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- [00:02]
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- [00:10]
Toure
2?
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- [00:28]
Maxine Waters
And that's the My dad works in B2B marketing. He came by my school for career day and said he was a big roas man. Then he told everyone how much he loved calculating his return on ad spend. My friends still laugh at me to this day.
- [00:44]
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- [01:15]
Toure
What was 16 like for you? What happened to you that day?
- [01:19]
Maxine Waters
When I saw the noose hanging up there, it was really strange for me because I just worked with Lee Daniels on The United States vs. Billie Holiday where she was singing, you know, strange fruit based on the lynchings that she had seen. And then I also thought about, I just read the book the Devil you know and that the lynchings that he Talked about, the 5,000 or so lynchings before the Civil War. And I'm thinking, and looking at that noose and looking at them, I said well they say that that's supposed to for pence that they're going to hang him. But I wonder, I wonder first of all if they're going to hang a white man. And secondly, I wonder how many of us they would hang if we, if we showed up and got in the way. I just thought that yeah, certainly I would have been killed.
- [02:12]
Toure
Maxine Waters has been an incredibly important congressperson for a very long time. I could not wait to talk to her about raising the minimum wage, getting Covid relief out to people, and just how she is able to find success as a congressperson. Couldn't wait to do this conversation. It's Congresswoman Maxine Waters on Torre Show. One of the things that people have been talking about since the beginning of this is what are we going to do for renters? How are people who are renters going to survive when a lot of them are not able to work or they're working at far lesser wages. And a lot of homeowners have been helped. We were able to pause our mortgage for three to six months or more last year. And now you're trying to get something done for renters. What have you been able to do and how did you do it? Did you have. Because I know there's horse trading that goes on. Did you have to give away certain things to get the protection for renters?
- [03:22]
Maxine Waters
Well, thank you very much for asking the question, because rental assistance has been a priority of mine. And I started out when we first had the CARES act and we were not able to get it in. And then when we had the Heroes Act, I was able to get my idea of what we should be doing into that bill. And as the final bill has come out, we have $21 billion for rental assistance. Now. It has been frustrating because, as you know, there were a lot of rental moratoriums that were being put on, and small landlords were having a fit because they didn't have the money to do repairs and upkeep. Some of them, of course, still have mortgages on that property that they had to pay. And so I agreed with the small landlords that I thought that the extension of the rental moratoriums was being hurtful and harmful to them, except we didn't have anything in place to replace it. And getting this 21 billion now in place has been, you know, pretty difficult. We have a lot of support from people who know that we need to give rental assistance, but we were not able to really figure out how to get that money into the hands of the renters and how to get that money into the hands of the landlords. And so we know now we've got the money, the bill is going to pass. The 21 billion is in that it's going to be run, I believe, through the Treasury Department. But they have to now go to the states. And the states agencies, housing agencies, whatever those agents are with the state, are going to have to get this money out to the renters and to the landlords. And so the process is stressful for me because I wanted to do this a lot faster. I know that there are people who have not been able to pay their rent since last March, for example. But yes, it's going to be taken care of, but it's not fast enough. And the moratoriums have been mixed because in addition to the federal moratorium that we placed on evictions, the states and the counties all were doing different kinds of things, and they came up with programs for rental Moratoriums, and they ended at different times. And so people have been a little bit confused. Some people have been able to get help because some of the cities and counties did take some money from the CARES bill and do some assistance in some way. But it has not been easy. And I know that people are anxious about it. I'm anxious, too. But I'm going to follow it all the way through to make sure that the rental assistance is done and that the landlords get paid.
- [06:12]
Toure
My dream and my thought, because I think it makes good political sense, is that we give people monthly payments, $1,000, $2,000, whatever it is, every month, until we feel like we're through this thing directly into the hands of the people rather than into corporations. And I imagine the politician in the party that's able to say, hey, we're giving you money every month. That would be extremely valuable politically. Is that even possible?
- [06:41]
Maxine Waters
No, but it has been talked about. As you know, we had no Republicans on this bill when it passed the House, no Republicans supporting the bill when it came out of the Senate. And so. And so, in addition to that, the numbers are so close, you have to worry about whether or not you're gonna lose Democrats. And so we have problems with a couple of our more conservative Democrats. And so that kind of progressive thought. No. Has not been able to move very far.
- [07:12]
Toure
So that, I mean, the way the structure of the Senate shapes what you guys think about in Congress, about, like, we can't send that up because that'll never get through. So we have. Right. Is that. That shapes how you think about legislation every day.
