam Mosseri]

What do I get? I get a lot of. I get some fashion. I get some sort of architecture. I like comedy. I'm, like, all about, like. I think laughing is just good for your soul. Facts in your abs and your abs. Exactly. Watches parenting. That's probably the. And then. Oh, a lot of. A lot of soccer and a lot of basketball.

[Host 2]

What about dad fashion? That's the thing that doesn't apply to me, but it's coming across my desk

[Host 1]

where it's like, I have kids, but,

[Host 2]

like, I still want to get fresh. And it's like, that's the. That's the whole niche where it's like a dad, but also caring about what he wears.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. No, dad fashion is a thing. You know, it's like, there's, like, the New Balance situation and the wide leg trousers and the whole thing. I get a good amount of dad fashion. I don't know if I can really pull it off, but, like, I. I have a lot of respect for it.

[Host 1]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

Okay.

[Host 1]

Let's continue with the honesty. Adam, how hard are you going Elon mode and boosting your own personal engagement?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, scale. Yeah, we okay it. So there's been different periods. So there have been periods where the main accounts get some juice and that. Periods where they haven't. I don't like it when we go to. When I have extra juice. I know that's easy to say, but the whole point for me of being on the platform is to feel like. To get a sense of what it's like. And so to me, it just kind of messes everything. It's nice to be able to reach more people, but it's. It makes it much harder for me to know is ranking changing or the rest of it.

[Host 1]

Do you have, like, you know, Gen Pop IG on your personal phone and then, like, Beta Super IG on your work phone? That's.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

You're testing all the products?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, yeah. Even on my personal phone. So we have a. We are always trying new things. I know it can be frustrating when Instagram changes, but we do want to make sure we're evolving and staying relevant. And so we are almost always living with new features that might not ever be shipped or even tested. So even my personal phone usually has a couple new features on it. Oh, is.

[Host 2]

Is there something that you guys were testing that never came out that you can share? Is that, like, proprietary?

[Adam Mosseri]

And you can't say, I'm sure. What have we.

[Host 2]

I mean, just something that we're like, okay, we're not doing this. So you could let us know.

[Adam Mosseri]

Well, sometimes teams just do stuff and they don't tell me and then I find out about it. I'm like, that's not. That's not gonna happen.

[Host 2]

Yeah, the AI girlfriend feature, the world.

[Adam Mosseri]

That's not gonna happen.

[Host 1]

Is there product roll out that had you super nervous?

[Adam Mosseri]

Plenty. I mean, like, right now we are. One of the things we're working on is very contentious. And this is being tested right now. I think. I think in India, maybe one other country is a version of Instagram that the main tab is. Is Stories and then you can swipe into reals. Oh, there's photos there in there too. But it's that Reels full screen viewer.

[Host 1]

Wow.

[Adam Mosseri]

Because obviously so much of our growth is being driven by stories, DMs and reels. But I don't want to do that unless I can get it to a place where people are really excited about it. So the test not only is seeing, do they use it, do they like it? What happens to engagement, revenue, sentiment? It's also seeing like it's allowing people to opt in and then seeing how many people opt into it and how many people keep it on. And we want to make the experience better and better. And then if we get to a point where most people opt in and keep it on, then we can consider actually rolling it out.

[Host 2]

Loaded. Follow up question. Is this being beta tested in India Because India has the best reels by far. I don't know if you've seen some of the content they're creating. It's unreal.

[Adam Mosseri]

I mean, in part because reels is just so big in India.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

I mean, also India's. It's not the whole country of India that has access to 5 or 10% of them because, I mean, India is probably 1 out of 4 users at this point on Instagram. It's a huge amount of our.

[Host 1]

What are the country? India? Brazil.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

America.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yep. What's number four in terms of overall sizes? No, no, we're banned.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

How do you like it in Russia and Iran? We're banned in a couple places. Places I don't know what's for. That's a good question. My guess would be Indonesia, just because it's so big. But. But I mean, there are. It's interesting to see because there it's. It's very different in different countries. Like when I started at Instagram in Japan, Twitter was the biggest social network. Then Instagram, then Facebook and now it's like Instagram, then maybe Twitter, then threads than Facebook.

[Host 1]

Oh.

[Adam Mosseri]

You know, whereas in Thailand, like Facebook is huge and we're not that big. So it varies a lot. Who's the most relevant in different parts of the world.

[Host 1]

Interesting.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

What's the IG product that you're most proud of?

[Adam Mosseri]

There's a couple. I'm really excited about your algorithm. I'm not necessarily proud of it yet, but I just think we are doing more than anybody else to give people insight into the algorithm and control over it. And that I'm really excited about. I, I really love, you know, do you know Restrict. It's a little one, but I love it. So Restrict was a feature that was inspired by. We were talking to teens about why didn't they just block people who are bullying them. And they said two things. They said, one, escalation. If I block them, they're going to find out and I'm going to hear about it tomorrow at school. And two was they need to know what the person was saying because they have to defend themselves because they're talking shit. And so Restrict basically is like, almost like a shadow block. So if they comment on your stuff, it looks like they commented but nobody else can see it but you.

[Host 1]

Oh, wow.

[Host 2]

And they don't know.

[Adam Mosseri]

They don't know the plausible deniability.

[Host 2]

I'm about to employ this immediately.

[Adam Mosseri]

If they message you, you can, you can read it without sending red receipts. And so it ended up being really useful, not just for teens, but also for creators and others who public figures. That one was pretty cool. And a small one, kind of an under known one.

[Host 1]

Muting is nice.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, muting is great meetings, really nice. And you can mute by surface if you want. But it's what I mean, you can mute just.

[Host 1]

Oh yeah, yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Stories are just right, right we there

[Host 1]

at the launch of IG Stories.

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I was working on Facebook stories when Instagram launched. Instagram Stories.

[Host 1]

Snapchat.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

And I want to say in the long run. Thank you. Yeah, thank you very much. I was able to escape. Yeah. Oh, here's a question, a product question. What determines the order? This is a personal one.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

What determines the order of how you see the people that have watched your story?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, I don't think. It used to be how interested we thought you were in them, but then that seemed like it was a weird creepy thing to show. So now I think it's just kind of random.

[Host 1]

Oh yeah. But if someone likes it or replies to it, they're up top.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 2]

Like it.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. If they've reacted then it's at the top.

[Host 1]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

People keep asking to search, they want to search.

[Host 2]

Speaking of creepy.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 2]

Let's get right down to it.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host 1]

Was there ever a decision, decision made under your tenure as head of ig, or a feature where you're like, guys, we're never doing that again?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, yeah, I'm sure a lot. We make a lot of mistakes.

[Host 2]

Nobody's perfect.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. I mean, look, in the long run, I think it's going to be better for us to take on some more risk and really evolve the thing forward and stay relevant than get too nervous to try anything risky and then just slowly become irrelevant as the world changes around us. And so as a result, every once in a while, like, we really get our hands burned.

[Host 2]

You know,

[Adam Mosseri]

it's not always as clean cut. Like, you know, a couple years ago, there was a big meme, you know, make Instagram. Instagram again.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

And that was a. Three or four people were mad about three or four different things. They were mad about too much video. They were mad about too much recommendations. So that's content from accounts you don't follow.

[Host 2]

Right.

[Adam Mosseri]

They were mad about a test for a new design, but that wasn't even rolled out there. Some creators were mad about their reach. And so it all kind of got mashed up. And then I got memed hard.

[Host 2]

You personally?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Just like my. Like, I was good.

[Host 2]

Yeah. Right?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. I mean, it was funny. It took me a little time to acknowledge.

[Host 2]

Did you restrict all those accounts?

[Host 1]

Your wife was, like, laughing on the couch. What are you laughing at?

[Adam Mosseri]

Well, she didn't even notice. Like, it was like, she. She does not care at all about what I do. She has, like, at the end of the week, she's like, did something happen this week? And I was like, I'm like, literally watching a three and a half minute thing spoof of me by the Daily show, just ripping into me.

[Host 2]

Gotcha.

[Adam Mosseri]

And I was like, you know what, babe? Nothing happens.

[Host 2]

It sounds like most marriages.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah.

[Host 1]

Let's turn off your work.

[Adam Mosseri]

I was like, oh, God.

[Host 1]

Have you learned to, like, not read the comments? Sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt. Like. Yeah, especially from that. From that episode.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, I mean, I think. I think you. Well, the thing that you really got to do is if you have a large account, don't read the comments right away. The people who comment the quickest are not the most normal people.

[Host 1]

No.

[Adam Mosseri]

And so there's a psycho.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Host 2]

You don't say.

[Adam Mosseri]

And so you need to give it a little bit of a Minute So that we'll, you know. Because we're not going to censor people for being mean. If they're, if they're, if they're attacking you, sure. But if they're just being mean. No, but we'll downrank them. But we need other stuff to put above it. So just give it an hour, let it marinate. Yeah. And then we let us let you know and then we'll help it out.

