Just Existing is Cringe w/ Justine Marino and Caroline Goldfarb

Summary

Podcast Summary: Trash Tuesday

Episode Title: Just Existing is Cringe w/ Justine Marino and Caroline Goldfarb
Release Date: February 4, 2025
Hosts: Khalyla Kuhn & Esther Povitsky
Guests: Justine Marino & Caroline Goldfarb

In this lively episode of "Trash Tuesday," hosts Khalyla Kuhn and Esther Povitsky, along with guests Justine Marino and Caroline Goldfarb, dive deep into a myriad of topics ranging from the frustrations of modern dating apps to the intricacies of celebrity relationships and personal growth. Here's a comprehensive breakdown of the episode:

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1. Opening Remarks: The Decline of Dating Apps

The episode kicks off with Khalyla expressing her disdain for contemporary dating apps, describing them as "cringe" and "apocalyptic." She nostalgically recalls a time when dating apps were fun and free of stigma.

Notable Quote:
Khalyla ([00:00]): "Anything that a guy posts on his Hinge or on his Instagram, like, is cringe. Like, just his mere existence. I'm, like, disgusted with it."

2. Guest Introductions: Justine Marino & Caroline Goldfarb

Justine Marino and Caroline Goldfarb are warmly welcomed to the show. Justine shares her background in stand-up comedy and her podcast "Glitter and Garbage," while Caroline highlights her involvement with Patreon and exclusive bonus content.

Notable Quote:
Esther ([02:41]): "We're still coming to you from Displacement. My face is still half paralyzed. Esther still has the poofies, and we will check in on her in a little bit."

3. Celebrity Spotlight: Jean Hong and Real Estate Insights

The conversation shifts to Jean Hong, a real estate expert known for his directness and honesty. Khalyla shares her positive experiences working with Jean, emphasizing his expertise in identifying great property deals and his trustworthy advice.

Notable Quote:
Khalyla ([05:33]): "He sends articles, and he's like, look, like the AQI in this house. This is before we're talking about AQI. This is like 20."

4. Tech Dependency: Living Without a Phone

Khalyla discusses her decision to forego a smartphone in favor of using an iPad, detailing the challenges and humorous mishaps that arise from being "off-grid." She shares a personal story about being late to a meeting due to connectivity issues, highlighting the drawbacks of cutting off traditional phone use.

Notable Quote:
Khalyla ([09:04]): "I have not had a working phone for two and a half weeks. Can you deal?"

5. Celebrity Gossip & Rumors: Barack Obama & Jennifer Aniston Affair

The hosts engage in a heated discussion about rumors suggesting an affair between former President Barack Obama and actress Jennifer Aniston. They dissect various facets of the rumor, including public perceptions and veracity, while expressing skepticism and humor regarding the speculation.

Notable Quote:
Kalila ([37:56]): "Barack and Jen, because this has been a rumor for a minute. But it's so outlandish, right?"

6. Aging Gracefully: Botox, Menopause, and Beauty Standards

A significant portion of the episode delves into the pressures of aging in Hollywood. The hosts and guests share their perspectives on cosmetic procedures like Botox, the onset of menopause, and societal expectations surrounding beauty and youthfulness.

Notable Quote:
Kalila ([46:52]): "She looks so good. I have a whole... She got a botched facelift? Wait..."

7. Personal Growth: Codependency and People-Pleasing

The discussion transitions to deeper personal topics such as codependency and the tendency to please others. Esther and Khalyla reflect on their experiences with 12-step programs, setting healthy boundaries, and the journey toward self-acceptance and growth.

Notable Quote:
Justine Marino ([58:08]): "I think it's just being tired. And also, it's like, life's short. We're 40 in now, you know?"

8. Cultural Differences in Communication: High vs. Low Context

The hosts explore the nuances of cultural communication styles, particularly how expressing needs directly can be perceived differently across cultures. They share anecdotes about navigating these differences in social settings.

Notable Quote:
Esther ([61:53]): "It's like, it's rude to be like, hey, can you just... It's... It's cold in here. Make it warmer."

9. Final Thoughts: Embracing Change and Letting Go

As the episode wraps up, the hosts encourage embracing personal changes and letting go of unfulfilling relationships. They emphasize the importance of prioritizing one's own well-being over external judgments and societal expectations.

Notable Quote:
Esther ([64:09]): "But I think it's that kind of mentality of like, okay, cool, if I'm not invited... let that friendship go away."

10. Closing Remarks & Future Outlook

In their closing thoughts, Khalyla and Esther express gratitude towards their listeners and hope to return to a more stable studio environment in future episodes. They also share a lighthearted hope that Gene Hong will eventually accept Khalyla into his friend circle.

Notable Quote:
Esther ([69:32]): "Thank you guys so much. And we hope that the next episode, we're back in the swing of things in a regular studio and that I have a home to live in by then."

---

Key Takeaways:

• Modern Dating Pitfalls: A critical view of current dating apps, highlighting their decline from being enjoyable platforms to sources of frustration.
• Celebrity Wisdom: Insights into the real estate market through the lens of Jean Hong's expertise.
• Technology's Double-Edged Sword: The challenges of minimizing tech dependency in an increasingly connected world.
• Navigating Fame: Engaging discussions on the rumors and realities of celebrity relationships.
• Aging and Identity: Honest conversations about the pressures of aging, beauty standards, and personal acceptance.
• Personal Development: Deep dives into overcoming codependency and fostering self-respect and boundaries.

This episode of "Trash Tuesday" offers a blend of humor, personal anecdotes, and candid discussions, making it a relatable and insightful listen for those navigating similar life challenges or interested in the candid side of celebrity culture.

Transcript

[Kalila]

Like, just existing is cringe. Like, anything that a guy posts on his hinge or on his Instagram, like, is cringe. Like, just his mere existence. I'm, like, disgusted with. I can't explain, but we're in what we call end stage apps. I think it's apocalyptic. People have, like, are jaded. They're past jaded. They've been on the apps, they've been off the apps. Like, there's just the drags left. Like, this recent time that I've been single was the worst yet, but 10 years ago, oh, my God, the apps were so fun.

[Esther]

So fun.

[Kalila]

Meaning good, guys. There wasn't, like, a stigma, really, and it was just. It was just easier, you know, people.

[Esther]

Were putting their MySpace bio energy into the apps.

[Caroline Goldfarb]

And a shout out to our golden slugs, Mary Thomas Shepard, Kia Carbasi, Anthony Pagano, Ron Perillo, Chrysante Kelly, and Ariel Rosso. They thank you. And we are having so much fun with you guys on the Patreon. Definitely come check us out. Join us right now. We have two full bonus episodes up there. Kyle and I did an AMA this week that we uploaded a whole episode answering your guys questions. And there's more to come. We're doing bonus content every week. Patreon.com Trash Tuesday, I think. Link below.

[Kalila]

I am really shook. I'm amazed. This apartment is kind of flooring me.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah, me too.

[Esther]

Oh, me too. Every day I wake up, I'm like, do I want to go home?

[Kalila]

How do I get a friend like Gene Hong? Friend, you know, Jean, I met him, like, three times, and I've been trying to get in with him and make a friendship where there isn't one for what feels like years at this point.

[Esther]

Can I tell you something about Gene Hong? You know when you meet someone and you're like, no notes.

[Justine Marino]

Yes.

[Esther]

No notes. They're decent.

[Justine Marino]

Yes.

[Esther]

They're generous. They're. They're direct. There's just almost like.

[Kalila]

Just no notes.

[Justine Marino]

Direct is so important. Direct is so hard to find. You know, Rip me a new one. Yeah, rip me a new one. Thank you.

[Kalila]

Be honest.

[Justine Marino]

Yes.

[Kalila]

Tell me I look like shit, and I want Jean to be that person.

[Esther]

He's not that kind of direct.

[Kalila]

Okay.

[Esther]

Okay. He's not gonna tell you you look like shit. But he is someone like you. There's no guessing game. You don't have to guess where you stand with him, right?

[Kalila]

I know where I stand. He doesn't want to be friends with me.

[Esther]

I. We should ask him.

[Kalila]

Okay. We should actually have a good Gene Hong story.

[Esther]

So let's introduce you guys. First, you guys, welcome to Trash Tuesday. I'm Kalila, and today is. We're still coming to you from Displacement. My face is still half paralyzed. Esther still has the poofies, and we will check in on her in a little bit.

[Justine Marino]

Thank God.

[Esther]

But thankfully, we have two amazing people who have come through. Frequent flyer Caroline Goldfarb right there on Wakanda Forever. Sex lives of college girls.

[Kalila]

Not anymore.

[Justine Marino]

What?

[Kalila]

I'll. I'll get into it. Okay.

[Justine Marino]

But previously, she's like, I got fired, actually. Well, basically.

[Esther]

And Justine Marino, you had a show on E. Thank you.

[Justine Marino]

The funny, Funny dance show. Not my choice to call it that. Just FYI.

[Esther]

Very funny. Standup. And you also have a podcast called Glitter and Garbage.

[Justine Marino]

Yes. So I thought a Trash Garbage crossover is what the people want.

[Kalila]

I love it.

[Justine Marino]

God.

[Kalila]

You guys both have podcasts that are named after, like, detritus.

[Esther]

Trash.

[Kalila]

Garbage. Detritus is a fancy word for garbage.

[Justine Marino]

Wow.

[Esther]

Oh, wow. Carolyn, do you think. Really? I would have known that.

[Kalila]

I was, like, struggling to think of the, you know, synonym for those things. I love that. That's so thematically appropriate.

[Esther]

What's your funny Jean Hong story?

