Bestselling Author Annabelle Gurwitch on Lung Cancer, Humor, and Adventure

Summary

Totally Booked with Zibby
Host: Zibby Owens
Guest: Annabelle Gurwitch
Episode: Bestselling Author Annabelle Gurwitch on Lung Cancer, Humor, and Adventure
Date: April 22, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Zibby Owens interviews Annabelle Gurwitch, acclaimed author, actress, activist, and recent lung cancer survivor, about her new book The End of My Life Is Killing Me: The Unexpected Joys of a Cancer Slacker. Annabelle shares her journey from a stage 4 lung cancer diagnosis through moments of deep grief, absurd adventure, and transformative joy. The episode centers on how humor, support, and curiosity helped Annabelle reframe her life and become a passionate patient advocate, while also engaging in unexpected escapades ranging from heavy metal band tours to challenging medical conventions.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Annabelle’s Unique Approach to Writing and Life

• Annabelle reflects on how this book distinguishes itself from her previous work because it blends personal narrative, education, and humor about living with cancer.
• Quote: “All my books chronicle my experiences as they exist in the world. I always say I'm not really interested in me. I'm interested in what it's like to be alive now.” (05:53, Annabelle Gurwitch)
• She describes this book as “an entertainment... We need moments, like pockets of joy. And there's a lot going on in the world. So, you know, if we want to still be engaged in the world, it can take its toll on our nervous systems, on our mental health. So I want to give a lot of joy.”

2. Discovery and Aftermath of Stage 4 Lung Cancer Diagnosis

• Annabelle narrates the surreal moment at the start of the pandemic when an incidental x-ray (prompted, she jokes, by the doctor’s looks) reveals her cancer.
• Quote: “I went in for a COVID test. I walked out with stage four lung cancer.” (08:36, Annabelle Gurwitch)
• Physical health is stabilized by a targeted medication, but she's emotionally devastated—compounded by divorce and pandemic isolation.
• She reframes her journey as not just one of “making peace with death,” but of relearning “how to live when you don't die, but you have a greater sense of your time that's left.” (10:49)

3. Saying “Yes” to Adventures and the Absurdity of Life

• Motivated by a desire to seize every moment, Annabelle embarks on adventures, sometimes to her own amusement and sometimes to her own detriment.
• Highlights include selling merch on a low-rent European tour with a heavy metal band at 61, developing relationships for the sake of fun, and joking about trying to “liberate” hospital basement art.
• Quote: “My fingerprints disappeared. It’s a side effect of the medication… I emailed my friends and I said, does anyone need someone murdered?” (12:00, Annabelle Gurwitch)
• Her involvement with Immerman Angels, a mentorship program, is transformative—her mentor (“Hardy”) encourages her to embrace possibility, even just “being in it for the sex.”

4. Support Systems, Humor, and Breaking Taboos

• Annabelle stresses the essential role of mentors, support groups, and even chaplain services in emotional survival.
• She actively wants to break stigma around seeking help, and credits a balance of medication, humor, and new experiences for her well-being.
• Quote: “If there's any taboo for anyone out there to seek support, I want to just tell you what a wreck I was and how much that first cancer mentor helped me." (14:36)
• Dark humor is woven throughout: “On my first year, my first cancerversary, I had a cake made that said, ‘not dead, just resting.’ It so upset my sister, but my angel mentor ... thought it was really funny.” (13:50)

5. The Impact of Adventure on Her Identity

• Annabelle details how being “band mom” (not “cancer mom”) and being ignored by 20-somethings lets her escape the label of patient and reclaim ordinary joy.
• Quote: “That was a gift because for a year and a half, I had been Annabel Gurwitch, stage four cancer patient. And for one week I was band Mom... And if I wasn't cancer mom, then I didn't have to seize every day, it was exhausting.” (18:23)
• Stresses that the book is about experiments in living, not a prescriptive transformation story: “I also have days when I can't get out of bed... but I have reframed how I experience things.” (19:36)

