Andy Baraghani on Yearning for Flavor Across Boarders

Summary

Podcast Summary

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Traveling Through with David Prior

Episode: Andy Baraghani on Yearning for Flavor Across Borders

Release Date: July 2, 2026
Guest: Andy Baraghani (Author, Chef, James Beard Award Winner)
Host: David Prior
Producer: Pushkin Industries

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Overview

In this episode, David Prior sits down with celebrated chef, food writer, and self-described "flavor obsessive" Andy Baraghani. They explore how Andy’s Iranian heritage and travels have shaped his culinary ethos, spotlighting the longing for a land he’s never visited, and the pursuit of transcendent tastes across borders. Their conversation traverses formative kitchens, vibrant markets from Beirut to Hanoi, mulberries in Sicily, the bittersweet gaps of diasporic identity, and the universality of food as a vessel for memory and connection.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Early Culinary Foundations and Chez Panisse (01:21–05:16)

• Andy’s Start: Began working at Chez Panisse as a deeply curious 16-year-old from a cooking-centric Iranian-American household in Berkeley.
• Obsession with Learning: "I just became honestly obsessed… with the philosophy, the mantra, the food, the recipes, the woman behind it." (Andy, 02:21)
• Key Lesson: The importance of tasting and adjusting throughout, staying curious, and understanding the “aliveness” of ingredients.
• Bypassed culinary school on advice from mentors: “Continue working in restaurants. Work your way up.” (Andy, 04:17)
• Chez Panisse’s focus on vegetables and herbs connected with his Persian roots.

2. The Power and Poetry of Herbs: Persian Roots and New Discoveries (05:10–08:46)

• Iranian cuisine’s “herb-forward” nature finds an echo in Vietnamese cooking.
• Vietnam: Herbs are consumed in fistfuls, a freshness reminiscent of his upbringing.
  • “Vietnam... just consumes herbs in a way so similar to the way I grew up…platters of raw herbs…provides this freshness and this bite and bitterness and sweetness and earthiness.” (Andy, 05:23)
• Dishes like Bun rieu and Cha Ca La Vong in Vietnam evoked nostalgia for Persian sabzipolo mahi (herb rice with fish).

3. Cross-Cultural Echoes: Beirut, Armenian Food, and the “Nearby but Far” Iran (09:17–16:09)

• Accidental Visit to Lebanon: A chance encounter, but full of intention and meaning.
• Suh al Tayeb Market: A meeting ground for Lebanon’s diverse communities—“an incredible thing of reconciliation.” (David, 10:06)
• Kamal Mouzawak, a key contact, guided Andy through Beirut’s food, including a detour to the city’s Armenian quarter.
• On Not Visiting Iran: The gate to Tehran was “right there” in the airport, highlighting his bittersweet proximity to his parents’ homeland yet denied the ability to enter due to political complexities.

4. Solo Travel Lessons: Vietnam, Lebanon, Istanbul (16:09–24:04)

• Andy extolls the virtues of solo food travel: “It was the greatest gift to myself.”
• Formative experiences in Vietnam, Lebanon, and Istanbul—places that “really shaped the food that I cook.”
• Vivid details:
  • Vietnam’s vibrant eating culture
  • Istanbul’s layered history (“center of the universe”), urfa biber chilies, and tumultuous protest era: “Good Berkeley boy, in the protest…” (Andy, 18:50)
  • Terror and survival during Taksim Square riots: passport waved at a guard during curfew.

5. The Language of Markets, Towels, Sweets, and Everyday Epiphanies (21:14–29:57)

• Favorite market finds: figs in Istanbul and Sicily.
• Turkish baklava—“a bit too sweet,” but one specific bakery offered transcendent pastry-laden spectacle.
  • Story of stealing mulberries from the pastry fridge at Chez Panisse (36:45).
• Deep appreciation for simple, ephemeral snacks: “muscles stuffed with rice just on the street…”

6. Grappling with Roots & “Yearning” for Iran (25:55–29:57)

• Persistent, painful sense of being unable to visit Iran:

  • “I really did not think that I would be 36 and have not gone to Iran… it’s more apparent that it’s a missing piece.” (Andy, 25:55)
  • Documentary efforts with food writing: “Spread light on a culture that is not viewed in the best light, especially in the States.”
  • Rituals of connection: requesting “lavashak” (Persian fruit leather) and dried plums from visiting relatives.

• Host’s Reflection:

  • “That yearning for flavor... comes across not just as transmitting that culture but through everything that you do. Sometimes that thing that we think is our weakness... can be our greatest strength.” (David, 29:04)

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

| Timestamp | Speaker | Quote / Moment | |-----------|---------|----------------| | 02:21 | Andy | “I just became honestly obsessed…with everything. The philosophy, the mantra, the food, the recipes, the woman behind it, the chefs that have gone through those doors.” | | 05:23 | Andy | “Vietnam...consumes herbs in a way so similar to the way I grew up… It provides this freshness and this bite and bitterness and sweetness and earthiness.” | | 10:06 | David | “It’s an incredible thing of reconciliation, that place, huh?” (on Beirut’s Suh al Tayeb market) | | 11:09 | Andy | On the Beirut–Tehran gate: “It was frankly like just a mindfuck because it was like…the country of my parents, where I speak the language...is right there and I’m not able to go.” | | 18:50 | Andy | “Of course I was right there. A good Berkeley boy, like, in the protest. With the protest...” (on Taksim Square riots) | | 36:42 | Andy/David | On mulberries: “Mulberries are a big part of...Persian culture.” “Dried mulberries, although I love the fresh ones.” (Andy) | | 29:04 | David | “That yearning for flavor...comes across not just as transmitting that culture but through everything that you do...it can be our greatest strength.” | | 34:59 | David | “Mulberry granita is my favorite thing in the whole world.” |

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Segment Timestamps

• Chez Panisse & Early Years: 01:21–05:16
• Herbs, Iran, and Vietnam: 05:10–08:46
• Lebanon, Armenia, and Being “Near but Far” from Iran: 09:17–16:09
• Solo Travels: Vietnam, Lebanon, Istanbul: 16:09–24:04
• Istanbul, Markets, Turkish Sweets: 21:14–24:04
• Longing for Iran, Diaspora, Food as Connection: 25:55–29:57
• Mulberries, Sicily, Sweet Memories: 34:52–39:54
• Japan, Travel Philosophy, Kyoto Garden: 39:54–46:57
• Rapid-Fire Questions: 49:24–53:28

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Additional Highlights

• Food is memory: Andy relates the distinct sense memories from his travels (stuffed mussels in Istanbul, granita in Sicily, the taste of lavashak) to deeper longing for belonging.
• Market Magic: Both agree that markets (especially in Japan, Istanbul, Beirut) are crucibles of cultural identity.
• Italy: Andy expresses a “love/hate” tension with Italian food’s regional sameness, singling out Liguria and Sicily as meaningful exceptions.
• Simplicity over Perfection: Many of his best food experiences were unplanned or humble—juice stands, open-air stalls, and local “mundane” moments.