[Host 1]

So is that what you did? You let, you let. Gave it an hour before?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I just read all of it. I just was like, I just read it really? And I actually know what I did is I called my brother and I because I was like, it was, you know, I was, you know, my feelings were hurt and I was like, is, you know, like, like, tell me the truth, is this mean or is this funny? And he's like, no, that shit's funny.

[Host 2]

That's hilarious. Actually.

[Adam Mosseri]

Thank you for sharing. I was like, all right, good. It's good. I'm glad I know that.

[Host 2]

Now do you have like an interface where like you can go into any post and you personally, you can just delete something if you wanted to?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, no, no, no. That's horrible.

[Host 2]

With great power comes great responsibility. I personally would have no self control.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Work with a Chinese Instagram state run social media. What about. Oh, speaking of like, kind of like, you know, big ig like kerfuffles and controversy, could we get an update on the Instagram nipple policy in 2026?

[Adam Mosseri]

O. Oh, we get Nipples are tough. So we Nipples are tough. Nipples are tough headline clip it. Oh, I said it the. So we don't allow nudity for two for. Primarily because it's actually not because nudity is necessarily a problem. It's not. But because it can be a safety issue because we can't verify age and we can't verify consent and so we don't allow nudity. And one of the things we don't allow, which some people think is way too prude and some people think is too open, is we don't allow topless women. So the female nipple. So one of the, one of the sort of nudity advocacy patterns is to take a picture of a woman with her shirt off and to cover up the woman's nipples with little clips of men's nipples. And then to see which of course just a lot of work to prove the point.

[Host 1]

Hey, what's not King Shame?

[Host 2]

Yeah. Whatever you're into.

[Adam Mosseri]

So it's so, you know, it's. Look, it's hard we wanna, we wanna, we wanna be honest and open about our policies. We want to, we want to enforce them consistently. We don't want to make mistakes. But we understand that not everyone agrees with where we draw those lines and they're going to try to find ways of pushing the envelope.

[Host 1]

Is there like a nipple division?

[Adam Mosseri]

No.

[Host 2]

Okay. A nipple task force?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, it's Seal team Dip. No. No. Nudity is mostly identified with, with, with classifiers, not with code, with AI.

[Host 1]

I mean, we've talked about how like you have been put in the crosshairs. Instagram has effectively and I think like, it's almost so obvious that especially to people that grew up with ignoring that, it's like it's still, I think it still warrants, you know, pointing out that Instagram effectively invented an entire economy and ecosystem and really shifted how we like, market things, learn about things, consume products, consume information, you know, project our self image into the world. How much pressure do you feel that like these changes that you guys are always making, these tweaks that you're always making can alter companies entire trajectories and people's livelihoods a lot.

[Adam Mosseri]

I mean, I think that that's the, that's one of the reasons why it's so exciting and that's one of the reasons why it can be so stressful to work here. Right? You get to, you get the privilege of working on something that billions of people, you know, that touches billions of people's lives. Some in very small ways, some in very meaningful, significant ways. And that is exciting and that is also, I think, you know, nerve wracking, terrifying. Yeah, it's, yeah, it really can be. And so now we try to be clear about where, where what we're doing, why we're doing it, where it makes sense for us to act, where it doesn't make sense for act. Like we're not going to tell you, you should read this and you should not read that, but we are going to try and promote content that is original, promote content that is from creators, promote content that is timely, you know, because we care about things like cultural relevance, but we can't really know what is actually culturally relevant in every country around the world. So we look for these other things. So, so those are values. You know, I try to be very clear. We're not neutral, but we also aren't going to weigh in on arguments either. We're going to try to be like, these are our values. We value originality, we value timeliness, we value small creators breaking this is how we try to pursue those concepts and ranking and in the design of Instagram. But then how people end up using it is ultimately something that we can't really predict.

[Host 1]

When you press the red button, I assume that's how it works. To send out a new product update, you to just like, fuck it, fuck it. We ball. Just do it. Send it.

[Adam Mosseri]

India loved it. No, no, no.

[Host 2]

We actually said we're Gucci.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, run it. Well, we have. We do. We. So we. One, we test things before we launch them, but we also do the inverse. So if we launch something, usually, particularly if it's a significant change, you know, 5 or 2 or 1% of people won't get that change. So we can make sure that it actually does what we thought it was going to do by comparing what everyone who does, who did get that product does against what people who didn't. And then once we feel like everything worked out the way we expected, then we will get rid of that holdout.

[Host 2]

So there's some people out there who still haven't gotten stories yet, is what

[Adam Mosseri]

we're saying, eventually for that shit to drop. There are some. There's some people out there who've never had an ad.

[Host 2]

Wow, that's fun. Oh, my God. The blessed ones.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Host 2]

Still sounds crazy.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, there's some.

[Host 1]

You haven't decided if ads are good?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, but we need to know the overall. Like, how much less do people use Instagram because of ads? Oh, how much less good do people feel about Instagram because of ads? Like, we need to quantify that.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

But when it's a feature, it's just super annoying not to have it. It's like, wait, I don't get close friends.

[Host 2]

Right.

[Adam Mosseri]

So eventually.

[Host 1]

You can't restrict a motherfucker.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. So eventually you just have to just be like, you know what the. It would be nice to know, but it's not worth Ohio the bad experience for. Because even if it's 1% of people, that's 30 million people. Yeah, it's a lot of people who are like, why. Why does. Why don't I have, like.

[Host 2]

Right.

[Adam Mosseri]

Whatever it is.

[Host 1]

I'm moving to India,

[Host 2]

so I can't. Girl.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, exactly.

[Host 1]

What? Speaking of ecosystems that are born from ig, like, literally exist because of the platform. What are the menswear content creators that you actually take advice from? Oh, and why are they all telling us to dress like Jake Velordi?

[Adam Mosseri]

Well, we should talk about Jacob Elordi, because I'm curious your take. Because, I mean, look, tall. He's very tall. He's rich. Yes.

[Host 1]

Is he on Instagram? He's like, he must have a secret.

[Host 2]

Oh, yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

I don't know. I mean, he's all over Instagram. I don't know if he's actually on Instagram himself.

[Host 2]

You don't have that information.

[Host 1]

He's a burner.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Often. Often they have burners. I mean, I don't know. I'll be curious who you guys follow and who you think. I mean, I follow you guys.

[Host 2]

Thank you. Thank you.

[Adam Mosseri]

I didn't follow your personal account until today. I didn't realize I hadn't because I had throwing fits for a long time.

[Host 2]

Me, I'm good. Don't worry about it.

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I got you. I got you already.

[Host 1]

You don't say anything.

[Host 2]

You're three for three. That's all that matters. You made. You made it, right?

[Adam Mosseri]

One of the guys I've been following for a long time that I've always really liked is the real Professor X. Yeah. I just think that Xander. Xander's great.

[Host 2]

Shout out to Xander.

[Adam Mosseri]

Shout out Xander. I don't know if I've never met him. I think I've DM with him a bit, but I just love the fact that, like, he's just. I think he's like a high school.

[Host 2]

David's like a sub. I think it was a sub.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, he's a sub. And he's just got hot takes and they're good and good wrecks.

[Host 2]

Good attitude. I'll say that.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. And it's not all like expensive. It's like, hey, like, you know what? You know what you can get? You can get, you can get an awesome wrangler. Snap. Yeah. He's throwing down for 30 bucks on eBay. Right. You know, and so. I don't know. I like that. I don't know. But who should I follow?

[Host 2]

Throwing fits? I don't know.

[Host 1]

I mean that's, that's kind of like goes on set.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Of course.

[Host 1]

It almost feels like the, the content creator, like standards are. I'm not saying like it's in a rut, but there's definitely like a lane, I think that works. And it feels like it's. We try to, I think through our long form podcasts and the reels we put out and everything, kind of like always encourage curiosity, like actually failing. There's this whole notion where people are like, I need personal taste. How do I get personal.

[Host 2]

Personal style.

[Host 1]

How do I get personal style? Yeah, it's like you can't really buy that. You have to like, develop that.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Over time, over failures, over spending a lot of money.

[Host 2]

Have some other interests outside of buying clothing.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yes.

[Host 1]

That helps, you know, you know, architecture, soccer, hanging out with friends, etc. I mean, you tell us, like, how can throwing fits do our part and make the men's style landscape of Instagram better?

[Host 2]

Yeah, because right now, a lot of

[Host 1]

it is, like, based on dressing like celebrities and buying the row. Yeah, like, that's not really.

[Host 2]

That doesn't apply to a lot of people.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, that stuff's expensive. I mean, I think you guys are doing a really good job because, I mean, look, your account. The accounts that I'm most interested in aren't the biggest accounts. They are the accounts that big accounts and influential accounts follow. And that's, like, right where you guys are. If I look at your followers, you've got people who have influence and taste who follow you. And I would much rather have, like, you know, a much smaller following, but an influential one influences the influencers. That's the thing I'm really into. Like, you know, we even try to look at that, which is like, all right, cool. Like, these are the big accounts. How are they doing on Instagram? But if you look at the accounts that all the big accounts follow, how is their experience? Are they. Are they staying on the platform? Are they getting. Are they using it more or less over time? How do they feel about the platform? I think that's where the real kind of interesting stuff happens.