6. Patient Advocacy and Access to Care

• Annabelle describes her advocacy for equal access to new lung cancer treatments in the US, involvement in lawsuits, and efforts to educate both patients and doctors.
• Mentions her role in research and as a mentor, and how self-care for her now includes acts of service for others.
• Quote: “How can I feel good about it without feeling a responsibility for helping everyone else to get this medication? So I’m involved in a number of initiatives—a class action suit against insurance companies ... I participate in support groups.” (24:36)
• On advocating for yourself: “There are so many different kinds of treatments... we have to speak up for ourselves and find ways to advocate that are sometimes challenging to be able to be real participants in our care.” (28:28)
• She humorously notes her reputation as “the vagina lady” in oncology circles due to her frankness about side effects—urging patients, especially women, to speak up.

7. The Book’s Emotional Tone and Audience Reception

• Zibby and Annabelle address concerns that the book might be too heavy for those with cancer—contrary to that, it's received as uplifting and funny, with shades of dark humor.
• Quote: “My life became a Samuel Beckett play, and suddenly I am living in an absurd drama. And I wanted to reflect that.” (31:00)
• The book is an invitation to curiosity, laughter, resilience, and going “beyond our known selves.”

8. The Story Behind the Book Cover

• A humorous detour about the journey from wanting a classical Daphne and Apollo cover to the eventual choice: a chicken doing yoga.
• Quote: “I was sending ... Pictures of Bernini, the Baroque sculptors Daphne and Apollo. Legos of Daphne and Apollo... I am standing in Barcelona ... and I get an email ... it’s a chicken doing yoga. I burst into tears... And then I realized, okay, this is good, because if my son, who's 28, is interested...” (33:05)
• Annabelle embraces the cover as a metaphor for life’s unpredictability: "You want baroque sculpture, Life gives you a chicken doing yoga. This is the meaning of this entire book." (35:00)

9. Reader Responses and Tour Reflections

• Annabelle shares stories of audience members, including those diagnosed after seeing her in the media and people forming a “cancer slacker club.”
• Finds joy and deep responsibility in connecting with readers: “I feel a profound responsibility, but also just so much joy... Just to affirm and to say, yes, you are seen in what you're going through.” (37:40)

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Notable Quotes

• On living with cancer: “What I ended up doing is writing a piece about how to live when you don’t die, but you have a greater sense of your time that’s left. And how do you want to spend it?” (10:49, Annabelle Gurwitch)
• On support: “If there’s any taboo for anyone out there to seek support, I want to just tell you what a wreck I was and how much that first cancer mentor helped me.” (14:36, Annabelle Gurwitch)
• On dark humor: “On my first year, my first cancerversary, I had a cake made that said, ‘not dead, just resting.’” (13:50, Annabelle Gurwitch)
• On self-care: “I want to stretch our idea of self care to service to others. Because this is part of what I realized in working for those 27 year olds in the heavy metal band, right. Is that by disappearing I had stopped some of the volunteer work that I had done when I was diagnosed.” (25:36, Annabelle Gurwitch)
• On the cover: “You want baroque sculpture, Life gives you a chicken doing yoga. This is the meaning of this entire book.” (35:00, Annabelle Gurwitch)

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Memorable Moments

• Annabelle joking about getting an x-ray because the doctor was cute: (08:36)
• Cake saying “not dead, just resting” at her cancerversary: (13:50)
• Being called “the vagina lady” in oncology circles for advocating around sexual side effects: (28:58)
• Her joyful embrace of the now beloved chicken-doing-yoga cover: (33:05–35:00)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [05:53] – Discussing the uniqueness of this book and the need for joy.
• [08:36] – The story of Annabelle’s lung cancer diagnosis at the onset of COVID.
• [11:22] – On impulsively saying “yes” to adventures post-diagnosis.
• [14:36] – The importance and transformation of support networks and mentorship.
• [18:23] – The impact of being “band mom” and letting go of the cancer patient identity.
• [24:36] – Advocacy for patient rights and medication access.
• [31:00] – On humor, absurdity, and the book’s emotional mission.
• [33:05–35:00] – The origin and revelation of the chicken yoga book cover.
• [37:40] – Reflections on touring and the meaningful connections with readers.

