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- [00:00]
A
Want to shop Walmart Black Friday deals first. Walmart plus members get early access to our hottest deals. Join now and get 50% off a one year annual membership shop Black Friday deals first with Walmart plus see terms@walmartplus.com.
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B
This is what you do when you've.
- [00:17]
A
Just found that statement handbag on ebay.
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B
And you want to build an entire wardrobe around it. You start selling to keep buying.
- [00:24]
A
Yep.
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B
On ebay.
- [00:25]
A
Over that all black everything phase.
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B
List it and buy all the color.
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A
Feeling more vintage than ever.
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B
It's out with the new and in.
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A
With the pre loved. Next thing you know, you've refreshed your wardrobe basically without spending a dime.
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B
Yeah, ebay.
- [00:39]
A
The place to buy and sell new.
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B
Pre loved vintage and rare fashion.
- [00:59]
A
Are you vulnerable enough to like cry when you feel that or would you hold it in?
- [01:06]
B
I didn't think I could cry. And what concerned me was I was becoming so busy that I went to my first. My first girlfriend. She was my first. I went to her funeral because she passed away.
- [01:18]
A
Oh, wow.
- [01:19]
B
And when I went there, I couldn't cry because literally I had somebody that was waiting for me outside to finish some interview and documentary thing I was doing. So I'm like, hold up. I gotta slow my life down. I wasn't able to cry. I wasn't able to feel. And when I went to my father's grave site, I cried. And I didn't know that I would or like, if not, I would have been troubled if I didn't. I cried and then I was like joyfully crying because I'm like, yes. I cried. Like, I can't believe it. Like I feel something and I let it out. I'm human. Yeah. And I felt better.
- [01:59]
A
A$AP Ferg is one of my favorite modern rappers, but he's much more than an mc. He's a super creative person who designs clothes and dreams of having his own clothing house one day. And he's brilliant enough to pull it off. Believe that we had a conversation that takes on a life of its own and flows far away from everything I planned to ask him. We go from talking about his hit plane Jane, which I to welcoming A$AP Rocky home from jail time in Sweden to talking about Jeff Koons and Damien Hirst and the meaning of modern art. I love this conversation. Let's dig in. It's A$AP Ferg on Torre Show. Playing Jane is a monster song.
- [02:48]
B
Thank you.
- [02:49]
A
And I want to hear about writing it, making it. Is it multiple takes? Are you punching in like you know, and it's an interesting vibe to it. Cause you talk about family, you talk about pain and trauma, but you also talk about hanging out, having fun. A lot of in the chorus is crazy.
- [03:11]
B
Thank you. I love the fact that you broke down everything I talked about, because I feel like Plain Jane, people love it. I don't know if everybody knows why they love it or, like, if they can pull out those parts. The trauma, the cookouts that you. That we used to have to dodge gunshots and, you know, me going to Liberia for the first time and coming back and feeling like I had to do more for my community. Hermes Lincoln feeder village in Liberia. That came from me spending, like $100,000 on a chain with Benbola and then going to Liberia and seeing how much starving kids is out there. And I was like, I came back, I wanted to give all my jury away. And I was like, man, like, a link can literally feed a village in Liberia.
- [04:03]
A
Did you give some money to them?
- [04:05]
B
I was going out there to put uniforms on kids. Cause out there, like, they can't go to school without uniforms. So I was going out there, put uniforms on the kids. And it was with this actual brand called Uniform Chid. Liberty is my partner's name that he started his brand. Because when the Ebola outbreak happened out there in Liberia, a lot of people were scared to buy product out there. So he had a lot of materials and things like that. So he brought a factory and he hired all of these women that didn't have jobs and things like that to make uniforms out of these materials. And he would use artists that has influences and just influence, period, to collaborate with. To sell clothing and partner up with Bloomingdale. So that's what I did. I basically partnered up with him and Blumindales to make a line with some of the material. I designed a line with traplord and uniform. We sold it. The money went towards putting Some of the money went towards putting the uniforms on kids.
- [05:13]
A
Wow.
- [05:14]
B
Yeah.
- [05:15]
A
I want to talk about design, because I know you're into that too, but, like, talk about making this record.
- [05:20]
B
So Plane Jane was the beat first.
- [05:23]
A
You wrote in the studio or.
- [05:24]
B
So I listened to Juicy J slop on my knob like horn on a cop. I was in LA and me and my uncle was just listening to the radio, and it just came on and I'm like, yo, this song is amazing. Like, it hit me. It's like I had a epiphany. Like, nobody did the song over. And I'm like, why doesn't this happen? Twice in the song. Check in with me, and everybody screams that. I mean, the whole song is like a hook, really. Yeah. Long bridge. It's so sticky.
- [05:57]
A
But it's dope to start with the hook instead of. A lot of people start with a verse and then build into it. But when you start with it, that's the. Beyonce loves to do that.
- [06:06]
B
Right? But the song don't even have a hook. It's just really the Suck a nigga dick or something. So that comes one time, and then it's like, back into the verse. But I don't even know if that's really a hook. And Juicy J said that's his first song that he put out. And he wrote, like, which is intriguing to me because that's a huge song. So I went right to the. Soon as I got to the hotel, we were stuck in traffic. I had this idea just brewing in my head to write to the Slava Mana beat. And then I was like, man, I gotta make this shit new. I gotta make it feel like young. The young people gotta own it. It gotta be an anthem for the young people. And I gotta say something. I had so much to say on this record. Cause I just came back from Africa. I've been traveling the world, and I'm always got the New York state of mind, but I'm like, everywhere. I was like, yo. And I wanted to get an underdog to work on a beat. So I got Kirk Knight.
- [07:08]
A
Okay, yeah.
- [07:09]
B
To do the beat over. I'm like, yo, bro, I got a banger for us to do. Kirk is like. He's amazing. Like, he's amazing. I can't think of anything else like a genius. And I feel like he doesn't get enough credit, or people don't even know the heights he can go with his music and his musicality. So when I approached him, I knew he would bring me different sonics and different sounds, but also understand the BPM and how important the 808s is and the drums and everything like that. And I laid the verse down and I recorded the whole thing. I didn't even put that footage out yet. I recorded the whole thing on my apple, on my computer, on my laptop, in the hotel. No, in the inside of studio.
- [07:59]
A
Okay.
- [08:00]
B
The whole process of me and Kirk working on it. A matter of fact, I'm gonna put that on YouTube today. The whole process, from start to finish, of him making a beat, me going in there and reciting it, everything. And it was magic. At first. Kirk was like, yo, I think you should project Your voice more like, I think you should really rap kind of more aggressive and more. And I was like, nah, I wanted to do it laid back so everybody could feel like it's their tone.
- [08:31]
A
The beat is really hype, but you are laid back on it.
- [08:34]
B
Exactly.
- [08:34]
A
You're not shouting. It's very.
- [08:38]
B
It is very, like, restrained ride with the mob. Humdor. I'm in the booth like this. Check in with me and DJ Ferguson. Name Bullet did the chain tunnel for the watch Reggie playing chain. Yeah. And I just let the, like, the ad libs go crazy. Yamorghini chain. Rest in peace to my superior Hermes Lincoln feeder village in Liberia. TMZ taking pictures causing my hysteria. Mama see me on BET and start tearing up like, my mother seen me on BET the first time, just start crying. She like, you don't tell me nothing. She don't know what's going on. Her friend gotta tell her son is blowing up.
- [09:13]
A
I mean, you come with that line, then you're talking about, you know, uncle Psycho.
- [09:17]
B
I'm gonna start killing n. S. How you get that trife? I attend the Harlem picnics where you risked.
- [09:22]
A
What is that? Harlem picnics where you risked your life. What is that?
