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Brandon Cartellone ////// 777
01:03:28
Brandon Cartellone ////// 777 Part 1 of 1 www.TrueCrimeGarage.com On July 26, 2011 - Brandon Cartellone was viciously killed. His body was found in his second floor apartment at approximately 1AM on July 27th. Brandon was just 21 years old. He was a successful Industrial Design student at the Cleveland Institute of Art. Brandon’s death continues to be an open wound that will not and cannot heal for the so many people who knew and loved him. The F.B.I. has taken over the case as it appears that the Cleveland Police Department either lacked the funding, the personnel, or both to conduct a thorough and proper murder investigation. Law Enforcement still needs your help. If you have any information regarding this investigation OR information about any of the persons described in this podcast please contact the Cleveland FBI office 216-522-1400. Online tips can be sent to tips.fbi.gov Beer of the Week - Strange Magic by Fat Head’s Brewery Garage Grade - 3 and 3 quarter b...
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- [00:00]
Nick
You're never just one thing.
- [00:02]
Angie Hicks
You're the boss.
- [00:02]
News Reporter
Hey Google, when's my next meeting? The athlete that class wrecks me and their mom. Everyone in the all new Mazda CX5 more to move every side of you. Learn more@mazdausa.com Google is a trademark of Google LLC. Sequences shortened and simulated.
- [00:15]
Nick
Picture this. It's the end of a long week. You're unwinding in the tub, listening to
- [00:21]
Advertiser/Host
your favorite true crime podcast and then chronic hives come back again in the middle of the episode. What a wet blanket looks like another spell of itchy, swollen red or skin colored hives.
- [00:36]
Nick
If you have chronic spontaneous urticaria or
- [00:39]
Advertiser/Host
csu, there may be a different treatment option. Worried about your chronic hives interrupting our next episode? Learn more@treatmyhives.com Garage Sam.
- [01:33]
Nick
Welcome to True Crime Garage wherever you are, whatever you were doing, thanks for listening. I'm your host Nick and with me as always is an optimist because while the US Is burning to the ground he says you need not worry because the Browns have started training camp. Here is the captain.
- [01:50]
Co-host
Get your massage tables out. It's good to be seen and good to see you. Thanks for listening. Thanks for telling a friend.
- [02:00]
Nick
Today we are very excited to be featuring Strange Magic by the creative folks over at Fatheads Brewery. Strange Magic is an American ipa. The magic is in the masterful combination
- [02:14]
Advertiser/Host
of hops that create this India Pale Ale.
- [02:17]
Nick
This is good hop flavor, maybe a little light on the hops with a good citrus finish. ABV 6.5% garage grade three and three quarter bottle caps out of five. And here's some of our magical friends that we would like to thank for helping us fill up the old garage fridge for this week's show. First up a shout out to Juliet in Detroit, Michigan.
- [02:41]
Co-host
And a big we like you jib goes out to Lauren in Richmond, Virginia.
- [02:44]
Nick
Next up a long distance cheers to Vicky in London, UK and a what's
- [02:50]
Co-host
up buttercup to Mary Ann in Springfield, Virginia.
- [02:54]
Nick
And last but certainly not least we have Julie from Pequot Lakes, Minnesota. Everyone we just mentioned, they went to truecrimegarage.com and helped us out with this week's beer run.
- [03:04]
Co-host
Yeah bwr. You win Beer run. For more True Crime Garage make sure you sign up on Patreon or Apple subscription and we love you. Thanks for keeping the lights on. And that's enough of the business.
- [03:18]
Nick
All right everybody gather round. Grab a chair, grab a beer. Lets talk some true crime.
- [03:33]
Patient
Now at 11 this is something every parent fears. Getting the News their child has been killed. For one Northeast Ohio mother, that unimaginable grief is made even worse by a lack of news or updates in the police investigation into the crime.
- [03:46]
Interviewee/Family Member
Now, she's lived without her son for nearly 10 years now. And it was July 26th of 2011 that he was killed in his Cleveland apartment. This mother tells News 5's Jesse Schultz she's doubtful the killer will ever see the inside of a prison cell.
- [04:00]
News Reporter
For Lynn Cardelloni, July 26, 2011 is a date she'll never forget.
- [04:06]
Interviewee/Family Member
My son's name is Brandon Michael Cardellani.
- [04:09]
News Reporter
It's the day her world stopped turning.
- [04:12]
Interviewee/Family Member
This is an event that changes you forever.
- [04:15]
News Reporter
The day her creative and loving son Brandon died.
- [04:20]
Interviewee/Family Member
It was a horrific crime.
- [04:22]
News Reporter
2021 year old Brandon was brutally beaten and strangled in his Tremont apartment. A crime so violent in a neighborhood so vibrant, Lynn was confident that justice would be swift.
- [04:34]
Interviewee/Family Member
We thought how important those first few hours were. We thought the police were on it. I wish I would have known then what I know now.
- [04:41]
News Reporter
But this isn't about what happened to Brandon that night. It's about what happened after. The weeks turned into months that turned into years. With no answers or updates from detectives, you feel alone.
- [04:56]
Interviewee/Family Member
In the process, you feel abandoned. What is justice?
- [05:00]
News Reporter
And while Lynn's world stopped turning once Brandon was no longer in it, the outside world kept going. It's been almost 10 years since she buried her son. And she believes his case file is also buried as newer investigations continue to pile up.
- [05:18]
Interviewee/Family Member
I've given up calling and trying to speak with someone because they refuse to talk to me.
- [05:23]
News Reporter
Since 2011, Cleveland saw more than 1,000 criminal homicides. 76 this year alone. And as violent crime continues to rise, the city's homicide unit is understaffed, budgeted for 25 detectives. But police union president Jeff Vollmer estimates there's only about 15 teen detectives.
- [05:43]
Co-host
If they start a homicide one day and then within 24 hours of getting another one, you gotta, you gotta jump around.
- [05:49]
News Reporter
Last year, the U.S. department of justice said in order to keep up with the growing caseload, Cleveland needed at least 38 detectives. It's been almost 10 years since she buried her son.
