Art, Family, Escape and Reinvention in Saoirse with Charleen Hurtubise

Summary

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Podcast Summary: Totally Booked with Zibby – “Art, Family, Escape and Reinvention in Saoirse with Charlene Hurtubais”

Host: Zibby Owens
Guest: Charlene Hurtubais (author of Saoirse)
Episode Date: February 24, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode of Totally Booked with Zibby, host Zibby Owens welcomes novelist Charlene Hurtubais to discuss her new novel Saoirse, a story centered on art, escape, reinvention, and family secrets. Broadcasting from Ireland, Hurtubais reflects on the inspirations behind her work, the emotional core of her characters, and the ways in which personal and collective histories weave into fiction. The conversation covers the creative process, the significance of art (in both form and story), and the empathetic lens through which Hurtubais writes about survival and reinvention.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Art of the Book: Cover and Symbolism

• Beautiful Cover Art (05:12):
  Zibby opens by praising the novel’s striking cover, which is a landscape painting by artist Emma Cowrie, whose work captures the spirit of Donegal and Northern Ireland—the settings for the novel.

  “It’s important also that the cover be representative of art, since that is such a huge part of the book. The main character is an artist… She’s a mastermind at using art to deal with her feelings and everything else…” —Zibby Owens [06:00]

2. Plot Summary and Protagonist’s Journey

• Story Setup (06:38):
  Hurtubais explains Saoirse opens in Donegal in 1999 with the protagonist Saoirse, an artist living with her family, who is secretly an American on the run, having assumed a false identity in Ireland.

  "She only meant to stay temporarily, just kind of lie low from some trouble she was having, and then she accidentally built a life." —Charlene Hurtubais [06:50]

• Inspiration from Real Life (07:43):
  Hurtubais was inspired by true stories of people slipping into Ireland undetected, especially in the pre-digital age, which kicked off her idea for the novel.

3. Themes: Escape, Identity, and Emotional Survival

• Ease of Escape Pre-2000 (09:01):
  Discussion about how, before biometric passports, even a simple act—like borrowing a friend’s passport—could lead someone to create a new life.

  "You made it sound so easy. She just, like, swipes her friend's passport and, like, sticks it in her bag... Luckily, the man on the plane next to her shows her how to flash it when she lands. And that's it." —Zibby Owens [09:01]

• Children, Abandonment, and Maternal Resolve (11:19):
  The novel flashes back to the protagonist’s childhood and moments of abandonment, showing how formative experiences shape later actions, especially as a mother clinging to her children and new life.

  “In all of her resilience, you know, those are her formative years… when she becomes a mother… she does not want to let [her children] down. So she isn’t kind of coming clean… it is still survival. She is in survival mode.” —Charlene Hurtubais [12:03]

4. Relationships and Emotional Crafting

• Portraying Relationships (15:54):
  Zibby lauds the vivid depiction of Saoirse’s partner, Dahi, whose calming presence is the emotional ballast in her turbulent life.

  “He soothes her sense of hyper vigilance. He soothes the sense of her being in survival mode… With him, she can finally breathe, she can finally let go for a while.” —Charlene Hurtubais [16:20]

• Hurtubais explains that she crafts characters and scenes around core emotions, drawing from her own life and observations to explore connection, longing, and the stakes of secrecy.

5. Writing Process and Motivations

• Building with Emotion (18:31):
  Rather than plot or objects, Hurtubais starts with emotions, likening her process to having a Minecraft-like toolbox of emotional building blocks, from which stories are constructed.

  "For me, the tools in my toolkit are emotions and it usually does start with something like that..." —Charlene Hurtubais [18:42]

• Personal Parallels (21:17):
  When asked if she herself was running from something, Hurtubais reflects on how moving from Michigan to Ireland brought her a sense of soothing—something she also channels into her characters’ emotional landscapes.

  “I think all of us are surviving something to some extent… when we're finding ourselves, we always are…” —Charlene Hurtubais [21:21]

6. Empathy and the Survivor’s Perspective

• Intentions for the Book (22:57):
  Hurtubais hopes readers will feel empathy for those in survival mode, especially women with flawed pasts and complex choices. She emphasizes the importance of telling a survivor’s story, with all its nuance and lack of simple heroes or villains.