- [09:27]
B
All right, so growing up in Harlem, you couldn't go to a picnic without somebody getting shot or, like, somebody shooting in the air, Crowds running and trampling people. And then everybody comes back. Like, everybody leaves, go across the street, and then they come right back across the street. Music gets turned back on, and there's almost, like, nothing gonna happen. And, like, you risking your life going to these cookouts all for you to dress nice. Like, I used to make these ch. Back in the days. Like, I always been into design and making chains and jewelry and everything like that. And I used to, like, I was inspired by Pharrell and Nigel. I used to make these big medallions back in the days, they didn't know what that was. Like, I was making it out of zaroski crystals, and they ain't know if it was diamonds or not. So I was really risking my life. Like, five people I made chains for got robbed. Like, really robbed. Like, call me like, yo, Ferg, I just got robbed for my chain. And then sometimes I knew the. That robbed him. So I'm, like, calling. I'm like, yo, you know y'all got a chain. It's like a black Barb Simpson. And, like, that's my boy. He live in the Bronx. They like, ferg, we just got it. I'm like, give him back his chain. I did that and you can get.
- [10:40]
A
Him his chain back like that.
- [10:41]
B
I get, I get. Sometimes I could do it. Sometimes I can't. Sometimes it's just too late. You know what I'm saying? Where you risked your life. Uncle used to skimp work selling Knicks at night. Skimping. He used to skimp work. Like he used to sell fake work or skimp it, like a little bit of whatever. And the rest cut. It's like whatever you cut it with. Uncle used to skimp work selling Nick's at night. But I was only 8 years old watching Nick at night. Uncle Psycho was in that bathroom, bugging knife to his gut. I hope that he don't cut him.
- [11:16]
A
What is that?
- [11:17]
B
My Uncle Psycho going, wow, he's bugging, threatened to commit suicide.
- [11:24]
A
You really witnessed that, witnessing that?
- [11:26]
B
Yeah. Like, hope daddy don't cut him. Suicidal thoughts brought to me with no advisory. Like, nobody could warn me that that was happening.
- [11:35]
A
One thing I wonder, like. Cause being young and seeing like your uncle wanting to commit suicide right in front of you, like, why not make a whole song about that?
- [11:45]
B
I did. What's wrong? I didn't write a song about that in particular, but I wrote a song called Psycho. Yeah, you gotta listen to it. It's on. Always Drive and Prosper.
- [11:57]
A
Okay.
- [11:58]
B
Yeah, that's deep. Like, my family got involved and like my cousins is calling me, like, yo. My students is in my classes, like, asking me about the record and what.
- [12:11]
A
Happened in that moment or has that happened a lot? Was he suicidal, like, or just.
- [12:16]
B
Nah, I mean, his name is Psycho. So like, my uncle was just wild back then. Like, the best way I could describe him is like a light skinned version of odb.
- [12:26]
A
Okay.
- [12:27]
B
And you have addiction. Yeah, definitely dealing with addiction. And just like, I guess early, like mental. Mental. I don't want to say illness, but just like going through things like struggling mentally and you know, I guess like his harsh realities, always getting into fights and things like that. But we all know it stems from something. Yeah. I don't know exactly what it was, but yeah, I talk about it in a song called uncle that I did with Clams Casino.
- [13:01]
A
Okay.
- [13:02]
B
Back in the days. And I talk about it in a song called Psycho and let it bang on. Always Driving Prosper. My uncle and his voice is actually throughout the whole album.
- [13:12]
A
Oh, wow.
- [13:13]
B
Yeah. So, yeah, I just talk about, like, I'm talking as if I'm him. And the song Psycho.
- [13:23]
A
Wow. Yeah, wow.
- [13:25]
B
Yeah.
- [13:25]
A
So this line, I'll fuck your bitch for the irony. Yeah, that line fucked me up.
- [13:34]
B
Yeah. I'LL fuck your bitch for the irony.
- [13:36]
A
What does that. What does that mean to you?
- [13:38]
B
It's just, like, getting at anybody who doubted me. And it's not even, like, literal, like, to the sense of where it's like, I'm directly fucking somebody's bitch. But it's like, whatever it is is like, I'm just gonna succeed. I'm just like, a bitch. Could be, like, just another hit record. Like, I'm fucking a game, like, and I'm fucking it up. Like, if you didn't want me to succeed, that's what it is. That's your bitch. Like, I'm gonna succeed.
- [14:10]
A
The first two thirds of the song, you talk about family. You're rhyming, like, hard sounds, and then that. I think it's in the third verse where you switch, right? You talk about, I'm in the sunken place, and then you do the easy. Like, a whole, like, long string of easy.
- [14:25]
B
I'm in the sunken place on Instagram. I'm watching tv. I think I trade my breakfast, lunch, and dinner for some kitty. Please believe me. I see riri. I'm gonna eat it like panini. Like, I'm just talking about. Like, I'm just in this rut. I was in a rut and such. In a rut. And, like, at that time, I was going through the. Like, I was going through things with my manager. Like, my accountant stuff wasn't. Wasn't really, like, my work ethic and everything that I imagined for myself just wasn't adding up. So, like, I. That was all of that coming out. So that's what I say. I was in a sunken place. I was fucking depressed. No Instagram or watching tv. Like, I'm focused. I think I trade my breakfast, lunch, and dinner for some kitty. That's how. That's how hungry I am. Like, I ain't. I'm not even in no pussy. Like, I think I trade my breakfast, lunch, and dinner for some kitty. Kitty, please believe me. I see riri. I'm gonna eat it like panini.
- [15:21]
A
But a lot of people will switch to a certain sound and do it for, like, four and then switch to another sound. But you really zoned in on that sound for It's a good 8 or 12 flow.
- [15:34]
B
I go dumb up in the. I go dumb up in the bra. Hit them walls like graffiti. I hit them walls like graffiti Indian burns all up on a nigga wee wee. I think I need a foursome. Bella can do Bella. Bella can do Gigi, please believe me, it be easy if Reneezzi hook it all up on the Leezy.
- [15:53]
A
I mean, in that one, you're really doing it internally.
- [15:56]
B
Yeah, Right.
- [15:57]
A
So it's not just the. On the. And on the four, but it's on the two as well. So you're thinking about, like, let me like, you. You've been hitting all those E sounds, and then there's like an orgy of them.
- [16:09]
B
Yeah. But then were you thinking about a more personal point? It was like, I think I need a foursome. Bella can do Gigi. It'd be easy if Reneezi hook it all up on a Lizzy. I'm talking about Renell. Renell is cool with. Renell is. My girl is cool with all of these girls. And it'll be easy if she could hook it up on a low. They're easy. So it was like an insider, and whoever knew knew, like.
- [16:41]
A
Right?
- [16:41]
B
Yeah.
- [16:42]
A
I mean, did you write it quickly or does it take a while?
- [16:47]
B
Nah, it didn't take. I wrote it in a hotel in, what, an hour?
- [16:51]
A
Couple hours?
- [16:52]
B
I don't know. I was locked in. Probably like. Probably like an hour and a half, two hours. I'm not even sure, honestly, when you.
- [17:03]
A
Rhyme, you go straight through or you punching in.
- [17:06]
B
Like, I do both. Sometimes. Sometimes I write the whole song. Sometimes I write a verse and then I go freestyle the second verse. Sometimes I freestyle the whole song. I do that a lot. I freestyle the whole song a lot. Like, I freestyle Wham, which is a song I got with Made in Tokyo. That's on a new project. I freestyle. Did I freestyle Floor Seats? Nah, I think I wrote Floor Seats, but I freestyle the hook.
- [17:32]
A
Floor Seats is another banger for you.
- [17:38]
B
It's interesting. Can we. Before we go into Floor seats, thanks, everybody, for allowing and making Plane Jane my biggest record of all times. 3 times platinum. I never would have even dreamed that I would be coming out with a mixtape or an album or a single, a song getting played on the radio. I just didn't dream that big, let alone a song going three times platinum.
- [18:04]
A
Thank you. What did you think you would be at this point in life?
- [18:09]
B
I always knew I'd be special, some type of creative, whether it be doing fashion, art, because I went to high school for art. I went to art and design high school, which my father also went to. My father did the Bad Boy logo. He did the Uptown cast logo for Andre Harrell.
- [18:26]
A
He made the Bad Boy logo?
- [18:28]
B
Yeah. Puff gave me the chain. He gave me the Bad Boy piece right here.
- [18:37]
A
Wow.
- [18:38]
B
Yep.
- [18:39]
A
Iconic logo.
