← Totally Booked with Zibby
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- [00:01]
Host
Welcome to Totally Booked.
- [00:03]
Zibby Owens
I'm Zibby Owens. I've interviewed more than 2,000 authors on this show and learned endless amounts about
- [00:09]
Host
storytelling, reinvention and life itself. Because when you talk about books, you're really talking about life. So get ready to hear from today's
- [00:17]
Zibby Owens
best authors, the best selling and the not yet discovered. Come find your next great read and the story behind it. Enjoy. Daniel Silva is the author of a novel. Daniel is an award winning, number one New York Times best selling author. He has written 29 novels and is best known for his Gabriel Allen series. His books are critically acclaimed and have been translated into more than 30 languages. Before ransom, his most recent work was An Inside Job, which was another instant number one New York Times bestseller. Enjoy our conversation.
- [00:50]
Host
Welcome Daniel, thank you so much for coming on Totally Booked to talk about Ransom. Congratulations.
- [00:56]
Daniel Silva
Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. What a pleasure.
- [00:58]
Zibby Owens
Well, pleasure's all mine.
- [01:00]
Host
I have to start by just commenting on all the importance you gave to your wife in all, in every piece of your bio, your book. I mean, it's amazing. You and Jamie must have like the best marriage ever is all I have to say.
- [01:19]
Daniel Silva
We do have a good marriage and it has somehow survived 29 books. So she's my, she's my primary editor and you know, the way I go about it and is that, you know, I write a sort of a overly long first draft. Now my first draft is actually sort of like a very long outline. So then we take this very big piece of stack of paper and we, I read it aloud to her and she has a stack and I have a stack and we edit it aloud and take the best of what's in there and recraft here and there. But, but she's my primary editor and look, there's art and books are passionate things and so we get it. She always wins, by the way. I never prevail in a showdown about anything that's in the book. But. Excuse me, she's just a professional journalist, very savvy person, smart person. She's really become a good editor.
- [02:22]
Host
Oh, that's amazing. Well, now it makes sense. I found myself thinking is, is she writing all of this copy for him? Is she writing the website and everything? And it was funny, but no, but
- [02:36]
Daniel Silva
she does supervise and handle that aspect of it for me. She acts as my agent as well and business manager. So yeah, I mean, if you hold up that cover again, I mean, she had a big role in designing that cover. Actually that one is hers.
- [02:58]
Host
This cover is beautiful by the way the whole book took us to so many places, which was really phenomenal. Ibiza to UK to Denmark. I mean, just really Russia. Very interesting. And transported me everywhere, which is really amazing. Also, I know I started with you and your wife, but we do have a couple at the center of this narrative as well, I guess you could say two couples. The one in which the wife goes missing, one in which they're charged with finding said wife.
- [03:30]
Daniel Silva
Yeah.
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Host
Why don't you share with listeners what this novel is about? And this is your 28th or 29th? 29th.
- [03:39]
Daniel Silva
26th in the Elan series. And as you pointed out, as this one opens, Gabriel somewhat reluctantly agrees to track down a very prominent missing British socialite, this dazzling beautiful woman named Alice Winter. And one thing leads to another, as is often the case in a Gabriel Law novel. And he discovers that Alice has a very dangerous secret. And that is a secret that's going to force him to find his way back to a life that he thought he had left behind. It is a fast paced, entertaining page turner. It's sort of part of kidnap drama, part international thriller. Mainly it's just a lot of fun. It's got a big, big ending, a shocking twist at the end. It's just the perfect book to take to the pool or the beach summer. And it's written. Let me just ask. It's written in a, in an elegant fashion but it's very, very readable and fast, I think. And I hope that you agree. It just, I, I found that this one moves like the wind. My, my son in law who's a really busy banker at Morgan's family sat and read it in two sittings the other night last weekend. It really, it goes by, it's a, it's a gulpable book.