  "I wanted to give a survivor a voice, even with all of her flaws and bad decisions... empathy that, you know, she made some bad decisions, but she's not a bad person." —Charlene Hurtubais [23:02]

• She urges readers to see the complexity of survival and reinvention, and to “think about those things... because clearly it's not a—it's a complex story. There's no winners, there's no losers.”

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Notable Quotes & Moments

• On art as survival:
  “She is a mastermind at using art to deal with her feelings and everything else and has received so much acclaim for it.” —Zibby Owens [06:00]

• On childhood trauma echoing in adulthood:
  “…that is children, whatever situation they're in, they want their primary caregiver… I do think there is a parallel between that scene and then the later scenes as well…” —Charlene Hurtubais [12:03]

• On emotional literary craft:
  “I think for me, the tools in my toolkit are emotions… you put all these little emotions in and they come out. You unpack them when you need them.” —Charlene Hurtubais [18:42, 21:15]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Episode intro & guest background: [02:16–04:51]
• Discussion about the cover art: [04:54–06:00]
• Plot summary & thematic overview: [06:30–07:26]
• Inspiration from real-life news stories: [07:43–08:51]
• Constructing Saoirse's escape: [09:01–09:35]
• Exploring childhood abandonment: [11:19–13:17]
• Describing Dahi and building relationships: [15:54–17:49]
• Charlene’s writing process: [18:31–21:14]
• Personal reflections & parallels: [21:17–22:33]
• Empathy and survivor’s voice: [22:57–24:36]
• Closing remarks: [24:36–25:06]

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Final Thought

Totally Booked with Zibby’s episode with Charlene Hurtubais is both heartfelt and probing, inviting listeners to consider the hidden lives, choices, and emotional battles of women who reinvent themselves against the odds. With art, empathy, and memory at its center, Saoirse is positioned not just as a compelling literary thriller, but as a lens onto the ways we all seek—and deserve—identity, family, and safety.

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Transcript

[Capital One Bank Narrator]

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[Sarah Gibson Tuttle]

Hi. Who here loves when their nails are perfectly done?

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Me.

[Sarah Gibson Tuttle]

I'm Sarah Gibson Tuttle, and I started Olive in June because, let's be real, we all deserve to have gorgeous nails. But who wants to spend a fortune or half their day at the salon? And that's why I created the Mani system. So you can have that salon perfect manicure right at home. And guess what? The best part, each mani only costs $2. Yep, you heard me. $2. No more. 30, 40, $50. Salon trips that eat up your day. Now you can paint your nails whenever you want, wherever you want. And trust me, you're gonna be obsessed with your nails, and everyone is gonna ask you, where did you get your nails done? And here's a little something extra. Head over to oliveandjune.com and get 20% off your first mani system with code [e-mail] perfectmanny20. That's code perfectmanny20 for 20% off at olivenjune.com perfect.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Perfect.

[Sarah Gibson Tuttle]

Manny20. You're all set for a nail glow up. Let's get those nails looking fabulous, shall we?

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Hi, I'm Debbie Millman and I host a podcast called Design Matters from the TED Audio Collective. Every episode, I have conversations with designers, writers, artists, and other luminaries of contemporary thought. People like Roman Mars, AI Weiwei, Ethan Hawke, and Ashley Ford. We not only talk about their crafts, but how they design the arc of their lives, what they've learned, what obstacles they've overcome, and how they've done it. And how they see the world. Join us for an inquiry into the broader world of creative culture. Find and follow Design Matters with Debbie Millman wherever you're listening to this.

[Zibby Owens]