- [18:41]
B
Yep. He did the Bad Boy logo. The Uptown Cats logo. So I just took after his footsteps. I was designing, doing graphic design, doing silk screen printing. I used to do, like, all D block shirts, all, like, making a band shirts, loon shirts, black rob shirts. This is all, like, junior high school, going into high school.
- [19:02]
A
How did you learn how to design?
- [19:05]
B
Um, I was just experimenting. I didn't know what I was doing. I just was having fun with it. I didn't know if I was. I didn't consider it designing. Like, I was just, like. I knew I wanted something different. I knew I wanted shit that people ain't have. Like, I throw my jeans in the tub, and I heard that bleach or Clorox could turn into different colors. So I'll try it and, like, let it dry, and it'll come out dope. And I start doing my friends stuff because they like what I did. And then people just started wanting to pay for stuff for me to do it. And then like, oh, I'm designing. Oh, people want to buy stuff. Oh, I got a business.
- [19:43]
A
So you weren't really driving and hustling. You were just artistically just.
- [19:47]
B
What you mean by driving and hustling?
- [19:49]
A
I mean, like, it sounds like I was trying things. And then people want to buy it instead of like, yo, I gotta make some money. What am I gonna do? I'm gonna do this and then try to flip it. Like, no, I was being creative. And people dug it. So then they started buying it.
- [20:03]
B
Yeah. And I was smart enough to provide service. Like, my father taught me how to first paint on T shirts. Cause he used to do, like, Nicky Barnes T shirts. And like, all of the big hustlers back in the days, they used to pay him, like, hundreds of dollars for, like, a drawing of them with their chain and they car logos and stuff on a car. So I mean, on a shirt. So, like, he taught me that trait of, like, painting on sneakers and doing stuff on shirts. So I picked that up. First moment I went to school with my shirt on, they like, yo, that shit is crazy. You got your name on your shit and all of that. Your favorite character on your shirt. I'm like, I did this. Word. I'm like, yo, bring a T shirt and I'll do it for you for $30.
- [20:53]
A
Bam.
- [20:53]
B
Yeah, just basically pay for my supplies and stuff. And I just do it. And I was like, yo, people really like this, and it's taking me extra long. We gonna up that to, like, about $60. And then I'm finessing now. I'm like, all right, I Could throw some crystals on there for, like, another $50. Now we up $100 per shirt, plus the T shirt. You gotta get a good T shirt. We gotta go to, like, H and M or something. American Apparel or something like that. Right.
- [21:21]
A
The part of what's dope is that you're close with your dad and he's able to help you, show you the way. You're able to watch him and learn from him.
- [21:32]
B
Right.
- [21:32]
A
And a lot of brothers don't have that, for sure.
- [21:36]
B
Major impact in my life. Idol. I didn't look up to, like, rappers and artists and things like that. I looked up to my mom and my dad. Wow. And my stepfather, too. Like, my stepdad is a business mind. He went to school, got his master's accountant major. My mom also graduated college. And, like, my father was just the most amazing person ever. Artist brought me Versace stuff when I was in Junior High School. $800 sweaters and coogees pants when I was in Catholic school. I have to pay, like, a dollar for free dress day. I always came through with the new trip back then. But, yeah, like, he taught me how to hustle, too. Like, he taught me, like, how to create. And he taught me how to create a business and depend on myself. Because I remember where he would, like, before he had his own store, he would take shirts to Fat Joe store in the Bronx and, like, drop off stuff and sell stuff and, like, come back and pick up his money or however he was doing it. He taught me how to do that. Like, one time, you know, we was printing these. This is when, like, basketball teams was popping and jerseys and all of that. We, like, made these T shirts with all the teams on it, like, from the NBA and different colors and everything like that. And this was hot. Nobody was doing it. That was another thing he was good at, too. Like, on the cusp of, like, a trend that hasn't even started. He was a trendsetter, so he would do, like, those things. And he was like, yo, D, I'm gonna give you, like, 12 shirts so you could sell it. Cause I told him, I'm selling shirts, but I'm just tired of, like, spending three hours on one shirt just to get $100. I'm like, I need to figure out, like, how to monetize, like, and make more money. He was like, all right, you ready for silk screening? So that's when I started silk screening and doing about a thousand shirts.
- [23:39]
A
But you said he taught you how to make it a business. So what are some of the keys to having a successful little business.
- [23:48]
B
Well, he told me not to take any loans or, like, borrow money from people. Like, he said it'd be better if, like, you could use your own money. That way, you know, you ain't gotta owe nobody no money back. And I still kind of go by that, but, like, to this day, I mean, now, like, now that my name is so big, my name is equity, so I don't have to, like, put up money. People just want me to promote they shit and I'll get, like some type of equity in their company or percentage. So, like, you know, but where I was at, like, I understood why. So I saved my money. That's why I said, like, being on Drake tour, I saved my per diem's and, like, I'll start a brand traplord off like a hundred dollars. I'll send it to my girlfriend, she'll get like 24 shirts. I already had the silkscreen machines, so I had somebody print the shirts up, send it back to me on tour. I sell it. Now I'm like, I got money now. Now I'm like 200 up or something like that. 300 up. I send that over, do it again, free up on more shirts. I'm eating ramen noodles, so I ain't really gotta worry about buying an expensive meal. By the end of tour. I'm walking away off tour as tour support. And even my tour is like, really rocky. And he brought us out. I'm walking away with like $7,000 off tour. All I ask, can I sell my merch? And they said, hell yeah. So that was really like, how I started my business.
- [25:18]
A
I mean, if you can design your own stuff, you'll never be broke.
- [25:23]
B
Oh, I would never be broke. Even if I get broke, I know how to get rich again.
- [25:28]
A
How would you do it?
- [25:30]
B
I always say, like, if I was like a homeless person or whatnot, I would just. There's so many things you could do. I've read books about people painting rocks and, like, selling rocks. You know what I'm saying? Like, you go find a rock anywhere, paint that shit and, you know, write a special quote on it and sell it to somebody for at least $2. As simple as that. You stack that, you can have some rocks. You go get some T shirts from like 28th street, get some prints put on it. Now you got a business running selling rocks and T shirts. Set your table up. The cops are probably gonna try to get rid of you, but you know, you gonna make some money and then at least you better like, you know, $500 to at least get like some type of license to sell your stuff, like on 42nd Street. Now you got a full blown business. You can hire some employees and get your shit moving, get it rocking. And now I ain't broke no more. At least I could get like a little room or something with one of my friends, you know, pay a little $500 a month and we could get it cracking that way.
- [26:36]
A
Start climbing back up.
- [26:37]
B
Exactly.
- [26:38]
A
So wait, before we get into floor seats, how'd you learn how to rhyme?
- [26:45]
B
In school? Junior high school, actually. Where I went to is 90. And in computer class, they used to make these do nows and aims and things like that. And we used to have these journals in our books. And the teachers and I thank y'all so much, teachers. If y'all hear this, they used to make us write, like, what's going on or what's on our minds. Like, it could be in the form of like a summary or a paragraph, whatever. But I used to write mine like poetry. Cause I just like the way it rhyme better. And like, when I go up in front of the class to recite it, I knew they impressed the girls. So I was just like, man, I'm gonna make it rhyme every time. So it started in that form, and then like, I just love music. So I'm like. I got into battle rap. I was writing rhymes, not even on beats, just like to go out and like spit a 16 and do ciphers and things like that. I used to. My best friend Zani at the time, we used to write rhymes together. He used to, like, write rhymes on his computer all the time. Like, type his rhymes. I used to come to his house. He was like, yo, I wrote like four 16s. I'm like, damn, I only got two. So he like, pushed me to, like, write more. And I wasn't never really good on the computer, so I was still writing. He was just typing them joints out. And then one time he told me he rapped to Jadakiss. And that, like, boosted mine. Like, Jadakiss was everything. Ruff Riders was everything to us back then. And then I ran into Styles P the day after that. So I was like. I was like going crazy. So I rapped to Styles and I came to him and I was like, yo, I rapped to Styles. And he was like, yo, that's crazy. Cause we looked at ourself, like the Locks or the Rough Riders or whatnot. So it was dope. Because I love Styles Style of rapping his lyrics and Jadakiss he loved his voice and he mimicked them a lot.