[Kalila]

Okay, so I have met Jean Hong a few times. Social. And he's just got the best energy of anyone I've met. I'm an energy reader. Yeah. Top tier energy. 10 out of 10. No notes. To quote you. He's just fucking cool. And when I worked on Chad, the comedy on TBS that I think seven people watched, starring the incredibly talented Naseem Pedro, who's one of my idols, she was on snl and she created, wrote, starred in the show, and it's ahead of its time. Everyone should watch if they have it. She is really close with Gene, and so she would sometimes bring around the writers room and just kind of like, Jean would be in the mix, you know what I mean? And he. He's just sick. And he, like, writes on all these shows. Like, he's got this really cool career. And I was looking for a house when I was, you know, before I bought a house, and she was like, jean's really, really good with houses. He is. He is.

[Esther]

He's the real estate guy. Like, he. He will tell you if it's a good deal.

[Justine Marino]

I just have to say, based on this apartment, I trust anything he says. Real estate, dude.

[Kalila]

This is, like, where I imagine Diane von Furstenberg lives. This kind of house. There's crown molding. There's original hardwood floors in here. It's gorgeous. Is that oak? Maybe. I don't know. Ask Jean. Anyway, so it seems like Gene knows everything. You gotta ask him. Like, if. When you find a house, have Gene look again. I was like, I don't really know him like that. And I was looking at this one house. It was deep in the Valley. Of course, I ended up moving to the Valley. I just can't help myself. I'm a Valley girl. And it was this really, really cute house. And it seemed too good to be true. Like, the price didn't make sense. And I was like, okay, Naseem, I guess, like, will you ask Gene about this house? I feel kind of weird. She's like, don't feel weird. He's like, so nice. Like, let me ask him. And he sends her back, which she sends to me a long paragraph, like.

[Esther]

She doesn't know me.

[Kalila]

This is the kind of paragraph that I would barely even send. Like, my closest friend or family member being like, okay, laying it all out, breaking it down. He's like, this house is. It is a deal. It seems too good to be true. And it is, because the house was pretty much right on the freeway. It was like, inside a freeway. It was so close to the freeway. And he's like, here's the thing. Like, you know, you're not really technically supposed to live next to a freeway, but, you know, that's kind of like it's case by case basis. He's like, but the freeway that it's next to is the 5, and the 5's an interstate, which means there's a lot of trucks on it. And what we call that is a diesel death trap. Where you're, like, within a thousand feet of a freeway. We call it the diesel death trap. A phrase that will never leave my brain. And he's like, sending articles, and he's like, look, like the AQI in this house. This is before we're talking about AQI. This is like 20.

[Esther]

Are we all experts now, though?

[Kalila]

I know. Don't get me started on particulate. Don't. Seriously, don't. Anyway, Jean's the man. I didn't get the house and diesel death trap. I learned a phrase from him that.

[Justine Marino]

Sounds like a Fast and The Furious. Like, 20 years from now. The 20. Fast and Furious 40. Diesel Death Trap.

[Kalila]

Fuck, yes. Familia.

[Justine Marino]

Starring Vin Diesel as diesel Tyson Beckford. Oh, Tyson for sure. Got to get Tyson in. Full team, Whole team.

[Esther]

I know we're all about, like, clean energy these days, but, like, I live with and my partner in life, the love of my life, Is very pro diesel. And I have. Do we this diesel need a rebrand cuz apparently it runs better for certain types of. Do you know much about diesel guy?

[Justine Marino]

This is random, but I had a car. I flipped over my Jetta. Oh no. When I was 17 on the way to see actually Fast and the Furious. Okay, on topic, 50 cent kept playing even after I crashed, so he is my angel. But after that I inherited my parents Passat, which was a diesel. And it was really great on gas. Like I only had to fill up. I mean I was probably ripping apart. I mean I am responsible for the ozone layer. I'm sure. Like great on like not having to stop for gas a lot.

[Kalila]

Totally. It's like you butterfly affected the fire. Exactly. Because you drove a Passat that took diesel for like two minutes.

[Esther]

But everything needs a rebrand because I think that like this whole clean air, clean energy thing, like aren't we mining the bottom of the ocean for lithium just so we can like. Caroline, you're looking at me like I just.

[Kalila]

My brain went blank because I'm like, I came here to talk about celebrity gossip and suddenly we're talking about mining lithium. I just like saw. Truly saw stars. I was like, I don't have anything to contribute to this conversation. They sound so smart right now. I'm like, I do not have a take on Diesel.

[Esther]

Straight up.

[Kalila]

Like I don't have a hot take at all. I'm scared, I'm nervous. I'm like kind of getting sweaty. I'm like trying to rack my brain for a take. I will say I'm always shocked when I go to the gas station. I see Diesel. I'm always like, oh, that exists. And it's expensive. I'm like, shouldn't it be the cheaper option if it's like the bad, you know, I mean, it's like, I think it was like the processed food of gasoline. I'm like, Doritos are cheaper than organic sandwich, right? I don't know. See, I don't know what I'm talking about. Like, why did you guys make me do this?

[Esther]

Some burly manly man is like banging his head against the wall listening. Listening to us talk about Diesel.

[Kalila]

Right now we have to change top. Okay, we will not be coming. Wait. Okay, I should share about how I don't have a phone.

[Esther]

Okay. Yeah.

[Justine Marino]

Oh yeah.

[Kalila]

You guys, I'm in my trad wife unplugged off the grid. I have not had a working phone for two and a half weeks. Can you deal?

[Justine Marino]

Why?

[Kalila]

Because I have Apple Care like every sane person. And I don't know if you guys have broken your phones before, but when you have Apple Care, you just reach out to your friend, you know, your Apple Care person who's like, located in Sri Lanka. I'm like, hey, girl, my phone broke. I need a new one. And they usually send one really, really fast. It's like, amazing service. But my phone is so old at this point. I have an iPhone 13 mini, and I will not deviate from my Mini. My phone is this big. It's a Polly pocket phone, but it's so old that it's on backorder. They're like, babe, we don't. We have to like, make that phone again. Like, it's so old. So I'm like, fine, I'll wait. I'm in a standoff right now with Apple.

[Justine Marino]

How it's making a point.

[Esther]

Yeah, and you want that mini. You want that 13, and you're not ever going to graduate.

[Kalila]

You don't understand how amazing it is to have a phone that's this big. My. When I pick up like a 16 max, like, what do you guys have?

[Justine Marino]

I mean, it's the 14, but it's.

[Kalila]

Let me see.

[Justine Marino]

Pro.

[Kalila]

Yeah. Like, yeah, you have the biggest phone possible.

[Justine Marino]

I love it though.

[Kalila]

This is so big. Doesn't your thumb get sore?

[Esther]

Guess what, Caroline, what are you lugging around the last two weeks and iPad.

[Justine Marino]

Yes, exactly.

[Kalila]

I am carrying everywhere I go for safety reasons. Like, I'm loving that just to say I'm loving not having a phone. I haven't opened Instagram in weeks. I, like, just don't need it. I don't need the distraction. It took like two days to get over the full on withdrawal drug withdrawal. But now I'm just free. I'm like, reading books. I'm like, looking at nature. I like, see colors I've never seen before. But I have to bring an iPad everywhere. So, like, just in case, you know, like, if I need to log on to the wifi and check my email.

[Esther]

Take it up a notch. Just go on MapQuest, print out your directions.

[Kalila]

You don't think that I'm leaving the house with printed stuff these days? Babe, you don't understand. I'm going to a movie tonight. I printed my AMC stubs QR code.

[Justine Marino]

Oh, your A list code.

[Kalila]

I printed my A list code. I'm sitting down at a restaurant and I hold up my iPad and I say, can I have the WI fi, please? I'm like a full crazy person. I'm kind of living for It.

[Justine Marino]

I kind of like it.

[Kalila]

So anyway, the reason I was fully 25 minutes late, basically, was because there are some moments where I missed the phone. Like today when I was sent the email with this address and it was like, the parking is kind of hard to find, babes. Like, call us if you have any issues. I was like, I've lived in LA my whole life. I can figure this out.

[Justine Marino]

She dropped a pin and I was like, oh, thanks. And then nothing from Caroline. I was like, man, she's confident. She doesn't even need the pin.

[Kalila]

I was on WI fi when I received that text, to be clear, and I opened up the pin, but I was like, well, I better not get too invested in this pin because, like, I'm gonna have to raw dog it when I get there. I was like, it's on. I won't say the street, but I was like, it's off this street. I, like, kind of looked at the pin. I was like, I've lived in LA my whole life. Like, how hard can this be? It was really hard. I pulled up I want to be clear at 1pm and I could not figure out the parking situation. And then I'm like, in my car and I'm like, well, maybe I'll open up the iPad and they'll magically be WI fi and I can open up the pin and no, there's just not WI fi magically. This is like in a residential area. And I was so confused. And I was like, this is the one day where I really miss my phone. So I just want to let you guys know you are.

[Esther]

You're a warrior now. You can honestly say, like, I'm analog and almost analog, and you're a changed woman.

[Kalila]

I sort of want to just commit. Is that crazy?

[Esther]

I think you should commit to just the flip phone.

[Kalila]

Yeah, exactly. I need a flip phone.

[Justine Marino]

When you walked in, I was like, oh, Caroline means business. Today she brought an iPad.

[Kalila]

Extremely late. She's holding a full blown iPad. Like there's something going on with her. And I think it's good, but I'm not sure, but I don't know, like, it's kind of sick, like, during the inauguration to not have to open Instagram.

[Justine Marino]

Mm.

[Kalila]

It was sick. I'm just saying.

[Esther]

So I think so I think, like, you know, occasionally, like, bury your phone somewhere. I think that's a good deal.

[Kalila]

But of course, you know, my mom was like, hey, I've been calling you for a week and it keeps going to voicemail. Are you dead? I'm like, no, I don't have a phone. Like, there are people I. There are people, I think, that are genuinely concerned, but this is my announcement. This is really good that I'm here.

[Esther]

Yeah.

[Kalila]

Just reminding everybody, all my friends that are dying to get in contact with me. I do not currently have a phone, but I do. I can receive imessages.

[Justine Marino]

Do you know when the phone will be coming? Is there a date? Is there a trip?

[Kalila]

Standoff is worse than ever. Apple will not give me updates. They will not commit to an eta. But again, I've got nothing but time, baby.