- [07:27]
Maxine Waters
Well, you know, what happens is you pass legislation out of the House and then you take it to the Senate, and then you fight to try and keep it the way that you passed it. And the senators, even, in my estimation, if they don't have any great ideas, they just gotta put their fingerprints on it. And so what happens is they start to nitpick here and there. And you saw Manchin, what he did with the unemployment benefits. He reduced it from 400 to $300. Took hours and hours, hours on that debate, which didn't make good sense to me. There may be some other nicks in there also, but, yes, in order to get a bill that we both agree on, and before we can take it to the President's desk, we have to tolerate the concerns of the Senate.
- [08:13]
Toure
I feel like Republicans in the House and in the Senate are not acting in good faith. They are not acting in terms of what's best for their constituents. They're saying we don't wanna do anything that would help this new president which would then possibly lead to him getting reelected, which could possibly lead to Nancy Pelosi being continuing to be there. Do you feel like they don't act in good faith, they just do things to try to hurt you Dems politically?
- [08:40]
Maxine Waters
Absolutely. They certainly cannot be trusted to act in good faith as you have described. And I just don't know how they get away with it with their constituents. Now for this, for the Rescue act. What we did have is so much public support, Republicans alike, you know, their constituents alike who were supporting it, and they still didn't vote for it, and they still get away with it. And I just wonder all the time how they get away with not responding to the needs of their own constituents. Because I want to tell you something. This $1,400 in cash stimulus checks that we're going to give out, you got poor Republicans who need it more than poor Democrats, you know, and on and on and on. You know, that money is so important. Whether you're talking about, you know, small businesses, you're talking about restaurants that are closing down, whether you're talking about many of the businesses that won't ever open up again. These guys literally choose to oppose us because it is political, as you have identified. It is about whether or not they're going to look successful. It is whether or not they're going to get reelected. It's whether or not this president is going to get reelected. But they absolutely have made a mistake on this one because like I said, the public does support it. Number one, the President looks good on being able to have delivered $1.9 trillion in a relatively short period of time. And we're going right to the needs of the people. And they're waiting, they're desperate. We've had these food lines where people, women and the children standing in line around blocks to get a bag of food because children and families are hungry. And the lines have been long. And so, yes, we're going to have the appreciation certainly of Democrats, but we're going to have the appreciation of a lot of Republicans who are desperate, who are in need, who are poor, who are living on the edge, who have lost their jobs, on and on and on with that. So they made a mistake on this one. They're gonna get hurt, not us.
- [10:56]
Toure
I mean, I feel like when we talk about how can they survive making these sorts of moves, it's probably because they don't live in the reality that we live in, which includes facts and logic and history. They get news, quote unquote from Fox, which paints the story in an entirely dishonest way. And they are misinformed. And I mean, that's part of why they get to succeed.
- [11:23]
Maxine Waters
You know, that is so true. And I'm baffled about how misinformed they are. When they invaded the Capitol and there was one woman who was caught in kind of a crush, and they put a microphone before her to ask her, you know, why was she here? What was she doing? And she said, this is the revolution. We've got to take back our government. This is a revolution. And she was serious about it. And you know, this indoctrination that they're able to do is baffling. But you would be surprised how many people bite and how many people buy into these lies and these distortions.
- [12:04]
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- [12:36]
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- [13:04]
Toure
What was 16 like for you? What happened to you that day?