- [28:44]
A
So how did you get better?
- [28:47]
B
I got better by just studying the game. I remember when I first came into the game, and I said this in about, like, two other interviews. I used to do ad libs. Like, Rick Ross.
- [28:58]
A
What do you mean?
- [28:59]
B
Like, huh? Like, ad libs. Like, took his ad libs. But I'm like, man, I can't keep. I can't. I gotta develop my own style. Like, it was just me wanting to be original. And I knew that that wasn't gonna work. Cause that wasn't me. I'm original. Like, I gotta be my own person. I took Master P ad libs, too. You hear some of my earlier songs, I be like, oh, that's from Master P. But the way I changed it was I put reverb in my voice to make it sound like I was falling and, like, reverb with a tail. So I'm like. And then, like, the. Instead of, like, doing Master P thing all the time, I was just like, man, what do we do? Like, and, like, what do we do? Like, I started thinking, like, what is the nuances in the hood? Like, how do we call each other? And I was like, cool, cool. And then, like, the dam came, like, the Durham. I just started adding different elements to it. And then the barks came from Q Dawgs. Actually, people don't know that. Like, I used to go to, like, a lot of Greek, like, parties and things like that, where the Q dogs would be barking, you know? Q dogs, they called us. Like, so it was just like.
- [30:15]
A
You mean the Omegas? Yeah, the Omega Sci Fi.
- [30:18]
B
Yeah.
- [30:19]
A
Ad libs are very important to your generation of MCs. Yeah, the older generation. You just spit a verse, some bars. But for you guys, the ad libs are extremely important.
- [30:31]
B
Yeah, I think everything is important for me. The lyrics, the bars, the ad libs, everything. I think the ad libs. Sometimes I don't want to put ad libs on my stuff because I just want people to hear what I'm saying. But I know that people just. They love the ad lib so much, it makes it.
- [30:53]
A
Sometimes, like, you're kind of talking to yourself, like you're commenting on your own music.
- [31:00]
B
That's exactly what it is. I'm hyping myself up.
- [31:02]
A
Yeah.
- [31:03]
B
Like, I'm like, woo Derm. Like, all right, that's right. Like, even the. All right, that's right. Like, Pharrell hit it on. He hit it on key, like, of what I was doing. He's like, Oh, I get it. I exactly get what you're doing. You're different characters. He's like you're at a Curtis Mayfield show or like a goddamn James Brown show and it's the people in the crowd that saying, all right, you go. There you go. Do that thing like, that's what I'm doing. Gif the remarkable with Marc Jacobs fragrances this holiday season. From the iconic Daisy and Perfect to the all new Daisy Wilde Marc Jacobs perfume. Gift sets include everything she needs to feel special from her favorite fragrance, plus the matching travel spray. Holiday gifts don't get much more perfect than this.
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A
So if you're looking for a gift.
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Inspiration these holidays, gift the remarkable with Marc Jacobs. So you want to be a marketer? It's easy. You just have to score a ton of leads and figure out a way to turn them all into customers.
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My voice influencer.
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A
It's a word that gets tossed around.
- [32:37]
B
A lot these days. There is a woman who went the distance, who broke ground as the first.
- [32:43]
A
True influencer by living a remarkable life. Her name?
- [32:48]
B
Elizabeth Taylor. I'm Katy Perry. This is the story of the original influencer.
- [32:55]
A
This is Elizabeth I. Elizabeth, the first.
- [33:01]
B
The podcast, wherever you listen.
- [33:04]
A
So you said you were studying certain people. You talk about Master P, Rick Ross. Who are you studying for? Your verses, your diction, the way you spit.
- [33:15]
B
I think about Eminem a lot just on like, vulnerability.
- [33:20]
A
Okay.
- [33:22]
B
And how he was so vulnerable, letting.
- [33:24]
A
His real pain out.
- [33:26]
B
Letting his pain out and letting that pain being able to open up and people relating to him. And Biggie did the same thing. Like, I used to love suicidal thoughts and things like that. People like Biggie, people like Jay Z being a businessman. To me, Jay Z, like Jay Z is like Steve Jobs rapping or something at this point. Like a business person rapping. Like he's not even supposed to be rapping. Like he's just a businessman, but he's giving us knowledge.
- [34:05]
A
But he's like a brilliant creative business who became rich.
- [34:09]
B
Yeah.
- [34:10]
A
And we still love the product.
- [34:12]
B
Yeah.
- [34:13]
A
And we.
- [34:14]
B
Yeah. Like, even his voice was different. Nobody wanted to sign him. He doesn't look like your ordinary rapper. He's Tall. Yeah. He changed the voice.
- [34:27]
A
His voice is usually a little higher.
- [34:29]
B
Than most MCs, as higher. And I think that since it was so different, it stuck out. Wayne. Love Wayne. I love what Wayne did. Wayne just went crazy. Like, I used to watch, like, Wayne a lot. Like, when I used to be making chains and, like, putting, like, the stones on the pieces and everything like that. I used to just watch his documentary, but on mute, just to see him and see the lifestyle and just have it playing on me.
- [35:01]
A
Before he went to jail, he was, like, unstoppable.
- [35:06]
B
Like, the God.
- [35:07]
A
Like, every mixtape, right?
- [35:08]
B
The time he came out with Pussy Monster and all of that, like, oh, my God, it was insane. Like, he was just. He was tapping in and I felt a spirit of Bob Marley in him. Interesting, because I would study Bob Marley, too, and I be like, they're trying to reach something different. Like, you don't feel like they're just doing, like, the subpar things or, like, just trying to. It's more spiritual. Like, I feel like it was a very strong spiritual presence in Wayne and Bob Marley, because it's just like, it was just. They was doing shit that was completely untouched. We never seen things they was doing before.
- [35:47]
A
I mean, Marley's career and music is really special.
- [35:51]
B
Very special.
- [35:51]
A
And his message, he's definitely a person from a higher plane, or at least speaking to you from a higher plane.
- [35:59]
B
He was on a different frequency.
- [36:00]
A
Yeah.
- [36:02]
B
Same thing with Wayne. I think he just tapped all the way in. And I think it's a certain time when an artist taps all the way in when nothing else matters. I feel like that's where I'm at right now. It's like everybody's talking about a party, and I'm like, nah, I'm trying to reach something. Like, I'm trying to touch something. I'm trying to, like, get something off. I'm trying to create a sound. I'm trying to, like, evolve, like, to the point where, like, I'm not comfortable doing normal shit. Like, I don't care to do, Like, I don't care to bullshit and lollygag, like, or go on vacations. Only time I go on vacation is to sleep. Because I'm trying to get to where I'm trying to get to so, so bad.
- [36:49]
A
You're trying to get to a higher level of music, you're saying, yeah, I'm.
- [36:52]
B
Trying to tap in artistically, to a higher level.
- [36:55]
A
So what do you do to, like, tap in?
- [36:58]
B
Yeah, I meditate. I study different artists. I go to the club. And I'm listening to, like, what's out. I'm fulfilling a void. Like, I'm trying to create the product that ain't here. I'm talking to the forefathers. I'm talking to Timbaland. I'm talking to Pharrell. I'm talking to Diddy. I'm talking to everybody who did something different and charged the game in a way it's never been charged or in a game. I mean, in a way we didn't know that the game needed to be charged.
- [37:33]
A
Talk to me about your meditation practice. When do you do it? How long do you do it?
- [37:37]
B
I haven't been meditating lately just. Cause I just haven't.
- [37:41]
A
Busy?
- [37:42]
B
Yeah, busy. And sometimes I fall off of it. But, like.
- [37:44]
A
But normally. What are you trying to do normally?