[Justine Marino]

You've got an iPad and time.

[Kalila]

Keep it coming. Keep it going.

[Justine Marino]

I mean, wait, what movie are you seeing tonight?

[Kalila]

I really want to see the Kiki Palmer SZA movie, but my friend was like, no, I saw it.

[Justine Marino]

It's cute.

[Kalila]

I'm dying to see it. We're seeing the Last Showgirl, which I'm sure you've seen.

[Justine Marino]

I've seen it.

[Esther]

Good.

[Justine Marino]

I was a little disappointed. Full disclosure, it's vibes. It's. It's Gia. It's not Sophia. Just know that. Yeah, but, I mean, I'm always rooting for Pam, but it's no anora, babe. I mean, anora I've seen still.

[Esther]

I know. You cried. I've seen it. I haven't seen it.

[Justine Marino]

I met Sean Baker last night. I went to a Q A and got to meet him after, and it was really. I'm obsessed with him now.

[Kalila]

I feel like you could get in there because he found that comedian, Ivy Wolk.

[Justine Marino]

Right. And also, I love her.

[Kalila]

She's so great. And yes.

[Justine Marino]

I mean, the. The way he casts people. Like he had seen Mikey Madison in Once Upon a Time in Hollywood, was blown away and then went to Scream. The scream that she was in five opening weekend, and left the theater and called her agent to put her in Anora wasn't.

[Esther]

You know, I know Mikey Madison because she played a daughter of Pamela Adlon in Better Things, Right?

[Justine Marino]

Yes, exactly.

[Esther]

Know her?

[Justine Marino]

Yep.

[Kalila]

You know, she's great. I. I'm Jewish, obviously. Spoiler alert. And Jewish people have an obsession with pointing out when other people are Jewish. So I apologize for this, but Mikey Madison is a Jewish girl from Sherman Oaks like me.

[Justine Marino]

She is.

[Esther]

You know what? So I genuinely thought she was a hot, like, a half Asian girl. And I claim no. I was like, oh, no, she's one of me. And that's how I, like, I clocked it in my head. I'm like, so cute that they. They casted like a half Asian girl as her Daughter. She's not even white.

[Kalila]

Well, Jew. Can you believe it?

[Esther]

Crazy.

[Kalila]

We're not putting up tens like that.

[Justine Marino]

She is so, so smoking hot.

[Kalila]

She' gorgeous.

[Justine Marino]

Body in anora is insane. She looks so good. My birthday party, my 40th birthday is Anora themed. I'm. We're going to go to this trip.

[Esther]

So you're turning 40?

[Kalila]

Yes.

[Justine Marino]

And what's.

[Esther]

What's the feeling?

[Kalila]

Is this not like. Can we just stop for a second? You look 21.

[Justine Marino]

Thank you so much. I love you so much.

[Kalila]

You're my hero.

[Justine Marino]

It's all the bangs. It's just the bangs.

[Kalila]

You say that, but it's not. Thank you.

[Justine Marino]

Bless you. I only do weed and mushrooms. No drinking. I think that's the key.

[Kalila]

Okay.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Kalila]

All right.

[Justine Marino]

That's the key.

[Kalila]

I'm still going to drink.

[Justine Marino]

You look so great, though. I mean, you're Zochi. Your. Your girl.

[Kalila]

I've been, like, slowing down on the Botox a little bit because Zochi, where I used to get Botox is really expensive.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Esther]

Is that the place to go? What am I missing?

[Justine Marino]

I only know because we've talked about it on my podcast and she's recommended Zochi to me. Who is.

[Kalila]

Who is she?

[Esther]

Where is she? Where do I need to be?

[Kalila]

She is an NP nurse practitioner at Facile. Do you know what that is? And she mostly works at other Pasadena locations. I think she was also displace.

[Esther]

Oh, no.

[Justine Marino]

Oh, no.

[Esther]

It's not good. When your Botox lady is this place.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah, no, that's.

[Kalila]

That's. Then it affects me and now we have a problem. Just kidding. I. I'm very sad. I've been sad. It's not just the Botox, but I. I love Zochi. I think I have to go back to her. I did something bad.

[Justine Marino]

What did you do?

[Kalila]

Well, it was just so expensive.

[Esther]

Cheated on you.

[Justine Marino]

Cheat and go somewhere less. You didn't go Groupon, did you?

[Kalila]

I did worse. I did a lot of research.

[Justine Marino]

Okay.

[Kalila]

And I found a place in deep San Gabriel Valley. Oh, like deep. Deeper than I've been in a minute.

[Esther]

I thought you were gonna say Tijuana. And I was like, oh, that I respect.

[Kalila]

Honestly, is not far off. It is so cheap. The Botox is. I'm out of there. Last time I went, I got full micro needling. Full Botox. And I think I was out for like, less than 300. Whoa.

[Esther]

No.

[Kalila]

With a PRP. The micro needling with PRP at facile. The micro needling with PRp that's when they take your blood. Yeah. Spin the centrifuge and, like, put the plasma all over you. I think it's like eleven hundred dollars or something like that. I. So I cheated. I do think that the Botox, it's just. It doesn't compare.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Kalila]

She's so good. Yeah. So I think I'm gonna have to bite the bullet and go back.

[Justine Marino]

Well, you look great either way today.

[Kalila]

Well, I guess I threw on a little makeup.

[Justine Marino]

Love a full beat on a Saturday afternoon.

[Kalila]

I guess a little bit, but. Okay, wait. So back to Anora your 40th birthday and how we're going to get you cast to the next Sean movie.

[Justine Marino]

Well, I did meet him. Y. And I was wearing the most batshit outfit. I was wearing a Halloween T shirt like, it's Jamie Lee Curtis. And then camo Aviator Nation joggers, checkered vans, and a bright orange long faux fur coat that's. And a leopard fanny pack. But I'm like, I'm in the back. He's not. He's not going to see my outfit. And then, of course, he waits to, like, meet people after. And I'm like, I'm meeting Sean Baker looking unwell. Like, I'm an unwell person.

[Kalila]

I totally disagree. I feel like he's loves color. The Florida project is all about color.

[Justine Marino]

It is all about color.

[Kalila]

He loves young comedians.

[Justine Marino]

He did compliment the coat.

[Esther]

I will say that's a win.

[Justine Marino]

That was a win.

[Esther]

Huge win.

[Kalila]

Huge win. We're gonna get you cast in the next.

[Justine Marino]

Thank you so much.

[Esther]

My biggest flex. Don't mean to.

[Justine Marino]

Yes, please.

[Esther]

My biggest flex is that for no reason at all. For reasons I cannot explain. Jamie Lee Curtis follows me on Instagram.

[Kalila]

Wow.

[Justine Marino]

I. I'm glad I didn't know that, like, coming in, I would have been much more nervous in my head. Like, that is a huge flex that you need to tell everyone.

[Esther]

So random. Also 711 Hawaii. So those are my two biggest flexes.

[Kalila]

Wow.

[Justine Marino]

What a day.

[Kalila]

Oh, my God.

[Justine Marino]

In the presence of great.

[Esther]

Am I not.

[Kalila]

No kidding.

[Esther]

Relevant. Most important person on earth.

[Kalila]

You are this apparently making a lot more sense. Yeah.

[Esther]

Do you know why Gene has brought me into his life?

[Justine Marino]

Yes.

[Kalila]

For those two follows, we call it the JLC effect. The Jimmy Lee Curtis effect. That is. Wow.

[Esther]

She unfollows me right after this.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah, she immediately unfollows me.

[Esther]

No, thanks.

[Justine Marino]

Isn't it funny how random celebs just follow you? Like Taylor Hansen randomly followed me a few months ago.

[Esther]

The Hanson brothers.

[Kalila]

Yes. The.

[Justine Marino]

The one that I Loved, by the way.

[Kalila]

I mean, I feel like I've heard you talk about Hanson, like, no less than 20 times on your public podcast.

[Esther]

I mean, there's a reason.

[Kalila]

Just random.

[Justine Marino]

I'm like, I can't believe I'm constantly texting him and. And blowing up his ig.

[Kalila]

You're like, how could this happen?

[Justine Marino]

How could he possibly know?

[Esther]

I feel like the Hansen brother pivot, though, has been really cool because, you know, they were just some like, you know, teeny boppy band back in the day, but now they're literally working with like. Like the Philharmonic and doing real shit. Yeah, like super cool shit.

[Justine Marino]

Well, they were always musicians, right? Like, they played music, you know. It was pretty impressive. Impressive. Although it was a little. It was seen as corny at the time, but I had my hands and folders in middle school. I sure did.

[Kalila]

Aren't they super Christian?

[Esther]

I think they were, yeah.

[Kalila]

So they transition from super Christian to like, slightly less Christian.

[Justine Marino]

Maybe they have a beer company now. Oh, yeah, like Hanson brews or something.

[Kalila]

Okay. I can get down with that.

[Justine Marino]

Or bruise or.

[Kalila]

Oh, can you name one other Hanson song besides Mbop? Gun to your head right now.

[Justine Marino]

Fly the wings of an eagle.

[Kalila]

That.

[Justine Marino]

That's a song on. It's been a while since I've listened to the full album, but I did like that. The full album.

[Esther]

Christian.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah. It, it, it.

[Kalila]

And wings are big code words.

[Justine Marino]

Big.

[Kalila]

Those are Christ code words. Christ coded, like peace. I don't know other Christ. I'm so Jewish. Like, I can't even do this. Like, hands. Kind of feels like a Christ thing.

[Esther]

Bread.

[Kalila]

That's a big one.

[Justine Marino]

Sacred. I went to Catholic school, so I. Catholic. Bread is Catholic.

[Esther]

Yeah, that's not.

[Kalila]

Yeah, I know. They so co opted that.

[Esther]

Yeah. Bread is ours.

[Kalila]

Well, and they left us with matzah, so it's not going well for me.

[Esther]

You got the balls.