[Host 1]

Yeah, I mean, that's where you have to go a little below surface level. It's also kind of like, similar to, like, the ideal boyfriend has 400 followers.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host 1]

No one wants, like, you want a boyfriend. I'm like, 100,000.

[Adam Mosseri]

No, no, you definitely want a boyfriend with 100,000 in our experience.

[Host 1]

So then how do we get. Explain to us why we're professionally and personally shadow banned. Like, can we get the juice?

[Host 2]

How do we get on the juice list? How do we break it?

[Host 1]

How do we break it?

[Adam Mosseri]

So if you have an issue on your account, you can go to profile settings, account status, and see that there's an issue.

[Host 2]

Oh, I'm sure throwing Fitz has a litany of those.

[Adam Mosseri]

Not those kind of issues.

[Host 2]

Okay, sorry, my bad.

[Host 1]

Yeah, we got issues.

[Adam Mosseri]

No, we don't. We don't. There's no interest in, like, surreptitiously suppressing people's reach. It's a very common misconception. People think that we do that to convince them to buy ads, but the truth is, if you're creating content that people want to see as a business, it's in our interest to show that content to those people, because if we do, they'll use Instagram more and then we can easily advertise against that attention elsewhere.

[Host 2]

Right.

[Adam Mosseri]

You're happier, they're happier, and we're better as a business.

[Host 2]

Is the, the idea the boogeyman of the shadow band? Is that like the biggest misconception from people when it comes to complaining about reach, or is that like something that used to happen a couple of years ago?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I think that's one of the biggest ones. And to be clear, like, I'm not saying that we don't restrict reach sometimes, like, so you can be in your account. Could be in a state where we don't show your content to accounts that don't follow you. We call that non recommendable. But if that's the case, you can see that in account status.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

You know, we can, we do take down content if it violates our rules. But if that's the case, you can see that in account status. If we made a mistake, you can appeal.

[Host 1]

Have you ever had your content taken down for violating community guidelines?

[Adam Mosseri]

No. That'd be pretty bad. That'd be pretty bad. I do know I'm very familiar with the rules there, which helps wrote them, but. Yeah, no, I don't think. Hasn't happened.

[Host 2]

Not yet. You never know.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah. I mean, never say never.

[Host 1]

Yeah. Never seen, never.

[Adam Mosseri]

That's how I go out. Just go out with a bang.

[Host 1]

How? Okay, I mean, we, we briefly touched on, on AI kind of creeping into just the general culture and world at writ large. Do you like, how can people train their media literacy? And it's like a different type of media literature to differentiate what's authentic and what's maybe marketing on the platform. Because now there's this whole notion of like all the psyops or all the paid accounts that are, you know, they're like, oh, I mean, I'm getting all this shit where people are trying to convince me the Future album is good. I'm like, there's no way.

[Host 2]

There's no way Def Jam paid for that one.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, it's okay, I think. I mean, look, it's a big question, but a few things. So AI is getting to a place where it's going to be harder and harder to tell, you know, what was captured by a camera and what was just completely generated in a synthetic content, photos and videos. And so in that world, it's also going to be more important for people to Think about not only what is being said or what is being shown, if it's a photo or video, but who is saying it and why they might be saying it. So we actually just recently launched this thing where you get these two little lines down every post, and if you tap that, we give you information about the post. Oh, and we're going to slowly give more information there. Give you more information about the account. More. Give you more. If we. If the count. If the content is AI and we know it's AI, we'll tell you that. That we're working on a thing where if we. The account, we know the image was actually captured by a camera because there's a certification in the file. We'll tell you that. But maybe we should also tell you things like this account has been alive, has been around for four days.

[Host 2]

Right.

[Adam Mosseri]

And has changed names 17 times. Like these signals. Maybe it's not always a bad thing. Maybe it's like, this is what this is referencing. This is, you know, this is the context in which this statement sits.

[Host 1]

So to increase media literacy or providing more literature for people to.

[Host 2]

More information.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, I think. Because I think people are going to need to make. They're going to need to be more skeptical of what they see, and they're going to need to really specifically think about who's saying and not only what they're saying and why they might be saying it. Like, when I'm talking to my kids about what to believe, what they read, I try not to explain, like, hey, you know that company is trying to sell something. So, yes, they say that Bodega says it has the best cup of coffee

[Host 2]

in New York City.

[Adam Mosseri]

But. But it might not exactly.

[Host 1]

They say Geese is the best band to come out of New York since the stroke.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Who's paying for that?

[Host 2]

Yeah, I did. They were right.

[Host 1]

Have you been tricked by something you thought was real, but it was actually AI that you like?

[Adam Mosseri]

Sure, I'm sure. You know what happened to me? It was. It was like I saw. It was like a Ralph Lauren Arsenal collab.

[Host 2]

You're like, yes, take my money. Where do I sign?

[Adam Mosseri]

And I was like. And then I was like, oh, this is. And then I looked at it and I hit the button. I was like, this is. And I was like, oh.

[Host 2]

Like, oh, Ralph Lauren is spelled wrong.

[Adam Mosseri]

Maybe it's not real.

[Host 1]

It's like Ralph taking a fucking penalty.

[Adam Mosseri]

This is awesome. Guard. It looked perfect. It was great. It was good.

[Host 2]

There wasn't an extra finger. No sign.

[Adam Mosseri]

I might just have it made.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Honestly, was it AI or was it just like a bootleg?

[Adam Mosseri]

It was AI.

[Host 2]

Wow.

[Adam Mosseri]

It was a shameless. It was. I just, I got, got poor gooners. Yeah.

[Host 1]

How, I mean, what about, how shook should content creators be about this burgeoning field of AI influencer?

[Adam Mosseri]

I actually think that, I mean, look, there are real risks, but they're also real opportunities to me. I think in a world where there's more and more synthetic content, people are going to actually be seeking out content from other people more, not less. That doesn't mean there isn't competition, that doesn't mean that it isn't risk of being displaced. But I just think that people are interested in content not just because of the photo or the video, because of who said it, why they said it, their perspective, their taste. And so I think that the creators that are going to navigate this massive change the most effectively are the ones who are going to stay curious and experiment and figure out ways to lean on these tools to help them do what they do to be creative, to maybe make more content or different content or better content. And yes, there will be competition from the pure synthetic creators, but I just don't think that there's a world in which that, that takes over everything. Because I don't think anyone wants an Instagram or a platform that is only right that or if they do that, it's only part of their media diet. They're going to want to also hear from other people about what they think and why.

[Host 1]

But did you read the article about that guy? That's like creating like an army of AI influencers and then it's just like, it's just pay for play from any company that wants to market their shit through these, through these, through this army.

[Adam Mosseri]

So there's different ver. There's been versions of that for a while. So there's AI versions of that. But like one of the most common ways that people get their account hacked right now is what we call self compromise. Some account is somebody sells you, I'll give you a thousand followers for free. Just sign up. You sign up with your Instagram login. Now they have your login and guess what they do? They log in as you and like other people's stuff or follow other people, which is how they're selling those likes to other people. And so they're. Now we look for these networks. When we find these networks, we take them all down.

[Host 1]

Damn.

[Adam Mosseri]

So don't pay for it because it's, if we find it, it's going away. Yeah, but that is A. This is just a new version of that spam. And we. Look, spam is. Doesn't go away, right? It's just arbitraged value. We have to find out. We have to find out what's happening. We have to figure out how to identify it. We got to shut it down and then it'll inevitably pop up somewhere else in some other way. So it never ends.

[Host 2]

Whack a mole. But like, you guys are getting out all the mallets out.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Have you, have you ever gotten hacked?

[Adam Mosseri]

No. But two fact man turn on two fact. Quick plug.

[Host 1]

You've passed the company phishing test every time.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host 2]

The training with flying colors.

[Adam Mosseri]

I post about 2 fact. I used to do it once a month. I think I just did it. I think I just did it a week ago. No one does it. And don't use SMS. Don't use SMS because people get SMS hacked all the time. Use 1. Use A. Use one of those authenticator apps. Oh, the.

[Host 1]

Okay. Yeah. All right.

[Host 2]

Google.

[Adam Mosseri]

You're not gonna do it. You're not gonna do it.

[Host 2]

No, no.

[Host 1]

If you say I have Google authenticator. Not for IG though.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, you can use. You could use WhatsApp, you can use Google Authenticator. You can use Duo, you can use one password. Whatever you want.

[Host 1]

All right.

[Host 2]

But two fact. You're like, you're an advocate for two fat.

[Adam Mosseri]

Two fact. No, no sms.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Host 1]

Because if you do get hacked and you become part of this like, like farm your just gets nuked. You're annihilated once. Once you might.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Snip them out.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yes. Well, if you're.

[Host 1]

Lose your account.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah. Well, if it's a big account, they might start posting things that they're trying to promote. And that's. But that's. They don't usually do that because then you're going to report it and it's going to get taken down. So what they do is they just like, like stuff on your behalf and follow stuff on your behalf that you don't even necessarily notice. But they're selling those likes elsewhere. And you're.