- [13:09]
Maxine Waters
Well, to tell you the truth, I had gone over to the gallery to witness the proceedings where the electoral votes were going to be announced and dealt with. And so once we had to divide, as you know, when they objected, and the way the Constitution goes, you get an objection and then you divide. The Senate goes back to the Senate, the House stays over here, and you debate it. Okay? So once the division took place and I sat there and began to watch our debate, well, I knew everything that our people were going to say, so I said, you know what? I think I'll go back to my office. I don't need to sit here and watch this. So I got up and walked back to my office from the inside. Didn't see anything, anybody. By the time I got to my office and turned on the television. They had breached, you know, the barricades. They were, you know, breaking, you know, the glass. They were out in a way that the chief of police told me never could happen. Four days before the invasion, I had a one hour telephone meeting with the chief of police. I asked him about whether or not they were going to be able to get up on the plaza. He said, no, they would have barricades. I asked him whether or not they knew that the Proud Boys were in town and the Oath Keepers and how were they going to deal with that. And they said that they did not do reservations for space for people to protest based on groups that if an individual came in, it could be an individual from the Proud Boys, it could be an individual, you know, from the Oath Keepers, but they wouldn't know that. But they're going to keep a close eye. And I said, well, on the grassy part, where maybe there's going to be a confrontation with protesters who will come and say that they're opposite from them and what they're trying to do. He said, oh, we'll have police in there everywhere, and we won't allow that. I said, well, what are you going to do about guns? They do not allow guns. This is not a gun carry state. They don't allow guns in D.C. he said, well, if any guns show up, we're going to, we're going to deal with that right on the spot. I even went so far as to tell him, look, you should be concerned about the top of the buildings because Martin Luther King and Kennedy were, you know, targeted from up high. I said, and so you should, you should have the top of the. He said, they can't get on top of our buildings. He said in order for them to get on top of the Capitol, they'd have to go into the Capitol. And then what did we see? Them scaling the wall. Scaling the wall. I asked him if they could block off the intersection up at the Capitol. He said, no, they couldn't do that because they had their First Amendment rights and they had to have passageways down the main thoroughfare on and on. And he made every excuse. But the Proud Boys had been in town days before the invasion took place. As a matter of fact, I think the Metropolitan Police had driven the head of the Proud Boys out of town because they had caused some trouble with one of the churches, I believe here. But they didn't seem to know any of this, or if they knew it, they were lying to me and telling me that we didn't have to worry. And so anyhow, the police were either, like I said, ignorant and incompetent, or they just plain didn't want to see us be able to drive them away or drive them back. But what I discovered was they didn't even know the numbers that were in town. And even though there had been a march, they were surprised when they took over both sides of the Capitol. They were on both sides of the Capitol, but they didn't.
- [17:08]
Toure
Were you scared at any point?
- [17:11]
Maxine Waters
You know, I was worried. Here's what I thought. I thought, boy, if you show your face out there, they'll kill you. You know what I'm saying?
- [17:20]
Toure
You thought that about yourself. If I go out there, I'll be killed.
- [17:23]
Maxine Waters
I knew they would kill me. I just know that because just days before that, I was getting threats, more threats. We get threats a lot. And I've been able to get some indicted and some convicted, But I know that they're haters and they had weapons. And I just know if I had walked up there any place where they were, I would have been killed. I believe that. I absolutely believe that. And so I got into my office and I got a call at some point. Well, I called the chief of police and I just. I mean, I just told him everything I thought about him and how he had misled me or how he was incompetent and how this was totally unacceptable. And I just slammed the phone up in his face. But then I got a call that said that the Capitol police was guiding all of the members into a room, a big room, because they wanted to keep tabs on us and know where we were. And I told them, I'm not going anywhere. I'm not moving out of this office. We locked all of our doors. We barricaded ourselves in, and I did not move, my staff did not move and come to. You know, we're so glad we didn't because they took them all to a big room in the Cannon building where we had Republicans with no mask and we had Democrats, even though the Republicans didn't tell us, but our Democrats who got sick, who got Covid, you know, and so I'm so glad I didn't go there. But evidently they didn't know what they were doing. They didn't have a plan. So this business surrounding us up and taking us someplace was one of these last minute things that they thought they should do in order to provide us with some kind of safety. But they didn't have a plan about what would happen, you know, if in fact they got literally taken over by a mob. And so it was. It was unnerving watching them. And I was thinking about the hatred that I saw, but I was thinking about the way that they was breaking the glass in. In the window. And one guy, you know, just took it with his fist and then one wrapped a little something. And I mean, they were. They were angry, they were mad, they were crazy. And I just thought that, yeah, certainly I would have been killed. And when I saw the noose hanging up there, it was really strange for me because I just worked with Lee Daniels on The United States vs. Billie Holiday, where she was singing Strange Fruit based on the lynchings that she had seen. And then I also thought about, let's see, I just read the book the Devil, you know, and that the lynchings that he Talked about, the 5,000 or so lynchings before the Civil War. And I'm thinking, and looking at that noose and looking at them, I said, well, they say that that's supposed to be for Pence, that they're gonna hang him. But I wonder. I wonder, first of all, if they're gonna hang a white man. And secondly, I wonder how many of us they would hang if we. If we showed up and got in the way. And so it was that kind of. That kind of just absolutely almost giving up on our government and giving up on our ability to deal with these domestic terrorists. The idea that they could come in broad open daylight in the way that they did, and basically break into the Capitol and go into the Senate floor and into Nancy Pelosi's office and all of that. I just really had a feeling of these people are out of control. They've got the president on their side, they've got the weapons, and we can't do anything with these people. They're going to cause real harm and they're going to kill folks. That's what I really thought.
- [21:35]
Toure
Some of your current colleagues helped the insurrectionists. Do you feel safe being in a body day to day with people who thought, those are my people, not you and Nancy?