- [06:12]
Nick
That news clip that you heard in today's trailer is from the good hard working folks over at News 5 Cleveland. You can check out their good work@news5cleveland.com and in that news clip, you heard the frustration of our victim's mother. Her name is Lynn. She has had this frustration for many years. Her son's case has remained unsolved all of these years later and she is expressing her frustration with the Cleveland Police Department with what she believes is their lack of competency and effort into her son's case. You hear the rebuttal from Cleveland Police Department saying we are underfunded, we are understaffed. And that certainly is a problem that many large cities are facing today.
- [07:00]
Co-host
Well, let's dive into the case details.
- [07:03]
Nick
On July 26, 2011, Brandon Carteleone was murdered. His body was found in his apartment at approximately 1am on July 27. Brandon was a 21 year old industrial design student at the Cleveland Institute of Art. He was in his junior year and was top of his class by all accounts. Brandon was a hard working, talented, fun loving young man with a large circle of friends. He had been working at a pizza shop and doing side design work and had a paid internship at a business called A Piece of Cleveland. Today's case, just like last week and the week before, these are all rough and difficult cases. He was found bound and strangled to death, slumped not over but sort of half on, half off of his couch in the living room of a small second floor apartment. This is in the neighborhood of Tremont, which is just minutes from downtown Cleveland, Ohio. Tremont is an otherwise great vibrant urban village. Brandon lived in a second floor apartment by himself. There were four apartments on that second floor at the time. This was above a bakery and an art gallery. Unfortunately, I think what we have here is some kind of what would typically be referred to as a push in crime or a home invasion. He was found bound at the wrist and ankles, badly beaten and manually strangled to death. I think we are dealing with a clear motive here as well. Maybe a touch foggy but agreed, murder, murder for profit situation. And I think that it is quite possible that the victim here, this dude, was set up to be robbed, likely because of someone he knew and even possibly by someone he thought that he could trust. Persons in Northeast Ohio who know this case and have followed this case know from the news reports Brandon had also been selling weed leading up to this. There has been a lot of focus on on that small part of his life. But I'm not going to gloss over any of that because it would appear to me that there is little question that that small part of his life didn't play a big role in his death. We're going to go through a timeline here starting with July 26, 2011 and then the early morning hours of July 27 when Brandon is found. This is a Tuesday in a Wednesday. Just for reference this is what we know about the timeline of his day. On 7 26, July 26, and the morning hours, Brandon was working at the internship with a piece of Cleveland. This is a woodworking and very cool design shop. They design tables, furniture, custom work. And he's an art guy and he's a design guy. So this is a perfect fit for him. And this is a paid internship for Brandon. Around 3pm that day, Brandon met with his buddy Alex for coffee. Brandon asked to use the phone at the coffee shop while he was there. This should stand out to investigators and his family as odd because Brandon had a cell phone. All right, it's 2011, so we're going back in time here a little bit. It wouldn't be completely out of the realm of possibility that he simply forgot his phone or did not have his phone on his person, asked to use the phone at the coffee shop that he had frequented. But to me, knowing what's going on and as we go through this timeline, I think that people are going to want to put a big question mark and circle this detail in the timeline. Why did he use the coffee shop's phone when there were or should have been other options?
- [11:09]
Co-host
Yeah. Did he not want the person he was calling to know it was him, or did he not want them to have his phone number?
- [11:15]
Nick
Now, he and his friend, after coffee, rode around town on their scooters for approximately two to three hours that day. Afterwards, Brandon went back to his apartment. This is at 2173 Professor Street. He's in apartment number one on the second floor. It's above two businesses, as we said. I believe there was also a fifth apartment that was at ground level. But the way to access his apartment there was, from my understanding, Captain, a front entrance and a rear entrance to the building, where it was simply a locked door, a door that would automatically lock. Tenants would use their key to get into that door, go up a set of steps, and then there was a hallway that would lead to the doors of each of those four apartments.
- [12:00]
Co-host
Did they have an intercom system where he could buzz somebody in?
- [12:05]
Nick
No. And some have cited that that might be why some of the details in this case are as such, the key here that I really want to point out to individuals listening to this case. You hear the Cleveland Police Department, they will cite. And when they spoke with Brandon's mom and other persons about this case, they. They constantly bring up the obstacles and the problems with this case. But the thing that I want to point out is that if I'm a detective and I'm looking at this case, at least, I'm going into it going. Okay, the potential for witnesses, eyewitnesses and ear witnesses is very likely here. I should be able to build something on this case. So a quick description here. As said, you would go up a flight of stairs. Whether you entered this building from the front, from the street side or from the rear. You would go up a set of stairs and then you would have the hallway, four doors, each one going to individual apartments. From my understanding here, Captain, once you entered Brandon's apartment you were, it was a small apartment, but these, these are relatively nice apartments in a, in a very cool area of town. So you walk in and you're immediately in the kitchen of this apartment. And from the kitchen there's two walkways. Some have described them as doors, but I don't, I don't think they were actual doors. I think that was just you. You could walk from the kitchen into one room, which would be the living room and then you could walk another direction out of that kitchen and you are in the bedroom. Remember, Brandon was found in the living room. Okay, so I got a little sidetracked there. But now we are at approximately 5:36 o' clock on July 26th and Brandon is back at his apartment at 2173 Professor Street. You are going to hear us use the term friend several times throughout this timeline, but truly that is for a lack of understanding on our part and others part as to the exact nature of these relationships. So we have a person, we have a friend of Brandon's, his name is David. He came to Brandon's apartment around 6 or 7pm that day with the purpose of purchasing marijuana from Brandon. Then we have a friend named Matt who claimed to have hung out with Brandon at the apartment that evening between the hours of 7 and 8pm after this we have Rachel, another friend was there at the apartment around 8pm she is there for the purpose of purchasing marijuana from Brandon. She says that she hung out there at the apartment for approximately 30 to maybe 45 minutes. Now we know that Brandon was on his phone, okay, that cell phone that we referenced earlier, he's on his phone with a friend named Meg. And this call takes place just before 9pm I have here in my notes that the call ends sometime before 9:30, question mark, question mark. So that is what has been provided to me. I've not been able to confirm and back up what time that phone call ended and the, the end of that phone call, whatever time that call ended may be incredibly important to this case because according to Meg and her statement and from the activity on Brandon's phone, it would appear that at that time, 9 o' clock to whenever that phone call ended, he's alive, he's well, he doesn't feel threatened, he doesn't, he's not distressed. There's nothing crazy going on, Everything's as it should be.