[Kalila]

That's true. We can make balls out of them. I guess it's fine.

[Esther]

How do you feel about almost turning 40? I just turned 40.

[Justine Marino]

You did?

[Kalila]

Yeah.

[Justine Marino]

You look amazing.

[Esther]

Thank you.

[Justine Marino]

You look so good.

[Kalila]

I'm in the substance. What the fuck is going on?

[Justine Marino]

Thank you so much.

[Esther]

You know, it's a little toxic LA water, babe.

[Justine Marino]

It is. It's extreme vanity. That's what it is. And bangs, as I keep saying. I. It's just Crypt Keeper up here. I pull up my. And it's literally to me, at the end of the substance, my forehead.

[Esther]

So when you get Botox, do you not bother at all?

[Justine Marino]

Never gotten Botox.

[Esther]

I Never know.

[Justine Marino]

I literally got bangs so that I wouldn't have to get Botox.

[Esther]

That is a life hack.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah, it is a life hack because also I got scared when I went to my dermatologist because I have a heavy brow and I have deep set eyes because I'm Sicilian. So she was like, we could do it up here, but then your brow might get heavier and you might have to do. Because part of why I have these lines is because I'm constantly lifting my brow because it's a heavy brow. Then she was like, we might have to do some around your eyes. And then I just got overwhelmed and got bangs instead. So I have done nothing except 9000 skin care steps at night.

[Esther]

That's.

[Justine Marino]

That's kind of my thing.

[Kalila]

Well, it's genetics. Let's also just be honest.

[Esther]

It totally is.

[Justine Marino]

It is my dad's side of the family and my mom's side, they both look great, but my dad is side is Sicilian and they all look like. Like my dad has a full head of hair, salt and pepper, and he's about to turn 70.

[Kalila]

Is your dad really hot?

[Justine Marino]

I. I do have had a few friends who have wanted to. My dad. So what's going on?

[Kalila]

Is he single?

[Justine Marino]

No, he's not.

[Kalila]

Just checking.

[Justine Marino]

I'll let you know. I'll let you know. Okay.

[Esther]

Are we still dating the same guy?

[Kalila]

Oh, my God.

[Justine Marino]

What guy?

[Kalila]

No, I think I've had. I'm not kidding. It's like six boyfriends this year.

[Justine Marino]

Really?

[Kalila]

It was my Carrie Bradshaw year. I dated so many guys.

[Justine Marino]

Only the 20.

[Kalila]

Sorry, sorry. I keep 2025. I keep forgetting. In the year of our Lord 2024, I had. I dated so many Chinese New Year. Yeah. I'm going lunar. My bad. I. Yeah. So the answer to your question is I think no, probably. I really move fast. And Q4, I was a lot of turnover.

[Justine Marino]

Wow.

[Kalila]

I am currently in an amazing relationship with the best. Best guy. I Knock on wood. Really happy. We're. He's the best. I'm so, so, so happy. I'm like, okay, I can finally calm down. But I had to really. It was a buffet. It was a dick buffet. That's.

[Justine Marino]

That's how it always is. I feel right before you get into a relationship. I was the same way right before I got with my boyfriend. It was just like dick city, you know?

[Kalila]

Well, you have to figure out what you don't like to figure out what you do like. And it really was helpful to have a lot of the. The recent. The dick turnstile, like recently in my mind, because all of this guy's amazing, incredible qualities that make him my dream partner were really put into sharp relief. I was like, okay, I had this guy that was so bad. I didn't like that. And this was that and that was it. But, like, when I was really ready, you know, like, I really knew what I wanted by the time I met him. I mean, I dated a. I dated a lot of weirdos. I'm like, it's kind of. It's kind of scary to think about because every time I see people, they're like, are you still dating that guy? I'm like, which guy? And no.

[Esther]

Yeah, but isn't it so interesting that, like, it dating that many weirdos will almost throw you in a state of like, whatever decent normie I come across is like a godsend at this point. And then you, like, latch.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Esther]

Like, that's basically how I felt about Aloha, my partner, where it's like, I think I was just in this, like, cesspool of a certain type of person for so long. Not Bobby, but just in LA in general, that I was like, oh, my God. Like, when I met him, I was like, you're so beautiful and normal and decent and kind and like, let's just. Let's be together. Please have me. He was like, calm your tits, bitch.

[Justine Marino]

Calm your tits. LA is a really hard place to date. I personally did have to import from Denver.

[Esther]

Oh, you had to import?

[Kalila]

Yes.

[Esther]

So I imported from Hawaii.

[Justine Marino]

Oh, see, so that's what I recommend to all my LA girlies who are single, go to Denver, Hawaii, like. But your guy.

[Kalila]

I got an import export business going over here. Like my Persian uncles. I got to be importing. D. Getting rid of the lady. No, my guy is. He's an L. A local, but he's a good. The key was a setup. Not online dating. The online dating. I want to be positive about it. I'm not a man hater. I'm not one of these girls. It's like, online dating is so awful you can't find anyone.

[Esther]

Then it is so bad.

[Kalila]

Like, yes, it's all of those things. But I believe in keeping a positive attitude. I was on all the apps. I was even on field. Do you guys know what field is?

[Esther]

Yes, I've been on field.

[Kalila]

There you go.

[Justine Marino]

I've never been on any apps because I started with my boyfriend when all the apps started. What? What's it?

[Kalila]

Sicilian with a heavy brow from Denver. Like, you've got a whole other situation going on. I don't know what's going on with you. The apps are crazy. And I've been on the apps so crazy because I've been on the apps in different, in different levels. I've been in and out of relationships for like, oh, my God, how old am I? I'm 34 for like 15 years. Like, and it's been so many phases of the apps and we're in what we call end stage apps. I think it's apocalyptic. People have, like, are jaded. They're past jaded. They've been on the apps, they've been off the apps. Like, the. There's just the drags left. Like, this recent time that I've been single was the worst yet, but 10 years ago, oh, my God, the apps were so fun.

[Esther]

So fun.

[Kalila]

Meaning good guys. There wasn't like a stigma, really. And it was just. It was just easier.

[Esther]

You know, we're putting their MySpace bio energy into the apps we were just coming off of. I mean, what. I mean, Instagram was brand new, right? We couldn't, we couldn't immediately, like, search for, like, look for intel. Right out the gate. We meet someone on the apps and the first thing I do is like, look at their socials. Like, what are, you know, are they, are they cringe on there? Are they not?

[Justine Marino]

Right?

[Kalila]

Yeah, it was like pre people. It's like, we're so post wave. Everything, like, just existing is cringe. You know what I mean?

[Justine Marino]

I don't know how to explain, like.

[Kalila]

Anything that a guy posts on his hinge or on his Instagram, like, is cringe. Like, just his mere existence. I'm like, disgusted with. I can't explain, but we've hit such.

[Esther]

A low in dating apps that I recently heard of this thing called food digging. I don't know if that's a correct term, and I might be wrong, but basically, where restaurants will create fake profiles on dating apps, set up a date with a girl, and the girl shows up to the restaurant, then ghosts her, and now she's forced to eat at that restaurant and spend her dollars there. That's how they're getting patrons in there. Have you heard of this?

[Kalila]

No. That's what happened. Wait, that's what that was.

[Esther]

Because, you know, I don't know if you guys. It's like my favorite hot hobby is are we dating the same guy Pages.

[Justine Marino]

Oh, I need to get into that.

[Esther]

Oh, yeah, I would love it. And you don't just get into the LA ones. You have to. You have to get into every single municipality.

[Kalila]

Like, oh, I want Kansas City drama girl.

[Esther]

Me too. That's all I do is read. That is my. That is my reading material.

[Kalila]

The baby's crying. You're like, not now, honey. Mommy's reading about two girls that are saying, dating the same guy in Boise. Stop crying.

[Esther]

This is where I found out about it. Because this girl's like. Literally, he was texting me up to the point where he was like, I'm right outside. I'm parking. And then all of a sudden, he's gone. And then blocks her on the apps. And she's like, what the happened? He was just parking his car. And it turns out it's a scam. It's a restaurant scam. So I don't know if this speaks to you in any way, Carol.

[Kalila]

I haven't been. Restaurant scam. But I'll share a couple quick stories. I met a guy on Raya who was like. Like, on paper, the dream guy. He was super hot, super tall, super. He was Jewish. That's very rare. And he just had it going on. He was really cool. We had a lot of friends in common. That's the key, because you gotta have someone vet their character. So I was able to, like, ask around. And people like, I've known him forever. He's so great. Oh, my God. I'm giving too many details. Cause I'm about to say something so nasty. But we go on this first date, and it's incredible. It's electric. There isn't a better first date in the world. And I'm like, this is my husband. I'm like, straight up, I found him. This is incredible. We go on a second date. He takes me to a very classic restaurant in Los Angeles. It's very romantic. I wear the sexiest dress ever. We're hitting it off. We're vibing. He's got a lot of game. But he's Jewish. So, like, you think that he's a nice guy. Like, my brain doesn't go to, oh, he's a fuck boy. I'm like, he's a nice Jewish guy. He's like, tell me about his fucking grandma. And, like, the temple he got bar mitzvahed at. He. We go back to my house. I'm not. I don't on this. I wait. I really make them wait for it. I re. I'm like, the full. The rules. I usually wait at least a month. But we were kind of fooling around. Like, I was getting a little tempted. And he did something to me that no man has ever done before or done since. And I Still can't believe I let him do it. On the second date, he was like. He, like, took my shoes off and we were, like, really making out. He was very sensual. Like, I said, he had a lot of game. And he went to suck my toes. Oh. And I was like, normally I would have that reaction. I'd be like, get your mouth the fuck off of my nasty toes. I also, like, do not have the kind of toes that would normally beg for sucking.

[Justine Marino]

They're.

[Kalila]

I have kind of like hobbit feet. Like, they're just not. I like pedicures. They're not, like, hideous, but they're just not like.