[Host 1]

And you're.

[Adam Mosseri]

And. But now your account's kind of.

[Host 2]

I wonder the biggest celeb who fell for this. And it's like, well, Tom Cruise just liked my fit pick. I thank God I spent a thousand bucks. Hell yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

That's not good.

[Host 1]

What's the. What's the vibe like in the. You're in the Bay.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah. Some of San Francisco.

[Host 1]

What's the vibe like in the Bay Area? Now that AI is proliferating. It's in the cars.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's a lot of billboards. I mean, look.

[Host 2]

I mean, marketing, baby.

[Adam Mosseri]

A lot of AI Billboards.

[Host 1]

How analog.

[Adam Mosseri]

The Bay Area is a weird place. I mean, look, I love the Bay. I've been in San Francisco since 2005. There are. It's. There are people who hate on it.

[Host 2]

You got hyphy, you ghost ride the whip, dude.

[Adam Mosseri]

But it was cool because in those first couple years, we were the first ones to have Airbnb. We're the first ones to have Uber. Like, it kind of felt like you were living in the future a little bit. It's not a perfect city by any means, but it's also not the apocalypse that people make it out to be.

[Host 2]

Right.

[Adam Mosseri]

I like being there because for what I do, it's sort of the center. I also like that we get access to things early. Like, I like Waymos.

[Host 2]

Oh, really?

[Adam Mosseri]

I love way.

[Host 1]

When they get. What about when they get in a. Yeah, there's a cell self propagated traffic jam in a parking lot.

[Adam Mosseri]

I'll tell you. I'll tell you, the second time I got into a Waymo, they won me over. I sit in the front.

[Host 1]

Not the first time.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Well, no, because the first time you're just like, what's happening?

[Host 1]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

There's like a ghost driver. Like, the thing is turning and there's no one turning the wheel.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

So I was like, all right.

[Host 1]

Those drivers all over these places.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. So I don't want to like, Driving Miss Daisy ghost driver style. So I sat shotgun instead the second time, and I'm sitting shotgun, and we hit a yellow light, and I'm like, oh, like, all right, ghost driver, what you gonna do? What you gonna do?

[Host 2]

The ultimate test is pop quiz.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. What do you. What's your deal? Are you a. Are you a break guy? Are you like a slam on the gas guy? And it didn't do either. It did the math and just cruise right through. It's like, all right, wow. 33 miles an hour, 120 yards. We're good. And just cruise at the same speed.

[Host 2]

And a human can't do that?

[Adam Mosseri]

No. And I was like, all right, you could drive me to work every day. I'm sold.

[Host 1]

Can you get on the aux in Waymos?

[Adam Mosseri]

I don't know.

[Host 1]

Or Bluetooth, I guess. Because, like, there's no.

[Host 2]

Yeah, you.

[Adam Mosseri]

Can you. Can you control the audio now? That's actually. No, I forgot that you can.

[Host 2]

Are you allowed to drink in them?

[Adam Mosseri]

I really hope not probably open container

[Host 2]

asking for a friend.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, exactly.

[Host 1]

But is everyone like evangelizing? I go, AI?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, no, there's both. There's people, there's look, there's the. I think too much of this debate around AI is either like the total zealot AI pilled crew or the. Or the really intense doomer sort of apocalypse crew.

[Host 1]

That's the two camps, right?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. But I just think it's like most nuance that there's a lot of room in the middle and there's not enough people talking about it. There are real risks. There is a lot of change. It's going to happen real fast. It's going to be hard for us to digest. There are also amazing opportunities and amazing things that it can help us do. And that's already happening. Like the. This isn't necessarily like a sexy thing, but. Or exciting thing, but I actually am very excited about it. Which is one of the things that we're finding with AI models is that we're way better at finding content that violates our rules without catching content that doesn't. Because to us, the more we push on finding more of the bad stuff, we inevitably have what we call false positives. So taking things down that we shouldn't, that sucks. No one wants that.

[Host 1]

So it sounds like there is a nipple team.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Yeah, they have it on their business cards.

[Host 2]

Do you use AI in your personal life at all?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, all the time.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

I tend to build. For me. What do I use it for? I built a bunch of apps that I just use in my daily life.

[Host 1]

Just like.

[Host 2]

Just you for the house?

[Host 1]

Like build apps just for you?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

For Adam?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, I just have a bunch of these like fresh baked software. I have like three or four apps I just use every day that I build.

[Host 1]

Sick.

[Host 2]

Damn. Any of those sellable?

[Adam Mosseri]

I mean, maybe, but I don't. I'm not going to do that. I mean, for me it's, it's. There is a world in which eventually AI is going to be able to be able to create interfaces for you or software for you on the fly so quickly that, you know, what is Instagram in a world where it can adapt the ui, not just the content to your interests. So I wanted to make sure I play around that space. I've built a bunch of like one. I have one for health. I've got one for just tracking on my packages so they can build like a bunch of little things.

[Host 1]

How much are these clothing packages you're buying?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, it's mostly cdlp, underwear, personal Line insurance. Yeah. Yeah. And like, you know, my kids, sports stuff. But. But I use it, I use it, I use it for writing. I don't have it right for me. I will write. I write a lot, both internally and externally. So I'll write something and then I, I will ask it for vicious critique. Particularly Claude. Claude really doesn't hold back.

[Host 2]

Particularly mean.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. In a way I kind of appreciate. Yeah. God is for. For writing. But it's actually great.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

For a long time I haven't done this. Not because they're a little older. For a long time. When Chat GPT first came out, I would. When I read books to my kids at bedtime and I would always end with a big. All right, you pick a protagonist, you pick a context, you pick a. Oh, you pick a. Whatever. A theme. And they'd be like, all right, I want a shark named robot who's in a race. And so I'd be like, I'd ask for. And I'd make a prompt. I'd be like, I need a. I need a five minute story for an eight year old about a shark named robot in a race where the moral of the story is to listen to

[Host 1]

your father, as Bandit would do.

[Host 2]

Yeah, of course.

[Adam Mosseri]

And then I read it and they loved it.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Host 1]

Do you say thank you to Claude?

[Adam Mosseri]

I do. I think it's important. Yeah. Not. Maybe not in your writing because. But like this is true for a long time. Like with Alexa, that I have little kids. If you just bark orders at Alexa.

[Host 2]

True.

[Adam Mosseri]

Like, you know, what time is it? Like. No. Yeah.

[Host 2]

They learn by osmosis.

[Adam Mosseri]

No, they're not thinking about it.

[Host 1]

Play E40.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

So I say. Yeah. Yeah. So I say please. And I say thank you.

[Host 1]

Play E40, please.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, exactly. Because that way it, you know, it helps.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

What are like, as. As fashion and tech become so intertwined, what are some positive, you think positive things you think will come from this, like ever more, I don't know, involved, intertwined relationship?

[Host 2]

Well, I think you said it, you unholy marriage.

[Adam Mosseri]

We're not really known for our fashion sense. Yeah, we should definitely talk about that. I mean, look, the thing that I'm. One of the reasons why I actually really love what I do is because part of what platforms like Instagram do is they allow anyone with taste and something interesting to say to actually find an audience. And the fact that you've got people like, like Xander, who's a substitute middle school teacher in somewhere middle America.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Like has a passionate following. It's just A rad thing that couldn't have existed. 20.

[Host 2]

That's true.

[Adam Mosseri]

True. Yeah. And so to me, that's, that's, that's

[Host 1]

the good stuff and the bad stuff.

[Adam Mosseri]

We're not, I mean, I don't know, like Adidas sandals and like, well, I

[Host 2]

mean like flip flops.

[Host 1]

There's the tech bro uniform. Like, like, if we go back far enough on your ig, will we see you wearing the tech bro uniform?

[Adam Mosseri]

I don't think you'll see a tech bro uniform, but you probably see something

[Host 2]

bad some for sure.

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, yeah.

[Host 2]

That's everyone though, right?

[Adam Mosseri]

You got to try stuff. Like, what have I tried that's bad? I don't know. Oh, I look back and like, I'm sure in the 2000s, my pants were way too tight. We went, I went through a lot of.

[Host 2]

Some joggers, maybe.

[Host 1]

Were you ever like, were you of the generation that was wearing like hoodie and flip flops to the office?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I, no, because I know, but when I moved out to San Francisco in 05, I was, that was kind of. When I started working at Facebook in 08, that was kind of the, the uniform, but I was much more like, like black boots and jeans and a

[Host 2]

black T shirt dress for the job.

[Host 1]

You want New York?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Like I gotta react to this. California.

[Host 2]

Yeah. I'm gonna wildly overreact like a mixologist and show all of them.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, exactly, exactly. It was not, it was not interesting, but that was definitely the, the uniform for a bit.

[Host 1]

What's the tech row uniform in 2026? Because we, we, we don't know.

[Adam Mosseri]

I don't know. It's, it's, it's, it's not as consistent now. Right. Because now you've got, there is the world of sort of quiet luxury where you got these guys with these like, you know, 1200 sneakers or whatever, or piano, you know, what else? But it's, it's, it's not this. Not the same. I mean, the Apple uniform is a uniform, so there's like the Steve Jobs inspired simplicity thing, but then it's designer. The Apple designers kind of have their, their sort of vibe, which is a little bit higher end brands.