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Episode Takeaways

• Annabelle Gurwitch’s story is an unflinching yet joy-filled exploration of living with serious illness, embracing adventure, leveraging humor, and finding purpose through connection and advocacy.
• Support groups, laughter, and reframing life’s absurdities are as essential as medicine.
• The book’s message and tone, much like this episode, transcend its cancer origins and offer inspiration and light to anyone facing challenging circumstances.

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Transcript

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[Zibby Owens]

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[Annabel Gurwich]

Enjoy.

[Zibby Owens]

Hi, this is Zibbee Owens and you're listening to Totally Booked with Zibby, formerly Moms don't have time to read books. In my daily show, I interview today's latest best selling, buzziest or underrated authors and story creators whose work I think is worth your time. As a bookstore owner, publisher, author, and obviously podcaster, I get a comprehensive look at everything that's coming out and spend my time curating the best books so you don't have to stay in the know, get insider insights and connect with guests like I do every single day. For more information, go to zibbymedia.com and follow me on Instagram. Ibbeowens so excited to release this episode with Annabel Gurwich. The End of My Life is killing me. The Unexpected Joys of a Cancer Slacker is one of our Zivi Publishing titles. We are so proud to have helped usher this fabulous book in the world. You may have seen it on the Drew Barrymore show, you may have seen Annabelle on the Bill Maher Show. It was debuted at number 60 on the USA Today bestseller list. And Annabelle has been in the midst of doing a bazillion events around the book, so make sure to catch one. Annabelle is an actress, activist and previous New York Times bestselling author, two time Thurber Prize finalist. That's the National Humor Prize and her essays and satire have appeared in the New Yorker, the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, the Washington Post, among others. In fact, this book was excerpted in so many publications I can barely keep track. She also recently wrote a beautiful essay in the well section of the New York Times about her cancer diagnosis and falling. Well, not falling in love, but falling in fondly in the New York Times. It was. It was really amazing. Also, she is one of the contributors to my book on being Jewish. Now she is a Jewish mother, lung cancer survivor and pat advocate. She says she's a terrible ukulele player and an unrepentant cat lady who lives in la. I am such a huge fan of Annabel. She's been on this podcast before. I'm delighted to now have her on the podcast as one of our Zivi Publishing authors as well. Congratulations Annabelle for all of your success. Welcome to Totally Booked Live. I really could not be more excited to be here with Annabel Gurwich, who's the author of the End of My Life Is Killing the Unexpected Joys of a Cancer Slacker, which by the way, we published at Zivi Publishing. Yes,

[Annabel Gurwich]

I feel like we should high five or something like that.

[Zibby Owens]

All right, let's do it. Yes.

[Annabel Gurwich]

Okay. Woo.

[Zibby Owens]

Okay.

[Annabel Gurwich]

Woo hoo.

[Zibby Owens]

I Should have worn a sweater for the high five anyway.

[Annabel Gurwich]

A sweater. Just kidding.

[Zibby Owens]

No, no, nevermind.

[Annabel Gurwich]

Oh, yes. Oh no. I know exactly what you mean.

[Zibby Owens]

Anyway, the end of my life is killing me. Annabelle, you've been on such a roll. If you have missed Annabelle, she is today going to be on Fresh Air with Terry Gross, which is huge.

[Annabel Gurwich]

It's almost as big as being on an author clock. I feel like it.

[Zibby Owens]

Second though, it's pretty close.

[Annabel Gurwich]

It's pretty close.

[Zibby Owens]

She was on Bill Maher. She's been in every magazine. She's just like symphony, space. Events, events all over. You're doing more events than like, I don't even know. I don't even know how you're getting from place to place. It's amazing.

[Annabel Gurwich]

Where am I now? You know, the thing is this book, Zibby, you know, and you know this because you published it. We talked about it. This book is.

[Zibby Owens]

Is different.