- [21:53]
Maxine Waters
Well, you know, I don't think about really feeling safe. I know that they had to stop them from bringing guns on the floor. And I know that when you talk to some of them, and particularly the one that we know belongs to Qanon, et cetera, I just get angry. And I just. You know what I really think? You come for me, I'm coming for you. You know what I really think? If I have to die, I just have to die because I'm not Gonna walk around here in fear of you. You just don't. Don't come for me. Okay. I mean, that's really what I was thinking.
- [22:29]
Toure
What should happen to the people who invaded the Capitol that day?
- [22:34]
Maxine Waters
Well, first of all, the FBI supposedly is identifying them one by one, two by two. They're arresting some, some are being held, others are being released on their own recognizance. They're all supposed to be facing indictments, et cetera. And so I think they should keep up with that, because here's what I believe. I believe that some of those people really did not think that anything could happen to them, that they had the president on their side, and so they're looking to be taken care of. And some of them didn' even think they'd be arrested. Some of them think, well, if I get arrested, they are going to bail me out. But we control the courts and the judges and the president does, and so we don't really have to worry. That's what I think. Now, what do I think about domestic terrorists? I think that unless this country gets a handle on, identify, and come up with special ways of convicting domestic terrorists, that we're in for a long haul with them getting bolder and bolder, particularly if Trump, you know, raises all of this money, intimidates those Republicans who are afraid to vote against him or say a word against him, that I think they get stronger. And also, you know, there are so many tricks in all of this because the head of Q or not had a relationship with the FBI, and they basically was. The head of the QAnon was basically an informant who was given information on stuff like drug dealing and those kinds of things. And you have to be doing that in exchange for not bothering you, because they knew he was. You know what I'm saying? So when I look around, I don't know who to trust. You know what I mean? I don't know who to trust. You know what I'm saying? And I tell my grandchildren and everybody every day, I say, we live in a society where many of the services that we need are provided by whites, but we don't know who they are. We don't know what they're thinking. What do you know if you in an emergency and you go to the emergency room and there's a white doctor? What do you know about the teacher that's teaching your child? What do you know about. You know, you don't.
- [25:01]
Toure
We do know that white supremacist groups have for years been telling their members, join the local Police department so we can continue to maintain power that way. So when you or I are and it doesn't happen to you, cuz you have a bubble. But when I get pulled over by a cop or when I get eyeballed walking down the street in Brooklyn by a cop, I don't know that he's not a proud boy or an oath keeper or some sort of white supremacist.
- [25:29]
Maxine Waters
Oh, you're absolutely right. And it's not only the local police, it's your military. It is the police. And you know what's surprising is you have veterans who have been a part of and that's not all of them, but I do know that that's what's being identified. And even they have identified some Capitol police here who are aligned with and identified with some of the white supremacist groups. So you don't know what you're confronting. You don't know to whom you're talking. You don't know who may do harm to you. You just don't know.
- [26:05]
Toure
Let me go back to policy because you're the chair of the Financial Services Committee, incredibly important committee. I want to talk about what that work entails generally, but specifically, what's the chance that we can get $15 minimum wage for folks that would make such a difference for millions of Americans?
- [26:28]
Maxine Waters
Well, that issue is not in financial services. That's in ways it means. However, it doesn't matter whatever it was in. No, we don't have the votes for it. No, we don't have the votes for it.
- [26:39]
Toure
You don't have the votes in the Senate because you have them in the House.
- [26:42]
Maxine Waters
We have it in the House, in the Democrats, with the Democrats, but you don't have the votes with Democrats in the Senate. You're absolutely right.
- [26:50]
Toure
Why wouldn't you bring it up and make Republicans show their hand, make them vote on it and see, like we're all voting against $15 for you guys.
- [26:59]
Maxine Waters
Well, of course we made them vote against it on the House side, but on the Senate side, it's a whole different operation about how they do things and what gets brought up and when it gets brought up and all of that. And so we've just got to keep pushing and we've just got to keep trying to leverage and embarrass and use whatever tools we have. Because even now, $15, that's outdated. I mean, you really need more than $15 now. We started on $15 several years ago. And so we just have to keep working. But I tell you what will make the difference in the final analysis, the people on the street will make the difference. And to the degree that people are willing to organize and make sacrifices and basically show up in the numbers that we can show up, we can create some change. We already saw some weakening of racist attitudes about George Floyd after he was killed by the local cop. And you saw people coming along, some of the corporations, the kind of things that they advocated for, kind of embarrassing, you know, trying to make it look like that they truly understood what have you. But we saw some attempts by others to say, oh my goodness, I didn't realize it was that bad, that was that terrible. And they hit the streets. You saw a kind of a mixture of young and old, all different ethnicities. And so you saw a little movement and people saying, this is outrageous, but it's not enough. It's not enough.