[Host 1]

You know, can you kind of clock someone by their, by their fit? Like if you're at a restaurant, you're like, oh yeah, that guy works for, I don't know, Uber or that guy's, that guy's, that guy's an engineer. That's a sales bro.

[Adam Mosseri]

A little bit. Yeah, a little bit. Depends on the company. Like Uber. No but like, Apple Design. Yeah, okay. But, but yeah, I don't think, like, if you look at the big tech titans, right? If you look at like, like, Satya and, like, Jeff Bezos and Mark Zuckerberg and Sundar, like, they, you know, they don't have a quite as, quite as consistent a look.

[Host 1]

I mean, are you the kind of the resident, like, swaggy exec? Like, how often does Mark ask you to, you know? Or does he consult you before he drops a Fitbit? Yo, yo. Which one?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, he does not part.

[Host 2]

The one you like best.

[Adam Mosseri]

He does not consult me before he drops a fit. That would be amazing. That was gonna be part of my job.

[Host 2]

Job. Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's like, what should I wear? No, I mean, look, I mean, I, I, we have, our leadership team has got a. From a bunch of different parts of a bunch of different industries at this point with a bunch of different types of experiences. People think of me as more closer to fashion just because I'm at Instagram

[Host 2]

and you go to the Met Gala. That doesn't hurt.

[Host 1]

Yeah, but also, that's true. Get fits off.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host 2]

I mean, look at you.

[Host 1]

And, like, smaller designers, too. Like, not.

[Adam Mosseri]

You got to go small. I think that's kind of the thing to do, because I think it's, I think too many people is like, all right, I want to get interested, so I just got to buy this big label. And look, I don't, I, I sometimes spend more money than I should on things, but I just think it's the club. It's more, it's more fun to find, like, yeah.

[Host 1]

Discovery.

[Host 2]

Discovery. Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

And then when they blow up, then you can be like, if, you know,

[Host 2]

you know, I was there.

[Adam Mosseri]

I was there.

[Host 2]

Everything you like, I, like 10 years ago.

[Adam Mosseri]

You get a little sad, though, about it, though, because then you're like, well,

[Host 2]

you don't want to gatekeep, you know, at least that's our opinion.

[Adam Mosseri]

You got to keep evolving. Like, you just got to keep looking. Like, you know, you guys always find stuff before. I mean, I'm curious who you think is interesting right now. I, I, I didn't know about cartic research until, like, six months ago, and they were. He was generous enough to make me something for the gala.

[Host 1]

Are you gonna go to a store here on Orchard Street?

[Adam Mosseri]

I want to, yeah, it's, it's five right there, right? Yeah, yeah.

[Host 1]

Pop in.

[Adam Mosseri]

This stuff is. I bought a bunch of stuff. That stuff is radio, but, you know, and then now he's, but he's, but then he he blew up immediately. And like, you know, I was happy that someone turned him on.

[Host 1]

Has. How often has or have you ever worn anything, like on a real. Or just like on story where Mark has asked you, like, id? What is that? Is that card? What is that? Karthik Research. You say, what is that?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I get a ton of questions about my glasses.

[Host 2]

Sure.

[Adam Mosseri]

Everyone is always commenting. Yeah.

[Host 2]

It's like, do you tell them something a little cheaper? So you seem like a man of the people.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. No, they're Warby Parker. Yeah. Almost all my glasses are J. Or Garrett. Lights.

[Host 2]

Shout out. Gary light the homie.

[Adam Mosseri]

So I, I don't usually answer because I don't think anyone really cares, but I get it.

[Host 2]

They asked.

[Adam Mosseri]

Well, a guy asked.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, this is one.

[Host 2]

One time.

[Adam Mosseri]

No, no, one guy per. I get a thousand comments.

[Host 2]

I see. Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

And I'm like, they're like, you know, like, what is the future of the algorithm? How are you keeping teens safe? And I'm like, oh, you know what? The one question I'm gonna ask is, like, where are your glasses from? It's like a weird look.

[Host 2]

Better than how much for a blue jacket?

[Adam Mosseri]

That's.

[Host 1]

That's why it's a. At the top of the comment.

[Adam Mosseri]

Exactly.

[Host 1]

Well, I mean, guys in the tech world have become obsessed with taste. This was like its own kind of meme for a second there as like the last humanizing differentiator in an AI driven, algorithm driven world.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yes.

[Host 1]

And Instagram has definitely democratized access and helped tear down gatekeeping. Do you think in any way it's flattened taste at all?

[Adam Mosseri]

I don't know that I would say flattened, but I do get that there's pressures in both directions. Right. Because it's. I do think that a world in which anyone with a really interesting idea or great taste can find an audience is. Is better than one where you. Everything gets funneled through a handful of gatekeepers that own whatever the main. Three magazines 50 years ago.

[Host 2]

Totally.

[Adam Mosseri]

But the flip side is it's just really noisy. There's just so much noise. There's so much. And like, it's hard sometimes to find the signal. And I, I feel that.

[Host 1]

Okay, how is Instagram, like, I mean, how are you guys, like, fighting against or combating the slopification culture?

[Host 2]

Yeah. Amplifying that signal you're talking about.

[Host 1]

Right?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. I mean, I think the thing is, so, like, when on the. So we want to help you find content that you're excited about. Right. Not just that you watch. And so we look at things like, we have this thing called worth your time. So we ask, I think tens of thousands of people a day, was this worth your time? And we look at the answer and we try to move those scores up, up versus down. We look at stuff that you actually send to a friend. Now, you might send slop to your friend, but you look at this.

[Host 2]

Hey, look at this slop.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, right. But like, generally speaking, people more likely to send something to a friend that they actually thought was worth their time, right? So we try to optimize for things that aren't that. That have meaning to people. That doesn't mean it has to be heavy. Meaning it could just be like, here's a good laugh, but that they actually feel good about having spent time on our sending to a friend. But we can't really know at scale, like, this is slop and that's not

[Host 1]

slop, because there's no slop factor.

[Adam Mosseri]

There's no slop.

[Host 2]

Slop.

[Adam Mosseri]

Well, like, what slop to you might not be slop to me.

[Host 2]

Oh, slop is in the eye of the beholder.

[Host 1]

Is it slop or does it slap?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, there it is. There it is.

[Host 1]

Yeah, That's a free one.

[Adam Mosseri]

That's free. I appreciate that. I'm going to take that. That'll be the new survey, please. Yeah, it's like, is it slop or it is it does it slap?

[Host 1]

And you're like.

[Adam Mosseri]

And maybe you hit it and it gives a little.

[Host 2]

Yep. Oh, totally.

[Host 1]

You have to slap it.

[Host 2]

Nice little binary.

[Host 1]

You're going to say that in real. And people like, yo, dude, Claude, right?

[Adam Mosseri]

This AI asks M Dash.

[Host 2]

Damn, dude. Yo, what's AN doing right now, bro?

[Host 1]

Is it slop, M Dash, or does it slap?

[Adam Mosseri]

Exactly.

[Host 2]

No.

[Host 1]

Why there so many M Dashes in M in AI writing?

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

I don't know. Probably because it's in the training area. But I'm bummed about it because I actually have always been a big fan. And now I'm like, now I can't do it. Because now I'm like, they're going to think it's AI. I gotta edit that out.

[Host 2]

Damn.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's true. I was like. I thought it was a very useful form of punctuation.

[Host 1]

That's like, looked cool. It looks like you knew what you're talking.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 2]

Oh, this is a smart thing to use now.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's like. It's like, oh, no, that is.

[Host 2]

That is.

[Adam Mosseri]

That is Gemini.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Okay. We mentioned Kartik. What other brand? And we mentioned Percival and Scott Frazier. What other brands are you Fucking with right now, Adam.

[Adam Mosseri]

Ooh. Those are three that are really high on my list right now. I, I, she blew up, but I was, I was, I got lucky that I was really deep on Bodhi early. I have way too many Bodhi shirts. They're all really short, though. I feel like I gotta, like, you

[Host 2]

can sell them on grilled.

[Host 1]

It's fine.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, it's a good idea. Those are probably the top four. Let me think about my closet. Kartik.

[Host 1]

Kartik, you love an embroidered shirt.

[Adam Mosseri]

You do.

[Host 2]

Hearing you love a bedazzlement.

[Adam Mosseri]

Well, I had to back off a little bit on that because I got some of these Bodie shirts that I'm like, I don't think I can pull off.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's like, I'm not. I'm in my 40s.

[Host 1]

I'm, like, racial as a young man's game.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host 1]

Also, like, we talked about this with Jonah Hills on the pod, and he's like, you know, you walk into the party with a body shirt, you're the guy.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host 1]

There's no.

[Host 2]

He's not wrong, right?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, he's not, but.

[Host 1]

And at this point, you might see a guy in the same shirt, and

[Host 2]

you're like, like, it's supposed to be one on one. What the hell?