[Annabel Gurwich]

It's a little different than my other books. All my books chronicle my experiences as they exist in the world. I mean, I always say I'm not really interested in me. I'm interested in what it's like to be alive now. But this one is a little different because it's an entertainment. And I really feel like we need a lot of laughs right now. We need moments, like pockets of joy. And there's a lot going on in the world. So, you know, if we want to still be engaged in the world, it can take its toll on our nervous systems, on our mental health. So I want to give a lot of joy. This book is also an educational book as well because the inciting incident was this cancer diagnosis. And the reason why I'm doing so many events and I'm on what I'm calling the Comedy and Cancer Center Unexpected Joys tour is that I feel a mission. You know, I feel there's not just, you know, a message to this. It's comedy and there's joy, but there's also educational. So yesterday I was doing Fresh Air with Terry Gross and then I talked to a cancer support group at Yale. Then I had dinner with a group of oncologists at Yale and then I did a book signing in Connecticut. And you know, it's just been just a profound experience to bring this book to people. So that's what's keeping me going.

[Zibby Owens]

Well, let me give you a little background about Annabelle in case you don't know a lot about her. Annabel Gurwich is an actress, an activist, a two time Thurber Prize finalist and the New York Times best selling author of six books. Her essays and satire have appeared in the New Yorker, the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, and the Washington Post, among other publications. Her books include the New York Times bestseller I See youe Made an Effort and you'd're Leaving Wynn, a New York Times favorite book for healthy living. Gurwich co hosted the Fan Favorite dinner and a movie on TBS and was a regular commentator on npr. She is a Jewish mother, lung cancer survivor and patient advocate, a terrible ukulele player, and an unrepentant cat lady who lives in Los Angeles.

[Annabel Gurwich]

All those things are true. And our book is a national bestseller. Yes.

[Zibby Owens]

Two weeks in a row, actually. I didn't even. I didn't even look today to see if it's the third week, but hopefully somebody will do that now.

[Annabel Gurwich]

Quickly.

[Zibby Owens]

Thank you, Kathleen.

[Annabel Gurwich]

We shall see.

[Zibby Owens]

We shall see. Okay, Annabelle, you got a stage 4 cancer diagnosis years ago thanks to Covid, in a way.

[Annabel Gurwich]

Talk about that moment. So five years ago, right as Covid was hitting, I got this out of the blue diagnosis which was for stage four lung cancer. I went in for a COVID test. I walked out with stage four lung cancer. It was in an urgent care. And the only reason I agreed for an X ray was I thought the doctor was cute and he had a thing for older women. Really at the time, I was going through a divorce. It was a difficult moment. And it is doctors had to have an X ray. I'm like, I just have a little cough. I tested negative for Covid. This led to further testing, finding out that I had this mass on my lung. It was a really difficult time. My son was one of those Covid graduates in college. So he was home living the dream in his childhood bedroom, quarantining with mom who now has cancer. I mean, it was just disastrous, difficult moment. I was getting a divorce. This was kind of a collapse of my entire emotional system because what happened was I was able to get stabilized physically through a targeted medication which keeps the cancer stable, which I'm still on five years going, which is amazing. Yes. Science I am made of pharmaceuticals, caffeine, and personal lubricants. We'll talk about that. Those three things have kept me going and I really endorse them and we'll talk about that. So the thing is, is my physical health was stabilized, but my emotional health was in ruins. And this is where the book is really dedicated to. I thought I would be writing a book about making peace with my death. What I ended up doing is writing a Piece about how to live when you don't die, but you have a greater sense of your time that's left. And how do you want to spend it? And how did I want to spend it? I had to reframe the way I felt I was living my life. And that's where the book really starts.

[Zibby Owens]

Amazing. Annabelle, tell us about when you said yes to all of these adventures. Right? You talk about how you wanted to live your life. Next thing you know, you're getting UTIs from having so much time with your friend Jeremy and going on band tours.

