← Trade Tales
Trade Tales
For Jean Stoffer and Grace Start, starting slow is the key to growing big ideas
00:48:16
Jean Stoffer and Grace Start on how they’ve kept their relationship healthy amid rapid growth, their strategy for scaling several different design-related businesses, and how they’re navigating a major C-suite transition at the firm.
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- [00:02]
Grace Stouffer
Everything was going so fast paced that there was really not even time to come up to the surface and say I need help. You just keep treading water and you don't even know that help is exactly what you need.
- [00:18]
Caitlin Peterson
Hi, I'm Caitlin Peterson, the editor in Chief of Business of Home. Welcome to Trade Tales, where I'll be talking to interior designers about the challenges, pivots and perspective shifts that come with growing a design firm.
- [00:31]
Caroline Burke
My hope is that you hear your.
- [00:32]
Caitlin Peterson
Own why echoed in these stories, or an idea that sparks your own breakthrough. I hope it helps you realize that even when entrepreneurship feels lonely, you're not alone. My guests today are a mother daughter design duo whose multi generational firm has always had an eye toward the future.
- [00:51]
Caroline Burke
They've paved a path to growth by.
- [00:53]
Caitlin Peterson
Launching new ventures including a cabinetry business, a home store, and a Magnolia Network show, all while making sure to protect the creativity that got them there in the first place. I can't wait to share it with you, but first a quick word from our sponsors. This podcast is sponsored by June Laloy from the family behind Laloy Rugs. June Laloy builds on more than two decades of industry expertise, expanding into furniture, lighting, decor and of course, more rugs. The company is driven always by a mission to deepen the relationship to home. If you know Laloy Rugs, you know that they lead with quality craft, thoughtful design and top tier service to the trade. And it should come as no surprise that June Laloy follows suit. As a qualified member of the Jungle Trade program, you enjoy exclusive benefits that make doing business a breeze, including special pricing and priority support. Visit junelloy.com to explore the collection and sign up for a trade account today. That's j o o n l o l o I.com this podcast is also sponsored by Serena and Lily. Serena and Lily's trade program offers designers exclusive access to their high quality collections, including customers own material, custom size upholstery and a dedicated support team for seamless end to end collaboration. Other trade member benefits include the best pricing, fast complimentary swatches, competitive lead times and extended returns throughout the year. Serena and Lily Trade members also receive additional discounts and free white glove delivery offers on the company's Benchmade furniture and decor. Visit Serenaandlily.com to become a member today.
- [03:03]
Jean Stouffer
When I first got out of college I went to work for an interior designer as her kind of admin. That's where I discovered how interesting interior design could be and after working for her for a couple of years I started my own business that Went on for a few years until I had Grace, who's our third. And I wanted to spend a lot more time at home with the kids during that time. We bought a house that was 100 years old and needed everything, including a kitchen that was probably 50 years old. So I wanted to remodel the kitchen. And that kind of started an interest in kitchen design for me. This was 1991. It was not this emphasis on European or particularly British style kitchens that we have now. But I kind of figured out how to get that to happen in the Chicago area. And that kind of started what became a specialty for me.
- [04:00]
Caitlin Peterson
That's Jean Stouffer. As she got to work building a design firm in Chicago, someone else was developing an eye for design right under her nose.
- [04:10]
Grace Stouffer
Growing up, we were often taken to job sites during the measure. I remember my mom's office was in the basement, and there was samples lined up on the walls in these little wooden boxes. And my little brother and I would just play with those samples and more like things with them than pretending to be a designer. But it was always kind of, for me, in the periphery instead of a focus on it. I knew my mom did that, but I always just thought of her as mom.
- [04:39]
Caitlin Peterson
And that's Grace Start.
- [04:41]
Caroline Burke
She studied education, started a family, and.
- [04:44]
Caitlin Peterson
Settled in Michigan near her siblings. Jean, meanwhile, was navigating a move to the state and the uncertainty that came with it.
- [04:53]
Jean Stouffer
My business was all word of mouth in the Chicago area, and coming to Michigan had no idea. Idea what to expect. I thought chances were that just gradually the business would just fade away as those contacts dissolved in Chicago. And I had no idea how to break into a new market. And I had no idea what to expect. And was just like asking the Lord, just one step at a time, show me what's next. Because really didn't know Grace and her.
- [05:22]
Caitlin Peterson
Young family had purchased their first house. Before long, finding joy in the process of renovating her own home nudged Grace in a new direction.