[Adam Mosseri]

I know. But sometimes, like, now, like, one of my favorite knits is, like, a big, oversized sweater from her that I love. And you, you'd have no idea that it's boating. And I always get people who are like, where's. That's, you know, that's a sick sweater. And I never tell where it's from. Right, right, right. But yeah, if you with one of the quintessential shirts, it's too much of a look now with, like, it's a little hot in the streets, pwk kind of style.

[Host 1]

What else?

[Adam Mosseri]

I don't know. I should think about this more.

[Host 1]

And is brown, like the general?

[Host 2]

You're an Earth guy.

[Adam Mosseri]

No, no, no. I like to mix it up. My favorite color by far is green.

[Host 1]

You and me both, brother.

[Adam Mosseri]

There you go.

[Host 1]

Nice.

[Adam Mosseri]

I have probably too many pairs of green pants. Fence the Riddler over here. What am I, what am I wearing lately? I should know. I should have thought about this beforehand.

[Host 2]

It's okay. You only came on throwing.

[Host 1]

I was just.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's the summer now, so I feel like I just have, like, basically so I don't have to think. I have a. I have, like, three or four pairs of oversized linen pants, and I have a bunch of shirts that are basically this. In different colors, and I just can just rearrange them and look like I'm wearing something different.

[Host 1]

Right. Not really an issue in the Bay Area, but what's your stance on shorts in the workplace?

[Adam Mosseri]

Ooh, okay, so this is a hotel hot debate at Instagram.

[Host 1]

Like, at the office or, like, on the platform?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, in the office.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

There's like, a big debate.

[Host 2]

Oh, here we go. Goss. I.

[Host 1]

Actually, you should do a poll.

[Adam Mosseri]

I'm pro. I'm pro.

[Host 1]

Really?

[Adam Mosseri]

But. But not everyone can pull them off.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

And not all shorts are created equal.

[Host 2]

Okay. Yeah, I detect no lies there. Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

So that's. But I. You know, but. But. But I am pro. I'm definitely pro. But I.

[Host 2]

It.

[Adam Mosseri]

But when it hits, it hits.

[Host 2]

Sure.

[Adam Mosseri]

But when it misses, you're sent home

[Host 2]

and you have to change.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Yeah. Like you should be.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

A little too much scraggly man thigh. Yo, does the IG office dress better than the Facebook office? Dress better than The Met? The WhatsApp office? Who's of the meta.

[Host 2]

Yeah. Who's taking the crown?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, no, we. We. We dress better. The. You know, different strokes for different folks. But we share office space usually. But, like.

[Host 2]

So you're mogging all day, you guys.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, I. I mean, I. So, I mean, when I first joined Instagram, I was like, oh, man, I kind of need up my game a little bit. So not everybody, but on average. Yeah.

[Host 1]

What's your. What's your preferred snack in the office? Because you guys got. Yeah, we've heard choices.

[Host 2]

Heard about some snacks.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, I'm boring on the. I'm really. I'm. I'm just obnoxiously healthy. It really pisses my wife off. I eat, like, Greek yogurt.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

When I'm here, there's a. There's a. A. There's a ice cream gelato bar, which

[Host 1]

is in the office.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, I think we.

[Host 1]

What flavor?

[Adam Mosseri]

I'm all about black sesame.

[Host 2]

Oh, that's a. That's a great pick.

[Adam Mosseri]

But normally I'm just, like. I'm just eating simple salad and Greek yogurt. I'm really very.

[Host 1]

Did you become really healthy?

[Host 2]

Coffee.

[Adam Mosseri]

A lot of coffee.

[Host 2]

Wait, how much. How many coffees you drink a day?

[Adam Mosseri]

I try to keep it under five.

[Host 1]

Five, bro.

[Host 2]

Come on, man.

[Host 1]

What's the last. When's the last cup of coffee?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, I won't. I won't have one after four or

[Host 2]

you might have a problem.

[Adam Mosseri]

I might. Yeah.

[Host 1]

Did you become really healthy because when you moved because of like the Bay Area californification of everything. Or that because you started, like, getting. That's just where the tech world moved.

[Adam Mosseri]

Neither. I. For me, it was the job got. Look, I don't want to complain. I'm very lucky to have my job. I, for now, appreciate my job. For now.

[Host 1]

They haven't heard this yet.

[Host 2]

This hasn't dropped. You're.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's like, you know, it had a good run.

[Host 2]

Yeah. What a way to go.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Yeah. This is how it goes. It just was. It gets. It's got so stressful that I started to really have to dial in things like my sleep and my eating. And now stopping smoking because I couldn't show up at work or at home, for that matter, with my kids, the way I wanted to, because I was. You know, if you underslept, you're eating, you're not exercising, and you're overworked, worked, you're short. And so. And I want to be short with anyone at work. People freak out sometimes when I say things at work now. And I definitely want to be sure with my kids in the morning. I want to get home at night. So it was really a way to compensate for. For a way to make sure that I could show up the way I wanted to show up, both at home and at work.

[Host 1]

You are a cool guy.

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I appreciate.

[Host 1]

Have you already started scheming on your Met Gala fit for 2027?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, no, but I. I always try to find somebody's. I've only once I've gone with a big designer every other time I try to find someone small.

[Host 1]

Who's the big guy?

[Adam Mosseri]

I did Louis Vuitton for the Black Dandy Year. Because it's for sure.

[Host 1]

Of course. Yeah.

[Host 2]

Yeah. He was the chair.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. But I did Grace Wells Bonner. She was rad. Years ago.

[Host 1]

You could do Hermes now.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

She's her menswear.

[Adam Mosseri]

I'm pretty. It's not. She's not. It's not dropping to January. Yeah, actually, that's before.

[Host 2]

Yeah. It's gonna be good for her.

[Adam Mosseri]

Curious to see that.

[Host 2]

Yeah. Because she's amazing.

[Adam Mosseri]

Great hire, actually. Did bodies like five, six, seven years ago.

[Host 2]

Wait, how many meals have you gone to, bro? God damn.

[Adam Mosseri]

Six or seven, bro. I don't know. Six, seven.

[Host 1]

Are they fun or are they just like. It's work.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's work. I mean. I mean, it is fun. It's an amazing event. I don't want to, like, say otherwise, but, like. But I'm working.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

I'm trying to figure out, you know, how do I make the most of the time? You know, I. Look, I think too often people in my industry, because we got big so fast, don't understand how important showing up is. Don't. Don't understand how important relationships are. Don't understand how important FaceTime is. And so for me, it's like, all right, like, who should I. Who should I be talking to? Who do I need to clarify things with? Who should I be hearing feedback from? So I'm. I'm working.

[Host 1]

All right. Yeah. Also, like, you posting backstage stuff. You doing bathroom selfies.

[Adam Mosseri]

No. You get in trouble for that, man.

[Host 1]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Kylie. What? Okay. What is the one piece of clothes? Oh, so. So you. You haven'. That's scheme been scheming on the fit?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I. I didn't even think I should think about it now because I should try to find, if you have a recommendation, someone small.

[Host 1]

I mean, we don't know. We don't know what the theme is, right?

[Host 2]

Yeah, that's true.

[Host 1]

It's probably some.

[Adam Mosseri]

What's like. Yeah, I should. I should know. I don't know what it is.

[Host 2]

It's gonna be AI.

[Adam Mosseri]

What about. Actually, you know, another designer I like. I don't think I have anything from him, but I think he's cool. What's his name? SS Daily.

[Host 2]

Nicholas Daily. He was on the show.

[Host 1]

He here a few days, a few weeks.

[Adam Mosseri]

I really like his style, but he's based in London.

[Host 2]

Uk.

[Adam Mosseri]

Uk, Not London. I gotta find something close. I don't know. I look, I just reach out. I try to find something small. I always am like, do you want me to. Do you want to. Do you want me to buy it or do you want to me to not buy it? Some designers want to have it and some designers, like, need the money. I'm like, I'm happy either way.

[Host 1]

I don't know what. I don't know if Instagram is, like, profitable yet or anything, but if you want some cons, some menswear consultants, we're open for business.

[Adam Mosseri]

I'm sure I could. I'm sure I could use it. I'm sure I could use it.

[Host 1]

No, no, no, no. But just in terms of, you know,

[Host 2]

like, maybe we'll connect you with some friends that could. Probably would love the opportunity. I'm sure that's what.

[Adam Mosseri]

Look, I mean, let's be real. No, nobody really cares what I'm wearing. It's about these big names there. But still, if I can wear something from someone small who's actually excited about it, that's just the cool thing to do. Plus if I can give them some business and I can actually, you know, as a result, I own like three suits and seven tuxes, which is a very weird thing, but it's like I would rather support the business.

[Host 1]

Sure.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Plus, I'm. Should they be stoked to have a guy with 3,3 million followers?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, yeah. I don't know. Yeah.

[Host 2]

You don't know. Come on.

[Host 1]

3.2.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's in.

[Host 1]

It's.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's under four.

[Host 1]

Under four.

[Adam Mosseri]

I think I'm close to four.