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Fast Favorites (Rapid Fire, 49:24–52:42)

• Place Always to Return: Paris
• Place Never to Return: Marrakesh
• Most at Home (outside NYC): Paris
• Most Out of Place: Orlando
• Favorite Hotel: Post Ranch Inn, California
• Memorable Restaurant Meal: Barang Khat in Kyoto, Izakaya; Suado
• Cultural Institution: Louisiana Museum (Denmark), Bordelle Museum (Paris)
• Favorite Market/Shop: Isetan Men’s (Tokyo)
• Weekend/Week/Month/Year: Iceland/Berlin/Japan/Paris

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Closing Thoughts

Andy’s journey is one of perpetual curiosity, a search for dazzling and sometimes fleeting flavors that stand in for lost heritage as much as culinary pleasure. His “yearning” finds solace in the textures and seasons of food, bridging childhood Persian meals, conscious travel, and the joys of “mundane” discovery—reminding listeners that true travel is about what you take with you, in memory and taste.

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For fans of food, travel, and the micromoments where heritage, politics, appetite, and identity tangle, this episode is a masterclass in yearning, tasting, and remembering.

Transcript

[Sam Sifton]

Pushkin. Some cooks are defined by a single food culture. Andy Baragani is shaped by many, but with a yearning for one. Growing up in a second generation Iranian American family in the Bay Area, he was immersed in Persian culture and Californian producer. At 16, that led him to the kitchen door of the Seminole restaurant Chez Panisse. From there, he cooked in kitchens in New York before finding his way to Bon Appetit, where he became known for both his recipes and his biceps. He went on to write the James Beard Award winning the Cook youk Wanna Be. What I admire most about Andy is that he's always been ambitious for himself and his place in the food world. The same goes for the way that he travels with every new country and trip, he finds a new flavor, expanding and refining his canon of recipes. Today we talk about going solo in Vietnam, the bold food of Beirut, his near but far relationship with Iran, and the mercurial mulberry. Here's my conversation with Andy Baragani, my friend. Welcome. Welcome to traveling through.

[Andy Baragani]

I can't wait.

[Sam Sifton]

I wanted to start our conversation with one place that we have in common, which is.

[Andy Baragani]

I know. Chez Panisse.

[Sam Sifton]

Yeah. When were you. When were you there? Because we didn't. We almost crossed over. Almost.

[Andy Baragani]

I was a baby. I was a little Berkeley, 2007 is when I came, like, end of 2006.

[Sam Sifton]

Yeah.

[Andy Baragani]

I was a baby. Very young cook. And I like to say I was a sponge. I really was just deeply curious. Went into the kitchen by myself and turned to Beth Wells, who's still there, and I said, I want to work here. I'll do whatever. I'm in school, but I'll come after school and on weekends. And I think I could see her confusion, but she was like, okay.

[Sam Sifton]

And was it because you grew up in Berkeley, or was it. And that was the most famous restaurant, or is it something else, some other quality of the restaurant that drew you?

[Andy Baragani]

I think I grew up in a household where we cooked pretty much every meal. I mean, we did go out, but not often. And then I wasn't aware of Chez Panisse until maybe a year or two before I started working there. It was my uncle who kind of told me about it. He's like, oh, there's a very famous restaurant here that's been here for many, many years that goes back to the 70s and really kind of created a movement. And then my aunt gave me the Chez Cafe cookbook. And then I just became honestly obsessed. And I don't use that word often, but I really was about everything. The philosophy, the mantra, the food, the recipes, the woman behind it, the chefs that have gone through those doors. And I just thought, how is this right there? How is it right there? And so I just had to kind of get myself in there somehow. And I feel like that behavior, the way I'm wired has kind of luckily still is very much in me. I still think I'm like that. Like anything that I become enamored by and really fascinated by, I think of like, how can I learn? How could I learn? It was a foundational period of time. It really kind of provided a tremendous foundation in terms of food and cooking for me.

[Sam Sifton]

Well, talking about the woman behind it, Alice, I worked in her office for about what, five, five, six years. And it's like, you know, interesting that you say it was kind of an education because that's where she's coming from. Of the main things that you learned, what were kind of the real takeaways from shaping is that you use kind

[Andy Baragani]

of, I would say, like, without even getting so technical, I'd say it's more of a like behavioral. I think it's like continuing to be curious, to practice, I think to. And really the most important is to taste taste throughout, taste in the beginning and the middle and the end. Adjust and understand the kind of aliveness of the ingredients you're working with and that you're cooking with. And even then, I was so not sure. I'm like, am I supposed to go to culinary school? I never ended up going to culinary school.

[Sam Sifton]

You've been there when you were 16?

[Andy Baragani]

I was very young and, and one of the chefs there, Cal, I remember, he told me, he's like, don't go, like, continue working in restaurants. Work your way up. And I just thought, list. This is now 20 years ago, which is very crazy.

[Sam Sifton]

We look fantastic.

[Andy Baragani]

Thank you. I did not, I did not think about that until this very moment. I'm like 20 years ago, I'm like, oh, I think those lessons that I've learned, I. I still use those lessons.

[Sam Sifton]

I remember in the pages of some of the books you mentioned the cafe, the Japanese cafe book, which is of course a masterpiece. But my favorite one is vegetables.

[Andy Baragani]

Of course.

[Sam Sifton]

Of course. I guess, like, I'd be curious to know your. Of Persian heritage.

[Andy Baragani]

Yes.

[Sam Sifton]

And that is obviously a very vegetable centric cuisine. So I think about your cooking is not only vegetables, but also very herb

[Andy Baragani]

forward, which is a big part of Persian cuisine too. It's like they love their herbs.

[Sam Sifton]

And so where is the kind of place that you Feel like uses herbs the best in terms of your travel?

[Andy Baragani]

Out of all the places that I've been to, I say this over and over. I. I've not been able to go to Iran. It's like the kind of missing piece, which I'm sure we'll talk about. But the place that I have been to that has the same. I imagine the same love for herbs is Vietnam. I mean, I really have not experienced a country that just consumes herbs in a way that is so similar to the way I grew up, where it's like the fistful and it's platters of herbs, platters of raw herbs and that you kind of throw into whatever soup or noodles or you eat in between bites. It's, it's. It provides this freshness and this bite and bitterness and sweetness and earthiness. Going there and traveling kind of up and down the country and seeing it, how it's, it's such a big part. And really the range of herbs, herbs I've had never even seen before.

[Sam Sifton]

Do you create Vietnamese. Vietnamese inflected food, or is it something you enjoy?