- [15:59]
Co-host
Yeah, it seems like everything is hunky dory.
- [16:01]
Nick
Now, another friend of his, this is also a man that he, a young man that he worked with at some point. His name is Deontay. He Texts Brandon at 9:28pm but phone records do not show Brandon using his phone after the call with Meg ends. So his friend Deontay texts him and his friend is saying, he's texting him, saying hey, I'm coming over. But what we know is that Brandon never responds to this. He doesn't call Deontay, he doesn't text Deontay back. So if we are starting to look for flags of where there should be concern of where things start to go wrong, it might be sometime between 9 and 10pm, likely around the time of receiving this text, just prior or a little bit after.
- [16:54]
Co-host
Yeah, it seems like this is the
- [16:56]
Nick
first red flag we have. Brandon's girlfriend, she calls him. All right, so she's on her cell phone, she is nearby and as the story goes, she's driving in the neighborhood. She looks up, she sees the light to Brandon's apartment on and she gives her boyfriend a call. This is at 10pm approximately. She says that Brandon's phone, cell phone picks up. She hears some voices when the call is answered, but the phone, the call, they quickly hang up, the call quickly ends, she calls back and gets no answer. Now later she would tell police she's trying to describe this because again, this is a pivotal point in our timeline here.
- [17:49]
Co-host
Well, when you call your boyfriend, you're expecting him to pick up. When you hear voices that maybe you don't recognize or just commotion that's going to lead you to be concerned that
- [17:59]
Nick
when the phone picked up, when, when she thought Brandon, her, her boyfriend were, was answering the phone and she heard the voices, she could not discern if it was actual voices in his apartment, people talking or doing something in her, his apartment or if it was just noise from the tv.
- [18:17]
Co-host
Yeah, that would make sense.
- [18:18]
Nick
The call was that quick. The pickup hang up, it's that quick. She calls back, Brandon doesn't answer.
- [18:25]
Co-host
Well, it'd be nice if this was a good investigation, but it wasn't just fact of the Matter because when you have this short call, could it be a conversation that he was having? Was there people over at his apartment? Was he out at a bar? Was it just the sound of the tv? We don't know. And what would tell us that? Cell phone ping technology. But guess what? We don't have that. Or if we do have it in this case, has it been released to the public?
- [18:52]
Nick
Yeah, and I don't want to harp on this for too much in today's episode because we got a lot to get through, but it would appear, right. Our view from 10,000ft. It would appear that this investigation early on was not conducted in the best manner, maybe not the most thorough of investigations. At times I would even question the efforts of, of the detectives and I hate to do that because I love the city of Cleveland. But today, when you look at the case and you try to get some information on this case, we're simply told, hey, look, we got to keep some of this information close to the vest. And it gets, you look at it and you go, well, is that because the guys early on didn't do a great job? And so you don't have any of that information and you don't want that to be public, that you are limited on your knowledge of the case, or is it you have been able to go back and clean up their mess, collect proper information and fill out gaps in the timeline and add details to your time frame. And now you know those details are important and we cannot release those to the public. But this call from Brandon's girlfriend is not just important because it, it fills in our timeline here. I am of the belief, and would be working this case unless something told me otherwise, that Brandon was in his apartment when the girlfriend attempted to call him at approximately 10pm that night. I'm basing that off of the light being on. I'm basing that off of prior activity of people coming and going from the apartment and that he's going to be found just a couple of hours later murdered in that same apartment. So unless something is telling me otherwise, I believe he was in that apartment from the time that, that we said when he would return between 5 and 6pm that night. And he was there and never left that apartment, unfortunately, because it will end up being the same person who attempted to call him at 10pm the girlfriend that would find Brandon dead, she says that she grew concerned when she attempted to reach out to him and never heard back from him. It wasn't like him. They stayed in contact. This was a long term Relationship. And so at some point she decided, you know what, I should. I'm just going to head over there, knock on the door. They did have some not so concrete plans for that evening. Right. To hang out. That was the purpose of her 10:00pm call.
- [21:31]
Co-host
Well, he's a college student. When you're a college student and you got an internship and you're working on all these different things and look, he's selling weed on the side. This guy has a lot going on. It's hard to make solid plans.
- [21:45]
Nick
Yeah, you're 21, you require about four hours sleep or at least that's how I was.
- [21:50]
Co-host
Or four minutes.
- [21:51]
Nick
She comes over to the apartment and this is really unfortunate because this plays, in my opinion, until anybody can prove otherwise, this plays a major role in this case. Brandon had the habit, not trying to victim blame here. Had the bad habit of. The captain asked earlier, was there an intercom system, could he buzz people in? No, there was not. This is an old school building. So he had the habit of using a brick to prop open the door to, to keep it open just enough for a person to open the door on their own. The door's not locked. It locked automatically behind the person when, when people would come and go. But he would put the brick in, especially if he knew someone was coming over. Right. Like Deontay, who had text him earlier to say, hey buddy, I'm coming over. Deontay says he never hears back from him if he heard from somebody. If he heard from his girlfriend, she says, hey, I'm coming over. I'll be over in 5 minutes, 10 minutes, Brandon might run down there and put the brick in the door. And so the person could just make their way up, walk into the hallway, knock on his door, which I'm sure
- [22:57]
Co-host
this habit annoyed his neighbors as well.
- [23:00]
Nick
I was going to point that out like, yeah, I know we do a true crime show so we are hyper vigilant about our personal security. But if, if I lived in a building like that and I'm guessing he probably wasn't the only one in the building that had that habit, but that would annoy me beyond belief.
- [23:19]
Co-host
Well, I'm the dumbest boy in school and left my garage door open all last night.