- [05:32]
Grace Stouffer
My husband and I bought our first house. We moved in, started fixing it up. I really then was like, oh, houses are very interesting, and my mom's job is very, very interesting. All of a sudden, I asked my mom if she would hire me part time, no experience. She hired me, and it was out of the kindness of her heart and I think nothing else.
- [05:54]
Jean Stouffer
But I actually was so excited about it because I thought she had a lot of talent, just naturally. And I had periodically had kitchen clients ask me to please help them with the rest of the house, all the furnishings and Finishes. And this was what Grace was particularly interested in. So she suggested that if I got one of those calls that I shouldn't just automatically say no and instead I should call her and we could discuss it and see if maybe we would take it on together.
- [06:25]
Caitlin Peterson
Working side by side, Jean and Grace quickly took the firm to new heights. I wanted to talk to them about how they've kept their relationship healthy amid rapid growth, their strategy for scaling several different design related businesses, how they're navigating a major C suite transition at the firm, and what it takes to protect their creative spark.
- [06:48]
Caroline Burke
Once the two of you were working together, how long before one of those calls did come in and you said yes?
- [06:54]
Jean Stouffer
Two weeks.
- [06:55]
Caroline Burke
That's amazing.
- [06:57]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah. And it was for a whole home that was 7,000 square feet. And then two weeks later we got.
- [07:03]
Grace Stouffer
Another call and one of them was very local to Michigan and one was in Chicago. And the other note about before I started is that my mom would often pair up with an interior designer. So she would be the kitchen and cabinetry specialist and a designer would also come on board, which is a little bit difficult for claiming the work as your own and also having the vision from start to finish so you could have a beautiful kitchen, but then the stools and the lighting that's put in is just not what would align. Right, yeah, exactly. And so this was kind of an exciting opportunity to have a vision for the project from start to finish.
- [07:47]
Caroline Burke
How did those two projects go and like, what did you learn about working together on those early jobs?
- [07:53]
Jean Stouffer
Well, the projects went, I mean, we felt our way through the whole job. We were learning about resources and methods throughout the whole thing. It was huge learning experience for us. And they were really running simultaneously.
- [08:07]
Caroline Burke
Oh, like same phase at the same time.
- [08:09]
Jean Stouffer
Almost exactly. Yeah. And it helped, you know, to have all that on site experience, but there were still other things that, that were brand new that just required new resources or resurrecting old resources that I'd used before Grace was born.
- [08:27]
Caroline Burke
Right. Like I think there's this company. Yeah, yeah.
- [08:31]
Grace Stouffer
Or that's was at the Mart. And now I don't think that they're a company any longer.
- [08:36]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah, it was great. And those two projects happened to coincide with when Instagram was really ramping up with design. And so I Instagrammed about these projects and it just really kind of took off.
- [08:55]
Caroline Burke
It was like all in the grid. Right. It was like pre stories, pre reels, pre video.
- [09:00]
Jean Stouffer
Oh yes, totally. That's exactly right. And it was when a lot of people were Trying to also start Instagrams that didn't have any content. So they would aggregate and use and find my content and use it on theirs. So like Becky Owens, you know, bigger accounts. And then all of a sudden everybody would be driven towards us and like, whoa, what's happening?
- [09:26]
Caroline Burke
You'd wake up with a lot more followers.
- [09:28]
Grace Stouffer
Yeah, it was kind of the perfect storm because it was 2017, right, Mom?
- [09:34]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah.
- [09:35]
Grace Stouffer
And my brother is an extremely good interior photographer, so he took all the photos and he even recommended that my mom change her Instagram name to include the word design in it. So not just a person, but an obvious design account. And then Chris Loves Julia, they did like a whole feature on Jean Stauffer Design. And that was kind of the beginning of all of it.
- [10:06]
Caroline Burke
After doing this alone for decades, you know, and kind of saying, okay, I'm going to keep this really contained. Did the two of you have to sit down and say, like, we're going to really grow this thing. We want to build a design empire? Or was it more organic than that?
- [10:23]
Jean Stouffer
It was not like that at all. It was like, oh, my gosh, what's happening? How did this happen? What are we going to do? I would say Grace Wright. It was never our aspiration.
- [10:34]
Grace Stouffer
No, it wasn't. I don't even think it was in the back of either of our minds.
- [10:38]
Jean Stouffer
We just wanted flexibility so that you could raise your kids. And I loved being with you. That was kind of the way that worked.