- [28:49]
Toure
It seems to be so when you're running an important committee or just being an important congressperson, it seems to me like we, the public, see you giving a speech, doing an interview, but the real work is to be able to go to another member privately and say, how can I get you to vote for this with me? Can I give you something? Is that being persuaded? And just, can I give you something that'll help you out? Is that where the real work is? And how do you do that?
- [29:17]
Maxine Waters
No, no, no, it doesn't really work that way. I mean, you can make all the personal appeals you want. No, that does not work that way. As a matter of fact, there are some things you may be able to get some bipartisan support on. Not a lot, but when there is resistance, it is for a lot of reasons. And it's not just the issue itself. I want to tell you the basis of all of this racism, the basis of this in our society, it is that, that maybe you don't hear, you don't see, but you know, it comes out in different ways. As a matter of fact, when you watch the previous president in the way that he, you know, sent these dog whistles to his constituency, remember how he talked about our cities and talked about, you know, okay, he was sending a message that, you know, these black people don't care. They don't care about these communities. Look how they live, that's terrible. They're never going to do any better. We can't waste the taxpayers money on them. When he talked about our countries, you know, in other countries, black countries, you know, he's sending dog whistling to them. When he talked about the athletes, a big message. Look at all these big black Athletes doing so well. They're rich, they live good. You know, you don't even have this. You know what I'm saying? They're doing better than you. All of this. The basis of all of this stuff is racism.
- [30:54]
Toure
The basis of what separates Dems and Republicans is racism.
- [30:58]
Maxine Waters
Yeah, yeah. Yes. And this idea that Trump absolutely strengthened his voice on had to do with taking it back. Taking it back. Take back our country. You know what I mean? This is ours. They don't have any right to be.
- [31:20]
Toure
Yeah, we know that the Republican Party is completely for white people. Is the Democratic Party completely for black people? Or are we sort of mixed that, like, because we need to pull in white voters as well to survive.
- [31:42]
Maxine Waters
But here's the answer to that. You have some of our Democrats and, you know, a majority of them who have some basic philosophies about life and some basic philosophies about fairness, and they belong to the Democratic Party. We have some more conservatives who it is convenient for them to belong to the Democratic Party. They don't always believe what the Democrats are working on, but they vote with you because it is in their best interest to do so for one or two or three reasons. And so when you talk about Democrats versus Republicans, you absolutely have more Democrats that believe in fairness and equality and that no matter what, they should be at least about the business of seeing that children get educated, that there's a decent healthcare system, that there should be housing on the opposite side of the aisle. They think it's not their fault and that the government spends too much money now and that those people need to pull themselves up by the bootstraps. No, we shouldn't have public housing, paying all this money out for poor people. So there is a difference. There is a significant difference.
- [32:58]
Toure
So how do you go into the body, go into work and get things done when, you know there's this fault line and it's rare that it's ever crossed?
- [33:12]
Maxine Waters
Well, we just had four years of not getting anything done. I tried to get this president impeached from the beginning, right after the swearing in, because having watched him during the primary and the way he talked about and treated human beings, you know, grabbing women by their private parts, mocking and mimicking disabled people. I just couldn't see why folks didn't understand who this character was and what he was all about.
- [33:43]
Toure
But they did and they liked it.
- [33:46]
Maxine Waters
Well, some did. And he had a hardcore, hardcore group that will follow him no matter what he says or what he does. These are your hardcore racists. You know what I'm saying yes, but we beat them. We beat them because we have more people and blacks understanding the power of the vote and what Stacey Abrams was able to do based on her experience, based on the fact that she had run for office and know and knew that it had been stolen from her and she went and she didn't stop and she kept working it until we got the numbers and we were able to put, you know, two Democrats into the Senate, which is just unheard of.
- [34:29]
Toure
Have black people or are black people being sufficiently rewarded for the support to Joe Biden and the Dems that they gave which led to a Democratic controlled Senate or a 50, 50 Senate and a Joe Biden presidency? Because it's really black folks in Atlanta and Philadelphia and Detroit and Milwaukee who really showed up and made the difference. Are we getting our just due from having given Joe Biden the presidency?