- [37:47]
B
When I. When I. I just need to be, like. The best way I could describe it is, like, you know, when say we doing, like, this podcast, right? And people be like, yo, let me record the room air. So, like, it could just match up, I guess, like, the sound, the sonic or whatever. I feel like we gotta do that with our bodies. Like, we need to, like, be cool with silence for a second. Like, we gotta, like, kinda, like, reset our bodies and, like, get used to silence again. Because it could be so much noise. It could be so much everything happening and losing sleep and everything like that. My life moves so fast that I have to sit down. Like, I constantly got my label in my ear, and the label is a whole building. Constantly got, like, my whole team in my ear. Constantly got everybody in the world opinions about what Ferg should be doing in my ear. This, that, third, this. Da da da da da. I have to come back down. I have to reset myself, refocus, sit in silence, sit with my own thoughts and just do nothing but just be.
- [38:56]
A
How long do you do it for?
- [38:59]
B
15 minutes. There's time that I'd done it for 15 minutes, and it felt like I had to go longer, an extra five minutes, like, if I really like feeling it. And I promise you, like, I used to look at meditation. So stupid. Like, how does this shit work? It's retarded. I don't know how to do it. I looked at YouTubes, this, that, and the third, I heard J. Cole talk about it. I read Russell Simmons book on meditation, and it works. It works wonders.
- [39:33]
A
I mean, when you get in the groove. I mean, I do it sometimes, and when you get in the groove, you know, and you're really in the moment and it really does tap into Something very deeply relaxing. Yeah, like spiritually relaxing.
- [39:51]
B
I don't know if I've tapped in that deep, but I know what I feel after. And what I feel after is like I just feel a sense of a weight lifted off of me. There's times I felt very high strung and just stressed. Like, you know how stressful this game could get life. That's why people be high and strung out and on drugs. And that stress be coming out of your paws all kind of ways. People just start eating bad, people start looking bad, people start taking drugs. People just drink everything. It comes out of you. It's gonna come out some type of way.
- [40:29]
A
Yeah.
- [40:30]
B
So I think resetting is like rebalancing yourself and like poison yourself. Like, not poison, but like poison.
- [40:38]
A
Getting poised for yourself.
- [40:39]
B
Exactly.
- [40:40]
A
Yeah.
- [40:40]
B
Right.
- [40:41]
A
Yeah.
- [40:41]
B
And I think that's.
- [40:43]
A
You seem very balanced, like just like mellow.
- [40:47]
B
Yeah. I try to keep it that way because it's so easy. I'm a Libra. I don't know if that got anything to do with it. We a scale, but it's so easy, I think for a human being, I.
- [40:56]
A
Mean, there's a lot going on in your mind. Like, you talk about the label, the design. I could do this. I got my girl. And then you are like, chill.
- [41:03]
B
And then also too, like, I have to be chill because once you start wearing it on your face, your face start to look like that. And I ain't trying to be walking around with the crazy looking, scrunched up like mad. You see people with the mean mug and all of that. Cause they've been mad so long. And you see people that look to relax and everything. They probably eating good foods, they probably relax. They probably in sun. They put in good things and good vibes and good energy into their bodies.
- [41:31]
A
You talked about Eminem's vulnerability. And you know, when we as men can be vulnerable and have the courage and the strength to allow yourself to be vulnerable. That's a really amazing place.
- [41:46]
B
Right.
- [41:46]
A
And for a lot of black men, being vulnerable is really scary. Cause we're already getting beat down by the world. We're already underestimated, underrated, undervalued. So being like, vulnerable is like, well, damn, like, how am I gonna. But if you can get to that, it's freedom.
- [42:06]
B
Yes, that's exactly what it is. It's freedom. And I think we're getting better with that as a people. As a black people, I think we're getting better with that. Just me hearing Jay Z saying he took therapy, that's our biggest rapper ever. I was like, oh, it's okay to talk to somebody.
- [42:28]
A
That and the whole 444, that song was very vulnerable and real.
- [42:34]
B
It gave us a side to him that we didn't know. All right, we know you the boss. We know how you made business moves and transactions, and that's all that's cool. But how do we get there? And, like, what are the trials and the tribulations it takes to get to where Jay Z is at?
- [42:50]
A
I mean, as hard as he can be, he'll let the song cry. He'll, like, basically cry about shooting his brother on the first album.
- [42:59]
B
Yeah.
- [43:00]
A
So he'll let it out and, like, you know, I like that you're talking about letting it out and not being afraid of being vulnerable. Cause like you said, it's so liberating. We want to be like, yeah, I'm the man. Everything is good. I got this. I'm handling life. But life is hard.
- [43:16]
B
I mean, it's almost like after you talk about it, it's just like you talked about it. There's nothing. It's like when I'm, like, scared to wear, like, you know, I mean, I ain't scared to, like, do shit, but, like, you get like, a little feeling of when you're doing something different. And like, when I make, like, the Evel Knievel outfits and the pants and stuff, and I'm like, yo, the world is either gonna hate this shit or they're gonna love it, but I don't give a fuck. Like, to me, that's being vulnerable and opening myself up to the world and dressing the way I wanna dress and expressing myself the way I wanna do it. So, like, when I first started doing it, like, it's like, ferg, what the fuck you got on? But then, like, now I got it on. And, you know, now people are wearing more bell bottom pants and things like that. It's cool. What I was doing months ago was crazy, but now it's like, oh, that shit is drippy.
- [44:11]
A
Are you vulnerable enough to, like, cry when you feel that, or would you hold it in?
- [44:18]
B
Cry when I feel what?
- [44:19]
A
Like, when you feel like that sad.
- [44:23]
B
Um. I've cried and I've, like, I didn't think I could cry because. And what concerned me was I was becoming so busy that I went to my first. My first girlfriend. She was my first. I went to her funeral. Cause she passed away.
- [44:43]
A
Oh, wow. When was that?
- [44:45]
B
That was like a year and some change ago.
- [44:47]
A
Oh, wow.
- [44:48]
B
And when I went there, I couldn't cry because Literally, I had somebody that was waiting for me outside to finish some interview and documentary thing I was doing. So I'm like, hold up. Like, I gotta slow my life down. I wasn't able to cry. I wasn't able to feel. Literally, I'm going back to work. I'm tired. This is fucked up. Like, I want to feel like. So I started focusing more on myself. I started like kind of not driving myself crazy with work and everything like that. Because I just wanted to get back to what matters, like, what really matters. And that's when I start thinking more about purpose and intention of things. Because now time can't be wasted. Yeah. And when I went to my father's gravesite, I cried. And I didn't know that I would or like, if not, I would have been troubled if I didn't. And I've cried and I kind of. I cried and then I was like joyfully crying because I'm like, yes, I cried. Like, I can't believe it. Like, I feel something and I let it out. I'm human. Yeah. And I felt better. At the Home Depot. The holidays have arrived and so is all my family. So I'm working on keeping up with the laundry. The Home Depot is here to help with Black Friday savings. Up to 40% off select appliances. Spend less time doing laundry with smart, efficient appliances from Samsung, ranked number one in customer satisfaction. Perfect. Less laundry time means more family time. Get Black Friday savings now with free delivery and financing on select appliances at the Home Depot. Visit jdpower.com awards for more details.
- [46:35]
A
Offer valid November 6 through December 4, US only.
- [46:37]
B
C Store online for details. Streaming December 12 on Peacock. Paris Hilton and Nicole Richie are back. That's hot.
- [46:45]
A
Loves it. For a show stopping reunion that will.
- [46:48]
B
Prove putting on an opera is anything but simple.
- [46:54]
A
We're really good at this. One thing's for sure, they won't be upstaged.
- [47:00]
B
Good to have you back. Come on, we've got a show to do.
- [47:02]
A
Paris and Nicole, The Encore, a three part reunion special.
- [47:06]
B
Streaming December 12th only on Peacock.
- [47:09]
A
Well, when yams passed. Yeah, that must have been hard for you.
- [47:13]
B
Very hard.
- [47:14]
A
What do you. I mean, the death sit you just mentioned and the funerals you talked about, what you learned, what you got from those moments, how you grew. So, I mean, I imagine the yam's death is probably the hardest, maybe with your dad. Probably the hardest that you've dealt with. So what did you learn? How did you deal? How'd you grow from that?