- [10:44]
Grace Stouffer
Right. And we just happened to love houses in the way that they look and people somehow trusted us. And then the cart started going at a million miles an hour and all of a sudden we needed some wheels underneath it.
- [10:58]
Caroline Burke
How did you start to sort of shore up, I guess systems or support to kind of meet that interest and demand in the business?
- [11:06]
Jean Stouffer
That was definitely a multi year program that we just did put one foot in front of the other. We started out with hiring a young woman to help us with design, who had lots of resources, had done it, knew, knew what was going on. And then we soon realized, well, it would be really helpful to have someone that just kind of managed things, wasn't a designer, but could handle all the paperwork and following up on orders and managing deliveries.
- [11:41]
Grace Stouffer
And we said, so after those jobs hit and they went on on Instagram, we started getting inquiries from all over the place and we said yes to a lot of them with a very skeleton team.
- [11:55]
Jean Stouffer
It's true. Like, still, Grace, they had three, maybe four of us, including you and I.
- [12:00]
Grace Stouffer
Yeah, yeah, we were going to New York and Austin and Colorado, and it kind of became something that we never anticipated and we didn't really have the resources.
- [12:14]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah. But we worked really hard. We learned a lot really quickly because you had to, like, there wasn't a choice. We had to figure it out. We had to learn vendors and, you know, we were doing all of our own accounting, all of our own taxes, all of our own ordering, legal, everything.
- [12:34]
Caroline Burke
How quickly did you grow a team around you? I know you have a big team with retail, with cabinetry and all that today, but if you think about just the design team, what was sort of the trajectory from that moment to today in terms of growth?
- [12:48]
Jean Stouffer
Grace, you might want to speak to that, because actually Grace runs the design.
- [12:53]
Grace Stouffer
Team now, and we still have a fairly small team. There are six of us, I would say there's a couple in procurement, a couple lead designers and a couple cabinetry specialists. And plus my mom and I, we prefer to keep that smaller and then have stove for home, cabinetry and stove for home be the things that the size of our staff is going to grow with.
- [13:23]
Caroline Burke
Was that a trial and error thing? Did the design team get larger and then you kind of shrunk it back down, or did you always really hold true to saying this needs to be kind of an intimate design experience?
- [13:34]
Grace Stouffer
It's been a little bit larger, but we've kind of purposefully kept it small. And then we've been very careful since that first kind of onslaught of inquiries, we've been very careful of what we say yes to.
- [13:49]
Jean Stouffer
And we see the, the full service custom design as more of an intimate. It's very immersive, intensive experience. Whereas we're trying to, to build up the Stouffer home cabinetry design side of things that focuses on the piece of, kind of the piece of the business that is kind of going back to my roots.
- [14:16]
Caroline Burke
It really mirrors that original work of helping someone create that shell. Right?
- [14:20]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah. Because they, our team over there partners with interior designers across the country, and we come in as the kitchen and cabinetry specialist that they can rely on.
- [14:32]
Caroline Burke
What does that team look like today?
- [14:33]
Jean Stouffer
There are eight people on that team. We have two lead designers and project managers who manage, you know, like all of the pricing and revisions and emailing. And then we have some logistics people. It's a very. It's still a very personal experience, but it is all remote, which is a very unique, a very different way of doing things. I, I have seen a couple more companies doing this now, but it took us quite a while to develop the correct process for it, but it's really running very well.
- [15:10]
Caroline Burke
Now for each of you, what part of growing this business and maintaining, I guess I should say these businesses has tested each of you the most as entrepreneurs?
- [15:22]
Jean Stouffer
Well, retail is very challenging, I would say. And neither Grace nor I have come from a retail background at all. And so a lot of that has been relying on reading stuff, trying stuff, getting a young team of people who are very interested and excited about it. But there's a lot of trial and error. You know, we started out with just a brick and mortar at the end of 2018 and added e commerce six months later and have learned a lot and pivoted a lot. Grace, I would say, is the one that had the vision for it in the first place, why it could be good for us, and has also had some defining pivots in mind that have helped it quite a bit.
- [16:16]
Grace Stouffer
Yeah, well, we first started the store. Again, had no business doing that. But we started it because if you are a, like they call it a stocking dealer, I think is the terminology. But if you have the stuff on the floor, you get better pricing and you can buy some stuff that you're not allowed to buy unless you have a store. And so that was one reason. And then the other reason is when we went to go style these beautiful projects, we could either go online or go to Target or try to find a way to style them beautifully. And it was always coming up short. And so we thought, well, we could just, if we have our own store, this would be a lot easier. And actually that is a big way. We still use the store today.