[Andy Baragani]

No, no, no. I, I definitely. There's. There's a few dishes in my first book and definitely recipes that I've developed for the times and when I was at Bon Appetit, but there I remember going. I was in Ho Chi Minh and Hanoi and Da Nang and Sapa and Phu Quoc, but. And there were dishes like Bunry, which if I could, that would be a dish I'd have every single morning. That would be the dish I'd have every morning. And it's a hot soup. It's noodle soup, but with tomatoes and toast, tofu, and sometimes some seafood. And it's just delicious. I love any kind of tomato soup mixture. And tomato and egg, I just, I love. Or Bon Baw Hue, which is more richer and heavier. And obviously all the different salads. I remember having like a. At these scene, this restaurant, this not even. It was like a open stall. It had just a pile. The whole window front was piled with fried eels. Tiny, tiny eels, like this big. Just all like so airy and crisp. And they did like three different dishes and they put like. And there was like a noodle soup or you had like a big handful of fried eel and then you had like this salad that was fried eel. And I. And I got both. But one dish that I had, and it was in Hanoi and it was a restaurant that made just this one dish. They didn't do anything else, which happens a lot in that part of the world in Vietnam especially called cha Cha La Vang. So it's this fried fish with turmeric and dill.

[Sam Sifton]

Oh.

[Andy Baragani]

And they serve it with rice noodles and ngok cham, which is obviously incredible Vietnamese sauce of, like, that has every single kind of sour, sweet, funky, and spicy, and then with, like, lots of herbs and lettuce. And I was very confused, because if you take away the noodles and then yak chom, I'm like, this is a Persian dish. This is. This is reminded me of. Of sabzipolo mahi, a dish you eat during the Persian New Year. It's a herb rice dish, but the fish, you. You fry it, and you fry it sometimes with turmeric or with saffron, and you serve it with sour oranges and dill.

[Sam Sifton]

Dill is such a huge. Is it really?

[Andy Baragani]

Dill is a huge part of Persian cuisine. Yeah.

[Sam Sifton]

How would it. But like, Vietnam, I had no idea.

[Andy Baragani]

I also happen to just. That's, like, my favorite herbs.

[Sam Sifton]

Is it really? I wouldn't. I wouldn't dare ask you. That was my opening question.

[Andy Baragani]

What your favorite changes every day. It changes every day. But today, it's still. For a while now, it's been dill, but. And tarragon and fresh bay leaves. Those are the fresh bay leaf. I blame. I'm sure people are going to roll their eyes. I blame Chinese 100% for that.

[Sam Sifton]

I was thinking about. We have a shared love of Lebanon.

[Andy Baragani]

Yes.

[Sam Sifton]

And Beirut specifically, for multiple reasons. And just thinking about markets and farmers markets. We have a mutual friend called Kamal Mozwa, who started a thing called Sukhothayeb, which is a farmer's market and a way to kind of catalog agriculture and food culture throughout Lebanon and really related to bringing people from all of the major sects.

[Andy Baragani]

So, yes.

[Sam Sifton]

Shiite, Sunni, Druze, Maronite, Christian, all coming together. Women and women. Yeah, well, exactly. And that's evolved from that, too. And it's amazing because it's. It's on the green line where, you know, that kind of demilitarized zone. I think that's what you call it, the zone in the middle of Beirut. I mean, it's an incredible thing of reconciliation, that place, huh?

[Andy Baragani]

Absolutely. I mean, I think I. It was very accidental. I have to mention. I. I wanted to go to Lebanon. I wanted to go to Beirut. I had this kind of. Sometimes it's these, you know, things you read or you see or an old photo, and it inspires me, and it's like, oh, I just want to go There I've got. There's plenty of places that maybe might feel random to some people, but it was very intentional for me. Lebanon was one of those places and I had met Kamal on that first trip and on my own, and it was incredible. It was incredible because it was. I remember going there and I was. Had a layover and it, the gate to go to Beirut was also the, the gate next to it was Tehran. So it was. So it was frankly like just a, a mindfuck because it was like, oh, I am this, this, the country of like my, my parents where I, I speak the language, I. The food and this deep desire, this missing piece is right there and I'm not able to go. And there's. It just, it's, it's near impossible for me to go. Obviously. I got on my flight, I went to Beirut and it felt at least there was something, well, wildly different in different, in a different language and different culture and different food. There was something about it because the hospitality that I felt from Kamal, from the people that I met in Lebanon was just. It reminded me of my own family, but with a little more chaos. I have to admit, like, I love my, my Lebanese people. I think they're a touch more livelier, right? And Persians are pretty lively, but I think Lebanese are even wilder because they have this amazing habit or accidental habit of speaking French, Arabic and English and like, you know, one or two sentences all at once. And the food, I should say, like the food. And, and I ate with Kamal a few times and. But this first trip was incredible and just had a deeper appreciation from the food of the Levant and all the breads and, and also getting into baits because, you know, of course, like, because we're somewhat neighbors and they'd say, ah, like you Persians, you guys just eat rice and you guys just. It's saffron, this saffron. I was like, well, you know, you guys don't know how to make rice. I love these kind of fun, you know, food debates and culture debates.

[Sam Sifton]

I was there, I mean, believe it or not, flying into Beirut in order to go and do a story in Damascus in Syria, because Damascus was going to be the new Marrakesh. And we did this extraordinary shoot. It's one of the great travels of my life. But, you know, you come in and out of Beirut and very few people realize that Beirut and Damascus are like, what, an hour and a half away. So I would get a taxi in and out from Syria, which is kind of crazy. But the project of Sukh al Tayeb also evolved then into Tawlet, which was really like an extraordinary program. And effectively what it was is women grandmothers that would bring. Every day of the week, they would change which community throughout the country would come, bring their produce and create kind of recipes.

[Andy Baragani]

Yeah, food from the region.

[Sam Sifton]

Yeah, exactly. And then they would catalog them. So it became this kind of living archive of Lebanese cuisine. And I only stumbled on it. It's like a. A canteen, but really beautiful. And then have all of the salads kind of brought out to you. And. And I remember they had an art exhibition, which was paintings and representations of Mount Ararat, because it was a nod to kind of the Armenian community there that kind of mixes in with. In Beirut because, of course, it's like

[Andy Baragani]

Nexus Kamal did something. He's the one who kind of said, you know, he gave me suggestions, and we. We had a few meals and we spent a lot of time together. But I remember him telling me, like, oh, you need to go to Burj Hamoud. And I was like, you know, and it wasn't far from Tallinn, and I. I went there and it was the Armenian neighborhood in Beirut. And I just had Armenian food. And I ate so much. I mean, from different kebabs, salah mazhu, to these stuffed incredible, like, at the hot breads and all the different kind of 20, 30, however many greens and herbs were in them. And it really. That. That food actually reminded me of Persian food in a way, because there is a kind of delicateness and a mildness. Persian food generally really doesn't have a lot of heat or spice to it. Like, you love your saffron, turmeric, certain warm spices, but there's no, like, fiery heat to it. And they love their kind of sweet flav, too. So you'll see, like, fruit in a lot of kind of stews and. And same with Armenian cuisine. And I grew up with a father who described. When I told him. I remember coming back and I told him about the Armenian food in that area, he said, the Armenians are, you know, we look at them as like, the artisans of, like, that area. And I don't know if that was something that, like, Persians feel. I think that was something more my dad felt. And it just made me think about, you know, a group of people that. That have gone through so much darkness and war, and yet it was just kind of the most incredible food that I had on that trip and in my life.