Hi, this is Zibby Owens, and you're listening to Totally Booked with Zibby, formerly Moms don't have Time to Read Books. In my daily show, I interview today's latest best selling, buzziest or underrated authors and story creators whose work I think is worth your time as a bookstore Owner, publisher, author, and obviously podcaster. I get a comprehensive look at everything that's coming out and spend my time curating the best books so you don't have to stay in the know, get insider insights and connect with guests like I do every single day. For more information, go to zibbymedia.com and follow me on Instagram ibeowens. I interviewed Charlene Hurtubais, the author of Saoirse. I'm sorry, I'm probably saying that wrong. S A O I R S E Saoirse, a novel on Zoom, unfortunately, but she was around the country, around the world at the time, so this is what we do. She was in Ireland. Charlene is a novelist, essayist and and artist, and the author of the Polite act of Drowning, which was published in Ireland and the UK in 2023. Saoirse is her US debut. Charlene holds a Master's of Something M sc dot from Trinity College Dublin and an MFA in Creative Writing from University College Dublin, where she facilitates creative writing seminars. She is the sixth sister in a family of nine and she spent much of her childhood in Michigan, her early adult years in Boston, and has now lived half her life in ire Ireland. Witches Home, which actually is a bit concerning because there is a woman in the book around whom the book centers, who escapes the US with a false identity and moves to Dublin. And I'm hoping that was not the case for Charlene, but I guess we'll never know. Though she lives in Dublin with her Irish family, the pull of Donegal never leaves and continues to influence her drawings and writings, including Saoirse, by the way. Charlene was incredibly, incredibly patient with me because for whatever reason, my messages on my computer kept dinging for about 15 minutes and I kept trying everything and do not disturb didn't work. And I finally had to restart everything and restart the zoom. And it was kind of a pain and incredibly disruptive, so she had to repeat a lot of this. So sorry for that. Sometimes my apple setup just malfunctions and so it did. So thank you to Charlene for her graciousness. Hi, Charlene. Thanks for coming on. Totally Booked to discuss Saoirse, your novel. Congratulations.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Thank you. And thanks for having me.

[Zibby Owens]

My pleasure. First of all, can I just say, this is one of the most beautiful covers I have ever seen. Tell me about. Tell everybody about the COVID It's a portrait of a landscape with water and sky. It looks like you can see the canvas underneath rocks, and it's just absolutely gorgeous.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

It's gorgeous, isn't it? And it's an artist who lives. Actually, I think she spends some of her time in Donegal, which is where, you know, the settings and part of it in, I believe, Northern Ireland. So she. Her name is Emma. It's on the back. And I have to. Emma Cowrie. And she is an artist, landscape artist. And Celadan found her and I think what a find. She has absolutely beautiful, beautiful work. And she paints. I think she focuses in that area and she also focuses over in England. But you can find her on the website. If I'd known, I would have.

[Zibby Owens]

No, no, I took you off guard. I will try. We'll find it and put it in

[Charlene Hurtubais]

the show notes somewhere. But she's. Yeah, no, she's absolutely stunning. Stunning artist.

[Zibby Owens]

Well, it's important also that the COVID be representative of art, since that is such a huge part of the book. The main character is an artist and starts off with her upcoming exhibit. She's worried that it will reveal all these secrets from her past, but she is a mastermind at using art to deal with her feelings and everything else and has received so much acclaim for it. So it better be a good artist on the COVID basically.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Exactly, exactly. Yeah. Good summary as well. Yeah.

[Zibby Owens]

Well, maybe do a better job. Why don't you tell listeners what your book is about?

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Okay. Well, so it opens in Donegal in 1999 with Saoirse, an artist who seemingly is living an idyllic life. She is living in a house by the sea with her two beautiful daughters, her gorgeous partner, Dahi, and everything seems to be just, you know, idyllic. But she has secrets, and we soon find out she has secrets. And so she's an American on the run. She has stolen an identity and she has come over to Ireland and on a false passport and built a false identity and is living a life. And she only meant to stay temporarily, just kind of lie low from some trouble she was having and then she accidentally built a life.

[Zibby Owens]

So when you have a character running from the past, how did you think of what she should like, what came first? Was it the issue she was running from? Was it the art? Was it the new family? Was it like, which piece of this jumped out at you and encouraged you to get going on this novel?

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Yeah, so, interestingly so, it was a few news stories over the years which kind of played to my imagination. So for some reason there. I wouldn't call it a trend, but there were times where people would kind of, what do you call it, kind of slip into Ireland on Detective, live their life on the run. For some reason and then be discovered. And usually it was a discovery for some other reason to know, detected by somebody not, you know, the system just seemed to not find them. And I don't know if it was just because their systems weren't joined up at the time or what have you. And this is in the 2000s. And it just made me think, if this is the 2000s, before technology, before, you know, our footprint, our digital footprint, like, what would that be like in the 90s before technology was prevalent? So it really. That played to my imagination. But he's gorgeous. I'm sorry.