- [23:23]
Nick
She gets to the apartment, she goes up the stairs to the building, to the second floor, walks to Brandon's door, knocks. I'm a little unclear if the door was just a touch open, but what is perfectly clear is the door was not locked because girlfriend did not have a key and she says that she entered the apartment she walked in, she's now in the kitchen. She turns, looks through one of those walkways to the living room, and she says that she spotted Brennan's knees. And it's difficult for me to describe the way that he was positioned. He's kind of half on, half off of the couch. His, his wrists and ankles have been bound with belts and his arms, his hands are up over his head. A cord wrapped around his neck. Now, he was manually strangled, and it's been suggested to me by more than one person that that cord wrapped around his neck is not what, what strangled him. Maybe it was an attempt to strangle him with that cord and unsuccessful, but that's been the statements to me.
- [24:40]
Co-host
So what you're saying is somebody tried to strangle him with his cord but was unsuccessful, so they probably used their hands.
- [24:46]
Nick
I've reviewed the autop and it's difficult for me to say, you know, the cord wrapped around his neck would be the obvious answer to me, but again, not a doctor.
- [24:58]
Co-host
Do we have marks around his wrist and where he was bound. Was he putting up a fight?
- [25:05]
Nick
He's most certainly put up a fight. So he's found in his. One description indicates that he's wearing a T shirt and boxer shorts, and another description says that he's wearing boxer shorts, but it doesn't say he's not wearing a shirt. It just doesn't say anything about a T shirt.
- [25:22]
Advertiser/Host
Right.
- [25:23]
Co-host
Well, this isn't one killer.
- [25:24]
Nick
You're exactly right. Thank you for saying that. This one. There are certain cases where you can take a look and it screams multiple persons involved. And I feel like here, this is one that you do not have to be Sherlock Holmes to take a look at the, the, the brief details, the limited details of this case, and go, you know what? This is a two man job at least.
- [25:54]
Advertiser/Host
At least.
- [25:54]
Co-host
Then it makes you wonder, why don't we have eyewitnesses? Why don't we have ear witnesses?
- [25:59]
Nick
We do and we'll circle back to that. But at the scene, here's what, what we're talking about. He's got a good amount of injuries to the face area, the head, the neck, shoulders, all which would be indicative of him putting up a fight or them trying to maybe beat something out of him, beat some information out of him. Once he was already bound and tied up. There is duct tape across his mouth. So they were attempting to silence him.
- [26:32]
Co-host
This is just very bizarre though, because we got this young college student, you know, he's getting pretty good grades, he's, he has an internship, paid internship. Okay, so he's selling a little bit of weed, whatever.
- [26:46]
Nick
I think he was selling a lot of weed. And there is nothing anywhere to suggest that he was selling anything else. In fact, there are persons that knew him well that said he strongly was against that.
- [27:00]
Co-host
I'm just saying that you've known guys that sold potential and almost all those guys could get you something else if they wanted to.
- [27:08]
Nick
Right, but I'm having a trouble making a connection here. I'm going to go to this guy's apartment, this pot dealer's apartment and try to beat it out of him where I can get something stronger. Those, those types can find people to get something stronger.
- [27:24]
Co-host
No, I understand that, but what I'm saying is there could have been assumptions by people, possibly.
- [27:30]
Nick
Look again, not to, to sound like someone who's victim blaming. This is a big part of the case. So if you think I'm being rude, sorry, but I think this was a half baked plan by an otherwise very smart, hardworking individual that figured out, hey, I'm a college student in an area with a whole bunch of friends who probably all of my friends have a whole bunch of friends too. And through my several workplaces, college and my big social circle of friends, I can move a good deal of marijuana and make a whole lot of money doing it. And he's doing it out of his apartment. That takes the risk level from about a four to about a nine. Now you're inviting persons in who you may not fully know what they're up to, you may not know what they do after you sell them a bag of weed or an ounce of pot or, or a quarter pound or however much you're moving with some of these individuals. One, one thing I believe is going on here too, which I've been told no, we don't think that that's what was happening. And I say no. Like these circles, I moved within these circles. I know how these things work within these circles. If you got one dude, he's buying from a guy that's moving way more than he's moving, then Brandon's moving a lot. In my opinion that means that there are persons under him that are buying from Brandon that are also moving product as well. What I think that we're seeing here is a guy that got thought that he would do something that was casual, harmless and make some good money, wouldn't hurt anybody and he could profit from it. And unfortunately his apartment became a target. He became a target. Persons were going in and out of that apartment with Ease. And all it takes is somebody that he knows, somebody that he's regularly selling to to either set his ass up to be robbed and this whole thing went horribly wrong or for somebody that frequents his apartment to buy, that tells, that accidentally tells the wrong person or persons where they get their weed from, who they get it from, what the protocol is.
- [29:53]
Co-host
Or like you said, he's selling a bunch of weed, making a bunch of money and not paying the people that he's supposed to pay. It's not like we have.
- [30:00]
Nick
I don't think that's going on at all. I do not think that's going on at all. Because we're not talking about, we're not talking about Philadelphia, New York City, 1980s where we're fronting junkies product and then coming and killing them when they don't pay us later. No, we're talking. This is suburban college kid movement here. This is, you want this amount of weed to sell within the course of the next week or two.
- [30:34]
Advertiser/Host
Cool.
- [30:35]
Nick
It costs this much and if you ain't got it, we'll sell you a little bit less. That's how that works. And he had a regular supplier and we know that based off of several persons close to this case. And I think he had a pretty, pretty casual setup here where he is the, his main supplier is showing up to his apartment and it's a quick, it's a quick deal. This is how much you want, this is how much it costs.
- [31:07]
Advertiser/Host
Cool.
- [31:08]
Nick
Here's the money, here's the product. Boom.
- [31:24]
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- [35:27]
Nick
Investment results will vary.
- [35:29]
Advertiser/Host
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- [37:14]
Nick
always a good one.
- [37:16]
Advertiser/Host
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- [37:55]
Co-host
All right, we are back talk. Hands in the air. Cheers to you colonel.