[Annabel Gurwich]

This is when you decide to change your life and say yes to things that sound like terrible ideas. This is how you end up traveling with a heavy metal band at 61, working as their merch girl on a low rent band tour of Europe, where you're sitting on the hump squished between band members, a position they call Riding Bitch. Who knew? Not like I'm a bitch, but riding like you're the lowest person of importance. But it started with this idea that I felt I had internalized, this idea of carpe diem, you know, seize the day. And it's just the knock of opportunity. Hello, opportunity knocks. And when you refrain your thinking, you say, yes, whatever is out there. And this is what I did. So I was determined to carpe every dm and I went a little crazy. Okay, so it was a little manic at first. I wanted to do everything. So my fingerprints disappeared. It's a side effect of the medication that can happen. I emailed my friends and I said, does anyone need someone murdered? You know, like, for like, a really good reason? And then I tried to steal artwork from the basement wall of the Cedars Sinai hospital where I was receiving care, because it was in the basement. What's it doing? I'm gonna liberate it. What could happen? A life sentence. I mean, it was a little nuts. And this is when, at the time, same time, I was matched with a cancer mentor. I was really, you know, struggling. And I had the good fortune to have someone recommend to me. Immerman Angels, an organization that matches people who have the same disease as you, who can help guide you through your. I hate this word journey. They've taken the word journey that's so great. Adventure travel. And it's always linked with cancer. I want us to think of another word for it. We're going to have to. We all have an assignment in this room, and I was matched with someone who had the same thing as me, and she was a septuagenarian And Hardy, my angel, recommended to me because I was like, I don't know, how do I do this? And she would listen to me and she had a sense of humor, which was hard for my family to have. On my first year, my first cancerversary, I had a cake made that said, not dead, just resting. It so upset my sister, but my angel mentor from Immersive Angels Hardy thought it was really funny. Hardy said, you can start a relationship, you know, I was like, no, I can't. She said, you could be in it just for the sex. I haven't done that since my 20s. And so this opened up other people.

[Zibby Owens]

You haven't done work, what sex since your 20s?

[Annabel Gurwich]

In it just for the sex. Two marriages later, you know, And I want to mention that I've been talking a lot about this on the tour because it's part of the educational element of this journey, which is that, you know, I want to make it, if there's any taboo for anyone out there to seek support, I want to just tell you what a wreck I was and how much that first cancer mentor helped me. And then I joined support groups and last year I enrolled in the chaplaincy service at my hospital. Support is out there and at every cost level and also free. And it's just, I want to make it safe for everyone to feel comfortable about that. And I just want to say that with us today is founder, along with his mother, Janie, of Immerman Angels, Johnny Immerman aw, who I am meeting for the first time. And so this was the beginning. And I went on and I ended up starting to see someone, the manager of this heavy metal band. And this is how you end up. You're three weeks into a relationship and you have stage four cancer and you're saying, I'm gonna take contrary. Someone says, do you want to go on a European vacation? We're going to go to London, Amsterdam, the Netherlands, and wind up in Paris. That day, Zibby. That day was the same day my oncologist had said to me, now is the time to drink the fine wine. And I thought, this sounds like a bucket list trip. And then he says, oh, I manage a heavy metal band and you can come on this low rent van tour if you'll agree to sell merch. And I said yes, because it sounded terrible, but I was saying yes to things. And that trip really changed my life, though. And I write about this in the I'm with the band story where I write about how on that trip it was actually traveling with these 27 year olds. I was working as their personal assistant, unpaid. They were not only ignoring me, they were actively ignoring me. No one learned my name. I was charging their phones. I was getting them snacks. I went on a shrooms run to Rotterdam because the drummer needed to be high. At a music festival in the Netherlands, I sold $1,400 of their merch and they gave me the gift of indifference. Why was that a gift? That was a gift because for a year and a half, I had been Annabel Gurwich, stage four cancer patient. And for one week I was banned Mom. Band mom was not cancer mom, as my son had started to call me. And if I wasn't cancer mom, that I didn't have to seize every day, it was exhausting. I didn't have to try to live every day like it was the last day of my life. It freed me from that. And at that point in the book, when you read it, you'll see, I started new ideas. So each of the chapters is really about experiments and thinking. That's when I realized, after having that experience and being treated like an ordinary person again, like a person who wasn't going through this difficult thing, that I needed to look to my daily life, to little joys, and to think about that as my goal. Because I still live with this existential dread. I still have this diagnosis. And in a ways, it's a lot like our lives today, where you're getting all this news, you don't know where things are going to happen. You're trying to find a way to survive through this and stay engaged in life. A certain aspect of the future has been taken from me. And in its place, I have put and prioritized every day. And I don't want to be one of those people. And I don't think I'm one of those people who says, my life is terrible now. It's better because I, you know. But I am living a very joyful life. I also have days when I can't get out of bed. I just want to say that it's not all work, you know, I'm not like, I'm an entirely new person now, but I have reframed how I experience things. And, you know, it's a. The book is hopefully an invitation through this storytelling for everyone to think about that. And, you know, it's. It's just so much fun to get to write about. I write about how art has influenced me and music and other authors and all those things I just find so redemptive. And I hope it's in some way because I'm a storyteller. I don't write prescriptives. I hope it's in some ways inspiring to everyone. I'm not above that. I like that idea. So. So I also have failed experiments. I just want to say that too.