- [05:00]
Host
I would agree with that. A gulpable book is a great way to say it. I was flipping pages very quickly. It opens with four women from Cambridge who go on a girls trip that goes horribly awry. First Phoebe leaves early, then Alice goes missing, which we don't find out till later. A little bit later. You set it up so it's like the height of relaxation and then quickly goes into a very dark narrative where we are following different threads and finding out what, what really happens, which we find out a little bit sort of in the middle of, of the book. We, we've actually. I won't give anything away but talk a little bit about your process. When you are trying to make these twists and turns and involve all the elements, you know, at your fingertips. How do you decide, like, when am I going to reveal this? When am I going to reveal that? And what does that do to the reader?
- [05:58]
Daniel Silva
You know, I, I, I used to say that I didn't have a process, but when I get asked that question all the time, you know, I, I don't have a process.
- [06:08]
Host
I'm sorry, I'm sorry. I hate questions people ask all the time.
- [06:11]
Daniel Silva
No, I'm going, I'm going to. And I've discovered very late in my career that, that I really do have a process. And I don't start with a blank page, you know, but, but I, like, I see maybe about that much, but if it's an arc like this, I see 100 pages or so of what's going on, and I get to work as quickly as I can. I mean, typically, I start the new book the day after I finish the old one, in part because I'm very uncomfortable when I'm not writing every day. But second, it's the only way I can get the previous book out of my head. I'll sit and fiddle with it to the very end. And I get going very quickly. And in the process of working through those first few chapters, I generally sort of see everything that's going to come. That first chapter of those four Women on Holiday. Everything is foretold in those pages, if you look back at it. And there's a lot of weight in that sequence at the beginning, seems like. And there's a lot of baggage between the four women, too, as it turns out. And so what I try to do is I have a, as I said in the beginning, you know, a contiguous book that's maybe a tiny bit overwritten, but that's okay. It's much easier to edit down than it is to edit up. So we edit down, down, down. I do some recasting and rewriting here and there. I have some new material that inevitably finds its way into the book in the rewrites. But look, at a certain point, you know, I write the way I write, I think the way I think, and it does, you know, I do go on instinct a lot, and I think most writers do.
- [07:55]
Host
Well, you've had time to really get to know Gabriel after all. But I appreciate that even now, you're still explaining to us, the reader, what exactly is involved in art restoration, because that is fascinating, bar none. That is what he does. And when he's not, you know, a
- [08:14]
Daniel Silva
former, you know, I do feel like I need to, to at least, you know, even though my fans, you know, have a basic sense of what's going on. To give a little bit of a primer on what it means to restore a painting. You know, it means to take off all the dirt and junk, all the previous restorations, take it down to its truest state and build it back up again. And most 4 and 500 year old works of art, which is, Gabriel specializes in that field, they're pretty damaged. So. And you have to paint the way if you're working on a Titian, you have to have Titian's brush strokes. If you're doing a Tintoretto, you have to paint like Tintoretto. If you're doing Veronese, you have to paint like Veronese. So he's very skilled and he is, you know, probably the, as I say, probably, you know, the best art restorer in the world at this point. And as we've seen in some past books, he's a pretty good art forger as well. And most restore, most restorers are.
- [09:11]
Host
Have you ever taken like the actual pads and touched these famous works of art and to try it yourself,
- [09:19]
Daniel Silva
to try to. I have been allowed to, I show the process of him, the way you get the stuff off and I have been allowed to do that. I have never put a paintbrush to a, to a painting before. No. But you know, in studying the, the craft, I've had some exciting moments. I was, I was once able to hold the signature work of the National Gallery, Woman with the Parasol, the Monet. I was able to hold that in my hot little hands. I was actually once able to hold an actual Leonardo in my hands. Yeah, the Leonardo at the Vatican, the St. Jerome that's there. So, yeah, it's been fun. And Gabriel is sort of a, kind of a revered figure in the restoration community. A lot of art restorers read, read the series and for that reason, you know, I try to, try to get the details right.