[Esther]

But the one thing I learned about the. The foot fetish community is that there is no right feet.

[Kalila]

He wasn't giving. Foot fetish is the thing you have to understand. It was almost like palladium, playful and sort of like, joking. Like, he did it in the exact right way.

[Esther]

Okay.

[Kalila]

Where you don't, like. You can't be like, can I please suck your feet?

[Esther]

He wasn't too fixated. He wasn't fixated at all.

[Kalila]

It was almost like an accident. He's like, how'd these get in here?

[Justine Marino]

He was like, oops.

[Kalila]

Now. Now we're doing this. And he did it so well. To my. To my. What I'm trying to say is, like, it's something I would never normally let a guy do, but he did it with confidence, grace, and swag. And I liked it. It. I was like, this guy's sucking my toes and I don't hate it. So we like, da, da, da. We keep going. We don't. But he, you know, it's all great. He's like, you know, can't wait to call you later. And he leaves. And I'm like, closed. I'm like, this is my guy. I can't wait. He ghosts me. To suck a woman's toes and ghost her.

[Justine Marino]

That's insane.

[Kalila]

That's low. That's low.

[Justine Marino]

That's insane.

[Kalila]

To suck a Jewish woman's toes. I know I keep bringing up being Jewish, but you guys have to understand, like, it's a small community. We've got to have each other's backs. It's like 003 of, like, the world's proper percent of the world's population to do that to a fellow Jewish woman to suck her toes. That's intimate.

[Justine Marino]

That's really intimate.

[Kalila]

That's so intimate. Why, like, you didn't have to even do that.

[Justine Marino]

Do you feel like he love bombed you a little?

[Kalila]

It's more of a toe suck bomb.

[Justine Marino]

Okay, okay.

[Kalila]

It wasn't a love bomb.

[Justine Marino]

Okay.

[Kalila]

It was certainly in. It was in the neighborhood of love bombing. But no, the worst was like, I dated this guy who was a Trump. I got dumped by a Trump voter in 2024. Low, new low, for sure.

[Esther]

Wow.

[Kalila]

It was like. It's really hard to say that sentence. I've done a lot of work to even just be able to share that, but I'm not ashamed. I am ashamed. Sorry. Let me, let me. Anyway, I'm like, watchman. Be like Kimberly Guilfoyle in two years. They're like, sorry, who are you guys? I'm in the Trump administration now. I got dumped by a Trump voter in 2020, 24. But he really loved bomb me. It's like the Trump thing is almost secondary to love bombing. He. It was fully like, I know you're gonna need your stuffy for this one.

[Esther]

I know. I feel like I need, I need.

[Kalila]

He was like, we're getting married. We dated for like a couple months. It was a little more serious. He had me meet his family. He. How long ago was this? I can't be too specific with the timelines. I have to.

[Esther]

I want to say 2016. Let's just say that.

[Kalila]

No, it was fully last year. It was with the last. It was within the recent Trump.

[Esther]

It was the last campaign.

[Kalila]

I was gonna say we were dating in the lead up to the election. It was. Tensions were high. Oh, and he lied to me. Sorry, I have to go back.

[Justine Marino]

Oh, yeah.

[Kalila]

So he was a Jew and he was. I don't want to, like, get too political on here, but he was a full blown Zionist, let's say that. And I know a lot of Zionists are pro Trump. It's kind of like a different thing. It's still, it's. It's abhorrent and it's disgusting to vote for Trump. I don't care, like, where you are. Like, it's gross. But he was sort of like, I was like, picking up on super Zionist vibes. Not that there's anything wrong with that. That's not a bad word. But I don't personally. Doesn't matter. Point is that on our second date, I was like, you're not voting for Trump, are you? Like, haha, you know where you stand on that. And he was like, no, no, of course not. He lied. And then a month or so later, he was like, look, he's like, I want you to get to know me. I want you to see that I'm a good person before I told you I was voting for Trump. Because if I told you on the second date, like, you wouldn't have wanted to date me. Is that true or false? I was like, it's probably true. He's like, but, yeah, I'm voting for Trump. And then I saw this whole new side of them came out. This contrarian, kind of like that, bro Trumpy. Like Mark Zuckerberg. Like, I remember when Tim Walls was announced as the vp. I remember we all, like, for a minute, he was really great. He kind of, like, ended up being a dud. But for a minute, we're like, oh, my God. He's like this guy from the Midwest.

[Esther]

He's a teacher.

[Kalila]

He coaches the peewee football. Like, and I remember he was like, ugh, Tim Waltz is disgusting. Like, that side of him came out. I was like, what are you talking about? It's like the nicest guy. He coaches, like, little kids football. He's like, he loves his daughter, little kids football. He's like, obviously that's fake. Like, I saw this, like, whole, like, weird conspiracy theory stuff, but don't worry, he did dump me. Anyway, point is that I'm dating the best guy now. I like, hope he doesn't hear this, because, yes, I date a few frogs, but I finally found my prince. Yay.

[Esther]

I'm gonna light my Michelle Obama candle for you tonight.

[Kalila]

Please.

[Esther]

Yeah, this has gotta work.

[Kalila]

Speaking of which, we need to talk about something. Yes. Are you guys keeping up with the Barack Gen rumors I saw?

[Justine Marino]

Tell me something about it. And I need you to break it down for me because I was. I'm too wrapped up in the Justin Baldoni.

[Esther]

I'm still stuck on that.

[Justine Marino]

I need to break to Tik Toks about that every night.

[Esther]

Me too.

[Justine Marino]

Like, I could be a lawyer. I feel like I've been to law school with all the lawyers I've watched. Break down the case.

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[Justine Marino]

Okay, but Barack and Jen, because this.

[Kalila]

Is interesting, I know nothing about circulating for years and it's kind of of had its moments of, like, heat, then gone away and now it's back on that Barack Obama and Jennifer Aniston have been in a pretty open affair. Slash, like, maybe it's a relationship. So this has been a rumor for a minute. But it's so outlandish, right? Like, you hear that, you're like, no, like, he's in love with the coolest, most amazing woman on earth, Michelle Obama.

[Esther]

Posted Michelle, like two days ago.

[Kalila]

Babe, you're gonna want to grip that stuffy because my sources, which are pretty reliable, I heard this months ago and my sources say it's absolutely true. So here's the thing. Michelle Michelle and Barack have never pretended to have a perfect marriage. Like read the receipts. She's like, when he was in his first term, I hated him.

[Esther]

Right. I do.

[Kalila]

Like they've had their ups and downs. They're really, really open about it and I love that about them. It's one of many things I love about both of them in particular Michelle. Like they're totally honest. They don't pretend to have this like perfect flawless relationship and they apparently, look, apparently they're just like living separate lives. Washington is kind of known about it. The D.C. gossip circles have known about this for a while, but obviously they fully pretend. Like I'm sure you guys saw Barack's birthday post of Michelle this week. He posted like a happy birthday babe, I love you. But they're pretending to be in a relationship but apparently he has been having an affair of some kind. Or like he and Jennifer Aniston are in a full relationship. I know, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. But it's true. I don't.

[Justine Marino]

Crazy.

[Kalila]

And you can go back and look. It's like the rumor's been around and there's even this clip of Jimmy Kimmel has Jennifer Aniston on the show when he pulls up an In Touch magazine and the COVID it's like In Touch, which those are always fake, those stories. So it's sort of played as this joke. He's like, like so like the COVID story for In Touch this week is that you and Jennifer or you and Barack Obama are having an affair? Like care to comment? It's like a joke. He's like haha. Like this is crazy. She's like, she's like I've met him once. Like I don't even know him. I met Michelle. More time. She totally denies it, but you have to watch this clip. You can tell they're. She just has this kind of flustered, weird reaction to it. And knowing what I know now and going back and seeing that clip, I don't know. Apparently her friends know. Like it's been open in her circle.

[Esther]

Let's play this out. What truly would happen if let's. They announce a divorce and he, they both move on. Like is it such a terrible thing?

[Kalila]

No. And they're the smartest.

[Esther]

What is the point of even staying together then if they are carrying on this?

[Kalila]

Like the point of staying together is that they are not just a couple. They're a billion dollar brand. They have a super successful production company. They. He's a former president. It's. It's earth shaking earth Shattering news. I mean, he's, like, got state functions to attend. For example, this week, he would earn. The last couple weeks. He went to Jimmy Carter's funeral and Trump. Trump's inauguration. She wasn't at either. People were saying, like, that was a big deal that she did not. You know, all the other presidential spouses were with them. He. She was not there. So people were saying, like, that is kind of like the first. We're starting to see the slow steps towards an eventual divorce announcement.

[Justine Marino]

They're soft launching it.

[Kalila]

It's a bit of a soft launch. I hope that they get back on track. I don't think. Look, it's not over till the fat lady sings. Like, maybe there's having a moment. Maybe they're gonna get back on track. Like, marriages have ups and downs. I am rooting for them. I always.

[Justine Marino]

Well, don't.

[Esther]

A lot of.

[Justine Marino]

I've always heard that a lot of celebrity couples are in kind of open things. I mean, it's so hard when you're on set and you're making out with people and having to pretend like you're in love with someone. I've just heard that kind of like.

[Kalila]

Oh, my God, Rach Vise and Daniel Craig apparently, like, swinging, having, like, bi sex parties. You got to be reading the blind items.

[Esther]

Oh, I am just missing all these blind items.

[Kalila]

No, it's not even the blind. I'm like, these are. You know, I'm.

[Esther]

Rachel Vice truly is, like, one of my number one, like, girl crushes.

[Kalila]

She would you. Apparently, at the Bisex party that they're having. Oh, girl.

[Esther]

Get you an invite, Please, somebody.

[Kalila]

And we're getting you invited.

[Esther]

If you haven't into Rachel Vice's sex party, please look it up.

[Kalila]

I'm. I know I'm being reckless and saying, like, absolutely inflammatory things that could get me sued, but I'm coming with. I don't have sources, but I'm. I'm speaking things that have been verified enough that I feel comfortable saying them in public on mic. Just saying.