- [35:05]
Maxine Waters
Well, here's what. And of course we're still early in it and of course time will tell. However, when you take a look at some of the appointments that are being made, some of them are very good. Some I think of them maybe we would have preferred to have a black in. But I think the last count was There were about 12 appointments that we liked an awful lot. And so he said he's got our back, he said we had his back and he's got our back. And so we are looking not only for appointments but public policy. And so in the 1.9 trillion dollar response that, that he's led, that's going to get voted out of the House in agreement with what has happened in the Senate and sent to his desk. We like the fact that he didn't back down on the amount because we even had Democrats sometimes who thought that, oh, it's too much money, never going to be able to get it. Republicans thought it was too much money even though they had given tax breaks to the richest people in this country. 1.9 trillion was money. So he stuck with that. And we think that he did good. He's doing good by increasing the testing for COVID 19, making sure that it got into black communities even deeper and more. In this bill we have substantial money for the vaccines and making sure that they get into all these minority communities even though a lot of black people are suspicious about the shots. And so far he's doing okay. He's got a lot more to do.
- [36:46]
Toure
But he's doing what can we do to get more black people to be comfortable taking the vaccine? Because as you just said, more of us are vulnerable and dying. From COVID For social reasons, you know, we're more likely to be essential workers. We're more likely to have preexisting health conditions. We're more likely to be in multifamily homes. And yet a large percentage of us, a good 30 to 35% of us, are like, like, I'm not taking the vaccine at all. I remember Tuskegee. I remember medical racism. I'm not doing. And I'm like, you guys, like, what? So what can we do to get more black people? Because you've had your shots, right?
- [37:27]
Maxine Waters
Sure had two. Yeah. Pfizer. Yep. And so here's what we have to do. First of all, we have to demonstrate that we are taking our shots and we're asking everybody else to take theirs. We've got to go out, you know, to the ministers and the churches and the social clubs and organizations. And it's hard, you know, living the way that we're living. But we've got to do everything that we can. I want to. In Los Angeles, I was talking with one of the. One of the health centers that's begging. You know, they've got all of this. All of this medicine in this center. And black people are not showing up, as a matter of fact, because black people are not showing up. Whites are coming from other neighborhoods and they're going into our neighborhoods getting the shots because it's available. It's available. Now. I really do believe that one of the things that will help out, two of the things that will help out, I think the ministers could be a lot more influential. They have the most number of black people in, you know, in the religious efforts, in the church on Sunday when the churches are open. But now, if they're doing it, virtually, however they're doing it, they're in touch. They've got a database, all of these churches. And I think that when the minister says, I'm getting mine, and I want everybody at 10 o'clock on Sunday morning, whatever, to be at so and so and so and so to get your. I think it could help a lot. The other thing that I think could help is athletes and entertainers. I think it entertainers. I think, you know, our hip hop movement still has a lot of power. And I think, you know, you get Cardi B. And, you know, you get Pete Diddy and Jay Z and you get everybody out there and, oh, God, don't bring Beyonce out there. I mean, come on.
- [39:32]
Toure
How many times have you been reelected?
- [39:36]
Maxine Waters
I've been reelected ever since 1991.
- [39:41]
Toure
Many times. Many times. So, you know, incumbents have a big advantage, but. Right. Like, we love aoc. And the other part of that story is that she dethroned a long term incumbent because she let the people know, I'm here for you. How does someone like yourself continue to make sure that the district knows, hey, I'm here for you. I haven't forgotten about you. I'm not just in D.C. i'm here with you guys. How do you maintain your finger on the pulse of what cause? The people in your district have to continue to know that you love them and you think about them.
- [40:19]
Maxine Waters
Yeah. Before COVID I fly home every weekend. I fly home every weekend. I know my church is in my district. I know every part of my district. I know all the different cities in the district. I know what their needs are. And I. I know the churches in the district. I even work with the chamber of commerce in one of my most conservative areas of my district. I work with the schools in my district. I work with organized labor. I show up and I attend all kinds of community meetings and projects. I mean, I'm a very active. This is my life. This is what I do. And so the people know me very well. The last election that I had in November, the Republicans and a group of haters decided to come after me and they funded my opposition to the tune of $10 million. And so he went out to try and buy up the community. He did food drives, he did backpacks, he did all kind of stuff. He lied, what have you. But I won handily because the people know me and they trust me.
- [41:24]
Toure
What's your superpower? What is the thing that you do better than other folks that has led to the success you've had in life?
- [41:31]
Maxine Waters
I don't know if I have a superpower, but I am very steeped in a basic philosophy about life. I believe in fairness. I believe that everybody has value, and I believe that people should be treated with respect. And I believe people should not be hungry, that poverty is atrocious, and that we should do everything that we can to help people have a basic, decent quality of life. Like to see people taken advantage of. And I have the courage of my convictions, and I will say what I need to say. I will do what I need to do.