[Zibby Owens]

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[Zibby Owens]

Annabelle, you have found a treatment that wasn't available a few years ago even.

[Annabel Gurwich]

Yeah.

[Zibby Owens]

And you have talked a lot about patient advocacy and research that's needed and how some states don't even have the same test available. And some do. And this has become a big mission of yours as well. Which is amazing because not only are you dedicated to sucking the marrow out of life, but you are trying to actively improve other people's lives and becoming a patient advocate and a representative. Talk a little bit about that. Really impressive work.

[Annabel Gurwich]

Well, I really appreciate you saying that. And the marrow, sucking the marrow. My grandmother would be very happy about that. You know, I have been involved in advocacy work for years with many different issues. For me, I'm doing things on two different levels. One thing is that this larger issue of access to medications is such a huge one. I didn't know that the medication that I'm on, which wasn't available a few years ago, is standard protocol around the world but not available to everyone in the United States. And so how can I feel good about it without feeling a responsibility for helping everyone else to get this medication? So I'm involved in a number of initiatives. A class action suit against insurance companies. It's filed here in the state of New York. I'm involved in research in the oncology world, giving doctors and researchers feedback because we are this first generation of people on targeted therapy. So I'm doing those kinds of conversations within the oncology community. I mentor people one on one. I participate in support groups. You know, I wanted to. There's something I write about in this book and it's the idea of also self care. I want to stretch our idea of self care to service to others. Because this is part of what I realized in working for those 27 year olds in the heavy metal band, right. Is that by disappearing I had stopped some of the volunteer work that I had done when I was diagnosed. Because this is, I think, a natural reaction. You shut down, you've got to take care of yourself. And the idea of self care is, we think it's limited. Sometimes it has connotations of spa days and retail therapy. And let me just say, I enjoy both of those. There has never been a sauna. I didn't want to get in. I am a Russian Jew who wants to schvitz and retail therapy. You name it, love it. I was at NPR yesterday. It was next to the Burberry corporate offices. I tried to break in again. Stage 4 Lungians. What are they gonna do? Life sentence. It's Burberry, for God's sakes. But Terry Gross. But Burberry, you know, I'm not above that. But the volunteer work that I do is not only because it's mission driven, but it's also, you know, it's so satisfying to not be me. I always, that's what I love. And I do. I work with teenagers and I love volunteering with teenagers when they're not mine because they forget you exist. It's so fantastic. I'll work with them. I could pass them in the street an hour later. Nothing. They don't want to borrow the car. It's just the, it's the best. And I think we forget about that as something that is restorative. And I just find I get so much energy when I do that. And so, you know, I want to remind people of that. So there's a selfish reason too. It really, it does feed me as well. And so I do write about that in the book too. I want to say one thing about that though. One of the most important things that I felt I needed to do in this book too was to write some and it's not a prescriptive again, but in the end of the book, I do include some strategies and tips for if you are going through care or if someone you love is going through care. And some of that has to do with adversity, advocating for yourself, how to talk to doctors. And we were just talking about this yesterday with the oncology department at Yale. In this era, it's very different than generations before where, you know, you just do what the doctor says to do. You really have this. There are so many different kinds of treatments available and different. Different things that are appropriate for different people's lives. And we have to particularly. And there are men here, too, but particularly as women, we have to speak up for ourselves and find ways to advocate that are sometimes challenging to be able to be real participants in our care. And there's something really important I want to say, because last night at this book event, someone was saying about, like, oh, it's so great that you're going to these conferences and you're speaking up. I am known in some circles of the oncology world as the vagina lady, because there's a connection between sexual dysfunction and the targeted therapy I'm on that's only recently been discovered. Because if men had that problem, they would have addressed it, but women. My oncologist was like, no, it's not related. No, it's not related. It is related. And other oncologists have found that out. He's not my oncologist anymore. But what I wanted to mention is I have spoken. I speak in front of thousands of oncologists at these conferences. I can do that, but it's harder when I'm alone in a room, feeling very vulnerable, talking to my own doctor. So I just wouldn't want anyone to have the impression that I do walk in with my list. And then I'm so nervous, sometimes I forget to open my notebook. So it's a really common experience, and I want to just affirm that it is not something we have to practice. We actually have to practice doing that.