- [17:10]
Caroline Burke
That's kind of that final, like 10%, the final layer of accessories, which really.
- [17:15]
Grace Stouffer
Makes a big difference in the way that a project looks.
- [17:18]
Caroline Burke
What categories are you pulling from in, you know, for your own styling?
- [17:24]
Jean Stouffer
Art, pillows, unique objects, just stuff that is not as expensive, but that is, when you mix it all in with other things, can make a project look really nice and finished.
- [17:39]
Grace Stouffer
Online we sell a certain thing and in store we sell another. And so we were spending a lot of time taking photos of these small things that we were buying at these big markets that any other store could buy as well and stock. And it was taking a lot of human resources and time to get these things online. And then they weren't even really selling all that well online. And so what we realized is the stuff that we produce, our scent line, our freestanding pieces, our bathroom vanities, lighting, the stuff that you can get from Stouff for home, that's unique to us is really what sells online. And so we're making a huge pivot to increase what we have that's offered that we produce and decrease the stuff that we are importing.
- [18:42]
Caroline Burke
And then the stuff that you've sourced elsewhere, does that stay just in the store because you saw that that's where that was selling.
- [18:48]
Grace Stouffer
Correct.
- [18:49]
Caroline Burke
Is that happening now or how far along are you in that transition?
- [18:53]
Jean Stouffer
We're about six weeks into that.
- [18:55]
Caroline Burke
Oh, okay. So it's really right now.
- [18:57]
Jean Stouffer
It's right now. In fact, probably over the next few months people will be seeing if they shop online with us. I think a very welcome increase in some things that are special just to us and a decrease in things that, you know, just search the image, find it in 15 different places, right?
- [19:18]
Caroline Burke
Totally.
- [19:19]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah.
- [19:20]
Caroline Burke
That's such an interesting. I mean, that's such a smart reaction to, I think something a lot of online retailers are struggling with. Do you see promising kind of early feedback from that shift?
- [19:31]
Jean Stouffer
Definitely. I think it actually increases the value of our bricks and mortar store quite a bit because things there you can't get in other places. And I think it's been. As our team has grown and our warehouse grew and our shopify got more crowded with things and difficult to categorize, it's allowed for us to make a really welcome change to have a very user friendly website where people can find actually what they have been looking for and just make it a lot easier to navigate towards it and stuff that's.
- [20:12]
Grace Stouffer
Like ethically made and has a story to it. It's not like just here, take this stuff and throw it on your shelf. It's like, hey, this is handmade by someone and designed with intention. And you can have it in your house too. And that's the story.
- [20:32]
Caitlin Peterson
We're taking a quick break to remind you about Serena and Lily's trade program. Their frames, your fabric. Members of the Serena and Lily trade program enjoy bespoke sizing and service perfectly tailored to any project. Use any one of their 17 design shops as an extension of your workspace or collaborate remotely with their dedicated support team. For high touch service and endless inspiration. Join Serena and Lily's trade program for exclusive pricing, complimentary swatches, competitive lead times and extended returns@serenaandlily.com Tradetails.
- [21:12]
Caroline Burke
Are you starting to source from like the accessories and gift markets a little bit differently as part of this shift as well? Are you looking for different things now?
- [21:22]
Jean Stouffer
Yes, we are. We're looking at those as what we would put in the store only. But what we're focusing more of our attention on is like increasing the designs and our vanity line.
- [21:35]
Caroline Burke
Okay, so the growth comes there. Yeah, right, right. What is the moment or what is the tipping point each time? Is it. I can't find this. Is it. We could make this easier. Is it. We have ideas that we don't see in the marketplace. What's sort of the tipping point to say we should create this?
- [21:54]
Jean Stouffer
The cabinetry line really came out of an overwhelming number of inquiries into wanting Grace and I to design people's kitchens. And the mode of me doing that had always involved me being on site probably at least 12 times during the course of the period.
- [22:18]
Caroline Burke
It's a really labor intensive and kind of intimate thing.
- [22:21]
Jean Stouffer
Very much so. And you know, completely customized. Whatever you want, wherever, you know, just any finish, any door style, I'll think of it. You know, just. And it was not physically possible to service people who really wanted just a beautiful kitchen in this fairly restrained design style of this British kitchen that we were becoming known for. And so we had seen, actually it was Duvall who started putting cabinets online where you could put them in a cart and sell them. And Grace thought, oh, we can do that. I looked at her, I'm like, we can. So we thought about that idea of doing things and I designed an entire line and I wanted to do it in one inch increments and make it feel custom. But we would have one door style. And I wanted it to be like a manufacturing situation that was very easy to process through, but the whole thing would also be virtual online. Now just so happens, Covid happened in the like when we were only maybe a year into this, which thrust everyone onto video calls. And that was when it took off for us because everyone got their head around, I can do this.