[Sam Sifton]

I mean, we have a lot in common. We're always searching, I think, for something flavor. Flavor of a place Actual flavor. And I always find that, like, my. Some of my most memorable trips are shared experiences, but many of them of them have been solo trips. And I remember one time we were talking about, like, when you're in a particular place, it's actually very freeing to eat by yourself. What's one of the trips, the solo trips, that stands out for you the most?

[Andy Baragani]

Oh, I'm a big solo traveler. Less so now because I have a husband I travel with often, but I'll sometimes do a little bit of solo traveling. But I did do a good job. Chunk of that pretty much majority of my 20s. And it was the greatest gift to myself. And whether, you know, I had. I had little money then, but I traveled incredibly well. And I mentioned. We spoke about Vietnam. I was on my own there. And in Lebanon and Istanbul. I'd say those were three. I traveled many places, but those three stand out because I think I learned the most from those places. Those three places really shaped also the food that I cook definitely had an influence on my style of cooking. Also. Those three places are actually very easy to eat. All the things. It's like when I was in Lebanon, like, there was so much good food, and we're like, oh, the rice culture is not a thing here. Like, I totally got that right away. But amazing other things. Turkey, they do rice well. They do breads well. They do kebab well. They do vegetables well. They really covered all this stuff. I'd say the thing that I kind of took away was how they kind of spice things. Their chilies, Turkish chilies kind of started to become part of my cooking style. The urfa bibir that you see on every single tabletop, no matter how casual or just that's milky, kind of leathery, lingering, like, mild heat. Like, now I just have so many little, like, plastic tin containers of urfa bibir. And I think that's the thing. It's. It's not a dish always. It's sometimes like a technique or a look or a spice where I'm like, oh, I. It feel. I feel very connected to it. I remember I was like, took a boat from. On the Bosphorus, and you just feel the feeling I had. There was more than any other place in the world where I'm like, this is old. This has seen things center of the universe. It felt that way, that deep, deep, deep blue water. This, the in between, you know, two continents. And I was there actually on my own during the Taksim Square riots.

[Sam Sifton]

Oh, wow.

[Andy Baragani]

And I was staying near Taksim Square. I was staying. I was staying in Taksim Square. I was staying in Jiangir. I stayed in two different areas, Giangir and Chukurchkama. And they were just incredible. And it felt like young. And obviously I didn't know about the riots. And the riots happened. I was in Turkey for, again, probably about, like, three weeks on my own. And I remember my family being like, get out of there.

[Sam Sifton]

Right?

[Andy Baragani]

What's happening? Of course I was right there. A good Berkeley boy, like, in the protest. With the protest. And then I remember there was. There was a. Was a curfew one night. Oh, my God, this. I can't believe I remember this. There were two things that had happened. I went on a date with. With a guy there one night, and protests were happening. And. And I guess there were. There. They. They were starting to impose a curfew, but they threw a noise bomb at where we were eating. So we all went inside this restaurant, and the owner just started dealing, yelling at them in Turks. But it made a noise that. I mean, what a noise bomb makes. And I had never experienced that, obviously, before. And it was terrifying. And I remember were walking back and there it was. It was a curfew. Like, no one was on the street, and I should have known better. And I remember just a guard, like, pointing to their gun at me. I just was so terrified. And all I remember saying was like, I took my passport out. That's all I remember. I'm like. I remember waving my passport. It's like, I'm an American. But I went into survival mode. That being said, like, that's not a good painting of Turkey, but that was a very specific time also.

[Sam Sifton]

You know, the thing is, and we should be realistic about, like, Istanbul and Turkey is like, whenever that, you know, people start going back.

[Andy Baragani]

Yeah.

[Sam Sifton]

Something happens in that way. I have very good friends. She used to be the editor in chief of Vogue Turkey, and her partner runs kind of a fixer that we. We work with all the time. And they're, like, fantastic, sensational people. And they. They were very involved in, like, the electoral Transparency Organization setting that up. And she was also very involved in trying to get the Olympics to go to Istanbul, which almost happened many times. And so I was there. Yeah. Last year. And I still encourage people to go. I mean, obviously there's, you know, these riots, and that happens every so often, often even recently. But it does. It. You know, it breaks my heart a little bit, because once they get momentum, they have this setback.

[Andy Baragani]

Yes.

[Sam Sifton]

I'm confident that, like, progress well, well, yeah, I think that that will overcome because it's one of the. You know, it's the original cosmopolitan city in. In a way, we're talking about markets.

[Andy Baragani]

I mean, the markets over there, and obviously there's the. More. There's the obvious ones, like the bazaar there. But there are smaller markets that are incredible within Istanbul and outside that are just, you know, the. I think the greatest figs I've had are obviously were in Istanbul and Sicily. Those two.

[Sam Sifton]

Yeah. I mean, I don't advise going with, like, glamorous girlfriends who then get caught up in the counterfeit market.

[Andy Baragani]

I know.

[Sam Sifton]

And then they're, like, going for this Chanel the entire time. It was like, drove me crazy. Three hours. You have to try to follow them around.

[Andy Baragani]

You have to go with. With your friends who want good peshtimals. Like, those are good. I still have the Turkish towels. They're very.

[Sam Sifton]

Oh, yeah, yeah, of course, of course.

[Andy Baragani]

And there are some that are just incredibly beautifully made. I mean, you can see so many. But there's ones that are really well made, and they're very thin, very lightweight. They're, like, perfect in the summer, and they dry so quickly.

[Sam Sifton]

You know, you're giving me a. A very vivid memory. I went with another great friend of mine, my best friend, actually, who was a chef, and we went to do this experience of speaking of thin. Thin kind of fabric. We went to a bakery, a Turkish bakery, and it was from a family from Gaziantep, which does the best sweets. And I'm not a big Turkish sweet person. I find them a bit too sweet. Sweet.

[Andy Baragani]

A lot of that's the case with, you know, not to. It happens a lot with Middle Eastern sweets. I have the same feeling with Persian sweets. There can be good ones, but Turkish baklava is amazing.