[Host 1]

Let's get those. Maybe. Maybe we can give you a little pose, help you. Yeah. Clear that, that 4 hurdle.

[Host 2]

You currently have 3.9 million followers.

[Adam Mosseri]

Close. Close.

[Host 1]

So close.

[Adam Mosseri]

I was on. I was.

[Host 1]

Are you going to celebrate at 4?

[Host 2]

Pop a bottle on live. You're gonna go live.

[Host 1]

You got a. You got a champagne bottle in the fridge.

[Host 2]

It's just.

[Adam Mosseri]

Thank everybody.

[Host 2]

Yeah, yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Just thank everybody. Yeah, dude, no, just not throwing fits

[Host 2]

is going to get you to four or five.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's not a really good look for me to do that now.

[Host 1]

Yeah. Stay humble, Adam. Wait, speaking of which, what is the one piece of clothing that you find yourself wearing the most? Maybe it's just old. Maybe it fits you great. Maybe it has sentimental value.

[Adam Mosseri]

What do I.

[Host 1]

And you can't see like CDLP underwear.

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I mean I like, I. I have this. Sometimes you find a really good, good vintage tea for something that you loved as like a teenager. Yeah, so I have a couple of those.

[Host 1]

What are they?

[Adam Mosseri]

I have like a Zeppelin tea that's probably from the 80s or 90s that I just love.

[Host 1]

Is it from. Do you buy it vintage or it's from your youth?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, no, I wish it was from my youth. I bought it. I just bought it on ebay.

[Host 2]

You can name five songs if we tested you. Zeppelin.

[Adam Mosseri]

You're a fan? Yes, but I don't.

[Host 2]

Okay, all right, never mind. Scratch that.

[Adam Mosseri]

Well, actually it's reminding me of like my brother is a musician and he was, he was a. He was. He was playing at those restaurant. I was, I was a boy eater at. I was like 16, he's like 14. And this guy was like, do you like Zeppelin? He's like, yeah. He's like, I'll give you a 20 spot for every Zeppelin song you could play.

[Host 1]

Wow.

[Adam Mosseri]

And he didn't realize that my 14 year old brother.

[Host 2]

Oh, dude.

[Adam Mosseri]

Just can just think of a song. So I think he paid a meal like 365.

[Host 2]

Wow. Dude. He got fleeced.

[Adam Mosseri]

But he. To Be fair. I was impressed. At 16, I was like, keep pulling it up. Yeah, he's like.

[Host 1]

He's like.

[Adam Mosseri]

He ponied up.

[Host 1]

That's kind of tough. Like, pay. Because all the songs are, like, five minutes long.

[Host 2]

I would pick.

[Host 1]

You got to pick the short ones.

[Host 2]

I think it would just be.

[Adam Mosseri]

Do it a minute. Be like, look, I know. Does that count?

[Host 1]

Oh, you do. Like, he did a medley Police.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Oh, my God.

[Adam Mosseri]

So good.

[Host 1]

Adam, how much money do you make?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, they pay me very well.

[Host 1]

Do you get paid off your reels?

[Adam Mosseri]

No.

[Host 2]

You're not monetized on the platform, you fool. That's double called double dipping, dog.

[Adam Mosseri]

One time this thing happened where, like, you know, we have this thing, like, gifts. So you can, like. You can, like, you know, tip, basically. And, like, I don't know how it got turned on for my account by mistake, but they're like. They're like. There's like. Here's like, oh, by mistake.

[Host 2]

Totally.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. Here's like, 4.34. Who's tipping me?

[Host 2]

Did you cash it out?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I was like, undo this. So twisted.

[Host 2]

Damn.

[Adam Mosseri]

Not allowed. Definitely not allowed. No, no, no. And I. If I. If I mention brands or anything like that, there's no kickbacks. Just trying to share the love. Love.

[Host 1]

Would you not be allowed to turn on monetization of your content?

[Adam Mosseri]

I hope not. I don't think so.

[Host 1]

Let's get. Let's get the ethics community.

[Adam Mosseri]

Massive conflict of interest.

[Host 1]

Okay, what is. What's a dumb purchase that you've made recently?

[Adam Mosseri]

Ooh, dumb purchases. Do I make? I make. I'm more like. I make fewer purchases, but they're a little bit more intentful. I'm trying to think if it's, like, a dumb one lately, like, buyers and

[Host 1]

more is kicked in.

[Host 2]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Host 1]

Maybe immediately.

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I don't have one recently. What did I buy recently? Everything I bought recently is like, I bought a couple pair of pants for the summer. I love that I bought. I mean, mostly I'm buying. Mostly it's not that interesting, man. Mostly I'm buying, like, it's like, you know, Blaze lost his, like, baseball cup, and he's got a game tomorrow. Like, my. I'm a lot of Amazon. A lot of Amazon.

[Host 2]

Are you buying anything off ig? You ever get, like, okay, you.

[Adam Mosseri]

I actually bought. I get actually more of a parenting ad. There's this, like, silent indoor soccer ball. So, like, actually, I'm gonna regret this. So it's like, for, you know, my kids play soccer a lot, and so, you know, they're really into the World Cup. It's been pretty fun and. But there's a ball that you use real quick.

[Host 1]

Argentina.

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, I'm gonna. I'm definitely rooting for Spain.

[Host 2]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

Especially after yesterday. I didn't like how yesterday went down.

[Host 2]

A lot of us did it.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah. That was rough.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

I still think. I mean, to be fair, I think Messi is the goat. I don't. I don't think that's the question.

[Host 1]

But Messi has the. I think of the most liked Instagram post of all time. I think he has, like, six or seven of them.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Host 2]

The sleeping with the World cup in bed at four years ago. That one is big.

[Adam Mosseri]

This stuff is huge.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

I was psyched about the Capo Verde goalie. He is, like, 20.

[Host 1]

Oh, yeah.

[Host 2]

He went crazy.

[Adam Mosseri]

He has, like, 29 million followers.

[Host 2]

That's.

[Host 1]

That's. He started with, like, what, 40,000 or something?

[Adam Mosseri]

Like, they're only 500,000 people in capo Verde, which, by the way, they have tied both finalists.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

In this tournament. So they did not lose. They should just get third place.

[Host 2]

Yeah. Or did you see it with the goalie? The funny thing, too, was, like, on the flip side, he unfollowed, like, he blew up and he unfollowed, like, four people.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Right?

[Host 2]

You.

[Host 1]

Lucky for him, Instagram is the number one dating app in the world.

[Adam Mosseri]

That is. I think he's gonna do just fine.

[Host 1]

Yeah, he is.

[Adam Mosseri]

Honestly, that was such an amazing.

[Host 2]

He's unreal.

[Adam Mosseri]

I was kind of negative in this 48 team thing, but that's kind of the reason for it, is to have someone like them.

[Host 2]

They wouldn't have the opportunity.

[Host 1]

Was that. Was that the biggest IG win of the whole World cup tourney?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

We saw the final to go and, like.

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I think that was the. I think that for me, that was the biggest win. I mean, there's a lot of. I mean, it's been actually on the fashion side, there's been some crazy. There's like the. The Congo guys with the leopards.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's been, like, a whole bunch of cool fashion stuff going on. Holland with all of his Birkins. What is going on?

[Host 1]

So that's, like, from like, a famous, like, Dallas Western wear.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, he went to that.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

He posted about in Dallas where, like, he's wearing a hat.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Trying on all the southern gear.

[Host 2]

Oh, that got memed on tf.

[Host 1]

Don't worry.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, yeah. Good. But I just. I just thought the Capo Verde guys that was the.

[Host 2]

Or the picture now of Messi with Yamal as the baby. Like, yeah, I've seen that on IG a thousand times.

[Adam Mosseri]

I know that has to be it.

[Host 1]

To level the playing field.

[Host 2]

That's real.

[Host 1]

That level the playing field. Messi has to show meat.

[Host 2]

Yeah, that's right. Yeah.

[Host 1]

On Sunday. Yeah. Just so.

[Host 2]

Yeah, it's only fair.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's only fair.

[Host 2]

Meat for meat.

[Host 1]

Wait, so what's up with this indoor soccer ball that's gonna ruin your life?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, so it's basically doesn't make noise. It's, like, soft. And so the guys, the kids, the boys can dribble inside and practice without making noise. But they're just. Now that I said it out loud, I'm like, oh, it still can, like, break.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

It's still gonna knock over a lamp that my wife gets really upset about.

[Host 1]

It's like a new element that was invented that is completely silent gravity.

[Adam Mosseri]

I bought it on Instagram yesterday.

[Host 1]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

Probably be at home by the time I get there. And now I'm realizing that, yep, I hadn't.

[Host 2]

Well done.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

No, no, babe. This is made of vibranium. It absorbs all energy for good. Is there anything you refuse to spend a lot of money on that you're like. Even as a man of means, you're still a cheap ass about?

[Adam Mosseri]

Probably. What do I refuse to spend a lot of money on?

[Host 1]

Soccer balls.

[Adam Mosseri]

No.

[Host 2]

That make noise.