[Zibby Owens]

Thank you. My dog in the background.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

It just really played to my imagination. So that came first, that piece of a girl on the run slipping into Ireland, you know, passport.

[Zibby Owens]

You made it sound so easy. She just, like, swipes her friend's passport and, like, sticks it in her bag, shows it. Luckily, the man on the plane next to her shows her how to flash it when she lands. And that's it. I mean, it made me feel like I better lock up my own passport. Who's gonna take these? Passport. How easy is it? I mean, now they have all the, you know, optic modification, but, wow.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

I don't think you'd get away with it. I really don't think you get away with it nowadays. And that's also part of the reason why it has to be written kind of in the 90s as well up through 2000.

[Zibby Owens]

But it would be. It would be fun if you tried just to see what would happen and say it was research for the book.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Do you know what's so funny, though? Just this morning, there was. You know how all these things pop up on your newsfeed. There were these two little boys back in the 80s who got on a plane without their parents. They were about 10 or 11 years old. They wanted to go meet a member of the A team, and they literally slipped through. They just pretended they were with the next people in line, like the parents. Their parents. They got all the way to New York City and undetected, and they just, you know, could you imagine? Can you imagine the audacity of that?

[Zibby Owens]

Well, I always thought it was a little bizarre. I mean, I travel with my kids a lot that you don't need. You have to go through so many hoops to get them passports and all this identification. And then you get on a plane, and until they're 18 or so, you don't even need to show any identification. Like, what is. What is that about? But yet you can't let them fly alone. Because then they need multiple forms and everything. But you could just fly with anybody. Not, you know. Right.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Really? And is that just in. In the US or is that not international or is it not international?

[Zibby Owens]

International. You need a passport. But within the us, I could be with any kid and the most they'll say is, what's your name? Who are you with? And they'll be like, my name's Whatever, and I'm with my mom.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

That is.

[Zibby Owens]

I don't know, it seems like there's a little bit of a loophole that. Yeah, okay. Anyway, getting off track.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

It's so interesting, though, isn't it? These are the things that make novels, these thoughts, you know, when you. You kind of get a little piece of, you know, a thread and you just pull it and pull it and pull it, and all of a sudden. So, like, you say those, you know, that was the first element, though.

[Zibby Owens]

Interesting.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

That was the first moment.

[Zibby Owens]

So you gradually show us how she ends up there. And Sarah, quote, unquote, and you take us back first to a scene where her mother leaves her with her grandmother. She doesn't really understand what's going on. She has this little lavender oil, which now becomes a focus of the art years later. Talk a little bit about that sense of abandonment, because it felt so visceral. And there was this tugging that went on where the grandmother seemed to want to keep her. She wanted to leave. There was the step father. Father. She didn't know who he was at the time. And she was like, whatever I do, I want to grab on with my legs so tightly to my mom and not let go. It felt like this primal urge. Talk a little bit about that.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Yeah, so. And I. I think that's, you know, that is children, whatever situation they're in, you know, they want their primary caregiver, no matter what that, you know, that sense is. And, you know, I think that is, you know, this is. Well, Sarah at the time and. And who became Saoirse, that's her. And all of her resilience, you know, all of her. You know, those are her formative years. And I think it plays into that fact that when she becomes a mother and the reason also why she isn't going to let this go. She's built this life and she has these children and she does not want to let them down. So she isn't kind of coming clean because, you know, you know, this is great crack. We're just not going to, you know, tell anybody and see how long we get. It's not like that at all. It is still preservation. It is still survival. She is in survival mode. And now so that be that translates into her children need her and there's no way she's going to let down. So I do think there is a parallel between that scene and then the later scenes as well, and even how she resolves that at one stage where she comes back to that moment. Hmm.

[Capital One Bank Narrator]

Wow.

[Sarah Gibson Tuttle]

Hi. Who here loves when their nails are perfectly done?

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Me.

[Sarah Gibson Tuttle]

I'm Sarah Gibson Tuttle and I started Olive in June because, let's be real, we all deserve to have gorgeous nails. But who wants to spend a fortune or half their day at the salon? And that's why I created the Mani system. So you can have that salon perfect manicure right at home. And guess what? The best part? Each mani only costs $2. Yep, you heard me. $2. No more 30, 40, $50. Salon trips that eat up your day. Now you can paint your nails whenever you want, wherever you want. And trust me, you're going to be obsessed with your nails and everyone is going to ask you, where did you get your nails done? And here's a little something extra. Head over to oliveandjune.com and get 20% off your first mani system with code [e-mail] perfectmanny20. That's code perfectmanny20 for 20% [e-mail] perfectmanny 20. You're all set for a nail glow up. Let's get those nails looking fabulous, shall we?