[Esther]

Oh, wow. So interesting.

[Justine Marino]

It's crazy, you know, and can I.

[Kalila]

Just say one thing? I love Brock. Of course. Who doesn't? I mean, we're all millennial libs here. Like, he's our president. Like, he's the best. He's the coolest guy ever. He, like, makes the playlists and, like, you like the movies and stuff. Of. Of all the women in Hollywood, he could have anyone. He could have anyone he wants. Jennifer Aniston. How do we feel about that?

[Justine Marino]

I feel like she had she was kind of America's, like, queen for a while, you know, like 20 years ago, she was that girl, you know. So I feel all Americans safe. She's a safe choice.

[Kalila]

I feel, you know, it's a little safe for me.

[Justine Marino]

It's safe. There's no controversy. Also, she was wronged with Brad and Angela and that whole thing.

[Esther]

So I think there is also a racial component that will not bode well for them.

[Kalila]

I think you're answering your own questions as to, like, why they're not going public with this. I think you're totally right. I think we'll get so much blowback. Race racism is America's racist.

[Justine Marino]

But I mean, are they so. But as far as we know, your sources, Michelle knows about this, I think so.

[Kalila]

I'm hearing that they're living completely separate lives. Michelle spends. Spends all her time in the Martha's Vineyard house. Kind of interesting. I don't know where. I mean, I guess Brock's just like, hanging in LA with Jennifer Aniston, Jason Bateman going to Cabo. I don't know what they're doing. I mean, it's just kind of impressive that they've kept it on the down low, but. I don't know. I don't know.

[Esther]

Wild.

[Kalila]

I want to believe. I want to believe. It's so juicy.

[Justine Marino]

It is so juicy. But also, if. I mean, not to go back to the Blake Justin thing, but like this, now that we have all these receipts, it's kind of like confirmed all the stuff that everyone thought of what was going on with that.

[Kalila]

Right? Totally. The.

[Esther]

Where are we on the. Because every day it's something new.

[Kalila]

I have a very, completely different hot take on it, but I really want to hear just.

[Justine Marino]

And I want to hear yours. I've been wanting to. I. I turned glitter and garbage into a 90210 rewatch pod, which is.

[Kalila]

When did that happen?

[Justine Marino]

Like, probably eight. When Shannon Doherty died, I started re watching 90210 and I loved it so much. It's all I wanted to talk about. So I just made it that. And I'm not going to put you through that.

[Kalila]

I appreciate that.

[Justine Marino]

But I've been wanting to talk to you about this. I don't.

[Kalila]

It's. It's hard.

[Justine Marino]

It's like. Well, because you've never liked Blake Lively. I remember on my podcast, been a publicator well over a year ago, you said she's always. I think you said, quote, she's always given me the heebie jeebies. That was a direct quote. A Heebie jeebie.

[Kalila]

Yeah, that sounds tame for me. I'm sure I said a lot worse things. I think she's a fake.

[Justine Marino]

Well, also, you never trusted her because she came out with a booze line when she herself does not drink, has never drank.

[Kalila]

This is. This is why I love you. You remember the things I don't remember.

[Justine Marino]

I have a creepy memory. It's amazing.

[Esther]

She has a booze line.

[Justine Marino]

She has a booze.

[Esther]

I only know her for her most recent hair care, because I'm in hair care. So I was like, oh, when she came out, she launched around the same time that I did, but. But I didn't know she had a booze line.

[Justine Marino]

She had, but Betty Buzz, originally it was mixers, so it was more like sodas. So they were non alcoholic, which made sense because she doesn't drink. She's been very open always about, I don't drink, I've never drank. It never appealed to me. I just bake cookies and stuff.

[Kalila]

She's a mean girl. She's in the Taylor Swift, Taylor Swift click. She's a fake. She's a phony. She seems mean and I just don't like her.

[Justine Marino]

And I can confirm.

[Kalila]

I know I never met her.

[Justine Marino]

Even before all of this. I have a friend who was good friends with one of the leads on Gossip Girl and was around for a lot of it. And before any of this came out publicly, anyone sniffing out that she's a mean girl, my friend said she is regina George. She's 100%.

[Kalila]

You can pick it up a mile away. Really?

[Esther]

I have. I'm.

[Kalila]

You fall in for it?

[Justine Marino]

I fell for it. I fell for it.

[Esther]

I. I am so. Just when I read the. The lawsuit, her lawsuit, the Justin Baldoni thing, I was like, oh, he's a. A creep. Like, immediately I was like, he is a creep.

[Kalila]

By the way, they're both horrible people. Yeah. I think they deserve each other.

[Justine Marino]

I think no one is. Is no one. You know what I mean?

[Kalila]

No, I don't have a side to be clear.

[Esther]

I think that's a problem. Right. Is that when you try to pitch yourself as this type of person.

[Kalila]

Yeah. Male feminist.

[Esther]

Right. It's that. That is the ultimate creep to me. It's like total creep. Are you trying to. You. Yeah. It's such a fraudulent thing. I can't even like, get started on it. I'd rather you just be openly shitty to women.

[Justine Marino]

Totally.

[Esther]

Than pretend to be a male feminist.

[Kalila]

I know. I'd rather be an out and about woman abuser and be Like, I beat women. I want you. I'd rather you be honest. I don't. I. I don't want. I hate women abusers, so I know how to. It's honesty. I know. Then I could be like. I could call the cops and like punch you.

[Justine Marino]

But here's the thing. Like, what do you guys think about, like, for instance, he. She said in her complaint with the New York Times, he called me hot.

[Kalila]

And then her lawsuit, that got leaked.

[Justine Marino]

And then he pulls out because he went through with all the receipts. And when he said, it will be hot, he was talking about the temperature.

[Kalila]

It's a he said, she said. I will not be bogged down by the fudgeing details between these two of these absolute complete fucking psychopaths. Taylor Swift is like footing the bill for the whole thing. And I don't like her. I'm sorry. I'm scared to even say that.

[Esther]

Oh my God. I'm a total Swift.

[Justine Marino]

I'm not. I'm. I don't. I've never.

[Esther]

You guys are rocking my world, okay?

[Justine Marino]

I like rotation. I like reputation.

[Esther]

I was home. I'm gonna beat this place.

[Kalila]

I know you've had a hard couple weeks, okay? I enjoy some of Taylor Swift's music, but I am personally not a Swiftie.

[Esther]

Oh, you're not a Swiftie?

[Justine Marino]

Yeah, I. I respect how much she writes and the material, the amount of material.

[Kalila]

Unbelievably talented.

[Justine Marino]

But I am a. I'm a dance person and I. My pop.

[Kalila]

When she goes like this.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah. The point.

[Kalila]

Her big dance.

[Justine Marino]

That is not it, honey. My. I need a pop star to dance.

[Kalila]

You wanted to hit the. The five, six.

[Justine Marino]

I need a five, six, seven, eight, you know?

[Esther]

Wow, you guys are breaking my heart.

[Kalila]

Here's my.

[Esther]

So easily sold on these people.

[Kalila]

Yeah. You've got to toughen up, girl. I don't know. You're j. I'm like, you got to be jaded like us.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Kalila]

Hard, like hardened.

[Esther]

Right. Oh, my gosh. You know why? Because I'm a people. People pleaser. Maybe. We talked about.

[Justine Marino]

We did talk about this a little.

[Esther]

Before you got here. We talked about just hitting 40 and are figuring out my people pleasing ways are starting to dim. They're not as like overt anymore. Before it used to be like, let me find you a solution. Let me make everyone happy. I want everyone to like me. And I don't know if. If I'm growing up or if I'm. My energy is just waning. So I don't have the energy to actually really please Anyone anymore. It's like, oh, I want to help. I want to do this for you, but I rather take a nap.

[Justine Marino]

I also think. I think it's just being tired. And also, it's like, life's short. It's four. We're 40 in now, you know?

[Kalila]

So it's like the back nine.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah, exactly.

[Esther]

But is that the back nine? Yeah, we're on the back saying, so.

[Kalila]

Yeah, babe, I'm already starting to make my piece with death. I'm 34. You don't know what's happening over here. Not to get too specific and, like, health related, but I'm on a whole menopause tip. I am preparing myself for menopause so hard.

[Esther]

Are you on Perry already or not yet?

[Kalila]

Not even close. But it could happen at any moment.

[Esther]

It really can. Because I. I do have friends who entered perimenopause at 38.

[Kalila]

It can happen at 36. Naomi Watts went 36.

[Esther]

Oh, that's right. She is the poster child for.

[Kalila]

She's becoming the face of menopause, which I love.

[Esther]

Right.

[Kalila]

So anyway, okay. Point is that I'm trying to make my piece, embrace death and menopause, among other things.

[Esther]

Well, you know, you don't die when you enter menopause, Caroline.

[Justine Marino]

Just immediately.

[Kalila]

That is such a relief to hear you say that because I have been so stressed. No, I know, but it's like in a. An existential, big picture way. You know, what. What's really. What really matters? What's important? What are the things that I'm gonna do or not do? And when I'm on my deathbed, look back and be happy I did them or are happy I didn't do them. What's really important, Dialing in, locking in.

[Esther]

You know, have you heard this theory about menopause and why menopause exists and why women are the more important gender in society, basically, is that men, they can basically have babies. Up until, like my dad say, for instance, he had me in his 60s, right?

[Kalila]

I hate men. Don't remind me. Just in general, just.

[Esther]

I think that they can do that, right? They can splooge and have a baby at 90. Disgusting, right? But us, we enter menopause and can no longer become pregnant. Let's say average 50, right? And they say that's because women have a unique. Not obligation, but unique ability to spread wisdom that men cannot. So it's like our job, the back nine, is to be the teachers of the world, which men cannot do. So they are of public. That's why they still have this Blue in their nuts. So all they're really good for is to not copulate.

[Kalila]

Just nut. Just shut up.