- [38:00]
Nick
Cheers to you and cheers to the people in in the mosh pit. Have good mosh pitting with this case. Here we have Brandon's girlfriend who she's the one that finds him. And again there's no interaction between the time period of 10pm and approximately 1am when she goes to the apartment to check on her boyfriend. So that would appear that in our timeline we have about three hours approximately of silence from our victim. We don't know what's going on with inside of those four walls during that time. We know approximately the start of it and we know the end result. She arrives, she calls 91 1. First responders get to the scene. We actually have paramedics arrive before police. One thing that we get a statement from both paramedics and from the girlfriend is that when they were in the apartment, when they arrived at the apartment the the place had been tossed. Clearly somebody was looking for something. And we know that our victim was tied up, bound, it appears that beaten. But I think a lot of those injuries captain are probably due to the struggle. This is a 21 year old man, I don't think that he's just going to willingly allow you to bind his wrist and ankles and put duct tape over his mouth. I think that's going to require a little bit of force, maybe a lot of force on someone's part. We also have a situation where one thing that a few people that have seen the autopsy note as a question mark, there is a small puncture wound in the way that it's described in the autopsy report. It would seem that it is on one of his hips. Now, it's very small, but people have wondered what this could mean. I don't want to get hung up on a small detail like this because I think. I think there was a large. A good deal of a scuffle, let's say, right between Brandon and some others. And I think that if he's just wearing boxer shorts, it's late at night, it's conceivable that he simply answered the door in a T shirt and boxers at 9:30, 10:00', clock, 10:30 at night with. If he wasn't planning on going anywhere. That makes sense to me. So I don't think that we have a situation where he's confronted by some people and they're like, all right, strip down, tie him up.
- [40:32]
Co-host
Right?
- [40:33]
Nick
I think that there. I think that he. He answers the door because while the brick might be holding the door open at the bottom of the stairs, his door is closed to his apartment. He likely had to answer that door. And we have an eyewitness. One of his neighbors says that when she left her apartment, she saw Brandon. He's. His door is slightly open and he's talking to two individuals. And this neighbor said, in her opinion, that Brandon looked like he was nervous, maybe even scared.
- [41:14]
Co-host
Well, there's your killers startled.
- [41:17]
Nick
Now, here's. Here's one thing that's missing from our timeline and from our details about this case. The witness claims to have seen Brandon holding, like protecting the door, preventing it from being open further by having his foot holding it tight with his foot. My question here was when. When we've had people who've looked at this case and they. They get very concerned about what he was wearing and what he was not wearing when he was found. If the eyewitness. If the neighbor walks by and there's two people. Try. Try to put yourself in the shoes of the eyewitness here, Captain, because what I hate about this case is a lot of the statements out there, they just don't make any damn sense. And sometimes it's just bad it's just bad reporting. Sometimes it's just bad record keeping by the person taking the statement. Or other times I wonder if you're giving a statement that doesn't make sense. What are you withholding from that statement? Or what do you know that you're not telling us? Or are you making this up? Because if I'm walking down a hallway, I see a neighbor who's blocking the door with their foot talking to two individuals. And you've described it as such that you were close enough to observe the look on his face of distress, to, to observe the foot holding the door closed. And where's the description of what Brandon's wearing?
- [42:48]
Co-host
I, I just want to make sure that I'm understanding this eyewitness report. She's saying that the two individuals she saw are. They're in the hallway.
- [42:57]
Nick
Correct.
- [42:58]
Co-host
He has his door cracked open, but is blocking it from going completely open with his foot or with his body.
- [43:07]
Nick
Correct.
- [43:08]
Co-host
And so she can, the door is open enough where she can see his facial expression.
- [43:14]
Advertiser/Host
Correct.
- [43:14]
Co-host
We should have a pretty good description of these individuals, at least roughly how tall they were, roughly what they were wearing, what ethnicity are they?
- [43:25]
Nick
Well, and that's where you, you question like the record keeping with the statements or the statement given. Right. Like if so with, with some of this, you, you want to go, well, did you see his foot blocking the door for preventing the door from being open further, or was that just an assumption you made?
- [43:41]
Interviewee/Family Member
Right.
- [43:42]
Nick
You know, briefly observing and walking by. So the neighbor is an older woman and I'm going to purposely leave her name out of it. If you dig deep enough, you might be able to find it. I don't know. But this is an older woman that lived on the second floor in another apartment. Here's what she describes. This, this is directly from my notes. She says that she saw two well dressed, dark skinned guys at Brandon's door the night of the murder. They were arguing with him and when she walked past, they stopped talking. She told Brandon's mother, Lynn, that Brandon had a look of terror on his face and had the door propped open only a little bit with his foot against it so it could not be opened more. She walked to the corner grocery store and they were still there, still arguing. When she came back, she said they did leave, but returned 30 minutes later. I that part of the statement I have a hard time wrapping my head around. She said they did leave but returned 30 minutes later, that one of them had something in his hand and they both went inside. The problem with this eyewitness statement too, that, that, that I get hung up on is what time was this? Right. What time did she first see these guys?
- [45:03]
Co-host
Yeah.
- [45:04]
Nick
Arguing with, with our victim. What time did, did they come back?
- [45:10]
Co-host
Well, I'm going to be nice to police because maybe we have a lot more details on this. And this is. Look, I'm not a, I'm not a mindhunter, but if you have two guys arguing at his door and then they come back and then enter the apartment during the time frame in which we believe. And again, we don't have the statement from the eyewitness, but we can just assume that this is within the time frame of when he was murdered.
- [45:40]
Nick
Oh, yeah.
- [45:41]
Co-host
So these are your killers.
- [45:43]
Nick
So I believe so too.
- [45:45]
Co-host
So you have to probably hold back some of this information. And, and I have no reason to believe that this eyewitness is just making crap up because also anybody that's lived in an apartment complex, if your neighbors arguing with somebody, you're checking out your window, you're looking, you're. I become a nosy parker very quickly.
- [46:07]
Nick
Well, and this is an older woman. I'm guessing that is why she didn't intervene. I didn't know Brandon. Okay. I didn't have the privilege of knowing him. But from everything that's described to me about him and the persons that I've talked to, I believe that I had friends that were, that I grew up with that were very much like him. Remember we were looking at pictures of him before we hit record and both of us are like, don't you get the feeling like you kind of know this guy Looks familiar? Yes. And so if he's the guy that's described to me, he was probably friendly with this neighbor. He's a smiling face, he's a joy. And I. This is where you just, you wish and pray. You wish you could have a Marty McFly, Doc Brown moment, go back in time and replace this older woman neighbor with a male neighbor or a garage neighbor that goes. Brandon, everything okay, man? Is everything all right here? Yeah, because.