- [47:36]
B
It was hard and it's still hard Because I'm still learning from that experience. Like, as I climb and I get. And I'm on my voyage and I'm experiencing different things. I question a lot of things. Even before I came in the game, I would question things like, yo, why? You know, these guys got so many hits and they look strung out or different things like that. Or like, how is that possible? But I can see why and, like, firsthand, that happened with my brother Yams. It's like what I say in Tattered Angel. I say, I say, I say something about access. Like, us is us being who we are. We have access to everything. We can either self destruct or we can glow up. Like, and it's just all about choices, about walking this thin line. Like, you can make one wrong move and just be in a ditch that'd be hard to get out of. Or you could keep making the right moves and dodge the bullshit. That's literally what it is. Like, being an artist, for me at least. Like, I tread lightly. Like, I'm not like, even like, trying to. Like, I don't play. Like, I'm like, very. I try to be on point and, you know, Yams, he was battling something that really, like, took him off his. His square. And it just, you know, it ended up in death. And that really made me, like, okay, you could die from making the wrong decisions.
- [49:17]
A
So that made you change your life, Hal.
- [49:19]
B
I mean, it just. It just made me more. It just made me more conscious of it, of the possibilities of, like, just as easier to get into shit. And it's hard to get out of, like, the trappings of being anybody, not even just the artist, but just the trappings in life.
- [49:40]
A
Have you seen Rocky since he got out?
- [49:42]
B
I did. I seen him soon as he got out.
- [49:44]
A
Yeah. What was that like?
- [49:46]
B
That was amazing. I was so tired. Cause I was.
- [49:49]
A
Were you, like, at the airport or when he came home or where was it?
- [49:53]
B
No. So I met him at this house he was staying at. And I had to fly from Hungary to London, from London to New York, New York to LA. And I landed in LA at 3:00.
- [50:07]
A
In the morning just to go see him.
- [50:09]
B
It was a party? Yep, to see him. It was a party. A huge party we had for him. And, like, I brought some people. I called people, we lit, we go to the party. I pull up like 4 o'clock in the morning, the cake is already, like slammed. Like, there's like, plates everywhere, there's cups everywhere. You see girls leaving and shit. So I'm like, damn. But I got a moment to, like, share with my brother. He was hyped. He was still up. We hugged like, yo, bro, I'm glad you home. And it was just. It was just a very, very dope moment. And we stayed up until like 9:00 in the morning where we went to Sunday service to see Ye and Kanye. Everything. Yeah.
- [50:57]
A
What were you going through when he was locked up in Sweden?
- [51:02]
B
A lot people don't. And what that made me realize is like, when your family member is locked up and when your friends is locked up, like, you're locked up.
- [51:10]
A
Yep, yep.
- [51:12]
B
Like, I see how that shit could happen. Like, the trickle down effect. It's because everybody was reaching out to me. I'm like, the guy people was like, yo, all right, how can I get to Rocky? I'm like, I'm the voice, really, for Rocky. Like, I'm using my platform to post them every day. And it was crazy too. Cause, like, you feel like you can't even be having fun. Like, I felt like, man, I can't be having fun. Fans gonna come at me for having fun.
- [51:42]
A
Yeah.
- [51:42]
B
They gonna be like, yo, motherfucker, you having fun outside and your friend is locked up.
- [51:47]
A
Yeah.
- [51:48]
B
Like you can't even have fun properly.
- [51:51]
A
Felt guilty.
- [51:52]
B
Yeah. You feel guilty for being out.
- [51:54]
A
Yeah.
- [51:54]
B
You know what I'm saying?
- [51:55]
A
Were you talking to him while he was inside?
- [51:57]
B
They wasn't allowing us to talk at first. They wasn't allowing him to talk to anybody, but then they allowed us to talk and I spoke to him and we spoke for about two hours. And he was talking about how he seen himself on TV in jail and shit, and how I'm just like, yo, you got the world going crazy. Like, this shit is nuts. This is not even a just you thing. This is a world thing.
- [52:28]
A
What was he talking about?
- [52:30]
B
He was talking about. He said, man, everybody in here got a buck fifty on their face. I'm like, word?
- [52:37]
A
You mean a slash?
- [52:38]
B
A slash across their face? He said, but everybody's spirits is, like, up. It's like lifers. I'm talking to that smile every day. And they asked me if I'm good and things like that. He's like, there wasn't no ill will towards him. He was in good spirits. He just wanted to be home.
- [52:56]
A
I mean, they made it like his lawyers made it. Like, yo, he's going through hell. It's cold. It's this and that.
- [53:02]
B
I mean, we wanted him to come home, of course. And it probably was all of those things. Like, he probably. I'm pretty sure, like those people was, you know, some of those people was treating him nice. But at the same time, he's still in jail. Like, you're not home. Like you're still locked up. You have to listen to when somebody wants you to eat shit, do everything. Like come out, go on your cell. Like, man, I hate working for somebody else. I could imagine a CEO telling me to when I could shit and fucking do shit.
- [53:34]
A
Right?
- [53:34]
B
Yeah.
- [53:35]
A
When did y'all meet?
- [53:37]
B
Me and Rocky met. I hadn't been like 16.
- [53:46]
A
Uh huh. I mean, like, meeting him was critical to you becoming an emcee, right? Like that's part of your.
- [53:53]
B
Well, doing it professionally. Yeah, yeah, definitely. Because he was more so on the rapping thing and like doing it as a career. I was doing a rapping thing as a hobby and I was like really trying to push me, like getting my own fashion brand and doing art.
- [54:12]
A
So that was the dream, to be a fashion designer?
- [54:15]
B
Yeah, that was the dream. That was one of the dreams. Yeah.
- [54:18]
A
Bigger than being a rapper?
- [54:20]
B
Yeah. The dream was never to just be a rapper. Like, the dream was just to be like a figure. Like that made change. Cause I would pick. And the reason why I say that is like, I used to pray and I used to be like, man, I used to pray to God for all the girls. I'm pretty sure every dude did pray for all of the girls. I used to want to be a huge figure. I used to see Birdman on his tour bus with like sweatsuits, with like stacks of money and jewelry. I'm like, man, I need an assistant that's gonna bring my jury back. Like Birdman has his nephew or whoever he had bringing his big stone rings and going to the Gucci store and spending all of this money. Like, I wanted that, but I didn't know what was going to get me there. And I also will look at Karl Lagerfeld documentaries. Is Picasso, Basquiat movies, Francis Bacon, Jeff Koons, Raf Simmons, Versace. Who killed Versace? Jimi Hendrix, Gandhi, Malcolm X. Like, I used to just study all of these people and I used to read books on them. Elvis, Liberace, you could. Elton John, you could go on and on. Cameron. Like, I would just try to tap in and see what these people was, what gave them their charisma and what made them. What made them tap into what they was doing.
- [56:04]
A
What'd you learn from Jeff Koons? Because I love him and his work.
- [56:08]
B
And how I love his work too.
- [56:10]
A
How he flips it and he makes just fantastic toys for Rich people.
- [56:15]
B
Well, I think he's one of the biggest artists.
- [56:18]
A
Yeah, he is.
- [56:19]
B
Of our time. Like, if not the biggest artist, but even Damien Hirsch, too, Like, yeah, they just. Damien Hirst's work was dark to me. It remind me of Francis Bacon. But he did, like, installations with sharks and a shark just.
- [56:35]
A
Just hanging out from all the hide.
- [56:37]
B
Just like.
- [56:38]
A
I love that.
- [56:38]
B
I'm like, how are you hanging this shark? Or how you.
- [56:42]
A
Or a sheep.
- [56:43]
B
Yeah, or a sheep just sitting there. How are you. I don't see any bubbles around it. Right, right. You know what I'm saying? Or like the pill room, which is something different to me now, being older now, I could ask him questions about stuff like that. Before, I would see it and be like, this shit is just cool. But now that shit meant something for him to do that. Even like Jeff Coons, like the huge. The glass hearts and the puppy. Yeah, the puppy. Or the rabbits and the bubble. I mean, the balloon silver rabbits. Yep. What I learned from Jeff Koons is team, team, team, having a team and delegating. And I learned that from an early age. Cause I was like, man, he's a big artist. He's not necessarily touching every canvas.