[Esther]

Whereas our back nine is to be the spreader of wisdom, the oral tradition. Yes.

[Kalila]

I love that.

[Esther]

Isn't that so sweet, too?

[Justine Marino]

That's really beautiful.

[Esther]

Yeah, that's one professor's theory. I was like, I will take that.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah, I like that.

[Kalila]

I know. Just that. Hold on to that. So hard, too. Just takes one, professor.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Kalila]

Okay, Now I feel good about death. Thank you.

[Esther]

You're welcome.

[Justine Marino]

Also, look at, like, Demi Moore and just how, like, I don't have the.

[Esther]

Money for that doctor.

[Justine Marino]

She looks so good.

[Kalila]

I have a whole.

[Justine Marino]

What are your.

[Kalila]

What, she got a botched facelift?

[Justine Marino]

Well, yeah, it was bad, but now she looks great.

[Kalila]

So then a parent. The new doctor guy in New York.

[Justine Marino]

Is it Lindsay? Did he do Lindsay?

[Kalila]

I think I'm not. No, I think a girl did Lindsay's.

[Justine Marino]

Apparently she also looked bad and now looks good.

[Kalila]

I know. Apparently there's this facelift doctor in New York who did redid Demi Moore's and did Brad Pitt. Oh. Oh. And among others. I, like, read a article about it. I don't know where I'm reading these articles, but it's like they're in there.

[Esther]

But it's a deep plane facelift, right?

[Kalila]

Oh, it's all about the deep plane, girl.

[Esther]

Deep plane.

[Kalila]

I know what's deep.

[Justine Marino]

So is that different from a regular facelift?

[Kalila]

I don't know. Facelift technology has advanced so much. And now the one. It's called a deep plane.

[Esther]

And the downtime is, like, two weeks, I think.

[Kalila]

I know.

[Justine Marino]

I had a friend who yesterday got this. It's like a laser treatment treatment that they go under your skin, but it's supposed to have the effects.

[Kalila]

All therapy.

[Justine Marino]

Maybe it's supposed to have heat. I think so.

[Kalila]

So the thing with these lasers, I can't remember what the word for them, what. What the category is, but it's like, cool sculpting is one of them. Like, these lasers that kind of promise a lot and basically, like, use heat. They really do have a. They're very risky, and there's a high risk rate and the effects. That's. It's kind of like the thing you do instead of getting lipo in the example of coolsculpting. Or like, instead of getting a facelift, Ultherapy, which uses heat to produce more collagen and tighten your skin. It's like you can see these before and after pictures that look kind of crazy, but it's like, probably you know, the tiniest percentage of people that have those results. But apparently there's a little bit risky, and you just kind of have to wait and save up for the big procedure.

[Justine Marino]

Got it. So wait and save. Okay.

[Kalila]

Wait and save. I mean, mean, I don't know what your friend got, but the thing I'm talking about, I think it's called old therapy. It's very. It's expensive, too. Yeah. It's not like getting Botox. You're supposed to get, like, three sessions.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Kalila]

And I think the sessions are thousands and thousands of dollars. I mean, at that point, it's like, just wait. Here's my plan. Wait till you don't wait too long for the facelift. You gotta get it in your. Let's say, my late 40s or early 50s is my target.

[Esther]

But don't you have to dissolve all fillers and wait for the Botox. Botox to leave your face?

[Kalila]

I don't know about all that, honey. My doctor's gonna tell me, but I think I might just go to Korea. That's it.

[Esther]

That's it. I was gonna tell you when you said you went to the Deep Valley to get your 300 Botox. I. I know. Korea. Ticket to Korea. All of my friends walk away. $180bill. And they've done everything.

[Kalila]

I know.

[Esther]

Everything they do.

[Kalila]

Crazy. In Korea. My friend got a procedure called small face in Korea. A man. I know small face procedure. It was like 10 years ago, too. Doesn't that sound so cutting edge? He's like, no, girl. Like, 10 years ago, you get put to sleep for a lot of the, like, laser procedures there. That's real. To get put to sleep. And he was like. It was unbearably painful. Small face. I don't know what it has to look that up.

[Justine Marino]

Insane.

[Kalila]

But I need it.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Kalila]

Yeah. Chris. Crazy.

[Justine Marino]

I'm so interested by the fox eye treatment. Has anyone. Does anyone. You know, it's a.

[Kalila]

It's a lip.

[Justine Marino]

It's where they put strings here.

[Esther]

Oh, the threading.

[Justine Marino]

The threading.

[Kalila]

No strings.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah. To give that. That. Because some of them can droop.

[Kalila]

You know, the strings dissolve. They don't.

[Justine Marino]

But they don't dissolve. I've heard sometimes. Yeah, I saw a thing that they're. It's actually very dangerous. But to give you that, like, Bella Hadid meets a Disney villain look.

[Kalila]

Yeah. It's a brow lift, I think. I think there's a certain kind of brow lift that is like the fox eye thing. But yeah, it's like. But you think it's gonna make you look like Bella Hadid, but then you're like, actually a normal girl whose eyes look kind of crazy. Why am I so scared to do.

[Esther]

Anything or just, you know, for the night? Face tape. Paris.

[Kalila]

Oh, yeah. I love doi.

[Esther]

She wears the face tape.

[Kalila]

She. But instead of putting it under her wig and hiding it like most pop stars, I'm looking at you gaga do. She wears face tape as an accessory. I love it.

[Justine Marino]

That's so cool.

[Kalila]

I love face tape. And there's also a trick. It doesn't super, super work where you take, like, chunks of, like, your sideburns, basically, and you. Okay. So then you, like, pull really. You pull really high. I'm getting a full lift right now. But you do it like under your ponytail so you like. I can't. It's. Do it right now.

[Esther]

You're gonna give yourself, like.

[Kalila]

No, no, I'm fine. So you, like, pull them really high under your hair, and then you, like, style your hair normally over it so you can face tape with your own hair.

[Justine Marino]

Oh, that's a little.

[Esther]

Do I like sending traction alopecia, like the jojo Siwa.

[Kalila]

Well, just right here. I mean, tracking Alpecia is like, you.

[Esther]

Know, like, I've definitely.

[Kalila]

Over time. Yeah, I'm definitely.

[Esther]

Should we check in on. On the little one?

[Justine Marino]

Yeah, we should.

[Esther]

Okay. Let's call her poor S. Her shirt with her shits.

[Kalila]

She got norovirus?

[Justine Marino]

I think so.

[Esther]

We think so. Yeah.

[Kalila]

From Ace.

[Esther]

No, from. She was. She's filming a. A. A movie in Chicago. And I don't know if it's craft service. You know how it's spreading these days.

[Justine Marino]

Does not sound great.

[Kalila]

No, she's really a lot.

[Justine Marino]

Probably she'll feel really skinny after.

[Esther]

How much?

[Kalila]

Sort of jealous.

[Esther]

That's the thing about Naro have it. It's like you. You're skinny, but you're bloated.

[Justine Marino]

Oh, that's sucks.

[Esther]

Yeah, I know. So it's not. It's. It's almost like a period belly.

[Justine Marino]

Oh, no, I hate that.

[Kalila]

Then you get on the scale afterwards, and you're like five pounds down. And it's a good feeling.

[Esther]

Yeah, it is.

[Kalila]

Only at the very end, though, during it, you're like, I would give anything to not have this.

[Esther]

Yeah.

[Justine Marino]

She might be right now.

[Kalila]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Esther]

Oh, she might have perished.

[Kalila]

Well, Esther died. I guess this is the Rip Esther podcast.

[Esther]

It's not a good way to go. But she did go out skinny.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah, Skinny as long as her stomach was flat.

[Kalila]

She's really true. I'm so happy for her.

[Esther]

So one of my friends that goes to the people pleaser Anonymous. I think they call it coda Penins.

[Kalila]

Been to a couple coda meetings.

[Esther]

An interesting observation she made was that every person that rolled up to that meeting had a very expensive car. And she was like, everyone here is super successful, but super sad. And I do wonder if there is something to. Of course there's something to it. But people pleasing, we always say, is like a detriment, sort of a liability to our lives, to our joy. But maybe it is also a big reason for success.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Esther]

And knowing how to sort of, like, navigate, when to kind of turn it on.

[Justine Marino]

Yes.

[Kalila]

Superpower. Right?

[Justine Marino]

Is it?

[Kalila]

And sometimes, like, don't you think that you're hypervigilant to other people's feelings and needs, which can be a burden and a time suck and unfulfilling. But also I'm hyper vigilant and I can read the room in a way that maybe some other people can't. I can read body language, energy when I'm like, in an interview, interviewing to be staff. Like, I feel like I am such a dyed in the wool people pleaser that I can, like, be on my feet and navigate and, like, see what they're picking up on that they like or they don't. Like, like, like, and say the right things. And like, sometimes in moments when you only have 30 minutes to impress someone, like, these skills that are so locked in over years of being codependent can sometimes be your superpower.

[Esther]

Yeah. I just think that the, the, the root of codependency is really sad. Like, for me, I'd. I had to read the room as a child. Right.

[Kalila]

I had to know, oh, no, it's so sad.

[Esther]

Why? You know, what my mom. What was around the corner for me, like, I had to know if my mom was going to beat my ass basically. Like, what I had, I had to be two, two steps ahead of her.

[Justine Marino]

Right.

[Esther]

So that's how apparently, like, empaths are built. Right. Or codependent people or people pleasers. But while it is so exhausting to exist this way, I really do think I, I succeed because of it. And it's almost as if, like, do I want to treat and do I want to get rid of this part of me or do I want to keep, like, some of it to sort of, like, keep me switched on to my surroundings, like, at all times?

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Kalila]

Why can't it be both? Why can't you own the parts of your personality that make you who you are and like, are your superpower. I know that phrase is so corny, but I always feel like there are people that have like, autism that are like, it's my superpower. Like, I've learned to embrace it and. But while you do the work and like, go to coda or like read coda materials or whatever to. To sort of protect yourself and like, learn how to establish healthy boundaries and, you know, you can undo the bad things and do the work on the bad things and, I don't know, like, heal your childhood and your trauma, but you're never gonna, like, get rid of that part of yourself.