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, man. I took my kids to a game, and they were like, they all wanted the FIFA boss. I was like, these things are, like, 200.

[Host 2]

Oh, damn.

[Host 1]

What game do you go to?

[Adam Mosseri]

I went to Norway. Brazil.

[Host 2]

Oh, banger.

[Adam Mosseri]

Dude, did you row? I definitely did. What a great, great chance. I don't even call it a chant. Here's one thing. So I'm. I'll spend a lot of money on? Coffee.

[Host 2]

I'm.

[Adam Mosseri]

I drink a lot of coffee. I make a lot of coffee.

[Host 2]

Yeah, we're aware.

[Adam Mosseri]

I'm a coffee.

[Host 1]

Are you a Phil's guy?

[Adam Mosseri]

No.

[Host 1]

Four barrel.

[Adam Mosseri]

No. But here's the thing is, like, if I feel like it depends on the four barrel or the, like, cafe. Like, if I feel like I can make a better coffee at home, then I won't go.

[Host 1]

What's your home setup?

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

What's your brew station looking like at the crib?

[Adam Mosseri]

So there's two sides.

[Host 2]

There's the command center.

[Adam Mosseri]

The command center. If it's pour over, I'm a big fan of this thing. I love pour over because you can go crazy for, like, $40 there's this thing called a Hario switch.

[Host 1]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

So it's both immersion and percolation. I won't nerd out any more than that, but it's a rad device. You can buy it on Amazon for 45 bucks and just, you know, standard pour over. And then for espresso, I have a La Micro Marzocco and a P64 are different.

[Host 1]

The craziest, nerdiest thing I've ever seen and maybe you're familiar with this or maybe I'm putting you onto game is that there's some sort of coffee creating machine that is like plugged into some sort of like network where other like coffee enthusiasts like talk about their like grind time and water temperature and bean and.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

And you can then like select a user preset and like add to the neural hive mind or something for coffee. You know what I'm talking about.

[Adam Mosseri]

I've heard about these things. I'm not, I don't have. I don't, I don't know of one specifically, but I've definitely heard about it. I just go deep either in reels or YouTube on like some crazy nerd rant about how to make the best shot.

[Host 1]

What's the most you've ever spent on a single coffee drink?

[Adam Mosseri]

New York is tough. Like if you want to pour over a nice place, it's like 11, which seems insane, but.

[Host 1]

You ever been to Japan and got like the 70, like the beans that are that some like Marsupial 8 and shout out?

[Adam Mosseri]

No, I have spent nutty. I've spent 45 on like a bag of coffee, but like 100 grams. Like a little bag.

[Host 2]

Right, right.

[Host 1]

Okay.

[Adam Mosseri]

Or 150 grams but different type of gram. No, but I probably, I mean honestly, for that kind of stuff, I feel like it's good.

[Host 2]

Good.

[Adam Mosseri]

Look, if you're lucky enough to be able to afford it, it's good to do it once and to see.

[Host 2]

Yeah. Just to see what the.

[Adam Mosseri]

Try the. Try the $30 strawberry. Is it really blow your mind or is it just a delicious strawberry and

[Host 1]

then have the pure ecstasy.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

See if what they're doing in Colombia.

[Adam Mosseri]

I just think anything. I think. Yeah.

[Host 2]

Just one time, you know, just, just for research.

[Host 1]

Just to see like what.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

What the standard is.

[Adam Mosseri]

I like to. I love talking about the top of their game. Like so if you are the very best, it doesn't matter what it is. Like I'm interested podcasting et y the very best podcaster. You make the best table, you make the best coffee. Pour over you make the best, you know, fish. Like I'm interested.

[Host 1]

What are the other hobbies or like interests or niches that you've like really nerded out over coffee's one coffee Fashion, soccer.

[Adam Mosseri]

Coffee, Soccer, fashion. Health stuff.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

To go real deep on the health stuff.

[Host 1]

What's the craziest like most woo. Woo. You, you've yeah.

[Host 2]

You've tried out some Brian Johnson style blood transfusion from your sir whatever.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, no, no, not quite that level of woo do. I did build an app. I have a health app that I built. So I basically this was like a, an idea from a book I read where you like said these are the goals, these are things you want to be able to do. If you make it to 90 or 100, like put your bag in your overhead bin without asking so then how much do you need to overhead press now and then like you just build your workout routine based on those long

[Host 1]

term goals and one of them is putting a bag and yeah, I want

[Adam Mosseri]

to be able to travel without asking someone.

[Host 1]

We're going to be flying private 1.

[Adam Mosseri]

Talking about another one is my wife is a Disney adult adult and she makes me go to Disneyland every year.

[Host 2]

It's a lot of steps.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, it's a lot of steps. So can I at 80 years old, can I do 20000 steps around Disneyland with my grandkids?

[Host 2]

Claude says get divorced now. Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yes.

[Host 2]

Save yourself the trouble.

[Adam Mosseri]

I probably would be the one who said that.

[Host 1]

At 80 years old can you do the drinking around the world?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Is that 12 drinks? 15. It's a lot, not never enough.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, but that's like pretty silly ridiculous

[Host 1]

stuff because they all look disgusting. Do you have any last question Adam, before we get you out of here? We know you got, you're a busy man, you got a billion user platform to run. Do you have any constructive criticism you would like to give throwing fits?

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, I mean I would love to know from you guys. I'd love feedback both on the platform but also I mean I would love your feedback on my fits. I mean. Oh yeah, it's always good to like.

[Host 2]

No, but we want constructive criticism from

[Adam Mosseri]

you know I was hoping to go the other way.

[Host 2]

No, no, that's not how it works.

[Host 1]

We'll do that too.

[Adam Mosseri]

But yeah, no, I think like I, I think you guys are doing a lot of things right. Like I said, it's if you look at who follows you, I think that's kind of if you know, you know which is what you want. Want.

[Host 1]

I'm curious who Those people are.

[Adam Mosseri]

That is like, I love you.

[Host 1]

Don't say. But I'm just.

[Host 2]

These burner accounts from Jacob Elordi.

[Adam Mosseri]

Yeah, exactly. You know, I like that you've got. I mean, it's this mirror where you take those pictures, right?

[Host 2]

That's our thing.

[Host 1]

That's our IG moment.

[Adam Mosseri]

I think having your thing is.

[Host 2]

Used to be a rooftop. Now it's this.

[Adam Mosseri]

And then, like, a lot of people don't realize that, but then I know it's you. I build up that sort of inequity. I feel the positive affiliation. I don't know. I'll take another look. I'll take another.

[Host 2]

We'd love that.

[Adam Mosseri]

But I. I've been. I mean, I've been following you guys. I've been following. Throwing fits for a while.

[Host 2]

Thank you.

[Adam Mosseri]

Thank you.

[Host 2]

We just want to get on that juice list. That's all.

[Adam Mosseri]

We want to throw our hat in the right are. You know, there's a boost button.

[Host 1]

All right, Adam, one last question.

[Host 2]

Sorry. Do you know who's playing you in the social reckoning?

[Adam Mosseri]

I. I hope I'm not in it.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

I do not know.

[Host 2]

I mean, listen, hopefully somebody 40, maybe Jake. That would be 63.

[Adam Mosseri]

That would be. He's got to be more than 63.

[Host 2]

He's 64.

[Adam Mosseri]

They always glow up everybody. So I'm sure they would make it a much more handsome, tall, fashionable person. Because everybody. I feel like that's what Hollywood does. They just find, like the best possible.

[Host 2]

It's Hollywood.

[Host 1]

So I think it's gonna be a lordy.

[Host 2]

They're not gonna make you uglier ed. Shorter.

[Adam Mosseri]

They might.

[Host 2]

Oh, I mean, actually, that'll be. Yeah. A creative choice.

[Adam Mosseri]

We'll say.

[Host 2]

We'll say it's a lordy for now until we're another one.

[Adam Mosseri]

I would be very flattered.

[Host 1]

Adam, is there anything you would like to plug?

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

Or where can the kids end? Or where can the kids follow you on Instagram?

[Adam Mosseri]

Oh, just most area, but I think plug just.

[Host 1]

I don't know, Instagram.com.

[Adam Mosseri]

yeah, no, I would.

[Host 2]

Have you heard of it?

[Adam Mosseri]

If you're using Instagram time. I would just go back to the thing I said before. Go back. If you're trying to grow your reach, you're trying to grow a following, that's great. But why? What are you trying to do? And don't lose sight of that. It. It's better to have a smaller following and less reach that actually helps you achieve your goal than just chase the numbers and then lose sight of why. You're there in the first place.

[Host 1]

Bars.

[Adam Mosseri]

It also will honestly, I think it tends you end up being more successful over the long run because it's more sustainable and it just, it's more valuable able. So don't. I know it's easy for me to say. I'm sure I'm going to get a

[Host 1]

bunch 3.9 over here. Yeah.

[Adam Mosseri]

But just like think long. Think long term.

[Host 1]

Think long.

[Host 2]

Yeah.

[Host 1]

All right, you heard it here first. Think long and hard. For coming onto the only podcast matters Chef, take us out.