- [47:09]
Co-host
Or gun carrying neighbor.
- [47:11]
Advertiser/Host
I'm not.
- [47:12]
Nick
Me too. I'm not a mindhunter, but I play one on the radio.
- [47:17]
Co-host
Yeah, a little bit. A little better than this joker.
- [47:20]
Nick
And here's the thing. What we've been told by the experts who are mine hunters are that you profile everything. You don't just profile the offender, you profile the victim, you profile the location, you profile the city, you profile the scenario and the situation. But I guess we know the situation. We can profile the situation very well. Very Easy. Based off of the limited information we have from that timeline, we have persons coming and going freely from his apartment that night, and a lot of them are buying marijuana from Brandon. What do we have here in this scenario that is very different from every one of those scenarios leading up to this, this moment? He's not letting these people into his apartment.
- [48:01]
Co-host
Right.
- [48:02]
Nick
He does. He either doesn't know them or he knows them and he's afraid of them. And he knows that they're bad guys. He's not letting them come willy nilly into his apartment like everybody else that night. He does not want these guys in his apartment. He has a look of terror on his face. He does not want to be talking to these guys. And then we have a situation where the crime scene and the way that the victim is found tells us 100% this is a two man or more job. And guess what? You got two guys standing at his apartment door.
- [48:32]
Co-host
Well, I get so tired too, because just take out the weed equation, which I'm sure the weed equation has something to do with his death, but 100%.
- [48:42]
Nick
But I'm sorry to say that, but it does, but it's a fact.
- [48:45]
Co-host
Okay? And, but we have this young, good looking, hard working college student, smart guy, has an internship, very talented, he's an artist, champion artist. We all, we need more artists in this world. And so he's selling some drugs on the side. Marijuana, big freaking deal. But, but that's what's so sad, is to probably make his ends meet or maybe to try to get a little ahead or live a little more comfortably, he decided to do this. And that was his fatal flaw.
- [49:18]
Nick
He was a, everybody told me that he was a saver, he was really good at saving money. And I kind of believe that he had the entrepreneur bug. And I think that he saw that, he, he analyzed the situation. His, he's 21, he's a dude, He's a young dude, he's got a bunch of friends, he's got, he's at college, he's living in his own apartment, he's working like three jobs. Some of them are internships and whatnot. But think about how many people he has access to and how many of those persons are probably 19, 20, 21, 22.
- [49:54]
Co-host
But that's the problem.
- [49:54]
Nick
There's a lot of pot smokers in that group. And so he's probably able to move a whole lot of stuff. And guess what happens when that gets out on the street that this dude has a whole bunch of marijuana in his apartment. Oh, he's got a bunch of money up there too, because he's, because he's making money. You don't even have to know that he's a good saver to know that there's probably a bunch of money in that apartment. When, when somebody that's coming and going from his apartment knows that, observes that, sees that going on, that person can set him up to be robbed or tells the wrong person or wrong persons, and they see an opportunity. There's a reason why the old cliche loose lips sink ships still remains to this day. Because it's true. And what happens here is we get people that show up at this dude's door, this is my opinion, show up at his door with the intent of taking all of his product that they can sell themselves and taking whatever cash that he has in the apartment. Because guess what happens after you rob that dude? What's he gonna do, call the police and say, hey, guys, you gotta come over here. Somebody came in here and stole my drugs and my drug money? You can't, you can't phone that in. You can't phone that in.
- [51:07]
Co-host
No, no. And that, and that's, and I think that's the issue here. And I think it's possibly that it's his loose lips. Because he could have found himself in a situation. This is just hypothetical, but I'm just saying he could have found himself in a situation where he feels, well, I've sold pot to this guy for the last year. He's my buddy. And the guy goes, man, you're selling a lot of pot and you're working this extra job and you're doing all this stuff, man, you must have a lot of money because you're in a small apartment. Unless he has like 10 TVs, unless he's driving some fancy car, you're like, where's this money going? And all he has to say is to the wrong person, oh, you know, I'm actually been saving a bunch of money. I, I. And then they go, well, but you can't save it in the bank. Oh, no, no, I just, I just save it here and just casually says to somebody, and, and that's all it takes. Then some idiots at a party going, hey, I know where we could get a bunch of money.
- [52:13]
Nick
So inside of his apartment, one of the items that police found. And here, here's a few things that, that are difficult. So it's been reported. We got two. We got multiple. To say two would be a very big understatement. Multiple reports that come out that all vary. They all have variables within them. So, and I'll keep it short and sweet here, but at the apartment, whether what was found or what wasn't found, the reports are this. He had a very expensive camera. The we know he had a cell phone. So the cell phone goes bye bye. It's that every report says the cell phone was not in his apartment when Brennan was found. The expensive camera, there's conflicting reports that the police collected it as evidence and they still have it or it was stolen. It's. To me, those reports are inconclusive. His computer was still there and retrieved and confiscated by police. Likely. They probably thought that they could find some interaction with somebody that might lead, present a good lead to them. What this is curious though. What else was found? And this is 100% was found. It's just the amount of money is in question. So there was an envelope that was found inside his apartment, kind of just sitting out in plain sight. The envelope was labeled car. And remember, he was said by all to be great at saving money. So he likely was saving up money for a car. He had a car. His car was found parked in its usual spot and police processed that car. But that envelope, depending on what report you read, contained anywhere from $6,000 cash to $8,000 cash. Now, it is believed by most people that take a look at this case that this envelope would have been taken by the killers, but it was just simply overlooked that they tossed the place looking for, I believe, hidden marijuana, a hidden stash of marijuana and a stash of cash that would have been hidden. And so because they're looking for something hidden at haste, they overlooked an envelope that just happens to be sitting there in plain sight. And one thing that is believed to have been missing, and again, this is different reports. Some reports say that a, the people that bought weed from him say that Brandon would typically use a large shoebox. And in that shoebox he may keep product, but at the very least, he was keeping a stash of cash that he made from selling weed. Some reports say that that shoebox was missing. Some reports say that the shoebox was found open with nothing in it.