- [42:12]
Toure
What are some of the key. So we started talking about this before, but the keys to success as a congressperson, you talk about running up against racism, but you clearly know how to make the body, make the organization work for you when you need it to. What are the keys to anyone being Successful as a congressperson?
- [42:33]
Maxine Waters
Well, you know, I think that what's most important is that you really care about the people that elect you and you show it. You respect them, you listen to them, you respond to them, you have time for them. They have to trust you. To the degree that people trust you, they will support you. And I think those are the basic things that you need to have in order to be successful. And I think people who lie to their constituents, who are dishonest, who don't really care, it usually catches up with them. It usually catches up one way or the other in some kind of a big old scandal or an arrest, or the ones who go out saying that they opposed to abortion and they have a girlfriend who they tried to get to abort a baby, you know what I'm saying? These are the ones that get caught.
- [43:31]
Toure
What would surprise people about the day to day life of a congressperson?
- [43:37]
Maxine Waters
You know what I think would surprise people? And I thought about this. Not too long ago, I came from a huge family, 12 brothers and sisters. It was 13 of us.
- [43:47]
Toure
What number were you?
- [43:49]
Maxine Waters
Number four. But we had to learn to do everything and it was just natural for us. And my mother was a very energetic woman who was extraordinarily independent no matter what. She is married a couple of times, two sets of children, but we learned to do everything. And so I'm never really handicapped when I get in a situation where I need. I mean, I don't need to have a housekeeper, you know, I can do everything. I scrub floors, I can, you know, I do. Everybody said, what do you do about makeup? I put my own makeup on. What do you do about your hair? Well, I take care of myself and I don't mind washing dishes and cleaning the house and folding the clothes. I don't mind doing whatever I have to do and whatever. I learned how to improvise and to deal with taking care of situations when you don't have, you know, what is thought to be needed to take care of situations. And so that's what I think. People would be surprised about me and my ability to shovel coal.
- [44:55]
Toure
If I had to, I could do anything. I could do anything. I think the biggest thing that black people need is relief from the war on drugs, right? And for the police to not be so oppressive in our communities. And I think an important step to that is marijuana legalization. What do you think about the potential in your lifetime, or at least your time on the Hill, of federal marijuana legalization so that we can stop attacking this underground market? Because the Underground market will collapse when there is a significant legal market. So what do you think about that?
- [45:33]
Maxine Waters
We're getting there. And that's in my jurisdiction in financial services because of the need for safe banking. And I'm working with Perlmutter, who is one of the leaders out of Colorado who really, really working on safe banking. And I think that's the key to getting marijuana off of a Schedule 1 list as a dangerous drug kind of thing. That will happen. That is going to happen. And so when you talk about safe.
- [46:00]
Toure
Banking, that has been one of the problems that legal marijuana operations have not been able to have normalized banking operations. So they're carrying cash. It's very dangerous. So how do we let them have normal banking operations? How do we get to that?
- [46:19]
Maxine Waters
We have a bill. We have a bill. We're working on it. And that's what I referred to when I said safe banking, safe Banking Act. We're gonna win on that. We're gonna get it. We're gonna get it so that they're able to have regular banking to keep them from being at risk of being robbed and all that goes along with handling large sums of cash, et cetera. We're gonna win on that.
- [46:43]
Toure
You see the votes for that in the Senate?
- [46:46]
Maxine Waters
Yeah, I think we're going to win on safe banking. Why? I think we're going to win on it because it has become an economic concern now. A lot of money is being made and a lot of money can help stimulate the economy and on and on and on. So I think we're going to be able to do it.
- [47:05]
Toure
Is reparations under financial services. Is that part of your purview?
- [47:11]
Maxine Waters
No, it's not. Absolutely. It's in the Judiciary Committee. And you know, John Conyers started out with the study and of course he's no longer with us, but Sheila Jackson Lee has picked it up and now it's in the studying stage still. But it comes out of Judiciary Committee, and that's a difficult one, but going. We have to keep going.
- [47:34]
Toure
Dream legislation for you. If you could say, like, you know, I'm going to wave my magic wand. I'm going to make this happen. Like, what would be dream legislation? Legislation for you?
- [47:46]
Maxine Waters
Well, quality of life is one of my greatest concerns. And just as you talk about whether or not there can be money that is basically given to our constituents on a monthly basis, I wish everybody had an income. But whether it is private government or it is a government assisted, that they could count on having a decent quality of life where they would have food on the table, they could pay their rent, they could, you know, have, you know, time to spend with their children, vacation time, basically a decent quality of life. If I had my brothers, I would make sure that we would have a guaranteed income for everybody.