- [10:14]
Host
I love that. Made me want to try my hand at it myself. But you also raise a really important issue, which is the lack of funding for some of the new exhibitions and restoration, all of it. And how places even like the National Gallery are relying on private donors to backstop the leaking funds, so to speak, especially in Britain.
- [10:38]
Daniel Silva
And anyone who follows the news that all, you know, knows that Great Britain's public finances are in disarray right now and the country, the politics of the country are in disarray. And when, when, when pennies are tight and, and budgets are tight, you know, the arts are always the first thing to go. And so it's it's sort of sad because they, you know, if you, as I said in the, in the author's note, I believe, you know, you had. They National Portrait Gallery. Their National Portrait Gallery had to raise a lot of money for a big restoration. So now it's covered with, in effect, naming rights and the names of donors are all over the exhibition rooms. And I don't think that's right. It's a shame. But it is what it is. It's where we are.
- [11:20]
Host
Well, we go from this very sort of genteel world of, of art and, you know, a quiet studio to towards the end, drones and attacks and how to manage that. And oh my gosh, I'm like, where am I going now? This is like quite a hold onto your seats type of book. Talk a little bit about that because obviously drone attacks and all of these new hybrid methods are quite in the news these days as well. And you managed to tie it all in very seamlessly.
- [11:55]
Daniel Silva
Look, everyone who reads my books know that I've been focused on the, on the threat from Russia, particularly as it plays out in a European setting for many, many books. And you know, a lot of people don't realize that Russia isn't only at war with, with Ukraine right now. Russia is waging a clandestine, secret shadow war against Western Europe. They want to destroy NATO. They want to destroy the, the liberal Western order. They view it as an existential threat to Russia. They want to destroy the global, the post war global order as we know it and replace it with one that is friendly to Russia. And you know, no one has been able to explicitly link the drones activities that have been taking place to Russia. But the Danes made it very clear that Russia was involved in it. And it just is something that I've been fascinated by and watch these series of attacks with rising alarm. And I got to write about this and this is the way to do it. I'm not going to say how we get from a kidnapped British socialite to a drone attack on London, but I hope it's as seamless as you said it was. I think that I did it very, very smoothly and made the transition throughout the book.
- [13:22]
Host
Indeed. I think so too. Okay.
- [13:24]
Zibby Owens
Yes.
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Host
And I won't give anything, anything away that leaves it, you know, throughout all of that.
- [13:31]
Zibby Owens
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- [14:30]
Host
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- [14:31]
Zibby Owens
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- [15:03]
Host
Do you ever worry, I mean, there were times in the book where Gabriel's kids were brought up and sort of very personal threats to him. Do you worry yourself as an author of this type of a book, you know, investigating countries and really scary stuff, to put it mildly, that you yourself could ever be embroiled in this world?
- [15:30]
Daniel Silva
That I could be targeted by Russia, you mean?
- [15:33]
Host
Yeah.
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Daniel Silva
You know, what if, if they would waste time going after someone like me, you know, then that means we're all very, a lot safer. That said, I would not go to Russia right now and I would not travel. Look, I am a Russian democracy activist, okay? I'm the first to admit that I oppose Vladimir Putin and everything he stands for. And I put myself in that position. So I love the time I've spent in Russia, but I would not go back right now. I don't think any really prominent American should be traveling in Russia right now. And I would sort of stay out of periphery states where their Russian intelligence is active. But then again, and that's just me looking after myself, I don't think that I have anything to worry. They have bigger problems right now. Some of the estimates that have come out of the Russian battlefield losses are just staggering. 750,000 dead. Things like these new numbers that are coming out and history doesn't bode well for Russian leaders who lose wars like this on this scale. So, as I say at the end of the author's note, I think that we need to start doing do unto others as they would do unto us, and that we ought to be trying to undermine him the way that he's trying to undermine the West. That would be what President Silva would do.