- [55:19]
Interviewee/Family Member
Right.
- [55:19]
Nick
Either way, it looks like whatever the killers went there looking for, they believed that they got it and they got out of there. Now, one thing I do want to point out too, that I found strange people. Point to that puncture wound. It was such a small puncture wound. I think that that's a little bit happenstance. I think that these three guys were probably fighting and happened in the Struggle. Yes. And that he, he sustained some kind of injury during the course of that. Unfortunately, Brandon was not a large dude. He was about 5 foot 6 or 7 and about 165 pounds. I don't. That's the other thing that's missing from the description from the neighbor.
- [56:02]
Advertiser/Host
Right.
- [56:03]
Nick
That how big were these guys?
- [56:06]
Co-host
Right. Again, I think that's information that law enforcement is probably keeping back. And then I wonder too, like, do we have surveillance footage from around that area?
- [56:18]
Nick
Well, that's great. And I tell you what, you are absolutely right. I have to believe that. I would wager. Here we go, Captain. Going to wager, Franklin, that the captain is right. And here's why. Because the statements are that the same witness, the neighbor, says that at a later date the detectives showed her a picture. Oh, here we go. And so the way that this has been described is that this was a picture with a lot of dudes in it, like a big group of dudes. It's been recorded that she points to two guys in that picture and says, these are the guys that I believe that I saw there that night.
- [56:53]
Co-host
Yeah. Now here's the thing. Do we have DNA? We don't know that.
- [56:57]
Nick
Correct.
- [56:58]
Co-host
But if we do, then we can collect that DNA. Why aren't they working this case harder? It just doesn't make a lot of sense to me. It seems like we have some pieces of the puzzle, but we can't complete it.
- [57:11]
Nick
Damn killers got lucky again here. Right.
- [57:14]
Co-host
Well, I think these stupid ass moose knuckles are going. They're going to talk. They're going to tell somebody. This is too horrendous of a situation to have these guys not tell somebody. The problem is the people they probably told are piles of shit themselves. And so maybe they'll get busted for something and go, hey, I can tell you information about this other case if you give me a deal.
- [57:42]
Nick
I think that there was somebody that was going to be there that night or was there that night that set him up. And here's why I say this. I think that Brandon was. You already talked about how busy he would have been. Right. With all that movement. And he's, he's a very. He lives an active outdoor lifestyle as well. He was big into skateboarding. We know that he wrote his scooter with a friend for two to three hours that day. This is a busy guy, but I think to keep. He's at the top of his class at school. He is successful with these internships. They're paid internships. He's. He has a job. And he's. And he's got this side hustle going on too. You're only successful in all of those realms if you maintain a calendar. And I have a feeling here that unfortunately Brandon probably had a routine. And I think that people that bought from him were aware of that routine. Hey, he, he usually, he's good to go if you contact him on a Tuesday or Wednesday. Why can we profile that? We see a lot of people coming on that Tuesday night to buy weed. He's good to go on a Tuesday or Wednesday. That means he's holding. And that's when you want to show up. If you're going to rob him, you want to show up and rob him while he has cash and while he has product. And one guy that we haven't got to yet is a man by the name of Tony. He's about Brandon's age. And he approached Brandon's family after Brandon was killed and says he's, he's, he's heartbroken. He appears to be heartbroken. He's crying and he says he asked the family, this is the very next morning or next day. I apologize. Could have been the evening time. He approaches the family. Is it true? Is it true? I heard, you know, I heard he was killed. Is it true? And yes, they tell him it's true. And he says, you know, I was supposed to be there last night, but I was out of town. I didn't get back until today. And I heard the news. He was my friend.
- [59:38]
Co-host
Sounds like he said alibi well. And look, is Tony a phony baloney?
- [59:43]
Nick
Well, Tony's Egyptian and described as always dressing well.
- [59:49]
Co-host
Well, there you go.
- [59:50]
Nick
I don't wanna. I'm not trying to say that Tony was one of the two guys spotted by the neighbor, but he might know him. He might know them and may have seen. Sent them there. So he doesn't necessarily have to be back in town to be involved.
- [60:03]
Co-host
You know what pisses me off? There's a lot of cases that we cover and we go, well, we just don't know. We don't know X, Y or Z. We have suspects here. We have them identified if they have a picture of a group of people and they have the neighbor identify these two individuals out of that picture. Law enforcement knows who these ass clowns are. And then this Tony guy, he, if
- [60:24]
Nick
identified correctly, yes, if identified correctly, if
- [60:28]
Co-host
you're walking past these guys in the hallway and you see a scared look on your neighbor's face, you're. You're going to remember more so than if you just walked by and just seemed. And it seemed like they were having a friendly conversation.
- [60:42]
Nick
I want to avoid some rabbit holes here because I don't think that they hold a lot of water, but it's
- [60:48]
Co-host
important to toss them out.
- [60:49]
Advertiser/Host
Where.
- [60:50]
Co-host
Where is the head of people looking into this case?
- [60:53]
Advertiser/Host
Some.
- [60:54]
Nick
Some persons, and these are not people that seem to be very dialed into this case, in my opinion. But some persons have referenced a group called the hippie mafia that he may have been buying from. Other persons have referenced the Hell's Angels. And then some people say that the hippie mafia and the Hell's Angels work together or were working together in that area and, quote, run an incredibly organized system.
- [61:22]
Co-host
See, again, that it doesn't add up to me with weed, and you can say what you will, but every guy that I've known that have sold, that has sold a little pot, has at some point stepped out of bounds or out of the realm of comfort and sold something harder.
- [61:45]
Nick
With Brandon's case, one thing that I found odd, well, there's a bunch of
- [61:51]
Co-host
things, obviously, but he's found tied up and dead.
- [61:54]
Nick
One thing that I found to be strange is I said I reviewed the autopsy. Well, that autopsy included a toxicology report. There's no drugs, not even marijuana found in his system. A certain portion of the population, you know, this doesn't mean anything today because in many states, it's recreational use or medical uses is legal.