- [48:39]
Toure
I mean, that sounds amazing. So is that your. What is your number one priority of the things that you are working on now or thinking about drafting? What is your number one priority for the next two to three years?
- [48:52]
Maxine Waters
Legislatively, there are a number of things, but number one, right now I'm dealing with COVID and having worked on rental assistance and stimulus money and all of that, and because I'm there and because Nydia Velasquez is there there, we were able to target money to what Is known as MDIs and CDFIs. These are your minority banks, and these are your small organizations that lend money in the community. And they didn't have the liquidity to be able to do that. And so we were able to snatch money out of that First CARES Act, Even though the large banks were giving it away to their premier clients, in creating portals for them, we were able to. To put more money into it and get $60 billion and get it to them. So this is very important that I always continue to support small minority businesses that, you know, the access to capital is what's going to make us, you know, able to have businesses where we can deal with this wealth gap that we have. And we, you know, we may never be able to get rid of it unless we. We are very consistent in the way that we pay attention to it and we deal with it. So I work on that. I created a subcommittee of my committee when I took it over, of diversity and inclusion, because I want to open up opportunities in the private sector and in the government and particularly in the financial services area for upward mobility, opportunities for minorities, blacks and women, et cetera, et cetera. And so that's high on my agenda, if we can. Years ago, we started out with something called affirmative action that just got killed. And so now we're coming back. We're coming back with diversity and inclusion. And we're getting corporations to say, well, you know, we're discovering that it's good for the bottom line. To the degree that we don't exclude, we probably can do even better. So some are saying that some now are creating departments inside the banks and financial institutions. That is a diversity and inclusion department, others identifying people or individuals to lead up efforts inside the corporation, et cetera. And so my dream is that we could get rid of this discrimination in financial services and in business and so that people can realize their potential and earn good money.
- [51:32]
Toure
And that's so huge. That's so huge. Because if we can get loans to buy homes, to start businesses at similar rates at equal proportions to white people, then we will have a more equal plane to be able to build wealth and to try to create companies that change the country. I mean, cause that wealth gap is a very almost tangible aspect of it all. There's so much of systemic racism that's like so abstract. How do we approach that? But the wealth gap and the banking aspect in that. And I was just listening to a brother talk about how insurance companies are quite often the backstop of racism. That a given company said, well, we can't, we can't be racist. But then the insurance company, somebody says, well, we can't insure that. We cannot insure a home in that area. And that way racism is able to perpetuate.
- [52:33]
Maxine Waters
That's where you see the most harm that has really created a deep systemic racist society. The withholding of the ability to get capital, to get loans, to be gouged and have to pay more for your interest rates, taking more from your salary. Everywhere you look in poor communities, there's somebody ripping folks off, you know, for trying to get every penny from them that they can and basically really trying to take the money from the people who least need to be, you know, stolen from. But this waste, this wage gap that we're talking about, it is a combination of these things that has created the system, racism that keeps us from avoiding being able rather to have wealth.
- [53:28]
Toure
What do you make of what we're talking about comes from a government program, 1950s, the FHA, giving money, 95% of it to white people to buy homes and create wealth. Black people getting little to none of that money. Those are the grandparents and great grandparents of people who are around today. If your grandparents owned a home, you're more likely to be wealthy than if they didn't. And we were blocked from all that money. And this is our government creating that.
- [53:59]
Maxine Waters
You're absolutely right. A government has been just as guilty as the private sector with racism and exclusion. And to the degree that they were able to help with racism, they've done that in so many instances.
- [54:23]
Toure
Thank you so much to the congresswoman for a great interview. Thanks to you for listening. Thanks to our super producers, Britt, Marcus Harkis, Noel, Sam Montes, Jason Reynolds, Gerville Kelle, Michelle, Brenda Cox, Kathy F, Keena Murphy, Earl Dorsey and Theo tokus Torre's show gives you fuel to power your dreams. Because you can use your dreams like a rocket ship to blast you into a life you never imagined. You can make your dreams a reality and this show can help. You can find me on Twitter or Torre and on Instagram or torreshow. Toure show is written by me Toure and produced by Jackie Garofano. Our editor is Ryan Woodhull. Our photographers are Chuck Marcus and Shanta Covington. Our booker is Claudia Jean. And we're distributed by DCP Entertainment. And we will be back on Friday and on Wednesday with more amazing guests because the man can't shut us down.