- [23:46]
Caroline Burke
Right. I can do this for virtually. Yeah, right.
- [23:48]
Jean Stouffer
I don't have to go into a showroom and open and close doors and drawers. I can see what's happening on video. But it took quite a while to develop the actual process that worked. And I have a lot of thanks to Joe Saltz, the editor of House Beautiful, because she had me come in and do her kitchen via Stauffer Home Cabinetry and film the whole thing for a video, a YouTube series.
- [24:21]
Caroline Burke
I remember when that came out.
- [24:23]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah. And that really, that really helped so much. But as people got more and more familiar with it and as we had more and more projects under our belt and developing our process, you know, more and more fine tuning it, it's now really, really running well. But it was seeing a need for this type of design and this quality, this level of quality of cabinetry in places that maybe people couldn't get it locally and figuring out a way to bring it to them.
- [24:57]
Caroline Burke
Is everything manufactured near you?
- [25:01]
Jean Stouffer
No, we're manufacturing in two different places in the US and that's helped quite a bit too, because we added a second location about three years ago, and that's given us quite a good way to distribute to the whole country.
- [25:16]
Caroline Burke
Grace, can you tell me about the vanities as well? How did that come to be?
- [25:19]
Grace Stouffer
Yeah, I think that this was my. My brother Danny's idea. We had always designed vanities for our clients, and we just saw that, you know, this can be something that we have in specific sizes that people can actually put it in their cart and order, kind of how we wanted to do kitchens, but realized that that was a little more involved. And so we designed a line in, I think that one's in 3 inch increments and had them available in our cabinetry colors. And that was something we. We put it online, we saw a few get ordered, maybe one or two a month, and then all of a sudden they caught on. And we've seen that grow tremendously.
- [26:08]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah. And now designers ordering them for every job.
- [26:11]
Grace Stouffer
And I will say that the thing that is something that we can stand behind and something that we're so proud of is the quality and the craftsmanship of the cabinetry. I mean, anyone who receives them is blown away. And that is why it has the ripple effects that it does.
- [26:32]
Caroline Burke
What does it take to have that kind of idea, believe in that idea with the capital it takes to develop something like this?
- [26:41]
Jean Stouffer
Well, I think knowing how something should be constructed and having a very solid relationship with a manufacturer and trusting that. I mean, I've been working with them for decades, and I think it's something that you really have to know what you want and be not subtle for a single thing less, but you have to know what that is that you want first. You know, we've along the way, now that things have taken off, we've had to figure out how do we get these vanities to people where it doesn't cost as much as the vanity.
- [27:20]
Grace Stouffer
Right.
- [27:21]
Caroline Burke
Totally.
- [27:22]
Jean Stouffer
And get it in excellent condition. And I think just pushing ahead, not trying to be real big, real fast so that course corrections can be made. And I think we didn't really put a push of marketing towards this until we really had it dialed in.
- [27:46]
Caroline Burke
How do you think about the work that you want to be doing as the firm grows around each of you?
- [27:53]
Jean Stouffer
Oh, that's such a good question.
- [27:55]
Caroline Burke
Entrepreneurship is hard, right? I feel like you can wake up and be like, oh, I have a different job now.
- [28:01]
Caitlin Peterson
Do I like it?
- [28:02]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah. Well. And especially when Grace and I were filming our television show that was 100 days a year, so there was no way we could continue to do the work that we were doing in the way that we were doing it at all. So we had to put people and processes in place. And probably one of the hugest decisions we made that was one of the best decisions ever, was to hire a CEO. This was about three and a half years ago she came on board. This was a very good friend of mine who was a college president with a law degree and who was ready to make a career change, has amazing leadership skills. And she took the business as if it was her own child and took care of it and put a foundation underneath it and a structure around each of the departments in a way that made it something that could stand on its own without Grace and I running it every day. And she just came and observed everything. And we'd had long conversations prior to her ever coming on board, and I think she recognized what she felt needed to happen to kind of save the business from imploding on itself. And she did it, and she just jumped in and, you know, started whole process with employees, like with performance reviews and appointment letters and salary studies and insurance and working with tax accountants and a payroll provider and all kinds of things. There was a lot that needed to be reworked and redone.