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Host
Interesting. Well, I mean, it's not too late.
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Daniel Silva
Yes, it is. Thank goodness.
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Host
I don't know. Never say never. There's sure ways to get involved. I also have to ask this tiny detail. Do you have a Range Rover? Because we have.
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Daniel Silva
I do not have a Range Rover. No, I do not.
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Host
Okay. No, put that one to bed then. When you write the same character for so many years, do you ever, like, do you ever have issues with Gabriel? Or do you ever say, like, gosh, I wish he wasn't acting this way, but I have to make sure he does this. Or like, do you and Gabriel as sort of people, even though Gabriel is not real, like, have differences of opinion? I know it sounds bizarre to say when it's your character, but sometimes these things happen.
- [17:58]
Daniel Silva
First of all, let me say that to me, he's extremely real. When I'm discussing the book with my wife, you refer to him by his name. You talk about him as though he's a real person. I'm intrigued by parallel universe theories. I think that I've given so much energy and thought to that somewhere out there, these characters live their lives and I sort of drop in on them every once in a while and eavesdrop on them and try to pick them up in mid sentence at the beginning of a book and start the next adventure. No, I don't have any differences of opinion, but the guy he is, you know, I have changed him. The character has evolved, he has changed. And the books have a lighter tone and a lighter cast to them. You probably didn't notice, but he never carries a gun in this book any longer. He's a different character than what he once was. And I love writing him. He has a wonderful sense of humor. He has. Obviously he's a restoring an artist. He has to great eyes. Okay. When you have a character with eyes like that and the way he see things, sees things differently, the way he looks at a scene and it turns into a painting in his thoughts, you know, like, he's just got a great pair of eyes. But the other thing is about the series that I would say is that the secret sauce is the people around him. I have a wonderful supporting cast of Characters that range from Prime Minister of United Kingdom is a friend, spies, the Pope is a friend of his. Those secondary and supporting characters are what make the series, in my opinion.
- [19:43]
Host
And you do sort of lightly poke fun at the social media divas of the world who are. Tell me what you really think about that.
- [19:54]
Daniel Silva
First of all, I am not allowed to post. I do not know how to log into my social media accounts. Everything gets. Jamie does that for me. Look, here's the, you know, you can sort of see what's going on behind me here. I, yes, I have computers in my office, but when I'm working, I keep my phone in another room. I don't know, I don't know what's going on on social media or it's being said on social media. I try to detach myself as much as I can from all the clutter and noise. It's the only way that, you know, I don't know how people can write fiction while at the same time being plugged into all these other little distractions. You know, I typically lie on the floor when I write. I write in longhand and I want it really, really quiet with, with no interruptions. And so social media is just not a part of my life.
- [20:41]
Host
You lay down.
- [20:42]
Daniel Silva
I'm not a consumer of it and, or, or a purveyor of it. But it has changed the world. It has changed the world. It's changed the way we communicate, it has changed our politics. It has had a huge, huge impact.
- [20:56]
Host
Well, having been in the publishing game, so to speak, for many years, what are you seeing now that's an improvement over the past?
- [21:05]
Daniel Silva
An improvement?
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Host
Yeah. Everyone is quick to say this is worse, this is worse. Have you seen any upside in what's
- [21:12]
Daniel Silva
going on in publishing?
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Host
Yeah, with your books, with pouring, with anything you've seen. I mean, I know we've mentioned social media, but you know, the landscape has changed since, since your first book came out.