- [57:43]
A
Right.
- [57:44]
B
But I'm pretty sure he studied Andy Warhol and the whole Factory. No doubt vibe. Because Andy Warhol started that where, like, he would have people come silk screen for him, all the Elvis canvases with the colors and all of that. Like, he can. He's more of a director.
- [58:04]
A
Yeah, yeah.
- [58:05]
B
So it was a new way of creating art.
- [58:07]
A
Yeah. Hell yeah. They say Picasso was the most important artist of the first part of the century.
- [58:14]
B
And that's arguable. Isn't that arguable? With Matisse, Picasso and Matisse going at.
- [58:22]
A
It, I would say Duchamp is incredibly important for the first half of the century.
- [58:27]
B
Okay, I gotta study him.
- [58:29]
A
I mean, Duchamp, he took a urinal and put it in a gallery and he said, art. And they were like, how is that art? Cause you signed your name on. He said, it's a ready made, it's done. I went to see it with my wife when she was my girlfriend, went to France and we saw it and I was like, that's not art. And she was way more into art than I was. And she was like, yeah, it is. And we argued for three days.
- [58:56]
B
And how was that art? How is that considered art?
- [58:59]
A
Because art is everywhere.
- [59:01]
B
Everything is everywhere.
- [59:03]
A
And, like, you know, it doesn't have to.
- [59:04]
B
Math is art.
- [59:05]
A
Yeah. It doesn't have to be some thing that an artist created that only certain individuals can make. Like anything can be art.
- [59:14]
B
Yeah. Is that the way you look at it? Is your perception?
- [59:17]
A
Yeah. I mean, is it good art or bad art? That's a whole other conversation. You could say.
- [59:21]
B
Well, I mean, but it's perception still.
- [59:23]
A
Yeah.
- [59:23]
B
As what you see as good and bad. Because people may consider Basquiat painting tires white, not art.
- [59:30]
A
But like, Warhol takes that aesthetic and takes the second half of the century and just blows it up.
- [59:36]
B
He was inspired by him.
- [59:38]
A
Definitely. Definitely. I mean, yeah. You think he's painting Campbell's soup cans. He's like, anything can be art. Why not a Campbell soup can?
- [59:46]
B
Who's your favorite top three artists?
- [59:48]
A
Oh, my God. Top three. I mean, Picasso's gotta be up there.
- [59:52]
B
Definitely.
- [59:53]
A
I love Jeff Koons. I love Damien Hirst. I love Basquiat to death. I love Romare Bearden.
- [60:01]
B
Haven't heard of him.
- [60:02]
A
Oh, Romare Bearden is probably the greatest black visual artist. Harlem guy made collages where he makes the collages.
- [60:11]
B
Yes, I know who he is.
- [60:13]
A
Yes.
- [60:13]
B
I see his work.
- [60:14]
A
And like, beautiful work. William Johnson, another great black artist. I mean, so. I mean, I love Kehinde Wiley's work.
- [60:23]
B
Kehende dope. He painted some of my friends early on. That's how I found out about him. And plus, he looks like Ice Cube to me.
- [60:35]
A
I love Kara Walker.
- [60:37]
B
Okay, you have to send me some of these names.
- [60:39]
A
No doubt, no doubt.
- [60:40]
B
Yeah, more the blacks. Cause I know, like, the master whites.
- [60:45]
A
Carol Walker does some amazing stuff where, like, it'll be like a white wall and she'll put like two dimensional black images, like the color black out of slavery. And it'll be like crazy, violent, crazy sexual, crazy fucked up moments that probably happened for real in slavery. Cause she's fucked up and she's depicting it and putting it in the middle of the MoMA or the Whitney. And people coming in to get their little art fixed and she's stabbing you in the eye with this is how it used to be.
- [61:19]
B
What type of art would you put in your house? And like, why, son?
- [61:24]
A
I mean, I mean, you know, I would buy whatever I could afford, but I would definitely get some beard in. I would definitely have. I would. I mean, I would love to have Damien Hirst. I mean, you know, Warhol's amazing. You know, I love Richard Avedon.
- [61:43]
B
Haven't heard of him.
- [61:43]
A
His photographs. He's just a great photographer.
- [61:48]
B
But some of these artists, right? Do you feel like they bring certain moods?
- [61:55]
A
Oh, yeah.
- [61:56]
B
And spirits and energy into your house. Yeah. And that's what I be like. I'm getting into collecting art too. So, like, I think about that. I think about moods, like, and what I want to wake up and see and how is it going to inspire me or move me for the day.
- [62:11]
A
Yeah. I mean, there's certain. Yeah, there's certain pieces. Let's say Basquiat. Certain pieces will like, lift you up because there's an exuberance to it and excitement to it. And there's certain pieces that will frickin drag you down.
- [62:24]
B
Yeah. Like that last painting he did.
- [62:26]
A
Which one?
- [62:27]
B
Which was the Skeleton Horse.
- [62:29]
A
Yes, yes.
- [62:31]
B
It's a beautiful painting, but I couldn't put that in my house.
- [62:33]
A
Yo. I used to date a girl who had had a heroin issue before we were together and we went to see that painting and she was like, that's what it feels like to be on heroin.
- [62:44]
B
Wow.
- [62:44]
A
And I was like, wow. Cause that's what he was kind of trying to evoke. Like Riding with death.
- [62:49]
B
Yeah.
- [62:50]
A
And he was like, I see it. Like, that piece freaks me out.
- [62:56]
B
Freaks me out too, in a good way. When I was younger, like, I'm like, that shit is cool. Like, that shit is probably going for mad bread. But now, like, you could afford that shit. Or like, I can't afford that shit. But I'm just saying, that shit. I couldn't put that in my house.
- [63:10]
A
I mean, a Romare bearden. To me, I would love to have something like that. Cause it's so beautiful and vibrant and dynamic and it's us. It's really the spirit of black people in the way he makes it and what he's talking about and what he's showing, you know? And the pieces will be incredibly detailed, so you can look at it every day and see something a little different. And like, you know that I would really love to be able to look at it over and over and see something a little different each time.
- [63:39]
B
Yeah. You know, I love Rothko.
- [63:42]
A
Yeah. Yeah.
- [63:43]
B
Rothko is just. Because it's like, even if he's trying to evoke violence or emotion or whatever the. Like, whatever it is, it still can be like. It's like water to me.
- [63:57]
A
Yeah.
- [63:57]
B
Cause it's just color.
- [63:58]
A
There's this brother in LA named Mark Bradford who's dope. He's one of the dopest current living black artists.
- [64:09]
B
Yeah.
- [64:10]
A
Definitely check him out. But like, Rothko is so powerful and it's so simple.
- [64:16]
B
Yeah.
- [64:16]
A
It's another one that's like, is this art? I just Put one or two on it.
- [64:21]
B
Yeah, but it's like the blends, the color blends, like the black on black, the matte black with the faded black, the. The blues that just goes into, like, the oranges and the yellows like that. I'm pretty sure Rothko inspired Hyte William videos and color and. Yeah, just that whole time. And mood, like, Ralph goes. Had to be on Hyde Williams mood boards.
- [64:49]
A
Yeah. There's this sister, Amy Sherald, who's crushing it right now. Amazing portraitist Amy Sherrod. Yeah. Remember when. When Barack and Michelle had their official portraits come out and Kehende did Barack's and Amy, Cheryl did Michelle's.
- [65:07]
B
Oh, wow.
- [65:07]
A
And it's dope. She's dope. She's dope.
- [65:10]
B
That's amazing.
- [65:13]
A
Let's go back for a second to emceeing. What's the difference between a good MC and a great mc?
- [65:21]
B
A good MC just knows how to rap. A great MC has integrity, he has intention and purpose. A great MC is Jay Z.
- [65:36]
A
What's your top three or five? Jay Z, number one all time.
- [65:43]
B
I don't know if it's out of Jay Z and Biggie. Okay, Jay Z, Biggie, and I'm gonna just say Eminem.
- [65:55]
A
That's your top three. I'm mad at you.
- [65:57]
B
Yeah.
- [65:57]
A
Where's Nas?