- [29:50]
Caroline Burke
What did it feel like to have someone come in and start to take those things off your plate?
- [29:56]
Jean Stouffer
It was a massive relief.
- [29:57]
Grace Stouffer
Yeah, I think mom, having your business for over 30 years and feeling like you could do it yourself the whole time, and then everything was going so fast paced that there was really not even time to come up to the surface and say, I need help. You just keep treading water, and you don't even know that help is exactly what you need. And I know you were talking to Lori is her name, but you were talking to Lori as a friend, and she was going, girl, you need help. And I know the exact help that you happen to need. And in fact, Lori said, why don't I just come in for a year and I will help get some of this stuff in shape and then you can decide if you still want me after that.
- [30:46]
Caroline Burke
Oh, that's a really beautiful way to sort of ease, like, so that it's not such an abrupt transition. 3 1/2 years later, she's. She's. Still there, right?
- [30:54]
Jean Stouffer
Well, this is a very interesting story. She is, but she's retiring at the end of the year, which she told us at the beginning of the year, which kind of like, yeah.
- [31:05]
Caroline Burke
What happens next?
- [31:06]
Jean Stouffer
Well, she led us through an entire process of what do we exactly need going forward? What is the job description of that person? All right, kids and Jean, start calling people that you think might know someone. And the Lord brought us an amazing man who is starting November 1st. And Lori will feather in and work with him for a month, and then he'll take the reins December 1st.
- [31:36]
Caroline Burke
Is there a sense of loss in handing over some of this executive leadership of this business you've built, or is that balanced out by kind of the energy and excitement of what a new person can bring?
- [31:50]
Jean Stouffer
Well, I think Lori set such a beautiful example for me of, like, what it could be to be a servant leader.
- [31:59]
Caroline Burke
Yeah.
- [31:59]
Jean Stouffer
Our whole company has witnessed it. I've experienced it. She has done nothing but increase my enjoyment of life and the company. Like, it's been such a positive experience for the kids, for me, for all of the employees that I realize I now am free to enjoy my family, my husband, the work itself. I have space in my head for new ideas, for listening to the kids ideas and actually, like, processing what that could look like. So it's been one of the best experiences that I feel like my life was given back to me. Honestly.
- [32:47]
Caroline Burke
For the designers listening to this who feel in their bones that they want that thing that you've been given back, how would you recommend other designers start to go looking to bring that person into their business?
- [33:06]
Jean Stouffer
Find a person who you respect them as a person and your values align. The way they live their life aligns with the way you would want to live yours. If they're a talented leader, they can adapt to any type of business.
- [33:25]
Caroline Burke
What roles specifically have you carved out for each of you for yourselves? How do you fit sort of within the company org chart, and what is your primary role these days?
- [33:39]
Grace Stouffer
I am happy to say this, that every single day that I have looks different.
- [33:44]
Caroline Burke
Okay.
- [33:46]
Grace Stouffer
Some days I'm at a job site. Some days I'm at a stone yard. Some days I'm meeting with clients. Other days we're doing a photo shoot or a brand partnership. I have the pleasure of making a lot of the designs for brand collaborations, and that's been really fun and a different sort of challenge. But, yeah, I love that every day looks a little different, that that suits my personality.
- [34:13]
Jean Stouffer
Well, Grace really is a key person in that she has A sixth sense for what is a good idea going forward and what isn't. So she really drives a lot of our new business ideas, but she's also.
- [34:31]
Grace Stouffer
My mom, so you have to take it with a grain.
- [34:34]
Caroline Burke
No, I don't know. It sounds accurate to me.
- [34:37]
Jean Stouffer
I mean, she's the one I call all the time, like, what do you think of this? You know, this is the opportunity. What do you think of it? And she has a pretty good idea of whether it's good or not.
- [34:48]
Caroline Burke
The two of you together, how has your working relationship evolved now that it's not just the two of you, now that there is this massive team around you?
- [34:57]
Grace Stouffer
At least in my opinion, our relationship has not been tainted by business at all. We still spend enough time together outside of that and can either. I don't think that we ever turn it off. Would you say mom? But it's not really. It's more like we're both comfortable talking shop and talking life at work and outside of work. So we kind of weave that in together. And I lean on her for parenting advice and how to live outside of just work. And so it's. Obviously, we work together every day, but that's not what our relationship is based on.