[Capital One Bank Narrator]

With no fees or minimums on checking accounts, it's no wonder the Capital One bank guy is so passionate about banking with Capital One. If he were here, he wouldn't just tell you about no fees or minimums. He'd also talk about how most Capital One cafes are open seven days a week to assist with your banking needs. Yep, even on weekends, it's pretty much all he talks about in a good way. What's in your wallet? Terms apply. See capitalone.com bank capital1na member FDIC.

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[Zibby Owens]

Well, and the way. The way you write about her husband is, like, so arresting that he's so attractive. She has to just go in and start writing, you know, sketching him. Right, like that. And you. I don't know how you did it with just a few sentences. And yet you make it so clear who this guy is, the vibe, like, what you feel when you see him. Did you have someone in mind? Like, who is this guy?

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Yeah, who is this guy? I'd like to meet him. Who is he? Yeah, so did I kind of had a clear image of, you know, of his presence more than anybody. Like, oh, he's like this actor. He's like this person. Or. I think I just had a clear sense of somebody really stable, you know, somebody who is low key, not a big reactor, obviously handsome, but, you know, but he has his own. And you do see a little bit kind of read between the lines that he also has a past. He also has a sense of needing somebody and needing to find somebody. Like, so. And. And when they do eventually meet in that scene in the kitchen of the Burns household in Dublin, that's what they see about each other first is the essence of each other and, you know, love at first sight or whatever you call it. But there is just something. And I think what. What he does is, you know, it's more than just his looks. It's more than all that. It's. He soothes her sense of hyper vigilance. He soothes the sense of. Of her being in survival mode all the time. And with him, she can finally breathe, she can finally let go for a while. But it's also the source of tension, isn't it? You know, like, the more. The longer, the better it becomes and the longer she hangs on, the more she has to lose. So. Wow.

[Zibby Owens]

Well, the stakes become very high, very fast, and you're alternately rooting for her and wondering and waiting to find out what happened. And it keeps the momentum going while your prose is so beautiful along the way. So it's like you're painting these beautiful pictures and yet there's this plot element that has us, you know, really keeps us guessing and questioning everybody. Like, who is the guy on the plane next to her. And is this, you know, all the things. Which is great. Tell me a little about when you were writing it, what that process was like and was it the kind of thing where you're like, oh, this is definitely what has to happen next? Or like, how did this whole thing. Or did you pick the objects first?

[Charlene Hurtubais]

It's interesting. I do, I think I pick the emotions first, if that makes sense. And I always kind of equate it to, like, my kids play Minecraft. I don't know if you're familiar.

[Zibby Owens]

Yes, they do. Yep.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

But, you know, they have this toolbox and have all these materials and everybody can build something unique, something individual, you know, even though we start this thing. So I think for me, the tools in my toolkit are emotions and it usually does start with something like that. So I knew we had a girl in trouble. I knew I had to get her to Ireland and get her to safety. And I. And I think that's why I'm often writing about getting this young woman to safety. It showed up in so many different stories, you know, so there's always that. So, you know, you need something, she needs something to run from. She needs something, you know, she needs the villains or the, you know, the ones who are, you know, antagonists or what have you. So I think those slowly, slowly as you unfurl the story. And I wish it were quick. Like, I would love to have, you know, like, here it is, I've written it in six months and. But I don't work like that. And I think I just labor this and I labor the idea and. But those emotions are the basic building block. And from there I, you know, and it might come, you know, it might be something that you pull up from the past or a moment that made you feel awful. And so you don't build from that moment, but you build on the emotion of that moment for like Paul, for example, you know, and I remember meeting not. And I have no idea who, who I'm about to talk about here, but like, I brought my son to one of those weekend clinics where you can't go to your regular doctor, but you go, you know, to this place where there's like 50 doctors who are on rotation. And there was, you know, I walked in and my. He was my 4 year old at the time, son, you know, I had him and he's feverish and. And the doctor says to him, or to, to him, actually. He says to me, mom, I'm speaking to the child. And I was like, and the child's burrowing And I just thought. My first thought was, like, what would it be like to be married to a man like that? And from there. And then, you know, put that away. And then a couple years later, when I'm writing this, that emotion and how that made me feel, that sense of control and that people actually exist now, I have no. Like I said, I have no idea who that is. But, you know, he might just have been having a bad morning. But it is that, I think you put all these little emotions in and they come out. You unpack them when you need them.