- [65:59]
B
I love Nas to death. I mean, but you ain't gimme a top five.
- [66:02]
A
Well, if it was five, is he four or is he right in there?
- [66:05]
B
He'll be in there. Yeah.
- [66:06]
A
What about Rakim?
- [66:08]
B
See, I gotta study more. I'm young, I'm 30. But I know he's the God. I've heard he's. I know Rakim is known for breaking the mold of an artist. I mean, Rakim, he came after Run dmc.
- [66:24]
A
Yes.
- [66:24]
B
And he showed us. Well, Run DMC showed us that we didn't have to wear costumes and shit, Right. And, like, to look like what I look like now. I mean, Knievel pants and shit.
- [66:39]
A
Run DMC takes the routine era.
- [66:42]
B
Yeah.
- [66:42]
A
And makes it a little more complex.
- [66:44]
B
Right.
- [66:45]
A
But it's still kind of routines, right? They're doing the verses together.
- [66:50]
B
It's rock and then turns higher. So. Yeah, like that. Like, Peter Parker picked pepper, rum, rock, rhymes. Right.
- [66:58]
A
But then Rakim just fucked it all up. Complexity. It was a different level of complexity than everybody had ever done to that point. And I think everybody after him is his son in a way.
- [67:10]
B
And he his son.
- [67:13]
A
I mean, as an emcee.
- [67:14]
B
Yeah. Facts. He's the father of the style, like internal rhymes of us rapping. Multi style and flow. Complexity, Complexity. He's talking knowledge. He wore a 7 on his jacket. Dapper Dan jacket.
- [67:29]
A
And talking about emceeing.
- [67:31]
B
Yeah, yeah. Facts, factual. Yes, I will have to concur.
- [67:37]
A
What is your. What is the most instructive failure that you've had? The failure that you learned and grew.
- [67:45]
B
The most from as far as music.
- [67:47]
A
Or just anything in life?
- [67:50]
B
Failure? For me, there's no such thing as failure, okay? Because, like, there's only lessons and no losses. And that's the attitude I try to have. And in fact, the more failure or more times we fall, it just makes us stronger. So, like, I don't consider it a failure. I just feel just a minor setback for you to make a major comeback.
- [68:19]
A
Right, Right. What do you want for your next four to five years? What's your big plan or your big dream?
- [68:30]
B
I want to build a clothing line. I want to really. I love what Kanye did with Yeezus and, like, sneakers and all of that. Creating his world. I'm continuing to create my world and what that is and show people I could use different mediums to express myself as an artist, be on my music.
- [68:52]
A
You want to move into being a.
- [68:54]
B
Clothing designer, Designer, period. Designer of great music, a curator, a dj. I design already. So it's like, I designed these pants.
- [69:06]
A
Would you design furniture?
- [69:07]
B
Designed this watch. I designed a rug in Nepal. I took my logo, which is the Devoni logo. It was a childhood brand that I started where I was making belts and leather goods and, like, I'm starting to do, like, more stuff with it. Home goods. Cause I just brought my first house. So, like, I just wanted to decorate it with my own art. I wanted to have the most exclusive shit. So it's like, you know, the way I could do that is just create it. Make my own couches, make my own pillows, make my own rugs, make my own dishes.
- [69:39]
A
Okay.
- [69:40]
B
Yeah.
- [69:40]
A
So where are you going with that next?
- [69:43]
B
I'm signed with Adidas. If you go on Google, you'll see, like, both of my shoes. I did. I want to make my own silhouette. Like, beyond Adidas and Jordan and all of that. Like, I would love to just make a shoe that, like, I love what Tyler is doing with his brand and golf and all of that.
- [70:02]
A
What is the silhouette that you people.
- [70:04]
B
Think Tyler is so silly and.
- [70:06]
A
No, no, no.
- [70:07]
B
Crazy. No, no. He's brilliant. He's a genius. Tyler.
- [70:11]
A
Brilliant. What is the silhouette that you are thinking about for your Ferg sneaker?
- [70:18]
B
I don't know what that is yet. I'm still like, pondering about it, but like, the shoe business is just such a great business and everybody loves shoes and I would love to be a part of that.
- [70:28]
A
Why'd you go with Adidas instead of Nike?
- [70:32]
B
They were just the ones I grew with. I met them early on when Rocky did a shoe with them and Jeremy Scott and we just kept the rapport going. They supported. They brought me out to, like, different shows and paid me to fly to Russia and do things and see the world. So, you know, they got me in bed early. So.
- [70:53]
A
You know, you have accomplished a lot, you're dealing with a lot. You're succeeding at a lot of different things. What is your superpower?
- [71:04]
B
My superpower is vision. I have vision. I could see what I say. How I started off tweed, Are you not here? All these rappers, I'm gonna put them in dishes. I'ma kill all these rappers, I'm gonna put them in dishes. They was rocking with your ass. So they made a decision. A lot of. I'll tell you the vision. I'm trying to think of these lyrics, I said, but basically I got the vision. I got the vision for myself and others. Is that a Jay Z line?
- [71:39]
A
I don't know. Is it?
- [71:42]
B
I don't know. He said, for I say a big verse. I'm big enough, my brothers. I'm big enough to do it. I don't think he said vision, though. But I got the vision for myself and others. Meaning I can see very far, very far. Like it's a talent. I think I've studied people enough to know tribes of people. Like, I know that there's a certain type of tribe I'm with, a certain. I know myself, I know who I'm with. I'm with like Busta, Missy, Ludacris, like David Bowie. Creative, very creative.
- [72:22]
A
Extra out there pushing the boundaries.
- [72:26]
B
Right, Exactly. That's a tribe of people. And like Wayne has a tribe of people. Where it's like Wayne, like young thug, Lil Uzi, like in a hard time.
- [72:37]
A
Hardcore energy.
- [72:38]
B
Exactly. Like rock and roll energy.
- [72:41]
A
Rock and roll, yeah.
- [72:43]
B
And then you also have like the Pharrell, which is like Dallas Austin, like Lenny Kravitz.
- [72:52]
A
Brilliant, creative, kind of young. Even though you're grown.
- [72:57]
B
Yeah, yeah. Uh huh.
- [73:02]
A
Essentially you put yourself with Bowie. Yeah, because he's the man.
- [73:06]
B
Bowie is the man. Bowie is the man. He changed the game.
- [73:12]
A
I mean, what I see, like what he does, what he did creatively, sartorially, musically, like, totally change up Every album and shit.
- [73:24]
B
Like, I don't know what sartorial means.
- [73:26]
A
Clothing.
- [73:26]
B
Okay.
- [73:27]
A
In terms of clothing. Like, rappers don't usually do that, right? In terms of, like, you know, like, painting your face or, like, changing completely.
- [73:34]
B
And, like, I painted my face for the first fashion week. I participated in the first Kanye west fashion show. I had my face painted. It's a picture with me, Jay Z, Travis Scott, Kanye, and I think Nas. And I had my face painted.
- [73:53]
A
So 10 years from now, are you just designing and not rapping and moving into here's the house of Ferg, you know, or whatever it's called. And, like, I'm more like Lagerfeld than.
- [74:08]
B
I think I will always be rapping as long as I got something to say. Like, the moment, I got nothing to say. And I'm pretty sure I'm always gonna have something to say. Like, I'm always gonna be rapping and.
- [74:21]
A
Okay.
- [74:22]
B
Yeah.
- [74:23]
A
Thank you.
- [74:23]
B
This is a very good interview. One of the best.
- [74:34]
A
Thanks to my man Ferg for a great interview, and thanks to you for listening to Ray. Show gives you fuel to power your dreams, because you can use your dreams like a rocket ship to bl into a life you never imagined. You can make your dreams a reality, and maybe this show can help. I'm on Twitter at Torre and on Instagram at Torres Show. Please leave a review on itunes. It really helps. And tell your friends about the show. Toray show is written by me, Tor, and produced by Jackie Garfano. Our photographers are Chuck Marcus and Shanta Covington, and we're distributed by DCP Entertainment. And we will be back, no doubt, next Wednesday with another amazing person because the man can't shut us down.