- [35:39]
Jean Stouffer
You know, back in the days when we first started working together, we were sitting at the same table next to each other all day or going to job sites together, in the car together. And now, actually, neither one of us even have a desk at our office. We have stools that we take around and take to other people's desks and meet with them about whatever's going on with them.
- [36:01]
Grace Stouffer
We do work really closely beside our designers. And so a lot of times that is what we're doing is pulling up a stool, which I do have a designated stool, pulling it up, looking at what they're working on, making some tweaks, pulling it up to another desk, talking about what they're working on. And, you know, we're up pulling samples at our sample library. We're walking into a conference room, and we're having a meeting with the sales team. It's kind of all all over the place. And so I think as someone who is in a leadership role, parking yourself at a desk is a little less collaborative than meeting the people that you're serving and seeing what they need from you.
- [36:43]
Jean Stouffer
Well, in my. I kind of touch every area of the company, so I can't just have a, you know, an office in the design office, because I'm talking to the warehouse staff, to the marketing department, to the Stow for home cabinetry team to the designers, to the accountants, everybody.
- [37:05]
Caitlin Peterson
We are taking a quick break to tell you more about June laloy. According to Homes and Gardens, June Malloy's new fall collection might just be their most sophisticated yet, featuring vintage, revival and warm, modern styles that put quality and value first. And if you're a member of the trade, the joomlloy trade program offers exclusive benefits to support your business, including special pricing, a dedicated support team, and a seamless sourcing experience. Visit joomlaloy.com today to explore the latest and sign up for a trade account that's J O O N LOL O y dot com. Well, tell me about your role, maybe.
- [37:51]
Caroline Burke
Relative to this new CEO job description, because it sounds like you do still have such deep involvement in all of these departments. Where is your focus? And then where is that CEO role's focus? And how are they split?
- [38:06]
Jean Stouffer
Well, Tad will be our coo, and I guess me and the kids will take on the role of CEO.
- [38:15]
Caroline Burke
Okay.
- [38:15]
Jean Stouffer
And so that role is really working with Grace in these new product lines. It's working with the COO about maybe new processes. It's thinking about new ways we want to do business. I get to do a lot of speaking, which I enjoy quite a bit. And also I still run my own Instagram, which is our main marketing.
- [38:42]
Caitlin Peterson
That's you?
- [38:43]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah.
- [38:44]
Caroline Burke
That's wild.
- [38:45]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah. I decided I can't do reels.
- [38:50]
Caroline Burke
You're opting out?
- [38:52]
Jean Stouffer
I'm opting out of reels. That was the big moment that I made the decision.
- [38:58]
Caroline Burke
That's so validating because me too. It's like this medium has passed me by. That's okay. Yeah.
- [39:06]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah. But I still. I mean, it's how I still am on the DMs with people that ask questions, and I'm still putting what we're trying to provide for people out there on Instagram, and that's our main marketing arm. And Grace and I still do expert calls, which we really love and has turned out to be a fabulous opportunity to help people, particularly in my case, with kitchen layouts, who are already thinking about using stove for home cabinetry, but don't really know how to start the process for their unique situation. So they make an expert call with me and we talk about layouts and what we can do with this space, and it gives them the confidence to go on to Stowe for home cabinetry, which is a wonderful thing for the whole business.
- [40:00]
Grace Stouffer
And, mom, you're still very involved in Jean Stouffer design, too. I mean, you look at everything that.
- [40:05]
Jean Stouffer
Yeah, I do pretty much all of the space planning for all of the projects. So how the whole house will be laid out, how the kitchen and those types of rooms will be laid out, and then kind of Grace takes it from there.
- [40:20]
Caroline Burke
What is the secret to working so closely with family? Because I know it's not just the two of you. You've brought in other family members into the business as well. How do you maintain that personal and professional harmony? Is there a secret to getting that right?
- [40:39]
Jean Stouffer
As a mother and now as a mother of adult children with their own families, I have a deep respect for each one of the kids and their ideas, their ways of doing things. And I think a secret is they're worth listening to because some of the very best ideas that we've ever had since the moment beyond when I was just doing it myself, have germinated from the kids. John, Daniel, Grace, and in a lot of ways, David too, who doesn't work directly with the business, but is quite a force. He's got his own business now, manufacturing finish style saunas and cold lunch. But all four of the kids are unique, have a unique perspective and respect each other and respect me and I respect them and it's huge. And the thing is like, the kids see things in the industry that I'm not picking up, you know, or they just see things in life. John, with marketing and photography, Dan is now in our build side of the business, which we just added. It's exciting and I do not want to close myself off to those because I think that's like kind of a death knell if you do. It's a way of really staying relevant too, is hearing them, listening to them and processing their ideas and then putting it through a lens of experience. I think it's just a really, I don't know, enriching environment for me and has been kind of a cool thing.