[Sam Sifton]

Can I tell you, though, this one was kind of amazing. And it was almost like going to a hotel laundromat because, like, behind the scenes, because they were throwing the filo pastry, like, sheets, and it was just these clouds of flour and sugar. It was one of the most extraordinary experiences.

[Andy Baragani]

I'm remembering all these things because Istanbul was. I was very young. And Vietnam. I was. Vietnam. I was in. I was still in college. I'd say Turkey and Vietnam are two places that have. Are the places that when people ask, like, oh, where have you gone where you've had, like, the best food? I. I still would say those two. I do love Paris, but that's separate, I think, like, in terms of just learning about the food and loving What I can. All the mussels, I just remember also all the muscle stuffed mussels that people were. I think some people might be afraid to have. I had so many stuffed mussels with rice just on the street. But it's like my mouth's watering because it was like this amazing, like, slightly overcooked, smoky rice and mussels and that were kind of briny, and it was delicious.

[Sam Sifton]

Where do you want to go next? Like, what's your. Like?

[Andy Baragani]

I'll say. I have a lot of trips, Egypt being one of them, where I have, like this loose list already forming. And Egypt is definitely one. I'd say the number one is India. I think it's crazy. I just am so fascinated by the hospitality, the hotel culture, the food culture. Just what a. I have no doubt that I would be deeply, deeply inspired. And I love that food. And it's highly, highly regional. You know, such a range of cuisine. There's. And I think, like, we're starting to. We're so lucky to see that here in New York, slowly, where we're seeing regional Indian cuisine a little bit more. And I. That's actually just what excites me now more in the world now. I think, like, with major cities, it's like we're not doing these kind of a general. This is Chinese, this is Indian. Because, like, what. What does that mean? These kind of countries and cultures, it varies so much. Just like a place like a smaller country, like Lebanon, it's highly regional. Each neighborhood, each province, they have, you know, their variation and different take.

[Sam Sifton]

But you're going to come to India with me. I would love that.

[Andy Baragani]

I feel like I. I feel like I have to. There's many countries. I just. Most countries, it's like, I would love for you to take me around because I'm usually the tour guide.

[Sam Sifton]

We would have a great time in India, you know. And interestingly, like, in India, there is the Parsi community which left Persia, Iran, the Zoroastrians, 700 years ago. And now, sadly, it's like a.

[Andy Baragani]

It's a smaller community, but still.

[Sam Sifton]

Yeah, it's a. It's. It's. And it's, you know, it has some troubles of, like, survival, I think, but that's kind of an extraordinary thing. You know, you talk about getting closer to. To your heritage. Like, that would be something extraordinary for you to see because it's filtered through the Indian tradition. You know, it's quite an amazing.

[Andy Baragani]

It's. I think that's also part of this. Sometimes I'm conscious of it sometimes I'm not this desire to kind of go to places that have maybe a sliver aspects or certain pages that are related to Iran and Persian history and Persian cuisine and the people and places and the smells and textures, because it's very confusing. I really did not think that I would be 36 and have not gone to Iran. I really thought that this would be something that I would have done. I always felt like I'm going to get there. I'm going to get there. And I think the older I get, it makes me. It's more apparent that it's a missing piece. It's very confusing to be writing about a culture, speaking the language, studying the food, trying to spread. And that's really, I think a part of my job as someone who's first generation Iranian American is to kind of spread light on a culture that is not really viewed in the best light, especially in the States. And it's often misunderstood. And obviously, I think an easy way to do that is through food and through showcasing that culture. I have no idea. I did try to get to Iran, by the way. I should mention seven years ago, it was 2019 and I went through the whole process. I. I got my citizenship. I like went to D.C. i did a whole. My citizenship birth certificate because that's how I, I have to go. That's why it was always tricky for me. I can't go through a visa. I'd have to go as a citizen. And then there's the kind of more complicated matter where they wouldn't acknowledge dual citizenship. But when I was ready to go and, and had the whole kind of trip pretty planned and it just was not a great time, especially it hasn't been a good time for, for, for many, many decades now. But. So I have not gone. And I still have to believe that I will get there because I really think about it all the time. And I just the amount of like accounts and videos I save and things that I. I mean, even now it's like I have this habit that I've developed in the past few weeks where I asked, my mom had some family come from Iran. I said, please bring me two things. I never asked for anything. That's a lie. I always asked for saffron. But I'm like. I added. Asked for two additional things. I said I need lavashak, which is the kind of Persian leather fruit, which is incredible because they make with such, you know, flavors that are distinct to that. That part of the world. Like barberries.

[Sam Sifton]

Yeah.

[Andy Baragani]

That sweet, sour and dried Persian plums, aloo, which are amazing because they're like salty and sour and a little sweet and you freeze. I freeze them, which, and I eat them frozen. So they're kind of like this chewy, jammy, salty. It just makes you salivate. It's so delicious. So I find my own little ways to kind of maintain that connection.

[Sam Sifton]

But Andy, can I say to you that you're yearning for that and translates not only in the way that, you know, you write those extraordinary recipes and are a conduit to that culture, like your extraordinary narrows feature that you did in the New York Times, but that yearning for flavor comes across not just as like transmitting that culture but through everything that you do. And so sometimes it's like that thing that we have that we think is our kind of weakness or spot. And we all have that. It can be our greatest strength. So you're, you know, even if you're not there or have not been there, you are decoding that and helping people realize that all around the world. And then I think you should be.

[Andy Baragani]

I've never thought about it that way. But that is a, I will start from the seon to kind of look, look at it that way because it's, it is a drive for me to try to do good. Yeah. For that culture.

[Sam Sifton]

Well, you do plenty. This episode of Traveling through is sponsored by Capital One. Capital One cardholders are passionate about unforgettable experiences. Together we partner to connect these curious travelers to world cultures through expert guided journeys. From the peaks of Machu Picchu to the grand architecture of Vienna, these once in a lifetime trips take you somewhere truly off the beaten path. Through Capital One Entertainment, eligible cardholders can book exclusive experiences and so much more, all while earning elevated rewards. Saver cardholders earn 8% cash back and Venture X earns 5x miles. Thanks to Capital One, your dream getaway is one step closer. Last year you came and visited me in Milan. I think you were one of the first people to come and come and see the terrace with the little garden and we had a little aperitivo.

[Andy Baragani]

That's Milan I've spent more time in than any other city in the world outside of New York.

[Sam Sifton]

Really.

[Andy Baragani]

I've been to Milan, I don't know, 40 times.

[Sam Sifton]

Really.

[Andy Baragani]

I, I, there was a period where I feel like I, because I've been going since I've gone before I was an adult and last year I think I was there like four times. Just there was this, for some reason, it just has taken me a lot to Milan and I love Milan, I think it's a underrated city.

[Sam Sifton]

I think you were headed to Liguria actually with.