- [21:23]
Daniel Silva
Like, oh my gosh, those are the before times. When I first came out, I mean, we had multiple national chains. We had multiple regional chains. Amazon was that I didn't even know what Amazon was. When I first published my first novel, my father in law had to explain to me what it was. And there was this little addendum to my first contract that talk talked about electronic books, you know, they didn't exist. What is this? What are, you know, they were trying to, you know, be able to publish those and, and my lawyer spotted it. You know, we didn't even know what they were yet. But, but it was, it was coming and now everything has changed. And, and the other thing that's going on is that I think that just the overwhelming volume of. We were talking about social media, you know, these things, what's available on our phones in terms of content and video. There's just a lot of competition for people's time. And then there's the other shocking development that's happened in the last couple of years is that men to a very large extent have stopped reading. Yeah. And you can sort of, you can, you can sort of see it in the, you know, the weekly bestseller list, for example. Women, women's fiction is. Reigns supreme and just men are just not reading the way they once did.
- [22:48]
Zibby Owens
So.
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Host
Does that worry you?
- [22:49]
Daniel Silva
You know what? It worries me. Look, I revere books. I mean, I've. I am a lifelong reader. I am a reader first and writer second. I love to read. If you could see what's around me. I'm surrounded by books and this is just one of my offices and libraries. So I find it a little odd, you know, I can't go anywhere without a book. If I have to go shopping with my wife or something, you know, I take a book with me. I don't go anywhere without a book. And a lot of that doesn't. Books don't matter the way they once did to a lot of people. And that does trouble me, and that does worry me. But the industry is adapting and trying to find its way and it's going to be an interesting few. I mean, it's. By the way, it's not just publishing, it's. The newspaper industry has been decimated. Magazine industry, my goodness, Time in Newsweek gone for all extensive, purpose intensive purposes. Motion pictures in theater, motion pictures releases not the way they once were. So everything is changing. It's changing very quickly. And by the way, it's going to get faster and faster once AI starts.
- [24:00]
Zibby Owens
True.
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Host
What brings you hope then for this chapter?
- [24:04]
Daniel Silva
What brings me hope right now?
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Zibby Owens
Yep.
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Daniel Silva
You know, I have to say that I am. I am a little. My friends tease me about this, but I'm a little alarmed about where we are right now in terms of the politics of our country, politics of the West. There isn't a country in Europe an old liberal Democratic. I'm using small L, small D country that isn't going through political upheaval. I mean, great written, for heaven's sake, is in complete and utter turmoil. The climate is changing so quickly, AI is going to, I'm afraid, decimate the knowledge economy and other segments of our economy. These are going to seem like the golden age. There's a lot of change is going to be coming at us very, very quickly.
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Host
Wait, but where was the, where was the hopeful thing in that?
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Daniel Silva
I don't, I, I, I. Look, humans are incredibly resilient, and we have gone through, we have adapted to new technologies over and over again in the last couple of hundred years. I mean, particularly from the industrial revolution forward. But this is going to be a rough ride. This is going to be a rough ride in the next few years, but it gives me things to write about.
- [25:27]
Host
All right, last question. What do you think Gabriel would be reading right now?
- [25:32]
Daniel Silva
He is a. And I drop little hints about how incredibly well read and how smart he is. So he reads a lot of history, a lot of important nonfiction, but he does read really, really good literary fiction. And the other thing about him is that he's so multilingual that he can read, as I pointed out, he can read books in their original languages and things like that. He really reads French. He reads Ital, obviously. And so he's very, very, very well read. I don't know what's on his nightstand right now, but something good sounds great.
- [26:13]
Host
Well, now, thanks to you, we can all have this something good on our nightstands. So congratulations on Ransom and thank you very much.
- [26:21]
Daniel Silva
Thank you.
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Zibby Owens
Hats off to your wife as well
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Daniel Silva
for all those pass along your greetings.
- [26:26]
Host
Please do. All right. Thanks so much. Take care.
- [26:29]
Daniel Silva
Okay, thank you.
- [26:29]
Zibby Owens
Thank you.
- [26:30]
Host
Bye bye.
- [26:31]
Zibby Owens
Thank you for listening to Totally Booked with Zibby, formerly Moms don't have Time to Read Books. If you loved the show, tell a friend, leave a review. Follow me on Instagram, ibbyowens and Spread the word. Thanks so much. Oh, and buy the books.