[Zibby Owens]

Someone here before we started said, oh, you know, I have a really close friend going through a cancer treatment right now. Do you think this is a depressing book for them? Is this a good book for them? And I was like, no, no, no. This is a great book for someone going through cancer. Also someone who's not going through cancer who just wants a really fun read. But it is not something that is dark and depressing and that will upset someone. This is a very light inspiration, as light as you can be talking about.

[Annabel Gurwich]

Well, you know, I have some dark humor in there. So light, dark. I like it. All the shades of humor. You know, I think the way I see the world is, you know, I always see the absurdity in the world. So I'm never like the joke setup person. But I feel like my life became a Samuel Beckett play, and suddenly I am living in an absurd drama. And I wanted to reflect that. It was really important to me, though, that this particular book. My mission with this book was to look at emotional resilience and whether that's you're going through cancer or whether whatever it is you're going through, it was the idea of an invitation to be curious about how far we could go beyond our known selves. And so the goal was laughter and joy, because isn't that the goal of, like, what we want, whether we're going through, whatever it is we're going through? And so that was really what I wanted to address. And that's also the experience I've had. I haven't had, I haven't gone through. And I've been so fortunate so far to not go through this very difficult kind of treatment that many people I know have gone through. But this particular book exists as an emotional solve, and that. That was really the goal. And I've been really happy to hear people get a lot of laughs out of it.

[Zibby Owens]

What has it been like on tour so far? You've done so many events already as we referenced. What are you surprised at from reactions? What are you getting? What satisfaction are you getting from hearing from readers who have already inhaled the book? Tell me a little bit about that and how that makes you feel.

[Annabel Gurwich]

Well, the first thing people say is, I love the chicken on the COVID Doing yoga. So I'd like to say a word or two about that. There is someone in this room.

[Zibby Owens]

That's right.

[Annabel Gurwich]