[Zibby Owens]

Wow. I love that.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

I think that's how it works.

[Zibby Owens]

Yeah, I think you're right. Do you feel that you were running from something?

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Oh, interesting. And actually Paul or somebody on the airplane asks them that. I feel. I think all of us are surviving something to some extent. But this is, you know, it's most definitely a piece of fiction, but it is based on an emotional landscape that I would be, you know, I'm not a stranger to these. This landscape, you know, at times. And so I think when I came to Ireland, originally from Michigan, I think it was a much more soothing place, you know, initially. Initially. And I do think there was a whole slew of things.

[Grow Therapy / Kachava Advertiser]

Yeah.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

That I have dealt with over the years, you know, and I think for a while it felt like a safer place. And then you realize it's just like everywhere else. It's just, you know, the. The things that you're dealing with are slightly altered or. But. And I'm not. I'm definitely not running from anything now, you know, But I do think when we're finding ourselves, we always are, you know, I think adolescents into young adults growing into the women that we become. I think we always are in a way that makes sense.

[Zibby Owens]

Yeah, that makes sense. Well, tapping into those feelings makes it so easy for anyone to jump in because it feels like the accessibility of it is in how we're feeling, not in the circumstances themselves. So by putting something so universal, it allows us all to feel and connect over that. Even if the trappings may look different, but the feelings can be the same.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Absolutely. Yeah, absolutely.

[Zibby Owens]

What is your hope for this book? What do you want people to take away when they put it down?

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Do you know, it is. I think it's written from a survivor's perspective. And I think very often we. And we don't hear that narrative, you know, especially, you know, say it's in the mainstream media. Say you're dealing with, you know, powerful men or you're dealing with people with privilege. And what we don't often hear is that, you know, maybe these women, you know, or maybe somebody like Saoirse, she was vulnerable to begin with, you know, and then she has to go on and find ways to survive. She has to be resilient, she has to be resourceful, and she finds that. And I wanted to give a survivor a voice, even with all of her flaws and bad decisions. And I. And I guess what I want for her is empathy to know, empathy that, you know, she made some bad decisions, but she's not a bad person. And I think her sense ultimately of reinvention and coping and was the best that she could do. So. Yeah, so I guess I'm always, you know, in getting this girl first of all to safety and then. But empathy for her and for people in her situation who need it, who really need that, that's what I would love. I would love people thinking about those things, you know, because clearly it's not a. It's. It's a complex story. It's. There's no winners, there's no losers. It's really complex. And I think that's life, you know?

[Zibby Owens]

So true. Charlene, thank you so much. Thanks for talking about Saoirse. Sarah, thank you for dealing with my technical foibles here and for using your keys to make people who are running feel a little bit better understood and know that there's always the next page to turn to.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Thank you and thank you so much for having me.

[Zibby Owens]

Okay, thank you.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Stay warm.

[Zibby Owens]

Thank you. Sorry again. Okay, bye.

[Charlene Hurtubais]

Bye. Lovely to chat.

[Zibby Owens]

You too. Thank you for listening to Totally Booked with Zibby formerly Moms don't have Time to Read Books. If you loved the show, tell a friend, leave a review, Follow me on Instagram ibyowens and spread the word. Thanks so much. Oh, and buy the books.

[Capital One Bank Narrator]

With no fees or minimums on checking accounts, it's no wonder the Capital One bank guy is so passionate about banking with Capital One. If he were here, he wouldn't just tell you about no fees or minimums. He'd also talk about how most Capital One cafes are open seven days a week to assist with your banking needs. Yep. Even on weekends, it's pretty much all he talks about. In a good way. What's in your wallet? Terms apply. See capital1.combank, capital1NA member, FDIC.

[Grow Therapy / Kachava Advertiser]

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[Capital One Bank Narrator]

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