- [42:30]
Caroline Burke
Grace, what keeps that creative spark alive for you or what keeps that innovation engine humming?
- [42:36]
Grace Stouffer
I think that sometimes it's hard to turn it off. But on the really basic side, I love to look at Pinterest. I think Pinterest is really good at curating beautiful images that inspire. And then when I am thankful for the opportunities that I have experienced in my life and thankful for the way that I was brought up and thankful for my husband, thankful for my children in my home, when I'm thankful for those core things, then there's room to kind of have joy in creating more. And so I think like gratitude and thankfulness are kind of, like, the spark of joy and creativity.
- [43:26]
Caroline Burke
Is that mindset? Is that a certain practice, or is there something you do to really get in tune with that sense of gratitude?
- [43:36]
Grace Stouffer
Well, this year I've been doing the Bible recap, which is a daily Bible reading, and that. That just kind of brings everything boiled down to a really, really good perspective.
- [43:48]
Jean Stouffer
And I'm doing it too.
- [43:50]
Caroline Burke
Oh, cool. So it's something you're doing together too.
- [43:52]
Jean Stouffer
It is, it is. And that's been a really cool thing to share as well. And some of the people on our team are also doing it, so I can't speak enough about that, actually. That's really impacted both of our lives quite a bit this year, I think another thing that keeps the creative going is that periodically Grace and I do our own personal projects.
- [44:13]
Caroline Burke
Like for yourselves in your own home?
- [44:16]
Jean Stouffer
Yes. Like right now, Grace is doing a project with her husband, Ted. They bought a little house in a downtown area of the. Of the small town that they're nearby and an old home, and they're doing this whole thing together. He's. Ted's doing most of the work. Grace is doing all the design work and, you know, on a budget for a less expensive home and really like digging in to how to do things with materials in a way that aren't expensive materials, but make a place look amazing. It's really helpful to get creativity going. And then I'm embarking. Well, I'm working on a project right now, both my own personal home that we'll be moving to, as well as a house that I bought for the purpose of doing a project on, found a buyer and now leading the design on that. And our son Dan is doing. Is being the general contractor on it. So, like, we're deep in ground level, you know, with this stuff, and I think that's very energizing as far as creativity goes.
- [45:29]
Caroline Burke
How have the last maybe five years of this business changed your goals and ambitions for what you want to achieve with the business?
- [45:41]
Grace Stouffer
I think for me, it seems like five years ago, it was the business seemed more personal, and now we have a whole family of employees, and the business means a lot more to a lot more people. And so our job is. Is not only, like, personal, but it is looking out for everyone on the team to make sure that they have a steady income and a place to come to work where they feel valued.
- [46:15]
Caroline Burke
What does success look like for each of you today?
- [46:20]
Jean Stouffer
I would say being a humble servant of God and blessing people with good design, with integrity, I would say that.
- [46:32]
Grace Stouffer
Success looks like every day, waking up and choosing to do, I would say the right thing in each circumstance that you're presented. Because every day, you know, you wake up, you're getting your kids ready for school, going to work. And sometimes that can seem mundane. But in every little moment, you're given an opportunity to make a choice that's either like honoring and gives love to the people around you or doesn't. And so that success would be choosing to do the right thing in those circumstances. And I fail at it. But that would be success would be choosing success would look like trending in the right direction. Trending in the right direction every day. Yeah.
- [47:28]
Caitlin Peterson
That's our show for today. Thank you so much for listening. If you'd like to keep up with.
- [47:33]
Caroline Burke
The latest design industry news, check out.
- [47:35]
Caitlin Peterson
New products or browse job openings, head on over to businessofhome.com and if you're enjoying Trade Tales, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts to help others discover the show. If you have a note for the show or a story of your own to share, I'd love to hear from you and you can email me@trade talesusofhome.com Trade Tales is produced by me, Kaitlyn Peterson and Caroline Burke. This episode was edited by Caroline Burke and Michael Castaneda. Our theme music is by Kyle Scott Wilson.
- [48:07]
Caroline Burke
Thanks again for listening and I'll see.
- [48:09]
Caitlin Peterson
You back here next week.