Who came up with the idea. Graca Tito came up with this cover. And this was not the expected idea. You know, the book is about transformation. And I had gotten really fascinated with the idea of seeing myself through Greek mythology and these women in Greek mythology, and in particular, Daphne, who translates, transforms into a laurel tree to escape the clutches of Apollo. I felt like a Daphne. I sort of feel like a Daphne transforming to escape maybe cancer or what I think of as existential dread, becoming something else. And I started to have this idea of, like, laurel tree not so bad. This is a really positive image. And so I was sending Zibby and Kathleen and Ann and Graca and the entire team Pictures of Bernini, the Baroque sculptors Daphne and Apollo. And then paintings of Daphne and Apollo, and then line drawings of Daphne and Apollo. Legos of Daphne and Apollo. It was Daphne and Apollo or bust, right? So I knew what I wanted. And I happened to be standing in Barcelona. Crockett, did I tell you this? I may have told you this story. So I'm standing in Barcelona, feeling very international, at a cancer conference, drinking a glass of wine, and I get an email from the team saying, oh, we come up with a cover, but it's not what you're going to think it is. Kathleen writes to me, and I said, okay, I'm ready, you know? And it's a chicken doing yoga. A chicken chicken doing yoga. And I burst into tears. I'm like. Just this feeling of, like, what? It was not sadness. It was like sort of shock. It just. I was like, what is this? And I do what I always do. I call my friend Nina and I call a friend, and I say, here, take a look at this. What do you think? I don't. I don't know what to even think this is. There's no Daphne. There's a chicken. And she says, annabelle, it's really funny. I don't know exactly what it means, but it's really funny. I love this chicken doing yoga. And then I call my son, my second thing I do, and he said, mom, is chicken a theme in this book? And then I realized, okay, this is good, because if my son, who's 28, is interested, he's like, I'm not sure if that chicken should be wearing pants. And then he's giving me, should the chicken be doing down dog? Okay, you know what? This is really good. I thought, after maybe three more glasses of wine. And then I emailed back the opposite of what I had thought. And this is part of my taking contrary action, which was I thought, oh, my God, no. And I said, this is great. I love it. Let's do it. And I don't even understand your genius in coming up with it. I love this cover so much, I didn't realize I didn't need to write an entire book. All I needed was this cover. Because this cover explains life. You want baroque sculpture, Life gives you a chicken doing yoga. This is the meaning of this entire book. Why did I write a book? Groka, we got could just put out nothing and just say, look at the COVID This is what life is gonna be like. And I just love it so much. So this is always the first thing is people come up and say, I Love that little chick. I just love her. And I am that. I'm that little chick doing yoga. But that was a long answer. I'm sorry, guys.

[Zibby Owens]

Would you like to show us your yoga moves?

[Annabel Gurwich]

Yeah. Oh, I'm still doing yoga every day. Yes, I made a. Pharmaceuticals, caffeine, personal lubricants, and yoga. I should add that. But I want to say this tour has been amazing, because first of all, the events, this comedy and cancer center tour, they've been so much fun. I have heard people from readers who are just getting so many laughs and joy from it. I'm also hearing from people who are in treatment who come to meet me. Some people who are getting into treatment for lung cancer who didn't know they were at risk for lung cancer. A woman came the other day in Columbus, Ohio, and said she had seen me on Bill Maher and had radon exposure, didn't know she was at risk, and was now in treatment at the James Cancer Center. It was just unbelievable. This is what you dream of, but to actually get to live that. And then every day when I'm doing events and I'm doing events twice a day every day, it's a little crazy. But I get so much energy from connecting to people. People are telling me their stories. Last night, I heard about 50 or 60 stories in Madison, Connecticut, and I feel a profound responsibility, but also just so much joy. People have said, I want to join your cancer slacker club. I'm like, yeah, yeah, we're a club. And it's just. Just to affirm and. And to say, yes, you are seen in what you're going through. It's just been an extraordinary opportunity that you have given me Zivi Media. And so I'm so grateful for this getting. Getting this chance to do this with you, which we decided to. To do. Actually. This really came about because we were sitting here. I don't know how many years ago now was that? Three. Two and a half years ago. We were sitting actually in the auditorium upstairs. You had invited me to do an event, and I was like, I'm working with this people. I love this woman. I'm working with this company. And that was when I decided, and I was like, yeah, this next book.

[Zibby Owens]

So we are so honored. We've had the best time. The whole team is here to. To celebrate you and everyone else. We could not be more thrilled that your genius is now out even wider in the world, even though you've been doing this for a while and have had so much success. This is such a personal beautiful story with so many implications and we just couldn't be more grateful. So thank you so much for coming.

[Annabel Gurwich]

Thank you so much.

[Zibby Owens]

Thank you for listening to Totally Booked with Zibi, formerly Moms don't have Time to read Books. If you loved the show, tell a friend, leave a review, follow me on Instagram ippyowens and spread the word. Thanks so much. Oh and buy the books.

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[Annabel Gurwich]

hi,

[Hannah from Giggly Squad]

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