[Andy Baragani]

I was going with my husband and I had been to Liguria before, but I had gone there for a story and it was very. You know how it is. It's like you're in and you're out and it was just very quick and I just had to kind of COVID the spots that I needed to get to. And this time we had a little more time and I. Again, I've been lucky to kind of travel up and down Italy and I think I have. I have a love, I don't want to say hate, but I do have a. I have a tension with Italy because it's the country I've spent the most time in and I've been to the most. The attention is the food design, fashion, so many things. The, the. My favorite beaches, the rocky beach. I love all of that. I do sometimes have tension with the food and it's Liguria less so. I loved, I loved the Gloria. I didn't have too much tension with the food, but there was a. There's a. The thing that I have to accept and it's a one way tension. Obviously I don't think Italy has a problem with me. It's that because it's so regional and because it's so kind of divided in that sense, very Italy more so than I think most countries. I have to remember that when I'm in a region, you have to accept that there will be a kind of sameness, there will be a kind of, let's say, consistency that I will kind of get tired by that I don't feel. And maybe in other countries and in Liguria, like I was very happy to have, you know, handkerchiefs with doused and pesto and then trofe with pesto and then, you know, pesto was with every meal and that was totally fine. I wanted to kind of find the best pesto and. And I had focaccia every day. And there's. I have to accept like that. Well, that's like we're in that region and that's. This is also what makes this country so great. I think also there are some places like I went to Sicily and Sicily, I really built it up and it was incredible. I loved all the kind of water moments. I loved the kind of derelict kind of. The city of Palermo. I love, love Palermo. I think like being in Sicily and going to Syracuse, that was just amazing because it felt so raw and it felt just so special. And it really felt like, you know.

[Sam Sifton]

Did you get to go to the Catania fish market by chance?

[Andy Baragani]

I went to the Catania fish market. I spent time in Catania. I mean, food in Catania is amazing, and it's intense. We drove all. We did a full loop.

[Sam Sifton]

We did a full loop.

[Andy Baragani]

There were a lot of things in the. In the middle we didn't get to that I wanted to. I think all the kind of. We had so much me. Keith doesn't drink amazing Sicilian wine. I think the pastas. I had some amazing pastas. I think what confused me about my time in Sicily and why I need to go back was because I left a little bit. I wouldn't say disappointed, but confused because I felt like this has some of the most incredible produce in the world, and yet there was a kind of a heaviness to the food that I was confused by. And I was kind of searching for more of a kind of maybe lighter area moments. But I also had the thing that I think about constantly in the summer, which is Sicilian granita. Or I shouldn't say Sicilian granita. Granita. And it was.

[Sam Sifton]

I didn't know this is what you were gonna say. I didn't know that we shared an ultimate love of granita. Mulberry granita is my favorite thing in the whole world.

[Andy Baragani]

Mulberry granita. Fresh almond. I mean.

[Sam Sifton]

Yeah. Fiki too. Also. Fantastic with that earthiness.

[Andy Baragani]

I would take that over pretty much over any Italian sweet period. And I would definitely take it over gelato. There is having that on its own or with brioche. It was amazing. I think about. Because I've never experience in the States like that. And I'm not talking about the flavors. I'm talking about really about. There's a texture that just. I hope there's something here, but I have not found it yet. Maybe there's something you're aware of.

[Sam Sifton]

I think you're absolutely right. I think it is one of those things that is an only inn. I don't know why it's so mercurial. On the Aeolian islands, which. The islands north, there's an island called South Selena and has a particular mulberry, the green mulberry. And you know, the thing that I think about with mulberry granita and mulberries in general is that they're not shelf stable.

[Andy Baragani]

No.

[Sam Sifton]

They're so fragile.

[Andy Baragani]

No, they're like instant jam.

[Sam Sifton]

They're just instant, like. And so you make it into a granita. It's those hot days it has that unique, you know, inky quality, that depth of flavor with the pan, with the cream. It's like. It is rich. I mean, I don't like to say favorite anything, but I know if I was to refer to anything, it's that. And I have very happy memories around it, too. But I couldn't agree with you more.

[Andy Baragani]

There's a creaminess to it without any dairy, without any. There's. It's very confusing. I will say, like, we're talking about mulberries. And mulberries are also a big, you know, big part of that area also in Persian culture.

[Sam Sifton]

That's right. Of course. Dried mulberries.

[Andy Baragani]

Dried mulberries. Although I love the fresh ones. I'll. I'll say that, but I have to. Just because it's you. I will say it on the record, and I've never admitted this, but when I was at Chinese, no one knew but sue, who was the lead pastry chef. They, for some reason, even though they had a fridge in their pastry station, the walk in, one of the walk ins, the back walk in had like, the trays where they held their mulberries. And I just would go in because I had to go in or I had breaks and I just would have to, like, snack on mulberries. And I only one time they. Someone did say, like, can you people not eat the mulberries? And I just was like, I will never.

[Sam Sifton]

Can I just. I'll never act. This is like a. A moment of confidence. I. I'm really sorry. Sorry, Alice, but that, you know, it was the day of the year for Bastille Day, right?

[Andy Baragani]

Y.

[Sam Sifton]

Where they made the mulberry, like, ice cream. I went back there and tucked in, there is a photo of me because I would be the person that year that would serve out the front of. And sell the ice creams. But I pilfered it as well, because it was such. It was just that perfect thing.

[Andy Baragani]

It was pure.

[Sam Sifton]

You couldn't. And you know, the other thing about that, that mulberry is. Do you remember the mulberry tree that they got it from?

[Andy Baragani]

It was crazy.

[Sam Sifton]

That held up by, like, I don't know, planks of wood. And it was this just immense tree, I guess maybe in Sonoma or somewhere that is. That is really amazing.

[Andy Baragani]

There is a mulberry tree in New York that I have that I sometimes will go. It's a. We're slowly getting at that time. In like another month or two, I'll be walking past that train. But I'll be waiting.

[Sam Sifton]

I just planted two weeping mulberries because I want a mini tunnel. I mean, beautiful, Ridiculous, but considering I have a terrace. But I, I was talking to the nursery and they were like, but you, you want a fruiting weeping mulberry because they think of it as ornamental. Like, why would you want a fruiting one? Because. And to do a tunnel. Because they're going to drop. The berries are going to drop and stain. And that's exactly what I want. I just want it to be messy.

[Andy Baragani]

I love.

[Sam Sifton]

So I only just did it a couple of weeks ago. Anyway, mulberries. I mean, I think that food people who really understand, like, the fragility of a flavor completely get it with a mulberry.