- [62:17]
Co-host
Hell, I'm high right now.
- [62:19]
Nick
Most people of a certain age, a small percentage of persons of a certain age, will tell you that it's customary that when a friend shows up or to buy from a friend, they regularly will share a joint or smoke a bowl together. And we know we have people coming and going purchasing from him that night. Yet there's no marijuana found in Brandon's system in the toxicology report. Anybody that's seen Pineapple Express will tell you that it's customary to hang out briefly. And we know that we have people that have said, you know, I, yeah, I went over there for the purpose of purchasing. I was there for 45 minutes that day hanging out with. With my cool friend Brandon. So this case, look, we've said it. I've said it dozens of times. The killers get lucky. Unfortunately, the victims never do. And in this case, the detective that catches this case suffers a heart attack within 24 to 48 hours of catching the case. So they immediately have to transfer it to another detective. So right there, you have a major speed bump. I think the other problem for this Case is, is while we have some detailed information of that last day for Brandon and, and people coming and going and people that he interacted with, we're sitting here looking at that information 13 years later. They, at the time, these people were conducting illegal activity themselves. So unless you love this guy dearly, you're probably not very forthcoming with that information. When you sit across the table from a detective or, or he knocks on your door. Did you see Brandon? Yeah, I saw him yesterday. Why? What were you doing? What did you guys talk about? What did you know? What was the purpose of your visit? Were you at his apartment? Details get m. Get. Get stepped over and purposely left out of those conversations and statements because there is illegal activity within those statements, within those details. So we don't know how much of this information the detectives were privy to on day three or four or five of their investigation.
- [64:35]
Co-host
So where do we go from here in this case?
- [64:37]
Nick
Well, one thing that's great about this. Let me, let me step back a second and talk about something that's not so great. You asked earlier about cell phone technology and I am of the belief, you know, we live in the. Thank God we live in the day where we see DNA. It's almost every week, every other week, some 30, 40, 25 year old case is being closed out. We're finally getting delayed justice for a victim in their family using DNA technology to connect it to the perpetrator. I am of the belief that one day, and we might be very close, maybe we're there now, but cell phone technology will surpass the numbers on solving crime, solving homicides beyond DNA. And so Lynn, Brandon's mom was the person that was paying for his cell phone. And we talked about Brandon being a good saver. There are people close to this case that believe that he could have had anywhere between 20 to 80 thousand dollars between cash and product in that house, in his apartment. $80,000. There are people out there that will do a lot of crazy, dumb, horrible shit for $80,000. And with his cell phone, Lynn, his mother, she, because it was stolen, because it was not at the crime scene, it was not found. It was one of the items we know to have been taken. She continued to pay that cell phone bill every month. She thought that that cell phone, if they could find the cell phone, they could find the killer. And so she went to the FBI to have them ping the phone because she's like, look, I'm still paying on this phone and I'm still paying on it because somebody's using this phone. Somebody's racking up the bills on this thing. And so she had to go to the FBI to get it done. The FBI, they ping it and they say that they have. This is 2012, right? Months after the murder, they say, we've pinged this phone. We know it's general location. We don't have jurisdiction here. The Cleveland Police Department Homicide Division has jurisdiction here. In your son's case, we are going to give them the information we have and they can use it to find that cell phone. This. This will make you tear your hair out. So. So sit on your hands for a second here, everybody, or your thumbs. This information is given to the Cleveland Police Department and they delay the. The homicide detective that was air quotes working Brandon's case said he was too busy to go to that location to look for the phone on multiple occasions, eventually telling Brandon's mom that, oh, I went to the location, it was an apartment complex. And because the amount of people there and the amount of people living in the building and in the complex, we couldn't locate the phone.
- [67:48]
Co-host
Congratulations, Detective Dickweed.
- [67:52]
Nick
Now, I say all that to say this here's where there should be some optimism for Brandon's case. This case, the investigation at some point was transferred from Cleveland Police Department Homicide Division to the FBI to their local office.
- [68:09]
Co-host
Good.
- [68:09]
Nick
And there are agents currently working this case. I have spoke with the FBI about Brandon's case. We didn't go into great details about certain things, but what I was told is that it is an active case and that there is reason to be optimistic for the future of this investigation, that it will not drag on forever. That should be good news for Brandon's case.
- [68:40]
Co-host
While he deserves justice and his family deserves justice,
- [68:55]
Nick
Thank you for listening to Brandon's case information. Law enforcement still need your help with this case. If you have any information regarding the murder of Brandon Cart Leone or any of the persons described in today's podcast that you can add further detail, please submit any information you have to the Cleveland FBI field office.
- [69:21]
Advertiser/Host
Their Phone number is 216-522-1400.
- [69:26]
Nick
Online tips can be sent to tips.FBI.gov
- [69:32]
Advertiser/Host
or if you are uncomfortable speaking with
- [69:34]
Nick
law enforcement, you may reach out to True Crime Garage. Go to our website, truecrimegarage.com and find
- [69:42]
Advertiser/Host
our contact information there. Thank you.
- [69:44]
Nick
And we wish law enforcement and Brandon's family and friends the very best of
- [69:49]
Advertiser/Host
luck with this case.
- [69:51]
Co-host
Want to thank everybody for joining us here in the garage and sharing this show with your friends and loved ones. Until next week, be good.
- [70:00]
Nick
Be kind and don't litter.
- [70:09]
Co-host
Sam.
- [70:39]
Patient
I like things my way. My coffee, my schedule and my treatment. So I talked to my doctor about self injecting with the Vivgard Hytrulo pre filled syringe, which contains fgartegamide alpha and hyaluronidase qvfc. It's injected under your skin subcutaneously. It means I can inject in my space on my time. It's my treatment, my way. Visit vivgartmyway.com that's V-Y-V-G-A-R-T myway.com and talk to your doctor about Vivgard Hytrulo. Brought to you by Argenics hi, I'm
- [71:10]
Angie Hicks
Angie Hicks, co founder of Angie. One thing I've learned is that you buy a house, but you make it a home. For decades, Angie's helped millions of homeowners hire skilled pros for the projects that matter. Angie the one you trust to find the ones you trust. Find a pro for your project@angie.com.