[Esther]

Yeah, that is true.

[Justine Marino]

It's funny, the superpowers thing. Paris Hilton. As someone who went to the Paris Hilton concert last year.

[Esther]

Oh, how was it?

[Justine Marino]

It was incredible. My friend randomly got. Got like VIP tickets. So I did make eye contact with Kim while wearing a skims catsuit. I feel like I'm forever changed. Thank you. She did not notice. She quickly looked away. But Paris has a song called ADHD Is my Superpower.

[Kalila]

Oh, my God.

[Justine Marino]

It's like a ballad. It's like supposed to be really emotional, but I do have adhd, so I do. It is my ballad and it is my superpower.

[Kalila]

Going to be your first dance at your wedding.

[Justine Marino]

You hear that, Mitch? Cranket, Crank it. But I think I'm with you. Like, I think it's good to be aware of when it's getting in the way of your own because people pleasing. A lot of times, like, you put your own aside to people, please other people, and then resentments build. Right. So I feel like a lot of my interpersonal relationship issues, like, if I've had, you know, a fight with a friend or whatever, a lot of times it was because I wasn't being upfront about something. So now I'm just trying to be more upfront while still trying to get everyone to like me but still being honest about where I'm at with things.

[Esther]

Yeah, Yeah. I think there's like a cultural difference too, because, like, have you heard, have you guys heard of like, low context, high context culture? I don't know which is which, but basically, like, in my country, you can't be from in the Philippines. Like, it's rude to be that direct.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Esther]

Like, it's.

[Kalila]

It. It.

[Esther]

For instance, if. If it's cold out or if you're feeling cold and you're someone's. You're at someone's house and you need a thermostat higher or lower, instead of saying like, hey, can you make it warmer? In here, you say it's cold and then hope that they offer you to lower the temperature or offer you a blanket.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Esther]

It's rude to be like, hey, can you just. It's. It's cold in here. Make it warmer.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Kalila]

I identify with that. There's a word in Iranian for something very similar. It's called tariffing. And the idea that's very ingrained in Persian culture to always say no when something is offered to you and to lie about how you truly feel. So an example would be, like, if the check came to the table. And let's say Justine and I are sitting down to dinner, and Justine's like, please, like, I would like to cover it tonight. As an Iranian person, I would have to be like, no, absolutely not. You're not covering it. Get. I'm not even gonna have this discussion. No. And I like to. And then you're like, no, seriously, it's your birthday. I really want to cover with you. And then I just go, no, seriously, like, you're not covering it. And the idea is that you have five to ten rounds of this before the favor can ultimately be accepted. But you have to just, like, watching two Iranian people figure out who's going to go first on the elevator, like, it could be hours. It could be actual hours.

[Esther]

But this extends to Asian culture, too, because they. We always fight for the bill. And I never really could figure out if truly we all wanted to pay or if it's just an act of courtesy. But now you're telling me that they. You don't, in fact, want to pay. You just have to throw it out there.

[Kalila]

It's the game, though. It's about the back and forth. Like, that's what the word means. And. But it's ultimately about, I don't know, like, being nice, I think, to a fault or.

[Esther]

Right.

[Kalila]

Not accepting when someone's nice to you. Like, I don't even. I don't really.

[Esther]

Because I know exactly what you're saying.

[Kalila]

Because.

[Esther]

Because in. In when I've, you know, paid for a meal, say, for instance, or when I've offered and someone's like, okay, thanks. Immediately, I am like, yeah, no, I know.

[Kalila]

A little bit of a fight. I know. I know.

[Esther]

You're just gonna watch me pull out my wallet and not fight me. I am slightly offended.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Esther]

So, like, maybe that has somewhat ingrained in my head. That is so interesting.

[Kalila]

I am just so loving getting older and leaning out of my people pleaser tendencies. Have you guys heard of, like, the. Let them. Yes. New Pop psychology thing right now.

[Justine Marino]

Theory.

[Kalila]

You. Have you read the book? You should probably share because I actually am not super.

[Justine Marino]

I'm not super, but basically I see Tick tock. All my information is from. So yes, I've read the Tick tock.

[Kalila]

But the Tick tock.

[Justine Marino]

Mel Robbins, right?

[Kalila]

Yeah. Is it her? Yeah, she's a. She's a tick tock psychiatrist. She's like some social media.

[Justine Marino]

Yes, exactly.

[Kalila]

It's a big pop psychology thing. And she wrote a book. The book is selling huge. I was at a Barnes and Noble two nights ago, and they have like a whole table full of like a thousand copies of it. And I think the general idea is like, if someone. Let them, Let them. Let them do whatever they're gonna do. For example, if your friends go to dinner and they don't invite you and your feelings are really hurt and you let them. Yeah, let them.

[Justine Marino]

Because I think the theory is. And I. This is how I really do approach life. So I was kind of. I felt like, you know, oh, yes, okay, I'm doing something right, even if it's all my people. Ple is like, you can't change someone unless they truly want to be changed. That's the theory. And so. And I'm very into, like, kind of like law of attraction, spirit, all that kind of stuff of like, allowing and not forcing things.

[Kalila]

Yes.

[Justine Marino]

And so I think it's that kind of mentality of like, okay, cool, if I'm not invited, you know, let them not invite me. If someone is not with me, let that friendship go away. You know, like, opposed to maybe 10.

[Kalila]

Years ago, I feel like I would want to force it. Or if someone didn't like me, I'd want to figure out they didn't like me or be really nice the next time or overdo it. But I am so in a different place now. I'm just like, I don't care if people don't like me.

[Justine Marino]

Totally.

[Kalila]

That's on them. I don't care if I'm not getting invited to this thing. I just don't. I. If my family, like, I used to be the fixer in my family and want to fix everything. I still really struggle with that. But I'm just like, you know what? It's not my job. It's not my job to make you feel better and fix your life. Like, I've got my own shit to worry about.

[Esther]

About, right?

[Kalila]

Yeah. I mean, but coda is kind of fun. Like, you guys haven't been to a meeting ever.

[Justine Marino]

I haven't. I've Been to other.

[Esther]

I've just been white knuckling. My, my, my people, you know, struggle.

[Kalila]

Not to bring it full circle. But if I get the WI FI password, I can send you guys some quota materials right now on my iPad. I'm not kidding. They're kind of fun to flip through. Like. I don't know. I've been to a lot of. I've dabbled in some. That. What? The anonymous is 12 stuff. Thank you.

[Esther]

Yeah, the Anonymous is better.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Kalila]

I just really. I don' Identify as an addict, however. I just really like love 12 step culture and like think it's really cool and know so many people whose lives it's truly changed and I've.

[Esther]

How cute. Have you delved into the beginnings or the A. Just the AA history in general.

[Kalila]

Well, no, it's like probably religious or something. No, it's not.

[Esther]

It's really sweet and cute and it's just a man who figured out one day that when I spoke to someone else who had similar struggles, I didn't drink that day.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Esther]

That's literally the core of AA was Bill W. Being like, I commiserated. And I found myself not picking up the bottle that day.

[Kalila]

Well, right.

[Justine Marino]

Cuz so much of addiction. Cuz my parents actually met in aa, so. I know, right? So I have a very addictive personality. That's why I saw Anora seven times. I've seen Titanic 21 times. So I, that's why I never like Bobby. I.

[Esther]

He made, he watched. He made me watch all season. Like six seasons of the West Wing. Yeah, no, like 10 times.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah, no, I'm that way because. And that's why I, I get it all out with that. That's why I never tried cocaine because you know, Titanic is three hours. How much cocaine could I do in.

[Kalila]

Three, you know, like 24 hours in the day.

[Justine Marino]

Exactly. But I think the core of 12 steps is getting outside of yourself and helping other people. And there's so much shame involved in addiction. Right. That I think when you bring it to light and realize like, oh, that person also has that issue. That's also why I like comedy so much. Is like I would watch sitcoms as a kid and like people would be going through things that I would be going through that I felt like alone about and I. They would be making it funny and relatable.

[Kalila]

So true. Destigmatizing.

[Justine Marino]

Yes, exactly.

[Kalila]

I think shame is a very ugly word.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Kalila]

Shame is like the source of all the worries.

[Esther]

Ill, pills. Genuinely everything.

[Kalila]

Everything. Yeah. Wow. Maybe that guy who ghosted Me after sucking my toes. Just had a lot of shame.

[Justine Marino]

I think he had shame.

[Esther]

Maybe he had never done it before. And he was like, I can't believe I did that.

[Kalila]

No, he seemed like he had done it before. He was really good.

[Justine Marino]

You don't just go straightforward if you've never done it before.

[Kalila]

No. Hell no. It's like.

[Justine Marino]

Like that was just his on a whim. Like, I'm just gonna try something, right?

[Kalila]

Like, if you're trying a new kind of crazy, crazy food for the first time, you don't, like, get two spoons and, like, eat. You know, you take a little bite, you know, you're a little demure. But the way he sucked them things, he had been. He had been down there before in the southern hemisphere of a woman, you know, not her vagina, her toes.

[Esther]

So we couldn't get a hold of our little one. She might have perished.

[Kalila]

Yeah, she's dead for sure.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Esther]

Esther, we miss you. You've been a great co host.

[Justine Marino]

Yeah.

[Esther]

Thank you guys so much for being here today. Thank you guys for coming through. Thank you for eventually making it here. Caroline, I hope that Gene Hong accepts you into his friend circle.

[Kalila]

If he does or he doesn't, like, just to know I was kind of in the game.

[Justine Marino]

Let them.

[Kalila]

Let them.

[Esther]

Thank you guys so much. And we hope that the next episode, we're back in the swing of things in a regular studio and that I have a home to live in by then, although I don't want to move out of here. And thank you, sluggies. We'll see you guys next week.