[Andy Baragani]

Absolutely. I mean, it's. I remember, God, we're gonna. This is the mulberry episode. I remember. I, I, I gave Keith the mulberry for the first time, and he was like, what is this? I was like, think of it as, like, this kind of the, like, instant jam that it's going to like, it just trembles and just in your mouth, like, it's so fragile and so delicate and so distinct. Like, it doesn't taste like a BlackBerry. It's definitely doesn't feel as seedy. It definitely is more interesting than a raspberry. No hit on raspberry. But I, I, I love it.

[Sam Sifton]

You know, everyone that's a food person needs to, like, Italy needs to go to Japan. And I went with my family several years ago, just before the pandemic, actually. And I have this memory in Kyoto because, you know, Australian family, the time that they can get off really is between Christmas and New Year's. And so New Year's is when the whole country is shut down. So it's kind of like, really shut down.

[Andy Baragani]

Yeah. They are not open.

[Sam Sifton]

No. And I have two, like, vivid memories on the family spectrum, one of which is in the Kyoto market. Before the kind of market closed down for the year. There was, there's a Hoshigaki stand, which are dried persimmons. And the dried persimmons are kind of amazing because, you know, they eat them at New Year's, I believe, or in the festive period. But, you know, they cut, they're a fall fruit, as we know, and they peel the skin and then hang them in like a, I guess a moist or maybe dry spot, and then massage the sugars out. And so you get the world's best dried fruit. Maybe you're gonna go with dried mulberries, but I'll go with no, no, no.

[Andy Baragani]

I would take that a bird. Right moment.

[Sam Sifton]

And myself sister loves a bit of dried fruit. She's also kind of an athlete. Anyway, I went and bought my year's supply of Hoshiaki, which by the way is the Rolls Royce.

[Andy Baragani]

Oh, totally.

[Sam Sifton]

I mean that's expensive and comes with a price. Exactly. So anyway, I'm hidden them away and then she just thinks that she's found a bunch of dates or something or apricots and she eats them all. So that was like I had to have a fight with my sister in 10 years and then we had a huge blow up in Kyoto about Hoshigaki. So it's called the Hoshigaki affair in my family. But I mean, I'm sure you've got more experience of that than I do in Kyoto.

[Andy Baragani]

I do think like, I think if you love food, if you love design, if you love really just anything like Japan is that should be on your radar. And I had never gone my. I went my first time I went. I've gone twice, both times with, with my husband Keith and he had gone before, but I think it was, it was more work related.

[Sam Sifton]

Yeah. And Keith come. Keith comes from a design perspective. Yes.

[Andy Baragani]

And he comes from a design perspective and he worked in editorial for many years. And I'm definitely more of a planner in terms of like the travel. And so our first time we went and I'm not someone who wanted to kind of, I'm not. I knew I was not going to see and try to go to so many different places and go up and down Japan in the two and a half weeks we were there. But we went to Tokyo, we went to Kyoto and we went to a kind of an onsen town, Kinosaki. It was great. Kyoto. We went to the moss temple there, a Saiho ji. And part of it, I have to admit, the reason why I was so interested because there's so many incredible kind of gardens obviously in all of Japan and especially Kyoto, was because a friend told me like, oh, well, it's very hard to get in. So I was like, I want to get in. But it was, it was like, oh, you have to write to them or you have to have someone write on your behalf to, to, for them to accept you because there's a very, very short amount of visitors they allow. And then once you're there, you have to kind of spend like 10, 15 minutes to kind of trace calligraphy. And then once you're done with that, I think, I think you do A prayer. And then. Then you could see the garden. So there's definitely a process. I'm thinking about this space because I just got a text message from Becca Parrish.

[Sam Sifton]

Becca's a publicist.

[Andy Baragani]

Yes. In New York City and a dear friend. And I knew that she was going to Japan for the first time. And I said, look, you have all the lists. You don't need my thoughts. But I'm gonna tell you one thing. When you're in Kyoto, you go to this place. And she went, and she wrote me this note just a few days ago, being like, I am so happy and grateful you told me. It was the most amazing experience. And I really felt like that there's nothing I've ever seen in my life.

[Sam Sifton]

What was it like?

[Andy Baragani]

It was just incredibly vibrant and this verdant green and this calm, which you will kind of experience that calm in so many gardens. But it was this kind of evenness and care, and you see all the people maintaining it, and it just. It's. It made me feel actually that the letter, the waiting, the calligraphy, the prayer, it still wasn't enough. I would have been happy to go through a lot more obstacles to be granted permission to kind of view this. It was the most common experience I felt throughout that trip.

[Sam Sifton]

Well, can I tell you that as someone that works in a travel company, the least calming place to work with and for is Japan.

[Andy Baragani]

Japan.

[Sam Sifton]

Because they don't want visit for exactly that reason. And sometimes I think it's, like, a really good thing to do to have a balance with Japan. My big advice there is if you can get those types of experiences or see, like, a national living treasure, master craft, then that's kind of.

[Andy Baragani]

It's hard to do that. Hard to get a lot of those, though. It's very difficult.

[Sam Sifton]

Yeah. But also, people get a bit of FOMO big time when they're in Japan, and. And that can be, like, not the best thing. So I think if you. You know, people that get all of those lists from all of their friends too much, it can. It does sometimes disappoint you because you have this sense that something is better around the corner. So I always think, you know, planning is important. A couple of things a day, but don't plan Japan within an inch of your life. No, I went there last year with Vietnam after we were in Mongolia, and we're kind of exhausted, and we're staying at, like, admittedly one of the best hotels ever, the Bulgari in Tokyo. So super fancy. But we hadn't planned anything. And Actually, and it was the middle of summer, and actually that was one of the most relaxing things I've ever done in that center of that city. Precisely because, you know, there's such a level of quality there, it's very hard to go wrong.

[Andy Baragani]

Yeah.

[Sam Sifton]

But if you're racing around and thinking,

[Andy Baragani]

thinking, oh, you're exhausted. I was always. Every day, that first trip. I was exhausted every day in Tokyo.

[Sam Sifton]

No, exactly. And, and, and I think that, like, people, you know, if you, you're lucky, not everyone can go multiple times. But don't jam everything in or try to control it to every degree, because otherwise you're kind of missing out. And I just think Japan is like counterintuitively. Yeah. That's the way to approach it.

[Andy Baragani]

I think the one thing to remember with Japan and I kind of gathered this after the first trip and app to. Well, the funny thing is after the first trip, Keith was like, like, you love it so much. Like, I, I, I, I, I love it. I love it so much. Where during that trip, I was like, I'm extending my trip an extra week without you. And he left.

[Sam Sifton]

I remember when you did that.

[Andy Baragani]

I was like, I'm staying an extra week without you. He's like, why? I'm like, because you don't eat pork or beef, so get out of this country and let me eat all the things.

[Sam Sifton]

Right.

[Andy Baragani]

And it was perfect. And he totally understood. But I remember when I came back, he's like, it's like, are you sad? Like, it's probably gonna be like, we probably won't go there for a long time. And then we get married the next year and we have our honeymoon in Japan. So it was, I was like, no, no. Japan's part of our, part of our life now. But I, I do have some thoughts on it for anybody who's going to Japan for the first time, which is like you said, you don't kind of over plan. I'd say one also thing is like, try to end your trip in Tokyo. I don't think I say that because for me, I want to shop and I will shop wherever. But I think, like, it's with Tokyo, there's so many things I, I end up buying.

[Sam Sifton]

Yeah. Well, this is what I was gonna say, was gonna say to you.

[Andy Baragani]

Keith had to pull me out.

[Sam Sifton]

He's like, literally the same. Because I think it's genius to say actually leaving, like ending in jingling. Yeah, I really do. Because, you know, what you're referring to is what I was going to say to you is like, have you been to these basement department store food courts? Of course you have. That is like. I mean, a wild food experience.

[Andy Baragani]

I would say Japan's probably the only time in my. I've definitely did it in my life, but in my 30s where. Because usually it's been by myself. Right. Where Keith will be like, are you okay? Like, are you okay? It just like there's this. Because it's too. It's too much.

[Sam Sifton]

The same thing happened with Veep. He was like, what is going on?

[Andy Baragani]

It's too. Because it's like, wait, so there's all this food. It's all beautiful. It's sweet, it's savory. It's all these different things I want to try. And then there's this other element where it's like. It's all gorgeous and it's all perfect looking. And then the things where it's takeaway. It's all wrapped perfectly. So then I'm obsessed with, like. Like the paper and the every little thing. I'm just like, this is too much simulation. And so, like, I have to buy a pack of cigarettes and smoke.

[Sam Sifton]

It's like you can get like the perfect musket grape for like the week or it's the perfect white.

[Andy Baragani]

That's all you're gonna have.

[Sam Sifton]

Oh, my God. I know. I went wild there as well. Okay, Andy, we do. We'll do a f. Fast few questions at the end. We ask everyone. And the first instinct is the right instinct, so don't overthink it. Where's a place you would always return?

[Andy Baragani]

Paris.

[Sam Sifton]

A place you'd never go back?

[Andy Baragani]

Marrakesh.

[Sam Sifton]

Oh. Oh. I'm not even going to go there.

[Andy Baragani]

I didn't say Morocco. I said Marrakesh.

[Sam Sifton]

Okay. Where's the place you've felt most at home?

[Andy Baragani]

I mean, outside of New York.

[Sam Sifton]

Yeah. Outside of your home.

[Andy Baragani]

Outside. I'm like, outside of New York. Like, there's a lot of place. I hate to say it. Paris.

[Sam Sifton]

Yeah. Well, it's most out of place. There's not necessarily a bad thing.

[Andy Baragani]

Orlando.

[Sam Sifton]

Oh, well, yeah. Favorite hotel or memorable? Most memorable hotel.

[Andy Baragani]

Oh, Post Ranch Inn. I mean, I think it was just a whole perfect experience. The meal was perfect. The room was perfect. The amount of fog was perfect.

[Sam Sifton]

The California Riddle. Yeah.

[Andy Baragani]

Yeah. It really just. Just. It was a reminder of just how, you know, I've traveled so much and will continue to. But the state that I'm from is. Is really special.

[Sam Sifton]

Okay. So I was thinking, I almost want to give you a special of dispensation to not Answer this question, but I'm gonna make you answer it again. First instinct. And rather than favorites, let's say memorable restaurant meal taste.

[Andy Baragani]

Okay. There is a restaurant in Kyoto and Izakaya place called Barang Khat. Tiny, tiny spot. And you sat around the bar. I think there was maybe 1, 2 top and it was delicious. I think that was my favorite meal. And I'd say that and suado only because it's. In the past couple years were two restaurant meals that I had that were perfect. The suado is also known as a kaya spot. The more memorable things I think of in my past are the mundane. The things that are so simple. You'd never think it's like having a pomegranate juice vendor juicing and then Kamal putting some salt in it and giving it to me to like take a swig. It's like things like that where there's an unexpectedness that felt good.

[Sam Sifton]

Museum or cultural institution?

[Andy Baragani]

The Louisiana Museum, obviously, just outside of Copenhagen's, an amazing one. And the Bordell Museum in Paris.

[Sam Sifton]

What's that one?

[Andy Baragani]

Oh, it's like all these incredible busts and statues.

[Sam Sifton]

What about shop or market?

[Andy Baragani]

What does that mean? Like, I either shop or I go to the market.

[Sam Sifton]

Like a shop or a market.

[Andy Baragani]

Like, why shop? Oh. Oof, my God, that's so hard. Or market Just like market wise, it would be. Honestly, it would be like a. Like is itan men's in. In Japan? Like, okay, sorry. It's like a complete.

[Sam Sifton]

No.

[Andy Baragani]

I loved it. Also, I think shopping has become so sad in so many parts of the world and not there.

[Sam Sifton]

It's true.

[Andy Baragani]

It's like amazing and like kind of Ben's shopping is like, feel. I feel like the men have it better there than women almost.

[Sam Sifton]

Full stop. Agree. Where would you most like to spend a weekend, week, month, a year?

[Andy Baragani]

A weekend would be in Iceland, a week would be in Berlin, a month would be in Japan, and a year would be in Paris.

[Sam Sifton]

I asked this question and take it as. As you have, however you first understand it. What are you traveling through right now?

[Andy Baragani]

I'd say this is a year of a lot of big changes and shifts for me personally and also I would say my career. So I can't get into detail too much quite yet, but I think one of those things is doing another book and finishing that up. And I'm excited to kind of bring that to the world and go through that again and a few other kind of things that I'm. I've been working on privately or I should say with many others for a while now that eventually I'll be able to kind of share with with everybody soon.

[Sam Sifton]

But big moments coming. Well, seeing as though I know you're about to finish the book, I'm so grateful for you making all this time to come and chat, my friend. Thank you. And I actually hope that we get to travel together.

[Andy Baragani]

I know we feel like we'd be good travel.

[Sam Sifton]

I feel like India again. You know, it will either be terrible or amazing.

[Andy Baragani]

No, I think it would be amazing because we're good eaters. I feel like we're both. I think we're both night owls.

[Sam Sifton]

No, actually I'm a morning person. But what I do.

[Andy Baragani]

I'm a morning person and a night owl.

[Sam Sifton]

Okay, well then actually that's true.

[Andy Baragani]

I'm like I get up early, but I also. I can say a bite.

[Sam Sifton]

Well, yes. Okay, now I understand what you're saying. No for sure. Well, we're going to do it.

[Andy Baragani]

I can't wait. Thank you, friend.

[Sam Sifton]

Thank you. Thank you so much,

[Andy Baragani]

Sam.